It’s real simple. If you must use lithium ion make sure you have a quality charger and don’t charge entirely unsupervised. That’s the minimum. If you want to go a step further buy an adjustable charger and charge your battery to 80% or 90% and don’t let it get below 10%. Bonus: you will double the cycle life of the battery. If you ever find the battery has been over discharged (
The fact you said Li-ions are happiest around 30%-80%, suggested slower chargings, and gave the tip to keep batteries at 50% for long term storage made me so happy! I'm glad yall did research behind this video and made it to where any PEV owner can understand. Great video! :D
Also store them at low temps. A combo of full charge and high temps drains them a lot just while in storage. I always try to not charge mine beyond 80% except a few occasions I need max power. Never charge them close to freezing or below. Best temp to charge is 10C. There are special chemistry much more expensive batteries that can treat differently.
I have installed a RCD power socket with surge protection to use to charge my scooter with a time switch plugged in that will cut off well before bedtime just in case I forget to turn it off and it's left charging all night.
30%-80% then days are gone you just charge when you like your iPhone, charging technology for lithium ion batteries has come along way since them days unless it’s a cheap China crap 💩 you’re probably dealing with older technology so for that crap 30-80 probably best but approved brand and from a approved dealer nothing to worry about just charge when needed
The problem with many small EVs is that they have minimal thermal management. So, owners go out and use the device hard, heating the batts, then they come home and immediately charge them. This can exceed battery safe temps and off it goes. Some manufacturers of smaller electric devices have worked this out. A good example is the 82V battery packs from Briggs & Stratton, used for garden tools, which have a charger that forces air through the battery pack while charging, and won't charge the batt until it is at a safe temp. But, from what I've seen of most of these scooters, boards and e-bikes, they have simple chargers that may or may not connect to a temp sensor in the pack, or just rely on the pack sensor and pack BMS, which is often pretty rudimentary, to do the thermal control. Hence, boom, occasionally. Add into that the fact that the batts and their BMS are subject to high G forces in general use, at least in things like scooters and boards where they are all unsprung weight, and it's easy to imagine fatigue faults in cells, cell links and PCBs, which would lead to excessive heating. A properly designed pack would have multiple temp sensors and would disconnect the battery from input or output in the case of any temps outside of the safe range. But, that's too expensive to implement in small, cheap EVs, hence it generally isn't done. Of course, the problem will largely go away if manufacturers shift to safer chemistries like LFP or even LTO.
@@Electroheads They would never use LTO since the gravimetric engery density is too low for mobile appliances. The heat problem only occurs when too much current is drawn(put into) from each individual cell. A larger battery pack solves this because more cells in parallel share the load. And this is where companies are trying to save money. Knowing your battery is essential since they can be very dangerous.
The problem is that there are " battery safe temps " over which "off it goes" under normal use. "Use the device hard"? What does that even mean? You're supposed to do calculations on your head and keep score how long you used to bike it and with what delay to recharge it, or it can explode? It's an immature technology then and shouldn't be sold in this state.
I dont think its heat stress which causes the "blow up" on cells, at least not regarding to your argument "warm batteries from direct use to the charger". I have a 48V 10Ah and a 26Ah scooter, both are delivered with just a 2A charger (basic on most scooters). One needs about 5 hours, the other scooter 14 hours with a single and 7 hours with 2 chargers (2x2 = 4A). So we talk about only 0,2C charging speed in case of my small battery scooter and even below 0,1C with a single charger and still below 0,2C when "fast charging" (0,15C calculated, VERY SLOW!) on the big 1,2kWh battery. Also, just think about tool batteries... they are abused with 2-4C charging speed, thats why they need this extensive and mostly loud active cooling, anything up to 0,5C is very safe for LiIon batteries of any type, 1C is not good for them in general, but still safe. Above 1C is getting... into active cooling terretory for sure (EVs, tool batteries and their fast chargers,...)
Battery management needs to be taken to the next level to detect even the _slightest_ irregularities and physically disconnect the problem cell immediately and sound some sort of alarm to let the user know that they need to take precautions right now, like taking the scooter or whatever outside immediately. Hopefully, solid state batteries that we've been hearing about for many years will finally make their debut and squash the possibility of thermal runaway once and for all (in addition to their numerous other advantages).
@Shep VanDelay I imagine that they already use the thinnest wire necessary to carry the load while also being safe, but there must be SOME way to isolate a problem cell and disconnect while keeping the rest of the pack usable. The way most battery packs are made nowadays, unfortunately, don't lend themselves to having a single cell replaced in a feasible manner, but the pack could easily be recycled. Safety first, but after that, they need to find a way to make it economical too when there is a bad cell. Maybe a trade-in allowance on the current pack - with one or several bad cells - with a rebuilt or new replacement (if you're outside the warranty period).
@Shep VanDelay thermal runaway from overcharging will still happen with a thin wire, it's not from drawing too much power from the cell at once, but from pushing too much into it, slowly, it's an internal failure, a fuse wire will prevent a fire from a short though, but charging fires are from bad BMS's that don't cut the charge above a certain cell voltage.
Hi all! Thanks for the comments. Many are asking what happened to Kol's skateboard that led to its explosion. We can't be totally sure as we weren't able to inspect. We have a suspicion it was water ingress from riding in heavy rain. Water got through the shrink wrap, the cells got wet and as they dried they corroded and the rest is history. Like I say we can't be sure, but that's our hunch.
Or a damaged charging port from user error, water, wrong plug... etc... imagine an hot exhaust causing a fire do you see that on the news do you see that article on the news 24/7 do you have a camera in the engine bay just ready for it ????
I don’t mean to be argumentative, but in comparing conventional vehicle fires to EV fires , you have to put the numbers in context , there are near 2 billion vehicles on the road and most are internal combustion engines , the number of EV powered vehicles would be a mere fraction of that number , just saying.
@@mikldude9376 your phone, e-cigarettes your lap top and tablets all have lithium ion batteries many more items than that. With all that considered there will be far more items than vehicles with petrol/diesel engines. It really is minimal risk
@@Scooot1972 well if you really want to throw everything into the mix , there are billions upon billions of small engines , larger engines, heavy machinery , trucks, ships , etc , there truly is no comparison , internal combustion engines have been working since the late 1800’s , all these new battery toys have only been popular for a fraction of the time.
I'm so happy that people are putting on these kinds of videos. I had an electric e-bike that I built myself but used a kit from eBay with a 48 volt battery pack. At the time I had no idea that lithium batterys were dangerous. Needless to say one day I had it in my office with my three kids at home and my wife was taking a shower it started hissing and exploded shooting flames all the way to the ceiling we had about a minute or less to get out of the house before it was totally engulfed. I drug my three kids out yelled at my wife to get out I did not have time to even grab the fire extinguisher. It was a rather large battery in the flames sounded like a jet engine with a ton of white smoke which the air conditioning unit picked up and spread throughout the whole house so we cannot see to get out after about 20 seconds. After we finally got out and we're standing across the street in the park while the fireman were coming the rest of the battery exploded and caught a few spray oxygen cans that I had for cleaning out my computer in my office which in turn made a bomb like explosion blew the doors off of the house all this happened within about a minute and a half if we have been sleeping and it happened we would have not made it out in time good thing we were just preparing for bed and we're all awake house was a total loss and everything in it we did not even have time to grab our cell phones. A kind homeless guy in the park called the fire station for us just be very careful and I would even say if you're going to charge electric bikes battery maybe for one don't buy it off eBay for two charge it in the middle toolbox like case that latches shut it will keep the flames down at least enough for you to get out of the house!!! Just be careful batteries from China. I now have a lawsuit going with both Samsung and the assembly factory in China who knows if that would yield anything. I have not been scared off by it though I have another electric bike but by a company that assembles the batteries here in the United States and also pots the batteries which is like in case them in a hard resin that's clear and about an inch thick all the way around it makes the battery heavy but it's much safer no water in ingress it cant be damaged from crashes or shocks. Luna cycles out of California has been super helpful if anyone wants a bike I think that would be the best safest place to get your batteries from.
13:35 Once you've completed your trip, best to let the battery "catch its [electronic] breath" - wait for 15-20 minutes, then commence charging (trickle charge is always best).
I love this particular video's content. I have a darn scooter sitting in my living room. It's new as of in December, but in my second ride out I went off it quite hard. I thought I had busted a hip and some ribs ... nothing was broken, but I have been really incapacitated with soft tissue damage. I'm able to walk now, but there is still a lot of pain. Anyway I now know that my unit should not be sitting by my front door and in the middle of my garage next to nothing flammable. Cheers.
Glad Electroheads came out safe! Don't let the internet trolls and self-proclaimed "experts" get to you! Your survival extincts kicked in you tried your best in the moment to contain the fire to keep you and your environment safe! also I subbed for those lovely accents
One thing I think is worth adding is buy a timer that will cut power to your charger , so you can say it will take 7 hr to charge to 100 percent sat it for 6 hr and if you forget about it for two days it's all good .
Thanks so much for watching! Make sure to watch all the way through as there's lots of key info in here. And don't forget to share with your friends, family, colleagues - whoever needs to see this! Ride safe.
This is not new you know.. + you dont find videos like this for a good reason.. because there are only a few cases. What about your phone? What about your laptop(if you have one) what about your tv? Its not just electric scooters.
Great video guys. Lots of helpful info in here. Sorry to hear that people were being unkind. What you do is fantastic and much appreciated. Keep em’ coming.
A city with a population of 9.4 million people which has the highest number of all types of ev vehicles in the country. How many fires were caused by electrical goods like washing machines, tumble dryers, dishwashers, TV’s, mobile phones, or faulty house wiring? A petrol car has a lot of possible causes of fire, fuel tank, leaks in the high pressure fuel systems used on modern fuel injection systems, wiring faults, electric motors that power the air con, windows or starter motor. All it need is some common sense in charging, use and storage to mitigate any danger as well as good maintenance .
Interesting about the EV fires relative to those in ICE vehicles. However, the absolute numbers don't tell us much as there are far fewer EVs to ICE vehicles. We'd need to know the relative percentages of ICE vehicle relative to EV fires for it to give us an idea of the risks.
I think you’ll find that London has the greatest density of ev’s of all kinds in the country and yet there were only 54 attendances by the London fire brigade to ev fires.
@@sergentcolon1 old cars are easier to steal, most older cars are ICE and they end up burnt hence the stats. How many un-stolen new car fires do the fire brigade attend? LOL
@@badcampa2641 did you see on the news in the last few days the 3 year old Range Rover that caught fire and also set fire to the owners house? The only clown here chummy is you and you’re a sad clown at that.
It is also essential NOT to charge that battery below zero degrees centigrade. Once you have done this, it can seed a dendrite and the battery can still work for maybe 100 charges but that dendrite grows each time it is charged even if it is charged at the correct temperature. Once the dendrite cuts through the separator within the battery, it causes an internal short and thermal runaway.
It's easy to collate all these isolated incidents together and give the distorted impression it is common and very dangerous..in reality it isn't the reality. Escooters should be kept when charging in an outhouse or conservatory area and not left alone. But it's rare they go wrong...don't over charge them or leave them plugged in when fully charged. But most modern controllers will turn the current off
I’d really like to buy a scooter but the fire issue is concerning especially for people that live in rentals and not their own homes, where other people’s safety is important. Anyone have suggestions on some of the best, not necessarily most popular, escooter companies that have consistently good reviews and good long term quality? Thanks in advance!
"A lithium iron battery is much safer than a tank of petrol".........until it's alight, at which point petrol can be extinguished and remain extinguished. Also, perhaps you could produce statistics that show how many petrol vehicles catch fire when switched off and stationary, and also how many ICE vehicles catch fire in the home or in a garage.
When I purchased my electric bicycle, I also had the sense to purchase a lithium fire extinguisher. I do think that the fire extinguisher should be a mandatory purchase. Though it's a whole different ball game with regards to an electric car because of the size of the battery . As yet I've not purchased an electric car.
NO excuse(s) for not have adequate/sufficient fire/smoke detectors, fire blankets, fire extinguishers, first-aid kits etc. AND A PLAN in your home! Electrons are DANGEROUS!
Technically it's not a explosion. Thermal runaway is probably better terminology. Best way to deal with those large batteries is to either take away oxygen or take away heat and then shred them to make safe, then recycle. This should be done in place before transporting. Vehicle crash recovery people are going to have to learn some new skills.
I'm no expert but I would think that generally you should be able to walk calmly to safety if you notice your batteries are getting a little too warm. I'd recommend running like F...! if your fossil fuel or hydrogen fuel is looking a little too warm.
The word " Explosion " sells news and creates a more negative environment. Thermal runaway that means using IQ to work out what it means aka less news worthy....
Great video....I myself have an E-Scooter and an E-Bike. With the E-Scooter, I try not to ride it during the winter and rainy days so its good that I do this!!!
Good call, I've bought a second-hand electric off road skate board so I am off to the shed to take that skate board apart to examine the battery pack and put it outside in the dry. Just in case guys!! Just open the thing up and sure enough evidence of water ingress so disconnect the battery and place it in a 2nd hand log burner safest place I could think of outside!! Also checked my DJI battery packets and one is dead the other is taking a charge but it outside charging just in case.
6:55, now do the math percentage wise and it is actually very different. Once electric vehicles reach petrol/diesel numbers you will see fires in electric vehicles are outnumbering them vastly. The cause of fire in petrol or diesel cars is also quite often the electrical system. We should not play down the numbers in any case!
There was a study on car fires done by an insurance company (autoinsuranceEZ) in the US which looked at the frequency of fires per 100,000 vehicles on the road. The findings were that hybrids had the most frequent fires at 3,474.5 per 100,000 followed by ICE at 1,529.9 per 100,000 followed by BEV at 25.1 per 100,000. Another study (this time performed by the National Fire Protection Association) examined fire frequencies per miles driven and found that between 2012-2021 there was 1 tesla fire per 210 million miles driven compared to 1 fire per 19 million miles driven for all vehicles put together.
@@RigelBerg All good and well, but the problem is there is no good system in place to properly deal with a thermal runaway. Technically EV's don't have fires, but thermal runaway, which is impossible to put out and the collateral damage can be vastly larger, as in human life. These things, no matter how rare are of the likes that would make satan himself scared, with flames shooting from it of several feet with the violence of a blowtorch and respective heat pattern. Petrol, no matter how volatile is a known type of fire hazard, and we know how to deal with it, and we have proper safety regulations in place, where EV's somehow get a free pass, probably because they are so called green.
@@RigelBerg The problem with ICE numbers are most of the fires are arsening (pure vandalism, insurance fraud, and the likes. In France they've reached 1000 every night, all nights). And a lot are from older cars (no proper maintainance, because of economical dificulties or pure careless attitude, and even "mods" not well done). Newer cars can get on fire after a crash (been there as a firefighter) but it takes seconds to minutes to take it out. Even you can do it with a good fire extinguisher. BEVs not so: Takes hours and they can "be back" even months after.... The worst problem are fumes/droplets of cobalt, for instance, that will desable you for life...(happen to two firefigthers in USA, because they didn't know what was burning) If you see a BEV fire , run away (you have 5 seconds) and stay far , and upwind, or you can be severely afected.... Don't say I didn't warn you...
I haven't even talked about the prevalence of car fires per vehicle age. Apparently it shoots up drastically when the age surpasses 10 years, and the EV fleet barely does represent that age yet. Then the cause of car fires, about 33% is arson. When you pair that with thermal runaway, and the likely hood of an arsonist chosing an EV, it is not hard to understand this will be a very big problem in the 'green' future that our politicians like to portray.
First rule of doing anything online is you're always "doing it wrong" and apparently things like split second decisions and adrenaline aren't even a consideration. That said, keep things like phones and discarded batters off surfaces that could easily go up in flame or stoke a fire. I'd keep my scooter in a concreted area like a shed where ever possible.
My wife and I where actually shopping for 2 scooters for us to have so we could make short fast trip down to the lake about 3 -4 miles away to go fishing I'm so glad I watched this before we had a house fire
A few years ago my first ebike, stored downstairs, burst into flames one evening. It was during New Years eve and I actually heard the fire begin, only I thought it was a nearby firework. It was only when the smoke alarm triggered that I investigated with powder fire extinguisher in hand. In my case it wasn't a faulty battery pack but instead faulty wiring on the hub-based motor; the motor section was on fire, but the battery pack wasn't. Apparently there was a connection that came loose over time and ultimately caused the battery to dump a massive current into the motor, enough to cause the non-metal materials to ignite. I disconnected the battery pack and kept it outside, but had no rumblings from it since the pack wasn't damaged. So the cautionary tale here is that it's not only the battery pack that can betray you and it's worth investing not only in reliably sourced equipment, i.e. not the shonky Chinesium products, but also to have them regularly serviced to try and pick up on other electrical points of failure.
Interesting video, would be useful to compare the BEV fires to ICE fires in 2019 to actual vehicles on the road to get a realistic view on the risk. Obviously there are many more ICE vehicles on the road vs BEV. Also to add I'm pretty sure batteries aren't submerged in water to prevent oxygen getting to them - just to keep them cool.
There was a study on car fires done by an insurance company (autoinsuranceEZ) in the US which looked at the frequency of fires per 100,000 vehicles on the road. The findings were that hybrids had the most frequent fires at 3,474.5 per 100,000 followed by ICE at 1,529.9 per 100,000 followed by BEV at 25.1 per 100,000. Another study (this time performed by the National Fire Protection Association) examined fire frequencies per miles driven and found that between 2012-2021 there was 1 tesla fire per 210 million miles driven compared to 1 fire per 19 million miles driven for all vehicles put together.
We need to be fast in establishing safety regulations for personal/light EV's like scooters. We can't allow import of poorly made and unsafe EVs. If we can also invent a cheap indoor "scooter-container" that allows it to burn out without lighting its' environment on fire, that could prevent a lot of damage, injury and death as EV's become more common.
This is easily the most important and useful video I have viewed this year. Everyone who owns an eride should be shown this. The problem is that 90% of people will not follow any of this advice, because it requires them to think. Electrical devices are considered "dead" you fill them with electricity as fast as possible, you thrash them around in all conditions, you return home and charge it as fast as possible to 100% every night in the lobby of your flat next to the front door, soaking wet and after bumping it on a kerb, the only smoke alarm is in the kitchen. Can you imagine the average eScooter owner regulating their charging to those safe limits, slow charging, smoke alarms, entrance blocking, it will all happen. Your cheap Chinese knock-off escooter bought on Ebay will have had no checks or ever be checked in its lifetime. So many sScooter riders I see are teenagers of around 14, they have no clue about anything and will certainly ride it home in the pouring rain, pay no attention to any maintenance issues and if they live in a block of flats- guess what? This is a disaster like Grenfell, waiting to happen. These Erides need regulating and owners need to pass a maintenance/charging test to own one. They should have legally required registration, insurance and some form of registration number. Thank you Eilis for this strong and sensitive statement of vital importance to everyone.
I’m 14 and I’m really experienced with lithium batteries no not what you learn at school you can ask me a lot of questions and I’ll 95% chance probably have the correct answer i admit I don’t know all things about lithium batteries but I know way more then the average adult about lithium I can’t even watch this it’s sad how a very small percentage of people know about lithium batteries safety.
Brilliant video 😎 My son had an electric bike, I took his battery off the bike and set it on the kitchen worktop and plugged it in, then switched the charger on, it had Panasonic cells, I was cooking bacon and eggs 😀 There was a crackling noise, and I didn't know where was it was coming from, Then the battery started behaving like a flare and filled the kitchen with smoke, I picked it up and ran outside and threw it on the lawn, It continue to flare for at least 10 minutes, I was so scared it was like carrying a bomb that was just about to blow up, The company that supplied it didn't give him any warranty they said he must have done something wrong 🙄 I wonder what would have happened if I wasn't in the house, son was asleep upstairs with my 🐕 😰
So the moral of the story is: 1) Don't buy cheap Chinese scooters, e-bikes, etc. with cheap batteries. Only buy from reputable Brands and dealers 2) Don't get your battery system/wires wet 3) Don't push machine past it's limits 4) Don't constantly charge your batteries to full Don't charge battery soon after use
I had a cell phone do this on my desk during a battery repair. While the smell and flame was horrible and bright, the heat wasn't even enough to light a piece of cardboard.
Seems like lithium batteries are now more dangerous than lipo batteries. With lipo you need to take more care and be more cautious. Plus you can disconnect it so as long as they disconnected and kept at proper storage level charge.
its a shame that there are so little products like fire blankets made for electric vehicles like scooters, skateboard and etc, to help prevent or help you out to fight these fire There should be a huge focus on making that type of products more available we live in a age where there are electric personal vehicles everywhere so its not like its unkown
I'm sorry but my understanding is that once a battery goes into runaway it's an exothermic reaction. The burning battery produces its own oxygen. so dunking in water does not deprive it of oxygen to continue to burn. What a large body of water may do is to cool down the cells so they don't all go into thermal runaway.
I called my insurance company I have my home and auto policy with about getting a Gazelle top tier e-bike. I told them it was UL approved. They said "NO E-BIKES". My house burns down I'm shit out of luck.
Can anyone please link me a place where i can buy a fireproof bag big enough to store an ebike battery inside. After seing this video and others like it, ive decided that just to be on the safe side ill no longer be leaving the battery on my bike when not in use, instead storing it in the fireproof bag instead. Or in other words; youve scared the shit out of me!
Worth mentioning that LFP (lithium iron phosphate) chemistry is slowly taking over from Lithium turnary chemistry. LFP is a lot safer than the older turnary chemistries and much less likely to suffer thermal runaway especially when fully charged to 100%. This chemistry is also way better for consumer batteries as it contains no cobalt and can be cycled many more times than lithium turnary cells, up to 5,000 cycles while still maintaining over 80% capacity. This battery technology is slowly taking over from the older less safe turnary chemistries.
I store Chinese Engwe P26 ebike in the living room... There's no way I leave it in the common garage for the whole apartment block... Locked bicycles are being stolen from there... But I hope, there is no risk, since the battery is QC passed, right?
Nobleman Tech are making dedicated fire-resistant charging bags for electric skateboards; in future, likely making ones for EUC's and E-scooters too I reckon.
The water ingress point in the video water can collect in ur sealed waterproof battery with a metal shell as well if u go out when its cold and return to ur warm apartment when u get inside all the cold metal instantly warms up and u start to see condensation same as when u go from cold into a warm house with glasses and they fog up
Charging Suggestion to put the Charger on a small plate... Coffee Cup Saucer Type... Absorbs the Heat!... Watch the time check every 1/2 hour... Don't charge a HOT Battery!...
Great video. I've been riding electric scooters 5 years. I was talking to my neighbor today about batteries for the scooter and for e-bikes and we want to know how much temperature plays in the health of a battery. For example is it okay to store a scooter or e-bike outside or in an enclosed shed in the winter? And what about Extreme Hot temperatures in the summer? My scooter battery cannot be removed so I would like to know what is the best way or place to store my scooter when it's not being used. Thank you.
since weather is uncontrollable, me personally i just switch the main breaker off on my scooter, Dualtrons have dat breaker off / on switch under the deck not sure to other scooters
@@elliotalderson9945 in the winter I've been taking my scooter inside my house when I'm not using it because I thought that the cold is bad for battery. But it's a pain in the butt getting it up and down the steps. I have an SXT Ultimate Pro Plus and it's very heavy. In the Spring and Summer and Autumn I leave my scooter in the shed which doesn't get very hot. So this is why I'm asking my question. I hope somebody can give me an answer about storage temperatures. Thank you.
My Varla Pegasus just went up in flames yesterday while charging!!! All stock parts never modified at all!! There are threads online about cheaper cells being used for the newer model.
seemingly no mention in the video that other battery technology exists like LFP that does not pose the same thermal runaway problems LCO/NMC/NCA has. the issue is not lithium but cobalt. the cobalt allows the fire to self-sustain when battery packs fail. LFP doesnt have as good of a energy density but its not terrible either. cobalt-based Li-ion tech imo, should have more regulation. for small devices like your phone its fine, there is not much cobalt to sustain a fire, but when we start to look at EVs and LEVs there needs to be compartmentalization and precision temperature monitoring to try limit these fires, its insane we currently allow these batteries to be packed so densely when we know only one cell needs to fail for the whole pack to ignite. and if manufacturers cant come up with a good way to isolate large packs into smaller ones then they should not be allowed to use this battery chemistry.
London Fire Brigade stats: EV fires: 54 Gas & petrol fires: 1898 So there's 35 times more gas and petrol fires. How many EVs are there compared to gas & petrol vehicles? Vehicles in London: 13956 EVs (2020) 2600000 cars total (2020) Using just total cars (excluding trucks and motorbikes), there are 186 petrol & diesel cars for every 1 EV. 186/35 = 5.3. EVs are at least 5.3 times more dangerous than gas & diesel vehicles.
There was a study on car fires done by an insurance company (autoinsuranceEZ) in the US which looked at the frequency of fires per 100,000 vehicles on the road. The findings were that hybrids had the most frequent fires at 3,474.5 per 100,000 followed by ICE at 1,529.9 per 100,000 followed by BEV at 25.1 per 100,000. Another study (this time performed by the National Fire Protection Association) examined fire frequencies per miles driven and found that between 2012-2021 there was 1 tesla fire per 210 million miles driven compared to 1 fire per 19 million miles driven for all vehicles put together.
This can happen to a laptop, this can happen to your mobile phone, this can happen to your e cig ,cheap batteries, damaged, batteries, if you regularly keep a check on your battery and don't try and modify, you are controlled by the net and fear
Does the stat comparing electric car vs petroleum/diesel fires take into account the number of said cars? Surely this is more useful if it was presented as a percentage?
I'm wondering about how many lithium battery packs for portable equipment like power drills, weed whackers, leaf blowers, etc. have burst into flames? I would speculate that they get more abuse by being dropped into tool chests and such. Plus they tend to come with what are advertised as quick chargers.
So amazing to see this information, when I was going to buy a second hand Veteran Sherman I ring PET in matter to get the EUC checked and they laughed in my face, like a EUC you use till some defect shows up then you most look for service or a periodic check.
Submerging a lithium ion battery in water will not put it out if the casing is compromised. If the water hits the contents it is converted into Oxygen and Hydrogen and thus the now available oxygen will feed the fire again.
The video is contradictory, in that the male host never admits to doing any of the "bad" things they say not to do. Why did his blow up? What did he do? Or admit it isn't infinitesimal.
3. Summary of charging methods : short charging and short charging ( infrequently charging , but if you want to rush ! ) 4.It is the time to charge when the power drops to 10 % 20 % 5.Use high - quality dedicated lithium battery charger with protection function 5. In low - temperature weather , the use time of the lithium battery will be significantly shortened . This is normal , and it will be restored in about 1 hour in a warm place
Cheap nickel strip isn't 100% nickel, it's nickel coated steel, which most definitely can rust. Even expensive laptops batteries use nickel over steel, and can corrode enough to cause localised heating of the interconnect, and start a fire.
@GeeKIller Yep, a lot of issues can be traced back to shady Chinese quality. Unfortunately when people talk about this it feels like it's blasphemy to blame the glorious People's Republic of China, and therefore we blame electric vehicles in general instead and the misinformation is being spread.
@GeeKIller It's not just the batteries themselves, it's the entire assembly line that is untrustworthy as there are no real regulations and no safety priority. Don't back down, you mentioned China because China is where most garbage comes from as it's there most stuff are produced unfortunately, and it's corrupt to the core. Sure there might be better companies there that care more (not enough), but that's a rare sight and most often it's because they have had bad lemons before.
Thanks for the extremely sound advice! I do find myself wondering, however, whether any of the red flags you mention apply to this particular scooter. It’d make me easier in my mind to know that the scooter featured in this video didn’t catch fire on a whim.
Dude did the right thing. First off. That board that blew into flames was a Backfire board. 12s2p battery. Stay away from that company. I didn't have a blow out with my board. But it still has a major issue with the battery. I am going to trash the battery. I don't need this thing exploding or burning my place. Water is the only quick way to kill flame. Just takes a crap load of water.
Grab the nearest metal garbage can and flip it over the lithium fire!!! That is only to stop the spread of the fire... The battery produces its own oxygen is why this fire is hard to put out!!!
eScooter manufacturers tend to advise keep the scooters indoors (to prevent corrosion) - ok, fine. BUT - insofar as I'm aware, all it takes is one - one - cobalt electron to sneak past the [graphite] divider/insulator in the battery in an uncontrolled away and team up with Mr. Lithium => BAD! So, I keep mine in the kitchen 'workspace' and also invested in 4 extra smoke detectors (remember, hardware fails, batteries die, bad stuff happens, so only having one smoke detector [downstairs?] never makes sense to me) plus extra general-purpose fire extinguishers and also have a plan - "In the event of ..... what will we do?). Perfect system? Far from - but it's the best I can think of. Also, I recently purchased a Decent One Max (removable battery - branded as Turboant X7 in America I think) - it didn't power up when I started my static tests (it being supported off-floor via 2 axle stands [thank you Lidl]), so charged the battery (took @ 15-20 minutes to go green). However, on doing speed-mode tests, it died - completely - during speed-mode 3. What would have happened if myself (or anyone else) was actually onroad at 15.5mph and the (front wheel) motor just died? Stopped dead? Bottom line - once you remove your scooter from the box, support it and test it. Test it. Test it again. 'Nuff said.
I have an emove cruiser. Can you tell me if its at the safer end of the scale or the worse please? I live in a first floor flat and have no choice but to keep it and charge it in doors.
On some aspects it is good and some really bad. There's too many cells so no way you can overheat it by forcing it uphill. They advertise the Cruiser as watertight, however this is completely false, it is extremely easy for water to get inside the cruiser battery. Also the bms module (battery management system)is totally junk, the cheapest chinese could find on the shelf
The comparison between electric vehicles and gasoline/diesel vehicles wasn’t fair. Because electric vehicles self-ignite, where gas or diesel vehicles only ignite in an accidents.
‘A lithium ion battery is much safer than a tank of petrol’ - I have to disagree. How many times have you heard of a petrol car catching fire while parked and switched off or even while being refuelled/driven, versus all the reports of EV’s (including e-bikes and scooters) randomly catching fire in people’s homes/garages or while being charged/ridden?
An addition. If the goal is safety, avoid lithium ion altogether. Look for LiFePO4 battery chemistry packs. These weight ~20% more for the same capacity, but has much less chance of catastrophic failure (and also has a 4x longer usable lifetime).
Makes sense. However it as not mentioned in this video as many other videos available online as they desperately try not to spoil the shaky narrative of lithium ion batteries around safety
Prevent electrical fires and battery explosions; build a gas motorized bicycle. If you have an electric vehicle ( be it a bike, scooter, skateboard), in Northern California (fire land), your home insurance goes up...
Most informative yet you never discuss the events (the ways it was charged) leading to his fire. Was it hot and after a ride that he pulled it up? Was it charging when it caught fire?
I have gone over the lithium battery technology and find that we have different companies making these and different chemistries of lithium. Generally, the newer ones are safer. Any product catching fire like that, if reported, would result in a safety recall focused on a brand and a model…A newer type is LiFePO4, lithium iron and is not a fire hazard. The new Tesla batteries are safer, for example. Good batteries have circuitry to trip them if they overheat.
A full tank of petrol is much safer than a half tank of petrol. Liquid petrol does not burn, it only burns when it vaporizes. Diesel is far safer still.
If it's Lithium or Lithium base or like most rechargeables.. Beware ! Here you go, in plain English Lithium batteries are regulated as a hazardous material under the U.S. Department of Transportation's (DOT) Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR; 49 C.F.R., Parts 171-180). Exposure to Lithium can cause loss of appetite, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea and abdominal pain. ► Lithium can cause headache, muscle weakness, twitching, blurred vision, loss of coordination, tremors, confusion, seizures and coma. This isn't for me or my family. Good luck, with your so called .. clean energy !
Do not put water on a battery fire. Smother it with backing soda or dirt. Anything to take the oxygen away from it. Even then just like a Magnesium fire it will still smolder until the fuel is burned up.
Note : 1. Don't wait until the battery runs out before char ging . Lithium batteries are not the same as ordinary batteries . Charging the batteries before using them is not conducive to the health of the lithium battery . Depleting the battery may cause it to fail to recharge 2. Don't put the lithium battery in a place with high temperature . The lithium battery prefers a place with a low temperature . 3. Summary of charging methods : short charging and short charging ( infrequently charging , but if you want to rush ! )
on the train platform to work a guy not far from me suddenly dropped his phone as dark smoke was gushing out of it...it didnt catch fire....imagine if this was on the train and it happened......not imagine if it was a e scooter, e skateboard on the platform or on a moving train...i see them on the trains and for some reason keep a close eye on them as even if not charging they could go up at anytime.....fingers crossed noe on my commute havent.....but TFL has banned them as they have had a couple catch fire.......
Be aware guys, this can happen to anyone. If you keep any E ride in your house make sure to test that your fire detectors are working properly and test weekly just to be safe.
I unloaded a lipo drone pack 1 time to deep and then tried to charge it again. I was home at the time it was charging and heard a small hissing (no smoke yet). I didn't trust it because I know these kind of batteries can be explosive. I unplugged it and laid it outside on a dumpster... about 2 minutes later, lots of smoke and the lipo burned a whole through the lid of the dumpster. I was lucky that time! Since then I store my lipos in a lipo bag in a military ammo box (steel).
Thanks for sharing your story. Glad to hear you're okay. Lipo bag and ammo box suddenly doesn't sound so drastic once something like that has happened to you.
The ebike community should take the experience of the electric RC aircraft and heli crowd into account. Lipo batteries have a similar chemistry to Li-ion, but are more fragile,and charging and treatment of Lipos is very similar to Li-ion. First rule is don't manhandle the batteries. Second rule is don't deplete the charge. Third rule is lower charging rates are best. Even as low as 1C. Fourth rule is that hot batteries are to be left to cool. And finally, if you can, charge in a Lipo bag. But even with the above, as was seen in my RC days, the problem is mostly NOT the batteries, but the chargers and the consumption management. In the RC world that was a function of the mind and experience of the pilot. In ebike etc, it's the BMS. Don't skimp on the quality.
Hang on a mo..... I thought private E scooters usage was illegal in UK? That aside, a very informative video on the possible hazards of battery fires. Personally I wish these things was allowed in the UK. I suffer with my knees and walking to and from work is a pain.....literally. Under normal circumstances my journey to work would be 10 minutes and I cant justify driving to work with the added expense of parking fees. An E scooter would be the next best thing to using a mobility scooter and Im quite not ready for the Madge mobile just yet.
Ok, so i have 2 m365's one for me, and one for my partner. I just got bought a new Max G30 for crimbo, but all are just sitting doing nothing because of legislation. We must of used them probably about 3 times Sadly!😖 For fear of getting them confiscated. I charge them up every couple of months, and they all seem ok. Now i am slightly concerned, the only place i could put them outside would be in a Keter lock up in the garden, or even in the shed, but i think this may cause them to gain some condensation. So i am still kinda worried as to were to store them for now?🤔 People who own ev's should be made aware of the dangers of these batteries, and should also look at storage & safety guides to familiarise themselves so as too avoid any potential fires. Thank you again EH! Keep doing what you do best!🛴😉✌️
Great to hear from you! Why not get them checked out at a reputable retailer and give them an MOT? That might help put your mind at ease ☺ If you live in London Personal Electric Transport would be happy to help.
Hi Folks. So glad everyone is OK. Good to have all this safety advice Did Mark fail to observe any of these suggestions? Do you know or suspect a cause for this fire?
Thanks Stephen. We can't be sure what caused it as we can't inspect post fire, but we have a suspicion it happened due to water ingress which led to corrosion.
It’s real simple. If you must use lithium ion make sure you have a quality charger and don’t charge entirely unsupervised. That’s the minimum. If you want to go a step further buy an adjustable charger and charge your battery to 80% or 90% and don’t let it get below 10%. Bonus: you will double the cycle life of the battery. If you ever find the battery has been over discharged (
The fact you said Li-ions are happiest around 30%-80%, suggested slower chargings, and gave the tip to keep batteries at 50% for long term storage made me so happy! I'm glad yall did research behind this video and made it to where any PEV owner can understand. Great video! :D
Thank you!! 😊
@@Electroheads Very helpful!
Also store them at low temps. A combo of full charge and high temps drains them a lot just while in storage. I always try to not charge mine beyond 80% except a few occasions I need max power. Never charge them close to freezing or below. Best temp to charge is 10C. There are special chemistry much more expensive batteries that can treat differently.
I have installed a RCD power socket with surge protection to use to charge my scooter with a time switch plugged in that will cut off well before bedtime just in case I forget to turn it off and it's left charging all night.
30%-80% then days are gone you just charge when you like your iPhone, charging technology for lithium ion batteries has come along way since them days unless it’s a cheap China crap 💩 you’re probably dealing with older technology so for that crap 30-80 probably best but approved brand and from a approved dealer nothing to worry about just charge when needed
The problem with many small EVs is that they have minimal thermal management. So, owners go out and use the device hard, heating the batts, then they come home and immediately charge them. This can exceed battery safe temps and off it goes.
Some manufacturers of smaller electric devices have worked this out. A good example is the 82V battery packs from Briggs & Stratton, used for garden tools, which have a charger that forces air through the battery pack while charging, and won't charge the batt until it is at a safe temp.
But, from what I've seen of most of these scooters, boards and e-bikes, they have simple chargers that may or may not connect to a temp sensor in the pack, or just rely on the pack sensor and pack BMS, which is often pretty rudimentary, to do the thermal control. Hence, boom, occasionally.
Add into that the fact that the batts and their BMS are subject to high G forces in general use, at least in things like scooters and boards where they are all unsprung weight, and it's easy to imagine fatigue faults in cells, cell links and PCBs, which would lead to excessive heating.
A properly designed pack would have multiple temp sensors and would disconnect the battery from input or output in the case of any temps outside of the safe range. But, that's too expensive to implement in small, cheap EVs, hence it generally isn't done.
Of course, the problem will largely go away if manufacturers shift to safer chemistries like LFP or even LTO.
You are a fountain of knowledge, thanks for sharing.
@@Electroheads They would never use LTO since the gravimetric engery density is too low for mobile appliances. The heat problem only occurs when too much current is drawn(put into) from each individual cell. A larger battery pack solves this because more cells in parallel share the load. And this is where companies are trying to save money. Knowing your battery is essential since they can be very dangerous.
lol these little things wont heat up enough they barely got any power
The problem is that there are " battery safe temps " over which "off it goes" under normal use. "Use the device hard"? What does that even mean? You're supposed to do calculations on your head and keep score how long you used to bike it and with what delay to recharge it, or it can explode? It's an immature technology then and shouldn't be sold in this state.
I dont think its heat stress which causes the "blow up" on cells, at least not regarding to your argument "warm batteries from direct use to the charger".
I have a 48V 10Ah and a 26Ah scooter, both are delivered with just a 2A charger (basic on most scooters). One needs about 5 hours, the other scooter 14 hours with a single and 7 hours with 2 chargers (2x2 = 4A).
So we talk about only 0,2C charging speed in case of my small battery scooter and even below 0,1C with a single charger and still below 0,2C when "fast charging" (0,15C calculated, VERY SLOW!) on the big 1,2kWh battery.
Also, just think about tool batteries... they are abused with 2-4C charging speed, thats why they need this extensive and mostly loud active cooling, anything up to 0,5C is very safe for LiIon batteries of any type, 1C is not good for them in general, but still safe. Above 1C is getting... into active cooling terretory for sure (EVs, tool batteries and their fast chargers,...)
Battery management needs to be taken to the next level to detect even the _slightest_ irregularities and physically disconnect the problem cell immediately and sound some sort of alarm to let the user know that they need to take precautions right now, like taking the scooter or whatever outside immediately. Hopefully, solid state batteries that we've been hearing about for many years will finally make their debut and squash the possibility of thermal runaway once and for all (in addition to their numerous other advantages).
@Shep VanDelay I imagine that they already use the thinnest wire necessary to carry the load while also being safe, but there must be SOME way to isolate a problem cell and disconnect while keeping the rest of the pack usable. The way most battery packs are made nowadays, unfortunately, don't lend themselves to having a single cell replaced in a feasible manner, but the pack could easily be recycled. Safety first, but after that, they need to find a way to make it economical too when there is a bad cell. Maybe a trade-in allowance on the current pack - with one or several bad cells - with a rebuilt or new replacement (if you're outside the warranty period).
@Shep VanDelay thermal runaway from overcharging will still happen with a thin wire, it's not from drawing too much power from the cell at once, but from pushing too much into it, slowly, it's an internal failure, a fuse wire will prevent a fire from a short though, but charging fires are from bad BMS's that don't cut the charge above a certain cell voltage.
that's the dumbest idea ever. great way to faceplant, disconnect the battery while riding. the only thing keeping you upright
@Shep VanDelay it cant balance without power you knucklehead
have you got any smarter in the last year @@Blox117
Hi all! Thanks for the comments. Many are asking what happened to Kol's skateboard that led to its explosion. We can't be totally sure as we weren't able to inspect. We have a suspicion it was water ingress from riding in heavy rain. Water got through the shrink wrap, the cells got wet and as they dried they corroded and the rest is history. Like I say we can't be sure, but that's our hunch.
You guys need some lipsol everyone's got dry lips bless you guys
Or a damaged charging port from user error, water, wrong plug... etc... imagine an hot exhaust causing a fire do you see that on the news do you see that article on the news 24/7 do you have a camera in the engine bay just ready for it ????
I don’t mean to be argumentative, but in comparing conventional vehicle fires to EV fires , you have to put the numbers in context , there are near 2 billion vehicles on the road and most are internal combustion engines , the number of EV powered vehicles would be a mere fraction of that number , just saying.
@@mikldude9376 your phone, e-cigarettes your lap top and tablets all have lithium ion batteries many more items than that. With all that considered there will be far more items than vehicles with petrol/diesel engines. It really is minimal risk
@@Scooot1972 well if you really want to throw everything into the mix , there are billions upon billions of small engines , larger engines, heavy machinery , trucks, ships , etc , there truly is no comparison , internal combustion engines have been working since the late 1800’s , all these new battery toys have only been popular for a fraction of the time.
I'm so happy that people are putting on these kinds of videos. I had an electric e-bike that I built myself but used a kit from eBay with a 48 volt battery pack. At the time I had no idea that lithium batterys were dangerous. Needless to say one day I had it in my office with my three kids at home and my wife was taking a shower it started hissing and exploded shooting flames all the way to the ceiling we had about a minute or less to get out of the house before it was totally engulfed. I drug my three kids out yelled at my wife to get out I did not have time to even grab the fire extinguisher. It was a rather large battery in the flames sounded like a jet engine with a ton of white smoke which the air conditioning unit picked up and spread throughout the whole house so we cannot see to get out after about 20 seconds. After we finally got out and we're standing across the street in the park while the fireman were coming the rest of the battery exploded and caught a few spray oxygen cans that I had for cleaning out my computer in my office which in turn made a bomb like explosion blew the doors off of the house all this happened within about a minute and a half if we have been sleeping and it happened we would have not made it out in time good thing we were just preparing for bed and we're all awake house was a total loss and everything in it we did not even have time to grab our cell phones. A kind homeless guy in the park called the fire station for us just be very careful and I would even say if you're going to charge electric bikes battery maybe for one don't buy it off eBay for two charge it in the middle toolbox like case that latches shut it will keep the flames down at least enough for you to get out of the house!!! Just be careful batteries from China. I now have a lawsuit going with both Samsung and the assembly factory in China who knows if that would yield anything. I have not been scared off by it though I have another electric bike but by a company that assembles the batteries here in the United States and also pots the batteries which is like in case them in a hard resin that's clear and about an inch thick all the way around it makes the battery heavy but it's much safer no water in ingress it cant be damaged from crashes or shocks. Luna cycles out of California has been super helpful if anyone wants a bike I think that would be the best safest place to get your batteries from.
I am so sorry to hear this happened to you and best of luck with the law suit ❤️
So you work for Luna cycles?
holy moly 😟
13:35 Once you've completed your trip, best to let the battery "catch its [electronic] breath" - wait for 15-20 minutes, then commence charging (trickle charge is always best).
I love this particular video's content. I have a darn scooter sitting in my living room. It's new as of in December, but in my second ride out I went off it quite hard. I thought I had busted a hip and some ribs ... nothing was broken, but I have been really incapacitated with soft tissue damage. I'm able to walk now, but there is still a lot of pain. Anyway I now know that my unit should not be sitting by my front door and in the middle of my garage next to nothing flammable. Cheers.
Hope you heal up soon 🙏🏼
@@Electroheads Cheers. Yes, certainly on the mend!
There is always a chance any battery operated device might catch fire, don t stick it in sensitive areas and remain" Decent"
Right on!
I see what you did there! 🤣
Glad Electroheads came out safe! Don't let the internet trolls and self-proclaimed "experts" get to you! Your survival extincts kicked in you tried your best in the moment to contain the fire to keep you and your environment safe! also I subbed for those lovely accents
Leave you cellphone outside then DONT keep it inside
@@1littlelee Well, sometimes you need to know if your" Phone" still works
One thing I think is worth adding is buy a timer that will cut power to your charger , so you can say it will take 7 hr to charge to 100 percent sat it for 6 hr and if you forget about it for two days it's all good .
Thanks so much for watching! Make sure to watch all the way through as there's lots of key info in here. And don't forget to share with your friends, family, colleagues - whoever needs to see this! Ride safe.
This is not new you know.. + you dont find videos like this for a good reason.. because there are only a few cases. What about your phone? What about your laptop(if you have one) what about your tv? Its not just electric scooters.
Cops didn't like stake boards back when they first came out..... and roller skates etc......
Great video guys. Lots of helpful info in here. Sorry to hear that people were being unkind. What you do is fantastic and much appreciated. Keep em’ coming.
Thanks so much, Robin! Appreciate all your support.
54 electric vehicle fires in one year in one city, in 2019, when they were a minority of vehicles doesn't sound that rare.
A city with a population of 9.4 million people which has the highest number of all types of ev vehicles in the country. How many fires were caused by electrical goods like washing machines, tumble dryers, dishwashers, TV’s, mobile phones, or faulty house wiring? A petrol car has a lot of possible causes of fire, fuel tank, leaks in the high pressure fuel systems used on modern fuel injection systems, wiring faults, electric motors that power the air con, windows or starter motor. All it need is some common sense in charging, use and storage to mitigate any danger as well as good maintenance .
Interesting about the EV fires relative to those in ICE vehicles. However, the absolute numbers don't tell us much as there are far fewer EVs to ICE vehicles. We'd need to know the relative percentages of ICE vehicle relative to EV fires for it to give us an idea of the risks.
I think you’ll find that London has the greatest density of ev’s of all kinds in the country and yet there were only 54 attendances by the London fire brigade to ev fires.
Evs have less chance to catch fire you dont need to do a lot of research just to know wich one its more dangerous..
@@sergentcolon1 old cars are easier to steal, most older cars are ICE and they end up burnt hence the stats. How many un-stolen new car fires do the fire brigade attend? LOL
David Samways these clowns are EV religious, they want to believe, so they do.
@@badcampa2641 did you see on the news in the last few days the 3 year old Range Rover that caught fire and also set fire to the owners house? The only clown here chummy is you and you’re a sad clown at that.
It is also essential NOT to charge that battery below zero degrees centigrade. Once you have done this, it can seed a dendrite and the battery can still work for maybe 100 charges but that dendrite grows each time it is charged even if it is charged at the correct temperature. Once the dendrite cuts through the separator within the battery, it causes an internal short and thermal runaway.
It's easy to collate all these isolated incidents together and give the distorted impression it is common and very dangerous..in reality it isn't the reality. Escooters should be kept when charging in an outhouse or conservatory area and not left alone. But it's rare they go wrong...don't over charge them or leave them plugged in when fully charged. But most modern controllers will turn the current off
I’d really like to buy a scooter but the fire issue is concerning especially for people that live in rentals and not their own homes, where other people’s safety is important. Anyone have suggestions on some of the best, not necessarily most popular, escooter companies that have consistently good reviews and good long term quality? Thanks in advance!
"A lithium iron battery is much safer than a tank of petrol".........until it's alight, at which point petrol can be extinguished and remain extinguished. Also, perhaps you could produce statistics that show how many petrol vehicles catch fire when switched off and stationary, and also how many ICE vehicles catch fire in the home or in a garage.
When I purchased my electric bicycle, I also had the sense to purchase a lithium fire extinguisher. I do think that the fire extinguisher should be a mandatory purchase. Though it's a whole different ball game with regards to an electric car because of the size of the battery . As yet I've not purchased an electric car.
I dont think you shold get close to a burning ev car,let the fire department handle it
@Annie’s approximately how much did extinguisher cost? Thanks
NO excuse(s) for not have adequate/sufficient fire/smoke detectors, fire blankets, fire extinguishers, first-aid kits etc. AND A PLAN in your home! Electrons are DANGEROUS!
My charger kills all power to the power supply when fully charged - After 2 years haven't had a single problem 😊
Charge the battery outside in the baraque with the lid on . Safty first .
Stop beating the crap out of it
Brilliant video ,thank you for informing the public of the danger of the fire hazard 👍 It could save lives
Technically it's not a explosion. Thermal runaway is probably better terminology.
Best way to deal with those large batteries is to either take away oxygen or take away heat and then shred them to make safe, then recycle. This should be done in place before transporting. Vehicle crash recovery people are going to have to learn some new skills.
Also there was no detonation.
I'm no expert but I would think that generally you should be able to walk calmly to safety if you notice your batteries are getting a little too warm. I'd recommend running like F...! if your fossil fuel or hydrogen fuel is looking a little too warm.
The word " Explosion " sells news and creates a more negative environment.
Thermal runaway that means using IQ to work out what it means aka less news worthy....
Great video....I myself have an E-Scooter and an E-Bike. With the E-Scooter, I try not to ride it during the winter and rainy days so its good that I do this!!!
Great video guys. We need some focussed accurate info like this for all PEV riders.
The reason those comments said no water on electrical fires is because of electrical shock. Which you wouldn't have in a battery fire.
Good call, I've bought a second-hand electric off road skate board so I am off to the shed to take that skate board apart to examine the battery pack and put it outside in the dry. Just in case guys!! Just open the thing up and sure enough evidence of water ingress so disconnect the battery and place it in a 2nd hand log burner safest place I could think of outside!! Also checked my DJI battery packets and one is dead the other is taking a charge but it outside charging just in case.
6:55, now do the math percentage wise and it is actually very different. Once electric vehicles reach petrol/diesel numbers you will see fires in electric vehicles are outnumbering them vastly. The cause of fire in petrol or diesel cars is also quite often the electrical system. We should not play down the numbers in any case!
There was a study on car fires done by an insurance company (autoinsuranceEZ) in the US which looked at the frequency of fires per 100,000 vehicles on the road. The findings were that hybrids had the most frequent fires at 3,474.5 per 100,000 followed by ICE at 1,529.9 per 100,000 followed by BEV at 25.1 per 100,000. Another study (this time performed by the National Fire Protection Association) examined fire frequencies per miles driven and found that between 2012-2021 there was 1 tesla fire per 210 million miles driven compared to 1 fire per 19 million miles driven for all vehicles put together.
@@RigelBerg All good and well, but the problem is there is no good system in place to properly deal with a thermal runaway. Technically EV's don't have fires, but thermal runaway, which is impossible to put out and the collateral damage can be vastly larger, as in human life. These things, no matter how rare are of the likes that would make satan himself scared, with flames shooting from it of several feet with the violence of a blowtorch and respective heat pattern. Petrol, no matter how volatile is a known type of fire hazard, and we know how to deal with it, and we have proper safety regulations in place, where EV's somehow get a free pass, probably because they are so called green.
@@vincenzodigrande2070
Great comment 👍👍👍
Congratulations👍
@@RigelBerg
The problem with ICE numbers are most of the fires are arsening (pure vandalism, insurance fraud, and the likes. In France they've reached 1000 every night, all nights).
And a lot are from older cars (no proper maintainance, because of economical dificulties or pure careless attitude, and even "mods" not well done).
Newer cars can get on fire after a crash (been there as a firefighter) but it takes seconds to minutes to take it out.
Even you can do it with a good fire extinguisher.
BEVs not so:
Takes hours and they can "be back" even months after....
The worst problem are fumes/droplets of cobalt, for instance, that will desable you for life...(happen to two firefigthers in USA, because they didn't know what was burning)
If you see a BEV fire , run away (you have 5 seconds) and stay far , and upwind, or you can be severely afected....
Don't say I didn't warn you...
I haven't even talked about the prevalence of car fires per vehicle age. Apparently it shoots up drastically when the age surpasses 10 years, and the EV fleet barely does represent that age yet. Then the cause of car fires, about 33% is arson. When you pair that with thermal runaway, and the likely hood of an arsonist chosing an EV, it is not hard to understand this will be a very big problem in the 'green' future that our politicians like to portray.
First rule of doing anything online is you're always "doing it wrong" and apparently things like split second decisions and adrenaline aren't even a consideration.
That said, keep things like phones and discarded batters off surfaces that could easily go up in flame or stoke a fire. I'd keep my scooter in a concreted area like a shed where ever possible.
My wife and I where actually shopping for 2 scooters for us to have so we could make short fast trip down to the lake about 3 -4 miles away to go fishing I'm so glad I watched this before we had a house fire
A few years ago my first ebike, stored downstairs, burst into flames one evening. It was during New Years eve and I actually heard the fire begin, only I thought it was a nearby firework. It was only when the smoke alarm triggered that I investigated with powder fire extinguisher in hand. In my case it wasn't a faulty battery pack but instead faulty wiring on the hub-based motor; the motor section was on fire, but the battery pack wasn't. Apparently there was a connection that came loose over time and ultimately caused the battery to dump a massive current into the motor, enough to cause the non-metal materials to ignite. I disconnected the battery pack and kept it outside, but had no rumblings from it since the pack wasn't damaged.
So the cautionary tale here is that it's not only the battery pack that can betray you and it's worth investing not only in reliably sourced equipment, i.e. not the shonky Chinesium products, but also to have them regularly serviced to try and pick up on other electrical points of failure.
Really interesting, thank you for sharing!
Also if you use your e- scooter on heavy rain.. especially if we are talking about e-skateboards..yeah its not hard to understand why
Interesting video, would be useful to compare the BEV fires to ICE fires in 2019 to actual vehicles on the road to get a realistic view on the risk. Obviously there are many more ICE vehicles on the road vs BEV.
Also to add I'm pretty sure batteries aren't submerged in water to prevent oxygen getting to them - just to keep them cool.
There was a study on car fires done by an insurance company (autoinsuranceEZ) in the US which looked at the frequency of fires per 100,000 vehicles on the road. The findings were that hybrids had the most frequent fires at 3,474.5 per 100,000 followed by ICE at 1,529.9 per 100,000 followed by BEV at 25.1 per 100,000. Another study (this time performed by the National Fire Protection Association) examined fire frequencies per miles driven and found that between 2012-2021 there was 1 tesla fire per 210 million miles driven compared to 1 fire per 19 million miles driven for all vehicles put together.
We need to be fast in establishing safety regulations for personal/light EV's like scooters. We can't allow import of poorly made and unsafe EVs.
If we can also invent a cheap indoor "scooter-container" that allows it to burn out without lighting its' environment on fire, that could prevent a lot of damage, injury and death as EV's become more common.
Imagine having an EV Car with 1000 more energy under your house in the garage :-0
Never never never park you EV car under your house
Was his e-skateboard from a reputable company?
This is easily the most important and useful video I have viewed this year. Everyone who owns an eride should be shown this. The problem is that 90% of people will not follow any of this advice, because it requires them to think. Electrical devices are considered "dead" you fill them with electricity as fast as possible, you thrash them around in all conditions, you return home and charge it as fast as possible to 100% every night in the lobby of your flat next to the front door, soaking wet and after bumping it on a kerb, the only smoke alarm is in the kitchen. Can you imagine the average eScooter owner regulating their charging to those safe limits, slow charging, smoke alarms, entrance blocking, it will all happen. Your cheap Chinese knock-off escooter bought on Ebay will have had no checks or ever be checked in its lifetime. So many sScooter riders I see are teenagers of around 14, they have no clue about anything and will certainly ride it home in the pouring rain, pay no attention to any maintenance issues and if they live in a block of flats- guess what? This is a disaster like Grenfell, waiting to happen. These Erides need regulating and owners need to pass a maintenance/charging test to own one. They should have legally required registration, insurance and some form of registration number. Thank you Eilis for this strong and sensitive statement of vital importance to everyone.
I’m 14 and I’m really experienced with lithium batteries no not what you learn at school you can ask me a lot of questions and I’ll 95% chance probably have the correct answer i admit I don’t know all things about lithium batteries but I know way more then the average adult about lithium I can’t even watch this it’s sad how a very small percentage of people know about lithium batteries safety.
I would discharge to 3.5V per cell, to store the scooter for winter.
Brilliant video 😎
My son had an electric bike,
I took his battery off the bike and set it on the kitchen worktop and plugged it in, then switched the charger on, it had Panasonic cells,
I was cooking bacon and eggs 😀
There was a crackling noise, and I didn't know where was it was coming from,
Then the battery started behaving like a flare and filled the kitchen with smoke,
I picked it up and ran outside and threw it on the lawn,
It continue to flare for at least 10 minutes, I was so scared it was like carrying a bomb that was just about to blow up,
The company that supplied it didn't give him any warranty they said he must have done something wrong 🙄
I wonder what would have happened if I wasn't in the house, son was asleep upstairs with my 🐕 😰
You were charging a battery on a hot stovetop. Genius.
So the moral of the story is:
1) Don't buy cheap Chinese scooters, e-bikes, etc. with cheap batteries. Only buy from reputable Brands and dealers
2) Don't get your battery system/wires wet
3) Don't push machine past it's limits
4) Don't constantly charge your batteries to full
Don't charge battery soon after use
I had a cell phone do this on my desk during a battery repair. While the smell and flame was horrible and bright, the heat wasn't even enough to light a piece of cardboard.
i was in bed the other night and my vibrator went up.
storage charging and balance charging are two important battery care tips everyone should know
Seems like lithium batteries are now more dangerous than lipo batteries. With lipo you need to take more care and be more cautious. Plus you can disconnect it so as long as they disconnected and kept at proper storage level charge.
its a shame that there are so little products like fire blankets made for electric vehicles like scooters, skateboard and etc, to help prevent or help you out to fight these fire
There should be a huge focus on making that type of products more available we live in a age where there are electric personal vehicles everywhere so its not like its unkown
I'm sorry but my understanding is that once a battery goes into runaway it's an exothermic reaction. The burning battery produces its own oxygen. so dunking in water does not deprive it of oxygen to continue to burn.
What a large body of water may do is to cool down the cells so they don't all go into thermal runaway.
Where did Kol get his skateboard and what kind of battery cells did it use?
I called my insurance company I have my home and auto policy with about getting a Gazelle top tier e-bike. I told them it was UL approved. They said "NO E-BIKES". My house burns down I'm shit out of luck.
I got a m365 second hand. Works perfectly but I'm sure I can hear a loose screw inside flying about. Should I take it for a checkup?
Can anyone please link me a place where i can buy a fireproof bag big enough to store an ebike battery inside. After seing this video and others like it, ive decided that just to be on the safe side ill no longer be leaving the battery on my bike when not in use, instead storing it in the fireproof bag instead. Or in other words; youve scared the shit out of me!
Good stuff . Thank you for debunking some myths
Worth mentioning that LFP (lithium iron phosphate) chemistry is slowly taking over from Lithium turnary chemistry. LFP is a lot safer than the older turnary chemistries and much less likely to suffer thermal runaway especially when fully charged to 100%.
This chemistry is also way better for consumer batteries as it contains no cobalt and can be cycled many more times than lithium turnary cells, up to 5,000 cycles while still maintaining over 80% capacity.
This battery technology is slowly taking over from the older less safe turnary chemistries.
To those who say not to extinguish them with water should read up before they say anything. Lithium battery should be lowered in water
I store Chinese Engwe P26 ebike in the living room... There's no way I leave it in the common garage for the whole apartment block... Locked bicycles are being stolen from there... But I hope, there is no risk, since the battery is QC passed, right?
Kol I am glad you reacted quick and are ok.
Nobleman Tech are making dedicated fire-resistant charging bags for electric skateboards;
in future, likely making ones for EUC's and E-scooters too I reckon.
That’s awesome to hear 🙏🏼
The water ingress point in the video water can collect in ur sealed waterproof battery with a metal shell as well if u go out when its cold and return to ur warm apartment when u get inside all the cold metal instantly warms up and u start to see condensation same as when u go from cold into a warm house with glasses and they fog up
Charging Suggestion to put the Charger on a small plate... Coffee Cup Saucer Type... Absorbs the Heat!... Watch the time check every 1/2 hour... Don't charge a HOT Battery!...
Great video. I've been riding electric scooters 5 years. I was talking to my neighbor today about batteries for the scooter and for e-bikes and we want to know how much temperature plays in the health of a battery. For example is it okay to store a scooter or e-bike outside or in an enclosed shed in the winter? And what about Extreme Hot temperatures in the summer? My scooter battery cannot be removed so I would like to know what is the best way or place to store my scooter when it's not being used. Thank you.
since weather is uncontrollable, me personally i just switch the main breaker off on my scooter, Dualtrons have dat breaker off / on switch under the deck not sure to other scooters
@@elliotalderson9945 in the winter I've been taking my scooter inside my house when I'm not using it because I thought that the cold is bad for battery. But it's a pain in the butt getting it up and down the steps. I have an SXT Ultimate Pro Plus and it's very heavy. In the Spring and Summer and Autumn I leave my scooter in the shed which doesn't get very hot. So this is why I'm asking my question. I hope somebody can give me an answer about storage temperatures. Thank you.
My Varla Pegasus just went up in flames yesterday while charging!!! All stock parts never modified at all!! There are threads online about cheaper cells being used for the newer model.
seemingly no mention in the video that other battery technology exists like LFP that does not pose the same thermal runaway problems LCO/NMC/NCA has. the issue is not lithium but cobalt. the cobalt allows the fire to self-sustain when battery packs fail. LFP doesnt have as good of a energy density but its not terrible either.
cobalt-based Li-ion tech imo, should have more regulation. for small devices like your phone its fine, there is not much cobalt to sustain a fire, but when we start to look at EVs and LEVs there needs to be compartmentalization and precision temperature monitoring to try limit these fires, its insane we currently allow these batteries to be packed so densely when we know only one cell needs to fail for the whole pack to ignite. and if manufacturers cant come up with a good way to isolate large packs into smaller ones then they should not be allowed to use this battery chemistry.
London Fire Brigade stats:
EV fires: 54
Gas & petrol fires: 1898
So there's 35 times more gas and petrol fires. How many EVs are there compared to gas & petrol vehicles?
Vehicles in London:
13956 EVs (2020)
2600000 cars total (2020)
Using just total cars (excluding trucks and motorbikes), there are 186 petrol & diesel cars for every 1 EV. 186/35 = 5.3. EVs are at least 5.3 times more dangerous than gas & diesel vehicles.
There was a study on car fires done by an insurance company (autoinsuranceEZ) in the US which looked at the frequency of fires per 100,000 vehicles on the road. The findings were that hybrids had the most frequent fires at 3,474.5 per 100,000 followed by ICE at 1,529.9 per 100,000 followed by BEV at 25.1 per 100,000. Another study (this time performed by the National Fire Protection Association) examined fire frequencies per miles driven and found that between 2012-2021 there was 1 tesla fire per 210 million miles driven compared to 1 fire per 19 million miles driven for all vehicles put together.
This can happen to a laptop, this can happen to your mobile phone, this can happen to your e cig ,cheap batteries, damaged, batteries, if you regularly keep a check on your battery and don't try and modify, you are controlled by the net and fear
I like how people are so quick to be toxic without thinking twice when he had no knowledge to not put water on that battery
Does the stat comparing electric car vs petroleum/diesel fires take into account the number of said cars?
Surely this is more useful if it was presented as a percentage?
I'm wondering about how many lithium battery packs for portable equipment like power drills, weed whackers, leaf blowers, etc. have burst into flames? I would speculate that they get more abuse by being dropped into tool chests and such. Plus they tend to come with what are advertised as quick chargers.
So amazing to see this information, when I was going to buy a second hand Veteran Sherman I ring PET in matter to get the EUC checked and they laughed in my face, like a EUC you use till some defect shows up then you most look for service or a periodic check.
I am pretty sure PET did not 'laugh in your face...'! You want to elaborate?
How do you slow charge?
Submerging a lithium ion battery in water will not put it out if the casing is compromised. If the water hits the contents it is converted into Oxygen and Hydrogen and thus the now available oxygen will feed the fire again.
The video is contradictory, in that the male host never admits to doing any of the "bad" things they say not to do. Why did his blow up? What did he do? Or admit it isn't infinitesimal.
Hey! We can't be sure what caused it as we can't inspect post fire, but we have a suspicion it happened due to water ingress which led to corrosion.
3. Summary of charging methods : short charging and short charging ( infrequently charging , but if you want to rush ! )
4.It is the time to charge when the power drops to 10 % 20 % 5.Use high - quality dedicated lithium battery charger with protection function
5. In low - temperature weather , the use time of the lithium battery will be significantly shortened . This is normal , and it will be restored in about 1 hour in a warm place
7:50 The connection between the batteries are Nickel. They cannot rust!! How does he not know this?
Cheap nickel strip isn't 100% nickel, it's nickel coated steel, which most definitely can rust. Even expensive laptops batteries use nickel over steel, and can corrode enough to cause localised heating of the interconnect, and start a fire.
@GeeKIller Yep, a lot of issues can be traced back to shady Chinese quality. Unfortunately when people talk about this it feels like it's blasphemy to blame the glorious People's Republic of China, and therefore we blame electric vehicles in general instead and the misinformation is being spread.
@GeeKIller It's not just the batteries themselves, it's the entire assembly line that is untrustworthy as there are no real regulations and no safety priority. Don't back down, you mentioned China because China is where most garbage comes from as it's there most stuff are produced unfortunately, and it's corrupt to the core. Sure there might be better companies there that care more (not enough), but that's a rare sight and most often it's because they have had bad lemons before.
Thanks for the extremely sound advice!
I do find myself wondering, however, whether any of the red flags you mention apply to this particular scooter. It’d make me easier in my mind to know that the scooter featured in this video didn’t catch fire on a whim.
Dude did the right thing. First off. That board that blew into flames was a Backfire board. 12s2p battery. Stay away from that company. I didn't have a blow out with my board. But it still has a major issue with the battery. I am going to trash the battery. I don't need this thing exploding or burning my place.
Water is the only quick way to kill flame. Just takes a crap load of water.
Grab the nearest metal garbage can and flip it over the lithium fire!!! That is only to stop the spread of the fire... The battery produces its own oxygen is why this fire is hard to put out!!!
eScooter manufacturers tend to advise keep the scooters indoors (to prevent corrosion) - ok, fine. BUT - insofar as I'm aware, all it takes is one - one - cobalt electron to sneak past the [graphite] divider/insulator in the battery in an uncontrolled away and team up with Mr. Lithium => BAD! So, I keep mine in the kitchen 'workspace' and also invested in 4 extra smoke detectors (remember, hardware fails, batteries die, bad stuff happens, so only having one smoke detector [downstairs?] never makes sense to me) plus extra general-purpose fire extinguishers and also have a plan - "In the event of ..... what will we do?). Perfect system? Far from - but it's the best I can think of.
Also, I recently purchased a Decent One Max (removable battery - branded as Turboant X7 in America I think) - it didn't power up when I started my static tests (it being supported off-floor via 2 axle stands [thank you Lidl]), so charged the battery (took @ 15-20 minutes to go green). However, on doing speed-mode tests, it died - completely - during speed-mode 3. What would have happened if myself (or anyone else) was actually onroad at 15.5mph and the (front wheel) motor just died? Stopped dead? Bottom line - once you remove your scooter from the box, support it and test it. Test it. Test it again. 'Nuff said.
I have an emove cruiser. Can you tell me if its at the safer end of the scale or the worse please? I live in a first floor flat and have no choice but to keep it and charge it in doors.
On some aspects it is good and some really bad. There's too many cells so no way you can overheat it by forcing it uphill.
They advertise the Cruiser as watertight, however this is completely false, it is extremely easy for water to get inside the cruiser battery. Also the bms module (battery management system)is totally junk, the cheapest chinese could find on the shelf
@@slick1908 l just want to get out and ride it.
The comparison between electric vehicles and gasoline/diesel vehicles wasn’t fair. Because electric vehicles self-ignite, where gas or diesel vehicles only ignite in an accidents.
‘A lithium ion battery is much safer than a tank of petrol’ - I have to disagree. How many times have you heard of a petrol car catching fire while parked and switched off or even while being refuelled/driven, versus all the reports of EV’s (including e-bikes and scooters) randomly catching fire in people’s homes/garages or while being charged/ridden?
An addition. If the goal is safety, avoid lithium ion altogether. Look for LiFePO4 battery chemistry packs. These weight ~20% more for the same capacity, but has much less chance of catastrophic failure (and also has a 4x longer usable lifetime).
Makes sense. However it as not mentioned in this video as many other videos available online as they desperately try not to spoil the shaky narrative of lithium ion batteries around safety
@@nicolagianaroli2024 tin foil hat off for a moment... many people simply don't know LiFePo. Easy as that and you should seek help for that paranoia.
Prevent electrical fires and battery explosions; build a gas motorized bicycle. If you have an electric vehicle ( be it a bike, scooter, skateboard), in Northern California (fire land), your home insurance goes up...
UL listed for people in America..
If it's not UL listed its dangerous...
Seen a guy touch the terminals on a brand new disconnected capacitor, and get thrown to the floor once. Electricity is no joke.
Most informative yet you never discuss the events (the ways it was charged) leading to his fire. Was it hot and after a ride that he pulled it up? Was it charging when it caught fire?
Thanks Steve! The board wasn't charging at the time. We have a suspicion it happened due to water ingress that led to corrosion.
Water ingress... a water seal had been disrupted/tamper with... or if self built as a kit built wrong.
More than half of fires at recycling facilities are caused by lithium ion batteries that are not properly disposed. Usually an AA or AAA battery.
I have gone over the lithium battery technology and find that we have different companies making these and different chemistries of lithium. Generally, the newer ones are safer. Any product catching fire like that, if reported, would result in a safety recall focused on a brand and a model…A newer type is LiFePO4, lithium iron and is not a fire hazard. The new Tesla batteries are safer, for example. Good batteries have circuitry to trip them if they overheat.
A full tank of petrol is much safer than a half tank of petrol. Liquid petrol does not burn, it only burns when it vaporizes. Diesel is far safer still.
I think all social media should have option to turn off comments. Too much hate has been created and perpetuated by them.
If it's Lithium or Lithium base or like most rechargeables.. Beware !
Here you go, in plain English
Lithium batteries are regulated as a hazardous material under the U.S. Department of Transportation's (DOT) Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMR; 49 C.F.R., Parts 171-180).
Exposure to Lithium can cause loss of appetite, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea and abdominal pain. ► Lithium can cause headache, muscle weakness, twitching, blurred vision, loss of coordination, tremors, confusion, seizures and coma.
This isn't for me or my family.
Good luck, with your so called .. clean energy !
Do not put water on a battery fire. Smother it with backing soda or dirt. Anything to take the oxygen away from it. Even then just like a Magnesium fire it will still smolder until the fuel is burned up.
I would love one but not bothering due to fire risk.
Note
: 1. Don't wait until the battery runs out before char ging . Lithium batteries are not the same as ordinary batteries . Charging the batteries before using them is not conducive to the health of the lithium battery . Depleting the battery may cause it to fail to recharge
2. Don't put the lithium battery in a place with high temperature . The lithium battery prefers a place with a low temperature .
3. Summary of charging methods : short charging and short charging ( infrequently charging , but if you want to rush ! )
It is absolutely better to wait until the day of your next ride to charge the battery providing it is not below 50% when you store it.
on the train platform to work a guy not far from me suddenly dropped his phone as dark smoke was gushing out of it...it didnt catch fire....imagine if this was on the train and it happened......not imagine if it was a e scooter, e skateboard on the platform or on a moving train...i see them on the trains and for some reason keep a close eye on them as even if not charging they could go up at anytime.....fingers crossed noe on my commute havent.....but TFL has banned them as they have had a couple catch fire.......
Be aware guys, this can happen to anyone. If you keep any E ride in your house make sure to test that your fire detectors are working properly and test weekly just to be safe.
I unloaded a lipo drone pack 1 time to deep and then tried to charge it again. I was home at the time it was charging and heard a small hissing (no smoke yet). I didn't trust it because I know these kind of batteries can be explosive. I unplugged it and laid it outside on a dumpster... about 2 minutes later, lots of smoke and the lipo burned a whole through the lid of the dumpster. I was lucky that time! Since then I store my lipos in a lipo bag in a military ammo box (steel).
Thanks for sharing your story. Glad to hear you're okay. Lipo bag and ammo box suddenly doesn't sound so drastic once something like that has happened to you.
The ebike community should take the experience of the electric RC aircraft and heli crowd into account. Lipo batteries have a similar chemistry to Li-ion, but are more fragile,and charging and treatment of Lipos is very similar to Li-ion. First rule is don't manhandle the batteries. Second rule is don't deplete the charge. Third rule is lower charging rates are best. Even as low as 1C. Fourth rule is that hot batteries are to be left to cool. And finally, if you can, charge in a Lipo bag.
But even with the above, as was seen in my RC days, the problem is mostly NOT the batteries, but the chargers and the consumption management. In the RC world that was a function of the mind and experience of the pilot. In ebike etc, it's the BMS.
Don't skimp on the quality.
Hang on a mo..... I thought private E scooters usage was illegal in UK? That aside, a very informative video on the possible hazards of battery fires. Personally I wish these things was allowed in the UK. I suffer with my knees and walking to and from work is a pain.....literally. Under normal circumstances my journey to work would be 10 minutes and I cant justify driving to work with the added expense of parking fees. An E scooter would be the next best thing to using a mobility scooter and Im quite not ready for the Madge mobile just yet.
Ok, so i have 2 m365's one for me, and one for my partner. I just got bought a new Max G30 for crimbo, but all are just sitting doing nothing because of legislation. We must of used them probably about 3 times Sadly!😖 For fear of getting them confiscated. I charge them up every couple of months, and they all seem ok. Now i am slightly concerned, the only place i could put them outside would be in a Keter lock up in the garden, or even in the shed, but i think this may cause them to gain some condensation. So i am still kinda worried as to were to store them for now?🤔 People who own ev's should be made aware of the dangers of these batteries, and should also look at storage & safety guides to familiarise themselves so as too avoid any potential fires. Thank you again EH! Keep doing what you do best!🛴😉✌️
Great to hear from you! Why not get them checked out at a reputable retailer and give them an MOT? That might help put your mind at ease ☺ If you live in London Personal Electric Transport would be happy to help.
I haven't used or charged my scooter in over a year. Can it still catch fire???
Hi Folks.
So glad everyone is OK.
Good to have all this safety advice
Did Mark fail to observe any of these suggestions?
Do you know or suspect a cause for this fire?
Thanks Stephen. We can't be sure what caused it as we can't inspect post fire, but we have a suspicion it happened due to water ingress which led to corrosion.
I'm curious to know how they had to extinguish diesel fires when diesel is only flammable under pressure.