Tascam 388 vs. m30 // Comparing Vintage Preamps!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 4 ส.ค. 2024
- Let's compare Tascam 388 vs Tascam m30 Preamps, and let's also record to tape on the Tascam 388. Do the preamps on these vintage machines sound the same? And how influence does the preamp impart compared to recording to tape? Same song, 2 consoles, 3 ways of analog recording in my home studio (in a Barn).
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I was given a special dispensation from the Vatican which permits me to play bass with a pick. Do not attempt this. You may be struck by lightning.
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I felt like this would be the time I'd get it right. I performed the songs 3 times very similarly. I didn't touch the mics. I wore hermetically sealed undergarments. I thought I crossed every T and dotted every I. But alas. Another flawed test. Despite my ineptitude, maybe we can learn something from this test. But first will someone explain to me what a preamp is? And if that's the preamp where is the postamp? Science may one day tell us.
Inadvertently, I learned just how colored the preamps on the m30 can be, and I really like the overdrive it can produce! 100 times better than any digital 'plugin' distortion in the box. So that was pretty cool to learn.
#taperecording #homestudio #analog
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Tascam 388 vs Portastudio 424 -> th-cam.com/video/Jp0w5Y9gGHQ/w-d-xo.html
Awesome vid, shout out for that remarkably tasty bit of slide at the end on the lil epiphone
Thanks Robin!
Another great video. Glad I stumbled onto your Channel! I recently upgraded from a portastudio 424 to an m30 with a Tascam 38. So it's been great to see you messing around with the m30.
wow that sounds like a killer set up right there. what's the tape width on that? it probably sounds much better than the 388
@@travisraab it’s a 1/2 inch 8 track
@@travisraab Yep half-inch. I'm still getting the hang of it, but hopefully it'll be sound good here in a bit..
Haha the stank. I haven’t listened on headphones for the actual audio comparisons yet but I really enjoyed watching you in your Narnia studio and everything just sounded great anyway! Will be interesting to listen back in more detail.
Awesome! Thank you Sleeping Orchard! looking forward to it
388 sounds great thru the tape, but the preamps on the M30 sound better straight in…You need to hook the M30 up to a tape machine and see how that sounds. Great vids on this stuff, man! Super helpful
Laying it down! Love it!
Thanks Reve!
I also just checked m30 and 464mkii (ver BBE) with Vsti 808 Roland ! and also surprised with "Kick" from M30! very compact and full like a little Comp! Thank you The video is worth listening to!
Thanks! M30 is a really great machine I agree
Just got a perfect working Tascam 234. It sounds great, but I agree with what you said about removing reverb from the room. It kind of automatically does that. Not the best on acoustic guitar, cuz it's rough capturing those higher airy frequencies..but on electric, bass, synth, vocals sounds really sweet
I hear you! Ooh 234 classic machine!! Congrats
Bought a Tascam M30 new in the early 80's to link up with my Teac A3340S 4 track. Just the best of times with that rig. I'm in the process of transferring all those 10" tapes to DAW. Really surprising how good they sound!
The good ol days!
M30 Preamps have less bandwidth and dynamic range. They are probably the exact same IC chips (TL07X if I remember) running on lower voltage rails. Tascams M series (M308, 312, 320 and B variants, M388 ) were at the time the most professional mixers they had on the market. I believer they have 15volt rails, but it has been a while since I was inside one. The M30 Looked like the other M series boards but were the lower end of the line and more similar to some of the earlier TEAC branded (like Teac 5) small boards in design. I have owned every board I have mentioned aside from a M88, but they are the same as a M308 in design. Haven't used one in a long time but I DO remember that you could hit the front end of the M308/12/20 a lot harder than the smaller Tascam boards and the noise floor was a lot lower too. I actually really love the EQ on the M series boards and if you recap them with high quality caps and do a little improvement to the ground buss, they are very cool and quiet boards. Weirdly the Tascam 520 than the 320!
Makes me wanna find myself one of these bad boys but it's seems kinda difficult. What do you think about a Teac Mb 20/2A as an option to pass my frustration ? Ever heard about those preamps ? Great videos by the way and your studio seems awesome to work in !
whoa that thing is pretty cute, Simon! never heard of it. no xlr in but it would be cool in a little home studio
Hey Travis, definitely the Tascam 388 (on tape) has the best sound. It was fat and clean, full spectrum man... I could smell it from over here!! Another fab vid and you're layin down a solid on the \m/
thanks dave! i agree with your assessment! I have a lot to learn on the skins. think my kick drum is salvageable? it's driving me to commit drumicide
@@travisraab put a front head on that kick... get a good dedicated kick drum mic (Beta52, AKG D112, Audio D1, EV etc there are many). I wasn't hearing any definition on the kick... but your guitar sound is excellent!
@@haddadbeats cool!
Great playing and niche comparison!
So how would you feel about me running my Two Tascam 244's into a standalone 1/4" 8-track reel-to-reel? I think I can finagle it as a way to upgrade to open reels while using these portastudios as 2 mix banks without having to get something like that nice M30. Just gotta see if dbx in the signal path will mess anything up. Happy recording.
I do not think that is possible with two different motors
Thanks for this video. I just bought a Tascam M312.... My old mixer is a Yamaha RM 804. Does the M312 Pre amp the same on 388?
I talk about preamps and stuff in my course tinyurl.com/3u7nysmp
Picking up the m30 in two weeks - I might need an assist with getting set up. Any videos you can recommend for going into a focusrite and plugging guitars straight into the board? Cheers!
very cool chance! i have a few videos on the m30 on my channel. definitely get the manual!
M30 Preamp sounds warmer and rounder. more natural sound bass I would say. The 388 give more push and brightness to the signal, making it cut through the mix a little bit more. It is really subjective but in the context of that song I prefer the M30 sound. Anyway both sounds nice.
thanks Marcel!
The thing I love about the 388 is how it works with it's tape. It's got a touch more brightness and it works perfectly with the tape. I did prefer the kick and bass sound of the M30 but think this is easily remedied. But the clarity the 388 still get's even after tape is what makes it a killer machine.
the m30 can do clean also, I just drove it accidentally. I was pretty impressed with driving it though. kills anything in the box. the 388 is crazy clean i was amazed when I bypassed the tape!
@@travisraab I'd love an M30 or something like it to go with my 388. PS: here's a piece I did on the 388. Totally different vibe, but maybe you find it interesting.. th-cam.com/video/tJoTxUIIDNc/w-d-xo.html
This is really entertaining to watch! Can you do a comparison between Modern Model 12 with these older ones?
thanks puipuia! sure if i get my hands on a model 12 i'd be happy to
I have a Model 24 and it's awesome. I know nothing about home recording, but I'm having fun learning. The Model 24 sounds good. I'd love to hear some comparisons to the older school Tascams. I'd send ya mine, but I use it too much lol. Love this channel!!!!
Are you referring to micing the drums through the desk that gives you the impression of a collapsed room width?
If that's what you refering to, maybe the channels crosstalk comes to play here.
interesting! crosstalk I didn't think of that. thanks Dany
the m30 definitely sounds fuller in this vid!
you're right!
Not at all Nerdy when you happen to have both gems, but I almost forgot about the M-30 since Vu meters were out for ages and just did not get it. due to your video , which was ehm...rather confusing, I grabbed the M30 again, and wow , it is fully functioning. simply magic. do not remember doing any work with it last 10 years...so I am starting dubbing on this again. the Tascam have the best workflow and layout in the business. Reel Workhorses. Roll it!!!thanks man, for the messy comparison. after all, they do not differ that much, but can not compare going to tape in the end. that will diffuse everything. nothing like tape compression.
😎
good stuff. is the m30 the same preamps and internals as the m312b and m320?
The m312 looks even more like the 388 than the m30. Just looking at it from the top
@@travisraab true, i thought you compared them a few months back, but i think i was mistaking some other models.
@@a.stockton4817 havent got my hands on the m312 or m320 yet!
Any quick insights on how to get signal out of the m 30? maybe an m 30 tutorial video?? I really enjoy the content. Thank you!
You can't get any signal at all from your m30?
@@travisraab Thanks for the reply! Every channel peaks when the att is set to 0 I tap the mic and I tap the mic. The only time I can hear anything thru my headphones or see the needles move is when headphones and monitor are set to submix. Idk. I plan on getting my hands on a copy of the manual. Thanks for your time. And again, the content is great! I hope you keep it up!
@@michaelleko1894 first of all set the att to the next notch nor beyond so it stops peeking. It's not in front of me but submix out should at least get you an aggregate signal. This is a super non intuitive machine and the manual is a necessity
Cool, was this with DBX on the tape? Looks like it was turned off on channels 5-8 so curious if you were trying it with and without DBX
I think DBX was off on everything. def off on drums always. it might have been on for guitars this time
Yes I could hear that little tape hiss once I put headphones on. It's worth it though! I track bands live on mine sometimes so I have to roll with the dbx if we don't have time to mess with levels between takes. Even with DBX on it still rounds off all those transients and adds some sub frequencies that makes the digital versions some how dull and harsh at the same time@@travisraab
Tascam/teac have quite a mad circuit , The EQ's are quite unique design, I tried to build them once as I had got hold of the design , never worked though, strange design. Loved all the models they made with Teac. They can lack warmth compared with more transformer based pre amps.
I don't know too much about circuits what is strange about them? Which circuit is the warmest?
I don't know as I never had different models to test at the same time. They all used similar designs though until late 90's when it changed with the porta one 4 tracks etc. The desks that had the frequency pot and gain pot combined had these designs. The frequency pot was 2 pots wired in series , it wasn't the usual standard tone circuits. My electronic tutor at the time was very puzzled by it. I guess the best desk I used was the M320 connected to a Tascam 1" 16 track. Was very cool. Miss it very much. @@travisraab PS , love your channel, good work.
@@corindingley7797 🙏 thanks
fow did you connect your m30 to the interface? line in?
Yes
what version of dbx is in the 388 ?
I'll have to check
Mmmm30 drums... au natural... Deluxe! I'd sleep with that open hi-hat (in my humble opinion, of course). I would really like to hear what would you do
with them in a "proper" mix...
🤣🤣 yeah that's a good idea i should do full mix!
I notice that both preamps sound amazing despite this being youtube. The M30 was more rounded sounding. Try the Aquarian head on your kick, they have a ring around them. Could have been a gimmick but it sure wasn't. edit: the exact model was aquarian super kick II.
Yeah I need to figure my kick out....
@@travisraab I don't know if this will help but although one might fantasize about a long release on a kick and it might work in really sparse recordings or electro, I found that whatever you need to do to shorten the release as much as possible helps, and focus on the sound of the attack part. And then obviously try to get rid of any ringing/spurious sounds. Getting the drum set to sound awesome outright is best but then you can also EQ a bass drum into something nice, maybe more so than other instruments. I'm sure you know all this stuff better than I do. I don't know what they did in Erykah Badu's Soldier but that's quite the kick if you like that particular sound. Sort of "dusty" and you can almost feel the air it moves.
What hi hats are you using? They sound neat
I think dark ks?? i can check when i'm back up there remind me
@@travisraab cheers for the recommendation on these hats, just arrived! Great sound ✌️
Just got a tascam 388 after waiting 10 years for the planets to align, near impossible in the uk!!
that's what i hear! wow what a find. congrats man that's huge!
@@travisraab cheers travis! Thanks for the good content ✌️
8 may be wrong but don't they have the same pres? My under standing was the m30 was a 388 without the tape deck. I have an m520 which is dope and I've been using it for everything since I got it. Go Tascam!
I think the pres are from a very similar era. m520 is a beautiful machine! go tascaaaaam
Does anyone know if the teac 144 has the same preamps as the m30
I don't know exactly but I don't think so.
@@travisraab damn I recently got a 144 but the motor is frozen. The mixer side works great but idk if it’s worth keeping it or just selling it for parts:/
The highs sounded better on the 388, the bass definitely cut through with the m30.I'm currently using an m35 mixer into a digital da38 tape recorder and it sounds pretty good, not as sterile as in the box.
Ooh da38 def has an appeal sounds like a nice combo! Thanks for lending your ears Frank
Frank any ideas the difference in the tascam d38 v d88 ? Thanks
@@saren6538 I think the 88 has more features, you can go to any tascam recorder chat groups and find out for sure. If my memory serves me right there were 4 diffferent models over the years
Hey I also use a M-35 Mixer. Mine distorts way early. at about -7 dB it begins to overdrive. Normally with other mixers it's at about 0 dB. Does your Mixer also distort early?
Maybe I need to calibrate that thing or something. But besides that it sounds amazing.
@@thallrudedjentstorm1756 mine does not distort at -7db but I really don't hit it too hard because I'm recording to digital tape.
good morning :D
Morning!
Sorry for My Bed England :'(
How do you set levels for recording?, I’ve got my hands on and m-30, do you use the monitor output?, do you pull the monitor knob all the way up or the fader below?, aahhhhh so many question. 😂
You should make a video for dummies about “How to set gain and record with an analog tascam mixer”. 🤣
M30 is prob one that confuses the most people out there! I should prob make some more videos on basic recording. Not sure if enough people are interested though
@@travisraabI am!! Please do one haha. A full run down on the m-30 would be amazing, just got one. :)
@@julianmunyard4802 i talk about it in my course tinyurl.com/3u7nysmp
@@travisraab you’ve convinced me
The reduction in ambience / increase in tightness you're hearing may be a result of crosstalk. The signal bleeding into the adjacent channels can make emphasize the mono part of the source. It's kind of weird! (or it could simply be the tapered off high end of tape, de-emphasizing the high end of the reverb, who knows!)
Yeah I thought it was #2. But a couple people have mentioned crosstalk. Thanks for your input!
Nerd checkin in
M30 sounded more mono and glued probably due to the guitars being less bright.
@@cheekbone4554 i hear you
Slappadatbass, mon
and now i'm cancelled
Instruments you couldn't record?
Sure
@@travisraab You couldn't record them because of the interface preamp ("sound bad") or because of some physical configuration aspect the m30 now caters too? Apologies if I'm missing sumthng seemingly obvious!
The $2 Tascam preamps always sound thin no matter which unit you’re using. I lived in the Tascam world for years and one API preamp changed everything for me.
are they $2 wow. I hear you , scott!
Come on Scott you can’t compare an api fully fledged pre amp to to a mixer that just happens to have preamps .. but we hear you
What api pre amp model are you referring to ? Thanks
to really hear the character of some preamps you have to at least make one really overdriven mix to push things to the max.
Seems to be that ou're a big mac demarco fan ;-)
I'm not a super fan, but I got really into one of his albums in like 2015 or 16. he's got some great tunes, and also gets cool sounding recordings. he's great.
@@travisraab your recordings sound great, too!
@@MrGingerPirate thanks so much!
My monitor speakers sucks.. I can't hear much of a difference.. need to get my headphones!
lmk!
@@travisraab Now that I have my cheap koss headphones on and I can hear a difference! 388 vs m30 there is a difference no question about it. The first comparsion the m30 sound tighter than 388 - the 388 sounds more open, more space, more presence! m30 more base and more punch to it and hum, if I'm not mistaken. The second case where you isolate the guitars it's opposite! Weird.. 388 to tape you have hiss (naturally) and it has less space in sound but that's the nature of tape at that speed (7.5 ips). Don't know if the 'reverb' feeling to the sound would increase if you overdrive the guitars when recording to tape.
@@Mute67 good ears mute!! thanks for lending them🤓
@@travisraab You're welcome! I don't think you can go wrong with either m30 or 388, both sounds great in their own way! 👍
Yeah you overdrived the guitars, but it sounded good though
I agree with you Jason!
M30 kick!
it's fatter right?
@@travisraab Yeah! I think you said in another vid, M50 pre amps are about the same as 388 but this shows M50 are beefier and round it out better.
Also - I getting a little lost when you talk about routing the pre amps through your daw. Are you saying you mic the drums through m50/388 and then put it thru clarrett w out any of the clarrett pre amp?
Thanks for the great content!
@@littlevibetown yeah my clarett has 8 channels. only 4 of them have preamps. so when i use an external preamp I use the preampless inputs on my clarett.
I think something to consider regarding the differences are that this just how the kick sounded without any eq on the pres. it's not clear if after applying eq they would sound identical, or which preamp has greater dynamic range. i would need to go a lot deeper before making that call. but right off the bat yeah m30 seems to have more low end on the kick
@@travisraab Trav, the preamps are the same on these, but is EQ the same? One just came up locally. Are the 388 and m30 boards dfferent?
@@littlevibetown they are not identical as i once thought. both very useable though. how much do they want?
Wanna sell me the Tascam m-30? Lol
Man I'll think about it!
@@travisraab haha sweet, if so I’m in VA so not too far
@@travisraab got lucky and got one! I’m trying to figure out how to send effects to separate tracks, do you have an idea?
@@vask8ers1 you absolutely need the manual
same same but different, who cares, they really sound like an early 80s mixer with bunch of hiss and so called "analoginess" that i see all over this channel... idk.... both can print a record or sound like trash. Like always.
great addition thanks