I do think Michael Jones is trying to not be a super-naturalist. I think he conceded to much on the topic of evolution as well. I really like him, like his channel. But I don't think he gets everything right. I'm not saying he has to endorse young earth creationism. I'm sort of sympathetic to Dr. Hugh Ross' old earth creation view. But I think we could have naturalistic objections to most miracles, and that the naturalist objections Jones employs at times are reflexively anti-supernatural.
I like to try to accommodate both/and whenever possible instead of either/or. It seems likely that if the angelic beings were taking human wives whenever they pleased, sinful humans would follow their example. The Sethite view is definitely the weakest interpretation and it seems designed to create divisions among human societies.
I think this is a good approach. The supernatural view of Heiser and others does not exclude the possibility of the other two interpretations which I find interesting.
The first question to ask want to raise is does the receptive work of God only apply to men or to the whole of recreation - it is the matter, then in what sense dies it apply to the realm of heaven above, where there is wearily and issue around the time of the creation and heat action and then fall of humanity. How does Christs work apply here? Has heaven itself been redeemed by that work? It is at why the rebellious anneals were sent here and what relationship causes God to do this? Were the involved in our fall in the garden? Was the serpent used by a fallen Lucifer to persuade Eve and thereby Adam.? When did our relationship with rebellion begin?
All good questions. It does seem like there was an angelic fall prior to or around the time of the garden. "The earth was formless and void" seems to indicate a prior cataclysmic event. It also seems like the Bible is vague when it comes to this. So my interpretation has always been that we are wrapped up in a larger cosmic history that includes heaven and earth, but we only see a glimpse of the heavenly reality.
It's pretty clear that the graven was a place where Heaven and Earth inner-crossed hence God walking in the garden hence it was a realm of angels as well so they were present before the falls?@@strangetheology
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Yes there were giants
I do think Michael Jones is trying to not be a super-naturalist. I think he conceded to much on the topic of evolution as well. I really like him, like his channel. But I don't think he gets everything right. I'm not saying he has to endorse young earth creationism. I'm sort of sympathetic to Dr. Hugh Ross' old earth creation view. But I think we could have naturalistic objections to most miracles, and that the naturalist objections Jones employs at times are reflexively anti-supernatural.
I agree, I like InspiringPhilosophy but I’m okay taking a supernatural position when the text leads me there.
I like to try to accommodate both/and whenever possible instead of either/or. It seems likely that if the angelic beings were taking human wives whenever they pleased, sinful humans would follow their example. The Sethite view is definitely the weakest interpretation and it seems designed to create divisions among human societies.
I think this is a good approach. The supernatural view of Heiser and others does not exclude the possibility of the other two interpretations which I find interesting.
The first question to ask want to raise is does the receptive work of God only apply to men or to the whole of recreation - it is the matter, then in what sense dies it apply to the realm of heaven above, where there is wearily and issue around the time of the creation and heat action and then fall of humanity. How does Christs work apply here? Has heaven itself been redeemed by that work? It is at why the rebellious anneals were sent here and what relationship causes God to do this? Were the involved in our fall in the garden? Was the serpent used by a fallen Lucifer to persuade Eve and thereby Adam.? When did our relationship with rebellion begin?
All good questions. It does seem like there was an angelic fall prior to or around the time of the garden. "The earth was formless and void" seems to indicate a prior cataclysmic event. It also seems like the Bible is vague when it comes to this. So my interpretation has always been that we are wrapped up in a larger cosmic history that includes heaven and earth, but we only see a glimpse of the heavenly reality.
It's pretty clear that the graven was a place where Heaven and Earth inner-crossed hence God walking in the garden hence it was a realm of angels as well so they were present before the falls?@@strangetheology
Well said, you hanging in there alright? @@howardbabcom
Then discuss it already!
I don’t have the pleasure of understanding you. It’s a long form podcast, I can’t say everything at once.