Well THAT was an ordeal to put together, so thanks for taking the time to watch. All references are in the video description. Huge thanks to Private Internet Access for sponsoring. Head to www.privateinternetaccess.com/NostalgiaNerd to check out their VPN deal!
Good lord, what a mess! Nice work piecing this chaos together into something easy to follow. Now I’m wondering if some of the odd “”Commodore”” products I’ve come across from the 2000s were manufactured by anyone even half-legit.
@@TeppichPilot Just enhance it to Atari Commodore Siclair Apple Records, this would add some lawyers of Apple Records, the company founded by the Beatles 😀
@@TeppichPilot What we really need is a Commodore Sinclair Tandy Amstrad Atari Thompson Dragon Adam Altair DEC Sun Micro Compaq Gateway Aquarius eMachines Data General Eagle Kaypro Zenith NeXT Be Rainbow Tandem Silicon Graphics Osborne Data General Wang Packard Bell computer.
38:26 There's my son holding a C64 box for our "Commodore 64 Christmas" video! I didn't realize "CBM" had ripped our pixels too. Great work digging into this, Nostalgia Nerd.
Unless someone from Jack Tramiel's family, or the Ghost of Jack Tramiel himself, appears and says "Here is our latest product", just assume it's a scam!
The C64 mini, and the The C64(full size version yet to get an official US release), have not been scams, but overall I don't blame you for thinking this way, as I've heard so many times over the years that Commodore is making a comeback, and it always fails in one way or another. Once it was so bad it was just generic stick style Mp3 players with the name on it lol!
To be honest if Jack Tramiel and Irvine Gould themselves rose from the dead, and it was confirmed to really be them beyond all doubt, and they somehow both managed to agree with each other long enough to create a new product and bring it to market, I'd still assume it was shit, because most Commodore products were. The Commodore 64 and Amiga were outliers and borderline flukes and even then were plagued by incompetence and bad decisions. Every other computer Commodore ever made was somewhere between bad and complete garbage, and I have my doubts about their calculators.
These things are "skinsuits". None of these businesses have any connection to the original creators, engineering or vision. None of them have particularly novel or exiting ideas either, which is why they are glomming on to old brands.
Only exception i remember, vaguely, probably, was IBM phone with original integral scheme piece from end of '80s. One of the first comercially available. 'MrWhosTheBoss' have a review of it in some compilation. It allegedly was't half bad, if you're dashing out for nostalgia type.
@mipmipmipmipmip that goes for a lot of old once proud brands that stood for excellent quality. The Chinese have also been buying up a lot of old automotive brands that were shut down for decades, just to use them to sell unimaginative boring junk cars in the west - that's why MG suddenly came back with cars that do in no way resemble what the brand once stood for
This story is deeply relatable. I myself was struck blind as a youth and the best surgeon in Rochdale restored my sight. The first thing I saw was a Ford Galaxy. For that reason I've spent the last 20 years wandering the country as a homeless drifter handing out pieces of paper with 'OWNER OF FORD MOTORS' written on them. It's good to hear Italians can share that same dream.
I would think it’s a little nod to the old school days when Commodore thrived. Though it’s definitely not “read-only” memory in the case of the phone lol
This was bloody amazing, mate, and as someone who's had 'fun' with trademarks in the past, it's mind-boggling that this ended up the way it has. Also, I realise videos like this take loads of time to put together and may not perform as well, but I really would love to see more stuff like this from you! Long-form content for the win! Down with the congealed algae-rithm!
I bought one 😂 They weren't actually low powered, just overpriced and a bit pointless. They did have big plans to develop the brand further, but the guy behind it died shortly after, and that was the end of it
The idea of an entire PC in a keyboard form factor is pretty neat. In the era where TV's and monitors have looped around to being one and the same again, I feel it could have a lot of utility. You could have a portable PC that actually has a touch of power to it, without being an overpriced overheated gaming laptop with a 37 key chiclet keyboard..
I'd love to see a crowd funding campaign for Nostalgia Nerd to buy a licence to use the Commodore name. Not sure what he'd do with it, but it'd be good for some lulz.
Holy crap NN That was one hell of a video to put together. I can't even imagine how much it's taken you to gather all these facts. Hats off for putting together this video!
I would never ever buy any new product with this logo or name. The real commodore died with the end of the cd32 and 1200 computers. The original company pissed it away, and that’s how it should be left. Every single company that has used the name and or logo is scum, purely after your money with fake promises, and should always be avoided. Thanks for the effort in making this video, a tragic and tacky end to a once great company, that almost had it all, but threw it away, many times!
CD32 and 1200 were Amiga products, Commodore just happened to own Amiga at the time, but they were actually their own entity, which is also why Amiga was sold off on their own when Commodore went bust.
@@alpzerlaken Hyperion did NOT make any computer EVER! And they have barely made any software or OS improvements in over a decade. They somehow get a few developers to work for nothing, or next to nothing, but the only thing they are a little competent at doing is lawsuits.
This is like watching hyenas contending bits of a desiccating corpse. Personally, I think the brands of historical computer companies like Commodore and Atari should be simply laid to rest and just remembered for what they were in all their past glory.
I still didn't watch the whole video, so I don't know if it's mentioned, but Paolo Besser was the director of Zzap! and then went to work for The Games Machine, which is the only paper videogame magazine still alive today in Italy. Also he's pretty easy to find online: from facebook to the TGM forum itself.
@@kaisersoymilk6912 yep, being Italian and a long time Amiga owner, I bought TGM many years ago, so I already knew who Paolo Besser is, and his involvement in the Amiga scene. Which is, frankly, a further motive of disappointment, knowing that's he's involved in the current CBM "endeavors".
@@QuintusCunctator I have to believe there is some kind of rational reason for him to have a 40% stake. I mean his hard work on AROS scene is phenomenal. Perhaps he genuinely was convinced that the branding could be secured for future products or something?
Apparently you only have to pay 900 EU to bribe Italiant patent officers and they throw in the TM'd logo. But that's not the twist the twist is they realized they were ALL Leos during the LEO launch party where - twist #2 the music was 8bit chiptune inspire Electro-Swing.
* I blame the head-scambino guy's hairdresser!! I mean with 'tufts'* like that you gotta be tough, really play the _Part _ but one should ensure like holding a drink that's been _Spiked_ to be getting the right kind of attention cause when cause every story at somepoint has the _buzzed in Steps on the side_ up to the moment when when the outcome will be only one of possible _Split Ends._ When one is you being the focus of a _Flock Of Seagulls_ and everything you do starts with _Bangs_ and ends like a cape being hurled off in that way a vamplie might spin it as he decloak. But now you feel like you have to deliver in one singe night it's the winter theme is really pushed by that fact fancy cape spins seem caused a snowfull of melting no one-snow man and Pieces of you float down all around landing on some people who you want left in "perm" cheery, balanced lke with a "Flat Top" or left feeling _Bald_ with nothing even if that can feel _Real Smooth_ it's short term . it's literally all UpDew you don't wanna get that _Fuzzy_ werewolf chills on the _Nape_of your neck and have _Hair Standing_ feeling like you're looking at the world from inside a fish _Bowlcut...._
I remember when Commodore was advertising within the Tron Legacy 3D Blu Ray. And I remember the "fake spat" between Nintendo and Commodore over the name "the 64". 2 things came about from it, an agreement to use "C64" and "N64" as short names and no one uses just "64", and Commodore had some C64 games on the Wii Virtual Console.
I said “Jesus Christ” in perfect unison at the start, and from then knew I would enjoy this. Had all manner of iffy branded tat over the years from whichever company happened to be flogging the commodore horse that year.
Amazing effort putting this together mate. As a big C and Amiga fan of the 80's its just so sad to see how things have gone for our beloved Commodore. Once one of the biggest companies in the world, to this tit for tat on their name, very depressing.
as far as my observations go, the both italian "Commodores" used to be a single company, but now they go separate ways, that's why we have "Commodore Business Machines" and "Commodoe Engineering" now. seems like they weren't agreeing too much on what to do with the stolen brand...
I love your stuff. I need to watch more of it, but I do try to keep up and all. I love shorter type videos, but the longer ones are amazing too! Thank you for the good stuff! ❤️
There are enough cowboys involved in this to staff a ranch. The tactic of dissolving a company to avoid posting accounts needs closer scrutiny. If their phone/s were one off bulk purchases that didn't sell very well I can see the sense in just sending out replacements as they would have the stock to do so. This would also explain their aversion to monetary refunds and would also explain the people who got no phone at all. They wanted to appear as credible as possibleto keep those orders coming in even if they had no stock. No wonder they don't like publishing their accounts.
Great video. In Argentina we had Garbarino stores selled brand new Commodore PC around 2010... with original logo.. .then they switched to a new logo. Now they are only selling a Commodore mouse.
Amazing producing one of the best videos you have made yet. I felt like I was watching a top notch movie. I was glued to the screen from beginning to end
Your research is unmatched!! Living in the US and trying to just get my hands on C64 Maxi has been almost impossible, other than paying way too much to get it shipped from Europe. I would love for a company to if nothing else start making C64/128 or even Amiga's using new parts.
Really? I managed to get a C64 Maxi way back in March 2021. There is a few facebook groups that always post when Amazon gets a supply in. That is how I got mine and I had it shipped to Canada. The Vic 20 remake I still have never gotten though and those were only limited time, so I guess I am SOL on that one.
Fantastically made documentary, really appreciate the time and effort you take to produce them especially as you only use a minimal amount of stock footage.
That was clearly a lot of work and research... well done! I remember the first time I saw the phone. I just rolled my eyes and moved on. These same kind of shenanigans have happened with the Atari name and trademark. Maybe you could make a video about that too?
@@doedsstierna It's a machine that came out in the early 2010's. It was an all in one computer that had a micro ITX motherboard (if I remember) and ran something called Commodore OS Vision. It actually looked a lot like an Amiga 500. But I've never seen one in the wild... like most recent Commodore gear.
Brilliant investigative journalism. I’m a Chartered Accountant and all your facts and readings were correct. On another matter if you look at Aros and Icaros desktop, perhaps do it as a piece on how the Amiga is still being taken forward with MorphOS and Amiga OS4.1 Final Edition.
Honestly, I wish trademark law allowed a brand such as Commodore to be permanently retired, given a respectful final sendoff without expiry. When a brand was so iconic as Commodore, and then ceases to be meaningfully used for a long period, I don't feel *anyone* should have the right to revive the brand unless they were personally involved with the brand in some way back when it was meaningfully active. There has to be some lineage for the brand to mean anything, frankly a financial exchange with a holdings company does not quality as lineage in my book. Perhaps this is a hot take, but frankly, when it comes to works of creativity and engineering, transfer of a trademark without transfer of associated talent is misleading and anti-consumer, and I wish it were not permitted.
just about everything in the world today is owned by holding companies, pension funds, and companies with fake addresses. There's a couple mailboxes in Luxembourg that famously are home to a few thousand companies that sit on just as many brands and trademarks, but have never produced anything of note. We really need to make it a requirement that companies produce something that can be considered an actual product in order to hold onto their IPs.
Extremely comprehensive and informative documentary. Thank you for taking the time to put this all together. I agree with your final assessment, that regardless of who actually owns the IP no one is really using it properly. If I held it I would take a good hard look at a project like the Commander x16 and say "hey wouldn't it be fitting if that was a commodore branded computer"? In my opinion that would be a real and proper use of the brand.
Such a shame when enthusiast "rip offs" are so much more legitimate than what the legal trademark owners are doing with it (or more accurately, what they aren't).The X16 project and TheC64 mini/maxi are such loving homages and it pains me to see them needing to act like "legally distinct" ripoffs just to avoid these trademark trolls. Either do something to preserve the brand's legacy or let it rest in peace. Same with the other fondly remembered brands of yesteryear.
Seriously interesting investigation into the current state of a retro brand. Who else takes the time to make videos like these? A welcome diversion to the game pickup and top 10 game videos. Excellent.
In Argentina there are some discutibles electronic products with commodore brand on it. Pc, notebook, tablet, mouse , the cheapest junk possible. The Commodore brand is registered to Garbarino sa (Elettronics Gdo) , the C logo is a different, but close. It 's a shame, and i feel a little malinconic to see this brand scalping era happening.
Really great investigative journalism. You usually don't see his level of work these days on main stream media let alone You-Tube. Could you be nominated for an award for something like this?
all I can say is: wow. and thanks for your efforts in researching all of this. I knew about _some_ shenanigans going on around that trademark over the years, but never realized what a cesspit it was/is.
"As synonymous with computing as ICL" Considering I've never heard of ICL until today (and had to look it up on Wikipedia), perhaps not quite as much synonymous outside of the UK; odds are most North Americans have never heard of them either. In any event, another interesting and informative video, keep up the good work!
Wait a minute a couple of years ago I bought a Commodore mini - basically everything was built into a replica keyboard. it was shipped to the US from England I believe. Was this another case of a company using the brand name without permission?
Thankfully they didn't actually use the Commodore branding, only implied it. It would have been a real shame if a legitimate use was shot down in favor of such "technically legal" scummery...
Very nice! Loved the video but i missed references to the commodore licensed icomp products like the c64 reloaded mk2 board or the licensed powersupply..... also the new and licensed c64c case remake was not mentioned.... these were by far the most relevant and licensed commodore products in the past 10 years....
Commodore has always been known for its shady business. Ever from the start on towards the end a bunch of happy go lucky sort of business men tried to get out as much profit as they could. The name Commodore Business Machines was "borrowed" from International Business Machines well known for it HIGH QUALITY office equipment. "Commodore" bought MOS Technology and its MOS6502 Microprocessor, which accidentally looked as two drops of water like the Motorola 8600. Former Motorola employees started their own business producing a microprocessor for a fraction of the costs. If the real research is paid by somebody else I can produce very cheaply! The name "Commodore" was never a good name. Still people who own a computer made by Commodore have the fear their machines will break down, the ever increasing power supply goes on increasing till the machine is fried. All the crooked MOS Technology chips eventually stop working because they were made in the cheapest way, not build for a century like IBM. All of the present owners of all of the trademarks of Commodore got their brand-names out of bankruptcy sales by shady law firms. Non of these companies hold a real trademark because there is nothing traded except for the trademark itself. Whoring out a logo and a name is not a business!
There's a lot more to MOS technologies than that. Their real invention was the ability to correct microprocessor lithomasks without having to redo them from scratch. That saved them tons of time and money. They could crank out new chip designs faster than anyone -- the C64 was designed in a whirlwind turnaround that's hard to top even today. This let them drop the bottom out of the market. But that advantage didn't last.
Great video, thank you! As the Commodore smartphone was announced I was tempted in the first place but found out soon they've rebranded some cheap china phones. At this point I jumped off.
Absolutely fantastic video, brilliantly researched and had me intrigued all the way to the end. Bravo Pete, Ps: I've not got a headache but it was worth it. 👍
As my maintenance man said... "Take a shit or get off the pot!" Now with that said, its unfortunate that it has ended up in rebranded products. But it seems like "Commodore Engineering" has plans for something unique.
The alignment of the C in that Commodore logo looks really broken 😶 I wonder who puts out all the Commodore merch that are for sale nowadays? I found both t-shirts and coasters with the Commodore and Commodore C64 branding when I was in Stockholm a few weeks ago. Thanks for digging down in that rabbit hole!
Thank you for investigating this fly-by-night outfit that's tried to cash in on our memories of Commodore. Sadly the Icaros Desktop gets dragged into this, because it's a sharp-looking AmigaOS continuation that's fun to play with in a VM.
Eeeh infogrames snatched those years back and rebranded to Atari , Atari is actively developing and publishing games to this day so there ain't a chance in hell for the name to move again But they did release that VCS console thing recently and that is actually a proper fully custom job, not just badge engineering
@@Space_Reptile I’m more curious about where all the Atari computer IP resides currently, like the system ROMs, case designs and branding, etc, because that seems to have been passed around a bit, and I can’t tell where it is right now. I think for a time Time Warner owned it, so that’s probably where it went to die.
That's a deep dive! Thank you for this investigation. These trademark hoarders and little-leaguers seem to make sure, that soon there's no brand to fight over. That's really sad IMO.
The fact that the holdings company can just sit on the trademark and contribute nothing while stifling innovation is a lot more ridiculous and silly then Mario and Luigi trying to sell cheap Chinese smart phone to aging Gen X/Zers.
Mario and Luigi are Commodore fans too. Although I must give it to you that Laurel and Hardy made better products with the commodore licence, the target it's the same: aging GenX and millennials.
It’s difficult to fully root for Commodore Corporation even though they’re the legal trademark owners. I see three entities, none of which are doing a class job stewarding the Commodore legacy :(
Well THAT was an ordeal to put together, so thanks for taking the time to watch. All references are in the video description. Huge thanks to Private Internet Access for sponsoring. Head to www.privateinternetaccess.com/NostalgiaNerd to check out their VPN deal!
I just realised it's an hour long. I'm constantly itching for a distraction from depression in entertainment, so you've just saved my evening!
The big ordeal is verry much appreciated! Wow, that must have cost a load of time. But as always: great video!
@Nostalgia. Really good work. Enjoyed it! And I never even used a Commodore.
You can't really trust the history of a brand name very much. I say this as the Managing Director of Acorn Computers Ltd
I did not even realise an hour went by as I watched this video! What a journey down the rabbit hole of corporate nonsense!! Pure Entertainment!!
Good lord, what a mess!
Nice work piecing this chaos together into something easy to follow. Now I’m wondering if some of the odd “”Commodore”” products I’ve come across from the 2000s were manufactured by anyone even half-legit.
Spolier: they weren't.
@callMeKenpai Nice to see you too.
@callMeKenpai He is kinda always here, and also in the 8-bit-guy...
@@sophiacristina *'s comment section.
It's all just a bunch of copyright trolls fighting each other. I guess the Dutch gentleman has the strongest claim, but who knows?
Somebody should just throw IP caution to the wind and introduce the Atari Commodore Sinclair.
You mean the Atari Commodore Sinclair Apple, this would really make some lawyers rotate in California :D
@@TeppichPilot Just enhance it to Atari Commodore Siclair Apple Records, this would add some lawyers of Apple Records, the company founded by the Beatles 😀
You forgot Amstrad
Applatari Commodair
@@TeppichPilot What we really need is a Commodore Sinclair Tandy Amstrad Atari Thompson Dragon Adam Altair DEC Sun Micro Compaq Gateway Aquarius eMachines Data General Eagle Kaypro Zenith NeXT Be Rainbow Tandem Silicon Graphics Osborne Data General Wang Packard Bell computer.
Outstanding piece of investigative journalism here, I'm blown away.
Just when you thought you couldn't open up that old can of worms again, damn 😅
That part is good but the background music detracts.
38:26 There's my son holding a C64 box for our "Commodore 64 Christmas" video! I didn't realize "CBM" had ripped our pixels too. Great work digging into this, Nostalgia Nerd.
Unless someone from Jack Tramiel's family, or the Ghost of Jack Tramiel himself, appears and says "Here is our latest product", just assume it's a scam!
The C64 mini, and the The C64(full size version yet to get an official US release), have not been scams, but overall I don't blame you for thinking this way, as I've heard so many times over the years that Commodore is making a comeback, and it always fails in one way or another. Once it was so bad it was just generic stick style Mp3 players with the name on it lol!
@@CommodoreFan64 at least they didn't try to pretend they are THE Commodore, just that they created a fan service product.
If the “ghost” of Jack Tramiel appears to sell me something, i’m just going to go ahead and also assume it’s a scam.
To be honest if Jack Tramiel and Irvine Gould themselves rose from the dead, and it was confirmed to really be them beyond all doubt, and they somehow both managed to agree with each other long enough to create a new product and bring it to market, I'd still assume it was shit, because most Commodore products were. The Commodore 64 and Amiga were outliers and borderline flukes and even then were plagued by incompetence and bad decisions. Every other computer Commodore ever made was somewhere between bad and complete garbage, and I have my doubts about their calculators.
Jack had nothing to do with the development of Commodore computers, except financial. Engineers working at MOS did.
If he wasn't solidly wedged in that coffin, I'm sure Jack Tramiel would be spinning in his grave.
@Lassi Kinnunen 81 Jack Tramiel had a few sons....
This is bordering on being on bad enough for him to start shaking the dirt loose and spinning his coffin through the earth.
I'm sure he's lost some weight by now....
Turns out his spinning coffin burrowing through the center of the earth is due to emerge somewhere in the Pacific in a few hours time.
Morticians lift up the skin and shave fat off to make the customer an easier fit in the coffin.
These things are "skinsuits". None of these businesses have any connection to the original creators, engineering or vision. None of them have particularly novel or exiting ideas either, which is why they are glomming on to old brands.
"That's not your childhood friend, it's someone wearing their skin"
Only exception i remember, vaguely, probably, was IBM phone with original integral scheme piece from end of '80s. One of the first comercially available.
'MrWhosTheBoss' have a review of it in some compilation. It allegedly was't half bad, if you're dashing out for nostalgia type.
coming back to these video and this comment reminds me of what happened with the whole intellivision amico thing
What passes for Polaroid these days is an excellent example of that.
@mipmipmipmipmip that goes for a lot of old once proud brands that stood for excellent quality. The Chinese have also been buying up a lot of old automotive brands that were shut down for decades, just to use them to sell unimaginative boring junk cars in the west - that's why MG suddenly came back with cars that do in no way resemble what the brand once stood for
This story is deeply relatable. I myself was struck blind as a youth and the best surgeon in Rochdale restored my sight. The first thing I saw was a Ford Galaxy. For that reason I've spent the last 20 years wandering the country as a homeless drifter handing out pieces of paper with 'OWNER OF FORD MOTORS' written on them. It's good to hear Italians can share that same dream.
Nothing says “rebranded Chinese phone” like the onboard storage being referred to as “ROM”
Actually, that's very common in Spain, and my Samsung phone has 16 GB ROM.
@@Ndlanding ya, pero no es correcto y los "chinorris" son los que mas usan esa forma de indicar la capacidad de la memoria
@@HaikuOezu Lo que nos faltaba -- una respuesta en español. Speak in English, ya dumbfuck!
I would think it’s a little nod to the old school days when Commodore thrived. Though it’s definitely not “read-only” memory in the case of the phone lol
@@ej22_gc86 yeah I would think that if every "AliExpress special" low cost Android phone didn't have that same "RAM + ROM" labelling
This was bloody amazing, mate, and as someone who's had 'fun' with trademarks in the past, it's mind-boggling that this ended up the way it has.
Also, I realise videos like this take loads of time to put together and may not perform as well, but I really would love to see more stuff like this from you! Long-form content for the win! Down with the congealed algae-rithm!
Let’s not forget that whole Commodore USA thing that happened some time back. Where someone was selling a low powered PC in a C64 shell.
Yeah, and also the Commodore OS that was just a bloated Ubuntu
I bought one 😂 They weren't actually low powered, just overpriced and a bit pointless.
They did have big plans to develop the brand further, but the guy behind it died shortly after, and that was the end of it
I got confused at the start with Leo and Leo Nigro! 😂
The idea of an entire PC in a keyboard form factor is pretty neat. In the era where TV's and monitors have looped around to being one and the same again, I feel it could have a lot of utility. You could have a portable PC that actually has a touch of power to it, without being an overpriced overheated gaming laptop with a 37 key chiclet keyboard..
Nostalgia Nerd and the Commodore Heist.
The sequel we never expected, but one we definitely needed.
I was fully expecting you to become the owner of the commodore trademark by the end of the video 😅
I'd love to see a crowd funding campaign for Nostalgia Nerd to buy a licence to use the Commodore name. Not sure what he'd do with it, but it'd be good for some lulz.
@@TheKnobCalledTone. That's pretty much what Besser did, too bad they couldn't think of anything better than rebranding an android phone.
"I OWN THE COMMODORE BRAND NOW......... in 3 countries" xD yeah something like that.
That would've been fantastic 😄
Wow. You should totally consider doing more investigative deep dives. This documentary was brilliant!
I'm having the sudden urge to move to Italy and start my own company using the Commodore logo.
Doughnuts? Or cars?
@@diamondsmasher I feel like the Commodore logo would look pretty good on a donut box.
Holy crap NN
That was one hell of a video to put together.
I can't even imagine how much it's taken you to gather all these facts.
Hats off for putting together this video!
"I tried contacting Massimo numerous times but he seems evasive"
I wonder why
Been following this for 30 years and still not sure what the hell is going on.
I would never ever buy any new product with this logo or name. The real commodore died with the end of the cd32 and 1200 computers. The original company pissed it away, and that’s how it should be left. Every single company that has used the name and or logo is scum, purely after your money with fake promises, and should always be avoided. Thanks for the effort in making this video, a tragic and tacky end to a once great company, that almost had it all, but threw it away, many times!
CD32 and 1200 were Amiga products, Commodore just happened to own Amiga at the time, but they were actually their own entity, which is also why Amiga was sold off on their own when Commodore went bust.
One of the finest pieces of investigative journalism that I witnessed. This videos on par with the "Polibius" video on the channel "Ahoy". Great job!
The Amiga brand is also still around and technically never officially died.
That is what they say about Intellivision as well.
Atair is still alive somehow
Hyperion made Amiga computer
@@alpzerlaken Hyperion did NOT make any computer EVER! And they have barely made any software or OS improvements in over a decade. They somehow get a few developers to work for nothing, or next to nothing, but the only thing they are a little competent at doing is lawsuits.
Don't say that, everyone will start trying to claim that brand next!
This is like watching hyenas contending bits of a desiccating corpse. Personally, I think the brands of historical computer companies like Commodore and Atari should be simply laid to rest and just remembered for what they were in all their past glory.
Atari just refuses to die and, frankly, I find that hilarious. Although they did publish Tycoon City New York, a PC game I really enjoy.
I still didn't watch the whole video, so I don't know if it's mentioned, but Paolo Besser was the director of Zzap! and then went to work for The Games Machine, which is the only paper videogame magazine still alive today in Italy.
Also he's pretty easy to find online: from facebook to the TGM forum itself.
@@kaisersoymilk6912 yep, being Italian and a long time Amiga owner, I bought TGM many years ago, so I already knew who Paolo Besser is, and his involvement in the Amiga scene. Which is, frankly, a further motive of disappointment, knowing that's he's involved in the current CBM "endeavors".
Just like Rock'n Roll. It is dead but let's keep dissecting & observing its decaying corpse, shall we? :)
@@QuintusCunctator
I have to believe there is some kind of rational reason for him to have a 40% stake. I mean his hard work on AROS scene is phenomenal. Perhaps he genuinely was convinced that the branding could be secured for future products or something?
I know that was a ton of work, but honestly the Commodore community sorely needed someone to clarify all this and you did a bang up job!
Nostalgia is a helluva drug.
I see this Commodore Business Machine as a scam with a twist, with only one purpose: To live on a well-established and loved brand...
Apparently you only have to pay 900 EU to bribe Italiant patent officers and they throw in the TM'd logo. But that's not the twist the twist is they realized they were ALL Leos during the LEO launch party where - twist #2 the music was 8bit chiptune inspire Electro-Swing.
Scammers love the power of Nostalgia. Because you can sell people anything with the lowest effort possible.
* I blame the head-scambino guy's hairdresser!! I mean with 'tufts'* like that you gotta be tough, really play the _Part _ but one should ensure like holding a drink that's been _Spiked_ to be getting the right kind of attention cause when cause every story at somepoint has the _buzzed in Steps on the side_ up to the moment when when the outcome will be only one of possible _Split Ends._ When one is you being the focus of a _Flock Of Seagulls_ and everything you do starts with _Bangs_ and ends like a cape being hurled off in that way a vamplie might spin it as he decloak. But now you feel like you have to deliver in one singe night it's the winter theme is really pushed by that fact fancy cape spins seem caused a snowfull of melting no one-snow man and Pieces of you float down all around landing on some people who you want left in "perm" cheery, balanced lke with a "Flat Top" or left feeling _Bald_ with nothing even if that can feel _Real Smooth_ it's short term . it's literally all UpDew you don't wanna get that _Fuzzy_ werewolf chills on the _Nape_of your neck and have _Hair Standing_ feeling like you're looking at the world from inside a fish _Bowlcut...._
"Now that you have regained your sight, you have to become Commodore's boss"
The amount bullshit oozing out of this dude is unbelievable
I remember when Commodore was advertising within the Tron Legacy 3D Blu Ray.
And I remember the "fake spat" between Nintendo and Commodore over the name "the 64". 2 things came about from it, an agreement to use "C64" and "N64" as short names and no one uses just "64", and Commodore had some C64 games on the Wii Virtual Console.
I said “Jesus Christ” in perfect unison at the start, and from then knew I would enjoy this.
Had all manner of iffy branded tat over the years from whichever company happened to be flogging the commodore horse that year.
As an Amiga 500 veteran, thanks for this informative nostalgia trip. The last days of Commodore and the Amiga brand are a sad tale indeed.
The boob marketing for that phone is just hilariously silly it still cracks me up. 9:40
That is some fantastic information! Thanks for doing all the legwork in finding the facts behind all of this.
That 'you must become commodore's boss!' origin story is so weird.
Strange story!
@@Alibm80 ikr!
Jesus Christ just let these old brands die already. Thanks for the video!
This feels like an Open University lecture on Trademark and patent law :)
Makes me appreciate the non shady nature of "THEC64" and their operations.
As far as I’m aware they still haven’t made a US version of the Maxi right?
@@danhanson1032 I don't know, but I own the EU version
Great documentary! It was very interesting! You did a great job digging this out!
This was so well researched and presented. And super entertaining.
Amiga ten million from Finland, comes with a ten thousand ton press and a flamethrower. I bet I could get someone drunk enough to register it.
This was brilliant! I'm no short of awe of the research that went into this!
Pretty much a "Down The Rabbit Hole" episode but starring Nostalgia Nerd instead of Fredrik.
Amazing effort putting this together mate. As a big C and Amiga fan of the 80's its just so sad to see how things have gone for our beloved Commodore. Once one of the biggest companies in the world, to this tit for tat on their name, very depressing.
as far as my observations go, the both italian "Commodores" used to be a single company, but now they go separate ways, that's why we have "Commodore Business Machines" and "Commodoe Engineering" now. seems like they weren't agreeing too much on what to do with the stolen brand...
To have an authentic Italian read everyone's replies just warmed my half Italian heart 😊
Lynn Faulds Wood and John Stapleton would be very proud of you with this level of work :)
"You have no choice"
Unrelated, but the CBM Pet was voted best smartphone by users from the Borg Collective.
I love your stuff. I need to watch more of it, but I do try to keep up and all. I love shorter type videos, but the longer ones are amazing too! Thank you for the good stuff! ❤️
There are enough cowboys involved in this to staff a ranch. The tactic of dissolving a company to avoid posting accounts needs closer scrutiny. If their phone/s were one off bulk purchases that didn't sell very well I can see the sense in just sending out replacements as they would have the stock to do so. This would also explain their aversion to monetary refunds and would also explain the people who got no phone at all. They wanted to appear as credible as possibleto keep those orders coming in even if they had no stock. No wonder they don't like publishing their accounts.
Great video. In Argentina we had Garbarino stores selled brand new Commodore PC around 2010... with original logo.. .then they switched to a new logo. Now they are only selling a Commodore mouse.
Thank you for this entertaining video, my man. I was laughing so hard, what a trip!! This should be made into a movie. Also more power to you!!
Amazing producing one of the best videos you have made yet. I felt like I was watching a top notch movie. I was glued to the screen from beginning to end
WOW that was some rabbit hole, well paced and researched, I watched all the way through.
Your research is unmatched!! Living in the US and trying to just get my hands on C64 Maxi has been almost impossible, other than paying way too much to get it shipped from Europe. I would love for a company to if nothing else start making C64/128 or even Amiga's using new parts.
Really? I managed to get a C64 Maxi way back in March 2021. There is a few facebook groups that always post when Amazon gets a supply in. That is how I got mine and I had it shipped to Canada.
The Vic 20 remake I still have never gotten though and those were only limited time, so I guess I am SOL on that one.
Super quality piece of journalism and video here, might as well have been shown on tv!
Fantastically made documentary, really appreciate the time and effort you take to produce them especially as you only use a minimal amount of stock footage.
That was clearly a lot of work and research... well done! I remember the first time I saw the phone. I just rolled my eyes and moved on. These same kind of shenanigans have happened with the Atari name and trademark. Maybe you could make a video about that too?
What a mess that is! And you haven't even talked about the "Commodore Amiga" Linux machine that came out a while back...
Tell me more. I can't find the Amiga machine.
@@doedsstierna It's a machine that came out in the early 2010's. It was an all in one computer that had a micro ITX motherboard (if I remember) and ran something called Commodore OS Vision.
It actually looked a lot like an Amiga 500. But I've never seen one in the wild... like most recent Commodore gear.
I tried the Commodore OS Vision, that is just a over bloated Ubuntu with a lot of Commodore machines emulators
@@FloatingDogs not surprising. If it had really been groundbreaking it would have made more waves than it did.
Brilliant investigative journalism. I’m a Chartered Accountant and all your facts and readings were correct. On another matter if you look at Aros and Icaros desktop, perhaps do it as a piece on how the Amiga is still being taken forward with MorphOS and Amiga OS4.1 Final Edition.
Honestly, I wish trademark law allowed a brand such as Commodore to be permanently retired, given a respectful final sendoff without expiry. When a brand was so iconic as Commodore, and then ceases to be meaningfully used for a long period, I don't feel *anyone* should have the right to revive the brand unless they were personally involved with the brand in some way back when it was meaningfully active. There has to be some lineage for the brand to mean anything, frankly a financial exchange with a holdings company does not quality as lineage in my book. Perhaps this is a hot take, but frankly, when it comes to works of creativity and engineering, transfer of a trademark without transfer of associated talent is misleading and anti-consumer, and I wish it were not permitted.
just about everything in the world today is owned by holding companies, pension funds, and companies with fake addresses. There's a couple mailboxes in Luxembourg that famously are home to a few thousand companies that sit on just as many brands and trademarks, but have never produced anything of note. We really need to make it a requirement that companies produce something that can be considered an actual product in order to hold onto their IPs.
That story about losing vision and having a famous Italian surgeon restore it and all that mother business is the biggest porky I have ever heard.
Its a lost JoJo story
Extremely comprehensive and informative documentary. Thank you for taking the time to put this all together. I agree with your final assessment, that regardless of who actually owns the IP no one is really using it properly. If I held it I would take a good hard look at a project like the Commander x16 and say "hey wouldn't it be fitting if that was a commodore branded computer"? In my opinion that would be a real and proper use of the brand.
Such a shame when enthusiast "rip offs" are so much more legitimate than what the legal trademark owners are doing with it (or more accurately, what they aren't).The X16 project and TheC64 mini/maxi are such loving homages and it pains me to see them needing to act like "legally distinct" ripoffs just to avoid these trademark trolls. Either do something to preserve the brand's legacy or let it rest in peace. Same with the other fondly remembered brands of yesteryear.
What an amazing amount of research. Well done!
Great video and must have took a long time to edit and put together. Love your content as I have done for years. Keep up the great work buddy 🙂
Seriously interesting investigation into the current state of a retro brand. Who else takes the time to make videos like these? A welcome diversion to the game pickup and top 10 game videos. Excellent.
This was a truly fantastic video. Thank you for making this!
In Argentina there are some discutibles electronic products with commodore brand on it. Pc, notebook, tablet, mouse , the cheapest junk possible. The Commodore brand is registered to Garbarino sa (Elettronics Gdo) , the C logo is a different, but close. It 's a shame, and i feel a little malinconic to see this brand scalping era happening.
Its just a good lesson, to not buy a product just because it has a familiar logo on it.
Really great investigative journalism. You usually don't see his level of work these days on main stream media let alone You-Tube. Could you be nominated for an award for something like this?
Really well researched and educational as well. I never really knew about the trademark system before this.
Astounding investigative work there. Researching this looks to have been maddening.
These voiceover accents are fucking amazing hahahaha, such quality content mate!
This is brilliant :) Really enjoyed it :) Thank you! :)
all I can say is: wow. and thanks for your efforts in researching all of this.
I knew about _some_ shenanigans going on around that trademark over the years, but never realized what a cesspit it was/is.
Next level investigative journalism for a tech topic haha. Thanks, n. Nerd!!
Great video! Loved all the work and research you've done on this 👌
"As synonymous with computing as ICL"
Considering I've never heard of ICL until today (and had to look it up on Wikipedia), perhaps not quite as much synonymous outside of the UK; odds are most North Americans have never heard of them either. In any event, another interesting and informative video, keep up the good work!
I'll never unsee the chicken head now. God damn you
You haven't seen the Chickenlips april fools video, have you?
@@galier2 the retro recipes one.
Who would downvote such a video documentary?
Massimo and brand accounts for each Commodore-related brand he's tried to trademark thus far?
Wait a minute a couple of years ago I bought a Commodore mini - basically everything was built into a replica keyboard. it was shipped to the US from England I believe. Was this another case of a company using the brand name without permission?
Thankfully they didn't actually use the Commodore branding, only implied it. It would have been a real shame if a legitimate use was shot down in favor of such "technically legal" scummery...
Superb video very informative and interesting to see how it all panned out back and forth .
Very nice! Loved the video but i missed references to the commodore licensed icomp products like the c64 reloaded mk2 board or the licensed powersupply..... also the new and licensed c64c case remake was not mentioned.... these were by far the most relevant and licensed commodore products in the past 10 years....
Commodore has always been known for its shady business. Ever from the start on towards the end a bunch of happy go lucky sort of business men tried to get out as much profit as they could. The name Commodore Business Machines was "borrowed" from International Business Machines well known for it HIGH QUALITY office equipment.
"Commodore" bought MOS Technology and its MOS6502 Microprocessor, which accidentally looked as two drops of water like the Motorola 8600. Former Motorola employees started their own business producing a microprocessor for a fraction of the costs. If the real research is paid by somebody else I can produce very cheaply!
The name "Commodore" was never a good name. Still people who own a computer made by Commodore have the fear their machines will break down, the ever increasing power supply goes on increasing till the machine is fried. All the crooked MOS Technology chips eventually stop working because they were made in the cheapest way, not build for a century like IBM.
All of the present owners of all of the trademarks of Commodore got their brand-names out of bankruptcy sales by shady law firms. Non of these companies hold a real trademark because there is nothing traded except for the trademark itself. Whoring out a logo and a name is not a business!
There's a lot more to MOS technologies than that. Their real invention was the ability to correct microprocessor lithomasks without having to redo them from scratch. That saved them tons of time and money. They could crank out new chip designs faster than anyone -- the C64 was designed in a whirlwind turnaround that's hard to top even today.
This let them drop the bottom out of the market. But that advantage didn't last.
What is it with vintage computing brands and grifters? Commodore, Sinclair and Atari have all fallen victim at least once.
Makes me think about old video game companies not doing anything with their old IPs. Good stuff, and an interesting look to Commodore.
huge respect and kudos Pete for this -no doubt- herculean task you pulled off!
Great video, thank you! As the Commodore smartphone was announced I was tempted in the first place but found out soon they've rebranded some cheap china phones. At this point I jumped off.
Absolutely fantastic video, brilliantly researched and had me intrigued all the way to the end. Bravo Pete, Ps: I've not got a headache but it was worth it. 👍
Love your docu style videos. Great job.
Amazing work on this video! Thanks.
Awesome video really appreciate the work you put in 😁👌
As my maintenance man said... "Take a shit or get off the pot!" Now with that said, its unfortunate that it has ended up in rebranded products. But it seems like "Commodore Engineering" has plans for something unique.
Great for you to taking the time
The alignment of the C in that Commodore logo looks really broken 😶
I wonder who puts out all the Commodore merch that are for sale nowadays? I found both t-shirts and coasters with the Commodore and Commodore C64 branding when I was in Stockholm a few weeks ago.
Thanks for digging down in that rabbit hole!
Thank you for investigating this fly-by-night outfit that's tried to cash in on our memories of Commodore. Sadly the Icaros Desktop gets dragged into this, because it's a sharp-looking AmigaOS continuation that's fun to play with in a VM.
"Manufacture of men's underwear"
I 100% approve of this business plan for the would-be owners of the C= logo
Next up, finding out just where the Atari trademarks are mouldering in some trademark war chest in pieces.
Eeeh infogrames snatched those years back and rebranded to Atari , Atari is actively developing and publishing games to this day so there ain't a chance in hell for the name to move again
But they did release that VCS console thing recently and that is actually a proper fully custom job, not just badge engineering
@@Space_Reptile I’m more curious about where all the Atari computer IP resides currently, like the system ROMs, case designs and branding, etc, because that seems to have been passed around a bit, and I can’t tell where it is right now. I think for a time Time Warner owned it, so that’s probably where it went to die.
@@NoobixCube that I dont know either, would be worth investigating who owns the rights to the ST Chassis design and so on
Atari rolled off so much Atari and, consequently, so many bought and sold off those Atari, you could do a four hour video on who owns what game.
@@NoobixCube The arcade division is currently owned by WB iirc.
Very well researched, and very well said.
That's a deep dive! Thank you for this investigation. These trademark hoarders and little-leaguers seem to make sure, that soon there's no brand to fight over. That's really sad IMO.
The fact that the holdings company can just sit on the trademark and contribute nothing while stifling innovation is a lot more ridiculous and silly then Mario and Luigi trying to sell cheap Chinese smart phone to aging Gen X/Zers.
Innovation lol. That ship has sailed for Commodore.
Mario and Luigi are Commodore fans too. Although I must give it to you that Laurel and Hardy made better products with the commodore licence, the target it's the same: aging GenX and millennials.
Honestly id rather trust the business with more verifiable customers then shady and frankly mob vibe mario and luigi.
@@jameskosusnik1102 No mob, they from Milan :) They're also a bunch of computer nerds, don't be afraid.
@@kaisersoymilk6912 still doesn't mean they have business experience, sorry there fraudsters in my eyes
It’s difficult to fully root for Commodore Corporation even though they’re the legal trademark owners. I see three entities, none of which are doing a class job stewarding the Commodore legacy :(
Thanks for this nice video, you really dived deep into the matter. Very interesting. I like the Italian accents as well haha