Another thing that has messed me up is this idea of hitting in front. Yes, the ball is in front of the body, but often times behind the tip of the front foot and even inside the front knee. If you hit too far in front you will lose power and hit thin. This has been a big challenge for me as I learned to "hit in front" thinking that "in front" was more in front than it should be. Changing your contact point after years of doing it wrong takes a lot of work. I think more important than hitting in front is that the hitting shoulder is not behind the non hitting shoulder. For me, that is a much more accurate and helpful lesson than "hitting in front"
This is a great point. It's amazing how words can mess up a person's ideal of how to hit the ball. You figured out that the hitting shoulder should be "square" or "align" with the non-hitting shoulder. Basically you rotate and square up your shoulders and hips to the target. Great stuff, I may have to do a video on this. Thanks for your comment! JF
@@topspintennisYep. They told me to hit the ball "in front" so I tried hitting the ball 3 feet in front of my forward foot. Several years later, I tried hitting the ball "late" which to me was still quite well in "front" but after years of trying to hit "in front" this felt exceedingly late. Years of practice down the drain because of a bumper sticker lesson improperly contextualized. Now I have before me years of unlearning, which is much harder than learning.
I started recently pointing my strings to back fence like shown here because it forces me to turn my shoulders more (I don't turn enough in match play) and this technique takes pressure off my long head biceps tendon compared to prior takeback which was more on the right side of body as a right handed player. So now I can hit with same power as before and less pain.
Wow, I love this. I am going to use your comment and your Top Spin name in my next video. Showing the strings to the back fence can indirectly cause a great unit turn. Nice job and thanks for your comment! JF
great vid, also trying to implement his Forehand into my game. I'm trying to hit like his BH too and it's going better, forehand is a tougher shot technically.
Hi, I have used the Djoker forehand for a while now and here is some particulars I've experienced. 1. The ready grip; this varies for me as it does with Novak. I am perfectly comfortable switching grips in any situation so I am not dogmatic about which one I used for my ready position. However, my habit is to use a continental grip when I'm uncertain from which direction the ball will be coming but use the semi-western forehand grip when I know the ball is likely coming to my forehand or if I just really want to hit a big forehand with the next shot. Often I can force my opponent to hit to my forehand so I ready myself for that . I suspect it is similar for Novak. 2. Racket facing back fence during load; the exact position of the racket when starting the forward swing can have a significant affect on the amount of spin vs. pace produced. When facing the racket towards back fence that is a high spin position. Rotating the racket towards the side fence reduces spin and adds pace (all other things equal.) However, top pros know how to disguise their shots at long as possible, so with Novak that position doesn't give away his intent. What you want to notice is that during his swing he "turns" to a flatter shot to emphasize pace over spin. If you compare with a forehand where Novak has to hit a speedy incoming ball I suspect you will see less of a "turn" and rely on heavier spin. That's what I do with this forehand anyway and it works very well for me. My confession is that I was shooting for a Federer forehand but straightening that elbow out was a challenge, at least at full match speed. . Always enjoy your analysis. Thanks.
Wow, great insight. I’m usually in a neutral (continental grip) when returning serve but that is because I hit a one hand backhand. Thanks for your comment and support! JF
@@bournejason66 Absolutely. It has to do with elastic energy stored in the forearm as a result of the lag created by the initial forward portion of the swing. When the racket faces the back fence as one starts the forward swing the wrist experiences both ulner flexion/deviation (toward the pinky) AND extension (lays back). The ulner flexion aids in upward acceleration near ball contact producing more spin. Extension aids in forward thrust producing more pace. When one starts with the racket facing the side fence as one starts the forward swing the wrist experience only extension, but little ulner flexion. So this results in more pace but less added spin due to elastic energy. (corrected my logic error from first reply. sorry.) There are infinite gradations between the two extremes which can be easily leveraged to alter the degree of pace and spin for a given shot. I pretty much guarantee Roger fully understands this as I see him doing this very thing to control not only pace and spin, but ultimately depth of shot. Once I understood this concept myself my control improved immensely. Hope that helps.
@@finnyr9330 thanks for the explanation. Not sure why I didn’t see the notification from YT. I am reviewing John’s analysis again and saw your reply. I, too, was shooting for RF forehand but find it quite difficult to implement it. Djokoviv is indeed easier to imitate IMO. Will need to think about more on what you wrote above. Cheers!
@@bournejason66 Glad my comment didn't disappear into the black hole of cyberspace. :) The best way I found to get one's mind around this subject is to go out with the ball machine (or have some way to be able to repeat the exact same shot over and over) and vary only the racket position just prior to the lag. Everything else about the swing should be identical. Monitor the ball trajectory and depth of shot as you change that racket "pre-lag position." Also pay attention to; 1) the feel of how the forearm stretches during the lag; how it differs as the racket pre-lag position changes 2) and the direction of the snap-back (un-stretching); how one pre-lag position has more vertical force than the other. What you want to take away from this is the ability to control depth by altering the pre-lag position; and learn how to quantify precise changes in pre-lag position when reacting to the changes to the incoming balls so that you can consistently hit very deep shots. I don't know how conscious the pros are about how they change the pre-lag positions in this way, but it appears to me that at least Roger, Rafa, and Novak all use this technique so effectively that I am fairly certain they are quite intentional with it. The big three are exceptional at depth-of-shot which I believe is one of the skills that separates them from the rest of the pack. Enjoy! :)
One of the things that has messed me up in my mental image of this stroke are these videos that draw a straight line to show low to high swing plane. Once I replaced this mental image with a circular swing path that stays connected to the core a lot of good things started to happen. Something clicked. So instead of thinking of a straight line from low to high, I imagine a curved line, something like a backwards Nike swoosh. With this idea in my mind I get better core involvement, more power, more spin, more control. The straight line image caused me to try to roll my forehand over the ball and I would often hit thin or long. Once I got the idea of rotation and staying connected to my core, I was able to execute a bit more of the windshield wiper effect where my strings stayed pointed toward my target longer and the brushing across the ball for spin became more from the internal shoulder rotation rather than from the forearm and wrist. This has been a dramatic improvement in my power and control. Those straight line images messed me up for a long time.
very important is the correct use of the left hand, which moving first, then the elbow, which is taking the main action and the wrist action, and also the weight transfer to the left to a stable position...I am always admiring the stable center of the pros, especially Novaks
Using the semi-western makes it easier to hit the checkpoints on the Djokovic forehand. Especially in the backswing when he shows the strings to the back fence. It can be a challenge to hit this checkpoint with a continental or eastern forehand grip. Let me know your thoughts. Thanks! JF
@@bournejason66 As you can see in slow motion, when Djokovic turns sideways tip of the racquet is pointing towards the net, hiting part of the strings towards the side fence (very similar to Dominic Thiem forehand. Thiem is using pause, thats the main difference). You can do it by using sem -western or western grip. If you try to copy that position of the racquet with eastern grip, it will cause you pain in muscule-biceps of the arm, because of unnetural position of muscule. Hope i have helped you.
What a great question! I would say Djokovic's forehand would be easier to mimic since he doesn't use a "straight arm" position on contact. The timing on the straight arm forehand can be a bit more challenging. Thanks for your question! JF
My biggest issue with the forehand is the racket drop. I just cannot get comfortable with it. In tournaments I revert to the old school straight take back and flat swing.
I have the same problem Carl, having learned and competed as a junior playing with a Continental grip and trying to switch to an Eastern grip. A good drill is to choke down on the racket gripping it by its neck and play some mini tennis within the service lines. Enjoy practising!
I've always felt it was a semi-western grip. He may modify it and move closer to a western grip but for the most part it is a semi-western grip. Thanks for your comment! JF
Would love to hear your take on why Roger and Nadal haven’t had much success against Novak in recent years. Is it technique or mental or something else?
I believe it comes down to three things: Djokovic's movement, his endurance and ability to neutralize their offensive shots. One thing the top pros do better than anyone else is they can handle spin, depth and pace better than anyone else. Djokovic doesn't hit the biggest serves and doesn't the biggest off of the ground. His biggest asset in my mind is his ability to "NEUTRALIZE" his opponent's best shots. Thanks for your comment. I hope this adds some perspective. Regards, JF
@@bournejason66 th-cam.com/video/IwdQJa_o0sM/w-d-xo.html 1 ) Defense thanks to flexibility 2) Backhand 3) return (anticipation by reading the "movement ") @Bourne Jason Topspin Tennis makes the same analys.
I don't know what is the benefit of point racket face to the fence? I tried this but it's totally unnatural for me. I'm losing timing and control all my balls going down to the net.
I believe you only show the racquet to the back fence when you have ample time. I feel showing the racquet face to the back fence initiates full body rotation and sets the wrist in a "strong" position. I do want to emphasize having time. I hope this helps! Thanks for your comment! JF
His forehand always looks so effortless to me. Very impressive. Great video.
E2G, I agree. It's the reason why he will continue to have longevity in the sport. Thanks for your comment! JF
Another thing that has messed me up is this idea of hitting in front. Yes, the ball is in front of the body, but often times behind the tip of the front foot and even inside the front knee. If you hit too far in front you will lose power and hit thin. This has been a big challenge for me as I learned to "hit in front" thinking that "in front" was more in front than it should be. Changing your contact point after years of doing it wrong takes a lot of work. I think more important than hitting in front is that the hitting shoulder is not behind the non hitting shoulder. For me, that is a much more accurate and helpful lesson than "hitting in front"
This is a great point. It's amazing how words can mess up a person's ideal of how to hit the ball. You figured out that the hitting shoulder should be "square" or "align" with the non-hitting shoulder. Basically you rotate and square up your shoulders and hips to the target. Great stuff, I may have to do a video on this. Thanks for your comment! JF
@@topspintennisYep. They told me to hit the ball "in front" so I tried hitting the ball 3 feet in front of my forward foot. Several years later, I tried hitting the ball "late" which to me was still quite well in "front" but after years of trying to hit "in front" this felt exceedingly late. Years of practice down the drain because of a bumper sticker lesson improperly contextualized. Now I have before me years of unlearning, which is much harder than learning.
I started recently pointing my strings to back fence like shown here because it forces me to turn my shoulders more (I don't turn enough in match play) and this technique takes pressure off my long head biceps tendon compared to prior takeback which was more on the right side of body as a right handed player. So now I can hit with same power as before and less pain.
Wow, I love this. I am going to use your comment and your Top Spin name in my next video. Showing the strings to the back fence can indirectly cause a great unit turn. Nice job and thanks for your comment! JF
Excellent video and comments! This is the best explanation video of Djokovic's forehand I have seen.
Wow, thank you! That means a lot. More videos to come, thanks for your comment! JF
great vid, also trying to implement his Forehand into my game. I'm trying to hit like his BH too and it's going better, forehand is a tougher shot technically.
Great to hear. Keep me posted on your progress. Thanks for your comment! JF
Hi, I have used the Djoker forehand for a while now and here is some particulars I've experienced.
1. The ready grip; this varies for me as it does with Novak. I am perfectly comfortable switching grips in any situation so I am not dogmatic about which one I used for my ready position. However, my habit is to use a continental grip when I'm uncertain from which direction the ball will be coming but use the semi-western forehand grip when I know the ball is likely coming to my forehand or if I just really want to hit a big forehand with the next shot. Often I can force my opponent to hit to my forehand so I ready myself for that . I suspect it is similar for Novak.
2. Racket facing back fence during load; the exact position of the racket when starting the forward swing can have a significant affect on the amount of spin vs. pace produced. When facing the racket towards back fence that is a high spin position. Rotating the racket towards the side fence reduces spin and adds pace (all other things equal.) However, top pros know how to disguise their shots at long as possible, so with Novak that position doesn't give away his intent. What you want to notice is that during his swing he "turns" to a flatter shot to emphasize pace over spin. If you compare with a forehand where Novak has to hit a speedy incoming ball I suspect you will see less of a "turn" and rely on heavier spin. That's what I do with this forehand anyway and it works very well for me.
My confession is that I was shooting for a Federer forehand but straightening that elbow out was a challenge, at least at full match speed.
.
Always enjoy your analysis. Thanks.
Wow, great insight. I’m usually in a neutral (continental grip) when returning serve but that is because I hit a one hand backhand. Thanks for your comment and support! JF
Why does the racket face direction during load affect the spin? Can you elaborate on that please?
@@bournejason66 Absolutely. It has to do with elastic energy stored in the forearm as a result of the lag created by the initial forward portion of the swing. When the racket faces the back fence as one starts the forward swing the wrist experiences both ulner flexion/deviation (toward the pinky) AND extension (lays back). The ulner flexion aids in upward acceleration near ball contact producing more spin. Extension aids in forward thrust producing more pace. When one starts with the racket facing the
side fence as one starts the forward swing the wrist experience only extension, but little ulner flexion. So this results in more pace but less added spin due to elastic energy. (corrected my logic error from first reply. sorry.)
There are infinite gradations between the two extremes which can be easily leveraged to alter the degree of pace and spin for a given shot. I pretty much guarantee Roger fully understands this as I see him doing this very thing to control not only pace and spin, but ultimately depth of shot. Once I understood this concept myself my control improved immensely.
Hope that helps.
@@finnyr9330 thanks for the explanation. Not sure why I didn’t see the notification from YT. I am reviewing John’s analysis again and saw your reply. I, too, was shooting for RF forehand but find it quite difficult to implement it. Djokoviv is indeed easier to imitate IMO. Will need to think about more on what you wrote above. Cheers!
@@bournejason66 Glad my comment didn't disappear into the black hole of cyberspace. :)
The best way I found to get one's mind around this subject is to go out with the ball machine (or have some way to be able to repeat the exact same shot over and over) and vary only the racket position just prior to the lag. Everything else about the swing should be identical. Monitor the ball trajectory and depth of shot as you change that racket "pre-lag position." Also pay attention to;
1) the feel of how the forearm stretches during the lag; how it differs as the racket pre-lag position changes
2) and the direction of the snap-back (un-stretching); how one pre-lag position has more vertical force than the other.
What you want to take away from this is the ability to control depth by altering the pre-lag position; and learn how to quantify precise changes in pre-lag position when reacting to the changes to the incoming balls so that you can consistently hit very deep shots.
I don't know how conscious the pros are about how they change the pre-lag positions in this way, but it appears to me that at least Roger, Rafa, and Novak all use this technique so effectively that I am fairly certain they are quite intentional with it. The big three are exceptional at depth-of-shot which I believe is one of the skills that separates them from the rest of the pack.
Enjoy! :)
One of the things that has messed me up in my mental image of this stroke are these videos that draw a straight line to show low to high swing plane. Once I replaced this mental image with a circular swing path that stays connected to the core a lot of good things started to happen. Something clicked. So instead of thinking of a straight line from low to high, I imagine a curved line, something like a backwards Nike swoosh. With this idea in my mind I get better core involvement, more power, more spin, more control. The straight line image caused me to try to roll my forehand over the ball and I would often hit thin or long. Once I got the idea of rotation and staying connected to my core, I was able to execute a bit more of the windshield wiper effect where my strings stayed pointed toward my target longer and the brushing across the ball for spin became more from the internal shoulder rotation rather than from the forearm and wrist. This has been a dramatic improvement in my power and control.
Those straight line images messed me up for a long time.
good tip for the backward nike swoosh!
very important is the correct use of the left hand, which moving first, then the elbow, which is taking the main action and the wrist action, and also the weight transfer to the left to a stable position...I am always admiring the stable center of the pros, especially Novaks
That is so beautiful
Pat, it is a thing of beauty isn’t it. Thanks for your comment! JF
Love these videos! Keep them coming!
I’m glad you are enjoying them. Thanks for your support! JF
Follow through Is insane
nice, good job mate
Thanks Ap Ed, I appreciate your support! JF
Another great video 😀
Glad you enjoyed it! JF
Great!
But what about timing?
I mean how does he reads the ball and initiates the stroke
Great point, timing is so important. I will have to make a video on the timing of the backhand. Timing of course is very important! Thanks! JF
Is Djokovic swinging the arm independently as the hips rotate or pulling the racket and meeting the ball square
Does it have to be semi-western to implement his forehand? Can I do it but with an eastern grip? Anything to watch out for if I do that?
Using the semi-western makes it easier to hit the checkpoints on the Djokovic forehand. Especially in the backswing when he shows the strings to the back fence. It can be a challenge to hit this checkpoint with a continental or eastern forehand grip. Let me know your thoughts. Thanks! JF
@@topspintennis I agree. How about bend arm at contact with eastern grip?
It is immposible to copy Djokovic forehand with an eastern grip. Dont try it, belive me, you will hurt your arm.
@Manuel Oljaca thanks for reply. Do you mind elaborate that a bit more? Why it’ll hurts ones arm/wrist?
@@bournejason66 As you can see in slow motion, when Djokovic turns sideways tip of the racquet is pointing towards the net, hiting part of the strings towards the side fence (very similar to Dominic Thiem forehand. Thiem is using pause, thats the main difference). You can do it by using sem -western or western grip. If you try to copy that position of the racquet with eastern grip, it will cause you pain in muscule-biceps of the arm, because of unnetural position of muscule. Hope i have helped you.
Which one’s forehand is easier to imitate or model for recreational players, Federer or djokovic?
What a great question! I would say Djokovic's forehand would be easier to mimic since he doesn't use a "straight arm" position on contact. The timing on the straight arm forehand can be a bit more challenging. Thanks for your question! JF
Topspin Tennis thanks for the explanation. Novak is doing great so far at AO 2021
My biggest issue with the forehand is the racket drop. I just cannot get comfortable with it. In tournaments I revert to the old school straight take back and flat swing.
Carl, trust the process and continue to rep it out. The more you practice the better you will get. It takes a lot of reps. Thanks for your comment! JF
I have the same problem Carl, having learned and competed as a junior playing with a Continental grip and trying to switch to an Eastern grip. A good drill is to choke down on the racket gripping it by its neck and play some mini tennis within the service lines. Enjoy practising!
Hi, what grip does Novak Djokovic use western grip or semi western grip I can’t tell
I've always felt it was a semi-western grip. He may modify it and move closer to a western grip but for the most part it is a semi-western grip. Thanks for your comment! JF
Who is second and 3rd backhand by you ?
I feel Nadal and Sinner are in the top 3. I have Zverev and Medvedev in the top 5. Thanks for your comment! JF
Whoa I just realized there is a John frausto and Jason frausto. I always thought You and him were the same person. ;)
You are correct, we both have our own YT channels. Jason does a great job. Thanks for your support! John
Would love to hear your take on why Roger and Nadal haven’t had much success against Novak in recent years. Is it technique or mental or something else?
I believe it comes down to three things: Djokovic's movement, his endurance and ability to neutralize their offensive shots. One thing the top pros do better than anyone else is they can handle spin, depth and pace better than anyone else. Djokovic doesn't hit the biggest serves and doesn't the biggest off of the ground. His biggest asset in my mind is his ability to "NEUTRALIZE" his opponent's best shots. Thanks for your comment. I hope this adds some perspective. Regards, JF
Topspin Tennis how does he neutralize opponents best shots? Are there something we can learn from it ?
@@bournejason66 th-cam.com/video/IwdQJa_o0sM/w-d-xo.html
1 ) Defense thanks to flexibility
2) Backhand
3) return (anticipation by reading the "movement ")
@Bourne Jason Topspin Tennis makes the same analys.
I don't know what is the benefit of point racket face to the fence? I tried this but it's totally unnatural for me. I'm losing timing and control all my balls going down to the net.
I believe you only show the racquet to the back fence when you have ample time. I feel showing the racquet face to the back fence initiates full body rotation and sets the wrist in a "strong" position. I do want to emphasize having time. I hope this helps! Thanks for your comment! JF