Ive met charlie cox in real life, in 2019 he was in a play in nyc called betrayl. He was very nice, was willing to take pictures with me and my friend and had the patience to stick around bc our camera wouldn’t work. Point is, he deserves better. Let this guy get a proper daredevil season 4, and don’t have him run away from someone he could easily beat
She removed Kingpin's childhood trauma with a *touch,* and that ends the conflict, and she just *leaves.* That's an actual scene from a *NEIL BREEN movie.*
That was... actually kinda gross. It feels like they trivialized mental trauma, glossed over LITERAL psychopath behavior with the mom healing the bird... just ugh. I feel sick.
There is no reason at all why Kingpin is out of jail in the MCU, considering that there are two scenarios that will doom him either way. Scenario 1: He made a promise with the Punisher in Daredevil season 2 that once they see each other again outside of jail, they are gonna kill each other. Yeah, this promised boss fight is totally gone and forgotten now thanks to Disney. Scenario 2: In Daredevil season 3 finale, since Kingpin’s wife Vanessa ordered Bullseye to kill a cop named Nadeem, Daredevil used this info as a leverage against Kingpin. If Kingpin tried to expose Daredevil’s true identity (he already knew that Daredevil is Matt Murdock) or even tried to get out of jail, he will arrest Vanessa so in order to keep Vanessa safe, Kingpin chose to take all the blames on himself, including the murder of Nadeem (which he didn’t commit). So, yeah, Disney kinda forgot that Kingpin getting out of jail means he’s signing his own death warrant and his wife’s arrest warrant but I certainly haven’t forgotten about them.
Bearing in mind, Marvel only decided that Netflix Daredevil was canon like, last week. When Hawkeye and Echo were commissioned, they were mucking about with that vague "oh, they could be variants" shite. Now, they want to cash in on the Daredevil Netflix continuity and goodwill... while forgetting to explain how key plot points and cliffhangers have been resolved. Maybe they'll address it in Episode 1 of Born Again!
I'm pretty sure the Netflix Daredevil series isn't canon anymore. They're just using the same actors so they can cash in on the good will they've accumulated. We have to assume all those events are undone unless they characters recall them.
@@DuneStone6816 The series was canon for a while, but then it wasn't canon anymore, and now Disney is running out of things to ruin so it's canon again
forgot, or simply didn't give a flying fuck because continuity is for nerds (and talented writers)? But yeah, it's all sort of utter horseshit to just magic Kingpin back into the universe without even addressing all his previous character development. And incredibly lazy horseshit at that.
@@DuneStone6816 as of right now it's officially canon just so they can cash in on the pre-existing fanbase. It'll be decanonized soon after the premiere of 'born again' once people start asking why it makes no fucking sense.....
Remember, this show was used as "proof" that Diregentleman was right when he said "if we got a character like Toph today, people would lose their minds." People unironically think *both characters are written with the same level of quality.*
I didn't like Toph at first, but not because she had a durability, that was interesting, it was because I didn't like her personality. Of course, over time, that changed.
“Queenpin” was actually a nickname Daredevil fans made for Vanessa, Kingpin’s wife but it’s supposed to be non-canonical and shouldn’t be taken seriously. MCU somehow used this name unironically and it’s for Echo (a wrong person).
What bothers me is I was working on a story, and I had as a joke created the Queenpin. I have yet to publish it, so it's going to look like marvel came up with it first.
it's also complete nonsense. The 'kingpin' is the main connecting pin within a mechenism, almost literally the pin the whole mechanism works around. The secondary meaning of kingpin, from which the character takes his nickname, is derived from this.... not from the concept on monarchy. It's literally a gender neutral word, anyone, male or female, can be defined as a 'kingpin' from an organizational perspective So her using the word 'queenpin' is just her failing english while pretending to act cool, and betraying the fact that the person who wrote this doesn't understand highschool level fucking english.... jesus christ, the depths of cringe they've reached....
The moment in episode 4 when Fisk beats up the ice cream guy is outrageous. Kingpin would never want to make a repeat of the "keep kicking him" scene from his childhood. He shouldn't let any child, let alone one close to him keep kicking a body, LET ALONE IN JOY. What a disgrace.
I beg to differ. I think it’s in his character to use his own childhood trauma to manipulate people. Remember the primal scream scene that he manipulated Bullseye in season 3?
From an Echo promotional site: "Prior to being cast in the role of Maya Lopez/Echo, she did not have acting experience outside of a high school play." I can tell.
It’s even worse when you realize that signed languages rely heavily on facial expressions & non-verbal gestures. So the fact that she’s stone faced for the most part is just sad.
Apparently there was a bunch more stuff with two deleted secondary villains and them running the NYC crime empire in Fisk's absence. And Matt Murdock was supposed to be communicating with Maya via texts, advising her on her next moves. The flashbacks structure was rearranged and how her powers developed and manifested was changed. I still don't think it would have helped, but it explains why the show feels so odd and empty. My guess is this show tied closely into the original version of "Daredevil: Born Again", and when Disney saw that it was shaping up to be a train wreck, they gutted "Echo" and took out anything that could conflict with the blank-slate revamp. What a nightmare
Wellz they also couldn't have HER relying heavily on a MAN. *scoofs* Imagine the feminist articles that would be written about the able bodied White patriarchy holding the hand of an indigenous physically challenged, haierng impaired alternative beauty standards WOMAN!
Ah. Typical Disney. Instead of reflecting on making something shit or fixing it, they just try to do damage control and prevent the stink of it from affecting something else that they'll likely screw up anyways.
Sounds like Disney didn't want to have their strong diverse lady hero taking advice from old Matt "Mansplaining" Murdock with all of his "helpful" text messages... and now they're ghosting this whole series. 😏
@@othertalk3313 Funny, I wrote a similar comment yesterday and now it's gone. I also touched on the pigments differences and made a comparison with what Rey said to Finn when he saved her from the bombings when they first met in Jakku, so let's hope that was what crossed the line for the TH-cam directives and keep an eye on it. ;)
I’m absolutely fucking terrified of how they’re gonna butcher Daredevil dude. Such an amazing show in the hands of such a fucking dumpster fire of a company.
The scene of her building the gun out of random stuff reminds me of the scene in Scary Movie 2 when Cindy builds a bulldozer out of random things in a freezer.
40:35 "Kingpin was found shot in the head near Goodsprings, he is due to make a full recovery; now that is crime you can count on. This is Mister New Vegas, filling in for Mister New Vegas."
3:00:54 [sigh] ...I don't want to defend this, but the sad part is that this is actually how RPG warheads work. They have a self-detonation mechanism. After they fly roughly 950 meters/3,000 feet they just explode. The explosion wouldn't look as fireball-y as it does here because Hollywood just thinks all explosions look like gasoline explosions for some reason.
"for some reason" It started because a lot of actual explosions don't look that impressive on the screen (especially grenades), then it just became the standard. Sort of like why every plane falling out of the sky sounded like a Stuka siren.
So... Kingpin speaks Chinese, Japanese, (assumed) Russian and Italian... that we know from Daredevil. But he wouldn't learn ASL? He makes a contact lense/earpiece ASL translator that translates his speech into ASL, but not just simple text?
Being deaf is completely impractical for stealth and/or combat, as you'll have no idea if you're making noise or not nor would you know if someone else does.
Once again it is remarkable how EFAP manages to write a far more compelling and endearing plot for the show they are watching while watching it! Making Kingpin learn signlanguage to communicate with her seems like the absolutely simplest yet most effective method to give him some good qualities and to make us believe he cares for her.... but instead they give her wonky lenses to translate speech for her. It is not just needlesly complicated, but it also robs us of the bonus points Kingpin would have gotten as a parental figure. What we are left with is a terribly confusing relationship between Kingpin and Echo where it is never clear what we are meant to think or feel about their relationship. Him yelling at her in the end that he will kill her like he killed her father just seems to be the laziest and quickest way the writers could make us root for his downfall..... its just so cheap and bad, and needlesly so, but no one cared about the show at all clearly, apart from Vincent D'Onofrio who always gives it his best. That "again" he delivered when she was about to shoot him again just perfectly described how terribly this show is.
What's worse than that is having Kingpin hire then immediately kill interpreters. It's a knock against Kingpin's intelligence because he's now creating loads of loose ends and risk for himself and his precious Echo. All he has to do is order one of his trusted people to learn sign language or find a live-in interpreter that he can actually trust. Even if the cops are useless, the interpreters still have friends and family that might be just a little angry. It's a knock against Echo's sanity because now, even as a little girl, she's 100% comfortable with killing innocent people every day. That's kind of unprecedented. I don't think there's a single human being in the history of the Earth that's been able to not even care enough to come up with some kind of dubious rationale for why their viciousness is totally fine and ethical. If Echo is representation (art is not parliament, but for the sake of argument) then Echo is terrible representation.
@@zigzag1630 I totally forgot the fact he has to keep killing the interpreters when I wrote my comment, fuck that is so stupid. Echo is.. confusing as a character. Because I feel the show (as usual in modern mcu ) forgets that she is an awful person too, she just happens to be the protagonist.
Never in my life have I awaited an EFAP as much as this. Episode 3 made me pause in frustration with the overwhelmingly stupid idiotic decisions both off & on-screen.
Completely unrelated to the topic but I’ve heard you guys reference Archer a lot. Before they went on to make Archer Adam Reed and Matt Thompson created a show called “Frisky Dingo”. It was cancelled after two seasons and it’s criminally underrated. There’s a lot of references and jokes that made their way into Archer as well. I feel like Fringy would thoroughly enjoy it. I know Fringys brain is 80% Simpsons references, 5% critters, 5% Mario, 5% Joeover and 5% soundtrack’s but there’s room for more Fringo!!
Sid Meier’s Civilization 6 has a playable Cree faction, with Native American musical themes adapted to what they project to be modernized. It’s a great tune. Why didn’t Disney do something like that? Ah, yes, because they’re creatively bankrupt, and view this as checking a box above genuinely exploring culture.
The only thing I found slightly interesting in this entire show was the use of "Down In The River To Pray". It's a good song, but it's an old Gospel song. So it's pretty funny when they go directly from talking about the mystical Choktow pantheon, to making her culturally inspired dress... with a song about a completely opposite culture and religion playing over it. That's where it would be appropriate to do a modern pop song, something brassy and meaningless, just providing audio cover instead of meaning. But they picked an explicitly religious song that name drops a completely different (and famously exclusive) God from what she's supposed to be following. How do you make these kinds of unforced errors? Is ANYONE paying attention over at Disney?
With the amount of money Disney is paying they couldn't be bothered to do animatics / animated voiced storyboards of the entire season? They could've saved millions just by knowing if what they have is a stinker. It's how Pixar used to do things and it paid dividends.
That weird green screen shit blew my mind. It reminded me of the knock off "Nigerian assassin Vs the xenopredator" that some rando group of guys with 10 quid made on a camera phone. Except at least those are entertaining and funny as shit
I was trying to come up with a good “echo chamber” pun and then scrolled down and found out that about 3 dozen people are already funnier than I could ever be. Oh well, I’m sure my bad-joke muse will sing to me next time.
My favorite sequence in this has to be the mean lady at the roller rink throwing Maya's shoe/foot back to her. First off, our bad guys are already kidnappers, so, not great people, but the show then makes sure we understand this one lady is also ableist, because that's important to highlight. And then it not only turns out that letting Maya keep her prosthetics and related personal belongings MIRACULOUSLY aids her in escaping, but then you realize... wait, how does it even make sense that ableist-lady decides, being disgusted/confused by a prosthetic, to then throw it back to Maya? Wouldn't the lady instead just leave it where she found it? Or throw it AWAY? Or destroy it in front of Maya? This is immediately followed by Maya intentionally breaking a fluorescent tube in her confined room. Brilliant.
If RvB has taught me anything, it's that the reason why Kingpin's breathing is messed up from getting shot in the eye is because nobody thought to give him CPR when they found him.
I think what they were going for or at least wanted to with the relationship of Echo and Kingpin is something along the lines of Jinx and Silco from Arcane, but they failed at each and every step of the way.
Even in the deaf show they don't spare us from trashy pop music in the wrong place. Echo walks up to the skating rink counter and stares silently at him, but she calls him the jerk because he doesn't understand her. 55:00 It's not like we have plenty of evidence of how adult women fare against even teen boys in ball sports... 1:45:00 Even if they shot her it would be in the pegleg. 2:12:00 He asks her which one she wants and she can't just point at it, she expects him to learn another language.
2:11:12 With the comics, Marvel used to have a different line called Marvel Knights, which is where they would publish their more adult-oriented stories such as The Punisher.
Really saddens me what has become of the Daredevil characters since season 3. They have made some massive overhauls to Born Again recently and are now bringing pretty much everybody back, so maybe it won't be completely worthless
I can't believe that Rags freaked out about the water being CG in the flashback on episode 2 when the first dude in the canoe looked like the Agent Smith CG figures in the burley brawl from Matrix Reloaded.
Son of a deaf, they usually wire the house with flashing lights that have different timing on the flashes for doorbell, phone, cell, sleeping alarm. They also have a large pad that shakes the bed with similar timing.
Oh oh oh, I know something about that! Oklahoma has a pan handle because of an agreement concerning slavery (1820 Compromise) where peoples above a certain latitude would be free and below slave. After the agreement, It was taken from the top of Texas (Texas was a slave state) as it would have been free, so they and made a no mans land. It became so unruly that finally the federal government decided it needed to belong to an actual state, and they awarded it to Oklahoma. Now you know, rest well Fringy.
I think "WHAT DID YOU DO?" was actually an editor's note that accidentally made it into the script. Such a shame when that happens in your multi million dollar productions.
In Hawkeye, Echo was portrayed as being very capable, but still nowhere near a match for Hawkeye. Daredevil is renowned for being one of the best martial artists in the marvel universe, he should have made her look silly in a fight.
I never heard Mauler so disappointed while watching media than when he said "Ah no you're going to be nekid... oh" as the choclate fell off from the nekid choclate people only to reveal them fully robed suddenly.
1:14:46 You know that your show is fire when the EFAP crew recjoices over discovering that she works for the postal service and therefore drives a car with the steering wheel on the right!
" "Marvel Spotlight" focuses on introducing standalone content that doesn't require background knowledge of the MCU story arcs. It's designed to showcase individual projects characterized by their grounded and character-driven storytelling approach. The Disney+ TV series "Echo" is the first to be released under this new Marvel Spotlight banner." LOL
Not hearing any good reviews of thsi project. It seems to be stumbling out of the gate. Apparently there was a mishap at the stump store. Now she has 2 left feet.
@@R3cov3ry Precisely! Haha. And it heavily depends on Kingpin and Daredevil stuff from a show that wasn't even on the MCU. Well, I guess they are technically right ij that regard, hahaha.
The huge amount of CGI is probably because of the many reported reshoots and redrafts this show underwent before they decided to release it all at once...
This show was supposed to be a return to form like with the Netflix shows. The fact they couldn't commit to the fights scenes, by cheating with CGI and terrible blocking because the actors can't fight, tells me the Daredevil Born Again Series is gonna suck HARD.
Even having watched Hawkeye, I have no idea why Fisk had Maya's dad killed. That is the inciting incident for this series, and we are never given an explanation for it.
I still can't believe they actually had Echo "hit" a bird and then lie about it... Like, i assume most people will take a specific idea from that which isn't the most positive view on a character, to put it lightly. That said, I think i have to give credit and thumbs up to series. Seeing the flashback everytime she used her not-lame powers, I couldn't help but see as a skill cut-in/cutscene from a game. Especially the part where she was throwing stuff and it did flashback each time, i think was like 3 times in a row. Hell, the ending was basically her using her ultimate which lets her buff her female teammates. And now, while writing this comment, i've basically forgotten what happened (what little there was). Oh, i guess there was the whole 'healing' SadPin deal at the end that, imo, came off really spicy... like i don't know what they intended with that in regards to the message or theme.
I don't mean to be that guy but at 2:45:54 I just realized her mom could've used that to heal her so she wouldn't be deaf. If she can heal animals there's no way she can't just save her own daughter.
"I don't care, nor do I care to be convinced to care. In fact if you try to make me care, then you are the true Wumbo." -Mine Own Self 2024 when thinking about Echo.
2:06:32 Rags really states a very good point. Most of the advertisement or reasons stated to watch this show was because there was a lot of Choctaw representation, as they said. But there's absolutely nothing here. You could give this weird ancestral Attack on Titan Paths superpower to any ethnicity and nothing would change. You have: 1. Weird ancestral ability 2. Little Village with native people 3. Little traditional festival at the end. They could have been Choctaw, they could have been Spanish, German, Italian, Greek, Chinese, Japanese, Australian whatever you want! There's so little unique or representative here.
It's been brought up that if you only knew Kingpin and Daredevil from this show, She-Hulk, and Hawkeye you'd think they were very lame characters. But, don't worry, guys, Born Again will be great. Marvel would never screw that up because they respect Daredevil so much and fear fan backlash... Or so I've been hearing.
Love how kingpin won’t learn sign language to talk to his daughter figure even tho he learned/knew at least mandarin and Japanese in daredevil
Plenty of people have voiced their dislike of this show. Unfortunately, any criticism seems to fall on deaf ears.
"Deaf ears" Lol.
Is this the part where i say it has no leg to stand on
Maybe Disney will see the signs and course correct
Yeah, that criticism didn't have a leg to stand on.
Bad joke Ben
I thought I'd have a lot of thoughts to share about this show, but frankly, I'm stumped.
Indigo.. noo! not you too! 😔
You can do it! Make like Echo and put your best foot forward.
@Ceyx000 34:17 Fringy got caught.
@@Ceyx000 but she def doh
Ha!😂
Ive met charlie cox in real life, in 2019 he was in a play in nyc called betrayl. He was very nice, was willing to take pictures with me and my friend and had the patience to stick around bc our camera wouldn’t work. Point is, he deserves better. Let this guy get a proper daredevil season 4, and don’t have him run away from someone he could easily beat
And stay the fuck away from She-Hulk.
He'd get more respect in a Stardust sequel than anything Disney Marvel is making
She removed Kingpin's childhood trauma with a *touch,* and that ends the conflict, and she just *leaves.*
That's an actual scene from a *NEIL BREEN movie.*
"Steal from the best" as Rian Johnson would say.
That was... actually kinda gross. It feels like they trivialized mental trauma, glossed over LITERAL psychopath behavior with the mom healing the bird... just ugh. I feel sick.
you are now free . . . from ptsd
@@johnn.7849 WHAT DID YOU DO?!
If Rags doesn't call Echo a Mary Sioux, I'll be very disappointed.
But that pun only works in writing.
Marianne Saxionne Suezanne
...I'll have you know that she is Choctaw...tsk tsk....🤣
@@AmarenamannMillions must be called Mary Sues
@@Trump.Card.Media.Reviews. as quarter black Garrett kept explaining on nerdrotic fnt live
There is no reason at all why Kingpin is out of jail in the MCU, considering that there are two scenarios that will doom him either way.
Scenario 1: He made a promise with the Punisher in Daredevil season 2 that once they see each other again outside of jail, they are gonna kill each other. Yeah, this promised boss fight is totally gone and forgotten now thanks to Disney.
Scenario 2: In Daredevil season 3 finale, since Kingpin’s wife Vanessa ordered Bullseye to kill a cop named Nadeem, Daredevil used this info as a leverage against Kingpin. If Kingpin tried to expose Daredevil’s true identity (he already knew that Daredevil is Matt Murdock) or even tried to get out of jail, he will arrest Vanessa so in order to keep Vanessa safe, Kingpin chose to take all the blames on himself, including the murder of Nadeem (which he didn’t commit).
So, yeah, Disney kinda forgot that Kingpin getting out of jail means he’s signing his own death warrant and his wife’s arrest warrant but I certainly haven’t forgotten about them.
Bearing in mind, Marvel only decided that Netflix Daredevil was canon like, last week. When Hawkeye and Echo were commissioned, they were mucking about with that vague "oh, they could be variants" shite. Now, they want to cash in on the Daredevil Netflix continuity and goodwill... while forgetting to explain how key plot points and cliffhangers have been resolved.
Maybe they'll address it in Episode 1 of Born Again!
I'm pretty sure the Netflix Daredevil series isn't canon anymore. They're just using the same actors so they can cash in on the good will they've accumulated. We have to assume all those events are undone unless they characters recall them.
@@DuneStone6816 The series was canon for a while, but then it wasn't canon anymore, and now Disney is running out of things to ruin so it's canon again
forgot, or simply didn't give a flying fuck because continuity is for nerds (and talented writers)?
But yeah, it's all sort of utter horseshit to just magic Kingpin back into the universe without even addressing all his previous character development. And incredibly lazy horseshit at that.
@@DuneStone6816 as of right now it's officially canon just so they can cash in on the pre-existing fanbase. It'll be decanonized soon after the premiere of 'born again' once people start asking why it makes no fucking sense.....
Remember, this show was used as "proof" that Diregentleman was right when he said "if we got a character like Toph today, people would lose their minds."
People unironically think *both characters are written with the same level of quality.*
I didn't like Toph at first, but not because she had a durability, that was interesting, it was because I didn't like her personality.
Of course, over time, that changed.
@@johannesseyfried7933 we might say you ‘saw the ear of your eyes’...
Fringy's accidental leg-based jokes were better than anything in the show.
When he said that this show needs to put it's best leg forward and he didn't even realise the pun...😂😂😂
I am utterly astonished the contact lens doesn't just do captions. The writers were like "No, call the CGI team. We want arms."
She's illiterate, though.
Echo has the strength of ten elderly Native American women… so not very strong but she does have a very strong chance of having arthritis
Walks With Bad Knees
Dances with Rheumatism
Stalks with Lumbago.
Gimps with limp.
I love this reply section
“Queenpin” was actually a nickname Daredevil fans made for Vanessa, Kingpin’s wife but it’s supposed to be non-canonical and shouldn’t be taken seriously.
MCU somehow used this name unironically and it’s for Echo (a wrong person).
What bothers me is I was working on a story, and I had as a joke created the Queenpin. I have yet to publish it, so it's going to look like marvel came up with it first.
@@TheEldritchGod Don't worry about that. People before Marvel did it as well.
Look how far the King's pin has fallen.
Not *the* wrong person (She isn't the queenpin) she's *a* wrong person (Echo as a concept is the wrong answer)
it's also complete nonsense.
The 'kingpin' is the main connecting pin within a mechenism, almost literally the pin the whole mechanism works around. The secondary meaning of kingpin, from which the character takes his nickname, is derived from this.... not from the concept on monarchy. It's literally a gender neutral word, anyone, male or female, can be defined as a 'kingpin' from an organizational perspective
So her using the word 'queenpin' is just her failing english while pretending to act cool, and betraying the fact that the person who wrote this doesn't understand highschool level fucking english.... jesus christ, the depths of cringe they've reached....
The moment in episode 4 when Fisk beats up the ice cream guy is outrageous. Kingpin would never want to make a repeat of the "keep kicking him" scene from his childhood. He shouldn't let any child, let alone one close to him keep kicking a body, LET ALONE IN JOY. What a disgrace.
I beg to differ. I think it’s in his character to use his own childhood trauma to manipulate people. Remember the primal scream scene that he manipulated Bullseye in season 3?
@@nont18411 Yeah, but I don't think he'd do it to a literal child.
From an Echo promotional site: "Prior to being cast in the role of Maya Lopez/Echo, she did not have acting experience outside of a high school play."
I can tell.
It’s even worse when you realize that signed languages rely heavily on facial expressions & non-verbal gestures.
So the fact that she’s stone faced for the most part is just sad.
Echo to Kingpin in the finale: "I dunno. Just don't be a dick."
Timestamps
0:00Echoing
1:54 Confidence
5:45 The Format
6:43 Continuity
8:16 Excitment
9:05 Episode 1
26:00 Daredevil
40:43 Teaser
41:21 Discussion
52:52 Episode 2
1:16:16 A Bad CGI Scene
1:18:42 Discussion
1:32:10 Episode 3
1:58:14 Discussion
2:10:00 Episode 4
2:32:51 Have Come To Destroy Me, Echo?
2:37:00 Discussion
2:44:40 Episode 5
3:05:35 Discussion
Hero. 🫡🫡🫡
Thank you, Julian. Very cool
Thank you very much.
Thank you
@@crazypantz3492 you're welcome!
Apparently there was a bunch more stuff with two deleted secondary villains and them running the NYC crime empire in Fisk's absence. And Matt Murdock was supposed to be communicating with Maya via texts, advising her on her next moves. The flashbacks structure was rearranged and how her powers developed and manifested was changed. I still don't think it would have helped, but it explains why the show feels so odd and empty.
My guess is this show tied closely into the original version of "Daredevil: Born Again", and when Disney saw that it was shaping up to be a train wreck, they gutted "Echo" and took out anything that could conflict with the blank-slate revamp. What a nightmare
Wellz they also couldn't have HER relying heavily on a MAN. *scoofs*
Imagine the feminist articles that would be written about the able bodied White patriarchy holding the hand of an indigenous physically challenged, haierng impaired alternative beauty standards WOMAN!
Ah. Typical Disney. Instead of reflecting on making something shit or fixing it, they just try to do damage control and prevent the stink of it from affecting something else that they'll likely screw up anyways.
Sounds like Disney didn't want to have their strong diverse lady hero taking advice from old Matt "Mansplaining" Murdock with all of his "helpful" text messages... and now they're ghosting this whole series. 😏
@@othertalk3313 Funny, I wrote a similar comment yesterday and now it's gone. I also touched on the pigments differences and made a comparison with what Rey said to Finn when he saved her from the bombings when they first met in Jakku, so let's hope that was what crossed the line for the TH-cam directives and keep an eye on it. ;)
I’m absolutely fucking terrified of how they’re gonna butcher Daredevil dude. Such an amazing show in the hands of such a fucking dumpster fire of a company.
The scene of her building the gun out of random stuff reminds me of the scene in Scary Movie 2 when Cindy builds a bulldozer out of random things in a freezer.
I've heard her people use every part of the bowling alley
40:35 "Kingpin was found shot in the head near Goodsprings, he is due to make a full recovery; now that is crime you can count on. This is Mister New Vegas, filling in for Mister New Vegas."
The accidental puns by Fringy are the funniest fucking things I've ever heard
The slow zoom-in on Rags sitting there in silence built up more tension than anything in the show managed to do.
Time?
@@uneterostardust8233 1:56:30
A man who learn Chinese as a flex can't learn sign language for someone he's invested in
I heard people had their reservations about this series, although I didn't hear much conversation about to be fair.
@@pbradics3670 * chef's kiss *
Yeah, I heard most people just ended up going to a casino instead.
I see what you did there.
I hear this show has gone off the reservation.
It cant stand on its own two feet
Well, this level of terrible writing isn’t exactly unheard of. But even then, I thought a lot of the jokes in it were pretty tone deaf.
I hear Echo is a big fan of the Deftones.
🤔
Some how Kingpin returned.
Well, he was wearing his hard contact lenses
And he's stopped crying so he means business this time.
From the dead?
The dead speak!
3:00:54
[sigh]
...I don't want to defend this, but the sad part is that this is actually how RPG warheads work. They have a self-detonation mechanism. After they fly roughly 950 meters/3,000 feet they just explode. The explosion wouldn't look as fireball-y as it does here because Hollywood just thinks all explosions look like gasoline explosions for some reason.
"for some reason" It started because a lot of actual explosions don't look that impressive on the screen (especially grenades), then it just became the standard. Sort of like why every plane falling out of the sky sounded like a Stuka siren.
Wow, someone actually did a full breakdown?
Even Disparu just did the entire thing in a single video
2 videos.
Video 1 is ep. 1 and 2
Video 2 is ep 3 to 5
Angry Joe covered the whole show, it was quite hilarious and he gave it 3/10 😅
@@RaifSeverenceI wouldn't want Disparu to end himself doing all episodes in one go!
XD
So... Kingpin speaks Chinese, Japanese, (assumed) Russian and Italian... that we know from Daredevil. But he wouldn't learn ASL? He makes a contact lense/earpiece ASL translator that translates his speech into ASL, but not just simple text?
Being deaf is completely impractical for stealth and/or combat, as you'll have no idea if you're making noise or not nor would you know if someone else does.
I don't know why, but I binged this season in a day. I think it took years off my life
Wow, you spent years of your life in a day. The shit is so dense it bends space and time.
@@Zed012This show is a Hyperbolic Time Chamber
Imagine actually watching this show, oh wait you actually watched it… wtf is wrong with you?!
“Echo is the one thing that brings me joy in this life.
Echo is the one thing that brings me joy in this life.”
-Beebo Boogins
"Kingpin crying while telling a deaf woman I love you is the only thing that brings me joy in life"
-Retardo Baggers
"Echo is the one thing that brings me joy in this life.”
-Beebo Boogins Jr.
These Fringy puns are unacceptable. He's gone native.
He is realy scalping the bottom of the barrel.
This show didn't have a leg to stand on. It was pushed out with no noise made. (:
Once again it is remarkable how EFAP manages to write a far more compelling and endearing plot for the show they are watching while watching it! Making Kingpin learn signlanguage to communicate with her seems like the absolutely simplest yet most effective method to give him some good qualities and to make us believe he cares for her.... but instead they give her wonky lenses to translate speech for her. It is not just needlesly complicated, but it also robs us of the bonus points Kingpin would have gotten as a parental figure. What we are left with is a terribly confusing relationship between Kingpin and Echo where it is never clear what we are meant to think or feel about their relationship. Him yelling at her in the end that he will kill her like he killed her father just seems to be the laziest and quickest way the writers could make us root for his downfall..... its just so cheap and bad, and needlesly so, but no one cared about the show at all clearly, apart from Vincent D'Onofrio who always gives it his best. That "again" he delivered when she was about to shoot him again just perfectly described how terribly this show is.
What's worse than that is having Kingpin hire then immediately kill interpreters.
It's a knock against Kingpin's intelligence because he's now creating loads of loose ends and risk for himself and his precious Echo. All he has to do is order one of his trusted people to learn sign language or find a live-in interpreter that he can actually trust. Even if the cops are useless, the interpreters still have friends and family that might be just a little angry.
It's a knock against Echo's sanity because now, even as a little girl, she's 100% comfortable with killing innocent people every day. That's kind of unprecedented. I don't think there's a single human being in the history of the Earth that's been able to not even care enough to come up with some kind of dubious rationale for why their viciousness is totally fine and ethical.
If Echo is representation (art is not parliament, but for the sake of argument) then Echo is terrible representation.
@@zigzag1630 I totally forgot the fact he has to keep killing the interpreters when I wrote my comment, fuck that is so stupid.
Echo is.. confusing as a character. Because I feel the show (as usual in modern mcu ) forgets that she is an awful person too, she just happens to be the protagonist.
It does the opposite. Im rooting for kingpin now
Never in my life have I awaited an EFAP as much as this. Episode 3 made me pause in frustration with the overwhelmingly stupid idiotic decisions both off & on-screen.
Wait, you're watching this trash?
Why did you even watch it?
Why watch it at all?
I didn't see Echo. The EFAP breakdown will be the only way I consume this series...
That's what I call an echo chamber.
Completely unrelated to the topic but I’ve heard you guys reference Archer a lot. Before they went on to make Archer Adam Reed and Matt Thompson created a show called “Frisky Dingo”. It was cancelled after two seasons and it’s criminally underrated.
There’s a lot of references and jokes that made their way into Archer as well.
I feel like Fringy would thoroughly enjoy it.
I know Fringys brain is 80% Simpsons references, 5% critters, 5% Mario, 5% Joeover and 5% soundtrack’s but there’s room for more Fringo!!
What percentage is South Park and Star Wars
Frisky Dingo is one of the most underrated things in all of existence.
What percentage is "NOOOUGH.exe"?
Also yeah Frisky Dingo was a stellar standout from that era of adult swim!
Boosh! And or kakow!
@@averymasters as an Australian “nough” is just in our DNA; nough percentages needed.
When the show is so had that even efap themselves skip the episode parts and go straight to the one vieeo mash-up
Sid Meier’s Civilization 6 has a playable Cree faction, with Native American musical themes adapted to what they project to be modernized. It’s a great tune.
Why didn’t Disney do something like that? Ah, yes, because they’re creatively bankrupt, and view this as checking a box above genuinely exploring culture.
No. Play _Down By the River to Pray,_ because that seems culturally appropriate. Right?
Kingpin was obviously not shown because they didn't have the budget to de-age him...they spent it on CG pants. Pretty sure that's it.
Guys, I think Disney Marvel might be off, it doesn't smell right, and there are dark green and grey blotches all over it.
That’s one way to describe so many mids - stunning and brave my a$$
This is the bad Rat that will bring joy to my life.
The Don Protects
@@Amarenamann
The only Joy.
Till the next Rat brings the next only Joy in life.
Fringy pointing out the Boyz II Men song is the only thing that brings me joy.
This show is kinda like youre eating a sandwich.. and then a car horn goes off and you wake up and realize that the sandwich wasn't real
Staying up late on a work night to listen to efap is the only thing that brings joy to my life.
Fringy noticing boys to men in the right hand drive vehicle is funny.
The only thing I found slightly interesting in this entire show was the use of "Down In The River To Pray". It's a good song, but it's an old Gospel song. So it's pretty funny when they go directly from talking about the mystical Choktow pantheon, to making her culturally inspired dress... with a song about a completely opposite culture and religion playing over it.
That's where it would be appropriate to do a modern pop song, something brassy and meaningless, just providing audio cover instead of meaning. But they picked an explicitly religious song that name drops a completely different (and famously exclusive) God from what she's supposed to be following. How do you make these kinds of unforced errors? Is ANYONE paying attention over at Disney?
That really stood out to me. WTF were they thinking putting that song in this show, especially at the time that they did?
"Even in my mockery i overestimated them."
The motto of the Babylon Bee
With the amount of money Disney is paying they couldn't be bothered to do animatics / animated voiced storyboards of the entire season? They could've saved millions just by knowing if what they have is a stinker. It's how Pixar used to do things and it paid dividends.
That weird green screen shit blew my mind. It reminded me of the knock off "Nigerian assassin Vs the xenopredator" that some rando group of guys with 10 quid made on a camera phone. Except at least those are entertaining and funny as shit
A full EFAP on a Wedneday? Longman and crew have truly blessed us🙏🙏
Yet Kingpin cared enough about his business to learn Japanese
I was trying to come up with a good “echo chamber” pun and then scrolled down and found out that about 3 dozen people are already funnier than I could ever be. Oh well, I’m sure my bad-joke muse will sing to me next time.
My favorite sequence in this has to be the mean lady at the roller rink throwing Maya's shoe/foot back to her. First off, our bad guys are already kidnappers, so, not great people, but the show then makes sure we understand this one lady is also ableist, because that's important to highlight. And then it not only turns out that letting Maya keep her prosthetics and related personal belongings MIRACULOUSLY aids her in escaping, but then you realize... wait, how does it even make sense that ableist-lady decides, being disgusted/confused by a prosthetic, to then throw it back to Maya? Wouldn't the lady instead just leave it where she found it? Or throw it AWAY? Or destroy it in front of Maya?
This is immediately followed by Maya intentionally breaking a fluorescent tube in her confined room. Brilliant.
The writers seemed focused on removing the 't' from native and putting it in front of 'ruthless.'
If RvB has taught me anything, it's that the reason why Kingpin's breathing is messed up from getting shot in the eye is because nobody thought to give him CPR when they found him.
I think what they were going for or at least wanted to with the relationship of Echo and Kingpin is something along the lines of Jinx and Silco from Arcane, but they failed at each and every step of the way.
Even in the deaf show they don't spare us from trashy pop music in the wrong place.
Echo walks up to the skating rink counter and stares silently at him, but she calls him the jerk because he doesn't understand her.
55:00 It's not like we have plenty of evidence of how adult women fare against even teen boys in ball sports...
1:45:00 Even if they shot her it would be in the pegleg.
2:12:00 He asks her which one she wants and she can't just point at it, she expects him to learn another language.
2:11:12 With the comics, Marvel used to have a different line called Marvel Knights, which is where they would publish their more adult-oriented stories such as The Punisher.
Yep. MUCH better than Marvel Spotlight.
Really saddens me what has become of the Daredevil characters since season 3. They have made some massive overhauls to Born Again recently and are now bringing pretty much everybody back, so maybe it won't be completely worthless
I can't believe that Rags freaked out about the water being CG in the flashback on episode 2 when the first dude in the canoe looked like the Agent Smith CG figures in the burley brawl from Matrix Reloaded.
Son of a deaf, they usually wire the house with flashing lights that have different timing on the flashes for doorbell, phone, cell, sleeping alarm. They also have a large pad that shakes the bed with similar timing.
These are Hollywood people though. They can't figure out how to wipe their own asses. 🤣
It’s funny they recast the hammer cause they could’t be bother find the actual hammer from the show or get a replica, Disney are so lazy.
Knowing Disney, that hammer is now a lesbian as well.
Oh oh oh, I know something about that! Oklahoma has a pan handle because of an agreement concerning slavery (1820 Compromise) where peoples above a certain latitude would be free and below slave. After the agreement, It was taken from the top of Texas (Texas was a slave state) as it would have been free, so they and made a no mans land. It became so unruly that finally the federal government decided it needed to belong to an actual state, and they awarded it to Oklahoma. Now you know, rest well Fringy.
The Ancient Choctaw invented Green Screens and CGI. This show is a tribute to their inventiveness.
I like when they had a title card going "Alabama"... pretty sure Alabama, as a location, didn't exist back then...
I think "WHAT DID YOU DO?" was actually an editor's note that accidentally made it into the script.
Such a shame when that happens in your multi million dollar productions.
The only Echo that's not being heard in empty theatres.
Sometimes, it takes a deaf person to make us finally be heard. Says a lot about society :'/
Great reaction, I like this new format. All the fun of a Efap movies in a Efap episode.
Yeah, its easier for us to enjoy
But Im afraid its gonna get hit by YT
I think Mauler has talk bout this bfore
Truly one of the EFAPs of all time 😂
My mom's almost deaf, she use an alarm that makes vibrations on the bed to wake her up.
I can’t believe how many times Fringy walked into those leg jokes. Really put his foot in his mouth on those ones.
So, the moral of this whole series is that overcoming trauma is just as simple as "letting it go". Sweet.
Just heal it with tribal magic. Use your fingers, it's easy.
Bit of a mixed message when applied in the context of Native American culture...
In Hawkeye, Echo was portrayed as being very capable, but still nowhere near a match for Hawkeye. Daredevil is renowned for being one of the best martial artists in the marvel universe, he should have made her look silly in a fight.
I never heard Mauler so disappointed while watching media than when he said
"Ah no you're going to be nekid... oh"
as the choclate fell off from the nekid choclate people only to reveal them fully robed suddenly.
"I got a bag of nuts!"
"He's got a bag of nuts."
This is the kind of comedy gold that keeps me coming back.
Guns are the lightsabers of the MCU.
1:14:46
You know that your show is fire when the EFAP crew recjoices over discovering that she works for the postal service and therefore drives a car with the steering wheel on the right!
" "Marvel Spotlight" focuses on introducing standalone content that doesn't require background knowledge of the MCU story arcs. It's designed to showcase individual projects characterized by their grounded and character-driven storytelling approach. The Disney+ TV series "Echo" is the first to be released under this new Marvel Spotlight banner."
LOL
Not hearing any good reviews of thsi project. It seems to be stumbling out of the gate. Apparently there was a mishap at the stump store. Now she has 2 left feet.
😂😂 "stand alone content that doesn't require MCU knowledge" but the show heavily references other shows to the point of needing 25min flashbacks lolol
@@R3cov3ry Precisely! Haha. And it heavily depends on Kingpin and Daredevil stuff from a show that wasn't even on the MCU.
Well, I guess they are technically right ij that regard, hahaha.
@@DickDickstein Turns out it couldn't stand on its own.
The "what did you do" transition at the end... Wtf ahahahahah
This show isn't even hilariously bad, it's just *nothing*. Everything is wrong: it's deaf by a thousand cuts.
Take my like and get out. XD
1:14:08
From the moment I understood the weakness of my flesh it disgusted me, I was craving the strength and the certainty of the blessed machine
The huge amount of CGI is probably because of the many reported reshoots and redrafts this show underwent before they decided to release it all at once...
Jeez, this show just doesn't have a leg to stand on.
I didn’t even expect ya’ll to cover this at all.
Also im annoyed that they didnt use Echo's comic powers. Probably because they already had female Taskmasker in Black Widow
Man it's like these shows are made for the sole purpose of being made fun of by everyone else.
It's the Disney business model.
@@allouttabubblegum799 Thought their business model is quantity over quality
This show was supposed to be a return to form like with the Netflix shows. The fact they couldn't commit to the fights scenes, by cheating with CGI and terrible blocking because the actors can't fight, tells me the Daredevil Born Again Series is gonna suck HARD.
That skating rink fight scene is a contender with Mando S2E6 for the worst fight scene in history. Absolutely embarrassing.
Even having watched Hawkeye, I have no idea why Fisk had Maya's dad killed. That is the inciting incident for this series, and we are never given an explanation for it.
I've watched this entire EFAP, but if anyone asks me to tell them anything about Echo, I simply would not be able to say a word
I still can't believe they actually had Echo "hit" a bird and then lie about it... Like, i assume most people will take a specific idea from that which isn't the most positive view on a character, to put it lightly.
That said, I think i have to give credit and thumbs up to series. Seeing the flashback everytime she used her not-lame powers, I couldn't help but see as a skill cut-in/cutscene from a game. Especially the part where she was throwing stuff and it did flashback each time, i think was like 3 times in a row. Hell, the ending was basically her using her ultimate which lets her buff her female teammates.
And now, while writing this comment, i've basically forgotten what happened (what little there was). Oh, i guess there was the whole 'healing' SadPin deal at the end that, imo, came off really spicy... like i don't know what they intended with that in regards to the message or theme.
It's funny to me how the kingpin literally just invented subtitles with extra steps.
To me it makes it look like he thinks she can't read.
I don't mean to be that guy but at 2:45:54 I just realized her mom could've used that to heal her so she wouldn't be deaf. If she can heal animals there's no way she can't just save her own daughter.
"She kinda forgot."
Out of curiosity, why was this not an EFAP TV shows episode?
Echo: And I... am all the Indians.
Geez. I just watched the "I am all the Jedi" scene and it's even worse than I remembered.
Does echo not know how to read? 😅 why does she get a contact that makes arm motions instead of subtitles?!?! That just seems silly to me
"I don't care, nor do I care to be convinced to care. In fact if you try to make me care, then you are the true Wumbo." -Mine Own Self 2024 when thinking about Echo.
2:06:32 Rags really states a very good point. Most of the advertisement or reasons stated to watch this show was because there was a lot of Choctaw representation, as they said. But there's absolutely nothing here. You could give this weird ancestral Attack on Titan Paths superpower to any ethnicity and nothing would change. You have:
1. Weird ancestral ability
2. Little Village with native people
3. Little traditional festival at the end.
They could have been Choctaw, they could have been Spanish, German, Italian, Greek, Chinese, Japanese, Australian whatever you want! There's so little unique or representative here.
It's been brought up that if you only knew Kingpin and Daredevil from this show, She-Hulk, and Hawkeye you'd think they were very lame characters.
But, don't worry, guys, Born Again will be great. Marvel would never screw that up because they respect Daredevil so much and fear fan backlash... Or so I've been hearing.