Very good work. I did a similar experiment with a sokia theodolite. Due to my ignorance of its use, I only obtained 1 measurement at approximately 1.5 meters above sea level, and another at approximately 800 meters. I obtained values of 100.034 at 1.5 meters and 100.881 at 800 meters But these values by themselves, are not used to calculate the radius, it is necessary to take the angle in direct vision and rotating the viewfinder 180º, obtain the average. Repeat several times, and obtain the average value from all the values obtained. With this data, if you can make the calculation of the radius.
You do good stuff, Mathias. Your Turning Torso video is still a favourite example of undeniable curvature for me. Soundly's Lake Pontchartrain video has to be my all-time favourite just because it shows "curved water". Never the less, when a flat-Earther asks me for curvature I always cite your Turning Torso video along with Soundly's Pontchartrain video. I hadn't realised you had made so many good videos, I'll need to catch up on your good work. Subbed.
Thanks, While Sly Sparkane’s video of shadow angles of the Sun on the equinox ( th-cam.com/video/V03eF0bcYno/w-d-xo.htmlm29s ) is superior in every aspect to provide a more absolute conclusion on the FE/GE debate. There is something very simple yet powerful over videos like Soundly’s at Lake Pontchartrain and mine of Turning Torso, not to mention a simple video of a Sun setting over the sea, and what we can conclude from that, th-cam.com/video/n8qRyGZUuRA/w-d-xo.htmlm50s
I you just are looking for a cheap one to do these simple FE/GE test, this is a good one. But if you want to use it for more seriously work, I would recommend you to get an electronical one, they are much more user friendly for storing readings etc.
Thanks, yes a real theodolite, when used properly, is a lot more precise than all those smartphone apps. I’m actually a little surprised at how clear the drop is visible, using this relative cheap model.
Hi Wolfie This is anything but accuracy. Please read the following post which I directed to Mathias. Mathias Kp I must be missing something here. Can you please explain why in this video and the last video regarding the turning torso you have taken mesurements off the level by 0.5gon or 0.45 dgrees, at these distances such a degree off the level can equate to huge discrepancies. In the Turning Torso Video 0.5gon off the level equates to 288.86 meters @ 29.14Km distant. A simple calibrated automatic dumpy level is a much more accurate instrument for long distance leveling, as the theodolite does not have automatic leveling optics, which can give an accuracy of 1mm per Km on a double run ! Theodolites are used more so for angular distance measurements in setting out operations, where as the Automatic level is a far superior instrument when used for leveling operations. If you are going to continue to do this type of experiment, you should sell the theodolite and buy a good calibrated 32X dumpy level. Digital readouts on the theodolite might look the buisness but they just do not have the long range leveling accuracy required. Regards Flat Out
Thanks, I know you and others already have done this test. But I like being able to reproduce these tests with relative inexpensive (250€) equipment on my own. And since this test can be reproduced by everyone it is a bit strange that so many FE’ers claim the horizon does not drop below “eye level”.
From what I️ have seen is that at the convergence point you can’t see where the actual water level is. What I️ mean is that the horizon is higher than you can see because the water is reflecting the sky at that point so it looks lower than what it is. If you are implying that what you see in the video is due to the curve of earth, the videos out there zooming in on boats you can’t see normally until you zoom on them, are they fake? I️ have never been to ocean to try that myself.
4bangerlove , here is what I see ... Flat Earth Proof? - Observing Lighthouses Across The Delaware Bay Published on October 2, 2016 Video Description: This is a review of the survey observations posted on my blog and also includes video clips taken through the eye piece of my theodolite. th-cam.com/video/Qpxd5btyLJA/w-d-xo.html
Nice, I'm looking forward to further observations at clearer days and higher altitudes. :) You wouldn't be able to get such measurements just with a smartphone, which forces you to climb a mountain or go onto an airplane.
Yes, when I get a day with a more clear view I will measure the drop from higher up But the highest point in Denmark is just 165m so that sets a limit for how far I can get. But maybe I make a little trip to Norway and find some places higher up.
That level of accuracy might be a coincidence. The magnification is only around 20x so it is actual quite hard to place the cross hair exactly on the horizon. So the real error is properbly closer to 0.01 degree than 0.001 I would guess. But of cause more than enough to conclude that the horizon is in fact below "eye level".
Mathias Kp. True that. But don't forget, Theodolites are satanic devices. Only your unaided eyes can tell you whether the horizon is at eye level or not. ;)
Yes trust your eyes, not instruments...:-) The scary part of this, is that this denying of facts is more common than we realize. At least according to this article about why facts don't change our minds, www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/02/27/why-facts-dont-change-our-minds
Great, thank you very much:) I wish someone could take a theodoloite to Tenerife. The Pico del Teide is over 3 km high and one can see the ocean. A systematic study of the dip from different altitudes (eq. all 300 m) would be very nice... Cheers, Flo
_"...A systematic study of the dip from different altitudes (eq. all 300 m) would be very nice..."_ True, several people have started using similar equipment so I think a video like that will come out soon. In my country there are no point taller than 165m so I can't make such a video. But check out Jesse Kozlowski's channel th-cam.com/channels/qfP3eAXAyBkuOmvIU9J2dQ.html
Thank you for the hint! I’m looking forward for further measurements. I would like to see a plot dip against altitude. There are some guys in Germany intending to equip a weather balloon with instruments in order to measure the dip. But it seems that the project needs a lot of time:( Cheers, Flo
Mathias Kp I must be missing something here. Can you please explain why in this video and the last video regarding the turning torso you have taken mesurements off the level by 0.5gon or 0.45 dgrees, at these distances such a degree off the level can equate to huge discrepancies. In the Turning Torso Video 0.5gon off the level equates to 288.86 meters @ 29.14Km distant. A simple calibrated automatic dumpy level is a much more accurate instrument for long distance leveling, as the theodolite does not have automatic leveling optics, which can give an accuracy of 1mm per Km on a double run ! Theodolites are used more so for angular distance measurements in setting out operations, where as the Automatic level is a far superior instrument when used for leveling operations. If you are going to continue to do this type of experiment, you should sell the theodolite and buy a good calibrated 32X dumpy level. Digital readouts on the theodolite might look the buisness but they just do not have the long range leveling accuracy required. Regards Flat Out
+Flat Out, _”…you have taken mesurements off the level by 0.5gon or 0.45 dgrees…”_ I think you are mistaken. The two horizon measurements are 0.07 gon and 0.15 gon. Look at 0:20 _“…A simple calibrated automatic dumpy level is a much more accurate instrument…”_ Yes you are correct that an automatic level (using a compensator) might be more accurate than this theodolite with no compensator. But according to my own controlled error test this theodolite is only off by 0.013 degrees in a downward angle, which at 29140m gives an error of 6.61m. Anyway, I hope I within the next month can make the observation from the Zoo Tower to Turning Torso using a Leica NA332 auto level.
The scale is only in 0.1 gon and it is analog, though with measuring on the video I can get down to 0.01-0.02 gon. But it might be better to get an electronic one. There are many used ones on ebay like this one www.ebay.com/itm/Topcon-DT-104-Electronic-Engineering-Surveying-Digital-Theodolite-with-Case/152967751450?epid=1520492183&hash=item239d96a71a:g:1i4AAOSw90xawQ0o
Mathias Kp I intend to use it for astronomical alignments. Have you tried shooting the sun? What's the angle for the markers in the eyepiece? Can you light them up?
The mount on these theodolites is not good for viewing objects far from horizontal. I think mine has a maximum viewing angle from horizontal of 45 degrees, but only really useful for maybe 30 degrees. The small markers are used for distance measurements and are placed with a multiplication factor of 100. This means with a distance of 500cm there will be 5cm between them or an angle of 0.57 degrees. In my other video th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.htmlm40s I have some more close ups and also accuracy and precision test.
Ez egy epitesz teodolit bazdmeg, ezzel meg a pocsodet se mered meg pontosan. A theo-010 na aaz igen, az egy fasza eszkoz. Azzal kiskorosrol leolvasod a kekestetoi szanatoriumban az oregasszonyok pinajan a szorszalat!
Yes plumb is the same as something being straight up and down like a wall. I actually use plumb in this video as the same as level which is wrong. homeguides.sfgate.com/difference-between-level-plumb-83840.html
I wonder if that is at an elevated height or on the ground? Because it sure the hell looks like it is not on the fucking ground, but above the fucking ground to me.
@@glenn_gallaher Still have trouble with understanding what the point of your comment was. But I made a different video with observations from nine different heights. th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.html
Mathias Kp no you didn't sorry. For one you'd need to be out on the water. So you have measured from land and water. You can't get a curved measurement from one point. What you're measuring is the outta circle not a sphere.. To prove a sphere you'd have to do the other measurements. This is fact. Measuring a sphere in a 2d format is impossible.
I’m not sure what your point is, but the effect of curvature on the globe Earth is a drop of 8 in per mile squared. And this drop can be measured as I have done here th-cam.com/video/PrXw9914uHs/w-d-xo.html So not really any way around that. Unless you of course can show me some theodolite measurements you have done on your own, have you done that?
Mathias Kp OK you can think that, but I got my info from a proper surveyer not just someone with the equipment. Ask any surveyer and they'll tell you the same. But I'll leave you to it. But just know all this you're doing is not changing any flat earthers mind. So keep wasting your time, it's your life. All the best.
Mathias Kp my point is that you can't make a correct measure of curvature from one axis point. You need all angles. Trying to measure curvature from one point is not going to work. I still can't believe you people are rolling with this instrument thinking what you're doing is correct. Please get some in depth knowledge. Because you will bite back with lack of knowledge thinking your right.
The "horizon" you see is not the true vanishing Point, you know that huh?? The real vanishing Point is blocked out of the mirages and refraction and humidity above the Surface. You also have different temperatures between the air and the water that plays in on how light acts! And your theodolite is NOT right above the water Surface!! Instead Place it as low as possible and the angle of attack will make you see the "horizon" much closer thus less "curvature"""!!! Now if we took out all atmosphere you would see much further away out over the plane thus there would be less of "curvature"!!
In this other video I go more into detail and show nine measurements from 5m-184m at th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.htmlm24s you can see how well the drop matches the expected values on a globe Earth. _’…You also have different temperatures between the air and the water that plays in on how light acts!..’_ That is correct and guess what we see on days with the same water/air temperature? You guessed right a perfect match for the globe Earth as seen here th-cam.com/video/hEAyKb8wSZY/w-d-xo.html
And where in this other video ( th-cam.com/video/PrXw9914uHs/w-d-xo.htmlm ) I made, using a building instead, do you see any sign of convergence/mirages etc?
Theodolites are highly inaccurate at far distances due to refraction. Any surveyor will tell you. That's why they do it as certain distances in multiple checks. Rather than doing it at 1 very far distance. The only thing capable of maintaining an accurate level at far distances is laser that don't conform to refraction.. It's why construction workers use Hilti laser levels to determine sea level... If you actually knew this it would certainly help your case... but you don't. You prefer to remain ignorant to the fine details.
Thank you for your comment. I always tries to improve my measurements so it is nice to have some feedback. I have a feeling you will look forward to my upcoming video where I show the results of my observations from 5m to 184m altitude. Here is a little pretaste and comparison with the GE model: flic.kr/p/Djjzjx
Eh, if it's only through your observation with a lens, then I'm not interested. I prefer more accurate experiments that don't involve human error, refraction, and blurry lenses. Thanks anyways. Good luck with your future endeavors!
Sorry, these comments were rude of me. I personally just don't like the idea of using this as a "proof" of the horizon, or curvature for that matter. Not your fault though. You didn't deserve to be insulted. Good luck and I may check back in and see some more of your videos in the future!
Who is Tesla, You might have missed the point but that angle of drop of horizon allows to calculate the Earth radius, as Al Biruni did centuries ago. I did the maths in a comment and, with standard refraction factor, the calculation is very close to the official Earth radius. Not bad with a 250€ used theodolite. Theodolites are highly accurate measuring an angle at long distances, that's a classical part of geodesy. Surveyors take account of refraction. Why a laser would be immune to refraction? And how a single operator could use a laser to measure the angle of depression to horizon (it was the goal on the video)? Hilti laser levels are used to mark points in a horizontal plane for short distance, typically a building construction site.
FrenchCrow Hahahahaa... I think you may be missing a few points. Surveyors are ALWAYS in teams of at least 2. Lasers don't refract. Meaning, if you place it on the bank of a body of water and travel away on the water, the laser should eventually be way above your head. But, it never is. You can reach your hand out and find the dot EVERY time up to the laser's capability. I'm not too sure what you're missing here. Maybe you should look this up before you comment again. Like I said, I've built multiple combine cycle energy efficient power plants. What exactly are your credentials? Watching youtube videos and reading stuff on the internet doesn't cut it.
That we can measue the horizon to be below eyelevel. And that the drop below eyelevel matches what we expect to find on a globe Earth with an atmosphere th-cam.com/video/FPo77ukuHF8/w-d-xo.htmlm15s
@@MathiasKp Eye level lol . Normal observations at different attitudes show that the horizon appears to rise with the observer. You can fool yourself and others all you want.
![กี่หมื่นฟ้า | Your Sky Series EP.1 [2/4]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/qJbQs_nhjD4/mqdefault.jpg)
Very good work.
I did a similar experiment with a sokia theodolite. Due to my ignorance of its use, I only obtained 1 measurement at approximately 1.5 meters above sea level, and another at approximately 800 meters.
I obtained values of 100.034 at 1.5 meters and 100.881 at 800 meters
But these values by themselves, are not used to calculate the radius, it is necessary to take the angle in direct vision and rotating the viewfinder 180º, obtain the average. Repeat several times, and obtain the average value from all the values obtained. With this data, if you can make the calculation of the radius.
Thanks, in this other video I did nine observations from different heights.
th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.htmlm23s
You do good stuff, Mathias. Your Turning Torso video is still a favourite example of undeniable curvature for me. Soundly's Lake Pontchartrain video has to be my all-time favourite just because it shows "curved water". Never the less, when a flat-Earther asks me for curvature I always cite your Turning Torso video along with Soundly's Pontchartrain video.
I hadn't realised you had made so many good videos, I'll need to catch up on your good work. Subbed.
Thanks, While Sly Sparkane’s video of shadow angles of the Sun on the equinox ( th-cam.com/video/V03eF0bcYno/w-d-xo.htmlm29s ) is superior in every aspect to provide a more absolute conclusion on the FE/GE debate. There is something very simple yet powerful over videos like Soundly’s at Lake Pontchartrain and mine of Turning Torso, not to mention a simple video of a Sun setting over the sea, and what we can conclude from that, th-cam.com/video/n8qRyGZUuRA/w-d-xo.htmlm50s
This should piss off a whole bunch of flat earthers. Cool video
Thanks, but I'm sure FE'ers will have an explanation of why the horizon can drop on a flat Earth.
A theodolite is the devils tool, it shows the truth. LOL
I’m shopping around for a theodolite this morning and found this :)
I you just are looking for a cheap one to do these simple FE/GE test, this is a good one. But if you want to use it for more seriously work, I would recommend you to get an electronical one, they are much more user friendly for storing readings etc.
Nice work. Great to see this with a real theodolite.
Thanks, yes a real theodolite, when used properly, is a lot more precise than all those smartphone apps. I’m actually a little surprised at how clear the drop is visible, using this relative cheap model.
Hi Wolfie
This is anything but accuracy. Please read the following post which I directed to Mathias.
Mathias Kp
I must be missing something here. Can you please explain why in this video and the last video regarding the turning torso you have taken mesurements off the level by 0.5gon or 0.45 dgrees, at these distances such a degree off the level can equate to huge discrepancies.
In the Turning Torso Video 0.5gon off the level equates to 288.86 meters @ 29.14Km distant.
A simple calibrated automatic dumpy level is a much more accurate instrument for long distance leveling, as the theodolite does not have automatic leveling optics, which can give an accuracy of 1mm per Km on a double run !
Theodolites are used more so for angular distance measurements in setting out operations, where as the Automatic level is a far superior instrument when used for leveling operations.
If you are going to continue to do this type of experiment, you should sell the theodolite and buy a good calibrated 32X dumpy level.
Digital readouts on the theodolite might look the buisness but they just do not have the long range leveling accuracy required.
Regards
Flat Out
Nice job . Sharing to my Facebook group FLAT EARTH CAN'T GEODESY
Thanks, I know you and others already have done this test. But I like being able to reproduce these tests with relative inexpensive (250€) equipment on my own. And since this test can be reproduced by everyone it is a bit strange that so many FE’ers claim the horizon does not drop below “eye level”.
I see problem with your test
+4bangerlove: _"I see problem with your test"_ Can you elaborate on that?
From what I️ have seen is that at the convergence point you can’t see where the actual water level is. What I️ mean is that the horizon is higher than you can see because the water is reflecting the sky at that point so it looks lower than what it is. If you are implying that what you see in the video is due to the curve of earth, the videos out there zooming in on boats you can’t see normally until you zoom on them, are they fake? I️ have never been to ocean to try that myself.
4bangerlove , here is what I see ...
Flat Earth Proof? - Observing Lighthouses Across The Delaware Bay
Published on October 2, 2016
Video Description: This is a review of the survey observations posted on my blog and also includes video clips taken through the eye piece of my theodolite.
th-cam.com/video/Qpxd5btyLJA/w-d-xo.html
Nice, I'm looking forward to further observations at clearer days and higher altitudes. :)
You wouldn't be able to get such measurements just with a smartphone, which forces you to climb a mountain or go onto an airplane.
Yes, when I get a day with a more clear view I will measure the drop from higher up But the highest point in Denmark is just 165m so that sets a limit for how far I can get. But maybe I make a little trip to Norway and find some places higher up.
Mathias Kp. 0.16gon=0.144°
That isn't far from the expected 0.143° degrees at 20m.
Not bad
That level of accuracy might be a coincidence. The magnification is only around 20x so it is actual quite hard to place the cross hair exactly on the horizon. So the real error is properbly closer to 0.01 degree than 0.001 I would guess. But of cause more than enough to conclude that the horizon is in fact below "eye level".
Mathias Kp. True that. But don't forget, Theodolites are satanic devices. Only your unaided eyes can tell you whether the horizon is at eye level or not. ;)
Yes trust your eyes, not instruments...:-) The scary part of this, is that this denying of facts is more common than we realize. At least according to this article about why facts don't change our minds, www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/02/27/why-facts-dont-change-our-minds
Very nice Job! May I show parts of your Videos in one of my videos? Of course i will give you proper credit! Thx:)
Thanks. Sure you use what you want, just put a link to my video in the description of your video.
Great, thank you very much:) I wish someone could take a theodoloite to Tenerife. The Pico del Teide is over 3 km high and one can see the ocean. A systematic study of the dip from different altitudes (eq. all 300 m) would be very nice...
Cheers,
Flo
_"...A systematic study of the dip from different altitudes (eq. all 300 m) would be very nice..."_ True, several people have started using similar equipment so I think a video like that will come out soon. In my country there are no point taller than 165m so I can't make such a video. But check out Jesse Kozlowski's channel th-cam.com/channels/qfP3eAXAyBkuOmvIU9J2dQ.html
Thank you for the hint! I’m looking forward for further measurements. I would like to see a plot dip against altitude. There are some guys in Germany intending to equip a weather balloon with instruments in order to measure the dip. But it seems that the project needs a lot of time:(
Cheers,
Flo
You would properly also be interested in my newest video: _"Measuring 8in per mile squared on Turning Torso, using a theodolite"_
that looks just like when I do it
Intelligent informative video, many flat earth tears on the way, subbed.
Thanks, you will properbly also like my Turning Torso video, th-cam.com/video/MoK2BKj7QYk/w-d-xo.html
Mathias Kp
I must be missing something here. Can you please explain why in this video and the last video regarding the turning torso you have taken mesurements off the level by 0.5gon or 0.45 dgrees, at these distances such a degree off the level can equate to huge discrepancies.
In the Turning Torso Video 0.5gon off the level equates to 288.86 meters @ 29.14Km distant.
A simple calibrated automatic dumpy level is a much more accurate instrument for long distance leveling, as the theodolite does not have automatic leveling optics, which can give an accuracy of 1mm per Km on a double run !
Theodolites are used more so for angular distance measurements in setting out operations, where as the Automatic level is a far superior instrument when used for leveling operations.
If you are going to continue to do this type of experiment, you should sell the theodolite and buy a good calibrated 32X dumpy level.
Digital readouts on the theodolite might look the buisness but they just do not have the long range leveling accuracy required.
Regards
Flat Out
+Flat Out, _”…you have taken mesurements off the level by 0.5gon or 0.45 dgrees…”_ I think you are mistaken. The two horizon measurements are 0.07 gon and 0.15 gon. Look at 0:20
_“…A simple calibrated automatic dumpy level is a much more accurate instrument…”_ Yes you are correct that an automatic level (using a compensator) might be more accurate than this theodolite with no compensator. But according to my own controlled error test this theodolite is only off by 0.013 degrees in a downward angle, which at 29140m gives an error of 6.61m.
Anyway, I hope I within the next month can make the observation from the Zoo Tower to Turning Torso using a Leica NA332 auto level.
Mathias Kp
Ok
Regards
Flat Out
I am considering this theodolite. What is the accuracy of the reading estimate?
The scale is only in 0.1 gon and it is analog, though with measuring on the video I can get down to 0.01-0.02 gon. But it might be better to get an electronic one. There are many used ones on ebay like this one www.ebay.com/itm/Topcon-DT-104-Electronic-Engineering-Surveying-Digital-Theodolite-with-Case/152967751450?epid=1520492183&hash=item239d96a71a:g:1i4AAOSw90xawQ0o
Mathias Kp I intend to use it for astronomical alignments. Have you tried shooting the sun? What's the angle for the markers in the eyepiece? Can you light them up?
The mount on these theodolites is not good for viewing objects far from horizontal. I think mine has a maximum viewing angle from horizontal of 45 degrees, but only really useful for maybe 30 degrees.
The small markers are used for distance measurements and are placed with a multiplication factor of 100. This means with a distance of 500cm there will be 5cm between them or an angle of 0.57 degrees. In my other video th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.htmlm40s I have some more close ups and also accuracy and precision test.
Ez egy epitesz teodolit bazdmeg, ezzel meg a pocsodet se mered meg pontosan. A theo-010 na aaz igen, az egy fasza eszkoz. Azzal kiskorosrol leolvasod a kekestetoi szanatoriumban az oregasszonyok pinajan a szorszalat!
'Plumb' is straight vertical, right?
Yes plumb is the same as something being straight up and down like a wall. I actually use plumb in this video as the same as level which is wrong. homeguides.sfgate.com/difference-between-level-plumb-83840.html
I wonder if that is at an elevated height or on the ground? Because it sure the hell looks like it is not on the fucking ground, but above the fucking ground to me.
Not sure what you mean by _"is at an elevated height"_
@@MathiasKp not flat on the ground and at eye level.
@@glenn_gallaher Still have trouble with understanding what the point of your comment was. But I made a different video with observations from nine different heights. th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.html
@ Thus you are always above the ground, not flat against it, you have an elevated view, but never have to look at your feet to see the horizon.
Measure the curvature of the ocean water, then you have something.
You mean like I did in this video, th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.html ?
Mathias Kp no you didn't sorry. For one you'd need to be out on the water. So you have measured from land and water. You can't get a curved measurement from one point. What you're measuring is the outta circle not a sphere.. To prove a sphere you'd have to do the other measurements. This is fact. Measuring a sphere in a 2d format is impossible.
I’m not sure what your point is, but the effect of curvature on the globe Earth is a drop of 8 in per mile squared. And this drop can be measured as I have done here th-cam.com/video/PrXw9914uHs/w-d-xo.html So not really any way around that. Unless you of course can show me some theodolite measurements you have done on your own, have you done that?
Mathias Kp OK you can think that, but I got my info from a proper surveyer not just someone with the equipment. Ask any surveyer and they'll tell you the same. But I'll leave you to it. But just know all this you're doing is not changing any flat earthers mind. So keep wasting your time, it's your life. All the best.
Mathias Kp my point is that you can't make a correct measure of curvature from one axis point. You need all angles. Trying to measure curvature from one point is not going to work. I still can't believe you people are rolling with this instrument thinking what you're doing is correct. Please get some in depth knowledge. Because you will bite back with lack of knowledge thinking your right.
The "horizon" you see is not the true vanishing Point, you know that huh?? The real vanishing Point is blocked out of the mirages and refraction and humidity above the Surface. You also have different temperatures between the air and the water that plays in on how light acts! And your theodolite is NOT right above the water Surface!! Instead Place it as low as possible and the angle of attack will make you see the "horizon" much closer thus less "curvature"""!!!
Now if we took out all atmosphere you would see much further away out over the plane thus there would be less of "curvature"!!
In this other video I go more into detail and show nine measurements from 5m-184m at th-cam.com/video/6viR_GJ8998/w-d-xo.htmlm24s you can see how well the drop matches the expected values on a globe Earth.
_’…You also have different temperatures between the air and the water that plays in on how light acts!..’_ That is correct and guess what we see on days with the same water/air temperature? You guessed right a perfect match for the globe Earth as seen here th-cam.com/video/hEAyKb8wSZY/w-d-xo.html
NOT A CURVE but CONVERGENCE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And where in this other video ( th-cam.com/video/PrXw9914uHs/w-d-xo.htmlm ) I made, using a building instead, do you see any sign of convergence/mirages etc?
Theodolites are highly inaccurate at far distances due to refraction. Any surveyor will tell you. That's why they do it as certain distances in multiple checks. Rather than doing it at 1 very far distance. The only thing capable of maintaining an accurate level at far distances is laser that don't conform to refraction.. It's why construction workers use Hilti laser levels to determine sea level... If you actually knew this it would certainly help your case... but you don't. You prefer to remain ignorant to the fine details.
Thank you for your comment. I always tries to improve my measurements so it is nice to have some feedback. I have a feeling you will look forward to my upcoming video where I show the results of my observations from 5m to 184m altitude. Here is a little pretaste and comparison with the GE model: flic.kr/p/Djjzjx
Eh, if it's only through your observation with a lens, then I'm not interested. I prefer more accurate experiments that don't involve human error, refraction, and blurry lenses. Thanks anyways. Good luck with your future endeavors!
Sorry, these comments were rude of me. I personally just don't like the idea of using this as a "proof" of the horizon, or curvature for that matter. Not your fault though. You didn't deserve to be insulted. Good luck and I may check back in and see some more of your videos in the future!
Who is Tesla,
You might have missed the point but that angle of drop of horizon allows to calculate the Earth radius, as Al Biruni did centuries ago. I did the maths in a comment and, with standard refraction factor, the calculation is very close to the official Earth radius. Not bad with a 250€ used theodolite.
Theodolites are highly accurate measuring an angle at long distances, that's a classical part of geodesy. Surveyors take account of refraction.
Why a laser would be immune to refraction? And how a single operator could use a laser to measure the angle of depression to horizon (it was the goal on the video)?
Hilti laser levels are used to mark points in a horizontal plane for short distance, typically a building construction site.
FrenchCrow Hahahahaa... I think you may be missing a few points. Surveyors are ALWAYS in teams of at least 2. Lasers don't refract. Meaning, if you place it on the bank of a body of water and travel away on the water, the laser should eventually be way above your head. But, it never is. You can reach your hand out and find the dot EVERY time up to the laser's capability. I'm not too sure what you're missing here. Maybe you should look this up before you comment again. Like I said, I've built multiple combine cycle energy efficient power plants. What exactly are your credentials? Watching youtube videos and reading stuff on the internet doesn't cut it.
Lol, is this supposed to prove something?
That we can measue the horizon to be below eyelevel. And that the drop below eyelevel matches what we expect to find on a globe Earth with an atmosphere th-cam.com/video/FPo77ukuHF8/w-d-xo.htmlm15s
@@MathiasKp Eye level lol . Normal observations at different attitudes show that the horizon appears to rise with the observer. You can fool yourself and others all you want.