Magnus did nothing wrong. Well; besides ruining the Imperial Webway project, cause daemons to nearly invade Holy Terra and turning to Chaos. 😢 Then no, he didn't do anything wrong!! 😂😂
Whether or not he "did wrong," Magnus gets *way* more shit than he deserves. He was from the beginning a fundamentally good dude who only ever wanted the best for humanity and for his Legion. Let's run down some basic facts: - Magnus required and encouraged his sons to pursue peacetime arts as well; Ahriman, for example, grew grapes and made wine. To my knowledge, the Ultramarines are the only other Legion who mandated this sort of thing. - Magnus also mandated that each member of the Thousand Sons spend time attached to a different Legion, to learn from them. This shows a startling humility that stands in stark contrast to the arrogance that everyone always loves to accuse him of. - Magnus was personal friends with like half the Primarchs, loyalist and traitor. In particular he was drawn to fellow outcasts like Lorgar, or loners like the Khan. Sanguinius (who everyone acknowledges as the best boy) loved him, and stood by him at Nikaea. Vulkan also was a very close friend of his. - Magnus was the only Primarch, *on either side,* to ever seriously attempt a non-violent solution to the Heresy (by projecting himself into Horus' mind to try to save him from Chaos). - As far as his biggest mistake goes, breaking the wards around the Webway project, everyone always seems to forget that he encountered *the same kind of barrier* when he tried to warn Horus (specified in False Gods). It was perfectly reasonable of him to assume that these barriers were created by the enemy to try to stop him from delivering his messages. The being that he accepted help from in breaking the barrier was the same being who "saved" his Legion from the flesh-change. Ultimately he was manipulated into making this mistake, but when viewed from his perspective, it's more reasonable than it seems. - He was so loyal to the Imperium that, at least in theory, he was willing to sacrifice his own Legion to avoid weakening the Space Wolves for the war to come. Tzeentch offered to destroy the fleet before it reached Prospero, but Magnus said no. Let me re-iterate that; he was willing to save *his own executioners* for the good of the Imperium. It was only when he was confronted with the reality of his planet destroyed and his sons butchered that his will broke and he came down to fight. - He literally had to be browbeaten by Lorgar into joining the war, and basically only did so because it was the only way for his Legion to survive. - During the Siege of Terra, while infiltrating the Imperial Palace, he blew his own cover and risked detection in order to save a bunch of Imperial civilians from a phosphex bomb. Again; he *risked jeopardizing his mission* to *save "enemy" civilians.* Ask yourself how many of the other Primarchs had that kind of respect for human life. - During his fight with Vulkan beneath the Palace (the FIRST one, Echoes of Eternity doesn't exist and is basically character assassination written by someone who has literally gotten into Twitter beef with people about the "Magnus did nothing wrong" meme), Vulkan himself admits that if he were in Magnus' position, he would not have taken the deal that the Emperor offered. I will fight for my boy until the end of time. He made mistakes, but he was a genuinely good person who always did his best.
That was really interesting I do wish he could have could have fulfilled his potential to be a good guy. Seems really interesting and different and his legion had a lot more potential to be expended upon
he was arrogant and ignorant. magnus is the equivalent of someone filming himself giving a homeless guy a soup. sure, it is a generally good deed but the motivation for doing it corrupt the whole thing. in the end it was always for himself and for what he thought right (which was, of course, always what he concluded since he thought himself the smartest and wisest being ever)
The two most important moments of Magnus life occurred on Terra. The first was the Emperor advising Magnus unthenize his Sons because of a genetic fault, the "flesh change." Magnus refused and sold a piece of his soul to Tzeentch. Which manifested as a loss of an eye. The second was during the seige of Terra. The Emperor offered Magnus power, unimaginable and unlimmited access to the warp, and a litteral throne! All Magnus had to do is abandon his Sons. If Magnus was arrogant, selfish, and power hungery above all else he would have taken either of those offers. Magnus only sold his soul for other people, NOT himself!This is why the meme says "Magnus did nothing wrong".
He was brought low by his refusal to accept the fundamental laws of the 40k universe. Namely that no life is sacred, death and war are the only absolutes. He was close to accepting that when he hid the fleet, but still he fought to save his men.
@@japplekThis is why I can't fully call Magnus evil, at least not in comparison with other character in the setting. He's an arrogant dumbass, but he had an open mind and an open heart, and he still fights, even in his abhorrent and vile state as. Daemon Prince, to ensure that he can create a utopia for psykers and truth seekers, even if such goals will ultimately crumble under the influence of Tzeentch. He may be blind to the truth, but his vision of the world is kinda touching, and it certainly adds to the idea that Tzeentch takes advantage of hope and good intentions.
See, if the Emperor had that whole golden throne conversation with Magnus, say, right after Nikea, I firmly believe things would have been different. If he had even taken him aside and said, "Hey, I know that whole gathering was rough, but I have plans for you. See, there's gonna be this throne..." etc. Also something like, "By the way, there are literal evil gods in the warp and that's why I'm warning you to be super careful."
@PrimetimeD wasn't there something about how if you know about the masters of the warp it draws thier attention to you? And wasn't he trying to prevent that happening because he knew his son would not be ready to deal with them?
The fall of each traitor primarch has some notes of tragedy, but Magnus' story is particularly bitter. In truth, he wanted to further humanity and serve by his father's side, but his pride and insatiable hunger for knowledge were his undoing. I can only imagine what humanity's webway could have allowed for, and what the 15th may have grown into were things any different.
The 15th would have grown into angry puddles of goo, hence the reason for his fall, and the webway would have just enabled us to talk and travel faster it wouldn't have changed our nature so chaos would still be gnawing away at us just the same....
@@bodricthered The dark eldar have whole cities inside the webway. If the emperor was to create a webway, people could live inside that thing and not be preyed upon by chaos. It was my understanding that was part of the reason it was being created. That and faster travel through the material realm. Here's a quote from the 40k wiki page on the webway: "As with all of the Aeldari's most prized artefacts, the Webway was brought into being by psychic means, and the substance of its myriad corridors are protected by manner, methods and composition of their construction from incursions from the Warp."
On one hand, I feel sorry for Magnus for his fall, as he truly did have good intentions. On the other hand, he was the architect of his own downfall. He was told time and again of the dangers of the Warp, ignored the warnings, and found out just how right those warnings were. Everything that happened to him was his own fault. The path to hell truly is paved with good intentions, and Magnus is the poster boy of that phrase in 40k.
Much like his father, honestly. The Emperor is not actually a god but a man and like a man, he is flawed. As his sons are made in his image, they are equally flawed. Too many 40K fans believe that Games Workshop is advocating the methods of the Imperium of Man and its Emperor. The 40K universe is a horrific, miserable place where things have gone very wrong.
@@etinarcadiaego7424 I mean, when the Xeno is a sentient race of insect monsters who are motivated only by the desire to consume all organic life on a planet and leave it a desolate husk afterward, undead T-800s that hate all life and want it exterminated, Backstabbing Space Elves and their dark counterparts, or Green Mass Murder Machines without an off switch it's not unreasonable to want to suffer not the xenos to live. When Chaos and Horus's Temper Tantrum is a big chunk of the reason why the Imperium, it's not unreasonable to take drastic measures to ensure that the forces of Chaos never sink their claws into the Imperium again. Could the Emperor have done better with some of his sons? Absolutely. But Horus still chose to be foolish and listened to the honey sweet venomous words of Chaos in the end. Does the Imperium take things to the extreme at times? Again, absolutely. But considering the setting and the threat it faces, I can't really blame them. Though certain parts/members of the Imperium need unscrewing, like the Marines Malevolent and the High Lords.
Seriously, if The Emps didn't treat him like shit and just reminded him to be a little bit more humble and tell him that it takes time to master his power. Maybe he wouldn't be a tragic figure. He was beloved by The Hawk Boy and The Khan
@@Synthonym Yeah, no character gets more shilling as "I swear he's absolutely brilliant and the smartest human ever" while the crowd says "Right, pull the other one, it's got bells on" than The Emperor. So many of his decisions are not just the wrong ones (which is not the worst thing, since even really smart folks make mistakes), they're objectively, unequivocally, mind bogglingly stupid. Far more so than his dealings with Magnus, which had their fair share of... questionable logic, how he dealt with Angron and Perturabo was downright insane. On the other hand, Perturabo, Lorgar, and Mortarion's reactions to Daddy Dearest's dealings show they are definitely his kids and drank deeply from the cup of knuckleheadedness. I know a lot of this was retconning to make the traitor Primarchs more sympathetic and three dimensional in their various falls into chaos, but some of the authors went way overboard from "Big E was fallible" to "Big E couldn't tie his own shoes".
@@HgHg-yp6ftMagnus is his father's son. Magnus' flaws are the Emperor's. Though Magnus is correct in that reality would stagnate and collapse if chaos weren't there to be a counter-balance for order. All order and no chaos is just as undesirable as its opposite.
The way the Emperor handled Magnus is like. Imagine leaving a child unsupervised in a firework factory, and making them super promise to not touch anything. Of course, the child will start touching things out of sheer curiosity, and the factory will explode. At the Council of Nikaea, the Emperor could’ve been like “hey Magnus wanna help me with this special project?” and boom. Problem solved. Magnus doesn’t fall to chaos. The Emperor just refused to keep his kids in the loop.
As well as pride, which people point out, Magnus’ final undoing is a love for his people and sons - he would have let himself be destroyed if not for that love and he would have turned back to the light of the Emperor if not for that love.
@@etinarcadiaego7424 A thousand and change Astartes in comparison to untold trillions of human lives? I do not agree, although I do understand the loyalty.
Or he could've at least told him about it. The emperor does seem like a bit of a dunce at times. I mean, I've got two small kids. If I disappeared into another room for a bit I'd fully expect them to come charging in shouting "daaaad what you doing??" and fuck my shit up. I'm not the emperor of all mankind but even I know that XD
GW had a unique opportunity to make Magnus, and several other primarchs, likeable/relatable/tragic figures. But have, time-and-again, pushed the 'evil cause they evil' narrative. Imagine if Magnus really did nothing wrong(tbh GW retconned it so he did A LOT wrong)? Imagine if loyal primarchs were not as noble as they were proposed?
In a vacuum Magnus would prove to be correct in his viewpoint that humanity will become a psychic race similar to the Eldar, however he lived in a Galaxy that had Immaterial Predators that will prey on his noble viewpoint and egg him to look deeper in the Warp to hook him into their gaping maw.
I love how everyone puts 100% of blame on Magnus while ignoring how much shit he was given by the others and how he was an outcast. Like, sure he could have acted more responsibly - but does that realy absolve the Space Woives of their treachery with the sons and their hypocrisy, the unreasonable hate Mortation had for all things psychic? Does it absolve the Emperor's lack of just - hearing Magnus out and helping him out while he could? Does it magicaly remove the fact the forces of Chaos were also at play of making Magnus fall?
The intro got me thinking what if we could have gotten Christopher Lee to voice a cgi Magnus in a live action Warhammer movie. RIP to the legend. You will be missed 😔
This is what i was talking about on the Angron video. The Emp had Magnus's DNA, he used it to create the gene seeds, he could have made a clone (keep in mind that there were years between Magnus's message and the siege), instead he tried to bond a piece of his soul to a gene son to create a substitute. there is a nonphysical component to the Primarchs. and whatever it was, was used up. Thats why when he saw how messed up Kurze and Angron where he couldn't just make new ones. I choose to believe the resource was a part of his own being. And this is why he seems to just not understand some of his sons so often.
Wasn't the Emporer made from a ritualistic collective of ancient shamanic human souls? So, in theory, a primarch could just be a smaller portion of that? Is this old retconned lore?
Just a minor correction Remembrancer. thr Wolves did not "Cut a swathe" through Tiska. The Wolves were getting absolutly POUNDED and deetroyed until Constantine Valdor, the Custodes and thr Sisters of Silence showed up to assist them. The Wolves barely stood a chance against the psykers of the Thousand Sons
@@notladnstuff7976 Let's not kink shame. The fact that the Space Wolves are all furries doesn't have anything to do with them being colossal failures that were almost wiped out even after Magnus shut down all the defenses, delayed his Legion from joining the fighting, and generally spent most of the invasion trying to keep the Space Wolves alive.
Man I would love to see a tragic look at what Magnus would think of himself now, or some kind of dialogue between Magnus and an enemy discussing the fact his sons that he fights so hard to protect are now just fading memories of dust stuck in metal caskets. A lot of people dislike how he was turned into a “moustache twirling villain” but honestly I don’t think Magnus has spoke a word since the emperor gave him an ultimatum between prosperity or the death of his thousand sons. Just Tzeench.
I mostly see the blood Ravens being from the thousand Sons, due to the fact they have many librarians and have a thirst for knowledge. But what do you guys think?
I really like the idea of chapters descended from loyalist remnants of the traitor legions, but it seems that GW is not a big fan of the idea (what little remnants there were seemed to get wiped out or absorbed into non-standard Astartes groups in all the lore I can recall). I like the idea of guys like Night Lords or Iron Warriors (or heck, even a Word Bearers garrison that got forgotten about while all the big chess pieces were moving about the board) who, seeing the descent of their friends and Primarchs into absolute barbarism and psychosis, find it within themselves to pull back and try to return to a more admirable moral bent. Might not be very grimdark, but I find it more interesting than "Everyone's a bugger or a sucker".
@@TheLastRaven Tzeentch the chaos God of knowledge is somewhat controlling over the flash change, though the flash change was a just gene flaw that existed inside the thousand Sons, but Tzeentch use his power to make the flash change worse than it was.
@@kingleech16 You'd be surprised. GW doesn't seem against the idea. In White Dwarf's issue last month (485) ask grombrindal someone asked what happened to loyalists in the traitor legion, which included an unasked answer about the creation of loyalist chapters from traitor geneseed. The answer: ''Most of those who stayed true to their oats were killed at Isstvan III, but some survived in other regions of the galaxy. There are reports of many becoming Blackshields, casting off their former heraldry and adopting new colours. However, the eventual fate of these so-called 'Blackshield' formations, and whether they survived into the 41st Millennium, is unknown. According to official records, only geneseed from the Loyalist Legions was permitted to be used in the creation of the new Chapters. However, there are rumours that some stocks of geneseed from Traitor Legions were used to found Loyalist Chapters in the millennia following the Scouring, including and . Gromindal'' My guess, is that the two redacted are the minotaurs and blood ravens. Two of the most popular chapters with questionable origins. Of course, it is written intentionally to be vague and to not confirm anything while at the same time confirming. Like, ''there are RUMOURS'' yet in the same sentence ''including and is used; somewhat dispelling the line the sentence started with. IIRC there's also an article about the blood ravens becoming primaris marines in a white dwarf back in 2020? Not too sure. Which might've allowed them to come closer to whom their genesire is.
@Anthony Beatty Mortarion is the Hopeless One. He gave in to his suffering and bitter nature. Magnus - "Quickly! Sacrifice some human thralls to power our spell to warn the Emperor! What could go wrong?"
@@beardfistthegoldenone7273 mortarion's fall began with small actions with the intention of Justice for humanity. Every action from the least to the greatest he thought he was doing the right thing
@@beardfistthegoldenone7273 Magnus was finally embracing the standard Imperial policy of killing massive numbers of people for no good reason. It's sort of heartwarming after the other legions were so upset about him not doing that during his crusades, and instead using his psyker powers to prevent loss of life, that they censured him at Nikea. He'd learned his lesson, but he was still rejected. Too little, too late, I guess.
I just realized. That Prospero proved Emperor completely wrong. They purged chaos entites from their planet. And didnt fall to chaos.. Until wolf didlers forced them into it.
While I understand the whole Magnus did nothing wrong argument I personally disagree and believe it's more nuanced than that. It's not that he didn't do anything wrong, but that he made the wrong choices for the right reasons.
Did they ever confront Leman Russ about the destruction of Prospero? Because I know Magnus and Jagitai kahn were very close and if I were him I would had words with the wolf king.
Nae He got away clean. Kinda like he had zero reprecusions for abandoning Terra. We now know that his stabbing Horus with the Spear of Russ, ended up turning Horus into a god.... We also now know that the Loyalists had to hold on for exactly 9 more hours to have won the Heresy completely. If Russ had stayed, it would have been a unanimous victory for thr Imperium. Russ is that one spazz who gets away with doing whatever he wants lol
That being said Jagahtai abandoned Russ during a battle with the Alpha legion Not because of vengeance.... But because of the fact that Jagahtai did not know who was loyal and who was traitor...the way he saw it, Russ could be a traitor because of what he did to Magnus
@@adrienwatson2179 I know he didn't help Russ when he was fighting the Alpha legion but after the heresy was over because we all know if it was Corvus corax was sent to arest Magnus instead if Russ and he also disliked Magnus and was given the order to kill hom and burn Prospero he would have definitely said "are you sure about this" instead of jumping head first to attack.
@@frankiehernandez6232 Agreed There was even a point Valdor was like "Dude, you are literally enjoying this way too much, these are your kin" This was actually the first time...looking at Russ...that Valdor thought the Emperor made a mistake in even creating the Primarchs Another custodes was disgusted by Russ and his pleasure/joy in killing his own. If anyone else wqs sent, maybe they would have sent an envoy after their hails were not answered... Im sure even without Magnus, Ahriman would have talked it out and surrendered Leman caused more damage to the loyalists than anyone except Horus Especially with all thr new revelations in the newest books. Basically if he hadnt abandoned Terra, thr Loyalists would have won comfortably...and if he hadnt abandoned Terra on his suicide mission againat Horus....Horus would never have been empowered...he was still fighting off corruption. But he chose to take in the power of the 4 because of Russ... Now he is acsending to b3come the 5th God of Chaos...apl thanks to Russ
@@frankiehernandez6232 Also If Corvus hadnt had to stop and save Leman Russ from Abbadon, Corax would have made it to Terra in time to help the Loyalists
Magnus could have succeded if his father simply communicated with him and wasn't a toxic male figure who fails to communicate with his son and just says I know best without explaination and also allows his son to fail. He also punishes innocent people because of a mistake Magnus made. It's like dude the emperor might not be a nice guy. And all these people being like "well he let Magnus join him even after all the shit Magnus did" like Magnus made a mistake. It's literally the same if your son destroyed the car and you were like A) destory all your sons' toys, video games and movies, basically all his stuff or B) you kick your son out of your home. It's horrible either way you look at it. I will never get how the Emperor is in the right
Thank you for this video sir. JOYTOY is releasing Magnus snd his sons and I needed a video to understand what the story is with the great Red. Being still only 4 years into WH40k this was perfect! We are the 🔨!
Magnus is a phenomenal powerhouse and beyond anything but a combined effort in 40K. But he was lead there by his arrogance. To face them would be horrifying as a Human and even as an Astartes it would be very difficult to win.
We can all agree that the Emperor of Man Kind is at fault here right? There were multiple ways to keep Magnus Royal. Hell, he could of took the Thousand Suns to Tera speeding up the web way project.
None had ever seen such a dreadful apparition, the true heart of a being so mighty that it could only beat while encased in super-engineered flesh. The emperor alone recognized this rapturous angel, and his heart broke to see it. "Magnus," he said. "Father," replied Magnus. Their minds met, and in that moment of frozen connection the galaxy changed forever
Love this channel. Ive just subscribed there are some really good 40k lore stuffs out there it takes a bit of time and a lot of work to produce content such as this and you have gained the emperors glance.....ok a wink maybe....twitch of the fingers?....muscle spasm? Magnus is the misunderstood son,he deserves a comeback.
Tzeentch: How close are you to understanding the warp Magnus: Closer after your last question. Tzeentch: How are you to know what, if it is bigger than it seems? Magnus: Do you have nothing else to do and further your plots than impeding me with your most distracting words. Tzeentch: Well what do you know, maybe I sent a self aware 2 dimensional illusion. Magnus: I have more eyes than one! Tzeentch: It doesn't serve you all that much, one eye to books you oh so much and one you rarely open that looks outside. I would look in a mirror once a while however I am sure all would shatter after those horns on chest thingys. Magnus: Get out! Tzeentch: It's my planet you get out. Magnus: AAAAaaagggHHHHH
Magnus did nothing wrong. He, unlike his father, operated on good faith. His father denied him knowledge without reason or explanation. His loyalty was rewarded with betrayal.
Funny how most worlds in which the primarch ends up were actually quite fit for them. XD 24:04 Wait, i thought the sword of the God-Emperor had the power to permanently kill demons?
Magnus definitely screwed up, but this video definitely paints him badly lol. Magnus refused to rejoin the Imperium because he couldn't accept having to hunt down all of his sons, and there was a really cool moment that lead to the fight from this. After hearing the Emperors offer, Magnus asked Vulkan if he would accept that offer if it meant killing his sons. Vulkan said that we would not, and then they began fighting (not before as this video implies). I like these videos but this one is pretty biased throughout the video against Magnus 🤷♂
Love Magnus, but his own hubris set him on a path where he always thought he knew better. Sad story, but Russ and his ignorance of his use of pyskers, meant he was easily manipulated by Horus. Sadly the same god fucked with them both. I hoped for redemption for Magnus at some point, tho sadly doubt it will happen. They were loyal, and again Magnus caused their downfall, instead of going back to terra. According to new lore, be interesting to see what the Emperor has as a back up to each Primarch.
You're assuming the Emperor is perfect and always right, thought. He's as stubborn and arrogant as Magnus, which makes sense as he did create Magus and all his sons in his own image.
GW are like that kid in school who would copy your homework word for word. This is exactly how Odin was granted mystical knowledge by sacrificing his eye. At the very least, they could have changed what he gave up. Off the top of my head - Magnus could have sacrificed a nostril. How unique and memorable is that? Or how about his his upper lip?
So the whole population of Prospero along with the one so powerful in the warp( magic) that the Big E himself was conversing almost as with equal never had even a glimpse of the warp Gods? How come? All other Primarchs the crazy Wolf included needed armies of blanks to support them so to even approach Magnus least dueling him at " even odds" , what a jokes compared to the Crimson King they all are. The only thousand in his "legion" were carrying their weight in the crusade along with legions 100 and more times their own number and the worst " accusation" leveled against them was that they didn't butchered 90% of the population of the planets which they brought back to the Imperium, what a scumbags eh. There are plenty of other erm... inconsistencies in the lore of this franchise but downplaying this particular character powers, the same powers which are elevating the Big E to a godhood for example is one of them.
The webway failure was actually the emperors fault. Rather than take the time to develop and learn how to build the proper psychicly armored webway material the eldar and old ones used to create the original webway big E did what he always did and chose to be incredibly impatient and build it out of materials that required him to sit on the chair in order to protect his savant terra researchers working inside the webway as they constructed this knock off chinese quality webway. Old Big E takes another L by rather than doing things slowly and the right way he just to be haphazard.
If that is ALL he was doing at the time, that's still a tall order! Even for the best psyker in the imperium. Which, he knew, is exactly why he told Magnus not to. Essential, it's the entire point of Horus Heresy
I finished reading his Primarch book. He is quite powerful, but I was almost begging Perturabo to knock some sense into the big, red nerd. Why couldn't he just do as he is told and listen to other people, who clearly know what they are doing/ talking about? But then again, the book wouldn't have ended the way it did if Magnus hadn't been such an insufferable know-it-all.
He had a good dad :) supportive and giving :) reminds me of my dad except Magnus wasn't shoved into soccer despite being fat with short legs... Sorry, went on a tangent lmao 🤣🤣
Who do you think is the most powerfull primarch, i don't mean the best fighter, best duelist, just the ability to destroy other primarch. For me it's Magnus follow closely by Sanguinius
@@DragonboneWarhammer Kinda hard to win when hes surrounded by Sisters of Silence who negate the VAST majority of his power. To put it in perspective When Vulkan fought Magnus...Magnus killed him hundreds of times in a duel Any non Perpetual Primarch stands no chance without immense help unfortunately Thr guy even obliterated Malcador witha. thought....and remember...Malcador put Horus in his knees, strangled and gasping for breath... with a single movement of his hand.
@@DragonboneWarhammer Oh 100% Hes a total tool bag MAYBE If he had picked up the VOX Leman would have literally captured him peacefully and this WHOLE problem would solve itself But Magnus was too busy skulking in his tower. Leman tried to contact him and Magnus ignored it like a child. Nothinf wrong? LOTS wrong
@@DragonboneWarhammer Imagine he jas not been a child? Full loyalist Thousand sons... Full strength Loyalist Wolves. If Magnus had picked up the phone..... Loyalist victory uncontested
@@benjaminstevens6043 Wrong! Humbug Whoresy did everything wrong, him and Logass Oh-Really-ion are the embodiment of original sin, and for that reason, I will forever shoot super-heated las-bolts at their every depiction and mention. They made Rogal sad, and that in itself is sin enough to demand a World-Eater level of wrathful vengeance. Magnus, however, Mage-ass the in-Bred did nothing wrong, he was more like ammunition for sin rather than the gun. Tzeench shot the mind-wall protecting Terra WITH Magnus, essentially, which I don't think falls on Magnus as being his fault. I could have said all of this in a much more cordial and formal manner but I'm feeling zesty, pardon my crudeness lol.
He destroyed the webway giving demons a way through terra and knew that Horus the reason why wolves destroyed prospero yet still sided with him he did everything wrong
He destroyed the Corpse Emperor's project, because he made a mistake. For some reason, you neglected to mention the fact that it happened because the Corpse Emperor didn't tell him about it, and then he was trying to warn the Corpse Emperor about what Horus was doing. You neglected to mention that, why is that? You also neglected to mention the fact that the Corpse Emperor, by way of the criminal Sigilite's guilty confession to a dying woman, had fully intended for the Primarchs to fratricidally eliminate one another, as he had intended for a massive war between the Legions to happen, all along. Maybe you should actually find out what the Terminus Decree is. Just as the Corpse Emperor did not intend for the Thunder Warriors to live past a certain point, the current day Astartes have lived long beyond what the Corpse Emperor had intended, and he had very much meant to exterminate them all, and make way for yet another order of military slaves. Funny how you didn't mention any of that. Next thing you know, you'll be saying that he treated Angron like a loving father. Why did he side with Horus? Because Horus was fighting the duplicitous backstabber that was pretending to be their father, and had a far darker intent for the Imperium of Mankind, than anything in the Primordial Annihilator ever could.
@fjbatyoutube1681 yea the emperor was an asshole, if he told magnus what the web way project was(mortarion knew) or even told him that tzench existed, wich he also knew, magnus wouldn't have done anything wrong
Magnus is like that one cousin we all have that just can’t ever get his sht together… Bounces from job to job, always needing a small handout to “get em through a tough time” But the plans, ohh boy howdy the plans they have are so grandiose and seemingly epic if they could just catch a break!! Never able to look inward to notice the issue being themselves, it’s always someone else who has caused their hardships.. just an observation 😊
Yeah, Magnus needs to learn to take responsibility. He is the only one to blame for what happened. Not the Emperor for denying vital need-to-know information from his military forces and repeatedly demanding Magnus murder his children. Not Erebus for sparking the herasy that Magnus was trying to warn the Emperor about. Not Leman Russ for breaking his soul into pieces and ensuring the Emperor's plan to have Magnus dragged back to Terra to help fix the damage he'd done would be impossible. Not Tzeench the god of schemes and destiny personally intervening to manipulate events. He clearly has no one to blame but himself for everything that happened. He should have pulled himself up by his own bootstraps, stopped making excuses, and gotten his shit together. Because he is obviously the only person in this galaxy who hasn't managed that.
Protected with runic armour and the combined null-power of the sister(s) of of silence, Lemon Russ would face the crimson king in a duel of steel ALONE 🥴🥴
Magnus have a huge problem . he was created with psychic powers training in that... praise for that ... then you creator/father said the thing who made you unique is banned... making you worthless
I really think the emperor knew that the primarchs would be scattered after watching this ? Why because it’s very suspicious for Magnus to land on a planet of sorcerer’s ? He could of landed on nostramo a night world and his abilities would not be developed so well and could be a violation alpha class pysker . mmmm 🤔 .
While Magnus did nothing wrong, it's also fair to say he didn't do anything right either
I always say he tried to do the right thing and went about it in the completely wrong way
Just the example to the galaxy that the road to chaos is paved with good intention.
Poetry!
@@4starseniormasterspecialistyup
Magnus did nothing wrong. Well; besides ruining the Imperial Webway project, cause daemons to nearly invade Holy Terra and turning to Chaos. 😢 Then no, he didn't do anything wrong!! 😂😂
Whether or not he "did wrong," Magnus gets *way* more shit than he deserves. He was from the beginning a fundamentally good dude who only ever wanted the best for humanity and for his Legion. Let's run down some basic facts:
- Magnus required and encouraged his sons to pursue peacetime arts as well; Ahriman, for example, grew grapes and made wine. To my knowledge, the Ultramarines are the only other Legion who mandated this sort of thing.
- Magnus also mandated that each member of the Thousand Sons spend time attached to a different Legion, to learn from them. This shows a startling humility that stands in stark contrast to the arrogance that everyone always loves to accuse him of.
- Magnus was personal friends with like half the Primarchs, loyalist and traitor. In particular he was drawn to fellow outcasts like Lorgar, or loners like the Khan. Sanguinius (who everyone acknowledges as the best boy) loved him, and stood by him at Nikaea. Vulkan also was a very close friend of his.
- Magnus was the only Primarch, *on either side,* to ever seriously attempt a non-violent solution to the Heresy (by projecting himself into Horus' mind to try to save him from Chaos).
- As far as his biggest mistake goes, breaking the wards around the Webway project, everyone always seems to forget that he encountered *the same kind of barrier* when he tried to warn Horus (specified in False Gods). It was perfectly reasonable of him to assume that these barriers were created by the enemy to try to stop him from delivering his messages. The being that he accepted help from in breaking the barrier was the same being who "saved" his Legion from the flesh-change. Ultimately he was manipulated into making this mistake, but when viewed from his perspective, it's more reasonable than it seems.
- He was so loyal to the Imperium that, at least in theory, he was willing to sacrifice his own Legion to avoid weakening the Space Wolves for the war to come. Tzeentch offered to destroy the fleet before it reached Prospero, but Magnus said no. Let me re-iterate that; he was willing to save *his own executioners* for the good of the Imperium. It was only when he was confronted with the reality of his planet destroyed and his sons butchered that his will broke and he came down to fight.
- He literally had to be browbeaten by Lorgar into joining the war, and basically only did so because it was the only way for his Legion to survive.
- During the Siege of Terra, while infiltrating the Imperial Palace, he blew his own cover and risked detection in order to save a bunch of Imperial civilians from a phosphex bomb. Again; he *risked jeopardizing his mission* to *save "enemy" civilians.* Ask yourself how many of the other Primarchs had that kind of respect for human life.
- During his fight with Vulkan beneath the Palace (the FIRST one, Echoes of Eternity doesn't exist and is basically character assassination written by someone who has literally gotten into Twitter beef with people about the "Magnus did nothing wrong" meme), Vulkan himself admits that if he were in Magnus' position, he would not have taken the deal that the Emperor offered.
I will fight for my boy until the end of time. He made mistakes, but he was a genuinely good person who always did his best.
I'm sure you have a good point. However I can't be bothered to read your massive essay.
I did not know much about Magnus. Thank you
That was really interesting I do wish he could have could have fulfilled his potential to be a good guy. Seems really interesting and different and his legion had a lot more potential to be expended upon
he was arrogant and ignorant.
magnus is the equivalent of someone filming himself giving a homeless guy a soup. sure, it is a generally good deed but the motivation for doing it corrupt the whole thing. in the end it was always for himself and for what he thought right (which was, of course, always what he concluded since he thought himself the smartest and wisest being ever)
He is a very well written character and Legion.
Hence why he had to turn.
The more tragic the fall, the more Grimdark the setting is.
The two most important moments of Magnus life occurred on Terra. The first was the Emperor advising Magnus unthenize his Sons because of a genetic fault, the "flesh change." Magnus refused and sold a piece of his soul to Tzeentch. Which manifested as a loss of an eye. The second was during the seige of Terra. The Emperor offered Magnus power, unimaginable and unlimmited access to the warp, and a litteral throne! All Magnus had to do is abandon his Sons. If Magnus was arrogant, selfish, and power hungery above all else he would have taken either of those offers. Magnus only sold his soul for other people, NOT himself!This is why the meme says "Magnus did nothing wrong".
He was brought low by his refusal to accept the fundamental laws of the 40k universe. Namely that no life is sacred, death and war are the only absolutes. He was close to accepting that when he hid the fleet, but still he fought to save his men.
*euthanize
*unlimited
*literal
@@japplekThis is why I can't fully call Magnus evil, at least not in comparison with other character in the setting. He's an arrogant dumbass, but he had an open mind and an open heart, and he still fights, even in his abhorrent and vile state as. Daemon Prince, to ensure that he can create a utopia for psykers and truth seekers, even if such goals will ultimately crumble under the influence of Tzeentch. He may be blind to the truth, but his vision of the world is kinda touching, and it certainly adds to the idea that Tzeentch takes advantage of hope and good intentions.
Even mortarian did what he did for his legion.
See, if the Emperor had that whole golden throne conversation with Magnus, say, right after Nikea, I firmly believe things would have been different. If he had even taken him aside and said, "Hey, I know that whole gathering was rough, but I have plans for you. See, there's gonna be this throne..." etc. Also something like, "By the way, there are literal evil gods in the warp and that's why I'm warning you to be super careful."
I don’t think he would have listened…but unfortunately we’ll never know.
@@Justin_Anvilno, the Emperor is too arrogant to simply explain things so clearly.
The emperor is the dumbest powerful being in the entirety of 40k by a fucking wiiiiiiiiiiiiide margin.
@PrimetimeD wasn't there something about how if you know about the masters of the warp it draws thier attention to you? And wasn't he trying to prevent that happening because he knew his son would not be ready to deal with them?
I strongly believe that the eye of Magnus in Skyrim's mage guild quest is Magnus the red's lost eye.
OOOOOOOU i never made the connection. That would be so cool lol
Yeah that seems plausible cause of tzeench’s tomfoolery
hardly, they are two different IPs
@Laoch your point?
@@DragonboneWarhammer It's outright stated that the script on it isn't Dwemer, nor is it in any other language from Nirn
The fall of each traitor primarch has some notes of tragedy, but Magnus' story is particularly bitter. In truth, he wanted to further humanity and serve by his father's side, but his pride and insatiable hunger for knowledge were his undoing. I can only imagine what humanity's webway could have allowed for, and what the 15th may have grown into were things any different.
The 15th would have grown into angry puddles of goo, hence the reason for his fall, and the webway would have just enabled us to talk and travel faster it wouldn't have changed our nature so chaos would still be gnawing away at us just the same....
Over Konrad and Angrons Magnus was just a fool who thought he knew better
The web way would change a lot as warp travel would be less needed and as such less chances for morty cituations happening
Remember, his intentions were pure… he tried to warn the emperor of Horus’s treachery.
@@bodricthered The dark eldar have whole cities inside the webway. If the emperor was to create a webway, people could live inside that thing and not be preyed upon by chaos. It was my understanding that was part of the reason it was being created. That and faster travel through the material realm. Here's a quote from the 40k wiki page on the webway:
"As with all of the Aeldari's most prized artefacts, the Webway was brought into being by psychic means, and the substance of its myriad corridors are protected by manner, methods and composition of their construction from incursions from the Warp."
On one hand, I feel sorry for Magnus for his fall, as he truly did have good intentions.
On the other hand, he was the architect of his own downfall. He was told time and again of the dangers of the Warp, ignored the warnings, and found out just how right those warnings were. Everything that happened to him was his own fault.
The path to hell truly is paved with good intentions, and Magnus is the poster boy of that phrase in 40k.
Much like his father, honestly. The Emperor is not actually a god but a man and like a man, he is flawed. As his sons are made in his image, they are equally flawed. Too many 40K fans believe that Games Workshop is advocating the methods of the Imperium of Man and its Emperor. The 40K universe is a horrific, miserable place where things have gone very wrong.
@@etinarcadiaego7424 I mean, when the Xeno is a sentient race of insect monsters who are motivated only by the desire to consume all organic life on a planet and leave it a desolate husk afterward, undead T-800s that hate all life and want it exterminated, Backstabbing Space Elves and their dark counterparts, or Green Mass Murder Machines without an off switch it's not unreasonable to want to suffer not the xenos to live.
When Chaos and Horus's Temper Tantrum is a big chunk of the reason why the Imperium, it's not unreasonable to take drastic measures to ensure that the forces of Chaos never sink their claws into the Imperium again.
Could the Emperor have done better with some of his sons? Absolutely. But Horus still chose to be foolish and listened to the honey sweet venomous words of Chaos in the end. Does the Imperium take things to the extreme at times? Again, absolutely. But considering the setting and the threat it faces, I can't really blame them. Though certain parts/members of the Imperium need unscrewing, like the Marines Malevolent and the High Lords.
I don't know. I'm thinking the literal god of scheming that personally intervened multiple times might be due at least a little credit.
Seriously, if The Emps didn't treat him like shit and just reminded him to be a little bit more humble and tell him that it takes time to master his power. Maybe he wouldn't be a tragic figure. He was beloved by The Hawk Boy and The Khan
If Big E had acted like anything resembling a father the Heresy would never have happened
@@Synthonym Yeah, no character gets more shilling as "I swear he's absolutely brilliant and the smartest human ever" while the crowd says "Right, pull the other one, it's got bells on" than The Emperor. So many of his decisions are not just the wrong ones (which is not the worst thing, since even really smart folks make mistakes), they're objectively, unequivocally, mind bogglingly stupid. Far more so than his dealings with Magnus, which had their fair share of... questionable logic, how he dealt with Angron and Perturabo was downright insane. On the other hand, Perturabo, Lorgar, and Mortarion's reactions to Daddy Dearest's dealings show they are definitely his kids and drank deeply from the cup of knuckleheadedness. I know a lot of this was retconning to make the traitor Primarchs more sympathetic and three dimensional in their various falls into chaos, but some of the authors went way overboard from "Big E was fallible" to "Big E couldn't tie his own shoes".
@@Synthonym Well in fairness what happened to Fulgrim was his own fault.
@@brandonlyon730 more like an accident
He tried fighting the demon
@@joeford5181 Which wouldn’t have happened if he didn’t pick up that suspicious looking sword in the first place.
Magnus is an example that intelligence does not equate to wisdom.
You surely mean the Big E.
@@HgHg-yp6ft yes inquisitor, this comment right here.
@@HgHg-yp6ftMagnus is his father's son. Magnus' flaws are the Emperor's. Though Magnus is correct in that reality would stagnate and collapse if chaos weren't there to be a counter-balance for order. All order and no chaos is just as undesirable as its opposite.
@@HgHg-yp6ftMagnus reflects the Emperor's idealism, psychic power, and possibly most of all, arrogance. They are the same.
You know what Magnus forgot? "The warnings come *AFTER* The spells l."
The way the Emperor handled Magnus is like. Imagine leaving a child unsupervised in a firework factory, and making them super promise to not touch anything. Of course, the child will start touching things out of sheer curiosity, and the factory will explode.
At the Council of Nikaea, the Emperor could’ve been like “hey Magnus wanna help me with this special project?” and boom. Problem solved. Magnus doesn’t fall to chaos. The Emperor just refused to keep his kids in the loop.
that's because the emperor is by far the dumbest powerful being in all of 40k, lol.
As well as pride, which people point out, Magnus’ final undoing is a love for his people and sons - he would have let himself be destroyed if not for that love and he would have turned back to the light of the Emperor if not for that love.
Can you blame him? I know I'd always chose my family, even if it risked the destruction of all humanity.
@@etinarcadiaego7424 A thousand and change Astartes in comparison to untold trillions of human lives? I do not agree, although I do understand the loyalty.
It would have been wise if the emperor had taken magnus to aid in the webway project.
THATS WHAT IM FUCKEN SAYING!!!
Or he could've at least told him about it. The emperor does seem like a bit of a dunce at times. I mean, I've got two small kids. If I disappeared into another room for a bit I'd fully expect them to come charging in shouting "daaaad what you doing??" and fuck my shit up. I'm not the emperor of all mankind but even I know that XD
GW had a unique opportunity to make Magnus, and several other primarchs, likeable/relatable/tragic figures. But have, time-and-again, pushed the 'evil cause they evil' narrative. Imagine if Magnus really did nothing wrong(tbh GW retconned it so he did A LOT wrong)? Imagine if loyal primarchs were not as noble as they were proposed?
In a vacuum Magnus would prove to be correct in his viewpoint that humanity will become a psychic race similar to the Eldar, however he lived in a Galaxy that had Immaterial Predators that will prey on his noble viewpoint and egg him to look deeper in the Warp to hook him into their gaping maw.
Hhccvvv
I love how everyone puts 100% of blame on Magnus while ignoring how much shit he was given by the others and how he was an outcast. Like, sure he could have acted more responsibly - but does that realy absolve the Space Woives of their treachery with the sons and their hypocrisy, the unreasonable hate Mortation had for all things psychic? Does it absolve the Emperor's lack of just - hearing Magnus out and helping him out while he could? Does it magicaly remove the fact the forces of Chaos were also at play of making Magnus fall?
The intro got me thinking what if we could have gotten Christopher Lee to voice a cgi Magnus in a live action Warhammer movie. RIP to the legend. You will be missed 😔
At his core, the Emp is human. Flawed. Prone to errors of judgement. Many such moments over the history of this universe.
This is what i was talking about on the Angron video. The Emp had Magnus's DNA, he used it to create the gene seeds, he could have made a clone (keep in mind that there were years between Magnus's message and the siege), instead he tried to bond a piece of his soul to a gene son to create a substitute. there is a nonphysical component to the Primarchs. and whatever it was, was used up. Thats why when he saw how messed up Kurze and Angron where he couldn't just make new ones. I choose to believe the resource was a part of his own being. And this is why he seems to just not understand some of his sons so often.
Wasn't the Emporer made from a ritualistic collective of ancient shamanic human souls? So, in theory, a primarch could just be a smaller portion of that? Is this old retconned lore?
It’s hard to unhear Zegram as Magnus the Res.
Just a minor correction Remembrancer.
thr Wolves did not "Cut a swathe" through Tiska.
The Wolves were getting absolutly POUNDED and deetroyed until Constantine Valdor, the Custodes and thr Sisters of Silence showed up to assist them.
The Wolves barely stood a chance against the psykers of the Thousand Sons
The Wolves owned the Thousand Sons.
And Leman broke Magnus b***h ass back like a boss.
@@NatoHoro Sure
Guessing you didnt read the book
@@NatoHoro ok furry lover lmao
@@notladnstuff7976 Let's not kink shame. The fact that the Space Wolves are all furries doesn't have anything to do with them being colossal failures that were almost wiped out even after Magnus shut down all the defenses, delayed his Legion from joining the fighting, and generally spent most of the invasion trying to keep the Space Wolves alive.
Man I would love to see a tragic look at what Magnus would think of himself now, or some kind of dialogue between Magnus and an enemy discussing the fact his sons that he fights so hard to protect are now just fading memories of dust stuck in metal caskets.
A lot of people dislike how he was turned into a “moustache twirling villain” but honestly I don’t think Magnus has spoke a word since the emperor gave him an ultimatum between prosperity or the death of his thousand sons. Just Tzeench.
I mostly see the blood Ravens being from the thousand Sons, due to the fact they have many librarians and have a thirst for knowledge. But what do you guys think?
What if they are the love child's of Sanguinius and Corvus Corax?
I really like the idea of chapters descended from loyalist remnants of the traitor legions, but it seems that GW is not a big fan of the idea (what little remnants there were seemed to get wiped out or absorbed into non-standard Astartes groups in all the lore I can recall). I like the idea of guys like Night Lords or Iron Warriors (or heck, even a Word Bearers garrison that got forgotten about while all the big chess pieces were moving about the board) who, seeing the descent of their friends and Primarchs into absolute barbarism and psychosis, find it within themselves to pull back and try to return to a more admirable moral bent. Might not be very grimdark, but I find it more interesting than "Everyone's a bugger or a sucker".
I like the theory but as far as I know they don't have the flesh change effecting them
@@TheLastRaven Tzeentch the chaos God of knowledge is somewhat controlling over the flash change, though the flash change was a just gene flaw that existed inside the thousand Sons, but Tzeentch use his power to make the flash change worse than it was.
@@kingleech16 You'd be surprised. GW doesn't seem against the idea. In White Dwarf's issue last month (485) ask grombrindal someone asked what happened to loyalists in the traitor legion, which included an unasked answer about the creation of loyalist chapters from traitor geneseed. The answer:
''Most of those who stayed true to their oats were killed at Isstvan III, but some survived in other regions of the galaxy. There are reports of many becoming Blackshields, casting off their former heraldry and adopting new colours. However, the eventual fate of these so-called 'Blackshield' formations, and whether they survived into the 41st Millennium, is unknown.
According to official records, only geneseed from the Loyalist Legions was permitted to be used in the creation of the new Chapters. However, there are rumours that some stocks of geneseed from Traitor Legions were used to found Loyalist Chapters in the millennia following the Scouring, including and .
Gromindal''
My guess, is that the two redacted are the minotaurs and blood ravens. Two of the most popular chapters with questionable origins. Of course, it is written intentionally to be vague and to not confirm anything while at the same time confirming. Like, ''there are RUMOURS'' yet in the same sentence ''including and is used; somewhat dispelling the line the sentence started with.
IIRC there's also an article about the blood ravens becoming primaris marines in a white dwarf back in 2020? Not too sure. Which might've allowed them to come closer to whom their genesire is.
Whether or not he “did wrong” you gotta respect a man who’s willing to rock the ‘nipple tusk’ look
The Emperor just sat on his throne while his palace was being assaulted? It's almost like he wanted to die.
Ah Magnus, a lesson of intention, and how even the best can lead you straight to hell...
I'd say mortarion would be more of an example of that.
@Anthony Beatty Mortarion is the Hopeless One. He gave in to his suffering and bitter nature.
Magnus -
"Quickly! Sacrifice some human thralls to power our spell to warn the Emperor! What could go wrong?"
@@beardfistthegoldenone7273 mortarion's fall began with small actions with the intention of Justice for humanity. Every action from the least to the greatest he thought he was doing the right thing
@@beardfistthegoldenone7273 Magnus was finally embracing the standard Imperial policy of killing massive numbers of people for no good reason. It's sort of heartwarming after the other legions were so upset about him not doing that during his crusades, and instead using his psyker powers to prevent loss of life, that they censured him at Nikea. He'd learned his lesson, but he was still rejected. Too little, too late, I guess.
I just realized. That Prospero proved Emperor completely wrong. They purged chaos entites from their planet. And didnt fall to chaos.. Until wolf didlers forced them into it.
While I understand the whole Magnus did nothing wrong argument I personally disagree and believe it's more nuanced than that. It's not that he didn't do anything wrong, but that he made the wrong choices for the right reasons.
Did they ever confront Leman Russ about the destruction of Prospero? Because I know Magnus and Jagitai kahn were very close and if I were him I would had words with the wolf king.
Nae
He got away clean.
Kinda like he had zero reprecusions for abandoning Terra.
We now know that his stabbing Horus with the Spear of Russ, ended up turning Horus into a god....
We also now know that the Loyalists had to hold on for exactly 9 more hours to have won the Heresy completely.
If Russ had stayed, it would have been a unanimous victory for thr Imperium.
Russ is that one spazz who gets away with doing whatever he wants lol
That being said
Jagahtai abandoned Russ during a battle with the Alpha legion
Not because of vengeance....
But because of the fact that Jagahtai did not know who was loyal and who was traitor...the way he saw it, Russ could be a traitor because of what he did to Magnus
@@adrienwatson2179 I know he didn't help Russ when he was fighting the Alpha legion but after the heresy was over because we all know if it was Corvus corax was sent to arest Magnus instead if Russ and he also disliked Magnus and was given the order to kill hom and burn Prospero he would have definitely said "are you sure about this" instead of jumping head first to attack.
@@frankiehernandez6232 Agreed
There was even a point Valdor was like "Dude, you are literally enjoying this way too much, these are your kin"
This was actually the first time...looking at Russ...that Valdor thought the Emperor made a mistake in even creating the Primarchs
Another custodes was disgusted by Russ and his pleasure/joy in killing his own.
If anyone else wqs sent, maybe they would have sent an envoy after their hails were not answered...
Im sure even without Magnus, Ahriman would have talked it out and surrendered
Leman caused more damage to the loyalists than anyone except Horus
Especially with all thr new revelations in the newest books.
Basically if he hadnt abandoned Terra, thr Loyalists would have won comfortably...and if he hadnt abandoned Terra on his suicide mission againat Horus....Horus would never have been empowered...he was still fighting off corruption.
But he chose to take in the power of the 4 because of Russ...
Now he is acsending to b3come the 5th God of Chaos...apl thanks to Russ
@@frankiehernandez6232 Also
If Corvus hadnt had to stop and save Leman Russ from Abbadon, Corax would have made it to Terra in time to help the Loyalists
Idk if GW pays you anything for these, but if they don't, they should. The production of your videos is top notch!
Magnus could have succeded if his father simply communicated with him and wasn't a toxic male figure who fails to communicate with his son and just says I know best without explaination and also allows his son to fail. He also punishes innocent people because of a mistake Magnus made. It's like dude the emperor might not be a nice guy. And all these people being like "well he let Magnus join him even after all the shit Magnus did" like Magnus made a mistake. It's literally the same if your son destroyed the car and you were like A) destory all your sons' toys, video games and movies, basically all his stuff or B) you kick your son out of your home. It's horrible either way you look at it. I will never get how the Emperor is in the right
Thank you for this video sir. JOYTOY is releasing Magnus snd his sons and I needed a video to understand what the story is with the great Red. Being still only 4 years into WH40k this was perfect! We are the 🔨!
Magnus is a phenomenal powerhouse and beyond anything but a combined effort in 40K. But he was lead there by his arrogance. To face them would be horrifying as a Human and even as an Astartes it would be very difficult to win.
Magnus the Red, a.k.a Ketchup Aussie, Mophair, Horntits, and all sort of Australian-related puns
We can all agree that the Emperor of Man Kind is at fault here right?
There were multiple ways to keep Magnus Royal. Hell, he could of took the Thousand Suns to Tera speeding up the web way project.
Magnus vs. Guilliman, the two biggest nerds from both factions squaring off
None had ever seen such a dreadful apparition, the true heart of a being so mighty that it could only beat while encased in super-engineered flesh.
The emperor alone recognized this rapturous angel, and his heart broke to see it.
"Magnus," he said.
"Father," replied Magnus.
Their minds met, and in that moment of frozen connection the galaxy changed forever
They always want to talk about how Tzeentch manipulated Magnus
But never about how the *Emperor* did.
"I PUNCHED ONE OF HIS HEART OUT WHY DOES NO ONE REMEMBER THAT"
Someone did!
Love this channel. Ive just subscribed there are some really good 40k lore stuffs out there it takes a bit of time and a lot of work to produce content such as this and you have gained the emperors glance.....ok a wink maybe....twitch of the fingers?....muscle spasm? Magnus is the misunderstood son,he deserves a comeback.
He did things, right and wrong is a matter of perspective..... Hence why Tzeentch impaired his depth perception
Tzeentch: How close are you to understanding the warp
Magnus: Closer after your last question.
Tzeentch: How are you to know what, if it is bigger than it seems?
Magnus: Do you have nothing else to do and further your plots than impeding me with your most distracting words.
Tzeentch: Well what do you know, maybe I sent a self aware 2 dimensional illusion.
Magnus: I have more eyes than one!
Tzeentch: It doesn't serve you all that much, one eye to books you oh so much and one you rarely open that looks outside. I would look in a mirror once a while however I am sure all would shatter after those horns on chest thingys.
Magnus: Get out!
Tzeentch: It's my planet you get out.
Magnus: AAAAaaagggHHHHH
Magnus did nothing wrong.
He, unlike his father, operated on good faith.
His father denied him knowledge without reason or explanation.
His loyalty was rewarded with betrayal.
14:00 Single combat? "Aided by sister of silence."
That's not how he had one eye,in the early days of Warhammer 40k he was born with one big eye set in his forehead,this is cannon
This was really awesome, I just subscribed.
Cant wait to see your other videos.
Thanks for this.
Funny how most worlds in which the primarch ends up were actually quite fit for them. XD
24:04 Wait, i thought the sword of the God-Emperor had the power to permanently kill demons?
Magnus definitely screwed up, but this video definitely paints him badly lol. Magnus refused to rejoin the Imperium because he couldn't accept having to hunt down all of his sons, and there was a really cool moment that lead to the fight from this. After hearing the Emperors offer, Magnus asked Vulkan if he would accept that offer if it meant killing his sons. Vulkan said that we would not, and then they began fighting (not before as this video implies). I like these videos but this one is pretty biased throughout the video against Magnus
🤷♂
Love Magnus, but his own hubris set him on a path where he always thought he knew better.
Sad story, but Russ and his ignorance of his use of pyskers, meant he was easily manipulated by Horus.
Sadly the same god fucked with them both.
I hoped for redemption for Magnus at some point, tho sadly doubt it will happen.
They were loyal, and again Magnus caused their downfall, instead of going back to terra.
According to new lore, be interesting to see what the Emperor has as a back up to each Primarch.
You're assuming the Emperor is perfect and always right, thought. He's as stubborn and arrogant as Magnus, which makes sense as he did create Magus and all his sons in his own image.
GW are like that kid in school who would copy your homework word for word.
This is exactly how Odin was granted mystical knowledge by sacrificing his eye. At the very least, they could have changed what he gave up. Off the top of my head - Magnus could have sacrificed a nostril.
How unique and memorable is that? Or how about his his upper lip?
Arrogance. Hubris. Fallen Puppet. Magnus led by the nose by chaos.
So the whole population of Prospero along with the one so powerful in the warp( magic) that the Big E himself was conversing almost as with equal never had even a glimpse of the warp Gods? How come? All other Primarchs the crazy Wolf included needed armies of blanks to support them so to even approach Magnus least dueling him at " even odds" , what a jokes compared to the Crimson King they all are. The only thousand in his "legion" were carrying their weight in the crusade along with legions 100 and more times their own number and the worst " accusation" leveled against them was that they didn't butchered 90% of the population of the planets which they brought back to the Imperium, what a scumbags eh.
There are plenty of other erm... inconsistencies in the lore of this franchise but downplaying this particular character powers, the same powers which are elevating the Big E to a godhood for example is one of them.
Keep up the great work man
Fantastic video as always! really like the channel lately! :D
15:25 look at this cookie I found
Keep these amazing videos going
Everything he does ends as a failure. This, more than anything, is the legacy of the Crimson Clown.
Starting with his haircut...
Please do the lion next it seems like he’s about to return so it’d be awesome to have a video to get up to date
I have already Elucidated the Lion brother:
th-cam.com/video/Ry0sBke8qSc/w-d-xo.html
I felt for him. He tried to do well. But unfortunately your intentions to dont mean anything
The Emperor should have kept Magnus by his side the entire time.
That was good ty for video ❤
even though magnus and the thousand sons are bad guys, you can't deny that they got drip
On the last part, magnus kinda sounded like Saruman
The webway failure was actually the emperors fault. Rather than take the time to develop and learn how to build the proper psychicly armored webway material the eldar and old ones used to create the original webway big E did what he always did and chose to be incredibly impatient and build it out of materials that required him to sit on the chair in order to protect his savant terra researchers working inside the webway as they constructed this knock off chinese quality webway. Old Big E takes another L by rather than doing things slowly and the right way he just to be haphazard.
If that is ALL he was doing at the time, that's still a tall order! Even for the best psyker in the imperium. Which, he knew, is exactly why he told Magnus not to. Essential, it's the entire point of Horus Heresy
For most primarchs, the emperor rediscovering them was the worst thing that couldve happened.
F. amazinggggggg...... god tier video ... voice 11/10 .....
Magnus....the very epitome of smart people sometimes being the dumbest.
By the Emperor... he's the Sheldon Cooper of the Primarchs.
More arrogant than dumb. Lack wisdom too.
This seems like less of a explanation of Magnus the red and more blatant slander more than anything.
I finished reading his Primarch book. He is quite powerful, but I was almost begging Perturabo to knock some sense into the big, red nerd. Why couldn't he just do as he is told and listen to other people, who clearly know what they are doing/ talking about? But then again, the book wouldn't have ended the way it did if Magnus hadn't been such an insufferable know-it-all.
He had a good dad :) supportive and giving :) reminds me of my dad except Magnus wasn't shoved into soccer despite being fat with short legs... Sorry, went on a tangent lmao 🤣🤣
Who do you think is the most powerfull primarch, i don't mean the best fighter, best duelist, just the ability to destroy other primarch. For me it's Magnus follow closely by Sanguinius
If magnus was the best primarch killer he wouldn't have had his ass handed to him by Leman Russ.
@@DragonboneWarhammer Kinda hard to win when hes surrounded by Sisters of Silence who negate the VAST majority of his power.
To put it in perspective
When Vulkan fought Magnus...Magnus killed him hundreds of times in a duel
Any non Perpetual Primarch stands no chance without immense help unfortunately
Thr guy even obliterated Malcador witha. thought....and remember...Malcador put Horus in his knees, strangled and gasping for breath... with a single movement of his hand.
@@adrienwatson2179 True. But it sucks that he let his legion get utterly raped before doing anything.
@@DragonboneWarhammer Oh 100%
Hes a total tool bag
MAYBE
If he had picked up the VOX
Leman would have literally captured him peacefully and this WHOLE problem would solve itself
But Magnus was too busy skulking in his tower.
Leman tried to contact him and Magnus ignored it like a child.
Nothinf wrong?
LOTS wrong
@@DragonboneWarhammer Imagine he jas not been a child?
Full loyalist Thousand sons...
Full strength Loyalist Wolves.
If Magnus had picked up the phone.....
Loyalist victory uncontested
I think it's safe to say that the missing two Primarchs were killed by The Wolf King
I'm sorry I can't help but hear Zegram when I think of Magnus.
Is not my best prefered one the ultramarine primarch but best hairstyle 😎
"Would be for the EYE'S of the Crimson king alone" did nobody get the joke there at all 😂?
Damn you, Magnus!!
You fool!!!
oh Maggie you poor thing.
I thought the emperor had already created the same thousand sons long before they were named it.
The one, the only
Remember Magnus did nothing wrong he was manipulated by Tzeench the changer of ways
Hey same as Horus!
So he did everything wrong then
@@benjaminstevens6043 Wrong! Humbug Whoresy did everything wrong, him and Logass Oh-Really-ion are the embodiment of original sin, and for that reason, I will forever shoot super-heated las-bolts at their every depiction and mention. They made Rogal sad, and that in itself is sin enough to demand a World-Eater level of wrathful vengeance. Magnus, however, Mage-ass the in-Bred did nothing wrong, he was more like ammunition for sin rather than the gun. Tzeench shot the mind-wall protecting Terra WITH Magnus, essentially, which I don't think falls on Magnus as being his fault. I could have said all of this in a much more cordial and formal manner but I'm feeling zesty, pardon my crudeness lol.
And if Magnus did nothing wrong then Lucius is the worst swordsman
He destroyed the webway giving demons a way through terra and knew that Horus the reason why wolves destroyed prospero yet still sided with him he did everything wrong
He destroyed the Corpse Emperor's project, because he made a mistake. For some reason, you neglected to mention the fact that it happened because the Corpse Emperor didn't tell him about it, and then he was trying to warn the Corpse Emperor about what Horus was doing. You neglected to mention that, why is that? You also neglected to mention the fact that the Corpse Emperor, by way of the criminal Sigilite's guilty confession to a dying woman, had fully intended for the Primarchs to fratricidally eliminate one another, as he had intended for a massive war between the Legions to happen, all along. Maybe you should actually find out what the Terminus Decree is. Just as the Corpse Emperor did not intend for the Thunder Warriors to live past a certain point, the current day Astartes have lived long beyond what the Corpse Emperor had intended, and he had very much meant to exterminate them all, and make way for yet another order of military slaves. Funny how you didn't mention any of that. Next thing you know, you'll be saying that he treated Angron like a loving father. Why did he side with Horus? Because Horus was fighting the duplicitous backstabber that was pretending to be their father, and had a far darker intent for the Imperium of Mankind, than anything in the Primordial Annihilator ever could.
@Fjb Atyoutube1 PREACH!
@@RobouteGuilliman-M41 Oh for Pete's sake, everyone knows you're not Guilliman, go play with your Alpha Legion buddies, impostor. :P
@fjbatyoutube1681 yea the emperor was an asshole, if he told magnus what the web way project was(mortarion knew) or even told him that tzench existed, wich he also knew, magnus wouldn't have done anything wrong
@@kingleech16 I AM ALPHARIUS!
I really do need to cleanse my bulwark. It has been ages since I last did.
Magnus is like that one cousin we all have that just can’t ever get his sht together…
Bounces from job to job, always needing a small handout to “get em through a tough time”
But the plans, ohh boy howdy the plans they have are so grandiose and seemingly epic if they could just catch a break!!
Never able to look inward to notice the issue being themselves, it’s always someone else who has caused their hardships..
just an observation 😊
Yeah, Magnus needs to learn to take responsibility. He is the only one to blame for what happened. Not the Emperor for denying vital need-to-know information from his military forces and repeatedly demanding Magnus murder his children. Not Erebus for sparking the herasy that Magnus was trying to warn the Emperor about. Not Leman Russ for breaking his soul into pieces and ensuring the Emperor's plan to have Magnus dragged back to Terra to help fix the damage he'd done would be impossible. Not Tzeench the god of schemes and destiny personally intervening to manipulate events.
He clearly has no one to blame but himself for everything that happened. He should have pulled himself up by his own bootstraps, stopped making excuses, and gotten his shit together. Because he is obviously the only person in this galaxy who hasn't managed that.
He's like the nerdy kid who just wanted to do good but ended up screwing up
Magnus legit had a Steve urkel moment 😂
Why can't Magnus get one. W
Protected with runic armour and the combined null-power of the sister(s) of of silence, Lemon Russ would face the crimson king in a duel of steel ALONE 🥴🥴
Magnus have a huge problem . he was created with psychic powers training in that... praise for that ... then you creator/father said the thing who made you unique is banned... making you worthless
Hmmm there is a barrier here i wonder why.
Ok ok.....
Maguns is Thoth, Thoth is Hermes.
The book of Mangus = The Emerald Tablet
enjoy the rabbit hole. You're welcome
I really think the emperor knew that the primarchs would be scattered after watching this ? Why because it’s very suspicious for Magnus to land on a planet of sorcerer’s ? He could of landed on nostramo a night world and his abilities would not be developed so well and could be a violation alpha class pysker . mmmm 🤔 .
Tzeentch could and would have had a hand in this.
The scattering wasn't 100% random
Now do Mini-Magnus
Farsight video when?
If he "Damned" the warp-way watch it be him that "fixes" it😂
Magnus did nothing wrong but Perturabo did everything good.
#4th4ever
#MagnusDidNothingWrong
Falling to chaos is what you get for being a book reading nerd.
But why is he red-
Emps: MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGNUSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Many say that "Magnus did nothing wrong."
I would say that the crimes of arrogance and stupidity are neither blameless nor victimless.
Which is why Lorgar had the right idea. Prostate yourself before the true Gods and reject the arrogant tyrant who is trying to stand against them.
@@YouthRightsRadical "There he is... right over there, Mr. Inquisitor, Sir." ☝
Look at this cookie I've found.