I used these in a house with aluminum wire... and NEVER had another issue with outlets burning up. Before installing these, I had problems with a couple outlets. I lived in that house for 19 years and was 100% satisfied with Alumiconn connectors.
If I get this right, the cu/alr receptacles work with no pigtail and without anti oxidant compound BUT they're not as good for OLDER homes because the brittle aluminum might crack or break while attempting to bend and screw into the outlet, correct?. In that case, it's probably best to use the alumiconn connectors (rather than the twist connectors) to avoid this cracking or breaking, correct? Fantastic vid btw, gave it the thumbs up.
Thanks for watching... yes the aluminum wires are brittle and they also get damaged more easily than copper. The cu/alr receptacles are okay and they are better than nothing. The connectors are best.
One very important aspect left out is that it is crucial to use a calibrated TOPRQUE SCREW DRIVER to tighten the screws of the Alumiconn connectors ! Tightening "by feel" with a regular scredriver, as shown in the video, may get the AL wire damaged, creating a hotspot. Same goes for the CO side, that will create a hotspot if torqued too loose .
Yes, but unfortunately torque screwdrivers are like $250-$300. Fine for a pro who may get multiple uses out of it, expensive for a DIYer that needs it for one job. Alumiconn says a second method is acceptable too, which is 1 full turn after the set screw touches the aluminum wire, and 1 half turn after the set screw touches the copper wire.
@@OMGWTFLOLSMH quick tip you can get torque screw drivers for mounting scopes on rifles that’s what I used I have a vortex torque screw driver that will go from 10 to 50 inch pounds and I paid like $60 for it but I would say obviously rewiring a home is best but jeez copper expensive as hell right now I would say the alumiconn connectors are the best because you not bending 50 year old brittle aluminum and if I didn’t have those I’d probably go with the wire nuts with noalox in them I’ve seen some really dangerous aluminum when people think it’s easy to just put a wire nut on them I’ve also seen pig tails but with no regard to the jumper going to another outlet and it defeats the purpose of pigtails expansion and contraction will cause arcing and obviously can cause a fire I’ve seen plenty of melted outlets I’ve seen craziness in panels but at the end of the residential aluminum is extremely unsafe in my humble opinion
@@OMGWTFLOLSMHI disagree I got a used Sturtevant Richmont CAL 36/4 Adjustable Torque Screwdriver Driver For 35 bucks , and a cheap vevor one 35 bucks too , there is also a new Fix It Sticks Mini All-In-One Torque Driver 6-25 in/lbs for 53 bucks but that one don't click, so I didn't buy that one.
From what I've been reading, the AlumiConn 2-port and 3-port connectors installed with a torque screwdriver are the only "good" way for a homeowner to safely remediate. The wire nuts tend to become a fire hazard and burn up (though I've also read that proper wire twisting before capping can help avoid it), and I don't think the AL rated outlets are considered as safe either. Aluminum wires will still work their way loose over time. Disadvantages of the Alumiconn connectors: they're $3 each, and tough to pack into tight boxes. But it sounds like they're the only real safe option.
This problem with aluminum wall were from the beginning of use. My father would come home from work and talk about the problems you discuss . He rewired our whole house top to bottom
Helpful, thanks!!! The hardware store sold me some aluminum wire for a lamp- I have to connect it to solid copper wire- and don't want to buy a connector (time issue). After seeing this, I cannibalized a copper extension cord that didn't work well anyway, and that should work fine. No reason to do copper-aluminum if I can avoid it! I had no idea....
In my area there are tons of neighborhoods and houses with aluminum wire and no one I know has had any issues with getting insurance coverage. I have aluminum wire and have had coverage with one of the big insurance agencies for 20 years. I replaced most of the outlets and switches years ago with CO/ALR devices and have never had an issue. As far as pigtailing in some situations, I just pigtail a piece of copper with the aluminum, add antioxidant paste to a wire nut, secure with the nut and wrap with electrical tape. I've had zero issues in 20 years.
I heard someone say insurance would not insure a home with AL wire I called my insurance lady she been in the business for 30 years said she never heard of it, and that she even was an adjuster had been to homes that burned up due to AL wire. I live in Arizona 1970's was a boom for tract homes we probably have over a million homes with AL wire. I'm in the process of replacing every connection with Alumiconn's. Then I'm going to install AFCI/GFCI breakers in my panel. I never had a problem but I noticed that whoever wired my home in 1976 they didn't twist the wires in the wire nuts. Some of those nuts seem to have been heated the plastic just spins can't remove have to cut them off. The wire in my home is either 12, or 10 awg it's not soft not like copper I cut a piece out and played around with it see how weak it was as weak as I Thought.
Just for your edification, creep is an engineering term. It means that a material will slowly deform under persistent mechanical stress. I.e. a steel wire with a 100lb weight hanging from it. The steel will remain at some length, no matter how long it hangs (it won't, but it's more resistant than aluminum). But aluminum wire of the same gauge will get longer (and thinner) over time with the same weight hung. Higher temperature exacerbates the issue. So the wires do "creep out of the connectors". But really it's that the screws clamping the wire cause Al wire to eventually give way under the pressure of the screw, and then the clamping pressure reduces.
You can definitely WAGO PUSH WIRE and 773 connections because the rating includes aluminum (IF the paste is used). If it’s a copper only rated Wago, then no.
@@edbouhl3100 Wago's own data sheet says: *"Terminating Aluminum Conductors (Not for use in North America)"* EDIT Good luck with insurance if the house catches fire... or worse. ... As with everything like this, no matter your location, you best know your local codes, and what your insurance will or will not cover.
Great video thank you Do you have to pigtail copper to aluminum in the box if you’re getting an outlet or a switch that is compatible with aluminum and copper?
“AlumiConn Aluminum to Copper Lug is approved by the Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC), UL, and numerous insurance companies as a safe method for aluminum wiring repair.” The AL/CU wire connectors (nuts) are not considered a permanent solution to pigtail. As noted in a comment below the AlumiConn lugs MUST be torqued to specifications. They sell a special driver to do this, it runs around $135. Don’t use a regular screw driver, be safe not sorry.
Thank you for this excellent video, very illustrative... I will send this link to my clients in my Inspections Reports to reinforce our explanation regarding aluminum wiring.
The problem with the AlumiConn connectors is that they take up so much space. There are some boxes in our house that already barely have room for the existing wiring. We’d have to have an electrician retrofit newer, larger boxes to allow for the additional connectors.
That’s partly why I’ve used the CU/Alr switches and outlets to replace the old ones that were here. The problem is were GFCI or dimmers are needed since those are not made for aluminum wire.
For "decora" switches or gfci, pigtail with marrette 63 or 65 wire nuts. They're rated for co/alu and are certified as a proper fix in Canada but not the USA lol. Good enough for me.@@mikegoldnj
I just had a 220v. 30 amp dryer receptacle melt and burn to a crisp and fry the dryer cord too. Of course it's an aluminum wired house. What gets me is that it was pigtailed -- although it looks like it was done quite a while ago. It MAY have started at the copper and aluminum wire connector which may or may not have had anti oxidant applied. My guess is that the copper/aluminum connection came apart under one of screw caps, started shorting, fryed the cap, and sent the whole electrical current mess into the outlet.which burned it up. Your thoughts? Also, the connection is 220v, 30amp 3-wire for an electric dryer. I have the option of hooking up a gas dryer and being done with it. Again, your thoughts?
it does sound like you need to use the alumiconn connectors. Make sure they are in a metal box and not in the wall unprotected. Also yes I would convert to gas if you have that option.
@@flannelguydiy6458 The AlumiConn connectors you showed will only support #12 to #10 gauge solid aluminum wire. 30A dryer outlets and 50 to 60A electric stove outlets use a much larger stranded aluminum wiring solution. I have not investigated terminal block like solutions for connecting these so I can't make a recommendation.
Part of the reason Aluminum becomes brittle is that it is work hardening. The more you work (bend) it, the harder (and more brittle) it will become. That said, you really only want to go into these boxes once.
Indeed. This is why it's critical to snip off the already bent piece and re-strip the wire if going with the CO/ALR outlet option. I had to go this route due to lack of space in the box. I also give the newly exposed aluminum a light buff with scotchbrite and apply anti-oxidant compound.
the tough part is with the older homes, you often do not have enough slack (extra wire) to snip too much off to get a clean end. It really is a challenge
I’m planning on putting in the alumicons. Is it necessary to pigtail to copper for the ground wire? No current running through it, but it’s still aluminum.
Might say required somewhere in the NEC, not sure where. My 70's house has copper pigtails for the bare Aluminum ground wires. Seems like the correct way.
I NEED YOUR HELP with AlumiConn! Thanks for this info. What's your opinion on Ground? Obviously hot and neutral need the alumiConn, but do you think one can save a few $$$ by not using on ground?
BIG HEADS UP... Do NOT use Ideal Type 65 "Twister" wire nuts to pigtail residential aluminum wiring. Under an agreement with the U. S. Consumer Product Safety Commission, Ideal no advertises, markets, or recommends the type 65 wire nuts for the use described in this video. The was after several structure fires were attributed to the use of Ideal type 65 wire nuts. Underwriters Laboratories did not independently verify the results of the original tests conducted by Ideal, even though UL's published standards require said testing before UL certification is granted. The Canadian Standards Association (CSA) relied on the UL listing in approving CSA listing of this product. Currently, the only product available, tested and fully certified for this use are the Alumiconn connectors, as described in the latter part of this video. They are readily available on eBay, Amazon and many online electrical resellers. Separately, insure that ALL aluminum wiring is properly protected by either Are Fault Combination Circuit Breakers (AFCI-CB) or Dual Function (Arc Fault/Ground Fault) Combination Circuit Breakers (AFCI/GFCI-CB). As of 2017, the National Electric Code (NEC) requires Arc Fault breakers for all dwelling spaces in a new home, or whenever a breaker panel is replaced. If ANY wiring does start arcing, an Arc Fault breaker can cut off power before a fire starts. If nothing else, update your breakers. Be careful and stay safe, Bruce
All the outlets with aluminum wire I'm dealing with have a red and black wire to one side of the outlet and a white to the other side with no ground wire connected. How do I go about using the connectors?
can i use the connectors with the three holes on all receptacles even though they only need two? curious because idk which receptacles need what. thank you advance and thank you for posting this video.
Of course, but these things take up room in the box, so the smaller the better, and the 2s are cheaper than the 3s. Buy some of each and use the 2s where necessary. Do a quick survey, should only take a few hrs a day over a weekend to go around the house and do a count by taking off the outlet cover and looking inside with a flashlight. If there's only one cable coming into the box, you only need a 2 for that box. There maybe cases where there are 3 cables coming into the box, then you would need a 4 for those, but that wouldn't be too common in the average house.
Oh, second question, different topic. I see on the King Innovation site for AlumiConn connectors that they recommend using a torque screwdriver on the screws, which I see on Home Depot's site they have a Husky that will do the required 10 and 15 inch pounds for $56. Some comments there say it's very tough to guess the right amount of force to use on the aluminum conductor -- undertighten and that warming/cooling you mentioned could let it work itself out from under the lug's screw. Overtighten, and the aluminum could crack and break free of the connector. What are your thoughts on torquing the set screws on the AlumiConn?
@@flannelguydiy6458 I don't, and my friend who I thought had every tool in the world to borrow doesn't have one either. So, is it worth the $56 to get one, on the theory that I don't want to over- or under-tighten the aluminum lug screw, causing the connection to fail and the house to burn down, because I have no feel for how much 10 inch pounds is? Is there some rule of thumb to get that torque, short of the special tool?
@@JusBidniss yes, if you're repairing an entire home with aluminum to copper pigtails, might as well buy the torque screwdriver, better safe than sorry. Chances are you'll find many more uses for the torque screwdriver besides aluminum wiring repair.
@@claytonsprague7316 late comment, but for a multiwire circuit, there are double pole GFCI breakers for that, be aware they are about 100 dollars or so, and with the exception of a 50 amp (used almost exclusively for hot tubs) may have to be ordered and shipped to the store, since 15 and 20 amp double pole GFCI breakers are not commonly used.
I don't understand what scenario I'd use the 3rd port in the 3-port connectors? I have to pigtail a few inches of copper on the ends of my aluminum when replacing an outlet or switch in our house, because whoever wired the ones I've seen so far didn't leave an inch of extra slack to pull the outlet free or make a new shepherd's crook for the screws (they all used the holes in the back). It's awful -- you can barely get the outlet clear of the box opening! So pigtail it is. In the 2 or 3 I've done so far (which I now learn I have to go back and do right, since I used regular wire nuts), there was one 3-wire romex coming into the box, so I wire-nutted my 4" of copper to each, connected the outlet, and (barely) stuffed it all back in (these are all shallow boxes so far, so I guess the AlumiConns will require me tracking down some deeper old-work boxes I can install through the hole in the drywall, after carefully breaking out the old box). However, I know there will be some outlets I encounter with 2 romex's coming in, and both sides of the outlet used. In many of those, the little metal deal between the screws is broken off, because the top one is on the light switch. Would the 3rd port work for that scenario? Or only when the little metal deal is not broken out, and top and bottom both are always powered?
I've heard the purple wire nuts can leak out the cream. I try to install them open end up or on the side at least. I didn't know alumiconns had cream in them. Any issues there I wonder? All expensive and a pain in the ass in cramped boxes Anyway. Argh!
yeah they are a bit expensive but the alumicons are much better. When you do not have wires twisted together you have less heat getting built up. The cost is well worth the peace of mind. Have not had any issues at all since doing this....none.
Thanks for this informative video. However, my understanding is that you never join Aluminium and Copper wires together by using Twist caps due to fire hazards.
No... they are approved if you are using the correct caps with the substance inside that allows for it. However, I do not like using the caps and prefer the alumiconn connectors
I was wiring houses in the late sixties. It wasn't that we were cheaping out on wire costs, the problem was that we couldn't even purchase copper wire due to mine workers union strikes. The NEC (National Electrical Code) prohibits direct connection of dissimilar metals. And as to "not enough breakers", Again I refer to the NEC which was the same then as it is now. Which is 3 watts per square foot for calculating the number of lighting circuits in a single family residence. No contractors or inspectors were "fudging" the number of lighting circuits that I know of.
Purchased a 1970's house 3 months ago. Previous owner just before the sell, spent $8,000 replacing out lets, doing alumicon and adding a brand new breaker box. I still can't get insurance coverage.
Great information, thank you. In the process of attempting to replace light switches and wall sockets in my mid 80s home I found out I had cooper clad aluminum wiring because the wire was too thick to go into the quickwire holes. How do you deal with this issue? Can it be treated like cooper wire and use the screw terminals? Are there any precautions? TIA
You dont even want to use those quickwire holes. The wires may work themselves free. You can bend the aluminum wire and attach to the screw terminals just like a copper wire. However, aluminum wire is brittle and they can break. This is why those alumiconn connectors work so well. You can put your aluminum wire in there, then run copper to your switch or outlet.
Doing this now. Using alumiconn and when I torque to their recommendation it seems to deform the aluminum wire. The wire itself seems in good condition, is this normal when using alumiconn and torquing to 10 inch pounds?
if your using a plastic box does the AL ground still need an Alumiconn or can you jpoin by other means to the CU ground? Also do you need these connectors at the panel box also?s
I have a question,my house has aluminum wiring,here recently i noticed that one of the outlets was acting wonky so i decided to replace it, i went to home depot and they carried a outlet called aluminum /copper, one side looks like aluminum screws and one side looks like copper screws, if some houses have copper wiring and some houses have aluminum wiring but mainly exclusive one or the other what good does a aluminum /copper outlet do me? i would guess it would be better to have aluminum/ aluminum on both sides correct? so why do they even sell that kind of outlet ? thank you for your time!! Funny thing is that the outlet im replacing is also aluminum /copper,one side is aluminum and one side copper and it has been in this house for at least 30 years,once i opened up the outlet to replace it i noticed the aluminum side was kinda burn t a bit but the other wires on the copper side were pristine, what gives?
You are definitely not knowledgeable about this. Do a great deal of research, contacting, and learn your local codes/installation. On outlets, what you refer to is: The silver looking side is the neutral, the copper/brass looking side is the load. (Green = ground.) That is, very, very basic.
Can Pigtailing with Alumicon conectors be used on Air-conditioning unit wires that is aluminum, my house was build in 2003 and Aircond. company telling me i have aluminum wires, i do not know how is it possible, i thought no one used aluminum wires in 2000`s .
I am almost positive that your air conditioner is using a thicker wire (10 gauge or more) and they likely will not fit into an alumiconn connector that I THINK accepts no larger than a 12 gauge wire. An electrician can use a crimp to fuse aluminum to copper.
Aluminum is still fairly common for larger single purpose 240 volt circuits like air conditioner , dryer and stove. Those large aluminum (8 awg and bigger) don't have the same problems that 10 and 12 awg single strand aluminum did. However, you do have to make sure that the lugs are AL rated. Some devices such as furnace and AC are not compatible with aluminum, but a disconnect switch is required if the breaker box is not within sight of the unit, so in this case you could run aluminum to the disconnect, then come out with copper to the unit. This assumes the disconnect is AL/CU rated.
you can pigtail it but you really do not have to. There is no juice going through the ground and the usual dangers with aluminum wiring do not apply to the ground wire
@@flannelguydiy6458 Mucho thanks. It wasn't grounded when I open it up so was wondering if it wasn't setup right. Your reply is helpful and now my wife and rest at night knowing I'm not going to burn the house down again! :)
Ok so let’s say I go with the Alumiconn connections...on the new outlet, I’m also replacing old switches and outlets, will use a copper one now that I have a pigtail of copper from aluminum or will I use an aluminum still?
If you are running a short copper wire from the pigtail or alumiconn connector to the switch or outlet... then you can use a regular switch or outlet. You only need the CO/ALR outlets and switches if an aluminum wire is physically connected to them. Make sense?
Flannel Guy DIY yes sir, that’s what I will be doing. Thank you! Also do you recommend a certain torque screw driver? Somebody mentioned that it does have to be torqued to a certain amount to avoid resistance? Is this true?
Flannel Guy DIY last question I promise lol...if it’s a 12 gage aluminum wire, what size copper wire do I pig tail to it...also a 12 or should I go up to a 14 on the copper wire?
@@drizzy2343 The bigger the number, the smaller the wire....so 14ga wire is smaller than 12ga wire. Stick with 12ga copper to 12ga aluminum. I'm not even sure if they made 14ga AL wire since there is no amperage rating on all the charts I've seen. And YES, use a torque screwdriver....see my post above---3--If you use the Alumiconn's, you will need to get a torque screwdriver since the set screws on the Alumiconn's MUST be torqued to a certain tightness (spec's are on the package). I am using one called the "FAT Wrench" ($35 on Amazon)....just google it.
You can use the alumiconn connector or you can just use a regular wire cap. The ground wire does not carry a load so you can twist copper and aluminum ground wires together.
Wait. I’m confused. If the whole house is wired with aluminum, there would be no need for the Alumi con correct? I’d just need to make sure that all of my outlets and switches are aluminum wire compatible, correct? I’ll have an electrician do it but I want to understand it. Is it common for a 60’s hose to have BOTH aluminum and copper if there has been NO newer additions?
Yes and no. It is true that you can use aluminum safe outlets and switches. However, part of the problem with aluminum is they work loose at the connection points over time especially at a spot where it gets very hot such as a bathroom outlet where a 1500 watt hair dryer is used. The devices we use today draw more power with the exception of LED lights. You also have new light fixtures that do not have aluminum safe connection points. I would bet most homes built in the 60’s or early 70s have different fixtures now. All of those should have allumicon connectors between them and the aluminum wires. I don’t think it makes sense to use these things at every point.
I have both in my house. Years ago I went around and disconnected all my aluminum outlets and used an emery cloth to lightly sand any oxidation off the ends and applied anti-oxidation paste before putting them back onto the outlet. I think I'm going to switch to these alumiconn connectors now because my insurance company is asking questions suddenly after 16 years.
Copper AND aluminum in a 1960s house? That's a new one for me lol. I suppose if the electricians who wired the house had a bunch of older copper wire stashed in their trucks, sure. Everytime I've found a home with a mixture of copper and aluminum was either a much older home that had a renovation or addition during the 1960s thru the early to mid 70s, or was built during this time and had circuits added later on.
Quick question. My parents house has copper wiring. Recently they remodeled their bathroom and installed a GFCI outlet to replace a standard plug by the sink (following code). Not long after that work was done they suddenly lost all power in the adjacent room. They suspect it’s the GFCI they installed. I noticed in the GFCI instructions that it says ‘only to be used with copper’ so I feel it’s feasible that the GFCI could be the culprit. Is it possible for them to have a GFCI with aluminum wiring? If so, how? Thank you
When you come out of the alumiconn connector with new copper wire can you go back to receptacle if it is marked au/cu or will you have the came issue ,... copper pigtale to alum screw..i.e., do now have to buy new Copper only receptacle ... Thanks
@@claytonsprague7316 After reading the amperage capacity charts for aluminum wire I believe your statement "the amperage rating for aluminum 12 AWG wire is only 15 amps." is incorrect. 12 AWG solid aluminum wiring is rated for 20 amps. Here is the link to the amperage capacity chart: www.cerrowire.com/products/resources/tables-calculators/ampacity-charts/
@@craigschiemann9553 Thank you I appreciate your thoughtfulness of the chart. However there are some small details that need to be mentioned for safeties sake. First anyone watching this stuff in the US should read the CPSC study on Aluminum wiring (just google it cause I’m not as adept as Mr. Craig on links. Secondly, in that chart you have to know how to interpret the information., you will notice that it references 75deg C wiring as 20 amps. And yes you are correct in that case. HOWEVER please note that That classification of wiring didn’t appear until after 1984, and they stopped making aluminum wiring for branch circuits in the mid 70’s and that wire was only rated at 60 deg C. They didn’t make 14awg aluminum because the first gauge wire that could actually handle 15 amps was 12awg single strand aluminum NM. Please anyone with aluminum wiring research thoroughly before doing or hiring work done. Thank you.
@@claytonsprague7316 Thanks for adding the additional information. I agree, one needs to thoroughly understand the issues and remedies for handling issues with aluminum wiring before attempting to work on the project. One needs to take the steps needed to inform themselves on any issue they are not properly informed on. If not, then please leave the project(s) to a professional that is. Having only a little bit of knowledge on something can come back and harm you. This is not something one can take lightly. There are many licensed electricians out there that won't touch aluminum wiring. That tells you something. When seeking a professional make sure they are knowledgable and comfortable with working on your type of project before even thinking of hiring them.
I have a question that i am wondering. If i pig tie the aluminum to copper wires. do i still have to use a co/alr outlet to wire it back on or can i use one with out the co/alr ?
@@flannelguydiy6458 I'm not sure which part are you agreeing to after I pig tail copper wire to aluminum? Do I connect it to a co/alr outlet or can I use one without the co/alr?
@@ZeroZillions okay, if you are using a CO/ALR switch or outlet, then you can wire the aluminum wire directly do that without pig tailing. In general pig tailing copper to aluminum is a problem. You would need to instead use the alumiconn connectors with the aluminum wire going in, and then a short copper wire going out to e REGULAR outlet.
I have been doing research on this and it seems like there are two sides to this coin. Some articles conclude it is still safe with the right outlets and some still scream these "solutions" are just as dangerous. Why the controversy? Is it like the Federal Pacific box?
What about dimmer switches? Is it okay to use the pigtail method? I’m starting to see forums say that you can’t use dimmer switches with aluminum wiring. I just installed one today. Something told me to put my ear up close to the switch and I hear a fair humming sound...
I am confused. With the Alumincon connectors, I don't see where the black wire figures in. On your new outlet it is going to need a black wire to the gold screw and a white wire to the silver screw. I only see a white wiire coming out of the Alumincon.
I was just using random wires to show how to use the connector. You will use one connector to connect your black wires and another one to connect your white wires.
@@flannelguydiy6458 Thank you. I figured it out that I would need one Alumicon for the white wires and one for the black wires and one for the ground wires. It's going to be crowded in junction box.
Be careful when replacing old recepticles with new ones guys once you do this you have to bring up the branch circuit ok with arc/fault and or gfi protection t/r rated plugs, tr/wr rated plugs outside per 406.4,d thru out the home where ever you changed them out to new
That is people's biggest problem, they don't research. There are reasons trades people go to school, etc., and there are codes, and local codes. That includes this video, it is bad. EDIT In fact, as of now, I am through in here. There is no way to address all the bad posts. And, this channel should remove this video.
I have only one aluminum circuit controlling just a ceiling fan and 2 recessed lights. I understand about the pig-tailing at the switch box and the endpoints but is it necessary to have a pigtail at the electrical panel. I was told it was required but would like to verify if that is true or in what situation it would apply. thanks
No one here can (validly) answer that. You have to know your local code/s. EDIT BTW: "I have only one aluminum circuit controlling just a ceiling fan and 2 recessed lights." How are you 100% sure of that? You do know what an actual circuit entails, right?
I live in an apartment where my own room and my dad's room are on one signle socket. And its all aluminium wire. I was wondering why the socket was getting warm and now I know, its the old type of socket with NO termials, just the push in wire thingys ] o o] ---==== ---==== and they're so old its got that fiber insulation instead of the plastic or rubber.... how has this appartment building not burnt up. the fuse boxes have 30 amp fuses.
please people if you are going to do this just buy the correct copper gauge 10 is compatible with 12 gauge aluminum....and so on never 12g copper on12g aluminum.... i have gone through so many fuses after the unexperienced electrician i hired used the wrong gauge mix
It is less about the wire and more about the circuit breaker and how many amps it is rated for. You can go 12g to 12g if you are not over loading that 12g copper wire with too many fixtures attached to it. If you are having issues with an overload, you should add a line or size down the breaker.
Wait a minute. If aluminum tends to loosen over time, then how can BOTH parts (wire & outlet) being aluminum solve the problem? Seems it would result in DOUBLE the loosening effect.
This is an old comment, but I wanted to address for anyone reading: Since the aluminum will expand and shrink at the same rate, it won't loosen as much over time. Also, since they are aluminum on aluminum connections, you can have some cold welding happen as you clamp it down and that can reduce issues as well.
@@jakejones5736 part of the reason the aluminum would loosen over time is because it's coefficient of therman expansion is higher than that of copper. So when it heats and cools with temperature changes, it does so at a different rate than the copper. When you attach / coil the aluminum wire are an aluminum screw terminal, which are usually rivited in place nowadays by plastic, both the wire and screw terminal will expand at the same rate due to sharing the same thermal expansion coefficient and this can't unscrew itself or work it's way out of the post, since the loosening effect comes because the aluminum wire lengthens more than the copper screw term can expand, causing gaps that get worse as it cycles through temps. Hopefully that helps!
I talked to an electrician and stated that I could switch my breakers to arch fault breakers and it will solve the problem....does any one have comments about that??
I'm a licensed journeyman electrician and I agree with your electrician on his or her recommendation on AFCI breakers because if anywhere in the circuit there is arcing, this breaker will trip much faster than a standard circuit breaker, preventing a fire. Often a failing aluminum wire connection can generate sufficient heat to ignite wire insulation and surrounding combustibles without drawing enough current to trip a standard 15 or 20A breaker. However I have to respectfully disagree with the electrician stating AFCI breakers will solve the problem, because it won't. To solve the issues for good you generally have 3 main options, the best and most expensive is to have the aluminum wiring replaced with copper, the old aluminum is usually left abandoned in place, and removed wherever accessible to prevent someone in the future from attempting to reenergize it. The last two are permanent repairs, by Copalum crimps, or Alumniconn connectors to attach a copper pigtail to the receptacle outlet, switch, etc. Even with permanent repairs or a rewire I would strongly advise AFCI protection because it is possible that some connections will be overlooked even by master electricians. In older homes that have been renovated and stuff added or removed, unfortunately it's not uncommon for exposed splices to be hidden in walls without any junction box, receptacle outlets buried behind drywall, the list of possibilities goes on. Hope you found this information helpful.
mY method of securing alum and copper together at the connection point is to let both wires heat up naturally and what happens is they both end up melting together creating the perfect fuse between them. Sometimes the jacket will have holes in it where the insulation has bubbled but I just put electrical tape around it. No issues and been in this home 17 years
Aluminum wirenuts are not considered approved method of repair by UL or most Insurance companies. Neither is changing the device. In Florida its alumicons or crimp thats it
Thanks for useful video. Can I use regular industrial butt splicers AND anti oxidant grease, if I can't get these "allumicons" locally? Electrical Inspectors have a course in their curricula, called Electrical Idiocy; belong in a very elitist circle, only for Moronic Supreme Priests of the Consumer Electrical Religion. They all have to excel on it to get the mark.
Thumbs down for making zero mention that you need to use a torque sensing screwdriver to make a code compliant connection. You honestly should redo the video to include that important bit of information.
![ประสบการณ์ จ้าง Developer ที่ผมจะไม่มีวันลืม [ภาค1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bzivN4KDg-k/mqdefault.jpg)
I used these in a house with aluminum wire... and NEVER had another issue with outlets burning up. Before installing these, I had problems with a couple outlets. I lived in that house for 19 years and was 100% satisfied with Alumiconn connectors.
thanks for watching! please share the video
Instead of running a new copper wire for a microwave is it OK to use the Alumiconn connectors?
If I get this right, the cu/alr receptacles work with no pigtail and without anti oxidant compound BUT they're not as good for OLDER homes because the brittle aluminum might crack or break while attempting to bend and screw into the outlet, correct?. In that case, it's probably best to use the alumiconn connectors (rather than the twist connectors) to avoid this cracking or breaking, correct? Fantastic vid btw, gave it the thumbs up.
Thanks for watching... yes the aluminum wires are brittle and they also get damaged more easily than copper. The cu/alr receptacles are okay and they are better than nothing. The connectors are best.
One very important aspect left out is that it is crucial to use a calibrated TOPRQUE SCREW DRIVER to tighten the screws of the Alumiconn connectors !
Tightening "by feel" with a regular scredriver, as shown in the video, may get the AL wire damaged, creating a hotspot. Same goes for the CO side, that will create a hotspot if torqued too loose .
Yes, but unfortunately torque screwdrivers are like $250-$300. Fine for a pro who may get multiple uses out of it, expensive for a DIYer that needs it for one job. Alumiconn says a second method is acceptable too, which is 1 full turn after the set screw touches the aluminum wire, and 1 half turn after the set screw touches the copper wire.
@@OMGWTFLOLSMH quick tip you can get torque screw drivers for mounting scopes on rifles that’s what I used I have a vortex torque screw driver that will go from 10 to 50 inch pounds and I paid like $60 for it but I would say obviously rewiring a home is best but jeez copper expensive as hell right now I would say the alumiconn connectors are the best because you not bending 50 year old brittle aluminum and if I didn’t have those I’d probably go with the wire nuts with noalox in them I’ve seen some really dangerous aluminum when people think it’s easy to just put a wire nut on them I’ve also seen pig tails but with no regard to the jumper going to another outlet and it defeats the purpose of pigtails expansion and contraction will cause arcing and obviously can cause a fire I’ve seen plenty of melted outlets I’ve seen craziness in panels but at the end of the residential aluminum is extremely unsafe in my humble opinion
@@866martin can you tell me where I can buy a Vortex torque screwdriver like you purchased for $60? Thanks!
@@OMGWTFLOLSMHI disagree I got a used Sturtevant Richmont CAL 36/4 Adjustable Torque Screwdriver Driver For 35 bucks , and a cheap vevor one 35 bucks too , there is also a new Fix It Sticks Mini All-In-One Torque Driver 6-25 in/lbs for 53 bucks but that one don't click, so I didn't buy that one.
What do you torque them to ?
From what I've been reading, the AlumiConn 2-port and 3-port connectors installed with a torque screwdriver are the only "good" way for a homeowner to safely remediate. The wire nuts tend to become a fire hazard and burn up (though I've also read that proper wire twisting before capping can help avoid it), and I don't think the AL rated outlets are considered as safe either. Aluminum wires will still work their way loose over time.
Disadvantages of the Alumiconn connectors: they're $3 each, and tough to pack into tight boxes. But it sounds like they're the only real safe option.
This problem with aluminum wall were from the beginning of use. My father would come home from work and talk about the problems you discuss . He rewired our whole house top to bottom
Helpful, thanks!!! The hardware store sold me some aluminum wire for a lamp- I have to connect it to solid copper wire- and don't want to buy a connector (time issue).
After seeing this, I cannibalized a copper extension cord that didn't work well anyway, and that should work fine. No reason to do copper-aluminum if I can avoid it! I had no idea....
Man thank you so much for the info. I was nervous as hell. Makes sense pig tail the hot points
Thank you for helping us learn by being basic and easy to understand!
In my area there are tons of neighborhoods and houses with aluminum wire and no one I know has had any issues with getting insurance coverage. I have aluminum wire and have had coverage with one of the big insurance agencies for 20 years. I replaced most of the outlets and switches years ago with CO/ALR devices and have never had an issue. As far as pigtailing in some situations, I just pigtail a piece of copper with the aluminum, add antioxidant paste to a wire nut, secure with the nut and wrap with electrical tape. I've had zero issues in 20 years.
glad to hear it
when you wire back the outlet was it a CO/ALR outlet or a outlet without the CO/ALR?
I heard someone say insurance would not insure a home with AL wire I called my insurance lady she been in the business for 30 years said she never heard of it, and that she even was an adjuster had been to homes that burned up due to AL wire. I live in Arizona 1970's was a boom for tract homes we probably have over a million homes with AL wire. I'm in the process of replacing every connection with Alumiconn's. Then I'm going to install AFCI/GFCI breakers in my panel. I never had a problem but I noticed that whoever wired my home in 1976 they didn't twist the wires in the wire nuts. Some of those nuts seem to have been heated the plastic just spins can't remove have to cut them off. The wire in my home is either 12, or 10 awg it's not soft not like copper I cut a piece out and played around with it see how weak it was as weak as I Thought.
Where we live, the only people who will insure a home with aluminum wiring want DOUBLE the rate to insure the home. I'd say there are "issues".
@@zendyk I don't know where you live, but in Ohio I have State Farm and they have had no issue insuring my home the last 20 years at normal rates.
Hello everyone, here are the AlumiConn connectors amzn.to/31aW5GU
link broken
@@Bombelman fixed it
Just for your edification, creep is an engineering term. It means that a material will slowly deform under persistent mechanical stress. I.e. a steel wire with a 100lb weight hanging from it. The steel will remain at some length, no matter how long it hangs (it won't, but it's more resistant than aluminum). But aluminum wire of the same gauge will get longer (and thinner) over time with the same weight hung. Higher temperature exacerbates the issue.
So the wires do "creep out of the connectors". But really it's that the screws clamping the wire cause Al wire to eventually give way under the pressure of the screw, and then the clamping pressure reduces.
QUESTION: WAGO Connectors, What about Copper and Alum wires connecting in a WAGO With WAGO Alu-Plus Contact Paste?
You can definitely WAGO PUSH WIRE and 773 connections because the rating includes aluminum (IF the paste is used). If it’s a copper only rated Wago, then no.
Only 12 awg but my alum wire is bigger than that to fit inside the slot
@@edbouhl3100 Wago's own data sheet says: *"Terminating Aluminum Conductors (Not for use in North America)"* EDIT Good luck with insurance if the house catches fire... or worse. ... As with everything like this, no matter your location, you best know your local codes, and what your insurance will or will not cover.
Great video thank you
Do you have to pigtail copper to aluminum in the box if you’re getting an outlet or a switch that is compatible with aluminum and copper?
no
I wanted to see that Al/Cu fusing machine 😎 cool video, man! 👍🏻
“AlumiConn Aluminum to Copper Lug is approved by the Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC), UL, and numerous insurance companies as a safe method for aluminum wiring repair.” The AL/CU wire connectors (nuts) are not considered a permanent solution to pigtail. As noted in a comment below the AlumiConn lugs MUST be torqued to specifications. They sell a special driver to do this, it runs around $135. Don’t use a regular screw driver, be safe not sorry.
So looking at your example I could run a hot red wire into a lumicon and right next to it a white neutral I don't think so.
@@georgewhidden8064 Show where he even implied that. I know you cannot.
Is there a 4 port Alumicon connector. I have outlets with three wires and one going to the outlet.
Thank you for this excellent video, very illustrative... I will send this link to my clients in my Inspections Reports to reinforce our explanation regarding aluminum wiring.
Thank you Arturo!
The problem with the AlumiConn connectors is that they take up so much space. There are some boxes in our house that already barely have room for the existing wiring. We’d have to have an electrician retrofit newer, larger boxes to allow for the additional connectors.
Yes, that can be a problem.
That’s partly why I’ve used the CU/Alr switches and outlets to replace the old ones that were here. The problem is were GFCI or dimmers are needed since those are not made for aluminum wire.
For "decora" switches or gfci, pigtail with marrette 63 or 65 wire nuts. They're rated for co/alu and are certified as a proper fix in Canada but not the USA lol. Good enough for me.@@mikegoldnj
I just had a 220v. 30 amp dryer receptacle melt and burn to a crisp and fry the dryer cord too. Of course it's an aluminum wired house. What gets me is that it was pigtailed -- although it looks like it was done quite a while ago. It MAY have started at the copper and aluminum wire connector which may or may not have had anti oxidant applied. My guess is that the copper/aluminum connection came apart under one of screw caps, started shorting, fryed the cap, and sent the whole electrical current mess into the outlet.which burned it up. Your thoughts? Also, the connection is 220v, 30amp 3-wire for an electric dryer. I have the option of hooking up a gas dryer and being done with it. Again, your thoughts?
it does sound like you need to use the alumiconn connectors. Make sure they are in a metal box and not in the wall unprotected. Also yes I would convert to gas if you have that option.
@@flannelguydiy6458 The AlumiConn connectors you showed will only support #12 to #10 gauge solid aluminum wire. 30A dryer outlets and 50 to 60A electric stove outlets use a much larger stranded aluminum wiring solution. I have not investigated terminal block like solutions for connecting these so I can't make a recommendation.
Good info.
Just earned another subscriber 👍
thank you JP
Install arc fault devices guys ok
What about inside the breaker box. Can copper and aluminum be on the neutral bar or you must pig tail to bar?
Damn good video. Dealing with this RN
thanks for watching Jordan
So Alumiconn or CO/AU Outlets? A little contradiction in the comments.
Thanks, learned a couple of things.
I am glad to hear that Chris... thank you
Part of the reason Aluminum becomes brittle is that it is work hardening.
The more you work (bend) it, the harder (and more brittle) it will become. That said, you really only want to go into these boxes once.
Indeed. This is why it's critical to snip off the already bent piece and re-strip the wire if going with the CO/ALR outlet option. I had to go this route due to lack of space in the box. I also give the newly exposed aluminum a light buff with scotchbrite and apply anti-oxidant compound.
the tough part is with the older homes, you often do not have enough slack (extra wire) to snip too much off to get a clean end. It really is a challenge
Good job explaining! Thank you.
thank you!
Great video
Glad you enjoyed it
Excellent video
I’m planning on putting in the alumicons. Is it necessary to pigtail to copper for the ground wire? No current running through it, but it’s still aluminum.
Well, since the ground wires do not get hot, it likely is not necessary.
Might say required somewhere in the NEC, not sure where. My 70's house has copper pigtails for the bare Aluminum ground wires. Seems like the correct way.
@@lschweitz09 Yes these connectors are essentially the same as pigtailing, just in a more secure way.
I NEED YOUR HELP with AlumiConn! Thanks for this info. What's your opinion on Ground? Obviously hot and neutral need the alumiConn, but do you think one can save a few $$$ by not using on ground?
I think it would be fine to connect the ground wires to a traditional wire nut.
My home has very brittle aluminium wiring. What do you think about wago connectors?
There is no such thing as "wago connectors" in the sense that you are asking. There is a lot more to it than that. Anyway, in North America, NO!
BIG HEADS UP... Do NOT use Ideal Type 65 "Twister" wire nuts to pigtail residential aluminum wiring. Under an agreement with the U. S. Consumer Product Safety Commission, Ideal no advertises, markets, or recommends the type 65 wire nuts for the use described in this video. The was after several structure fires were attributed to the use of Ideal type 65 wire nuts.
Underwriters Laboratories did not independently verify the results of the original tests conducted by Ideal, even though UL's published standards require said testing before UL certification is granted.
The Canadian Standards Association (CSA) relied on the UL listing in approving CSA listing of this product.
Currently, the only product available, tested and fully certified for this use are the Alumiconn connectors, as described in the latter part of this video. They are readily available on eBay, Amazon and many online electrical resellers.
Separately, insure that ALL aluminum wiring is properly protected by either Are Fault Combination Circuit Breakers (AFCI-CB) or Dual Function (Arc Fault/Ground Fault) Combination Circuit Breakers (AFCI/GFCI-CB).
As of 2017, the National Electric Code (NEC) requires Arc Fault breakers for all dwelling spaces in a new home, or whenever a breaker panel is replaced. If ANY wiring does start arcing, an Arc Fault breaker can cut off power before a fire starts. If nothing else, update your breakers.
Be careful and stay safe, Bruce
All the outlets with aluminum wire I'm dealing with have a red and black wire to one side of the outlet and a white to the other side with no ground wire connected. How do I go about using the connectors?
can i use the connectors with the three holes on all receptacles even though they only need two? curious because idk which receptacles need what. thank you advance and thank you for posting this video.
Yes you can but they are also made for two. You can just buy those
Of course, but these things take up room in the box, so the smaller the better, and the 2s are cheaper than the 3s. Buy some of each and use the 2s where necessary. Do a quick survey, should only take a few hrs a day over a weekend to go around the house and do a count by taking off the outlet cover and looking inside with a flashlight. If there's only one cable coming into the box, you only need a 2 for that box. There maybe cases where there are 3 cables coming into the box, then you would need a 4 for those, but that wouldn't be too common in the average house.
@@OMGWTFLOLSMH thank you very much
QUESTION: Since the WAGO is a spring clamp it should be much better when Aluminum expands and contracts., The screw doesn't move. Comment?
Following
NO. And, no, period, in North America.
Oh, second question, different topic. I see on the King Innovation site for AlumiConn connectors that they recommend using a torque screwdriver on the screws, which I see on Home Depot's site they have a Husky that will do the required 10 and 15 inch pounds for $56. Some comments there say it's very tough to guess the right amount of force to use on the aluminum conductor -- undertighten and that warming/cooling you mentioned could let it work itself out from under the lug's screw. Overtighten, and the aluminum could crack and break free of the connector. What are your thoughts on torquing the set screws on the AlumiConn?
yeah if you have a torque screw driver then use it for sure..
@@flannelguydiy6458 I don't, and my friend who I thought had every tool in the world to borrow doesn't have one either. So, is it worth the $56 to get one, on the theory that I don't want to over- or under-tighten the aluminum lug screw, causing the connection to fail and the house to burn down, because I have no feel for how much 10 inch pounds is? Is there some rule of thumb to get that torque, short of the special tool?
@@JusBidniss yes, if you're repairing an entire home with aluminum to copper pigtails, might as well buy the torque screwdriver, better safe than sorry. Chances are you'll find many more uses for the torque screwdriver besides aluminum wiring repair.
Excellent information!
Thank you for the video.
thanks for watching! please share the video
Please help. I bought some of the 3 way alumni to copper terminals and they melted it happened twice on the same set of wires what would cause that?
I MUCH prefer WAGO lever nuts. They are spring loaded and will manage creap without loosening where anything that screws down will still work loose
Can you use “Ideal” wire nuts with “ideal” anti corrosion noalox solvent?
Do some research. The short answer, no.
I have not found a GFCI outlet that had Aluminum capacity.... pigtail is really hard for an already cramped box due to a GFCI.
you are correct in that it can get very cramped in there.
In that case may need to switch a GFCI breaker, just be cautious because Multiwire branch circuits were very common practice in those days.
@@claytonsprague7316 late comment, but for a multiwire circuit, there are double pole GFCI breakers for that, be aware they are about 100 dollars or so, and with the exception of a 50 amp (used almost exclusively for hot tubs) may have to be ordered and shipped to the store, since 15 and 20 amp double pole GFCI breakers are not commonly used.
Do they make 4 port alumiconn? I can’t seem to find them anywhere. Thanks.
hmmmm..... I don't think so
Haven't found them. Wish they would.
I don't understand what scenario I'd use the 3rd port in the 3-port connectors? I have to pigtail a few inches of copper on the ends of my aluminum when replacing an outlet or switch in our house, because whoever wired the ones I've seen so far didn't leave an inch of extra slack to pull the outlet free or make a new shepherd's crook for the screws (they all used the holes in the back). It's awful -- you can barely get the outlet clear of the box opening! So pigtail it is. In the 2 or 3 I've done so far (which I now learn I have to go back and do right, since I used regular wire nuts), there was one 3-wire romex coming into the box, so I wire-nutted my 4" of copper to each, connected the outlet, and (barely) stuffed it all back in (these are all shallow boxes so far, so I guess the AlumiConns will require me tracking down some deeper old-work boxes I can install through the hole in the drywall, after carefully breaking out the old box). However, I know there will be some outlets I encounter with 2 romex's coming in, and both sides of the outlet used. In many of those, the little metal deal between the screws is broken off, because the top one is on the light switch. Would the 3rd port work for that scenario? Or only when the little metal deal is not broken out, and top and bottom both are always powered?
You would use them wherever you have three wires twisted together today.
I've heard the purple wire nuts can leak out the cream. I try to install them open end up or on the side at least. I didn't know alumiconns had cream in them. Any issues there I wonder? All expensive and a pain in the ass in cramped boxes Anyway. Argh!
yeah they are a bit expensive but the alumicons are much better. When you do not have wires twisted together you have less heat getting built up. The cost is well worth the peace of mind. Have not had any issues at all since doing this....none.
@@flannelguydiy6458 you're right. It is about peace of mind. I'll most likely go this route. Thanks for getting back to me. Dave. Cheers
Thanks for this informative video. However, my understanding is that you never join Aluminium and Copper wires together by using Twist caps due to fire hazards.
No... they are approved if you are using the correct caps with the substance inside that allows for it. However, I do not like using the caps and prefer the alumiconn connectors
I was wiring houses in the late sixties. It wasn't that we were cheaping out on wire costs, the problem was that we couldn't even purchase copper wire due to mine workers union strikes.
The NEC (National Electrical Code) prohibits direct connection of dissimilar metals.
And as to "not enough breakers", Again I refer to the NEC which was the same then as it is now. Which is 3 watts per square foot for calculating the number of lighting circuits in a single family residence.
No contractors or inspectors were "fudging" the number of lighting circuits that I know of.
thanks for explaining about the copper shortage. I have seen a lot of houses where too many rooms are linked to the same breaker
Purchased a 1970's house 3 months ago. Previous owner just before the sell, spent $8,000 replacing out lets, doing alumicon and adding a brand new breaker box. I still can't get insurance coverage.
yeah the updated connections will not change whether an insurance company will allow aluminum wiring.
@@flannelguydiy6458 thats really too bad with electrians and county even approving the repairs.
Great information, thank you. In the process of attempting to replace light switches and wall sockets in my mid 80s home I found out I had cooper clad aluminum wiring because the wire was too thick to go into the quickwire holes. How do you deal with this issue? Can it be treated like cooper wire and use the screw terminals? Are there any precautions? TIA
You dont even want to use those quickwire holes. The wires may work themselves free. You can bend the aluminum wire and attach to the screw terminals just like a copper wire. However, aluminum wire is brittle and they can break. This is why those alumiconn connectors work so well. You can put your aluminum wire in there, then run copper to your switch or outlet.
What about the leviton 20 amp outlet with the tab where you would insert straight aluminum wire in the tighten the screw down. Is this safe?
Hello?
Thanks for the info. Did you link where to buy the connectors? Super expensive everywhere I have looked?
yes linked in the description
how do you know if your outlets are CU/ALR, do you just have to look for the aluminum connection.
Steve, they should be marked but yes you can look for the aluminum connection. You dont want to see copper screws.
Doing this now. Using alumiconn and when I torque to their recommendation it seems to deform the aluminum wire. The wire itself seems in good condition, is this normal when using alumiconn and torquing to 10 inch pounds?
if your using a plastic box does the AL ground still need an Alumiconn or can you jpoin by other means to the CU ground? Also do you need these connectors at the panel box also?s
follow your local code for grounding regardless of whether you are using alumiconn connectors
I have a question,my house has aluminum wiring,here recently i noticed that one of the outlets was acting wonky so i decided to replace it, i went to home depot and they carried a outlet called aluminum /copper, one side looks like aluminum screws and one side looks like copper screws, if some houses have copper wiring and some houses have aluminum wiring but mainly exclusive one or the other what good does a aluminum /copper outlet do me? i would guess it would be better to have aluminum/ aluminum on both sides correct? so why do they even sell that kind of outlet ? thank you for your time!!
Funny thing is that the outlet im replacing is also aluminum /copper,one side is aluminum and one side copper and it has been in this house for at least 30 years,once i opened up the outlet to replace it i noticed the aluminum side was kinda burn t a bit but the other wires on the copper side were pristine, what gives?
You are definitely not knowledgeable about this. Do a great deal of research, contacting, and learn your local codes/installation. On outlets, what you refer to is: The silver looking side is the neutral, the copper/brass looking side is the load. (Green = ground.) That is, very, very basic.
So if the wiring just goes to 1 outlet or switch you can just buy the 2 port Alumiconn Connectors?
yes that is correct.
@@flannelguydiy6458 thank you very much!
Can Pigtailing with Alumicon conectors be used on Air-conditioning unit wires that is aluminum, my house was build in 2003 and Aircond. company telling me i have aluminum wires, i do not know how is it possible, i thought no one used aluminum wires in 2000`s .
I am almost positive that your air conditioner is using a thicker wire (10 gauge or more) and they likely will not fit into an alumiconn connector that I THINK accepts no larger than a 12 gauge wire. An electrician can use a crimp to fuse aluminum to copper.
Aluminum is still fairly common for larger single purpose 240 volt circuits like air conditioner , dryer and stove. Those large aluminum (8 awg and bigger) don't have the same problems that 10 and 12 awg single strand aluminum did. However, you do have to make sure that the lugs are AL rated. Some devices such as furnace and AC are not compatible with aluminum, but a disconnect switch is required if the breaker box is not within sight of the unit, so in this case you could run aluminum to the disconnect, then come out with copper to the unit. This assumes the disconnect is AL/CU rated.
Thanks for the video. Does the ceeling, or vanity light fixture side where the copper wire is not solid have to have these connectors as well?
do you have link where to buy connecters
link is in the video description.
Where is the information on torquing the connections per the instructions?
On the Alumiconn package.
What do you do with the ground wire?
you can pigtail it but you really do not have to. There is no juice going through the ground and the usual dangers with aluminum wiring do not apply to the ground wire
@@flannelguydiy6458 Mucho thanks. It wasn't grounded when I open it up so was wondering if it wasn't setup right. Your reply is helpful and now my wife and rest at night knowing I'm not going to burn the house down again! :)
@@chefbambu9382 again?
Ok so let’s say I go with the Alumiconn connections...on the new outlet, I’m also replacing old switches and outlets, will use a copper one now that I have a pigtail of copper from aluminum or will I use an aluminum still?
If you are running a short copper wire from the pigtail or alumiconn connector to the switch or outlet... then you can use a regular switch or outlet. You only need the CO/ALR outlets and switches if an aluminum wire is physically connected to them. Make sense?
Flannel Guy DIY yes sir, that’s what I will be doing. Thank you! Also do you recommend a certain torque screw driver? Somebody mentioned that it does have to be torqued to a certain amount to avoid resistance? Is this true?
Flannel Guy DIY last question I promise lol...if it’s a 12 gage aluminum wire, what size copper wire do I pig tail to it...also a 12 or should I go up to a 14 on the copper wire?
@@drizzy2343 The bigger the number, the smaller the wire....so 14ga wire is smaller than 12ga wire. Stick with 12ga copper to 12ga aluminum. I'm not even sure if they made 14ga AL wire since there is no amperage rating on all the charts I've seen. And YES, use a torque screwdriver....see my post above---3--If you use the Alumiconn's, you will need to get a torque screwdriver since the set screws on the Alumiconn's MUST be torqued to a certain tightness (spec's are on the package). I am using one called the "FAT Wrench" ($35 on Amazon)....just google it.
How do you connect three aluminum ground wires with one copper ground wire?
You can use the alumiconn connector or you can just use a regular wire cap. The ground wire does not carry a load so you can twist copper and aluminum ground wires together.
Wait. I’m confused. If the whole house is wired with aluminum, there would be no need for the Alumi con correct? I’d just need to make sure that all of my outlets and switches are aluminum wire compatible, correct? I’ll have an electrician do it but I want to understand it.
Is it common for a 60’s hose to have BOTH aluminum and copper if there has been NO newer additions?
Yes and no. It is true that you can use aluminum safe outlets and switches. However, part of the problem with aluminum is they work loose at the connection points over time especially at a spot where it gets very hot such as a bathroom outlet where a 1500 watt hair dryer is used. The devices we use today draw more power with the exception of LED lights. You also have new light fixtures that do not have aluminum safe connection points. I would bet most homes built in the 60’s or early 70s have different fixtures now. All of those should have allumicon connectors between them and the aluminum wires. I don’t think it makes sense to use these things at every point.
I have both in my house. Years ago I went around and disconnected all my aluminum outlets and used an emery cloth to lightly sand any oxidation off the ends and applied anti-oxidation paste before putting them back onto the outlet. I think I'm going to switch to these alumiconn connectors now because my insurance company is asking questions suddenly after 16 years.
Copper AND aluminum in a 1960s house? That's a new one for me lol. I suppose if the electricians who wired the house had a bunch of older copper wire stashed in their trucks, sure. Everytime I've found a home with a mixture of copper and aluminum was either a much older home that had a renovation or addition during the 1960s thru the early to mid 70s, or was built during this time and had circuits added later on.
Quick question. My parents house has copper wiring. Recently they remodeled their bathroom and installed a GFCI outlet to replace a standard plug by the sink (following code). Not long after that work was done they suddenly lost all power in the adjacent room. They suspect it’s the GFCI they installed. I noticed in the GFCI instructions that it says ‘only to be used with copper’ so I feel it’s feasible that the GFCI could be the culprit. Is it possible for them to have a GFCI with aluminum wiring? If so, how? Thank you
yes it can be used with aluminum. Just get a compatible GFCI outlet. However, it sounds like your parents have a different problem
I have a copper home, but the ceiling fan I want to install has aluminum wiring, what can I do?
Hook it up. The connection is in a J-box that's designed to contain any spark/fire. [note: I am NOT a licensed electrician.]
When you come out of the alumiconn connector with new copper wire can you go back to receptacle if it is marked au/cu or will you have the came issue ,... copper pigtale to alum screw..i.e., do now have to buy new
Copper only receptacle
...
Thanks
Al/Cu marked outlets are also designed for copper... hence the "Cu" which is the elemental abbreviation for copper.
If the aluminum wire is 12 gauge, does the copper wire need to be 14 gauge or can it also be 12?
12ga. Both AL and CU wire are rated for 20 amps, but I avoid "loading" ANY aluminum wired circuit, but that's me.
The ampere rating for aluminum 12 AWG wire is only 15amps. Do not use a 20amp breaker or fuse for this wire.
@@claytonsprague7316 After reading the amperage capacity charts for aluminum wire I believe your statement "the amperage rating for aluminum 12 AWG wire is only 15 amps." is incorrect. 12 AWG solid aluminum wiring is rated for 20 amps. Here is the link to the amperage capacity chart: www.cerrowire.com/products/resources/tables-calculators/ampacity-charts/
@@craigschiemann9553 Thank you I appreciate your thoughtfulness of the chart. However there are some small details that need to be mentioned for safeties sake. First anyone watching this stuff in the US should read the CPSC study on Aluminum wiring (just google it cause I’m not as adept as Mr. Craig on links.
Secondly, in that chart you have to know how to interpret the information., you will notice that it references 75deg C wiring as 20 amps. And yes you are correct in that case. HOWEVER please note that That classification of wiring didn’t appear until after 1984, and they stopped making aluminum wiring for branch circuits in the mid 70’s and that wire was only rated at 60 deg C.
They didn’t make 14awg aluminum because the first gauge wire that could actually handle 15 amps was 12awg single strand aluminum NM. Please anyone with aluminum wiring research thoroughly before doing or hiring work done. Thank you.
@@claytonsprague7316 Thanks for adding the additional information. I agree, one needs to thoroughly understand the issues and remedies for handling issues with aluminum wiring before attempting to work on the project. One needs to take the steps needed to inform themselves on any issue they are not properly informed on. If not, then please leave the project(s) to a professional that is. Having only a little bit of knowledge on something can come back and harm you. This is not something one can take lightly. There are many licensed electricians out there that won't touch aluminum wiring. That tells you something. When seeking a professional make sure they are knowledgable and comfortable with working on your type of project before even thinking of hiring them.
I have a question that i am wondering. If i pig tie the aluminum to copper wires. do i still have to use a co/alr outlet to wire it back on or can i use one with out the co/alr ?
Yes you would. Pig tailing is still a problem
@@flannelguydiy6458 I'm not sure which part are you agreeing to after I pig tail copper wire to aluminum? Do I connect it to a co/alr outlet or can I use one without the co/alr?
@@ZeroZillions okay, if you are using a CO/ALR switch or outlet, then you can wire the aluminum wire directly do that without pig tailing. In general pig tailing copper to aluminum is a problem. You would need to instead use the alumiconn connectors with the aluminum wire going in, and then a short copper wire going out to e REGULAR outlet.
I have been doing research on this and it seems like there are two sides to this coin. Some articles conclude it is still safe with the right outlets and some still scream these "solutions" are just as dangerous. Why the controversy? Is it like the Federal Pacific box?
If I have aluminum wiring where is the copper come from that you are talking about?
The copper would be any new wires that you are adding for remodeling, etc
i couldn't find a 2 way, can i keep a 3 way for a 2 way split ?
yes you can leave one of the slots empty
@@flannelguydiy6458 thank you sooo much!!
What about dimmer switches? Is it okay to use the pigtail method? I’m starting to see forums say that you can’t use dimmer switches with aluminum wiring. I just installed one today. Something told me to put my ear up close to the switch and I hear a fair humming sound...
Yes you an pigtail before going to any fixture our outlet.
So what happened? I replaced most of my aluminum wire house with regular copper only. Look like I need to go back and change them out.
Do we have to use the Alumiconn connectors along with the AL outlets / switches? Is this the best solution?
I am confused. With the Alumincon connectors, I don't see where the black wire figures in. On your new outlet it is going to need a black wire to the gold screw and a white wire to the silver screw. I only see a white wiire coming out of the Alumincon.
I was just using random wires to show how to use the connector. You will use one connector to connect your black wires and another one to connect your white wires.
@@flannelguydiy6458 Thank you. I figured it out that I would need one Alumicon for the white wires and one for the black wires and one for the ground wires. It's going to be crowded in junction box.
Be careful when replacing old recepticles with new ones guys once you do this you have to bring up the branch circuit ok with arc/fault and or gfi protection t/r rated plugs, tr/wr rated plugs outside per 406.4,d thru out the home where ever you changed them out to new
That is people's biggest problem, they don't research. There are reasons trades people go to school, etc., and there are codes, and local codes. That includes this video, it is bad. EDIT In fact, as of now, I am through in here. There is no way to address all the bad posts. And, this channel should remove this video.
I have only one aluminum circuit controlling just a ceiling fan and 2 recessed lights. I understand about the pig-tailing at the switch box and the endpoints but is it necessary to have a pigtail at the electrical panel. I was told it was required but would like to verify if that is true or in what situation it would apply. thanks
No one here can (validly) answer that. You have to know your local code/s. EDIT BTW: "I have only one aluminum circuit controlling just a ceiling fan and 2 recessed lights." How are you 100% sure of that? You do know what an actual circuit entails, right?
I live in an apartment where my own room and my dad's room are on one signle socket. And its all aluminium wire. I was wondering why the socket was getting warm and now I know, its the old type of socket with NO termials, just the push in wire thingys ] o o] ---==== ---==== and they're so old its got that fiber insulation instead of the plastic or rubber....
how has this appartment building not burnt up. the fuse boxes have 30 amp fuses.
what gauge is the copper connection/pigtail?
please people if you are going to do this just buy the correct copper gauge 10 is compatible with 12 gauge aluminum....and so on never 12g copper on12g aluminum.... i have gone through so many fuses after the unexperienced electrician i hired used the wrong gauge mix
It is less about the wire and more about the circuit breaker and how many amps it is rated for. You can go 12g to 12g if you are not over loading that 12g copper wire with too many fixtures attached to it. If you are having issues with an overload, you should add a line or size down the breaker.
Wait a minute. If aluminum tends to loosen over time, then how can BOTH parts (wire & outlet) being aluminum solve the problem? Seems it would result in DOUBLE the loosening effect.
This is an old comment, but I wanted to address for anyone reading:
Since the aluminum will expand and shrink at the same rate, it won't loosen as much over time. Also, since they are aluminum on aluminum connections, you can have some cold welding happen as you clamp it down and that can reduce issues as well.
@@anthonyalbanese1993 I'm not quite sold on the first part of your comment, but the second part makes sense. Thanks.
@@jakejones5736 part of the reason the aluminum would loosen over time is because it's coefficient of therman expansion is higher than that of copper. So when it heats and cools with temperature changes, it does so at a different rate than the copper.
When you attach / coil the aluminum wire are an aluminum screw terminal, which are usually rivited in place nowadays by plastic, both the wire and screw terminal will expand at the same rate due to sharing the same thermal expansion coefficient and this can't unscrew itself or work it's way out of the post, since the loosening effect comes because the aluminum wire lengthens more than the copper screw term can expand, causing gaps that get worse as it cycles through temps.
Hopefully that helps!
I talked to an electrician and stated that I could switch my breakers to arch fault breakers and it will solve the problem....does any one have comments about that??
I'm a licensed journeyman electrician and I agree with your electrician on his or her recommendation on AFCI breakers because if anywhere in the circuit there is arcing, this breaker will trip much faster than a standard circuit breaker, preventing a fire. Often a failing aluminum wire connection can generate sufficient heat to ignite wire insulation and surrounding combustibles without drawing enough current to trip a standard 15 or 20A breaker.
However I have to respectfully disagree with the electrician stating AFCI breakers will solve the problem, because it won't. To solve the issues for good you generally have 3 main options, the best and most expensive is to have the aluminum wiring replaced with copper, the old aluminum is usually left abandoned in place, and removed wherever accessible to prevent someone in the future from attempting to reenergize it. The last two are permanent repairs, by Copalum crimps, or Alumniconn connectors to attach a copper pigtail to the receptacle outlet, switch, etc. Even with permanent repairs or a rewire I would strongly advise AFCI protection because it is possible that some connections will be overlooked even by master electricians. In older homes that have been renovated and stuff added or removed, unfortunately it's not uncommon for exposed splices to be hidden in walls without any junction box, receptacle outlets buried behind drywall, the list of possibilities goes on. Hope you found this information helpful.
What about ground? There's no ground wire available in the box
if you have no ground, then you are rolling without one
so no alumicon for the ground ?
Not needed... there is no heat in the ground wires
@@flannelguydiy6458 will still oxidize no ? Plus it is hooked to the copper receptacle
so does everything need to be done?...outlets switches and fixtures?ya didnt explain the 4 alumiconn
There's aren't any 4 port connectors.
10:12
@@lifebeginsat190 Check their website kinginnovation dot com......they don't make a 4 port alumiconn connector.
just sayin you said 4...lol...no worries...great video...thx man
5:02 your welcome
mY method of securing alum and copper together at the connection point is to let both wires heat up naturally and what happens is they both end up melting together creating the perfect fuse between them. Sometimes the jacket will have holes in it where the insulation has bubbled but I just put electrical tape around it. No issues and been in this home 17 years
manual says you need to use a torque screwdriver
Totally forgot to mention needing the $150 torque screw driver for the AlumiConn!
You can get them way cheaper than that.
Don’t forget to use the proper driver 10 for aluminum and 15 for copper…..
The connector one is not good for 12 gauge above
absolutely have to torque those alumicons to inch pounds...
Aluminum wirenuts are not considered approved method of repair by UL or most Insurance companies. Neither is changing the device. In Florida its alumicons or crimp thats it
Thanks for useful video. Can I use regular industrial butt splicers AND anti oxidant grease, if I can't get these "allumicons" locally? Electrical Inspectors have a course in their curricula, called Electrical Idiocy; belong in a very elitist circle, only for Moronic Supreme Priests of the Consumer Electrical Religion. They all have to excel on it to get the mark.
Jim West
Wago 221 series lever nuts is another great solve for this problem. Use them instead of wire nuts with your pigtails.
I've been in the electrical trade as a journeyman for almost 2 decades. And have successfully used the wago lever nuts to mitigate this same issue.
Wago needs to be accepted as a viable transition from aluminum to copper. Although it may work, it could fail a home inspection when you sell
No LED
1. Rewire home with copper 2. Alumiconn 3. Not as safe use CO/ARL, not CPSC approved like 1 and 2. Purple Wire nuts are a hazard!
thanks for watching....please share the video for me. Thx
Thumbs down for making zero mention that you need to use a torque sensing screwdriver to make a code compliant connection. You honestly should redo the video to include that important bit of information.
And #12 gauge Aluminum is 10. in-lb, but #10 gauge Al is 15 in-lb. Care not to over-torque the delicate #12 gauage Aluminum, it gets squished.
I was thinking the same thing. They are a safety critical item that need to be used correctly.
Anyone know what to do do with stranded aluminum?
I have hard-wired stranded aluminum to a copper block on a stove decades ago with absolutely NO problem.