Overcoming Resistance: Get A Horse to Pick Up its Feet with Ease

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  • เผยแพร่เมื่อ 25 พ.ย. 2024

ความคิดเห็น • 110

  • @susantunbridge4612
    @susantunbridge4612 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +10

    Excellent advice, so helpful. We have 2 Thoroughbreds who were abused with a ""nerve line", which applies harsh pressure on the poll, and this is what the trainer put on them at age 2 to make them stand still for tacking up or anything else - and one of them was terrified of the farrier. They learn to race backwards when there is no pain on their poll from the halter.
    On the track they used a tranquilizer on him. He fractured his coffin bone, right up the center, they didn't even xray they just put him out to pasture, thought he was just lame. So when they brought him back in, a good farrier told them he needed an xray, showed up the broken bone, and they put a round show on. The bone is actually offset by about 2mm, (which the vet said could cause some irritation, but it hasn't). So he healed ok, and they put him back with the abusive trainer, who told the owners he was no good for racing. Really nice horse, ggrandson of Seattle Slew. So I bought him for $1.00 rather than see him go for slaughter. Got the vet out, and he said he's fine, all healed. But we still have issues of course, and since I'm not a trainer we've relied on the help of some good farriers. We bought another one, abused by the same trainer with the nerve line, horses have been known to throw themselves over backwards bc of this trainer, apparently. He's out of business now.
    Both have been through training with German dressage trainers, one with a really good cowboy trainer - and they're outside 24/7 in Alberta, they grow coats like bears in the fall.

  • @lisaa9361
    @lisaa9361 ปีที่แล้ว +10

    Thank you! Our gelding doesn’t like to pick up his back feet so this is really helpful.

  • @originalthundercat4295
    @originalthundercat4295 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +9

    First video of yours that I have seen, and I’ll tell you what, I sure like the heck out of the way you compose yourself and work with horses. You speak from pure experience and you’re somebody that I could listen to for hours.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  3 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@originalthundercat4295 thank you there are a lot of videos on this channel so you probably will get to listen to them for hours . I appreciate you joining us and glad you like them .

  • @joettecrosier1712
    @joettecrosier1712 18 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Thank you! I bought my first green horse and he was extremely resistant to me picking up his feet, putting all his weight on the front ones and kicking out with the back one. I watched this video and had the first successful relaxed feet picking up session today!!
    Also, it's a joy to watch with the way you are :)

    • @KatieLeFeuvre
      @KatieLeFeuvre 13 วันที่ผ่านมา

      I’m in the same boat! 4 year old green mare!! Feet is our issue and has even bought me to tears!

  • @PONYHEAVEN
    @PONYHEAVEN ปีที่แล้ว +6

    Calmness and quietness always, in your proceeding.

  • @ToniWatson-lp7cy
    @ToniWatson-lp7cy ปีที่แล้ว +8

    Great information and reminders on handling our horses feet.

  • @carmanconrad8684
    @carmanconrad8684 ปีที่แล้ว +5

    Another great video Dennis! Working with the horse untied is so useful because once you establish the trust there is no need to tie the horse anymore. I find once this is accomplished you can walk out in the pasture and pick up feet no problem. Thanks for helping folks learn the easy way to build trust and confidence.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  ปีที่แล้ว +2

      Thank you

    • @cattymajiv
      @cattymajiv 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      This OP is so right. If you don't have to undo somebody else's bad training, that should be your goal for sure. And even if you do have to undo bad training, but it's a LOT harder! That's why it needs to be done right the first time, no matter their age, and no matter how long it takes. It's worth it.

  • @jasonbriggs1853
    @jasonbriggs1853 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +5

    I have watched most videos on youtube on this subject - and this has by far been the best! You speak with obvious experience and attunement with the horse, very clear, very visible - showed a few different methods and explained why they work. Thank you for this!

  • @susancampbell8228
    @susancampbell8228 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    Fabulous! All other videos instruct us to lower the hoof to the ground when finished. My young horse always fidgets and has to rearrange her feet a lot so she feels comfortable & has a good center of balance to support herself on 3 legs. She pulls her leg away once its up and is hard to work on. Definitely going to be working on her this way to help the farrier. Thank you Dennis!!

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  ปีที่แล้ว +3

      Your farrier will put you back on his favorite place to work list when you get this working for you !! You can do this ! Remember to catch the toe and let that leverage advantage help you to show your horse where the sweet spot is so that she can relax there .

  • @JoeLinux2000
    @JoeLinux2000 ปีที่แล้ว +4

    One of the best videos I've seen on picking up the feet.

  • @gregevans1062
    @gregevans1062 ปีที่แล้ว +8

    Great to make the picking the feet up the treat!!! I have had to ask politely for people not feed them “treats” not a fan, agree totally, their feet aren’t the problem it’s the brain and their owners that allow these issues become a habit. these videos are great.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  ปีที่แล้ว +2

      Thank you

    • @cattymajiv
      @cattymajiv 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      I'm agaist using treats too, but if a horse has already become accustomed, it's never going to be the same again. They need to not be given treats from day 1 as a foal. In 1 way that's so easy, but in other ways it's hard to do, to get, and to find. But training with treats should be avoided if possible.

  • @jessier907
    @jessier907 8 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I have a yearling and the smallest of tips have helped so much! Don't bind the knee out and don't bind the knee up when holding it with your leg. Thank you so much!

  • @jonisnyder3538
    @jonisnyder3538 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Thanks so much. I have a huge belgian that does not like to pick up his feet, he was Amish raised, not nicely. Also have a 8yr old newly gelding that does not like his back feet picked up. He will kick. He was used as a stud b4 I bought him. So I have to give dormosedan to him and the belgian for trim days.

  • @carolhatfield2900
    @carolhatfield2900 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Thank you for this help! I just got a 3 year old Tennessee Walker who had an accident with a fence, and got a deep cut on the left hind leg before I got him. It's healed, but he was afraid to let me pick up his back feet - I think due to the memory of pain.. He has responded beautifully to this kind of work and help. I have shared your videos with friends. Thank you!

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @carolhatfield2900 I appreciate you sharing the videos and you’re very welcome. I’m glad to hear you get good use of them.

  • @angelatracy7418
    @angelatracy7418 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Great job!

  • @kathleenfoxley3373
    @kathleenfoxley3373 ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Your content is very useful and well explained and demonstrated. Keep on with this excellent format.

  • @Scoober_Cat
    @Scoober_Cat 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Thank you. Great video

  • @Francesca1o
    @Francesca1o 7 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

    Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge. After all my years of owning horses I find I need to relearn this daily activity. I hope they respond to me as well as yours did.😊

  • @jackkrag
    @jackkrag ปีที่แล้ว +3

    thank ya sir

  • @patrikkarlsson1161
    @patrikkarlsson1161 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Thanks for the tips. Patrik from sweden

  • @brucebrown686
    @brucebrown686 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Best clip I’ve seen from you Dennis. Job well done.

  • @rhodarichardson8333
    @rhodarichardson8333 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +6

    Hi DC
    Can you make a video on the horses that like to pull back at the trailer and at the tie pole and what kind of technique do you use to stop that behavior?

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Will do my best to get one done
      Thank you for asking

    • @Lionessa8
      @Lionessa8 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      This would be a good video 👍

  • @jackkrag
    @jackkrag ปีที่แล้ว +2

    Thanks!

  • @Ozunicorn1
    @Ozunicorn1 5 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Fantastic video. Thank you.

  • @louiseregan2498
    @louiseregan2498 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Found this demonstration very informative. Thank you.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@louiseregan2498 thank you

    • @louiseregan2498
      @louiseregan2498 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing I have a question for you. How would you shoe a horse with wobbles? Young horse that is two years old was diagnosed with wobbles and is making good progress with adjustments. Can lift all legs. Working with him with his back legs using your trick using straps to get use to lifting his back legs. Should a strap harness be the trick?

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @louiseregan2498 Things like this are a case by case situation. If there is some type of neurological disorder going on you might have to adapt your approach to what ever fits best with this particular situation .
      Probably not a trick to fix but a learning experience for you to see what you can do to get this horse comfortable while doing what you want it to do . Which is the implementation of your clear mental picture .
      Good luck and if one thing isn’t working try something else until you find what does work for you and your horse

  • @lindsaycoulthard1132
    @lindsaycoulthard1132 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Good advice. Thank you for making g this video .

  • @debbiepalmblad7627
    @debbiepalmblad7627 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    What a treasure you are!

  • @PersonalTriumph2022
    @PersonalTriumph2022 ปีที่แล้ว +3

    Would you let the foot go on concrete as well ? I worry he will slam his hoof on the concrete once I let go so I put it back myself. Also, when I do my horses back feet, he likes to do a little back kick when his foot is let go after the hoof has been cleaned. It’s like some reflex. So I put those back down myself too. But now I’m wondering if I have been doing it wrong

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  ปีที่แล้ว +1

      Any kick back is unacceptable behavior .
      Let him have his foot by just letting go and standing up . If he kicks at all go right to the turn on the forehand with pretty good energy behind that move and stay there going round and round until that horse stops on his own then smooth his back muscles .
      Your horse needs to have his respect level for you elevated and that will do the trick

  • @violajackson9154
    @violajackson9154 8 วันที่ผ่านมา

    Dennis, are you working for free 😁?
    …Well then! Horses appreciate positive reinforcement 🍪 and learn quite fast 😉.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  8 วันที่ผ่านมา

      @@violajackson9154 that might be but the danger of a treat being perceived as a well fair check is too great for me to risk . My jerseys receive a far more valuable treat from me every time the step into my picture they receive what they really value and that is complete freedom

  • @fredrunning9655
    @fredrunning9655 8 หลายเดือนก่อน

    You can get a good sound gentle horse to cooperate but a crazy wild one.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  8 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      Well over the past several decades of using this as a go to tool. I’ve sure seen most all of them end just like this horse did no matter where they started.

  • @jennyrosd2003
    @jennyrosd2003 ปีที่แล้ว +1

    Shes being a good student . Ha. My mule will lift his front foot and lock his knee and plant it on the ground....then I have to ask again. Hes much better with the rears. Both my mules are heavy and hesitant on the fronts. Working on leading by a foot to try to get a better thing going. Probably my fault somehow. My horses lift their feet smooth and easy but my mules seem to think it's a funny trick. It's not terrible but just an interesting challenge.
    I like your position on the rear legs . Gonna use that for gentle stretching for an older horse. Seems like its be comfortable for us both.

  • @gweger6425
    @gweger6425 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    First time watcher. Subscribed. Can you address horses with stiff stifle issues and not wanted to lift their back feet? I'm getting tired of fighting.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@gweger6425 usually if you just take his leg straight back they will release after a bit and let you have it and keep his foot as low as possible

    • @gweger6425
      @gweger6425 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing thank you for I'm your reply. I think I'm going to to try the ropes like you show. Keeping it really low helps.

  • @finngamesknudson1457
    @finngamesknudson1457 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    Thanks for telling me to let horse put it down. If I let go he tends to lift a little higher and stomp down so I’ve been trying to lower it slowly - guessing I’ve made this worse.
    Any suggestions for an arthritic horse? No shoes so just checking for rocks and nails. Didn’t know to look for nails before incurring huge vet bills!

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  2 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@finngamesknudson1457 just be patient with him when you are picking them up and don’t keep it up too long and usually they get along pretty good .

    • @finngamesknudson1457
      @finngamesknudson1457 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing - He got much better with his back left after weeks of daily cleaning, bandaging and putting on medical boot (or duct-tape boot). That was several weeks of my wife doing it, occasionally with my help) following weeks having it done by staff in veterinarian hospital!
      That cheap horse has gotten quite expensive! He is my wife’s baby, who she babies with treats (!) - but brings her much peace and joy, so well worth it.

  • @Kashmir-Kikurage
    @Kashmir-Kikurage 3 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    7:45 Front
    13:25 behind

  • @ladyhawk6999
    @ladyhawk6999 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I have a younger I raised born here she picks her feet up great, she only knows us..
    There was a situation where another farrier trimmed her feet .
    I saw his mistake right away.
    He pushed her and picked her foot up, stretched it out sideways pulling her leg up and out hard . That mare reared, she never reared ever in her life like that! The guy said yeah they all say that.
    I was pissed , I called him on why she reared , he just laughed!
    You don't make a horse uncomfortable like that just so it will be comfortable for you .
    That leg isn't meant to bend that way!
    Since , I resumed her trimmings , the only other person who trims her is my long time old farrier . She hadn't over reacted since with me or him. I had medical issues that caused me to use others for hoof work. Something I never had to do before then.

  • @chewar7537
    @chewar7537 หลายเดือนก่อน

    My mare was quicked by a horrible farrier...she has trust issues now with farriers. I fired that guy that day he hurt her. She is 18 and that was the first time she has ever been afraid of her feet getting picked up. I can do it and she does not mind, but a farrier tries and she explodes with her fronts being picked up. Trauma is a HUGE reason horses don't like their feet messed with!

  • @Lonestarrangers620
    @Lonestarrangers620 9 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    What do i do when my horse will pick up her hooves but doesn't like to keep balance while i'm holding one up?

  • @phoenixrising323susanburnl8
    @phoenixrising323susanburnl8 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    My new mare tries to kick with her back feet & turns her butt to intimidate me to get back.
    How do I change this behavior?
    I don't want to get kicked

  • @jordanwhite5470
    @jordanwhite5470 11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    So, small female here, and I have a horse with a bracey back foot. My strength alone will NOT move that foot off the ground. What alternatives do I have? As of right now, it usually requires sedatives to get her shod.

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  11 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Stay consistent with the pressure that you do apply and when the horse finally tries it must feel instantaneous and complete release.
      You can try various positions so that you can find your place of advantage and stay with it until the right result happens. Quiting too soon is the only reason it won’t work

    • @jordanwhite5470
      @jordanwhite5470 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing Thanks! I'll work on that some more.

    • @cattymajiv
      @cattymajiv 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing You give excellent clear advice that's easy to understand. Not everyone does that. So thank you! I'm new here, but I've subscribed.

  • @lanedaw811
    @lanedaw811 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    I have one that will not let you pick up her back feet, what can I do?

  • @TheSkrugga
    @TheSkrugga 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    What if your horse tryes to jump forward or rearing when picking up front legs 🙄

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  10 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Stay with the turn on the forehand until the horse chooses to stop . Then try the front feet again. You likely are trying to hold him too tight and he is rearing because of that

  • @meganpahl2160
    @meganpahl2160 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

    My horse is twelve years old and she always kick with the rear when I want the front d vice versa. She should be used to this by now. I cannot hitch her because she busts halters to get away and she does not like to be penned in either. She us a sweetheart at any other time though. I've desensitized her to touch and she will even lift up whichever hoof I tap but when you want to go for it, she pins those ears and evades me. Suggestions?

  • @AmeliaHeye
    @AmeliaHeye 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    Whenever I try to pick up my horses hoof she will start to put wait on the leg that I’m holding up until I drop her leg so she doesn’t fall. I have tried to pick her hoof up then let it go for a reward but she just refuses to let me hold it. So I want to ask for advice and criticism on what I’m doing wrong or how to fix this behavior. Thank you so much

    • @AmeliaHeye
      @AmeliaHeye 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      I NEED HELP

  • @inwonderland333
    @inwonderland333 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

    But what do you do if a horse rips/ jerks his foot out of your hand ?

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  6 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      That’s what this horse was doing too and with the turn on the fore hand you can show them that standing quiet is the best deal for them . It might take a while but you can get it done this way .

    • @gweger6425
      @gweger6425 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Ok will do that

  • @desireemyers6262
    @desireemyers6262 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    How do you work a horse (2 yo) who's had rough handling and isn't used to having their feet picked up, and are kickers, and I suppose are generally spooky?

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      Exactly like I did in this video . In fact your description would have described this horse just one work and he got really good . Some of them take a bit longer . The concept presented here will work . The key is to be keen to see the slightest try from. Your horse and let him feel freedom in the try

  • @spelavidensek9733
    @spelavidensek9733 4 หลายเดือนก่อน

    I love this video. I have one ponny mare that is a biter, so I don't have.the guts, to turn my back on her, 'cause she is unpredictable... may I please ask for advice. Thank you!

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@spelavidensek9733 biting is happening because it can . If the price to at for it is too high she will choose not to. Pony’s are usually spoiled and think they are the leaders . If the attempt to bite makers her butt hurt she will quit this behavior. One of you is going to get hurt so you need to choose not to be the one that does and stop this obnoxious behavior in the pony now!!!! It is completely unacceptable

    • @spelavidensek9733
      @spelavidensek9733 4 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing how do I do that?

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  4 หลายเดือนก่อน

      @@spelavidensek9733 the answer is in what I told you earlier . You can go to my website Dennis cappel training and shoeing and you can contact me directly at info@cappeltrainingandshoeing.com

  • @michelleharabedian2051
    @michelleharabedian2051 6 หลายเดือนก่อน

    My horse the last 2 farrier visits won’t keep any of his feet on the farrier stand when doing top of foot. He will allow bottom feet done and allow each foot in cradle to do bottom but now refusing to allow top. Farrier uses power tools. Farrier been doing feet for 2 1/2 years

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  6 หลายเดือนก่อน

      This is a sign of a lack of trust or it could be disobedience or it could be a lack of understanding on both horse and farrier .
      Lot of different things can cause this . Perhaps flys ?
      I imagine it has to do with the horse moving his feet because he can . So because he can he will . Why because he is a horse and this is what horses do . Appropriate discipline is your answer more than likely

    • @michelleharabedian2051
      @michelleharabedian2051 6 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      Thank you. I appreciate you responding.

  • @dannybrooking6886
    @dannybrooking6886 5 หลายเดือนก่อน

    You’ve never meet my dentist ,
    Aka -the mad butcher

  • @jcpalmer6051
    @jcpalmer6051 ปีที่แล้ว

    Or you could squeeze the night eye a littlt bit!

    • @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing
      @cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing  ปีที่แล้ว

      I guess you are referring to what I call the chestnut. Yes that will work too .

    • @jcpalmer6051
      @jcpalmer6051 ปีที่แล้ว

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing exactly! I trained also for 30years n yes we also called a chestnut a night eye! I taught that trick to a young girl years ago when she was kicking her horse's ankle to get him to pick up if you can believe that! Glad I came along to teach her! She was amazed! Lol!

    • @cattymajiv
      @cattymajiv 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      @@cappelhorsetrainingandshoeing What is the chestnut for? It must serve some purpose. Do all horses have them? Is there 1 on every leg?
      Not looking for long reply. 1 word answers would be more than enough! And would be so appreciated. ❤

    • @skyehiscock6462
      @skyehiscock6462 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      It is where their legs are joined in their mother's womb. 😊

    • @janetkasovic1518
      @janetkasovic1518 10 หลายเดือนก่อน +1

      ​@@cattymajivNothing. No. Most. Usually.

  • @gerrycoleman7290
    @gerrycoleman7290 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

    Ease the horse's hoof down. Do not slam it down. Be respectful of the horse.

  • @gerrycoleman7290
    @gerrycoleman7290 2 หลายเดือนก่อน

    8:15 pulling the leg out like that is hard on the joints. It is not comfortable for the horse. Think of the horse instead of yourself.

    • @Lionessa8
      @Lionessa8 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +3

      Hi Gerry, I’m an equine osteopath and physiotherapist. Part of my work is I take horses joints through their natural range of motion and I look for restrictions in those joints and through the muscles (and soft tissue) working directly or indirectly with those joints, each joint has its own natural ROM and it’s important to put those joints through their ROM regularly to maintain healthy joints and muscles. What Dennis is doing here and throughout this video has zero negative affect on the horses joint, if your horses are unable to come out like that then they have a need for an osteopath, they have a restriction that is unnatural (most likely in their pectoral muscles for this particular stance seen at 8:15 in the video) and is probably caused by or is causing a somatic dysfunction which could be causing further compensatory restrictions and imbalances elsewhere affecting movement or comfort levels.
      I’m not here to tell you off, so I hope you don’t take it that way, or argue, just want to enlighten you for your horses sake. As I do for many of my clients humans. My client is the horse. I often get called in coz a horse cannot stand well for the farrier, and yes, if a horse is in restriction or in bind they will typically show resistance or inability to be placed in a way a farrier asks, but sometimes their is a disrespect issue and no bind).
      You’ll be surprised at how much ROM their joints like ours can move through in their healthy state and when the surrounding muscles and tendons are all in healthy condition without restriction and enjoying proper fluid dynamics.
      If you haven’t had a good Osteopath or Physio work with your horses I think you (and your lovely horses) will enjoy the benefits of a session. A stand-alone physio will also work with joints but not to the same degree as an Osteopath.
      Have a lovely day 🐴

    • @gweger6425
      @gweger6425 2 หลายเดือนก่อน +2

      ​@@Lionessa8how does one find one of these?

    • @ankymrn
      @ankymrn หลายเดือนก่อน

      Just shut up