I feel like this is the final stage of showing the punk or freedom or liberation of expression side to Electronic music and the Electronic scene. Regardless is this gets a massive buzz or if this preserves in starving undermined talent, this will be the keystone to how to form your imagination into and endless space of imagination.
What Autechre do could probably be called live coding, but they are pretty hush-hush and proprietary about their methods, which conflicts with the transparent philosophy of Algorave.
@@sweepstakes they're not literally typing live code live, or if they are it's not at all like this. they used machinedrums, monomachines and other elektron devices for a while which themselves are capable of making generative stuff, and they also use max/msp live, but they've said they have systems set up that is more akin to moving faders and changing values to jam, if you listen to the machinedrum and monomachine presets they gave away, you can hear a lot of melodies and stuff from quaristice, but you can mess them up easily with the machinedrum and monomachine.
@@sebastiangonzalez9881 I just rewatched it and I don't remember. I think it had something to do mostly with the narrator, but I don't know what that was.
Yeah sure but what do they actually do? What language do they write in? What's their approach in terms of method? What does the basic structure of for's and while's and if's say about the thin line between chance and decision-making? This video is such a missed opportunity
To answer your first question about the language, the main subject Alex is the developer of TidalCycles (written in Haskell, a layer on top of SuperCollider) But there could be other languages/platforms used i.e. Overtone (Clojure)
In this clip, there's at least foxdot, tidalcycles, supercollider and conductive in use to make music, and probably puredata, cyril and hydra to live code visuals. Here's the long list of available tech: github.com/toplap/awesome-livecoding The other questions are good but maybe best not answered here, the above list also has community links if you want to get involved/find out more.
@@alexmclean6917 I saw a lot of Cycling74 -Max Msp stuff here, do these people controll max with these languages or the soundgeneration is done by TidalCycles etc.. too ? If so what is the role of Max here ? Hope my question is clear
@2:09 _Influenced by radical politics?_ *** In what way? Is it something other than possibly displaying some images or texts about these politicians while playing?
It's good that this film talks about the ethics of the scene and the pursuit of accessibility and openness, but this message is undermined by the film's failure to engage with any of the women active in this genre, of which there are many. Algorave is not a boy's club, by any means. This film's attempt to cast it as one is deeply disappointing. [paragraph removed because it didn't say what I meant it to]
Have you watched the film, Les? RA and the film maker have acknowledged the problems with the soundtrack and editing process, but the film itself includes a reasonably diverse range of voices.
I picked my words very poorly in my second paragraph and it read as if I was having a go at people in the film. I meant to express something like, 'this is an issue I never would have thought of in this context.' Followed by ideas of how I might avoid it - which read as if I thought the people in the film had failed to do diligence. This was not what I intended to communicate and I'm sorry.
Don't worry Charles - I didn't have a problem with your second paragraph (although can't remember what it said). I was questioning the part about not engaging with any women - the film does engage with Lucy, a woman very active in the genre, organising many events (including running a music tech community of women/nb people) and performing widely..
@@yaxu I wish they'd made her role as a practitioner clearer. The way her interview was presented read as if she was a curator or musicologist. I also wish they'd included some of her music, as I'm not at all familiar with her work.
@@celesteh1 Lucy is shown performing a couple of times, but true no significant clips of her music. Some links here: heavy-lifting.github.io/ The film should definitely have had a more diverse soundtrack, RA have acknowledged this with an apology, and are actively looking for ways to better represent the diversity of the scene.
I hate the implication that algorithmically generated music is somehow inherently colder or less personal than humanly generated music, as if undertaking a tedious process of physically arranging sounds somehow imparts meaning on those sounds. You're pretentious and I don't like people like you.
@@ldskjfhslkjdhflkjdhf Check out Dopplereffekt, first- then respond (i.e.- it's an Afro-American response to... Kraftwerk). Perhaps you will notice that in live performance, gesture is implied- but can nevery be verified. The problem is cognitive- I'm questioning whether there is anything to 'read' here, yes.
@@ROTEsimplemachines Authenticity is a dumb thing to look for in music. If there's anything "authentic" about a piece of music it certainly doesn't reside in the performance of it. Why the fuck would it matter whether you can "verify" a gesture or not? &when you "read" music it's the high-level abstract details that matter, and those can be captured perfectly by an algorithm. You're just being pretentious when you dismiss it as a "cold" medium.
you've all got it all wrong. i wrote my first pop music generator in 1994. live coding is stupid. instead code platforms that make music. people should have made this the predominant form of electronic music decades ago. eg. my project 'blewm' (or breathcube, or bottlerocket, or new blend) took only 9 weeks, its not perfect but it shows how one live algorithm can synthesize complex timbres and music. infinitely. one little project, infinite music in a specified genre. (it is this limit which makes it possible to develop rapidly, by one person) and as breathcube demonstrates (in 2005 on a simple platform), it is simple to generate lyrics in realtime with voice synthesis as well. and its that last part, the part where it starts to affect your ideas, which is why, the music industry doesn't like to talk about xoxos. no matter what i say, i can't seem to get anyone else who actually generates procedural music, to understand, music has drums, and sounds, tuned and atonal, and words. and computers can do this easily years ago.
Nope, the 'infinite music' claim of generative music is a sham. The output of arbitrary processes may vary infinitely in some sense but the texture doesn't change infinitely. Just like wind chimes vary all the time but the sound and structure does not change.
@@alexmclean6917 obviously your conception is finite, not to the degree of your experience ;) as said, 1994, lot of years. i agree that infinite procedural music is a sham because music itself is finite. due to procedural music i've experienced hours of eg. rap in 13/8ths time, fields that the public aren't going to touch in your lifetime. "the sound and structure does not change" seems more fitting of culturally produced music than procedurally, which can churn out a fuck load of material.. and i like to parameterise widely for variance.. :)
@@atomictraveller regardless of whether or not generative pieces can be infinite, algorave is more about a form of performance and composition, not to press play and let the computer just make music. more and more now new music isn't about new beats or textures but about new ways to approach composition and performance
How 1s and 0s can make us dance.
I dance everytime my code compiles.
I feel like this is the final stage of showing the punk or freedom or liberation of expression side to Electronic music and the Electronic scene. Regardless is this gets a massive buzz or if this preserves in starving undermined talent, this will be the keystone to how to form your imagination into and endless space of imagination.
its like te opposite of building your own analog synths
thank you for this, very interesting
The nerds shall inherit the earth...
If not at least provide the soundtrack
This is awesome!
How do you separate intention and study from chance and opportunism?
It's kind of mixed together. I find that the sound of introducing a new function is somewhat predictable but always a bit surprising.
If you're interested, try making music with tidal cycles. Really easy to get into.
no mention of autechre?
Which is weird, because RA had an interview with them where they described their coding approach to making music.
What Autechre do could probably be called live coding, but they are pretty hush-hush and proprietary about their methods, which conflicts with the transparent philosophy of Algorave.
@@sweepstakes they're not literally typing live code live, or if they are it's not at all like this. they used machinedrums, monomachines and other elektron devices for a while which themselves are capable of making generative stuff, and they also use max/msp live, but they've said they have systems set up that is more akin to moving faders and changing values to jam, if you listen to the machinedrum and monomachine presets they gave away, you can hear a lot of melodies and stuff from quaristice, but you can mess them up easily with the machinedrum and monomachine.
@@VS3d0v can't find that interview can you link it?
O.K.! But is there any club in the D.C. area where I can dance to algorave?
I’m going to start algoDjing at Decades in DC
@@camweb3192 Awsome! Me and my friends have gone there back in the late 90's.
This video already feels retro.
why u say that
@@sebastiangonzalez9881 I just rewatched it and I don't remember. I think it had something to do mostly with the narrator, but I don't know what that was.
This. Is. Awesome.
Yeah sure but what do they actually do? What language do they write in? What's their approach in terms of method? What does the basic structure of for's and while's and if's say about the thin line between chance and decision-making? This video is such a missed opportunity
To answer your first question about the language, the main subject Alex is the developer of TidalCycles (written in Haskell, a layer on top of SuperCollider)
But there could be other languages/platforms used i.e. Overtone (Clojure)
In this clip, there's at least foxdot, tidalcycles, supercollider and conductive in use to make music, and probably puredata, cyril and hydra to live code visuals. Here's the long list of available tech: github.com/toplap/awesome-livecoding
The other questions are good but maybe best not answered here, the above list also has community links if you want to get involved/find out more.
@@alexmclean6917 I saw a lot of Cycling74 -Max Msp stuff here, do these people controll max with these languages or the soundgeneration is done by TidalCycles etc.. too ? If so what is the role of Max here ?
Hope my question is clear
@@balintfeher2570 You can do that yes.. You might be seeing max's cousin puredata in the video though. Tidal is most often used with supercollider.
@@yaxu Thank you Alex !
love it!!
tracking without a GUI...
Nobody knows what is "tracking" these days.
so cooool ❣️
Really interesting but I don't hear anything really "new" 🤔
Yeah I agree - but it seems promising...
...coder musician code music
ALGORAVE Radical Politics + Contemporary arts. ALAN TURING !
Music for art galleries.
Who is the artist with Trump video? It is very good, need to know)
@2:09 _Influenced by radical politics?_ *** In what way? Is it something other than possibly displaying some images or texts about these politicians while playing?
Which Software is displayed at 8:44 ?
github.com/hundredrabbits/Orca
@Disco_James sweet! Thx, definitely gonna check this one
Orca is especially cool because its primary author lives on an ocean-bound boat. It's also developed on a cheap Chromebook.
Yeah! I've been dig into it for the past month, I'm so addict!!
@@lilbedoin :')
If you’re interested check out yet another documentary about the live coding scene: th-cam.com/video/uA4SDytz8Aw/w-d-xo.html
Death Grips did this without algos. 🤯
what if they tried
This is like the bitcoin/crypto of music production
nah fam, this shit's obv the complete oppisate of that right-libertarian bullcrap
@@take5transfat i meant with the concept of coding
@@Vishscale so you see a line of code and your mind immediately goes "yep, that's crypto""? lol
Hell no!
Shout out to EBN 2:07
calvnnhobs what video is this clip from?
🙌🌚🙌
Uhmmm new methods for music but old music
It's good that this film talks about the ethics of the scene and the pursuit of accessibility and openness, but this message is undermined by the film's failure to engage with any of the women active in this genre, of which there are many. Algorave is not a boy's club, by any means. This film's attempt to cast it as one is deeply disappointing.
[paragraph removed because it didn't say what I meant it to]
Have you watched the film, Les? RA and the film maker have acknowledged the problems with the soundtrack and editing process, but the film itself includes a reasonably diverse range of voices.
I picked my words very poorly in my second paragraph and it read as if I was having a go at people in the film. I meant to express something like, 'this is an issue I never would have thought of in this context.' Followed by ideas of how I might avoid it - which read as if I thought the people in the film had failed to do diligence. This was not what I intended to communicate and I'm sorry.
Don't worry Charles - I didn't have a problem with your second paragraph (although can't remember what it said). I was questioning the part about not engaging with any women - the film does engage with Lucy, a woman very active in the genre, organising many events (including running a music tech community of women/nb people) and performing widely..
@@yaxu I wish they'd made her role as a practitioner clearer. The way her interview was presented read as if she was a curator or musicologist. I also wish they'd included some of her music, as I'm not at all familiar with her work.
@@celesteh1 Lucy is shown performing a couple of times, but true no significant clips of her music. Some links here: heavy-lifting.github.io/
The film should definitely have had a more diverse soundtrack, RA have acknowledged this with an apology, and are actively looking for ways to better represent the diversity of the scene.
Cold, cold, cold. If I want to explore the gestures of a highly regulated impersonality- I'll listen to Dopplereffekt (Arpanet, Japanese Telecom).
I hate the implication that algorithmically generated music is somehow inherently colder or less personal than humanly generated music, as if undertaking a tedious process of physically arranging sounds somehow imparts meaning on those sounds. You're pretentious and I don't like people like you.
@@ldskjfhslkjdhflkjdhf Check out Dopplereffekt, first- then respond (i.e.- it's an Afro-American response to... Kraftwerk). Perhaps you will notice that in live performance, gesture is implied- but can nevery be verified. The problem is cognitive- I'm questioning whether there is anything to 'read' here, yes.
@@ldskjfhslkjdhflkjdhf And I would suggest you offer something other than an admonition.
@@ROTEsimplemachines Authenticity is a dumb thing to look for in music. If there's anything "authentic" about a piece of music it certainly doesn't reside in the performance of it. Why the fuck would it matter whether you can "verify" a gesture or not?
&when you "read" music it's the high-level abstract details that matter, and those can be captured perfectly by an algorithm. You're just being pretentious when you dismiss it as a "cold" medium.
I perceive Gerald Donald's work as highly personal!
Great, now Bill Gates is going to dominate the Electronic music scene!!! 😂
you've all got it all wrong.
i wrote my first pop music generator in 1994. live coding is stupid. instead code platforms that make music. people should have made this the predominant form of electronic music decades ago. eg. my project 'blewm' (or breathcube, or bottlerocket, or new blend) took only 9 weeks, its not perfect but it shows how one live algorithm can synthesize complex timbres and music. infinitely. one little project, infinite music in a specified genre. (it is this limit which makes it possible to develop rapidly, by one person) and as breathcube demonstrates (in 2005 on a simple platform), it is simple to generate lyrics in realtime with voice synthesis as well.
and its that last part, the part where it starts to affect your ideas, which is why, the music industry doesn't like to talk about xoxos. no matter what i say, i can't seem to get anyone else who actually generates procedural music, to understand, music has drums, and sounds, tuned and atonal, and words. and computers can do this easily years ago.
Nope, the 'infinite music' claim of generative music is a sham. The output of arbitrary processes may vary infinitely in some sense but the texture doesn't change infinitely. Just like wind chimes vary all the time but the sound and structure does not change.
@@alexmclean6917 obviously your conception is finite, not to the degree of your experience ;) as said, 1994, lot of years. i agree that infinite procedural music is a sham because music itself is finite.
due to procedural music i've experienced hours of eg. rap in 13/8ths time, fields that the public aren't going to touch in your lifetime. "the sound and structure does not change" seems more fitting of culturally produced music than procedurally, which can churn out a fuck load of material.. and i like to parameterise widely for variance.. :)
The live coding community has been around for a lot of years too
@@atomictraveller regardless of whether or not generative pieces can be infinite, algorave is more about a form of performance and composition, not to press play and let the computer just make music. more and more now new music isn't about new beats or textures but about new ways to approach composition and performance
I'm interested to see what you've done.