Stuff like this is part of the real joy of being a Batman fan. Basically everyone has their favourite from the A-listers, but every person I've met has that C-List character which they will always go up to bat for, and have superb concepts for how they could be utilised. It really is part of the charm of having a franchise which is this old and has this many takes, there's place for all manner of foes big and small to gain some love. Keep up the great work, and have a lovely day.
@@felixleidig8307 Clock King could play into a fundamental fear that Batman has- his inability to save everyone. Setup these huge, sprawling crimes that push Batman to his limits as he tries to stop the Clock king's various plots all at once. Heck, to sell him as a threat, make it so there's one time Batman DOESN'T make it in time, and an innocent person gets killed.
Don't forget all the Frmale Villains that Batman had as well! Like, I will NEVER, EVER understand why the Caped Crusader Show had the _gall_ to change Penguin's gender and use Harley for the millionth time rather than spotlighting other obscure Female Batman Villains like the Mime, White Rabbit, Queenie, and etc. Nocturna was a step in the right direction.
Yea but that’s one of the most intelligent dc villains and one of the most maniacal villains in dc. They are exceptions bc of the severity of their tangible & potential impact. They’re just better lol
They were goofy AF at the start. The got rewritten as serial killers and/or terrorists with a gimmick, which is what batman writers tend to do with 99% of the sillier, older villains. It works, because goofy gimmicks quite naturally becomes deranged psychopathy when you mix in murder, mindgames and mass destruction, but its kinda lazy when it's overdone to every villain. Joker, riddler, calendar man, firefly, mad hatter etc. Etc.
Speaking of Calendar Man, if anyone was confused by this video in which Batspecter kept showing images of a non-tattooed Julian Day with commentary like "stories like *The Long Halloween* would eventually give him an exciting reimagining as some guy with tattoos on his head who sits in the asylum all day" It's because Julian Day doesn't have tattoos in that comic book... he gets them in *Batman: Dark Victory* .
Mutant Moth is cool but kinda generic, although assuming that he *isn’t* the one from The Batman (2004) we don’t exactly know who he was prior to mutating.
I'm glad you brought up Riddler's status as a "former C-lister," since I feel like a lot of people forget that the line between "big shot Gotham rogue" and "forever C-list joke with a stupid gimmick" all depends on fan reception and the faith modern writers have in the characters.
@@viscountrainbows2857 Pennies are unfortunately too weak of a gimmick, like even in his original debut comic you could tell the writers were struggling to come up with crimes involving pennies, not to mention how increasingly useless pennies are becoming to the point they might completed stop production because it takes more than two pennies to make one, It's hard to think of a way to modernize a character that is based exclusively on one piece of currency, at best you make him a henchman or you try something different like a bronze king Midas of sorts. I mean, when was the last time you used a penny? Because as a non American I never had to in my life
@@mateushenriquepinheiro3197 The US government decides it wants to get rid of Pennies should be a penny Plunter plot he has to stop this from happening
A very interesting fact about Mr. Freeze is that in Grant Morrison’s excellent Animal Man series, he’s one of several characters in Comic Book Limbo, which is a world where forgotten comic book characters go when no one wants to write for them-it’s a very meta series. That just goes to show how good his reinvention was.
I personally really love Calendar Man's classic look. The idea of a cape made of calendar pages is absurd, but so unique that I honestly have to respect it on creativity alone. I also love the sound of it unfolding when gliding as him in Lego DC Supervillains.
WOW... Never in my life I would have thought I would have met a person who thinks it like me, okay the design of him with the months wrote around his head I nice, but only when he's in Arkham or not doing anything. There should be more adaptions of him who maintain that cool costume, and he should have different costumes and gadgets for every festivity. In my Batman universe He would: steal Freeze's ice guns and bombs on Christmas while dressed as a snow man. Help poison ivy with one of her bio terroristic acts on earth day with some chemicals given by her. And other ideas, what do you think?
What do you think of Arkham Asylum's design for Calendar Man? Personally I think it's legitimately a worthy successor for a modern design (provided DC wants to let him out of his little cage)
It’s nice but it gave me to much riddler vibes he feels to refined the calander pages build into the design look nice but I hate the tattoos and he’s too lean for my tastes
The Eraser always had a cool idea to me, I like the villains who use crime as a job like the the Carpenter or The Broker, it makes the world feel more lived in, I even had a idea like that Killer Moth but for The Eraser.
Well now I wanna see a Killer Moth-Eraser partnership thing where they work together to assist other criminals in their misdeeds and helping them get out of trouble.
The Eraser has a huge potential to be another invertion of Batman. Where the Dark Knight uses his detective skills to fight the corruption in Gotham city and to make a change for the better of all people, the Eraser uses his detective skills to help other criminals get the upper hand, just because, well, that's his job, the city revolves around in criminal activity so he takes advantage of that and tries to fit in. It's not because of revenge, and not necessarily for power, the Eraser's goal is to just survive the hellhole that he's in.
Someone who leaves no evidence would be a perfect antagonist for the world’s greatest detective. Just give The Eraser a more serious design and you’ll be golden.
The killer moth lawyer angle sounds like an amazing way of reinventing the character, mostly because I really like the juridical side of the superhero world since Daredevil and She hulk have brought some interesting stories around it, we could get a story about killer moth being a big threat to Batman not only due to his actions in court, but also do to him figuring out Bruce's identity and using that as a bargaining chip to stop Bruce from arresting him (alternatively you could have him start as a pathetic villain but become an actual good guy as he joins Batman incorporated, sort of like 8 Ball in Marvel comics) I always thought that Maxie Zeus could benefit from being a metahuman with lightning based powers so that his delusional belief of being a reincarnation of Zeus could have more credit, plus he would be much more of a threat if he did have the power to back up his godhood claims even if he was on the weaker side of the electric power spectrum. If possible I think he would work amazingly as part of Tim's own rogues gallery, most reinvented joke villains should be spread out across the rest of the Batfamily. I like the new reinvention of the ten eyed man too, just wished he would make more appearances if possible. Also Kiteman got himself a whole ass cartoon series so I think he is fine for now (really liked the story where Damian and John bust him out of prison just so he can teach Diana's daughter how to fly a kite) Let's hope Caped Crusader season 2 brings new reinventions to other loser rogues in Batman's gallery of villains
Kite man shows that not all charactets need the type reinventions that removes most of the camp and sillyness. We have room for Batman stories which embrace those things :) For example, maybe Calendar man redesigns should embrace most of his sillyness
I like most of these characters. The only problem they have, if they have any, is that writers didn't bother modernising them. That's why they seem goofy because most of them were created back in the silver age and they still carry their silver age outlook and feeling with them. All you need is flesh them out, give them believable origins stories... In general, rework them a bit without making them loose their original identity. (For example, look at what geoff john did with the character of black hand). In reality they're not goofier than the joker or the riddler of the silver age. The only problem i see is that batman's rogues gallery becomes oversaturated with villains. But i could make an exception if we are going to see more of classic villains like maxie zeus, calendar man and especially killer moth
I like the idea of Killer Moth as an evil lawyer and Maxie zeus having a crime family based on the greek gods an ares crime boss would go hard. You should be hired by DC to make batman comics. Keep up the good work.
Ares heads the enforcer unites while Athena plans the heists Hades handles underground matter when needed but it’s mostly the beaurocrat dealing with logistics Poseidon works with costal imports and smuggling Hestia burns the evidence Dionysus is in charge of the production lines Apollo runs distraction with a prependiticy for flamethrowers Artemis is assassination Hers ensure peace between the family and heads the interrogations Aphrodite would be the trafficking Demeter grows the plants and “recycles” the victims Hephaestus deals with the weapon manufacturing Honestly it works
Maxie Zeus makes me think of General Patton, but like... on crack. A dude so delusional that he genuinely believes himself the reincarnation of a king/god? There has always been so much opportunity for incredible character development there, not to mention how fascinating his interactions with other villains would be if they brought him into the spotlight for a while. Imagine a crime lord who is like "my actions are justified because i am a god. I can do what I want, but lunatics like that Joker clown need to be locked up. If i weren't busy with other things, i'd smite them myself" Killer Moth as an evil daredevil would be insanely cool, especially because he is exactly the type of character who would directly antagonize the police. I think Killer Moth would work really well narratively as being a main driving force that gets Batman and GCPD to work together. Like in a setting where Batman and the cops have been kind of at odds with them viewing him as a negative vigilante, but because of stuff happening with Killer Moth, they realize that someone like Batman is the sort of person they might need to work with to take down people who push the boundaries of what criminals can realistically get away with doing Polka-dot man in the suicide squad was just fantastic. Enough said tbh Calendar man is the kind of character that becomes way more interesting the more intelligent you make him. Working off of dates and patterns that your average person would have difficulty keeping up with is exactly the type of intellectual foil that is fun to see Batman bring down. If people didn't treat Calendar man like such a joke or feel like they need to make him a mental patient, I think he is probably the best contender of the "losers" to become another Moriarty to Batman's Holmes. Out of them all, Calendar man even seems like the kind of criminal who would exist in real life. I can absolutely imagine headlines about some genius psychopath doing elaborate stuff based on patterns over time. Makes me think of people like the Zodiac killer. Calendar Man could be legitimately terrifying if they wanted to make it happen Anyway, great video as always
My favorite max interpretation was in "The Batman" where he literally lives in the clouds and controls weather events, I never really considered Max to be that much of a joke villain (at least in the batman media i have consumed)
Might be cool if he was kinda like a Simon stagg when he’s based on a air ship in Gotham and his company develops a weather augmenting cloudburst system which he uses to cause extreme weather damage in Gotham allowing him to scoop up tons of land and property that gets destroyed slowly turning Gotham into his Olympus
I’m pretty sure Catman only happened because original comic character Catman became public domain, and DC simply wanted to take the name for themselves. Similar to how Marvel to what they did for Captain Marvel.
Honestly he’s too much of a fsurjt odds parents character for me to even imagine being in DC I know he has been after the initial company went bust it whatever but that’s where I learnt if him
A villain I havent seen in a minute is Baby Doll. I think if used correctly she could be a great opportunity for commentary on body dismorphia, and also the way Hollywood treats child actors and how that impacts their adult brain functions. Great vid!
Your idea for Killer Moth is really good. I never understood why hardly any writer tried to revamp a character with such good potential based on his name and gimmick alone. Moths can be just as freaky as bats.
Play it straight of him being a badass fighting six pack for control of the earth, then cut away to the guards at Arkham looking mildly annoyed at these two drugged out harmless nut jobs.
I love the idea of Zeus’s crime family being based on the Greek gods. I’m imagining something where once they are brought into the family, they are assigned a god by Maxie, but where they go from there is up to them. Maybe Poseidon is given his name by how he controls the docks, but doesn’t commit beyond that, while someone who is given Artemis based on how she handles hunting down snitches and taking down members of other gangs, and she fully commits with using arrows in all her hits, and assigning all of her targets different animals while she is planning. Hermes handles sending messages to other members of the gang and marking targets to inspire fear in other gangs, and he has a chopper with little wings on the back and wears a helmet based on Hermes. There is just so much flavour in how the different members react to being assigned their gods.
THANK YOU for your segment on Condiment King. You can always tell if someone is a hack if they legitimately try and rag on Condiment King as some kind of ridiculous villain.
The Killer Moth as an evil Daredevil honestly sounds awesome. As for Calendar Man, BTAS inadvertently found a perfect way to reinvent him (albeit with a different character). The idea of his crimes being themed around the march of time and the inevitability of expiring is perfect for a villain like Calendar Man.
Killer Moth I think another factor that contributed to his negative reception is the fact he was another “anti-Batman” archetype. And him helping criminal escape is seeming taken by Wraith, a who design was just Batman with a few tweaks. But you idea of KM being a Saul Goodman would make an excellent twist, and even could let Wraith and KM team up occasionally. Honestly I like the idea of Calendar not having “official look” I think the idea he just changes his outfit based off the holiday would be a neat idea. Especially if you keep the serial killer aspect. Zeus not getting an update does bugs me because he probably not the worst offender here. He could easily just be reimagine as a mob boss who has a god complex. I could easily imagine him being rivals with Penguin.
5:05: The Batman(2004-2008) TV series made him more of a rich narcissistic Greekaboo who made technology based on Greek culture or mythology to get what he wants.
My take on Killer Moth is he's great by default, even with a costume that isn't that different from the original one. The issue really is the presentation they give him, I think he should mimic Batman in more ways than just being a reversal of his main goal. We know he's smart considering he's capable of not only disguising himself among Gotham's socialites, but also making all those gadgets that easily rival Batman's. Let's go further with his intelligence, then. If Batman is The World's Greatest Detective, a Sherlock Holmes type character, let's make Killer Moth The World's Greatest Schemer, something akin to Arsène Lupin (though more focused on his ability to plan out all his schemes and escapes perfectly, rather than stealing). What I'm saying is, Batman should struggle to figure out Killer Moth's crimes, as much as he would with someone like The Riddler, if he didn't leave clues. Furthermore, his combat abilities should ALSO be on a similar levels to Batman's, just that they come from different backgrounds, making a very noticable difference in their fighting styles. And if Batman is terrifying, he should be capable of being that, too. Lots of people have an irrational fear of insects (a large portion fearing moths specifically), and it's not like Killer Moth can't look scary, he CAN. It's all about framing. (I personally think some details on his costume play into a more scary look, the big eyes with the THICK lining on the Golden Age costume making him look perpetually angry, the mere silhouette of a man with wings, those antennas easily able to be misinterpreted as horns in the dark, just like Batman's ears) You could also change helping criminals, to just being a mercenary in general. Mirroring Batman in the way of having all this he could use to help people out of the goodness of his heart, yet he chooses to make money off of it instead. Though this point is entirely skippable, I think helping criminals still works. All this to say, I love Killer Moth and hope he gets more appreciation for how cool he actually is.
Also, if anyone wants to question how he couldn't figure out Batman's identity with an intelligence rivaling his: 1. Why can't so many other villains? Because the writer doesn't want them to. 2. That's not the focus of his intelligence. 3. He has no real reason to, unless paid to do so. 4. If I were writing him, I'd make it so he actively REFUSES to do it, because of how much he respects Batman. He was his main inspiration, after all.
I swear to god man, Like if you know a character suck why not rewrite to not suck? Why are there so many stuff that makes fun of a character instead of rewriting them to fix what didn’t work/give them more depth God, it’s such a waste for something that’s been SO overdone
I think a number of these villians should be given to superheroes who are starving for any credible recurring villians including Atom, Firestorm and Plastic Man. Batman already has enough villians and it's only fair to give his villians to other heroes when he's stealing the likes of Deathstroke from others.
Plastic Man and Firestorm both have a surprisingly large list of good villains. Well not really surprisingly large since Plastic Man was one of the best comics in the golden age and firestorm had a great original run. The problem is a lot of their villains don't get used. Or get absorbed into the suicide squad in firestorm's case
@@liasoid3073 With Firestorm and Plastic Man, they don’t appear to have a nemesis that really acts as their antis or opposites. At least, they don’t have any villain that could be their dark mirror while still individualistic at the same time. Brave and The Bold paired up Firestorm against a villain who basically has a similar two personalities in a shared body which makes me surprised they haven’t taken another villain with the Janus gimmick and give them to him. For Plastic Man? He started as a criminal before turning good and more of a comedic type superhero. Batman’s villains from the Golden Age to Silver Age and some parts of the Bronze Age look like they belong more with him than in Gotham. Hell, the Penny Plunderer could actually be made into a worthwhile villain against him.
@@rayvenkman2087 I think plastic man's nemesis was granite lady For firestorm I feel like his most importantly villains are (the first two) Killer Frosts (heat vampires) and Multiplex (Fission instead of Fusion)
Maxie Zeus could work as a Wonder Woman villain. He can somehow control thunder and believes Diana is his daughter so she should be his right hand to takeover the world. While Wonder Woman is taking on this madman, she is investigating why the Olympian Gods are disappearing and a new Maxie goon with that god's powers are appearing at the same time. For Calendar Man, I would just embrace the Silver Age goofiness. Imagine Batman trying to foil an over the top holiday crime that even he is having a hard time with. Make it feel like an Adam West style episode.
I have how he can control the weather and still be delusional, He has Mark Mardon (weather Wizard ) working for him as unnamed henchmen number 12 Mark does not know he has the power to control the weather he thinks it is Zeus and Mark unconsciouly does what Maxie's asks When Mark leaves the room Zeus tries to summon lighting but it doesn't work. Batman decides its best if Mark doesn't know he can control the weather and Zeus is still convinced he can
Love that killer Moth Concept perfect way to use an under utilized character and give a richness to the universe and adds a perfect law aspect for DC that’s missing that Marvel has with daredevil and she hulk.
Killer Moth has a really great niche as a villain who’s more of an enemy for Barbara Gordon than Bruce, or at least a villain who transitions into that role, and I’d like to see that expanded upon
I like your Saul Goodman idea for killer moth. What if he deduced Batman’s identity then extorted him for money. He would basically be paid to be Batman’s lawyer since vigilantism is a crime and Batman would be paying for his “legal counsel” but also so that he can’t tell everybody Batman’s secret identity. It also ensures Batman can’t put him away in black gate or something because he would then be disbarred and investigated and Batman would be found out.
There's actually a story where he pulled a Hush before he was a thing, where he got surgery to impersonate Bruce Wayne after he lost his fortune only for Robin to take him to the Batcave and expose to him that Bruce is Batman.
Nah, it wasn't just Riddler's drip that improved him, but also his puzzle based death traps. Especially how they were turned into Saw-level death traps in Arkham City...
I think a cool way to explore Maxie Zeus's character and make him more of a threat would it be to make his main "superpower" his incredible confidence. Yes he may be deluded but his delusion get some confidence and confidence can make you very powerful.
This is such a good video. I feel like the urge to portray Batman's c-list villains as "losers" speaks to kind of a lack of creativity in some writers. Like you said, sometimes it just takes a really small tweak to turn a joke character into someone that can be taken seriously as a threat. Also I've been saying how good Calendar Man's Arkham Asylum character portrait is for YEARS, it's criminal that they've never used that design anywhere else since.
Eh I like how boring calendar man design is, because he’s a vlllain that happens in real life, and his lack of design just make him scary . Which is why I like him in dark victory, and Arkham games.
Killer moth being an genius ultra successful lawyer would be a good reimagining. With his cosume being given antenna that more closely resemble bat man to boot. sounds like an banger if executed right
MY SWEET BEAUTIFUL PRINCE MAXIE ZEUS, IS NOT A LOSER! HE IS THE KING, HE IS MY SWEET LUSCIOUS PRINCE! THE REASON I WAKE UP EVERY DAY, IS THIS MAN'S GORGEOUS FACE! HE IS BATMAN'S ARCH ENEMY, JOKER WHO? MAXIE ZEUS IS MY GOD!
Me recordaste a un video de TH-cam en donde Batman pelea con condiment king diciendo que es un gran amenaza y todos los demas miembros de la justice league se le quedan mirando
Objection! Calendar Man committing crimes themed after holidays is not ANY sillier than the Joker's gimmick of being a clown. I'm sick of people saying that. It's a perfectly reasonable gimmick. Edit: Oh. You said that. Thank you.
I had an interesting idea for a serious Maxie Zeus story: The actual Zeus comes down from Olympus to punish the poser who bears his identity as his own, arriving at Maxie's mansion. Maxie, still delusional, accuses Zeus of being the fake, angering the god. Zeus, in a fit of rage, challenges Maxie to a duel, to which the latter agreed. However, believing he's the real Zeus and might actually take the "fake"'s life, Maxie challenges him to a trivia contest instead. Zeus flies them both to a greek museum and they coerce the staff into hosting a trivia contest for them, qbout greek mithology. Maxie ends up winning with his vast knowledge of greek mithology, also due to Zeus' forgetfulness. By winning, Maxie gets granted the full extent of Zeus' powers, allowing him to rule over Gotham. Batman would stand no chance, but Wonder Woman would arrive to investigate Zeus' disappearance, teaming up with Batsy.
This would be interesting, especially if Zeus decides to create a human Pantheon for Maxie Zeus by having the various Olympians each choose a human who assumes a place in Maxie Zeus' Pantheon. Each human gets some abilities of the god/goddess who selected them. Of course, they might also gets some of the personality issues of their patron.
Killer Moth’s backstory already is (probably by accident) a take on Jay Gatsby. Seriously: Drury Walker becomes rich through crime and reinvents himself as Cameron Van Cleer? It’s a solid base one could use to build upon and even intentionally draw parallels to.
I know he wasn't the focus but always appreciate when Firefly is mentioned. Love the dude, very simple premise, just an insane pyromaniac with a jetpack. Weird how there's not a lot of those in comics given how simple it is. Always waiting for his chance to appear in live action...
If done right these villains can be reinvented into a serious threatening villains. Killer Moth could be reworked into being a Dexter esp seriel killer/lawyer. Calendar man can be a simple serial killer that killls on holidays. Maxxie Zeus could be turned into a wonder woman villain.
I like the idea of a comic series where many of Batman’s lesser known rouges gallery (like Mothman, Maxie Zeus, Calenderman, etc) are all coming out of the woodwork at similar times, Batman soon discovering all of them are apart of the same plot to take over Gotham or even in some cases to kill him. To me it would be the perfect way to reintroduce and rework many villains in the modern age without reducing them into punchlines.
My killer moth au: drury walker as a kid, saw his little brother die in a fire accident. Now he is a deadbeat math teacher in severe debt. By his need for money, and prove that he isnt a loser in his life(to his parents) he starts working as a hired goon , to be a distraction in the crime scene and be the one who is attacked first(with his wacky clothes). Batman once met him and shot a batarang to his wings and left him there, saying "You arent a criminial , you shouldn't try being one". As Drury's ego was damaged and he wanted to prove himself worthy, he grabbed the batarang to his place and started detective work to see who is batman, seeing only a wealthy man can afford 10-20 batarangs a day, and it needs to be a person that isnt seen in nights, he suspected that it's Bruce Wayne. He went to tell the mob bosses and all he got was a laugh, mad as them he got into a crazy state, and fired the whole place of that gang whilst flying towards the fire to end it all(pyromaniac and a reference to Icarus flying too close to the sun) becoming the fire fly, but batman saved him last minute. After many years he found a detective job and Gcpd
Maxi Zeus being a Megalomaniac is pretty on brand with Batman Villains, he could just be a powerful crime lord who has god complexes as he is in fact a powerful crime boss. Batman already made reservations for him in Arkham Asylum.... with the cheapest room.
its always good to hear someone give characters like that a chance, DC really picked up their A game when they started embracing the C and D tier's of heroes and villains and exploring their possibilities since it doesn't take a lot of effort to find gold in what hasn't been mined very well, I know Caped Crusader has been mixed for People, but I really think they opened up something for seeing more of Otomatapoeia in the future or even the Silver age version of Clayface.
I would love an entire season of a Batman show with Calendar Man as the main antagonist. Each day, Batman figures out what weird holiday it is, and has to keep gadgets in his pocket specifically in case Calendar Man tries something that day. There’s a 50/50 chance of any crime being normal or Calendar based, and sometimes they sync up. Calendar man could be an even more fun version of the Riddler, and I’m waiting for the day where Batman has to face 365 days of petty crime!
We all forget too that all the prominent rogues from the 60s tv show where for a time ignored or sparingly used by the Bronze Age writers because of how goofy said show was yet they’re all overused if anything now (joker, penguin, cat woman, riddler, mad hatter)
The only take I'd disagree with is that the Spot was made cool by Spiderverse. Van Lente made him beyond badass in his "Return of the Spot" story in ASM #589
Great job on this project. I really enjoy hearing about what makes these villains interesting to you. I certainly agree with you about Mr. Freeze and I hope every villain gets their day in the spotlight!
I feel like any villain can be threatening if you just give them the time and write them well Like Shocker is typically treated as the textbook loser villain and even he can be threatening, like in the ps4 game where he takes a punch to the face from SPIDERMAN and barely even flinches and in the second game is said to have fought Kraven to the death and put up a better fight than any of the other villains Another good example from Spiderman is Spot, who over the course of a single movie went from just another villain of the week to the strongest villain in the multiverse, infact if DC ever tries to tackle the trope the same way Spiderverse did I think Killer Moth would be the perfect character for it On the other hand I hate when writers instead make them a whole different character to make them seem dangerous. Like recent adaptations of calender man turn him into this hannibal lector style criminal mastermind who is confined to a cell due to how dangerous he is, but that isn’t calender man, that’s just hannibal lector but calender themed And I know I’m dragging this on but I also feel like there are a few villains where they kinda have to be losers or silly because that’s who they are. Like condiment king, he’s a dweeb, he’s hilarious, that’s why we love him In general I’m not really a fan of the loser villain trope, unless it’s to set them up as a greater threat later or make them endearing I feel like it shows a lack of faith in the idea of a comic book villain.
Honestly some of the Arkham Asylum character artworks were great and it's a shame most were not only not what was actually used in games, but many were of characters that didn't appear and had designs that would never be used or drawn from again. Honestly I've always been a defender of Killer Moth as an idea. His concept is a really good one with heaps of potential, and the moth theme should be SO easy to make scary and cool, he frankly could have been just as iconic by now as Mr Freeze (my all time fav) if he'd gotten just a subtle rework/reintroduction in the same vein
I thought Maxie Zeus was done very well in The Batman 2004, so I almost didn't think he was a joke. I also agree villains like Killer Moth and Kite Man could use another chance for redemption
First of all amazing video i really liked it but i spefially like the idea of turning mothman into a saul goodman type character specially because you can add more forgotten villains to make a team. My idea is pretty much this, mothman being the face/charismatic guy whom does all the dirty work and fights batman and have the eraser and mr camera to dispose and falsificate evidence for their customers
One of my favorite villains only appeared for half an issue. It was a sick idea, an alien disguising himself with mob boss that has electricity powers. I would love a movie where the Gimmick Gang is trying to take down Gotham or something cool like that
Tbh I feel a take on Maxie Zeus that parallels the modern comics huge bat family with him having a crime family themed around Olympic gods, but also having him act insanely abusive and megalomaniacal to them much like how the actual Zeus acted in mythology to mirror a version of Bruce who abused and took advantage of his Allies and family would go insanely hard
I actually had a reimagining for ten eyed man a while back Instead of eyes on his fingertips he instead has synthetic compound eyes (fly eyes) so he can see in all directions, giving him enhanced reflexes
No surprise Dan Watters came up with a cool idea for Ten-Eyed Man. He says people always come to him when they need someone to write a villain and he revels in it, like he currently is with the Destro series. I prefer the idea of making even the weird villains serious and/or dangerous. Gotham is a dangerous place, so people who don't know what they're doing shouldn't make it long enough to be remembered. Plus, Mr. Freeze is a great example of what you can get when you shoot for the stars instead of settle for memes.
DC universe has the Greek gods active within it. That Zeus and company haven't slapped down Maxie Zeus leads to some interesting questions. Are they playing one of their cruel games with this mortal?
If anyone was confused by this video in which Batspecter kept showing images of a non-tattooed Julian Day with commentary like "stories like *The Long Halloween* would eventually give him an exciting reimagining as some guy with tattoos on his head who sits in the asylum all day" It's because Julian Day doesn't have tattoos in that comic book... he gets them in *Batman: Dark Victory* . Keep up the good work!
@@TheBatspecter - Hi there! Honestly I think hardcore fans would indeed get the idea, but I could also see lots of casuals being confused by the juxtaposition of footage & audio. Oh, and to prove that I'm not just a stick in the mud, let me recommend a pretty good semi-recent Calendar Man stories! From the 2020's *New Year Evil* , I recommend _"New Year, New You"_ in which a new psychiatrist at Arkham Asylum makes the terrible mistake of assuming that Julian Day is a "loser villain", and... you'll see ^^ Written by the multi-talented Christos N Gage, it's a nice short story about Julian. (and the short story right after, about Chronos, is a real tear-jerker... )
The eraser should of been a character in the suicide squad game and had his shoes as a melee and used them and put them together to make a pencil point and he would use it as a traversal
I honestly think Killer Moth could work if he was given a more serious treatment like how Calender Man was given. Just give him a new backstory based on the American Cryptid of the "Mothman," make him a legitimate threat, and there you go!
Stuff like this is part of the real joy of being a Batman fan. Basically everyone has their favourite from the A-listers, but every person I've met has that C-List character which they will always go up to bat for, and have superb concepts for how they could be utilised. It really is part of the charm of having a franchise which is this old and has this many takes, there's place for all manner of foes big and small to gain some love. Keep up the great work, and have a lovely day.
"they will always go up to bat for", heh. I see what you did there!
For me its probably Clock King and definitley Gentleman Ghost
@@felixleidig8307 Clock King could play into a fundamental fear that Batman has- his inability to save everyone. Setup these huge, sprawling crimes that push Batman to his limits as he tries to stop the Clock king's various plots all at once. Heck, to sell him as a threat, make it so there's one time Batman DOESN'T make it in time, and an innocent person gets killed.
@@wandereringshadow8658 yeah something like the start of knightfall but with Clock King and yeah someone dieng
Don't forget all the Frmale Villains that Batman had as well!
Like, I will NEVER, EVER understand why the Caped Crusader Show had the _gall_ to change Penguin's gender and use Harley for the millionth time rather than spotlighting other obscure Female Batman Villains like the Mime, White Rabbit, Queenie, and etc.
Nocturna was a step in the right direction.
Honestly them being losers for being ”goofy/ridiculous” doesn’t really hold up when Joker and Riddler are two of the biggest Batman villains.
Yea but that’s one of the most intelligent dc villains and one of the most maniacal villains in dc. They are exceptions bc of the severity of their tangible & potential impact. They’re just better lol
THIS. THANK YOU FOR SAYING IT. “Oohh too silly” LITERAL CLOWN AS HIS ARCH NEMESIS
They were goofy AF at the start. The got rewritten as serial killers and/or terrorists with a gimmick, which is what batman writers tend to do with 99% of the sillier, older villains. It works, because goofy gimmicks quite naturally becomes deranged psychopathy when you mix in murder, mindgames and mass destruction, but its kinda lazy when it's overdone to every villain.
Joker, riddler, calendar man, firefly, mad hatter etc. Etc.
@@JimIBobIJonesand I think many takes of those villains are lesser for it.
@@JimIBobIJones I love you
I like Calendar Man not having a consistent costume and just wearing things based on the date. That feels much more in line with his compulsion.
Speaking of Calendar Man, if anyone was confused by this video in which Batspecter kept showing images of a non-tattooed Julian Day with commentary like "stories like *The Long Halloween* would eventually give him an exciting reimagining as some guy with tattoos on his head who sits in the asylum all day"
It's because Julian Day doesn't have tattoos in that comic book... he gets them in *Batman: Dark Victory* .
@@randallflagg3700Manuela Effect
Does that not mean Calender Man has a maximum of 366 outfits in his closet? One for every day and one for every 4 years
@@TheUncivilizedNationis there a holiday for 29th feb also some holiday last days or week
@@TaniaDlc-z2x February 29th only exists every four years because of Leap Year. That has to mean something to Calendar Man
Killer Moth has a banger design, mutated and normal human form
Yeah
Yeah I thought the version of him in the Teen Titans show was pretty cool and scary, big mutant moth man with a killer design.
@@scottroxford5715 For a long time, I didn't know he was meant to be the same character. He was cool.
Teen titans Killer Moth is always my favorite
Normal human form is better hes the original anti batman
I really want a serious killer moth. The concept of an anti vigilante is so cool
The Eraser could be a partner. Then they’d be an evil Dynamic Duo.
There is a serious killer moth in the Batman Gargoyle of Gotham series
What about pre “Teen Titans Go!” Teen Titans depiction
Mutant Moth is cool but kinda generic, although assuming that he *isn’t* the one from The Batman (2004) we don’t exactly know who he was prior to mutating.
Batman had a character called the Wraith that was that.
I'm glad you brought up Riddler's status as a "former C-lister," since I feel like a lot of people forget that the line between "big shot Gotham rogue" and "forever C-list joke with a stupid gimmick" all depends on fan reception and the faith modern writers have in the characters.
Si osea su concepto era interesante un villano cuyo truco es dejar pistas que se enfrenta al mejor detective del mundo
Killer moth could easily be a big threat I feel.
Also calendar man
@@bestaround3323in Teen Titans (2003), he was
While the episode was comedic, he was still a legitimate threat
Not exactly. I dont think a character like Kite Man could ever be taken as a serious threat
The Penny Plunderer would have made the list, but he couldn't afford to sign up
Only batman villain to get the death penalty
@@abiodunsulaiman2297Lord Death Man got the death penalty twice
The sign up sheet took quarters only.
@@viscountrainbows2857 Pennies are unfortunately too weak of a gimmick, like even in his original debut comic you could tell the writers were struggling to come up with crimes involving pennies, not to mention how increasingly useless pennies are becoming to the point they might completed stop production because it takes more than two pennies to make one, It's hard to think of a way to modernize a character that is based exclusively on one piece of currency, at best you make him a henchman or you try something different like a bronze king Midas of sorts. I mean, when was the last time you used a penny? Because as a non American I never had to in my life
@@mateushenriquepinheiro3197 The US government decides it wants to get rid of Pennies should be a penny Plunter plot he has to stop this from happening
A very interesting fact about Mr. Freeze is that in Grant Morrison’s excellent Animal Man series, he’s one of several characters in Comic Book Limbo, which is a world where forgotten comic book characters go when no one wants to write for them-it’s a very meta series. That just goes to show how good his reinvention was.
Yeah, I was about to comment that. Gotta love the extremely meta final arc of Grant Morrison's Animal Man.
I personally really love Calendar Man's classic look. The idea of a cape made of calendar pages is absurd, but so unique that I honestly have to respect it on creativity alone. I also love the sound of it unfolding when gliding as him in Lego DC Supervillains.
100% agreed, I find his modern design aggressively boring compared to his standout classic costume
WOW... Never in my life I would have thought I would have met a person who thinks it like me, okay the design of him with the months wrote around his head I nice, but only when he's in Arkham or not doing anything. There should be more adaptions of him who maintain that cool costume, and he should have different costumes and gadgets for every festivity.
In my Batman universe He would: steal Freeze's ice guns and bombs on Christmas while dressed as a snow man.
Help poison ivy with one of her bio terroristic acts on earth day with some chemicals given by her.
And other ideas, what do you think?
What do you think of Arkham Asylum's design for Calendar Man? Personally I think it's legitimately a worthy successor for a modern design (provided DC wants to let him out of his little cage)
@@grinshady0164 I think it's a reasonable compromise.
It’s nice but it gave me to much riddler vibes he feels to refined the calander pages build into the design look nice but I hate the tattoos and he’s too lean for my tastes
The Eraser always had a cool idea to me, I like the villains who use crime as a job like the the Carpenter or The Broker, it makes the world feel more lived in, I even had a idea like that Killer Moth but for The Eraser.
Yesss. A guy who gets rid of crime scene evidence is literally a perfect counter for Batman
Well now I wanna see a Killer Moth-Eraser partnership thing where they work together to assist other criminals in their misdeeds and helping them get out of trouble.
The Eraser has a huge potential to be another invertion of Batman.
Where the Dark Knight uses his detective skills to fight the corruption in Gotham city and to make a change for the better of all people, the Eraser uses his detective skills to help other criminals get the upper hand, just because, well, that's his job, the city revolves around in criminal activity so he takes advantage of that and tries to fit in. It's not because of revenge, and not necessarily for power, the Eraser's goal is to just survive the hellhole that he's in.
Someone who leaves no evidence would be a perfect antagonist for the world’s greatest detective. Just give The Eraser a more serious design and you’ll be golden.
The killer moth lawyer angle sounds like an amazing way of reinventing the character, mostly because I really like the juridical side of the superhero world since Daredevil and She hulk have brought some interesting stories around it, we could get a story about killer moth being a big threat to Batman not only due to his actions in court, but also do to him figuring out Bruce's identity and using that as a bargaining chip to stop Bruce from arresting him (alternatively you could have him start as a pathetic villain but become an actual good guy as he joins Batman incorporated, sort of like 8 Ball in Marvel comics)
I always thought that Maxie Zeus could benefit from being a metahuman with lightning based powers so that his delusional belief of being a reincarnation of Zeus could have more credit, plus he would be much more of a threat if he did have the power to back up his godhood claims even if he was on the weaker side of the electric power spectrum. If possible I think he would work amazingly as part of Tim's own rogues gallery, most reinvented joke villains should be spread out across the rest of the Batfamily.
I like the new reinvention of the ten eyed man too, just wished he would make more appearances if possible. Also Kiteman got himself a whole ass cartoon series so I think he is fine for now (really liked the story where Damian and John bust him out of prison just so he can teach Diana's daughter how to fly a kite)
Let's hope Caped Crusader season 2 brings new reinventions to other loser rogues in Batman's gallery of villains
The Eraser could also be a minion/ally of Killer Moth who helps erase evidence, but without the silly eraser hat/helmet.
Kite man shows that not all charactets need the type reinventions that removes most of the camp and sillyness. We have room for Batman stories which embrace those things :) For example, maybe Calendar man redesigns should embrace most of his sillyness
@@JMandJJ7797 I saw someone suggest giving him a yellow pinstripe suit as a homage to the pencil motif.
@@themadtitan7603 Maybe give him pink hair in place of an eraser.
@@JMandJJ7797 That could work imo, yeah.
I like most of these characters. The only problem they have, if they have any, is that writers didn't bother modernising them. That's why they seem goofy because most of them were created back in the silver age and they still carry their silver age outlook and feeling with them. All you need is flesh them out, give them believable origins stories... In general, rework them a bit without making them loose their original identity. (For example, look at what geoff john did with the character of black hand). In reality they're not goofier than the joker or the riddler of the silver age. The only problem i see is that batman's rogues gallery becomes oversaturated with villains. But i could make an exception if we are going to see more of classic villains like maxie zeus, calendar man and especially killer moth
you're gonna love this one
This basically exactly what they did with Mr. Freeze.
@@TheBatspecter i literally did a summary of the video before even watching it😂
@@TheBatspecter hey bro, I like your content, keep it up! I wanna ask have watched Mr. Rouges batman video by any chance?
@@syahmisamba9694 to say i’ve watched some his stuff is an understatement
I like the idea of Killer Moth as an evil lawyer and Maxie zeus having a crime family based on the greek gods an ares crime boss would go hard. You should be hired by DC to make batman comics. Keep up the good work.
Yeah these ideas are really good, it would make a very enjoyable comic.
Ares heads the enforcer unites while Athena plans the heists
Hades handles underground matter when needed but it’s mostly the beaurocrat dealing with logistics
Poseidon works with costal imports and smuggling
Hestia burns the evidence
Dionysus is in charge of the production lines
Apollo runs distraction with a prependiticy for flamethrowers
Artemis is assassination
Hers ensure peace between the family and heads the interrogations
Aphrodite would be the trafficking
Demeter grows the plants and “recycles” the victims
Hephaestus deals with the weapon manufacturing
Honestly it works
Maxie Zeus makes me think of General Patton, but like... on crack. A dude so delusional that he genuinely believes himself the reincarnation of a king/god? There has always been so much opportunity for incredible character development there, not to mention how fascinating his interactions with other villains would be if they brought him into the spotlight for a while. Imagine a crime lord who is like "my actions are justified because i am a god. I can do what I want, but lunatics like that Joker clown need to be locked up. If i weren't busy with other things, i'd smite them myself"
Killer Moth as an evil daredevil would be insanely cool, especially because he is exactly the type of character who would directly antagonize the police. I think Killer Moth would work really well narratively as being a main driving force that gets Batman and GCPD to work together. Like in a setting where Batman and the cops have been kind of at odds with them viewing him as a negative vigilante, but because of stuff happening with Killer Moth, they realize that someone like Batman is the sort of person they might need to work with to take down people who push the boundaries of what criminals can realistically get away with doing
Polka-dot man in the suicide squad was just fantastic. Enough said tbh
Calendar man is the kind of character that becomes way more interesting the more intelligent you make him. Working off of dates and patterns that your average person would have difficulty keeping up with is exactly the type of intellectual foil that is fun to see Batman bring down. If people didn't treat Calendar man like such a joke or feel like they need to make him a mental patient, I think he is probably the best contender of the "losers" to become another Moriarty to Batman's Holmes. Out of them all, Calendar man even seems like the kind of criminal who would exist in real life. I can absolutely imagine headlines about some genius psychopath doing elaborate stuff based on patterns over time. Makes me think of people like the Zodiac killer. Calendar Man could be legitimately terrifying if they wanted to make it happen
Anyway, great video as always
The Killer Moth lawyer thing sounds really fire tho
The lawyer concept for Killer Moth is awesome. And it fully goes with how Cameron Van Cleer is a fake name like Saul Goodman.
My favorite max interpretation was in "The Batman" where he literally lives in the clouds and controls weather events, I never really considered Max to be that much of a joke villain (at least in the batman media i have consumed)
Might be cool if he was kinda like a Simon stagg when he’s based on a air ship in Gotham and his company develops a weather augmenting cloudburst system which he uses to cause extreme weather damage in Gotham allowing him to scoop up tons of land and property that gets destroyed slowly turning Gotham into his Olympus
Another character is catman. He became a huge joke for a while then became an interesting character in secret six
I’m pretty sure Catman only happened because original comic character Catman became public domain, and DC simply wanted to take the name for themselves.
Similar to how Marvel to what they did for Captain Marvel.
I loved Secret Six so freakin' much
I think Catman should be a villain of Catwoman, bc nowadays Selina is more of a anti-heroine than a villain.
Honestly he’s too much of a fsurjt odds parents character for me to even imagine being in DC I know he has been after the initial company went bust it whatever but that’s where I learnt if him
A villain I havent seen in a minute is Baby Doll. I think if used correctly she could be a great opportunity for commentary on body dismorphia, and also the way Hollywood treats child actors and how that impacts their adult brain functions. Great vid!
I love the little detail of you having a little action figure or prop related to the topic youre talking about on your characters desk, its cute!
Your idea for Killer Moth is really good. I never understood why hardly any writer tried to revamp a character with such good potential based on his name and gimmick alone. Moths can be just as freaky as bats.
Moths and bats aren't scary there both cute
@daraghokane4236 the blood sucking ones are horrible
@@daraghokane4236 Moths in certain cultures represent death. There is a whole-ass cryptid called The Moth-Man.
@@propane_salesman There fluffy I would hug and cuddle the Moth-man
R.I.P. Moth-Man, alcoholic dude
Condiment King should never be played straight; otherwise, he loses his charm.
Play it straight of him being a badass fighting six pack for control of the earth, then cut away to the guards at Arkham looking mildly annoyed at these two drugged out harmless nut jobs.
KILLER MOTH KILLER MOTH KILLER MOTH!!!!!!! 💜🧡💚
Where my Drury Walker fans at!?!?!
I love killer moth
KILLER MOOOOOTTHHH!!!!
I love the idea of Zeus’s crime family being based on the Greek gods. I’m imagining something where once they are brought into the family, they are assigned a god by Maxie, but where they go from there is up to them. Maybe Poseidon is given his name by how he controls the docks, but doesn’t commit beyond that, while someone who is given Artemis based on how she handles hunting down snitches and taking down members of other gangs, and she fully commits with using arrows in all her hits, and assigning all of her targets different animals while she is planning. Hermes handles sending messages to other members of the gang and marking targets to inspire fear in other gangs, and he has a chopper with little wings on the back and wears a helmet based on Hermes. There is just so much flavour in how the different members react to being assigned their gods.
THANK YOU for your segment on Condiment King. You can always tell if someone is a hack if they legitimately try and rag on Condiment King as some kind of ridiculous villain.
He’s got too much charm for that he’s the perfect joke character
Yeah stupid but in a good way, can't go wrong with goofy classic villains and heroes. legit love them.
The Killer Moth as an evil Daredevil honestly sounds awesome. As for Calendar Man, BTAS inadvertently found a perfect way to reinvent him (albeit with a different character). The idea of his crimes being themed around the march of time and the inevitability of expiring is perfect for a villain like Calendar Man.
Killer Moth I think another factor that contributed to his negative reception is the fact he was another “anti-Batman” archetype. And him helping criminal escape is seeming taken by Wraith, a who design was just Batman with a few tweaks. But you idea of KM being a Saul Goodman would make an excellent twist, and even could let Wraith and KM team up occasionally.
Honestly I like the idea of Calendar not having “official look” I think the idea he just changes his outfit based off the holiday would be a neat idea. Especially if you keep the serial killer aspect.
Zeus not getting an update does bugs me because he probably not the worst offender here. He could easily just be reimagine as a mob boss who has a god complex. I could easily imagine him being rivals with Penguin.
0:25 This scene right here still gives me trauma to this day!!!
8:56 That concept goes hard as hell man
5:05: The Batman(2004-2008) TV series made him more of a rich narcissistic Greekaboo who made technology based on Greek culture or mythology to get what he wants.
Teen Titans killer moth goes hard though
My take on Killer Moth is he's great by default, even with a costume that isn't that different from the original one. The issue really is the presentation they give him, I think he should mimic Batman in more ways than just being a reversal of his main goal.
We know he's smart considering he's capable of not only disguising himself among Gotham's socialites, but also making all those gadgets that easily rival Batman's. Let's go further with his intelligence, then. If Batman is The World's Greatest Detective, a Sherlock Holmes type character, let's make Killer Moth The World's Greatest Schemer, something akin to Arsène Lupin (though more focused on his ability to plan out all his schemes and escapes perfectly, rather than stealing). What I'm saying is, Batman should struggle to figure out Killer Moth's crimes, as much as he would with someone like The Riddler, if he didn't leave clues.
Furthermore, his combat abilities should ALSO be on a similar levels to Batman's, just that they come from different backgrounds, making a very noticable difference in their fighting styles.
And if Batman is terrifying, he should be capable of being that, too. Lots of people have an irrational fear of insects (a large portion fearing moths specifically), and it's not like Killer Moth can't look scary, he CAN. It's all about framing. (I personally think some details on his costume play into a more scary look, the big eyes with the THICK lining on the Golden Age costume making him look perpetually angry, the mere silhouette of a man with wings, those antennas easily able to be misinterpreted as horns in the dark, just like Batman's ears)
You could also change helping criminals, to just being a mercenary in general. Mirroring Batman in the way of having all this he could use to help people out of the goodness of his heart, yet he chooses to make money off of it instead. Though this point is entirely skippable, I think helping criminals still works.
All this to say, I love Killer Moth and hope he gets more appreciation for how cool he actually is.
Also, if anyone wants to question how he couldn't figure out Batman's identity with an intelligence rivaling his:
1. Why can't so many other villains? Because the writer doesn't want them to.
2. That's not the focus of his intelligence.
3. He has no real reason to, unless paid to do so.
4. If I were writing him, I'd make it so he actively REFUSES to do it, because of how much he respects Batman. He was his main inspiration, after all.
I swear to god man,
Like if you know a character suck why not rewrite to not suck? Why are there so many stuff that makes fun of a character instead of rewriting them to fix what didn’t work/give them more depth
God, it’s such a waste for something that’s been SO overdone
I think a number of these villians should be given to superheroes who are starving for any credible recurring villians including Atom, Firestorm and Plastic Man.
Batman already has enough villians and it's only fair to give his villians to other heroes when he's stealing the likes of Deathstroke from others.
regarding the deathstroke thing i have just the video for you
Si por ejemplo kiteman se volvió un villano de plástic man
Plastic Man and Firestorm both have a surprisingly large list of good villains. Well not really surprisingly large since Plastic Man was one of the best comics in the golden age and firestorm had a great original run. The problem is a lot of their villains don't get used. Or get absorbed into the suicide squad in firestorm's case
@@liasoid3073 With Firestorm and Plastic Man, they don’t appear to have a nemesis that really acts as their antis or opposites. At least, they don’t have any villain that could be their dark mirror while still individualistic at the same time.
Brave and The Bold paired up Firestorm against a villain who basically has a similar two personalities in a shared body which makes me surprised they haven’t taken another villain with the Janus gimmick and give them to him.
For Plastic Man? He started as a criminal before turning good and more of a comedic type superhero. Batman’s villains from the Golden Age to Silver Age and some parts of the Bronze Age look like they belong more with him than in Gotham. Hell, the Penny Plunderer could actually be made into a worthwhile villain against him.
@@rayvenkman2087 I think plastic man's nemesis was granite lady
For firestorm I feel like his most importantly villains are (the first two) Killer Frosts (heat vampires) and Multiplex (Fission instead of Fusion)
Maxie Zeus could work as a Wonder Woman villain. He can somehow control thunder and believes Diana is his daughter so she should be his right hand to takeover the world. While Wonder Woman is taking on this madman, she is investigating why the Olympian Gods are disappearing and a new Maxie goon with that god's powers are appearing at the same time.
For Calendar Man, I would just embrace the Silver Age goofiness. Imagine Batman trying to foil an over the top holiday crime that even he is having a hard time with. Make it feel like an Adam West style episode.
I have how he can control the weather and still be delusional, He has Mark Mardon (weather Wizard ) working for him as unnamed henchmen number 12 Mark does not know he has the power to control the weather he thinks it is Zeus and Mark unconsciouly does what Maxie's asks When Mark leaves the room Zeus tries to summon lighting but it doesn't work. Batman decides its best if Mark doesn't know he can control the weather and Zeus is still convinced he can
Love that killer Moth Concept perfect way to use an under utilized character and give a richness to the universe and adds a perfect law aspect for DC that’s missing that Marvel has with daredevil and she hulk.
Like we have villains based on jokes, riddles and flipping a coin but a date themed villain is apparently too much
Killer Moth has a really great niche as a villain who’s more of an enemy for Barbara Gordon than Bruce, or at least a villain who transitions into that role, and I’d like to see that expanded upon
9:44 Marvel needs to hire PSM and DC needs to hire Batspecter
They need to put The Eraser into the spotlight his concept is cool as hell cleaning up crime scenes for criminals
So, The Eraser is like Mr. Wolf from Pulp Fiction?
I like your Saul Goodman idea for killer moth. What if he deduced Batman’s identity then extorted him for money. He would basically be paid to be Batman’s lawyer since vigilantism is a crime and Batman would be paying for his “legal counsel” but also so that he can’t tell everybody Batman’s secret identity. It also ensures Batman can’t put him away in black gate or something because he would then be disbarred and investigated and Batman would be found out.
There's actually a story where he pulled a Hush before he was a thing, where he got surgery to impersonate Bruce Wayne after he lost his fortune only for Robin to take him to the Batcave and expose to him that Bruce is Batman.
Im surprised maxie zeus has never been featured as a main villain in a wonder woman or shazam story, he fit right in in their rogues galleries
I like what they did with King Tut in the Batman Spotify series!
What did they did to him ?
Nah, it wasn't just Riddler's drip that improved him, but also his puzzle based death traps. Especially how they were turned into Saw-level death traps in Arkham City...
I think a cool way to explore Maxie Zeus's character and make him more of a threat would it be to make his main "superpower" his incredible confidence. Yes he may be deluded but his delusion get some confidence and confidence can make you very powerful.
A "joke" villain that sticks out to me is Lord Death Man. He was really cool in his early adoptions, then New 52 New 52ed all over him
The word “loser Villian”sounds like a older version of the “loser Baby” from hazbin
This is such a good video. I feel like the urge to portray Batman's c-list villains as "losers" speaks to kind of a lack of creativity in some writers. Like you said, sometimes it just takes a really small tweak to turn a joke character into someone that can be taken seriously as a threat. Also I've been saying how good Calendar Man's Arkham Asylum character portrait is for YEARS, it's criminal that they've never used that design anywhere else since.
Eh I like how boring calendar man design is, because he’s a vlllain that happens in real life, and his lack of design just make him scary . Which is why I like him in dark victory, and Arkham games.
Killer moth being an genius ultra successful lawyer would be a good reimagining. With his cosume being given antenna that more closely resemble bat man to boot. sounds like an banger if executed right
MY SWEET BEAUTIFUL PRINCE MAXIE ZEUS, IS NOT A LOSER! HE IS THE KING, HE IS MY SWEET LUSCIOUS PRINCE! THE REASON I WAKE UP EVERY DAY, IS THIS MAN'S GORGEOUS FACE! HE IS BATMAN'S ARCH ENEMY, JOKER WHO? MAXIE ZEUS IS MY GOD!
Real. Preach my brother.
In some alternate universe people are making fun of the penguin and the joker while “Calendar Man 2” is coming soon rn
Esa película apesto
Al menos la serie de condiment king esta genial
Ojalá la serie de gunn de los teen titans este genial
"In the event of my death at the hands of Crazy Quilt"
I like to live in the World in which Batman considers all of his villains to be threats
Me recordaste a un video de TH-cam en donde Batman pelea con condiment king diciendo que es un gran amenaza y todos los demas miembros de la justice league se le quedan mirando
Killer moth so underrated
I think riddler and tokusatsu as a whole has taught me you can have the lamest gimmick and play it a 100% straight if you got the hardest drip
Maxie Zeus stans rise up!
Objection! Calendar Man committing crimes themed after holidays is not ANY sillier than the Joker's gimmick of being a clown. I'm sick of people saying that. It's a perfectly reasonable gimmick.
Edit: Oh. You said that. Thank you.
I had an interesting idea for a serious Maxie Zeus story:
The actual Zeus comes down from Olympus to punish the poser who bears his identity as his own, arriving at Maxie's mansion. Maxie, still delusional, accuses Zeus of being the fake, angering the god. Zeus, in a fit of rage, challenges Maxie to a duel, to which the latter agreed. However, believing he's the real Zeus and might actually take the "fake"'s life, Maxie challenges him to a trivia contest instead.
Zeus flies them both to a greek museum and they coerce the staff into hosting a trivia contest for them, qbout greek mithology. Maxie ends up winning with his vast knowledge of greek mithology, also due to Zeus' forgetfulness.
By winning, Maxie gets granted the full extent of Zeus' powers, allowing him to rule over Gotham. Batman would stand no chance, but Wonder Woman would arrive to investigate Zeus' disappearance, teaming up with Batsy.
This would be interesting, especially if Zeus decides to create a human Pantheon for Maxie Zeus by having the various Olympians each choose a human who assumes a place in Maxie Zeus' Pantheon. Each human gets some abilities of the god/goddess who selected them. Of course, they might also gets some of the personality issues of their patron.
Calendar Man's entire legacy is absolutely CARRIED by Long Halloween
Killer Moth’s backstory already is (probably by accident) a take on Jay Gatsby. Seriously: Drury Walker becomes rich through crime and reinvents himself as Cameron Van Cleer? It’s a solid base one could use to build upon and even intentionally draw parallels to.
I know he wasn't the focus but always appreciate when Firefly is mentioned. Love the dude, very simple premise, just an insane pyromaniac with a jetpack. Weird how there's not a lot of those in comics given how simple it is. Always waiting for his chance to appear in live action...
Lego Batman had a lot of loser villains and gave them some love at the end the movie 🥹
Don’t forget, Killer Moth figured out who Batman was way before Bane and Hugo Strange did
If done right these villains can be reinvented into a serious threatening villains. Killer Moth could be reworked into being a Dexter esp seriel killer/lawyer. Calendar man can be a simple serial killer that killls on holidays. Maxxie Zeus could be turned into a wonder woman villain.
I like the idea of a comic series where many of Batman’s lesser known rouges gallery (like Mothman, Maxie Zeus, Calenderman, etc) are all coming out of the woodwork at similar times, Batman soon discovering all of them are apart of the same plot to take over Gotham or even in some cases to kill him. To me it would be the perfect way to reintroduce and rework many villains in the modern age without reducing them into punchlines.
Killer Moth has ONE insane drip costume, from the original Teen Titans tv show. It doesnt have the cool mask, but looks actually menacing.
My killer moth au: drury walker as a kid, saw his little brother die in a fire accident. Now he is a deadbeat math teacher in severe debt. By his need for money, and prove that he isnt a loser in his life(to his parents) he starts working as a hired goon , to be a distraction in the crime scene and be the one who is attacked first(with his wacky clothes). Batman once met him and shot a batarang to his wings and left him there, saying "You arent a criminial , you shouldn't try being one". As Drury's ego was damaged and he wanted to prove himself worthy, he grabbed the batarang to his place and started detective work to see who is batman, seeing only a wealthy man can afford 10-20 batarangs a day, and it needs to be a person that isnt seen in nights, he suspected that it's Bruce Wayne. He went to tell the mob bosses and all he got was a laugh, mad as them he got into a crazy state, and fired the whole place of that gang whilst flying towards the fire to end it all(pyromaniac and a reference to Icarus flying too close to the sun) becoming the fire fly, but batman saved him last minute. After many years he found a detective job and Gcpd
Maxi Zeus being a Megalomaniac is pretty on brand with Batman Villains, he could just be a powerful crime lord who has god complexes as he is in fact a powerful crime boss. Batman already made reservations for him in Arkham Asylum.... with the cheapest room.
About The Spot, I'd argue Return of the Spot from Lente's run on TASM was proof enough that The Spot is cool.
its always good to hear someone give characters like that a chance, DC really picked up their A game when they started embracing the C and D tier's of heroes and villains and exploring their possibilities since it doesn't take a lot of effort to find gold in what hasn't been mined very well, I know Caped Crusader has been mixed for People, but I really think they opened up something for seeing more of Otomatapoeia in the future or even the Silver age version of Clayface.
I would love an entire season of a Batman show with Calendar Man as the main antagonist.
Each day, Batman figures out what weird holiday it is, and has to keep gadgets in his pocket specifically in case Calendar Man tries something that day. There’s a 50/50 chance of any crime being normal or Calendar based, and sometimes they sync up.
Calendar man could be an even more fun version of the Riddler, and I’m waiting for the day where Batman has to face 365 days of petty crime!
We all forget too that all the prominent rogues from the 60s tv show where for a time ignored or sparingly used by the Bronze Age writers because of how goofy said show was yet they’re all overused if anything now (joker, penguin, cat woman, riddler, mad hatter)
Teen Titans had the hardest killer moth design, y'all sleepin.
The only take I'd disagree with is that the Spot was made cool by Spiderverse. Van Lente made him beyond badass in his "Return of the Spot" story in ASM #589
Most of Tom King's DC runs were very bad. But honestly, his version of Kite man was one of his only good ones in my opinion
Just came across this channel on my feed and already loving it. Thank you for educating about all things Batman and DC. Keep doing what you’re doing.
Great job on this project. I really enjoy hearing about what makes these villains interesting to you. I certainly agree with you about Mr. Freeze and I hope every villain gets their day in the spotlight!
I like how Batman beyond reinvented obscure characters like Dr phosphorus, spell binder and the royal flush gang
I would love to see you talk about adoption that changes the character like the Batman 2003 cartoon.
3:40 love how the music changed to Kratos' boss fight theme in Shovel Knight as Maxie Zeus came on screen
I feel like any villain can be threatening if you just give them the time and write them well
Like Shocker is typically treated as the textbook loser villain and even he can be threatening, like in the ps4 game where he takes a punch to the face from SPIDERMAN and barely even flinches and in the second game is said to have fought Kraven to the death and put up a better fight than any of the other villains
Another good example from Spiderman is Spot, who over the course of a single movie went from just another villain of the week to the strongest villain in the multiverse, infact if DC ever tries to tackle the trope the same way Spiderverse did I think Killer Moth would be the perfect character for it
On the other hand I hate when writers instead make them a whole different character to make them seem dangerous. Like recent adaptations of calender man turn him into this hannibal lector style criminal mastermind who is confined to a cell due to how dangerous he is, but that isn’t calender man, that’s just hannibal lector but calender themed
And I know I’m dragging this on but I also feel like there are a few villains where they kinda have to be losers or silly because that’s who they are. Like condiment king, he’s a dweeb, he’s hilarious, that’s why we love him
In general I’m not really a fan of the loser villain trope, unless it’s to set them up as a greater threat later or make them endearing I feel like it shows a lack of faith in the idea of a comic book villain.
Not everyone in Arkham needs to be a massive threat, I killed one person is still bad and dangerous, they don't have to all be city wide threats
Honestly some of the Arkham Asylum character artworks were great and it's a shame most were not only not what was actually used in games, but many were of characters that didn't appear and had designs that would never be used or drawn from again.
Honestly I've always been a defender of Killer Moth as an idea. His concept is a really good one with heaps of potential, and the moth theme should be SO easy to make scary and cool, he frankly could have been just as iconic by now as Mr Freeze (my all time fav) if he'd gotten just a subtle rework/reintroduction in the same vein
I thought Maxie Zeus was done very well in The Batman 2004, so I almost didn't think he was a joke. I also agree villains like Killer Moth and Kite Man could use another chance for redemption
First of all amazing video i really liked it but i spefially like the idea of turning mothman into a saul goodman type character specially because you can add more forgotten villains to make a team.
My idea is pretty much this, mothman being the face/charismatic guy whom does all the dirty work and fights batman and have the eraser and mr camera to dispose and falsificate evidence for their customers
I mean, you have forgotten Film Freak, The Ventriloquist, Anarchy, Amygdala, Zsasz and the list just keeps going
Zsasz no es un villano de broma
@@williamdaviddiazcuchimaque7511film freak is literally the only valid take. All the others are good villains
I really like the idea of Killer Moth being a Saul Goodman type and him teaming up with Firefly
Killer Moth as a Saul Goodman type character would go crazy hard
I’d prefer that for the eraser tbh
We eatin good 🍽️
Kite Man is literally the peak supervillain in all of comics ever. This is (mostly) not a bit.
1:21 For a brief second I thought you were going to say Polkadot Man!!!
One of my favorite villains only appeared for half an issue. It was a sick idea, an alien disguising himself with mob boss that has electricity powers. I would love a movie where the Gimmick Gang is trying to take down Gotham or something cool like that
Better hop off Kite Man
If i can, condiment king would be a vengeful inventor who's steal food 2 make homeless his army, blaming the rich 4 forget them
i think that kinda misses the point of condiment king
Tbh I feel a take on Maxie Zeus that parallels the modern comics huge bat family with him having a crime family themed around Olympic gods, but also having him act insanely abusive and megalomaniacal to them much like how the actual Zeus acted in mythology to mirror a version of Bruce who abused and took advantage of his Allies and family would go insanely hard
I actually had a reimagining for ten eyed man a while back
Instead of eyes on his fingertips he instead has synthetic compound eyes (fly eyes) so he can see in all directions, giving him enhanced reflexes
Then he isn't ten eyed man
No surprise Dan Watters came up with a cool idea for Ten-Eyed Man. He says people always come to him when they need someone to write a villain and he revels in it, like he currently is with the Destro series.
I prefer the idea of making even the weird villains serious and/or dangerous. Gotham is a dangerous place, so people who don't know what they're doing shouldn't make it long enough to be remembered. Plus, Mr. Freeze is a great example of what you can get when you shoot for the stars instead of settle for memes.
DC universe has the Greek gods active within it. That Zeus and company haven't slapped down Maxie Zeus leads to some interesting questions. Are they playing one of their cruel games with this mortal?
If anyone was confused by this video in which Batspecter kept showing images of a non-tattooed Julian Day with commentary like "stories like *The Long Halloween* would eventually give him an exciting reimagining as some guy with tattoos on his head who sits in the asylum all day"
It's because Julian Day doesn't have tattoos in that comic book... he gets them in *Batman: Dark Victory* .
Keep up the good work!
Yeah I figured people would get the idea
@@TheBatspecter - Hi there! Honestly I think hardcore fans would indeed get the idea, but I could also see lots of casuals being confused by the juxtaposition of footage & audio.
Oh, and to prove that I'm not just a stick in the mud, let me recommend a pretty good semi-recent Calendar Man stories!
From the 2020's *New Year Evil* , I recommend _"New Year, New You"_ in which a new psychiatrist at Arkham Asylum makes the terrible mistake of assuming that Julian Day is a "loser villain", and... you'll see ^^
Written by the multi-talented Christos N Gage, it's a nice short story about Julian.
(and the short story right after, about Chronos, is a real tear-jerker... )
Calender man mentioned
The eraser should of been a character in the suicide squad game and had his shoes as a melee and used them and put them together to make a pencil point and he would use it as a traversal
Maxie Zeus... and you proceed putting on an 8-bit version of God Of War first games' theme. 😉👍😎🤟
I honestly think Killer Moth could work if he was given a more serious treatment like how Calender Man was given. Just give him a new backstory based on the American Cryptid of the "Mothman," make him a legitimate threat, and there you go!