@@charliewest1221 There was nothing like Old Hollywood! I have a collection of 8 by 10 glossies that I bought at Cinema Collectors in Hollywood at Sunset and Wilcox during the times that I have visited Los Angeles. Also visited the old Hollywood Park Cemetary now known as Hollywood Forever Cemetary. I love to read and learn about Old Hollywood such as homes, movie locations and famous sites such as hotels, bars, hangouts. Can't get enough!
@@juancervantes4085 Hi ho, Juan, I was very happy to read your post. Thank you for sharing this. You are very fortunate to have have had the privilege of visitng Hollywood. You will enjoy "Hollywood Story" (1951) which stars Richard Conte, Julie Adams and Fred Clark (if you haven't watched it). Let me know. Cheers for a great weekend.
@@charliewest1221 Thank you Mr. West for your feedback and recommendation. I have not seen it however will certainly look for it. Richard Conte I believe played Don Barzini in Godfather I. VAYA CON DIOS!
As harsh and cruel as Joe was in the breakup scene with Betty, in a way I felt that this was Joe's too late and misguided attempt to be the "stand-up guy" he thought he once was. He knew he had been corrupted, sunk into the depths of his "relationship" with Norma, accept her gifts and control as a metaphor for accepting the riches of Hollywood, and he didn't want Betty to be corrupted too. It was a cruel version of "Its too late for me, save yourself." My key for feeling that way is after cruelly breaking up with Betty he attempts to leave Norma too, not for, or with, Betty but on his own and then ends up face down in the pool for it. Which is of course the metaphor for Hollywood not allowing you to leave until IT'S done with you. - Just a thought.
I think you're right - he's definitely trying to shield her or free her from getting further enmeshed in the situation he's got himself into. You could say there's something admirable about that, but I think the way he goes about it - knowing that the entire situation is a complete surprise and shock to Betty - is particularly cruel because he doesn't even give her a chance to understand what's going on. It's a superb scene, but a hard one.
@@AaronHunter I agree with Michael. I think Joe was trying to be noble. When he overheard Norma on the phone with Betty, he looked disgusted and totally embarrassed and probably decided then that that was the last straw and he was going to leave Norma, Hollywood, and cut ties with fresh faced Betty to save her from association with his sleaze; he also probably felt really guilty about betraying Artie. So he was intentionally cruel to Betty, not because he wanted to (on the contrary), but because he believed if he gave her a soft landing she would rationalize and make excuses for him and try to hang on. By then there was no time to explain anything anyway. In retrospect, if she hadn’t left when she did, crazy Norma would’ve probably shot her too.
I found it hard to understand why he would break up with Betty. Norma has him in a disfunctional relationship, she is manipulating him and trying to make him stay under threat of suicide. But they say that when we pick partners that are disfunctional, its because we are disfunctional ourselves, and healthy people don't pick disfunctional partners, we pick them because it fulfills some function of our own problems.
@@jtt6650 Maybe he feels ashamed of himself as well, and maybe he thinks he's not worthy of Betty, when people fall in love they often feel -oh I dont deserve [the other person].
The picture is well-written and superbly paced, with no unnecessary dialog, or slow spots. The picture moves smoothly from one scene to another. The skillful editing by Doane Harrison keeps the picture moving towards its climactic scene.
When Betty and Joe walk into the room at 43:25 of your video, in the film they stop walking and they are framed by the two arches there. Each of them framed by an arch but the big portrait of Norma is right in the middle, she is litterally coming between them, visually. I think there are so many composition features in this film, but I'm not clever enough to work them out, I just know how they make me feel.
Couldn't agree with you more... the soundtrack is a perfect example how music heightens rhe mood and emotions in the film without being obstrusive... Truly a work of genius!
A response to your shadow analysis, what I realized is the "romanticism" of shadows and lights. I enjoyed your study of BOULEVARD. Incredible filmic mind.
Notice in the scene at Paramount when she’s in DeMille’s chair, a boom mic encroaches on her and she pushes it away, annoyed. The microphone is her nemesis since “talkies” killed the silent era.
I first saw this film when I was 21 it changed my life a adored it , so camp. Gloria Swanson is amazing. Iv see the musical about 18 times . I'm now 66 and hope one day it will be made into a movie. It a GLORIAS PIECES OF WORK.
Thanks! Ha ha, he comes up with some pretty trenchant observations sometimes - as you probably know, kids seem to lack filters (which isn't always great, lol), which allows them to see right to the heart of things sometimes!
I first saw this film as a 12-year-old, and at that young age I noticed a lot of things in its scenic design that enhanced the feeling that Joe is trapped in the world he’s stumbled into. An excellent example of this is the secondary front door, a door made up of bars that makes the house feel like a prison cell. Another note about the scenic design: my first thought as a 12-year-old was “this house feels like a huge attic”. I think that is an apt description of the world of Norma Desmond.
@@jadezee6316 - incidentally, I didn't say that I didn't know he thought he was trapped... I was referring solely to the scenic design, which drives home that image of a man who is trapped in his surroundings. But far be it from me to ruin your snarkiness.
I remember seeing SB first as a small boy ( no doubt adding to my lifelong dread of ever growing up) & too young to fathom the details I sat petrified by the "ghosts that haunt a swimming pool & spooky old house". More than 60 yrs on now & after many viewings I'm pleased that my initial take on this national treasure, er, still holds water.
Glad we agree, sir. It may be a stretch, but I've never been able to shake the idea that Wilder's SB greatly influenced Hitchcock's "Psycho" --- a master's nod in a good natured duel perhaps --- as well an even darker take on Hollywood.
It is said thar the cinematography of Sunset Boulevard is a masterpiece of photographic composition. I watched this film just to learn about composition. The rules of composition, like rule of thirds, frame within frame (his car windscreen) and all that, like the drapes in Normas bedroom are curved and reflect the curves of her form.
The first time I saw Sunset Boulevard I was surprised to see Jack Webb smiling. I had only seen him in Dragnet. He was also in The Men with Marlon Brando.
Unemployed actors and writers are a truthful cliche in Hollywood. Out of the 50,000-odd scripts submitted to studios each year, only a handful ever make it to the screen. Most are stuck in Development Hell forever - if they even manage to be put into development.
30:40 I absolutely LOVE this part where the microphone hits her hat and she sneers and shoved it away… much like how her career and high times rejected the concept of sound and microphones itself… really cool and subtle metaphor to me. This and Chinatown are my fave classic LA films of all time!
Gillis mentions at one point that audiences forget that movies are written, that actors make it up as they go along. This is perhaps the perfect expression of dialogue so real, casting so true to character, that you can't tell what's acting and what's made up.
@@LaurenceDay-d2pWilder still didn't understand American street slang so fluently in noires like Sunset Boulevard and loved using it wherever he could, sometimes improperly.
Reminds me of what I've heard about the Lunts. They would add little bits of unimportant dialogue to the ends of lines so they could interrupt each other. This made their dialogue seem much more real--and made a lot of people think they made up their own dialogue!
Thank you for a brilliant analysis, I want to see all your stuff now. What strikes me about Sunset Boulevard ,which I have never seen mentioned ,is that it is basically a gothic vampire movie brought up to date in a creative way.
Wow this was really great! Sunset Blvd is a favorite and I've seen it many many times. This discussion of it brought out many aspects I hadn't really understood or saw. Great video essay.
I enjoyed your presentation of this movie! Your talent for it made this fascinating to me. Your way of analyzing...exploring...brilliant!! Oh I see a loose connection with the psychological effect that Hollywood has in two other cinematic instances: One is "Whatever Happened to Baby Jane" in which not one but TWO old time Hollywood actresses are featured, and through them we see the pathology. Another example is a Rod Serling "Twilight Zone: episode in which Ida Lupino plays a "has been" actress who secludes herself in her house mainly in a viewing room in which she watches her old movies to create the illusion that nothing has changed. Finally at the end, in Rod Serling "Twilight Zone" fashion, she is able to "walk into the movie" joining her fellow actors, leaving the present world behind forever. Here is the Title of the episode: "The Sixteen-Millimeter Shrine", starring Ida Lupino, is episode four of the American television series The Twilight Zone. It originally aired on October 23, 1959,
❤My OCD has run rampent with this priceless movie,for years! I have stydied every frame of this movie and to me,EVERYTHING about it is perfection,including the score. Your take on it is so good I really enjoyed it,thank you😊❤
Hi, Aaron. I just love your interpretation of one of the finest films I have ever seen (in my top 20). As per Sunset Boulevard, I would like to mention the notion of being a 'kept' man. I have seen many thousands of movies in my time, and the subject is extremely rare. In fact, I cannot think of another example off the top of my head just now. However, one of my very favorite songs, Elton John's "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road," is a great example. The kept man in that song is very different from Joe, as in the song he is telling his meal ticket that he is leaving her. He suggests to her that there are other men out there who would be perfectly willing to be in his place, all the while degrading her. The lines, "Maybe you'll get a replacement, there’s plenty like me to be found - mongrels who ain’t got a penny sniffing for tidbits like you on the ground.” And the of course, “So goodbye Yellow Brick Road, where the dogs of society howl. You can’t plant me in your penthouse, I’m goin’ back to my plow…” I’m sure many people know this famous song. I find it sad and chilling, and every time I hear it it reminds me of SB, and watching SB reminds me of the song. Well that was my 2 cents. Any thoughts on that, anyone out there? And again, Aaron, I love your film analyses. I am a new subscriber. With love from Wonderland.
@@AaronHunter I hear ya. I grew up listening to that song, and never fully realized what it really meant until one day when I listened very intently, and then something clicked, and I said, "aaah" (or Eureka, if you like). I was in my early or mid 20's.
Very interesting comment and quite enjoyable to read. But I have to admit that it was a shock finding out about the “meaning “ of one of my all time favourite songs!! I WAS only about 12 years old when it came out and couldn’t have figured THAT out.
@@thesecondTH-cam thanks, I'll have to check it out. Can't believe I haven't seen that one by now anyway. One more I can think of is B.F.'s daughter from 1948. Not bad.
Watched it for the first time the other evening. Your discussion is great, just as good or better than the historical reviews. The title is what struck me as relevant. I somewhat knew that it would be an iconoclastic statement about the industry and I was not disappointed, especially in the brilliance of Holden and Swanson. Thank you for a great analysis.
i think i was about 12 when i first saw this, and most of the Billy Wilder catalog without knowing that they WERE all Billy Wilder,i hadn't started poring over credits yet 😮. Once i figured out credits, and then started receiving a Leonard. Maltin book every year,i was in movie buff heaven. But, "Sunset" has everything,plus Gloria watching "Queen Kelly" with Von Stroheim running the projector. Boggles the mind. And the 'waxworks'. Hedda Hopper playing herself is Wilders' nasty little joke on nasty little Hedda. And the list goes on. A film that broke the mold. A good double feature with "Whatever Happened To Baby Jane".
When Joe talks about his writing difficulties and his almost resignation that he’ll have to go back to Ohio and work for his hometown newspaper and endure the people there whom he imagines- and likely accurately- will talk about how he couldn’t make it in Hollywood or California more broadly, that’s a very relatable fear for people who’ve moved a long distance from where they grew up to ‘make it’ in California. For the many of us who’ve done that and followed our California dreams to make a life for ourselves in the sunshine, whether in Hollywood or in whatever we’re doing, the fear of having to go back because we couldn’t make it work is a very real one. I used to have bad dreams about it, lol. So when he focuses on that as the narrator, it’s instantly relatable and authentic.
As Thomas Wolfe wrote "You can't go home again." Joe Gills was just one of thousands of men and women who had their dreams destroyed by the Hollywood jungle. I suspect that his efforts to sell his writing were what Billy Wilder himself endured when he first came to Hollywood as a European refugee. Wilder's life itself would make a fascinating motion picture.
One thing that amaze me with movie history, is that so ridiculously many movies among the "all time classics" are horror movies, or at least profoundly inspired by the genre, like Sunset Boulevard. Billy Wilder's movie is a neo-gothic masterpiece, and it reminds us of Citizen Kane. The horror genre is _in theory_ the lowest of genres, but _in reality_ movie makers are fascinated by it.
Great insight! The ability of movies to depict our greatest fears is immense, regardless of their generic packaging (although, I have a lot of colleagues who would disagree with the categorisation of horror as low, lol!).
Have seen the movie and like yourself was swept up into it. So I have super enjoyed listening to your breakdown and analogy of this iconic story. Thank you.
Wow you did a wonderful job sharing MORE to this. Who knew I would watch it from beginning to end. Thank you for your insight and I look forward to watching this with fresh new eyes.
45:00 I had a similar life. I lived in L.A., West L.A., and Santa Monica. My background was also in performance, emphasizing acting and directing. I also had "entanglements" that led to tragedy, the events of some unknown to this day. I relate to this moment in how people learn about what should otherwise seem inevitable. What is most likely bound to happen to those undeserving is, for the first and last time, being revealed. From my perspective, Joe is recognizing that he's failed as a man to meet the challenges of life and what would make him deserving of life, and he is making a confession. He's an imposter, in other words. Hence, this foreshadows his end in celluloid logic. If you haven't noticed, I sympathize with Joe. The reason is that Joe has yet to succeed as a writer. Let's remember that Betty is the gatekeeper. Joe is emasculated from the beginning. He's forced into the role of a Giggolo and playing second fiddle. Last but not least, let's not fail to appreciate that Joe, the narrator, is already dead. The man is dead.
Norma's look at Joe before he embraces her after her suicide attempt seems to say, yes its worked, she's managed to maniplate him. I think she knows what she is doing, but she probably can't help herself, she can't not do it because she's messed up.
He knows he is being kept, and she knows he knows. In one line of dialogue he asks "What right do you have?" and Norma snaps: "What right? Do you want me to tell you?" Joe's acceptance of the role of kept male whore doesn't say much for his character. Keeping young studs is a common practice among wealthy Hollywood women - and men.
When Norma goes to see a confused Cecil B at the studio he tells her to sit in his chair and make herself comfortable while he goes to speak to Gordon Cole to find out why he has been calling Norma. It's interesting to notice as she sits in the chair something irritates her by brushing against the feather in her hat? Realising it is a microphone she pushes it contemptuously aside, after all, it is the instrument that records the sound, the cause as she sees it, as the thing that ended her career. It's a wonderful subtle unspoken comment by Norma about her view of the world as it is in that present time.
A lot of Wilder's movies were like this. WW2 generation man against the soulless organization. No one better captured the era. Who else would have made movies about Hollywood, the media, a POW camp, the police, Coca-Cola and three insurance companies?
really enjoyed this... thanks so much. I got here from a little dive into Wes Anderson's films, specifically from watching the trailer for Asteroid which I watched and immediately was struck by all the white people, or rather, the absence of POC. The 'dive' was to see if others have a like reaction. Im not going to see it - don't want to collude or participate - rightly or wrongly. However, I am so glad to have stumbled on your channel. Good work. - olympic peninsula, wa, usa
I first saw this movie in the 60s when I was a kid, always liked it, quite a frightening last staircase scene when you are a child. I must have watched it 20 times since, it gets better every time!... obviously now it's getting to be a peephole on history! It's amusing how " Norma" who was 50!!!! Was classed as a "has been", the thought of a 50 year old actually having sex!!!! With a younger man😢😢 shock, horror, court case! Try telling Countney Cox or Jennifer Anniston that!!!.... A different time, a different world! Love that Vicuna overcoat she buys him!!!
I always wonder what Billy Wyler was thinking, starting the movie with William Holden waking in the morgue, in the scene that was later cut out. The test audience fall about laughing when they saw it.
You have all got to read her bio, Swanson on Swanson. And then read, Gloria Swanson, The Ultimate Star by Stephen Michael Shearer and the please read the Vanity Fair Article that came out very recently!! Please read in that order! The uncovered truth on Swanson throughout those three books is incredible!! In the end, during the writing of her Bio - she became Norma Desmond!! I won't spoil anymore of it for you. Read those three books in that order!!
The lead was originally going to be Mae West! (And they did use her swan-shaped bed.) And the story was based partly on something that had actually happened to her. She got a call about a part in Gone With the Wind and she assumed they wanted her for Scarlett. Turned out they wanted her for Belle Watling. She was insulted and refused. They made this into Norma thinking they wanted her back to make a picture when they only wanted her car.
I think sunset blvd is great because the premise of the story was believeable! Most importantly the acting was so outstanding it wasnt a campy parody! The real life connections between the people in the film and being in black white also made the film more effective!
The only thing that drives me crazy is when William Holden's character goes up the driveway of Norma Desmond's mansion to escape the repo guys. Holden brings his car to a halt up the driveway then raises his head up like an ostrich to see the repo guy's car go by. I Would of told Billy Wilder, "Hey look, you've got to re-shoot this. Bill Holden should be diving down in the seat when he brings the car to a stop in the driveway." In real life, the repo guy riding shotgun would have probably spotted Holden with his head raised up high looking down the driveway. I think they should re-shoot this with a Bill Holden double, you could shoot it from behind the car, not seeing the double's face, the double would dive down into the seat, insert this into the original movie, then it would be perfect!
I know I’m late to responding to this. I enjoyed your commentary. But, how can this not be seen as a strait up noir? All the elements are there…in a Hollywood setting.
It's a good question - one of the difficulties of generic classification is that once we bore down into any particular genre, the elements that classify/qualify a particular film as a genre become more elusive. At the same time, it can become easier to see other generic elements creeping in (see the comment above that refers to SB as horror!). In this case, it has a LOT of the elements of classic noir, but it's missing the gumshoe, the central "crime" to be investigated (sort of), a particular type of femme fatale, etc. I wouldn't say the variations on those conventions make this NOT noir, but that they might be different enough to make categorisation less simple.
Was that really Schwab's Drug Store in the film or was it a recreation of it? Even a young Jack Webb was in the film. I wonder if that was his first film.
Long shots, establishing shots part of the era Heel turn for narrative, up to now his sympathetic pov Gothic instability, close up shot and lots of reveals/twists. Hollywood using people and then victims becoming perpetrators. Vampiric element. Unsettling things like speaking from the dead. Betty as real tragedy, lured in from innocent position
If I am not mistaken, Montgomery Clift was originally set to play Joe Gillis. However, he turned it down as his relationship with Torch Singer Libby Holman hit too close to home. By the way I know that the Norma Desmond Mansion was real and no longer exists and was torn down a while back. Does anyone have any pictures of the Mansion that you could share with all of us fans of Sunset Boulevard?
Hard to imagine that Montgomery Clift had a relationship with a woman, since Clift was gay. Maybe Libby Holman was a fag hag. I never heard of her. And anything going on between Holman and Clift could have been for appearance sake. Such things were done back then.
Theres a book out there, came out a few years ago. The monkey; what was the big deal about the monkey? This book posited that the writers, producers were subtly telling the audience that this has-been movie star was having se* with the monkey. The entire movie was sort of macabre but it was actually quite real. Surreal.
The picture contains a few glaring flaws and inconsistencies. If such great pains had been taken to prevent Norma from committing suicide, such as removing all the door knobs, how did she get the gun? Also, it is an automatic, not a revolver. And having had no training in firearms, with a gun she had just purchased, she shoots Joe with pinpoint accuracy in the back and then in the chest - no way could she have done that. The scene is a vivid melodramatic climax, but no way could it have happened in real life.
If Joe does not want to leave Norma for Betty because he likes the set up, deal, then why shortly thereafter does Joe in fact leave Norma? This video never answers or even addresses that question.
Because he didn’t actually “like the set up.” He was ashamed of it, and his shame was too great to feel “worthy” of Betty. So he was cruel to her in order to make her lose her affection for him (affection he didn’t feel he “deserved” from her), and once that was accomplished, he planned to go back to Ohio, a failure.
Music "dated"?😡 What options - Liszt Rhapsody? Glenn Miller? Doris Day? Marilyn Manson? Music OF its time, for a same-era film, is NOT DATED. *Be sure of quality points to say before posting them.*
Excuse me, sir, where I'm from, and based on the looks of it, this house would be considered a mansion. I know it sounds trite, but nuances matter if you're trying to do the best job of making a theory fundamental; I mean, selling it in place of a "construct" to lend a greater meaning to the subject. No, this is not just a decrepit house; it's a dilapidated mansion in the middle of "Holloweird." Having said this, the pitch is to sell you on comparing and contrasting the Mulholland Drive to Sunset Boulevard. Why? I think Mr. David Lynch thinks he's clever, but in reality, he's made a name for himself by stealing someone else's ideas. More than this, it will reveal more as it highlights more connections; for example, the name of the former is a salute to the last name of the man who gave us water in Chinatown, Los Angeles. Maybe this is all more babble for babble's sake, I don't know; ask your son about his opinion. Enjoyed your work, Mr. Hunter.
![[#2024MAMA] ROSÉ (로제), Bruno Mars - APT. | Mnet 241122 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/dgGqD28J6aQ/mqdefault.jpg)
I saw it in the theater a few weeks ago. I was knocked out all over again, especially by Gloria Swanson. She’s unbelievable.
Erich von Stroheim, in my opinion, delivers one of the finest performances, ever, in a supporting role. Truly a masterclass.
He was a historically great director, so it's not a surprise.
@@paulfrantizek102
I watched him recently in "I was an Adventuress" with Peter Lorre. He's brilliant there as well (in a surprisingly different role).
@@charliewest1221
There was nothing like Old Hollywood!
I have a collection of 8 by 10 glossies
that I bought at Cinema Collectors in Hollywood at Sunset and Wilcox during the times that I have visited Los Angeles. Also visited the old Hollywood Park Cemetary now known as Hollywood Forever Cemetary. I love to read and learn about Old Hollywood such as homes, movie locations and famous sites such as hotels, bars, hangouts. Can't get enough!
@@juancervantes4085
Hi ho, Juan, I was very happy to read your post. Thank you for sharing this. You are very fortunate to have have had the privilege of visitng Hollywood.
You will enjoy "Hollywood Story" (1951) which stars Richard Conte, Julie Adams and Fred Clark (if you haven't watched it). Let me know.
Cheers for a great weekend.
@@charliewest1221
Thank you Mr. West for your feedback and recommendation. I have not seen it however will certainly look for it. Richard Conte I believe played Don Barzini in Godfather I.
VAYA CON DIOS!
As harsh and cruel as Joe was in the breakup scene with Betty, in a way I felt that this was Joe's too late and misguided attempt to be the "stand-up guy" he thought he once was. He knew he had been corrupted, sunk into the depths of his "relationship" with Norma, accept her gifts and control as a metaphor for accepting the riches of Hollywood, and he didn't want Betty to be corrupted too. It was a cruel version of "Its too late for me, save yourself." My key for feeling that way is after cruelly breaking up with Betty he attempts to leave Norma too, not for, or with, Betty but on his own and then ends up face down in the pool for it. Which is of course the metaphor for Hollywood not allowing you to leave until IT'S done with you. - Just a thought.
I think you're right - he's definitely trying to shield her or free her from getting further enmeshed in the situation he's got himself into. You could say there's something admirable about that, but I think the way he goes about it - knowing that the entire situation is a complete surprise and shock to Betty - is particularly cruel because he doesn't even give her a chance to understand what's going on. It's a superb scene, but a hard one.
Michael, you nailed it.
@@AaronHunter I agree with Michael. I think Joe was trying to be noble. When he overheard Norma on the phone with Betty, he looked disgusted and totally embarrassed and probably decided then that that was the last straw and he was going to leave Norma, Hollywood, and cut ties with fresh faced Betty to save her from association with his sleaze; he also probably felt really guilty about betraying Artie. So he was intentionally cruel to Betty, not because he wanted to (on the contrary), but because he believed if he gave her a soft landing she would rationalize and make excuses for him and try to hang on. By then there was no time to explain anything anyway. In retrospect, if she hadn’t left when she did, crazy Norma would’ve probably shot her too.
I found it hard to understand why he would break up with Betty. Norma has him in a disfunctional relationship, she is manipulating him and trying to make him stay under threat of suicide. But they say that when we pick partners that are disfunctional, its because we are disfunctional ourselves, and healthy people don't pick disfunctional partners, we pick them because it fulfills some function of our own problems.
@@jtt6650 Maybe he feels ashamed of himself as well, and maybe he thinks he's not worthy of Betty, when people fall in love they often feel -oh I dont deserve [the other person].
The picture is well-written and superbly paced, with no unnecessary dialog, or slow spots. The picture moves smoothly from one scene to another. The skillful editing by Doane Harrison keeps the picture moving towards its climactic scene.
Gloria Swanson is incredible in Sunset Boulevard.
When Betty and Joe walk into the room at 43:25 of your video, in the film they stop walking and they are framed by the two arches there. Each of them framed by an arch but the big portrait of Norma is right in the middle, she is litterally coming between them, visually. I think there are so many composition features in this film, but I'm not clever enough to work them out, I just know how they make me feel.
2:00 Franz Waxman's Oscar-winning score....dated?? No, it's timeless. Mysterious, sardonic, haunting, subtle, climatic. Brilliant.
Couldn't agree with you more... the soundtrack is a perfect example how music heightens rhe mood and emotions in the film without being obstrusive... Truly a work of genius!
The skillful score adds to the overall mood and tone of the film, especially the eerie dubbed-in organ music.
A response to your shadow analysis, what I realized is the "romanticism" of shadows and lights. I enjoyed your study of BOULEVARD. Incredible filmic mind.
Notice in the scene at Paramount when she’s in DeMille’s chair, a boom mic encroaches on her and she pushes it away, annoyed. The microphone is her nemesis since “talkies” killed the silent era.
I always loved that, Swanson was brilliant
Great point! Watched the film many, many times and just saw that scene 30 min ago in another video. Never picked up on that.
I first saw this film when I was 21 it changed my life a adored it , so camp. Gloria Swanson is amazing. Iv see the musical about 18 times . I'm now 66 and hope one day it will be made into a movie. It a GLORIAS PIECES OF WORK.
Fantastic discussion, Aaron. I like your son’s observation that Sunset Boulevard seems filmed at night.
Thanks! Ha ha, he comes up with some pretty trenchant observations sometimes - as you probably know, kids seem to lack filters (which isn't always great, lol), which allows them to see right to the heart of things sometimes!
I first saw this film as a 12-year-old, and at that young age I noticed a lot of things in its scenic design that enhanced the feeling that Joe is trapped in the world he’s stumbled into. An excellent example of this is the secondary front door, a door made up of bars that makes the house feel like a prison cell. Another note about the scenic design: my first thought as a 12-year-old was “this house feels like a huge attic”. I think that is an apt description of the world of Norma Desmond.
maybe you should have paid attention to the dialogue....because "Joe"...TELLS YOU he is trapped about 5 times ...at least during the movie
@@jadezee6316 - I'll go back in time and let my 12-year-old self know this. 🙄
@@jadezee6316 - incidentally, I didn't say that I didn't know he thought he was trapped... I was referring solely to the scenic design, which drives home that image of a man who is trapped in his surroundings. But far be it from me to ruin your snarkiness.
I remember seeing SB first as a small boy ( no doubt adding to my lifelong dread of ever growing up) & too young to fathom the details I sat petrified by the "ghosts that haunt a swimming pool & spooky old house". More than 60 yrs on now & after many viewings I'm pleased that my initial take on this national treasure, er, still holds water.
Glad we agree, sir. It may be a stretch, but I've never been able to shake the idea that Wilder's SB greatly influenced Hitchcock's "Psycho" --- a master's nod in a good natured duel perhaps --- as well an even darker take on Hollywood.
It is said thar the cinematography of Sunset Boulevard is a masterpiece of photographic composition. I watched this film just to learn about composition. The rules of composition, like rule of thirds, frame within frame (his car windscreen) and all that, like the drapes in Normas bedroom are curved and reflect the curves of her form.
The first time I saw Sunset Boulevard I was surprised to see Jack Webb smiling. I had only seen him in Dragnet. He was also in The Men with Marlon Brando.
I never thought of it before but Humphrey Bogart in In a Lonely Place (which I have on DVD) was a Hollywood screenwriter who is down on his luck.
Unemployed actors and writers are a truthful cliche in Hollywood. Out of the 50,000-odd scripts submitted to studios each year, only a handful ever make it to the screen. Most are stuck in Development Hell forever - if they even manage to be put into development.
This was the movie that I turned my son on to years ago. He has loved old movies ever since!! Good choice!
30:40 I absolutely LOVE this part where the microphone hits her hat and she sneers and shoved it away… much like how her career and high times rejected the concept of sound and microphones itself… really cool and subtle metaphor to me. This and Chinatown are my fave classic LA films of all time!
Thanks so much for your work on this vlog ... and your passion! Kind regards from Marseille
Gillis mentions at one point that audiences forget that movies are written, that actors make it up as they go along. This is perhaps the perfect expression of dialogue so real, casting so true to character, that you can't tell what's acting and what's made up.
Note: Some actors do make up lines on-set, and some of the best lines n films were ad-libbed.
@@LaurenceDay-d2pWilder still didn't understand American street slang so fluently in noires like Sunset Boulevard and loved using it wherever he could, sometimes improperly.
Reminds me of what I've heard about the Lunts. They would add little bits of unimportant dialogue to the ends of lines so they could interrupt each other. This made their dialogue seem much more real--and made a lot of people think they made up their own dialogue!
Thank you for a brilliant analysis, I want to see all your stuff now. What strikes me about Sunset Boulevard ,which I have never seen mentioned ,is that it is basically a gothic vampire movie brought up to date in a creative way.
I like that analogy!
Wow this was really great! Sunset Blvd is a favorite and I've seen it many many times. This discussion of it brought out many aspects I hadn't really understood or saw. Great video essay.
Schwabs Pharmacy was even featured in this classic film. There were good golden era stars in the movie too. The oldness makes it so good.
I enjoyed your presentation of this movie! Your talent for it made this fascinating to me. Your way of analyzing...exploring...brilliant!! Oh I see a loose connection with the psychological effect that Hollywood has in two other cinematic instances: One is "Whatever Happened to Baby Jane" in which not one but TWO old time Hollywood actresses are featured, and through them we see the pathology. Another example is a Rod Serling "Twilight Zone: episode in which Ida Lupino plays a "has been" actress who secludes herself in her house mainly in a viewing room in which she watches her old movies to create the illusion that nothing has changed. Finally at the end, in Rod Serling "Twilight Zone" fashion, she is able to "walk into the movie" joining her fellow actors, leaving the present world behind forever. Here is the Title of the episode: "The Sixteen-Millimeter Shrine", starring Ida Lupino, is episode four of the American television series The Twilight Zone. It originally aired on October 23, 1959,
❤My OCD has run rampent with this priceless movie,for years! I have stydied every frame of this movie and to me,EVERYTHING about it is perfection,including the score. Your take on it is so good I really enjoyed it,thank you😊❤
Hi, Aaron. I just love your interpretation of one of the finest films I have ever seen (in my top 20). As per Sunset Boulevard, I would like to mention the notion of being a 'kept' man. I have seen many thousands of movies in my time, and the subject is extremely rare. In fact, I cannot think of another example off the top of my head just now.
However, one of my very favorite songs, Elton John's "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road," is a great example. The kept man in that song is very different from Joe, as in the song he is telling his meal ticket that he is leaving her. He suggests to her that there are other men out there who would be perfectly willing to be in his place, all the while degrading her. The lines, "Maybe you'll get a replacement, there’s plenty like me to be found - mongrels who ain’t got a penny sniffing for tidbits like you on the ground.” And the of course, “So goodbye Yellow Brick Road, where the dogs of society howl. You can’t plant me in your penthouse, I’m goin’ back to my plow…”
I’m sure many people know this famous song. I find it sad and chilling, and every time I hear it it reminds me of SB, and watching SB reminds me of the song.
Well that was my 2 cents. Any thoughts on that, anyone out there? And again, Aaron, I love your film analyses. I am a new subscriber. With love from Wonderland.
That's a really cool interpretation - I've never thought of that song (which I've heard. a million times) like that. Thanks!
@@AaronHunter I hear ya. I grew up listening to that song, and never fully realized what it really meant until one day when I listened very intently, and then something clicked, and I said, "aaah" (or Eureka, if you like). I was in my early or mid 20's.
Very interesting comment and quite enjoyable to read. But I have to admit that it was a shock finding out about the “meaning “ of one of my all time favourite songs!! I WAS only about 12 years old when it came out and couldn’t have figured THAT out.
Breakfast at tiffany's. Paul Varjak.
@@thesecondTH-cam thanks, I'll have to check it out. Can't believe I haven't seen that one by now anyway. One more I can think of is B.F.'s daughter from 1948. Not bad.
Watched it for the first time the other evening. Your discussion is great, just as good or better than the historical reviews. The title is what struck me as relevant. I somewhat knew that it would be an iconoclastic statement about the industry and I was not disappointed, especially in the brilliance of Holden and Swanson. Thank you for a great analysis.
i think i was about 12 when i first saw this, and most of the Billy Wilder catalog without knowing that they WERE all Billy Wilder,i hadn't started poring over credits yet 😮. Once i figured out credits, and then started receiving a Leonard. Maltin book every year,i was in movie buff heaven.
But, "Sunset" has everything,plus Gloria watching "Queen Kelly" with Von Stroheim running the projector. Boggles the mind. And the 'waxworks'. Hedda Hopper playing herself is Wilders' nasty little joke on nasty little Hedda. And the list goes on. A film that broke the mold. A good double feature with "Whatever Happened To Baby Jane".
Great analysis! Just saw this movie the other month, loved it. Thanks for going through the layers.
Film noir is not a genre. It's a style. And Sunset Boulevard fits completely into that style.
Well said.
When Joe talks about his writing difficulties and his almost resignation that he’ll have to go back to Ohio and work for his hometown newspaper and endure the people there whom he imagines- and likely accurately- will talk about how he couldn’t make it in Hollywood or California more broadly, that’s a very relatable fear for people who’ve moved a long distance from where they grew up to ‘make it’ in California. For the many of us who’ve done that and followed our California dreams to make a life for ourselves in the sunshine, whether in Hollywood or in whatever we’re doing, the fear of having to go back because we couldn’t make it work is a very real one. I used to have bad dreams about it, lol. So when he focuses on that as the narrator, it’s instantly relatable and authentic.
As Thomas Wolfe wrote "You can't go home again." Joe Gills was just one of thousands of men and women who had their dreams destroyed by the Hollywood jungle. I suspect that his efforts to sell his writing were what Billy Wilder himself endured when he first came to Hollywood as a European refugee. Wilder's life itself would make a fascinating motion picture.
I watched it last year on TMC. I had to see again.
One thing that amaze me with movie history, is that so ridiculously many movies among the "all time classics" are horror movies, or at least profoundly inspired by the genre, like Sunset Boulevard. Billy Wilder's movie is a neo-gothic masterpiece, and it reminds us of Citizen Kane. The horror genre is _in theory_ the lowest of genres, but _in reality_ movie makers are fascinated by it.
Great insight! The ability of movies to depict our greatest fears is immense, regardless of their generic packaging (although, I have a lot of colleagues who would disagree with the categorisation of horror as low, lol!).
The excellent black and white photography is also appropriate. The picture would not have the same mood if filmed in color.
A movie classic, that still today, 2024, still stands the test of time, and it always will another masterpiece 👌, by the legendary, Billy wilder 🎉
Aaron hunters critique of this movie is brilliant he has made a fan of me
Have seen the movie and like yourself was swept up into it. So I have super enjoyed listening to your breakdown and analogy of this iconic story. Thank you.
brilliant
My favorite film of all time.
Wow you did a wonderful job sharing MORE to this. Who knew I would watch it from beginning to end. Thank you for your insight and I look forward to watching this with fresh new eyes.
Thanks, much appreciated! Hope you have a very happy new year!
Wonderful ,I learnt so much,about this brilliant classic.
Thank you for your wonderful insights. I have always loved this film, one of my favorites!
45:00 I had a similar life. I lived in L.A., West L.A., and Santa Monica. My background was also in performance, emphasizing acting and directing. I also had "entanglements" that led to tragedy, the events of some unknown to this day. I relate to this moment in how people learn about what should otherwise seem inevitable.
What is most likely bound to happen to those undeserving is, for the first and last time, being revealed. From my perspective, Joe is recognizing that he's failed as a man to meet the challenges of life and what would make him deserving of life, and he is making a confession. He's an imposter, in other words. Hence, this foreshadows his end in celluloid logic.
If you haven't noticed, I sympathize with Joe. The reason is that Joe has yet to succeed as a writer. Let's remember that Betty is the gatekeeper. Joe is emasculated from the beginning. He's forced into the role of a Giggolo and playing second fiddle. Last but not least, let's not fail to appreciate that Joe, the narrator, is already dead. The man is dead.
Norma's look at Joe before he embraces her after her suicide attempt seems to say, yes its worked, she's managed to maniplate him. I think she knows what she is doing, but she probably can't help herself, she can't not do it because she's messed up.
What is best is your sincere enjoyment and willingness to share your thoughts with us
Excellent... this should be shown after the film in film study classes!
Norma keeps Joe as her "financial hostage".
He knows he is being kept, and she knows he knows. In one line of dialogue he asks "What right do you have?" and Norma snaps: "What right? Do you want me to tell you?" Joe's acceptance of the role of kept male whore doesn't say much for his character. Keeping young studs is a common practice among wealthy Hollywood women - and men.
Max and Norma. Many many decades later that machination is the backbone of "Let the Right One in," a vampire "love" story.
When Norma goes to see a confused Cecil B at the studio he tells her to sit in his chair and make herself comfortable while he goes to speak to Gordon Cole to find out why he has been calling Norma.
It's interesting to notice as she sits in the chair something irritates her by brushing against the feather in her hat? Realising it is a microphone she pushes it contemptuously aside, after all, it is the instrument that records the sound, the cause as she sees it, as the thing that ended her career. It's a wonderful subtle unspoken comment by Norma about her view of the world as it is in that present time.
A lot of Wilder's movies were like this. WW2 generation man against the soulless organization. No one better captured the era. Who else would have made movies about Hollywood, the media, a POW camp, the police, Coca-Cola and three insurance companies?
Aaron: These are interesting and fun. Keep going.
really enjoyed this... thanks so much. I got here from a little dive into Wes Anderson's films, specifically from watching the trailer for Asteroid which I watched and immediately was struck by all the white people, or rather, the absence of POC. The 'dive' was to see if others have a like reaction. Im not going to see it - don't want to collude or participate - rightly or wrongly. However, I am so glad to have stumbled on your channel. Good work. - olympic peninsula, wa, usa
Great analysis!
Great observations of a great film!
If you drive east on Sunset Boulevard, does it eventually become Sunrise Boulevard? :)
Great analysis. Thanks.
I first saw this movie in the 60s when I was a kid, always liked it, quite a frightening last staircase scene when you are a child. I must have watched it 20 times since, it gets better every time!... obviously now it's getting to be a peephole on history!
It's amusing how " Norma" who was 50!!!! Was classed as a "has been", the thought of a 50 year old actually having sex!!!! With a younger man😢😢 shock, horror, court case! Try telling Countney Cox or Jennifer Anniston that!!!.... A different time, a different world!
Love that Vicuna overcoat she buys him!!!
I always wonder what Billy Wyler was thinking, starting the movie with William Holden waking in the morgue, in the scene that was later cut out. The test audience fall about laughing when they saw it.
You have all got to read her bio, Swanson on Swanson. And then read, Gloria Swanson, The Ultimate Star by Stephen Michael Shearer and the please read the Vanity Fair Article that came out very recently!! Please read in that order! The uncovered truth on Swanson throughout those three books is incredible!! In the end, during the writing of her Bio - she became Norma Desmond!! I won't spoil anymore of it for you. Read those three books in that order!!
The lead was originally going to be Mae West! (And they did use her swan-shaped bed.) And the story was based partly on something that had actually happened to her. She got a call about a part in Gone With the Wind and she assumed they wanted her for Scarlett. Turned out they wanted her for Belle Watling. She was insulted and refused. They made this into Norma thinking they wanted her back to make a picture when they only wanted her car.
I think sunset blvd is great because the premise of the story was believeable! Most importantly the acting was so outstanding it wasnt a campy parody! The real life connections between the people in the film and being in black white also made the film more effective!
Brilliant analysis of a masterpiece.
Yeah, it's a great picture. I haven't seen it in a while. I'm not sure I wanna go back there...
Amusing Note: After watching the film, silent star Mae Murray remarked, "None of us floozies were THAT nuts!"
David Lynch is a huge fan of SUNSET BLVD (see MULHOLLAND DR). In TWIN PEAKS: FIRE WALK WITH ME he plays an FBI agent named Gordon Cole.
Betty is a woman on the move and a rounded character. I'm reminded again of the making of characters in Mulholland Drive.
The only thing that drives me crazy is when William Holden's character goes up the driveway of Norma Desmond's mansion to escape the repo guys. Holden brings his car to a halt up the driveway then raises his head up like an ostrich to see the repo guy's car go by. I Would of told Billy Wilder, "Hey look, you've got to re-shoot this. Bill Holden should be diving down in the seat when he brings the car to a stop in the driveway." In real life, the repo guy riding shotgun would have probably spotted Holden with his head raised up high looking down the driveway. I think they should re-shoot this with a Bill Holden double, you could shoot it from behind the car, not seeing the double's face, the double would dive down into the seat, insert this into the original movie, then it would be perfect!
Salome Herod's WIFE????? She was his step-daughter.
I know I’m late to responding to this. I enjoyed your commentary.
But, how can this not be seen as a strait up noir? All the elements are there…in a Hollywood setting.
It's a good question - one of the difficulties of generic classification is that once we bore down into any particular genre, the elements that classify/qualify a particular film as a genre become more elusive. At the same time, it can become easier to see other generic elements creeping in (see the comment above that refers to SB as horror!). In this case, it has a LOT of the elements of classic noir, but it's missing the gumshoe, the central "crime" to be investigated (sort of), a particular type of femme fatale, etc. I wouldn't say the variations on those conventions make this NOT noir, but that they might be different enough to make categorisation less simple.
Silent star Swanson playing someone who was in many ways her opposite was a real tour de'force.
Was that really Schwab's Drug Store in the film or was it a recreation of it?
Even a young Jack Webb was in the film. I wonder if that was his first film.
Salome was Herod’s step daughter.
❤
It was film at stage 5 before the 1969-1974 tv classic Brady Bunch
Gloria Swanson was forever tied to this movie like Fay Wray was always tied to King Kong . This was despite a fabulous total career .
Long shots, establishing shots part of the era
Heel turn for narrative, up to now his sympathetic pov
Gothic instability, close up shot and lots of reveals/twists.
Hollywood using people and then victims becoming perpetrators. Vampiric element.
Unsettling things like speaking from the dead.
Betty as real tragedy, lured in from innocent position
All I could think of after watching this as well as the whole movie Sunset Blvd. was Meghan and Harry.
If I am not mistaken, Montgomery Clift was originally set to play Joe Gillis. However, he turned it down as his relationship with Torch Singer Libby Holman hit too close to home.
By the way I know that the Norma Desmond Mansion was real and no longer exists and was torn down a while back. Does anyone have any pictures of the Mansion that you could share with all of us fans of Sunset Boulevard?
Hard to imagine that Montgomery Clift had a relationship with a woman, since Clift was gay. Maybe Libby Holman was a fag hag. I never heard of her. And anything going on between Holman and Clift could have been for appearance sake. Such things were done back then.
I do know they also used the house for the old mansion in Rebel Without a Cause.
Theres a book out there, came out a few years ago. The monkey; what was the big deal about the monkey? This book posited that the writers, producers were subtly telling the audience that this has-been movie star was having se* with the monkey. The entire movie was sort of macabre but it was actually quite real. Surreal.
Norma is the voice of insanity, and Betty is the voice of reason.
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Oh yes. So painful I don't want to watch it again. Ever watch the biodoc on Gloria Swanson? She poignantly was totally unlike Norma.
The picture contains a few glaring flaws and inconsistencies. If such great pains had been taken to prevent Norma from committing suicide, such as removing all the door knobs, how did she get the gun? Also, it is an automatic, not a revolver. And having had no training in firearms, with a gun she had just purchased, she shoots Joe with pinpoint accuracy in the back and then in the chest - no way could she have done that. The scene is a vivid melodramatic climax, but no way could it have happened in real life.
I would have liked this film much more if I didn't know that Gillis was going to die at the end. So skip the first scene.
If Joe does not want to leave Norma for Betty because he likes the set up, deal, then why shortly thereafter does Joe in fact leave Norma? This video never answers or even addresses that question.
Because he didn’t actually “like the set up.” He was ashamed of it, and his shame was too great to feel “worthy” of Betty. So he was cruel to her in order to make her lose her affection for him (affection he didn’t feel he “deserved” from her), and once that was accomplished, he planned to go back to Ohio, a failure.
Music "dated"?😡 What options - Liszt Rhapsody? Glenn Miller? Doris Day? Marilyn Manson? Music OF its time, for a same-era film, is NOT DATED. *Be sure of quality points to say before posting them.*
Joe was a gigolo.
I wish he would show the film and just shut up
Excuse me, sir, where I'm from, and based on the looks of it, this house would be considered a mansion. I know it sounds trite, but nuances matter if you're trying to do the best job of making a theory fundamental; I mean, selling it in place of a "construct" to lend a greater meaning to the subject. No, this is not just a decrepit house; it's a dilapidated mansion in the middle of "Holloweird."
Having said this, the pitch is to sell you on comparing and contrasting the Mulholland Drive to Sunset Boulevard. Why? I think Mr. David Lynch thinks he's clever, but in reality, he's made a name for himself by stealing someone else's ideas.
More than this, it will reveal more as it highlights more connections; for example, the name of the former is a salute to the last name of the man who gave us water in Chinatown, Los Angeles. Maybe this is all more babble for babble's sake, I don't know; ask your son about his opinion. Enjoyed your work, Mr. Hunter.
Organ, not "keyboard"... Ugh
I’m an idiot and I just realized that Altman’s The Player is hugely influenced by this movie. Or a homage or a rip off etc.
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That's easy for you to say.
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