Great presentation. I clearly shows the superior speed and power of the MiG-15 allowed it to dictate the terms of the fight with the F-51 forced on the defensive.
Mustangs, Corsairs, Sea Fury's all could out turn the Migs !!! The key is seeing them first and getting them in a turing fight keeping them in sight, this P-51 didn't see him behind !! Semper Fi
Being able to outturn your opponent when they have vastly superior guns, engines, and avionics isn't a huge advantage. A Fokker Dr.1 triplane can outturn a FW 190, but I know what I'd rather be in
@@TheWhoamaters I hear that, but the facts are the facts and WWll Fighter will and did out turn early Jets in WWll and Korea and also A-1 Skyraiders shot down a Mig-17 in Vietnam.
@@showtime112 victory disease that led to arrogance. The arrogance led to Macarthur retreating from Yalu down to Seoul and never to return to Pyongyang. Defeat for Macarthur and UN forces.
Actually I think the Korean war never ended, there was never a surrender, defeat or peace treaty, just a truce. It is a frozen conflict and both sides are still at war.
In Korea the jet pilots learned not to get into a turning fight with a P51. But the Mig was a better plane than the US Sabre jet. The Saber was rugged but the Mig was faster and could out turn the Saber. Both the Saber and the Mig were based on the German Messerschmitt P1101
Thanks for the comment. As for the basis for Sabre and MiG-15, I read that the MiG was based on designs made by Kurt Tank, the chief designer of Focke Wulf because that company was located in East of Germany and that's what the Russians captured.
Actually it was pilot quality that made the difference. The MiG and the F-86 were initially very closely matched. Eventually the F-86 started to gain the upper hand with constant upgrades including a redesigned wing and flying tail. The MiG punched harder but the lower muzzle velocity of its cannons often let skilled F-86 pilots escape while the higher velocity and larger concentration of .50 caliber bullets could end a MiGs day quicker. F-86 pilots reported they could tell when encountering a Russian “ Honcho” cause the MiG would just be way more aggressive. North Korean pilots just didn’t have the same flying style they said
General Chuck Yeager said the same thing when the USAF tested their war trophy MiG-15. Yeager was pretty sure he bent the stick trying to pull it out of a dive he said. The MiG-17 was said to have the same problem, considering it was just a slightly larger jet with a Klimov-VK-1S afterburning turbojet that makes sense
I seem to remember reading one of Yeager's books where he's talking with a Russian pilot and tells him he wishes they'd have made a movable tail and the Russion replies something like, "You dived that thing? I was terrified of it!"@@matthewcaughey8898
Technically, it's a bailout in those old aircraft. No ejection seats. And this is a flight simulator so we probably don't know if Aaron Abercrombie actually tried to bail or not. Most pilots know that if theur under 700ft it's futile.
@@matthewbittenbender9191 Yes, this is simply AI starting the bail out procedure without checking the altitude. Sources don't offer details on this matter but it is very likely that no attempt was made.
it wasn't a fair fight, I mean the only "advantage" of the P-51 Mustang was its maneuverability at low altitude (so the mig 15's also), the Mustang was slower then being piloted by a very good pilot it has at least a little chance to survive....
It was a clash of generations. History is not about fair fights, you do your best to have more advanced weapons than the enemy. Mustangs actually had pretty good chances of survival as long as they could see the MiGs. Because, MiG-15 really feels like a truck compared to the Mustang.
@@showtime112 you are right in terms of history and..you are right in everything ha ha. I was talking just about the game, and yes, first generation jets controls feels like driving a truck, at least in a flight simulator, I don't know if in real life was the same
Thanks! I was indecisive about what music to use for this video. I thought about using another Soviet 'fighting' song but eventually I decided on this film score type.
Many people don't understand what a complex scenario the Korean war was. First of all the k/d ratio can't be used as an indicator of success because: 1)Most non soviet pilots had almost no experience and that was even worse when piloting jets. 2)Migs had to fight at least a dozen of types of fighters, so you should at least consider the Mig/all US fighters k/d ratio 3)Most of the times migs fought they focused on intercepting bombers and almost ignored fighters, this made them vulnerable even to prop fighters since they couldn't fight back Secondly, another issue that I want to try to clarify is that in the 50s no korean government was good. At that time both of them were oppressive dictatorships with a long list of massacres of suspected opposers. It is only later that the South korean one developed into a modern democracy. Moreover in that period both USSR and US were oppressing their opposition (but Stalin did more) and the US were worse on the international plane because they helped dozens of right wing dictatorships rise in South America, Asia, Africa and South America, as well as ignoring the Francoist and Portuguese regimes. Also the UK and US made several plans to bomb down with nukes the eastern bloc as a preventive attack, which was an unfounded belief since Stalin's policy was purely defensive and he needed his bloc as a guarantee the Allies wouldn't attack the defenseless Soviet union on the spot. What I am trying to say in the second paragraph is that claiming only the Soviet union was bad in the early cold war is pure hypocrisy, thus flying soviet fighters in a game is by no way shameful, especially if only for the sake of entertainment
That was quite elaborate. And I agree that things are usually not black and white. We now have the benefit of hindsight but things were much less clear in 1950s through 1990s. You mention the Koreas, I heard somewhere that in 1960s, North Korean GNP was actually above the South. I will dedicate more videos to the Korean War to try to shed some light on the whole story.
@@showtime112 thanks, I by no means am trying to excuse the soviet regime but seeing people complain for you flying "evil" jets as a Russian it kinda angers me
@@jwhoward182 Actually, you don't know. You just jump to conclusions. I meant no kills during the dogfight part. The part when the Mustang gets shot down is nor really dogfight.
Actually, those ratios were later discredited even by American historians. They were much lower in reality. True, when fighting against inexperienced Chinese units, Sabres scored big. But against veteran Soviet regiments, things were pretty even.
You should also consider that in most of these engagements the migs focused on bombers almost ignoring the defending Sabres. When in the hands of experienced soviet pilots tasked with hunting fighters as well the k/d ratio rose a lot
While playing an early Microsoft Air Combat game I chose a Sopwith Camel flying against two BF-109 fighters and in every case I shot them both down by simply turning into them in a two dimensional battle as I never had to go vertical. But as shown here if you fly more than 30 seconds in a straight path you become a target. If depicted accurately he must have had a good reason to do that, low on fuel, assumed the jets had left, etc.
The pilot probably assumed he could run away. Some other Mustangs managed to do so. Maybe he panicked, it is hard to say. Generally, shootdowns usually happen when someone makes a mistake.
In the situation Showtime is presenting, The Yankee pilot was disoriented from previous engagement (he got separated from his group) and didn't see the much, much faster MIG creep up behind him. That's the in universe explanation for why the ai in this game mode is standing still, it could have happened exactly this way, by mustang being blindsided or the mustang just got shot during a turn as Showtime here is intentionally showing how not to place a gun solution on a target for the sake of the video presenting overshots, the gun should be ahead (and sideways bellow, in case of a sideways (deflection) shot) of the path of the target when approaching to shoot.
@@JebacPresretac101 The sources don't explain exactly how the kill was made except that one Mustang broke away and probably tried to escape. Maybe he didn't see the MiG. Most air-to-air kills occur because the victim doesn't see the attacker. If you see the attacker and do some good evasive maneuvers, you are very hard to hit. Such kills are relatively rare.
Zdravo, Showtime. I'll make a minor correction about the identity of the Soviet pilot who shot down Aaron Abercombie: he was Leyténant (Lt) Fiodor Vasilievich Chizh, member of the 72nd GIAP, 151st GIAD. But he was not a WW2 ace. Probably you mistook him with another pilot of the same surname who fought in Korea in a later period, who indeed was a 13-kills WW2 ace: Polkóvnik (Colonel) Vasiliy Ivanovich Chizh, who was comander of the 726th IAP, 133rd IAD. This unit fought during the last year of war (June 1952 to July 1953). Vasiliy Chizh scored two kills in Korea: the F-86F BuNo 51-2858 (334th FIS) on 24 December 1952 and the F-84G of Roger Warren (69th FBS, POW) on 15 January 1953.
Thank you for sharing that! The information about Lt Chizh actually comes from McKelvey Cleaver's book Mig Alley. It seemed a little strange that a WWII ace would still be only a lieutenant five years after the war 😁 Sometimes, when you dig deep you can find small mistakes in history books. For example, when I did a video about a HH-53 helicopter shot down by North Vietnamese MiG-21 in 1970, the book I used gave the wrong serial number of the helicopter, that one being shot down by AAA in 1968.
The (sad) irony is that without a moronic UK's PM the russians couldn't have build such an excellent fighter, they didn't have modern jet engines, only some old types from Germany'. Then mr.Attee send some RR Nene to comrad Stalin as a gift P.s. Stalin himself was really surprised by this monumental...".naivite"
That is not entirely true, axial flow turbojet, which is what German designed in world war 2, is more advanced in terms of design comparing to RR engine, but more difficulty to manufacture. All second gen turbojets are axial flow turbojets
@@lucastekkan both BMW003 and Jumo004 are axial flow engines, RR Nene is not. Nene is a technology dead end, but it was easier to produce. Russian had both 003 and 004 technology. So it wasnt that big of a deal to get Nene (It helped sure, but it wasnt such a big deal people made it out to be)
El MiG 15 era 200 Km/h mas veloz, subía y picaba mas rápido y tenía 4 veces la potencia de fuego del Mustang, no tenía ninguna necesidad de "pelea de perros".
I'm never comfortable with you flying for the Ruskies ,however I know for a fact that with a P51 it has to stay a turning battle, there's No way a P51 has a chance with a MIG15 unless you get into a blind spot or maybe the MIG is low on fuel? Good video
Think of me as an actor who is playing a role 😁 As for the Mustang vs MiG-15, the MiG basically needs to keep the speed high. If it slows down, it can become the target. In DCS, if you let AI Mustangs fight against MiGs at equal skill level, there are MiGs shot down as well. Thanks for the comment!
@@showtime112 Yep, you're right as a use to be war fighter it's challenging to let go some things especially when you know what the Soviet ideology is. Good video
@William Allford well I guess you're Right if you love murdering your own citizens- Stalin or Oppressing your own people - Putin, I'll end with those two murders, but believe me Hitler should of went to Stalingrad!!!!
@@ronaldwatson1951 yeah sure I am no soviet union excuser but I wont tolerate the equally atrocious crimes committed by the US during the cold war both in official and unofficial wars. You guys sure live well, but at the expense of others
@@andrygugli1928 I can't confirm or deny what you mentioned but what I know about Communism isn't pretty, and Democracy definitely has skeletons in its history. Only one answer - GOD
Thanks! True, early phase of the war saw some cool WWII style clashes between Mustangs and Yaks. However, Yak-9 is not yet available in DCS or even in IL-2. It it does become available, I will consider it.
@@hartmannf4169 You are right. They are special collector planes so I didn't notice them. But Mustang is available in Ill-2 so the P-51 (or more precisely, F-51) vs. Yak-9 can be done in it.
Oh yes! Me-262 had a lot of reliability issues and effective lifespan of the engines was extremely short. The top speed was also lower than the MiG's. This is a more mature technology.
@@showtime112 Oops! Sorry for the late reply, I did not see the notification. And even if the Germans had the chromium they neeed ri improve the engine life span? Also more manœuvrable I suppose ?
I wish you could make a movie from Biafra Babies lead by Count Carl Gustaf Ericsson von Rosen. That was really something to take down plenty of the Nigerian Air Force's MIGs Ilyushin bombers on the runway only with some SNEB rockets fired from lightweight civilian aircrafts (Malmö MFI-9).
Thank you for your comment and suggestion. I'm only very vaguely familiar with that story. From what I can see, it probably wouldn't be very easy to reenact in DCS World but who knows. I'll try to investigate a little more.
@@showtime112 I think all aircrafts are missing now but as far as I can see DCS could be the next modding platform after IL-2 Sturmovik 1946 (DCS has more modern graphics and I think physics too). The story is interesting and Von Rosen too, he was a real man of his ideas, not a typical mercenary type. And that war was a real asymmetric warfare, a guerrilla war fought with aircrafts in those missions.
Good stuff. It appears that Mustangs could outmaneuver MIGs easily. How did it happen that americans invented Sabres then?)) While watching the video I suddenly thought about the Falkland War. Harrier operations, that would be interesting too.
Mustangs could outmaneuver the MiGs just like biplanes could outmaneuver Mustang. However their time was over, just like Mustang's in the jet age. Falklands are very interesting but I think I'm going to wait for the map which should be released in the near future. Thanks for the comment!
Because the Mustangs can't put the guns back on the MIG15 once they outmaneuver it, the MIG is 2km away at that point. "Speed is life", which is what Showtime here is doing, mowing the lawn like a true f86 pilot, (doing horizontal turns) instead of going into the vertical and zooming back down on the mustangs. The correct way would be for MIG15s to climb to 3800m (~12k feet), and then dive down on the mustangs with the airbrake on once they spot them, then zoom back 1km up above the mustangs and zoom back down again. As to what happened in this scenario, who knows, but that's what the Korean War MIG15 vets said they liked to do, to cruise at 3800m.
I also forgot to mention that it's beyond easy to get a firing solution on that Mustang with a deflection shot, turning won't save ya, Showtime here is just pretending he can't aim for the sake of the video. Turning won't really save ya.
I was just kidding about the invention of F-86 :) The plane was commissioned even before the Korean War would break out) But it was remarkably shown here how old and new planes faced for the first time and tried awkwardly to figure out how to kill each other.
@@stevenbreach2561 true, everything that is currently happening in south America is the US fault. Cuba is communist but even there public services are a lot better than in Chile or Brasil
The might, even though it's a jet, could almost match the turning circle of a p51 at low speed. Testament to how bad a dogfighter the p51 really was. The key to its success in ww2 was the poor quality of Luftwaffe pilots when it reached frontline service.
@@slpkntmggt06 Even if it is automatic, there is still a flowmeter to let you know that the system is working or stuck on. Yes, you can turn the regulator to 100% continuous, but that wastes O2 unless you are at a positive pressure altitude, hypoxic, or smoke in the cockpit. I'm a retired Air Force KC-135 Crew Chief. Now when I point these faults out, it is in jest like the crazed canopies that I've seen here that should be replaced in real life.
Iznenadio bi se koliko ih je teško uloviti. MiG-15 je ustvari prilično trom u usporedbi s njima. Pogotovo roll rate mu je usporeni film. Ako Mustang obrne okret na drugu stranu, nema šanse da ga možeš pratiti.
As for this, DCS doesn't really have assets to cover it. No Osas, no older types of destroyers. Maybe someone will make some mods in the future. People are doing naval mids too such as Majestic class carriers.
@@showtime112 The process of destroying the destroyer Eilat is very special In October 1967, a few months after the ceasefire, the Egyptian Navy was the first in history to sink a ship using anti-ship missiles, when an Egyptian fast attack vehicle, Kumar, sank the Israeli destroyer INS Eilat with two planes. Direct strikes. [12] This was a milestone in modern naval warfare, and for the first time anti-ship missiles demonstrated their potential, sank the destroyer 17 kilometers from Port Said.
Jet versus piston was a pretty new thing, nobody had any experience in that (except the Germans). But generally, if your opponent sees you and he knows how to fly his plane well, he will be really hard to hit. That's why most kills in history were scored with the element of surprise.
Thank you for your comment and suggestion. It has been suggested already and it is a very interesting event. Maybe not very easy to reenact in DCS but I promise to investigate the possibility.
I can't stand flying the mig-15. The slow spool speed of the engines just messes with me (my bad piloting skills, surely). The P-51D on the other hand... I've been flying it alot. Don't even burn the engine up anymore. I'd definitely go for the P-51D.
Well, MiG-15 requires different tactics. It was very successful in interception of heavy bombers (that was its primary purpose). But as long as you keep your speed, the Mustang can't touch you.
The only reason the mig got the kill was because the mustang pilot forgot the important rule of combat.......ALWAYS CHECK YOUR 6!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Mustangs have no business being shot down by a mig 15. In fact a stalemate should be the result..... unless someone gets careless.
I remember a story from one of the books that an American pilot shot down a MiG-15. The pilot ejected and while he was descending, the American noticed he had red beard. That was a little odd for a Korean :)
@@showtime112 There are tons of documents from this time that show, how many Soviet pilots fought, coumoflaged as Korean soldiers. So it's common sense today, but still funny though.
¿Un documental donde los pilotos rusos o coreanos narren sus batallas en esta guerra? Ya me enfade de ver History chanel donde los pilotos gringos narran sus victorias y es buen sabido que sufrieron sus macabras derrotas. En todas esas narraciones los yanquis dicen que fueron a cazar patos.
History Channel es el mismo canal que dice que los aliens construyeron las pirámides y que Hitler escapó a América, no sé qué esperas de ellos tampoco.
The Mig has some advantages over the sabre but the sabre's advantage is more important.. that is making the pilots job easier. Windows that don't fog up, power assisted control surfaces, GeForce suits.. All this makes a difference and the mig wasn't equipped with any of it. The Soviets had this tech, the lavochin of the time used them but wasn't selected for mass production. The mig was because it was cheaper. As a result without knowing anything about the pilots a betting man would have to have his money on the sabre. In a video game where the sabres advantages are not tangible the mig is superior. But that's just a game.
![[ ออกกอง ] วัยหนุ่ม 2544 โลกหลังลูกกรง..ทัวร์กองถ่ายหนังใน "คุกของจริง" | JUSTดูIT.](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/vB--aOkZCpw/mqdefault.jpg)
Great presentation. I clearly shows the superior speed and power of the MiG-15 allowed it to dictate the terms of the fight with the F-51 forced on the defensive.
Thanks for your positive comment!
when gajin up tiers you into the jet tier.
When the me-262 gets uptiered to 9.0
Mustangs, Corsairs, Sea Fury's all could out turn the Migs !!!
The key is seeing them first and getting them in a turing fight keeping them in sight, this P-51 didn't see him behind !! Semper Fi
That's true. Thank you for your comment!
Being able to outturn your opponent when they have vastly superior guns, engines, and avionics isn't a huge advantage. A Fokker Dr.1 triplane can outturn a FW 190, but I know what I'd rather be in
@@TheWhoamaters Totally wrong ! Ask any WWll or Korean War pilot, I have. And bringing up a WWl plane is Clueless !! Semper Fi
@@ronniefarnsworth6465 Ronnie my point is an outdated plane vs the latest and greatest is not going to go well in most cases
@@TheWhoamaters I hear that, but the facts are the facts and WWll Fighter will and did out turn early Jets in WWll and Korea and also A-1 Skyraiders shot down a Mig-17 in Vietnam.
The Chinese warned the USA they were coming into the war, but big balls Mac along with others in Washington, DC didn't take it serious.
They caught the victory disease.
See how life is in North and South Korea. They did everything right.
@@showtime112 victory disease that led to arrogance. The arrogance led to Macarthur retreating from Yalu down to Seoul and never to return to Pyongyang. Defeat for Macarthur and UN forces.
Defeat? No. They did not surrender. South Korea is proof of that. We could have used atomic weapons but chose not to.
That’s why Harry had to fire him. It had to be done.
Actually I think the Korean war never ended, there was never a surrender, defeat or peace treaty, just a truce.
It is a frozen conflict and both sides are still at war.
Yes, formally this is only a really, really long ceasefire.
Wow, that was tense watching that. Rooting for the Mustang but knowing deep down the Mig was of a whole new age and only a matter of time. Great vid.
Thank you for the positive feedback!
In Korea the jet pilots learned not to get into a turning fight with a P51. But the Mig was a better plane than the US Sabre jet. The Saber was rugged but the Mig was faster and could out turn the Saber. Both the Saber and the Mig were based on the German Messerschmitt P1101
Thanks for the comment. As for the basis for Sabre and MiG-15, I read that the MiG was based on designs made by Kurt Tank, the chief designer of Focke Wulf because that company was located in East of Germany and that's what the Russians captured.
Actually it was pilot quality that made the difference. The MiG and the F-86 were initially very closely matched. Eventually the F-86 started to gain the upper hand with constant upgrades including a redesigned wing and flying tail. The MiG punched harder but the lower muzzle velocity of its cannons often let skilled F-86 pilots escape while the higher velocity and larger concentration of .50 caliber bullets could end a MiGs day quicker. F-86 pilots reported they could tell when encountering a Russian “ Honcho” cause the MiG would just be way more aggressive. North Korean pilots just didn’t have the same flying style they said
The MIGs seem to be making some steep dives. I've read that the MIG 15 was hard to control in high speed dives.
In DCS it seems to be simulated accurately since when you start to approach very high speeds, your control stick becomes unresponsive.
High being up to 0.92 Mach.
Needless to say no props could dive at those speeds.
@@miquelescribanoivars5049 Correct
General Chuck Yeager said the same thing when the USAF tested their war trophy MiG-15. Yeager was pretty sure he bent the stick trying to pull it out of a dive he said. The MiG-17 was said to have the same problem, considering it was just a slightly larger jet with a Klimov-VK-1S afterburning turbojet that makes sense
I seem to remember reading one of Yeager's books where he's talking with a Russian pilot and tells him he wishes they'd have made a movable tail and the Russion replies something like, "You dived that thing? I was terrified of it!"@@matthewcaughey8898
11:19 he tried to bailout, honestly felt bad for that guy
Technically, it's a bailout in those old aircraft. No ejection seats. And this is a flight simulator so we probably don't know if Aaron Abercrombie actually tried to bail or not. Most pilots know that if theur under 700ft it's futile.
@@matthewbittenbender9191 Yes, this is simply AI starting the bail out procedure without checking the altitude. Sources don't offer details on this matter but it is very likely that no attempt was made.
@@matthewbittenbender9191 yeah, its bailout, I had forgotten the word for it, English is not my native language
Please continue making the videos. You are doing great 👍
Thank you very much! Keep watching!
Flying straight and level in combat. That is why he was shot down.
Basically, yes. Often, escaping instead of fighting is the best choice. Sometimes, it's not.
it wasn't a fair fight, I mean the only "advantage" of the P-51 Mustang was its maneuverability at low altitude (so the mig 15's also), the Mustang was slower then being piloted by a very good pilot it has at least a little chance to survive....
It was a clash of generations. History is not about fair fights, you do your best to have more advanced weapons than the enemy. Mustangs actually had pretty good chances of survival as long as they could see the MiGs. Because, MiG-15 really feels like a truck compared to the Mustang.
@@showtime112 you are right in terms of history and..you are right in everything ha ha. I was talking just about the game, and yes, first generation jets controls feels like driving a truck, at least in a flight simulator, I don't know if in real life was the same
F22 vs Mustang. Guns only, inside a box. So no zoom attacks.
I love playing DCS. I need a new PC though. Love watching your stuff man. Always nice intro and transitions.
Thank you very much for the positive comment! I hope you get a new configuration soon!
I'm getting addicted to these
Just say no to addictions 😁
Nice video, I really liked the intro music. 👍🏻
Thanks! I was indecisive about what music to use for this video. I thought about using another Soviet 'fighting' song but eventually I decided on this film score type.
@@showtime112 Good choice, IMO at least. 😊
Many people don't understand what a complex scenario the Korean war was.
First of all the k/d ratio can't be used as an indicator of success because:
1)Most non soviet pilots had almost no experience and that was even worse when piloting jets.
2)Migs had to fight at least a dozen of types of fighters, so you should at least consider the Mig/all US fighters k/d ratio
3)Most of the times migs fought they focused on intercepting bombers and almost ignored fighters, this made them vulnerable even to prop fighters since they couldn't fight back
Secondly, another issue that I want to try to clarify is that in the 50s no korean government was good. At that time both of them were oppressive dictatorships with a long list of massacres of suspected opposers. It is only later that the South korean one developed into a modern democracy. Moreover in that period both USSR and US were oppressing their opposition (but Stalin did more) and the US were worse on the international plane because they helped dozens of right wing dictatorships rise in South America, Asia, Africa and South America, as well as ignoring the Francoist and Portuguese regimes. Also the UK and US made several plans to bomb down with nukes the eastern bloc as a preventive attack, which was an unfounded belief since Stalin's policy was purely defensive and he needed his bloc as a guarantee the Allies wouldn't attack the defenseless Soviet union on the spot.
What I am trying to say in the second paragraph is that claiming only the Soviet union was bad in the early cold war is pure hypocrisy, thus flying soviet fighters in a game is by no way shameful, especially if only for the sake of entertainment
That was quite elaborate. And I agree that things are usually not black and white. We now have the benefit of hindsight but things were much less clear in 1950s through 1990s. You mention the Koreas, I heard somewhere that in 1960s, North Korean GNP was actually above the South.
I will dedicate more videos to the Korean War to try to shed some light on the whole story.
@@showtime112 thanks, I by no means am trying to excuse the soviet regime but seeing people complain for you flying "evil" jets as a Russian it kinda angers me
@@andrygugli1928 Oh, that's not even remotely the dumbest kind of comments I get 😁
@@showtime112 I felt that lol. Anyway nice work, you got another subscriber. I hope you will make more reenactions of less known engagements
Loved the dogfight scene. Even though there was no kills!
Thanks! Keep watching!
Did you read the whole article or just read the title and reply? Don't answer, we know.
@@jwhoward182 chill my dude lol
@@jwhoward182 Actually, you don't know. You just jump to conclusions. I meant no kills during the dogfight part. The part when the Mustang gets shot down is nor really dogfight.
The Mig 15 was lethal until the arival of he F-86. F-86 Sabres kicked ass all over 10-1 ratio's.
Actually, those ratios were later discredited even by American historians. They were much lower in reality. True, when fighting against inexperienced Chinese units, Sabres scored big. But against veteran Soviet regiments, things were pretty even.
You should also consider that in most of these engagements the migs focused on bombers almost ignoring the defending Sabres. When in the hands of experienced soviet pilots tasked with hunting fighters as well the k/d ratio rose a lot
While playing an early Microsoft Air Combat game I chose a Sopwith Camel flying against two BF-109 fighters and in every case I shot them both down by simply turning into them in a two dimensional battle as I never had to go vertical. But as shown here if you fly more than 30 seconds in a straight path you become a target. If depicted accurately he must have had a good reason to do that, low on fuel, assumed the jets had left, etc.
The pilot probably assumed he could run away. Some other Mustangs managed to do so. Maybe he panicked, it is hard to say. Generally, shootdowns usually happen when someone makes a mistake.
In the situation Showtime is presenting, The Yankee pilot was disoriented from previous engagement (he got separated from his group) and didn't see the much, much faster MIG creep up behind him.
That's the in universe explanation for why the ai in this game mode is standing still, it could have happened exactly this way, by mustang being blindsided or the mustang just got shot during a turn as Showtime here is intentionally showing how not to place a gun solution on a target for the sake of the video presenting overshots, the gun should be ahead (and sideways bellow, in case of a sideways (deflection) shot) of the path of the target when approaching to shoot.
@@JebacPresretac101 The sources don't explain exactly how the kill was made except that one Mustang broke away and probably tried to escape. Maybe he didn't see the MiG. Most air-to-air kills occur because the victim doesn't see the attacker. If you see the attacker and do some good evasive maneuvers, you are very hard to hit. Such kills are relatively rare.
As always another superb job!! 👌👌
Thanks!
Cool animation. When did MIGs start encountering F-86 Sabres?
Sabres arrived to Korea on 14 December 1950. The first clash occurred on 17 December.. I made a video about that, you can check it out.
Birth of the MiG and the end of the Mustang.
The end of Mustang as a fighter. As a CAS platform, it continued for a better part of the war.
Superb graphics.
And this is only medium settings 😊
Zdravo, Showtime. I'll make a minor correction about the identity of the Soviet pilot who shot down Aaron Abercombie: he was Leyténant (Lt) Fiodor Vasilievich Chizh, member of the 72nd GIAP, 151st GIAD. But he was not a WW2 ace. Probably you mistook him with another pilot of the same surname who fought in Korea in a later period, who indeed was a 13-kills WW2 ace: Polkóvnik (Colonel) Vasiliy Ivanovich Chizh, who was comander of the 726th IAP, 133rd IAD. This unit fought during the last year of war (June 1952 to July 1953). Vasiliy Chizh scored two kills in Korea: the F-86F BuNo 51-2858 (334th FIS) on 24 December 1952 and the F-84G of Roger Warren (69th FBS, POW) on 15 January 1953.
Thank you for sharing that! The information about Lt Chizh actually comes from McKelvey Cleaver's book Mig Alley. It seemed a little strange that a WWII ace would still be only a lieutenant five years after the war 😁 Sometimes, when you dig deep you can find small mistakes in history books. For example, when I did a video about a HH-53 helicopter shot down by North Vietnamese MiG-21 in 1970, the book I used gave the wrong serial number of the helicopter, that one being shot down by AAA in 1968.
@@showtime112 HH53 sn66-14434 callsign jolly green71
Fantastic content man! Earned a subscriber
British engine in the Mig you see and the currently we train Chinese pilots. So proud.
The (sad) irony is that without a moronic UK's PM the russians couldn't have build such an excellent fighter, they didn't have modern jet engines, only some old types from Germany'. Then mr.Attee send some RR Nene to comrad Stalin as a gift P.s. Stalin himself was really surprised by this monumental...".naivite"
That is not entirely true, axial flow turbojet, which is what German designed in world war 2, is more advanced in terms of design comparing to RR engine, but more difficulty to manufacture. All second gen turbojets are axial flow turbojets
@@keith6371 axial flow is not a german design, but ok
@@lucastekkan both BMW003 and Jumo004 are axial flow engines, RR Nene is not. Nene is a technology dead end, but it was easier to produce. Russian had both 003 and 004 technology. So it wasnt that big of a deal to get Nene (It helped sure, but it wasnt such a big deal people made it out to be)
@@keith6371 Did I say it wasn't ? I said that axial flow technology isn't german
WWII propeller planes attacking jet fighters is like shooting fish in a rain barrel.
Amazing work
Thank you very much!
El MiG 15 era 200 Km/h mas veloz, subía y picaba mas rápido y tenía 4 veces la potencia de fuego del Mustang, no tenía ninguna necesidad de "pelea de perros".
Sure. This is just the representation of what happens when two generations of weapons meet.
شكرا جزيلا
Thank you for all these comments!
awesome video!!!
Thank you for your positive feedback!
@@showtime112 Your welcome and thank for the quality video.
If only Truman would have let Gen. MacArthur bomb those bridges over the Yalu and level Antung AF....no Mig Alley
That's a possibility, but not necessarily. However, they should have definitely attacked air bases in China, nothing worse could have happened.
I'm never comfortable with you flying for the Ruskies ,however I know for a fact that with a P51 it has to stay a turning battle, there's No way a P51 has a chance with a MIG15 unless you get into a blind spot or maybe the MIG is low on fuel? Good video
Think of me as an actor who is playing a role 😁 As for the Mustang vs MiG-15, the MiG basically needs to keep the speed high. If it slows down, it can become the target. In DCS, if you let AI Mustangs fight against MiGs at equal skill level, there are MiGs shot down as well.
Thanks for the comment!
@@showtime112 Yep, you're right as a use to be war fighter it's challenging to let go some things especially when you know what the Soviet ideology is. Good video
@William Allford well I guess you're Right if you love murdering your own citizens- Stalin or Oppressing your own people - Putin, I'll end with those two murders, but believe me Hitler should of went to Stalingrad!!!!
@@ronaldwatson1951 yeah sure I am no soviet union excuser but I wont tolerate the equally atrocious crimes committed by the US during the cold war both in official and unofficial wars. You guys sure live well, but at the expense of others
@@andrygugli1928 I can't confirm or deny what you mentioned but what I know about Communism isn't pretty, and Democracy definitely has skeletons in its history. Only one answer - GOD
Great vid. North Koreans also had a number of Yak-9U's early war. Any chance we can see a P-51 vs a Yak?
Thanks! True, early phase of the war saw some cool WWII style clashes between Mustangs and Yaks. However, Yak-9 is not yet available in DCS or even in IL-2. It it does become available, I will consider it.
@@showtime112 Yak-9 and Yak-9T is available in IL2 but MiG-15 isn't
@@hartmannf4169 You are right. They are special collector planes so I didn't notice them. But Mustang is available in Ill-2 so the P-51 (or more precisely, F-51) vs. Yak-9 can be done in it.
Was the Mig-15 much better than the Messerchmitt Me-262?
Oh yes! Me-262 had a lot of reliability issues and effective lifespan of the engines was extremely short. The top speed was also lower than the MiG's. This is a more mature technology.
Yes !!!! And better than all Sabre models except the F86F
@@showtime112 Oops! Sorry for the late reply, I did not see the notification.
And even if the Germans had the chromium they neeed ri improve the engine life span?
Also more manœuvrable I suppose ?
I wish you could make a movie from Biafra Babies lead by Count Carl Gustaf Ericsson von Rosen. That was really something to take down plenty of the Nigerian Air Force's MIGs Ilyushin bombers on the runway only with some SNEB rockets fired from lightweight civilian aircrafts (Malmö MFI-9).
Thank you for your comment and suggestion. I'm only very vaguely familiar with that story. From what I can see, it probably wouldn't be very easy to reenact in DCS World but who knows. I'll try to investigate a little more.
@@showtime112 I think all aircrafts are missing now but as far as I can see DCS could be the next modding platform after IL-2 Sturmovik 1946 (DCS has more modern graphics and I think physics too). The story is interesting and Von Rosen too, he was a real man of his ideas, not a typical mercenary type. And that war was a real asymmetric warfare, a guerrilla war fought with aircrafts in those missions.
Good stuff. It appears that Mustangs could outmaneuver MIGs easily. How did it happen that americans invented Sabres then?))
While watching the video I suddenly thought about the Falkland War. Harrier operations, that would be interesting too.
Mustangs could outmaneuver the MiGs just like biplanes could outmaneuver Mustang. However their time was over, just like Mustang's in the jet age.
Falklands are very interesting but I think I'm going to wait for the map which should be released in the near future. Thanks for the comment!
Because the Mustangs can't put the guns back on the MIG15 once they outmaneuver it, the MIG is 2km away at that point. "Speed is life", which is what Showtime here is doing, mowing the lawn like a true f86 pilot, (doing horizontal turns) instead of going into the vertical and zooming back down on the mustangs. The correct way would be for MIG15s to climb to 3800m (~12k feet), and then dive down on the mustangs with the airbrake on once they spot them, then zoom back 1km up above the mustangs and zoom back down again. As to what happened in this scenario, who knows, but that's what the Korean War MIG15 vets said they liked to do, to cruise at 3800m.
I also forgot to mention that it's beyond easy to get a firing solution on that Mustang with a deflection shot, turning won't save ya, Showtime here is just pretending he can't aim for the sake of the video. Turning won't really save ya.
I was just kidding about the invention of F-86 :) The plane was commissioned even before the Korean War would break out) But it was remarkably shown here how old and new planes faced for the first time and tried awkwardly to figure out how to kill each other.
@@IncoreFirearms Yeah, I find that point in history quite interesting for that fact.
With Rolls Royce designed engines,WTF were we thinking?
You can thank the UK and a succession of communist-sympathizing bureaucrats who influenced governmental economic, diplomatic and trade policies.
@@CaesarInVa as opposed to the USA which has happily supported Far Right regimes for decades
@@stevenbreach2561 Nice try. Better luck next time.
@@stevenbreach2561 true, everything that is currently happening in south America is the US fault. Cuba is communist but even there public services are a lot better than in Chile or Brasil
Moreover at the beginning both Korean governments were murderous dictatorship, but later on the south improved and became as we know it
Did you see the video of the Battle of Green Island?
Not yet, I was busy working on a new video.
@@showtime112 The video of the Battle of Green Island does not exceed 5 minutes at the latest
@@showtime112 Oh man, this is the confession of an Israeli leader. You will be in a state of daze and then post it on your channel
@@showtime112 And also create a video about the crazy Egyptian pilot. Israel was the one who shot it like this
Would be good now to see MIG V Fury.
Could be, I think it is possible in War Thunder.
The might, even though it's a jet, could almost match the turning circle of a p51 at low speed. Testament to how bad a dogfighter the p51 really was. The key to its success in ww2 was the poor quality of Luftwaffe pilots when it reached frontline service.
That's an interesting way of looking at things. Could be.
p51 is a bad dogfighter? no way that plane was very good for its time.
Luftwaffe pilots were anything but of poor quality. Unfortunately.
The mig 15 dominated until the f86 Arrived in Korea
Exactly.
The way Aaron Ambercombie died.
:(.
Need to get your O2 system checked as the blinker isn't working.
The O2 system in the MiG-15 is automatic. Even with the valve turned on, it will only supply oxygen at altitudes necessitating it.
@@slpkntmggt06 Even if it is automatic, there is still a flowmeter to let you know that the system is working or stuck on. Yes, you can turn the regulator to 100% continuous, but that wastes O2 unless you are at a positive pressure altitude, hypoxic, or smoke in the cockpit. I'm a retired Air Force KC-135 Crew Chief. Now when I point these faults out, it is in jest like the crazed canopies that I've seen here that should be replaced in real life.
Očekivao sam pokolj Mustanga, ali drago mi je da je Mustang bio teška meta..
Iznenadio bi se koliko ih je teško uloviti. MiG-15 je ustvari prilično trom u usporedbi s njima. Pogotovo roll rate mu je usporeni film. Ako Mustang obrne okret na drugu stranu, nema šanse da ga možeš pratiti.
Super taktika mustanga. Izbjegavaj i dotad će mig potrošiti gorivo .
@@dado500 Jedina taktika, ustvari. A kad pustiš AI da se bore međusobno, ima čak i oborenih MiG-ova.
Ovo me malo podsjetilo na Po 2 vs Bf 109, brži i jači protiv okretnijeg i sporijeg...
@@mharcsa Sukob generacija! Ali kao i obično, novija tehnologija nije baš u potpunosti superiorna u odnosu na stariju.
The MIG could and did destroy all competition
You should do something for us, especially with regard to the destroyer Eilat. We expect a lot from you
As for this, DCS doesn't really have assets to cover it. No Osas, no older types of destroyers. Maybe someone will make some mods in the future. People are doing naval mids too such as Majestic class carriers.
@@showtime112 Okay, my friend, but I expect a lot from you, specifically regarding the Egyptian army
@@محمدسليم-ص8ع5ر You are aware that I also do videos from the Israeli point of view?
@@showtime112 I really know the Six Day War is still resounding so far
@@showtime112 But you did not even see the video of the Battle of Green Island, which Israel claims has won
Did you see the video of the Battle of Green Island? That I sent to you
Not yet, actually. Haven't had time. I will try to see it tomorrow.
@@showtime112 You will lose a lot if you do not see this, with the admission of an Israeli leader who participated in that same battle
@@showtime112 And there are many more, too
@@showtime112 The process of destroying the destroyer Eilat is very special
In October 1967, a few months after the ceasefire, the Egyptian Navy was the first in history to sink a ship using anti-ship missiles, when an Egyptian fast attack vehicle, Kumar, sank the Israeli destroyer INS Eilat with two planes. Direct strikes. [12] This was a milestone in modern naval warfare, and for the first time anti-ship missiles demonstrated their potential, sank the destroyer 17 kilometers from Port Said.
@@محمدسليم-ص8ع5ر Yes, I'm familiar with that event. Missiles were fired from Osa class boats (which sadly, we don't have in DCS)..
it seems that you'll need a lot of patience to destroy an enemy aircraft
Jet versus piston was a pretty new thing, nobody had any experience in that (except the Germans). But generally, if your opponent sees you and he knows how to fly his plane well, he will be really hard to hit. That's why most kills in history were scored with the element of surprise.
Oh, hi comrade Doggo.
What happened to the 2nd F-51?
There were more than just two. They returned to base, I suppose MiGs were probably bingo fuel at some point and went home.
Peace be upon you. I want a video about the air battle of Mansoura
Thank you for your comment and suggestion. It has been suggested already and it is a very interesting event. Maybe not very easy to reenact in DCS but I promise to investigate the possibility.
@@showtime112 Thank you my dear friend
@@showtime112 I have a video of the Battle of Green Island with the confession of an Israeli commander. Do you want to see it, my friend?
@@محمدسليم-ص8ع5ر Send me the link
th-cam.com/video/XRz-IO1rhsg/w-d-xo.html@@showtime112
I can't stand flying the mig-15. The slow spool speed of the engines just messes with me (my bad piloting skills, surely). The P-51D on the other hand... I've been flying it alot. Don't even burn the engine up anymore. I'd definitely go for the P-51D.
Well, MiG-15 requires different tactics. It was very successful in interception of heavy bombers (that was its primary purpose). But as long as you keep your speed, the Mustang can't touch you.
Can you do Operation Mole Cricket 19?
Actually, I think it is best to wait until Phantom is available because it was really crucial for the operation.
is this christhoper walken's son?
Nope :)
A real life uptier
That's what makes Korean War really interesting. You have a major transition of technology generations and they meet on the same battlefield.
The only reason the mig got the kill was because the mustang pilot forgot the important rule of combat.......ALWAYS CHECK YOUR 6!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Mustangs have no business being shot down by a mig 15. In fact a stalemate should be the result..... unless someone gets careless.
Yes, this was a mistake. Sometimes, running away is the best choice but in this case, it wasn't.
@@showtime112 True especially when the mig can run you down. i would have taken full advantage of the faster not being able to out rate me.
@@bigcountry443 MiG-15 roll rate is like watching a film in slow motion 😁
@@showtime112 LOL!!!!! It really is..... its like anyday now....almost there....almost there...... LOL
cool mig very goot UURRS
Thank you for your comment!
Hehe, those years, when soviets pretended to be Koreans in Soviet Migs 😂.. Ivan Kim
I remember a story from one of the books that an American pilot shot down a MiG-15. The pilot ejected and while he was descending, the American noticed he had red beard. That was a little odd for a Korean :)
@@showtime112 There are tons of documents from this time that show, how many Soviet pilots fought, coumoflaged as Korean soldiers. So it's common sense today, but still funny though.
the ww2 p-51-mustang vs. mig-1 k
Deadly mistake flying straight and level in a war zone.
¿Un documental donde los pilotos rusos o coreanos narren sus batallas en esta guerra? Ya me enfade de ver History chanel donde los pilotos gringos narran sus victorias y es buen sabido que sufrieron sus macabras derrotas. En todas esas narraciones los yanquis dicen que fueron a cazar patos.
History Channel es el mismo canal que dice que los aliens construyeron las pirámides y que Hitler escapó a América, no sé qué esperas de ellos tampoco.
Mustang fly like Eagle And Shoot down like A duck
+1 sub
Thank you very much for that!
Looks like War Thunder match maker...
People mention that a lot with this video. It wasn't intentional :)
@@showtime112 :D only proves how realistic WT is :D
Я уж думал, что стрелять не будут... А по-русски принципиально говорить не хотите?
Who doesn't speak Russian out of principal? I don't understand.
Jesus Loves You
First!
You still rule! 😊
Ha,ha,ha! This is game, real war in Korea is 1MiG 15, and 2- 3 P (F)51 is chat down! MIG 15 is bether or F86!
F-86 Sabre any day.
The Mig has some advantages over the sabre but the sabre's advantage is more important.. that is making the pilots job easier. Windows that don't fog up, power assisted control surfaces, GeForce suits.. All this makes a difference and the mig wasn't equipped with any of it. The Soviets had this tech, the lavochin of the time used them but wasn't selected for mass production. The mig was because it was cheaper.
As a result without knowing anything about the pilots a betting man would have to have his money on the sabre. In a video game where the sabres advantages are not tangible the mig is superior. But that's just a game.
I didn't like this Video. It looks totally unrealistic!
Well, if you cared to support that claim with some arguments, I could tell you why you are wrong 😁 This way, it means absolutely nothing.