I prefer your method over opening multiple bank accounts although I understand how it could be helpful for those who don't feel comfortable relying on their balance sheet. One question... other than a separate physical payroll account, why do you feel the need to move your revenue to the savings account? Is it just for the interest earned? Can you think of any disadvantage of using just one main business checking for the Profit First allocation journal entry?
@@Michael-Lopez The Profit First method advocates for being very deliberate about pulling your profit out of the main account into a savings account so you always "pay yourself first". Having it sit in the main operating account makes it too easy to use for other items.
This is more complicated than just setting up the different bank accounts like Mike suggests in the book. I have implemented Profit First in my business and finally have clarity on how my funds should be allocated at all times! Having my bank accounts for Profit and Taxes at another bank with limited access is definitely the way to go because then there is no urge to dip into those accounts and transfer money around left and right. I appreciate the video but the a big part of Profit First is to simplify things for the entrepreneur, NOT the accountant.
I don't disagree with you, and I also agree that Profit First is much more than just the bank accounts (which is why I recommend everyone reads the book). With that said, lots of people are overwhelmed with and/or are put off by the idea of opening a gazillion bank accounts in different banks and/or don't want to pay the additional cost that comes along with having so many bank accounts. This video is meant to show people my workaround, but it's not going to be the right solution for everyone. For some people, the best answer will be to follow Mike's suggestions to the letter, and any related costs are worth every penny to have a solution that works when nothing else before did. The ultimate goal is to know your numbers and be in control of your finances. The way a business gets to that end goal is not important.
I read the book and everyone will find something that works better for them. I love this concept but I have an accounting background so it makes way more sense than all those bank accounts with fees and more
I was going to say the same thing. I have the different bank accounts, no fees, and the only thing I needed to set them up is tell the banker to do it. Took her probably 15 minutes.
Right! I have multiple savings accounts within my one bank account so that I can allocate and track. Most banks around here won't do the multiple individual accts
I think this perfectly shows the difference between CPAs/bookkeepers and business owners. I'm sure this makes perfect sense to you, as a CPA who probably spent months or years learning all these accounting terms and how to use accounting software, but to me, as a business owner, it's total garbledegook. You might as well be speaking Chinese. This is why I no longer seek business advice from my bookkeeper. Opening multiple accounts is the clearest and most sensible advice I've found yet.
I appreciate your method, but generally, business owners do not log into their accounting software to see how much money they have or can spend. Instead, they log into their online banking, that means, they will still see that 12K not the fraction that they can spend. As a Profit First professional, I use Profit First in my own business and it works wonderfully. My clients who use Profit First method are they ones who are thriving in their businesses.
I think if a business owner only looks at their balances and want to use profit first, they should set up the multiple accounts (with different banks) as the book suggests. If however the business owner does their own bookkeeping, then setting up these virtual accounts / envelops in your bookkeeping solution can work just as well, with fewer steps and costs. In my opinion, a business owner should see which of the two approaches feels like the most natural fit for them and go with that.
So true!! Cash has to be managed as it comes in and allocated before you even touch it otherwise there's too much temptation to spend it or dip into it make up for another allocation. IMHO, the next step would be to get a month ahead to give yourself more breathing room and gradually increase your reserves to fund expansion.
Online bank services like Novo and Lili allow you to create buckets for Quarterly Taxes etc without creating another account. I might try creating a bucket for each of the accounts you grouped under Savings. Since interest rates are so low, I don't bother with Savings accounts.
Thank you for recording this video. I am an accountant and bookkeeper and this really helped me to explain to my clients how to set it up in QuickBooks. I had to watch the video twice to make sure I got the process correctly, and I did. Thank you so much for sharing! This isn't an easy topic to explain to anyone that doesn't have bookkeeping knowledge. Good job!
@@AcuityEcommerce I would love specific guidance to set this up in my QuickBooks. I am guessing something with "subaccounts" as labels. I am not an accountant and truth be told, I already had SEVEN accounts (3 banks) before stumbling on Profit 1st. haha but I bought a business, and two cars this year. Only debt is my house, because of my crazy money chase
Maybe instead of trying to explain technical accounting and bookkeeping tasks to business owners, set it up yourself... This would provide additional income (you're not doing it for free), as well as ensure accuracy when they submit their books to you. It could help you both out. But, I would actually recommend you stay away from this approach and have your clients set up the 5(+) different accounts. Yes, it's more work for you, but it's also more income for you. Not only that, if they start seeing a profit, you can bet your bottom dollar (I had to use that somewhere on a comment section about finance) that they will refer other small businesses to you so that you can do the same for them. I can't really say that I see a downside to the actual Profit First system...
Before starting my business I invested in accounting courses incl Xero course for managing all my accounting. I think that people who find this video confusing need to really take a step back, as it won’t be any easier from this point if you don’t understand your tools and your accounting basics. Also IMO accounting/bookkeeping should be outsourced once you understand it.
Appreciate your video, though I will say this looks just as complicated if not more than transferring funds to another account. Im not a CPA, so maybe this method is helpful for you. As a layman, it seems confusing.
I won't say it's much less complicated than having separate accounts, but it does eliminate the cost and administrative burden of having a ton of separate bank accounts.
@@AcuityEcommerce Administrative burden? As in you (the accountant or bookkeeper) doing the job of keeping the books? I say make it easier on the customer, show them some value (like quarterly profits and ease of use), and YOU profit from that (less calls to answer, more referrals, etc.)
I love the idea of what you were doing and I'd love to learn more, but the video was pretty confusing and I'm not sure I walked away with anything tangible I could implement. I would need step by step instructions on how to use the system you're suggesting. Thank you!
I find the individual accounts to be easy, since all are linked to Quickbooks. I plug the balance of Income to Allocate into a spreadsheet and then do the transfers. QB imports and recognizes them so it’s all easy peasy. Only ‘offsite’ account I use is Vault, where I put 50% if Profit each quarter, paying the other 50% out to me. Maybe it’s just me but it seems easier than this approach... No bank fees, just had to choose account types to match the use of each account.
Thank you for this video! I have been considering using the profit first method in my business for over a year but have been reluctant to open 7 additional bank accounts and was concerned about how to manage all of this in QB. This is a MUCH easier method and will be giving this a try! Thank you!!
Thank you for creating this video. I want to do this in Quickbooks and couldn't figure out how to do it without all of the accounts. I can manage three accounts :)
I don’t get why owners comp is under the savings account? Surely it physically leaves that account during allocation and goes to a personal bank account of the owner? Or is there as much double handling of amounts as this seems?
In this case, you're talking about assigning a *purpose* to the funds. This is money still sitting in the business account but is earmarked for Owners Comp. Yes, eventually the money will leave the business account and be transferred to a personal bank account of the owner, but this is the step before that. And yes, there is a LOT of double-handling of amounts here. This is 100% a workaround to avoid having extra bank accounts. If you just want to handle the amounts once, I would open up extra bank accounts at relayfi.com (which didn't exist when this video was first published), and transfer the funds directly as the "allocation" step.
Now reading mm's book..was searching for a way to benefit from PFin Xero without all the Bank accounts. Thanks for your input. I may need to go through it a few more times tho as I get confused easily ☺️ xx
I hope this helps. In my experience, the "without bank accounts" method is most useful for accountants who are comfortable with subaccounts and balance sheets. Most non-accountants still love the separate bank account method. Just FYI.
I read the book 2 years ago and haven’t implemented it because opening up non-fee bank accounts is very hard to find and super annoying. This method is likely much better. Takes a little bit of thought but I’m definitely going to try out this method first. Thanks so much!
You do realize that that those fees are just excuses and resistance to change. Think about it, you probably waste much more money now that you would be spending with the fees on those accounts if you implement the methodology the right way. I've beed doing something similar with my personal accounts for years before reading this book and it does wanders in how effective it is to spend only what is available in the spending account and boost savings like crazy.
Thanks for this! Am about to set up my business accounting in Xero, and debating whether to keep my Porfit First bank accounts or just rely on...accounting! Useful vid.
I'm a bit late, but use both. Keep your P1st accounts and use Xero to do your bookkeeping. This technique/workaround she does is 1,000 times more complicated than just having 5 bank accounts.
Using savings accounts for operations will run you afoul of Reg D. Currently suspended by the Covid-19 crisis, this Reg will limit transfers in and out to 6 per month.
I feel like this would be great if I actually knew how to implement it. Managing my finances as a freelancer is hard enough as is, switching everything up feels super intimidating...
Hello my fellow Xero expert - this is a great work around. I have been hearing a few practice's in the US using this method. I am in Australia so I am interested in reading this book to assist our clients who are having cashflow problems.
Thanks for this video! A client introduced me to Profit first and I was wondering how one would do this practically. I like not having all the bank accounts, but does seem a bit complicated. Maybe it is just about getting into the habit of splitting all income that way. It does feel as if one will double up on actual transaction processing. E.g.if you pay an expense, I guess you pay it from the savings account, but then also need to do transfers from the current asset account for sales taxes as the expense reduces the sales tax...I guess if I draw T-accounts it will become clearer.
A big part of the system is establishing the habits to be profitable. The system, as is, is practical. The ones most resistant to it are those that keep the books (accountants and bookkeepers). Most claim it's "too difficult", then offer options that are 1,000 times more difficult for the average business owner without a finance background. What could be more simple than 5 accounts, all earmarked for different activities? On the bookkeeper end it's a little more work, but they have simple transactions, easy to reconcile, and, YOU GET PAID MORE for the additional accounts... I personally like to get paid more, especially when the additional work is minimal.
This is really useful to me thank you! But - wouldn’t that make bank recs more difficult? Don’t you have a bunch of extra transactions that get ignored each month, and don’t they just keep adding up?
They don't get ignored, but yes, they can add up. This process doesn't work for everyone, and it's definitely a more advanced technique geared more for accountants. There are several banks (i.e., relayfi.com) that have now caught on to this need for small business owners and are offering additional free accounts for this purpose. You might want to check that out if this method isn't resonating with you.
I enjoyed your video but I don't think this is a good process for me because I don't even know how to use zero and moving all this stuff around. As an Accountant, you are well verse and I do understand where you are coming from. I wish you were my accountant, than perhaps You could teach me this process but i will probably use multiple account. If you do come up with another solutions, please I would love to know. I will be following you on youtube.
You're spot on and that's one of the reasons why I created a follow-up video that you might want to check out. :) th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html
It's much easier to just set up the accounts and setup auto sweep with your bank on the 10th and the 25th. I'm an accountant and I just don't get it. I feel the learner curve would be way to steep for someone not fluent in accounting.
You're not wrong. There are a hundred different ways to address this same problem. This video was intended for people who didn't want to set up all the bank accounts. I also did a subsequent video talking about why Profit First is a great solution for some people. th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html
I used to do this exact same thing with my personal accounts when I first started out working and as a new home owner. However, I found reconciling my bank account inside the software was a bear with all of the “fake transfers” so I stopped doing it after finances weren’t quite so tight but I still love the theory. How do you get over the reconciling part?
Maybe I have fewer fake accounts or maybe I do less transfers or maybe I stay on top of it more regularly? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I don't know why - I just don't have that problem.
Thanks for the video! Why is it only 15% for taxes? I keep hearing 30% and it's killing me lol! I would love to only save 15% if possible, but don't want to not have enough saved up in the end!
I'm going to have to the defer to the author of the book on that one. But if you feel like you need to save more, save more. The worst that can happen is you have an extra, unexpected windfall of savings at tax time. :)
Thanks for the video. I use Profit First with bank accounts now and like the idea of not having to reconcile so many accounts by manual transaction import into my Wave accounting software. If I use one bank account that holds the actual funds and create current asset accounts for all but the Operating Expense account, won't my accounting software show that I have double the assets for the funds I transfer to the Current Asset accounts?
Thanks for sharing this video Patti! I'm curious which account houses money that will be reinvested into more inventory, etc should be held? Is that the Operating Expense (45%) account?Thank you.
Nope. I would set up a separate subaccount under savings (so "Savings: Inventory") and then transfer it out to your checking account as you need to buy more product.
So your splits might be more like: 15% Profit, 25% Owners Comp, 15% Income Tax, 25% Inventory, 20% Operations (or whatever percentages work for your business).
@@AcuityEcommerce got it! Thank you for replying so quickly. I was thinking "maybe the 15% profit is used for that". I'm assuming Operating Expenses would be spent on Warehouse rent, supplies, etc (retail example of course). Thanks for clarifying!
Hi, I'm currently reading profit first and I noticed that he says to set up an income account I noticed that you didn't set up this income account so I decided not to either. I was just curious why you decided not to set up a separate income account? I assume it's not really useful to have an income account since it would kinda double the work. Instead of just coding the money into our Opex, Profit, Tax and Owner's Comp accounts we would first have to code in into the Income Account and then into the other accounts which is kinda just more work...
Yeah, if you hadn't noticed, I'm a big fan of less work wherever possible. In my mind, I guess I just treat my checking account as the income account and transfer funds out of there to the savings account as they show up. I don't really need a separate account for that, but maybe some people do.
Alright thanks so much. I have one very last question. When you go to your balance sheet, I noticed that the word "Savings Account" is highlighted in blue while mine is actually in just plain black font (which means I can click on it like you can with the blue text). I was curious how you got your savings account to appear blue like this on your balance sheet. Thanks so much! :)
I'm not sure I know what you mean, but maybe it's because I created a "Savings Account" group and put all the accounts underneath it. Is that what you mean? (Maybe if you can share the time in the video that you're looking at, that'll help me see what you're getting at.)
Great tips! I hate the idea of having what seems like 10 different bank accounts for profit first it just seems to make extra work when our clients are trying to minimize things to begin with. I use YNAB for my personal budgeting and there are some posts where people have used Profit First with YNAB without all the bank accounts as well.
So, to clarify, in Xero, you are creating ‘imaginary’ bank accounts in order to calculate, manage and visualize the math behind the financial decisions for your business? This could be genius. Is Xero a free software?
Have you had any success stories from entrepreneurs who have shifted to "Profit First" system? My launching a new business and want to convince my partners to using the profit first system, but they are very set in their ways, haven't found 1 testimonial online that isnt associated to a book review or from ones of Mikes websites.
I've heard from a few other sellers who use it and are very happy. We also use it (although tweaked here and there for our purposes), and we're really happy too. It's a good, common sense approach.
I implemented Profit first from the beginning. I never have a single quarter that I don't have a profit. What did I do with the profit distribution, I took my family on vacations. Don't be afraid of the accounting part either. I have clients who have 10 checking and savings accounts and I handle their books. Reconciliation is a breeze. Just make fully use of your accounting software capability. I use QBO for all of them.
I think the idea is that you take a (somewhat) conservative percentage based on your income tax rate. For the US, Mike suggests 35% might be a good ball park figure. Now, you don't want to set aside 35% of all incoming revenue, as your operating expenses are all deductible. So, you take 35% of your revenue, minus operating expenses. If you determined your operating expenses are 45%, then you take 35% of the remaining 55% and that will be your allocation for taxes. (35%*55%=19.25% --> Maybe use 20% as your percentage). Furthermore, if your revenue is subject to sales tax, I would advise to set aside all sales tax in full first before doing the allocation process. Call it "sales tax first", if you want ;-)
Yeah it is--except for 2 accounts. You transfer the Profit and the Taxes to 2 other accounts at a different bank where it's a pain in the butt to get the money out(like, make yourself visit the bank to get the money out). That way you don't touch the money or even see it until quarterly estimates are paid and you pay yourself a bit of the profits as a bonus.
You are really missing the point!!! Do you really think this is about accounting methods? Nooooooo! It's about having the right prospective of your business, which is the reason most people fail! That's why its called Profits First. Not Accounting First!! Most accountants will not get this very well because of their mechanical personality.
No - not missing the point. Just not talking about the point you wanted me to make. ;) Check out this follow-up video for more context: th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html
Thanks for watching! Have you tried this method? Success? Failure? Tell me about it by commenting here!
Patti, I would go the route you suggested. It doesn't feel complicated for me. Opening separate accounts with minimums gets costly. To each their own.
I prefer your method over opening multiple bank accounts although I understand how it could be helpful for those who don't feel comfortable relying on their balance sheet. One question... other than a separate physical payroll account, why do you feel the need to move your revenue to the savings account? Is it just for the interest earned? Can you think of any disadvantage of using just one main business checking for the Profit First allocation journal entry?
@@Michael-Lopez The Profit First method advocates for being very deliberate about pulling your profit out of the main account into a savings account so you always "pay yourself first". Having it sit in the main operating account makes it too easy to use for other items.
This is more complicated than just setting up the different bank accounts like Mike suggests in the book. I have implemented Profit First in my business and finally have clarity on how my funds should be allocated at all times! Having my bank accounts for Profit and Taxes at another bank with limited access is definitely the way to go because then there is no urge to dip into those accounts and transfer money around left and right. I appreciate the video but the a big part of Profit First is to simplify things for the entrepreneur, NOT the accountant.
I don't disagree with you, and I also agree that Profit First is much more than just the bank accounts (which is why I recommend everyone reads the book).
With that said, lots of people are overwhelmed with and/or are put off by the idea of opening a gazillion bank accounts in different banks and/or don't want to pay the additional cost that comes along with having so many bank accounts. This video is meant to show people my workaround, but it's not going to be the right solution for everyone. For some people, the best answer will be to follow Mike's suggestions to the letter, and any related costs are worth every penny to have a solution that works when nothing else before did.
The ultimate goal is to know your numbers and be in control of your finances. The way a business gets to that end goal is not important.
@@AcuityEcommerce yup agreed
I read the book and everyone will find something that works better for them. I love this concept but I have an accounting background so it makes way more sense than all those bank accounts with fees and more
I was going to say the same thing. I have the different bank accounts, no fees, and the only thing I needed to set them up is tell the banker to do it. Took her probably 15 minutes.
Right! I have multiple savings accounts within my one bank account so that I can allocate and track. Most banks around here won't do the multiple individual accts
I think this perfectly shows the difference between CPAs/bookkeepers and business owners. I'm sure this makes perfect sense to you, as a CPA who probably spent months or years learning all these accounting terms and how to use accounting software, but to me, as a business owner, it's total garbledegook. You might as well be speaking Chinese. This is why I no longer seek business advice from my bookkeeper. Opening multiple accounts is the clearest and most sensible advice I've found yet.
LOL. I said almost the exact same thing in my follow-up video. You should check it out.
I agree!
I appreciate your method, but generally, business owners do not log into their accounting software to see how much money they have or can spend. Instead, they log into their online banking, that means, they will still see that 12K not the fraction that they can spend. As a Profit First professional, I use Profit First in my own business and it works wonderfully. My clients who use Profit First method are they ones who are thriving in their businesses.
Yep. I discuss that in this video at about the 2:18 mark. :) th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html
I think if a business owner only looks at their balances and want to use profit first, they should set up the multiple accounts (with different banks) as the book suggests. If however the business owner does their own bookkeeping, then setting up these virtual accounts / envelops in your bookkeeping solution can work just as well, with fewer steps and costs.
In my opinion, a business owner should see which of the two approaches feels like the most natural fit for them and go with that.
So true!! Cash has to be managed as it comes in and allocated before you even touch it otherwise there's too much temptation to spend it or dip into it make up for another allocation. IMHO, the next step would be to get a month ahead to give yourself more breathing room and gradually increase your reserves to fund expansion.
At least a month. ;)
Online bank services like Novo and Lili allow you to create buckets for Quarterly Taxes etc without creating another account. I might try creating a bucket for each of the accounts you grouped under Savings. Since interest rates are so low, I don't bother with Savings accounts.
Yep, same concept. :)
Thank you for recording this video. I am an accountant and bookkeeper and this really helped me to explain to my clients how to set it up in QuickBooks. I had to watch the video twice to make sure I got the process correctly, and I did. Thank you so much for sharing! This isn't an easy topic to explain to anyone that doesn't have bookkeeping knowledge. Good job!
You are so welcome!
@@AcuityEcommerce I would love specific guidance to set this up in my QuickBooks. I am guessing something with "subaccounts" as labels. I am not an accountant and truth be told, I already had SEVEN accounts (3 banks) before stumbling on Profit 1st. haha but I bought a business, and two cars this year. Only debt is my house, because of my crazy money chase
I would love a little hand holding to get my QB set up!!!
Maybe instead of trying to explain technical accounting and bookkeeping tasks to business owners, set it up yourself... This would provide additional income (you're not doing it for free), as well as ensure accuracy when they submit their books to you. It could help you both out.
But, I would actually recommend you stay away from this approach and have your clients set up the 5(+) different accounts. Yes, it's more work for you, but it's also more income for you. Not only that, if they start seeing a profit, you can bet your bottom dollar (I had to use that somewhere on a comment section about finance) that they will refer other small businesses to you so that you can do the same for them. I can't really say that I see a downside to the actual Profit First system...
Before starting my business I invested in accounting courses incl Xero course for managing all my accounting. I think that people who find this video confusing need to really take a step back, as it won’t be any easier from this point if you don’t understand your tools and your accounting basics. Also IMO accounting/bookkeeping should be outsourced once you understand it.
Smart, and I totally agree with you. :)
Appreciate your video, though I will say this looks just as complicated if not more than transferring funds to another account. Im not a CPA, so maybe this method is helpful for you. As a layman, it seems confusing.
I won't say it's much less complicated than having separate accounts, but it does eliminate the cost and administrative burden of having a ton of separate bank accounts.
@@AcuityEcommerce Administrative burden? As in you (the accountant or bookkeeper) doing the job of keeping the books? I say make it easier on the customer, show them some value (like quarterly profits and ease of use), and YOU profit from that (less calls to answer, more referrals, etc.)
I love the idea of what you were doing and I'd love to learn more, but the video was pretty confusing and I'm not sure I walked away with anything tangible I could implement. I would need step by step instructions on how to use the system you're suggesting. Thank you!
Thank you for your feedback.
Thanks good insight and creative option . 2 thumbs up!!!
Glad it was helpful!
I find the individual accounts to be easy, since all are linked to Quickbooks.
I plug the balance of Income to Allocate into a spreadsheet and then do the transfers. QB imports and recognizes them so it’s all easy peasy.
Only ‘offsite’ account I use is Vault, where I put 50% if Profit each quarter, paying the other 50% out to me.
Maybe it’s just me but it seems easier than this approach...
No bank fees, just had to choose account types to match the use of each account.
Thanks for sharing!
Thank you for this video! I have been considering using the profit first method in my business for over a year but have been reluctant to open 7 additional bank accounts and was concerned about how to manage all of this in QB. This is a MUCH easier method and will be giving this a try! Thank you!!
I'm so glad it helped!
Hi Wise Women Fitness, did you manage to set this up in QB? I'm struggling and QB support don't seem much help. TIA x
@@theacupunctureloungeltd6874 I would also love specific QB guidance on this
Thank you for creating this video. I want to do this in Quickbooks and couldn't figure out how to do it without all of the accounts. I can manage three accounts :)
Glad it was helpful!
Absolutely fantastic, thank you. I get the various advantages and disadvantages. Depends on your preference but this video helps a lot to understand.
Glad it was helpful!
I don’t get why owners comp is under the savings account? Surely it physically leaves that account during allocation and goes to a personal bank account of the owner? Or is there as much double handling of amounts as this seems?
In this case, you're talking about assigning a *purpose* to the funds. This is money still sitting in the business account but is earmarked for Owners Comp. Yes, eventually the money will leave the business account and be transferred to a personal bank account of the owner, but this is the step before that.
And yes, there is a LOT of double-handling of amounts here. This is 100% a workaround to avoid having extra bank accounts. If you just want to handle the amounts once, I would open up extra bank accounts at relayfi.com (which didn't exist when this video was first published), and transfer the funds directly as the "allocation" step.
Now reading mm's book..was searching for a way to benefit from PFin Xero without all the Bank accounts. Thanks for your input. I may need to go through it a few more times tho as I get confused easily ☺️ xx
I hope this helps. In my experience, the "without bank accounts" method is most useful for accountants who are comfortable with subaccounts and balance sheets. Most non-accountants still love the separate bank account method. Just FYI.
I read the book 2 years ago and haven’t implemented it because opening up non-fee bank accounts is very hard to find and super annoying.
This method is likely much better. Takes a little bit of thought but I’m definitely going to try out this method first. Thanks so much!
I'll warn you that it doesn't work for everyone. But good luck!
You do realize that that those fees are just excuses and resistance to change. Think about it, you probably waste much more money now that you would be spending with the fees on those accounts if you implement the methodology the right way. I've beed doing something similar with my personal accounts for years before reading this book and it does wanders in how effective it is to spend only what is available in the spending account and boost savings like crazy.
Thanks for this! Am about to set up my business accounting in Xero, and debating whether to keep my Porfit First bank accounts or just rely on...accounting! Useful vid.
Glad it was helpful!
I'm a bit late, but use both. Keep your P1st accounts and use Xero to do your bookkeeping. This technique/workaround she does is 1,000 times more complicated than just having 5 bank accounts.
appreciate you taking the time to do this. I think a follow up video is necessary though because this got confusing
Funny you should say that... there IS a follow up video. :)
th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html
Using savings accounts for operations will run you afoul of Reg D. Currently suspended by the Covid-19 crisis, this Reg will limit transfers in and out to 6 per month.
Good tip!
Excellent concept:)
Pretty smart, right?
I feel like this would be great if I actually knew how to implement it. Managing my finances as a freelancer is hard enough as is, switching everything up feels super intimidating...
Have you read the book? I feel like they get pretty down in the weeds with you.
Great Advice!
Glad it was helpful!
Hello my fellow Xero expert - this is a great work around. I have been hearing a few practice's in the US using this method. I am in Australia so I am interested in reading this book to assist our clients who are having cashflow problems.
Hey - I'm in Australia at the moment as well (just visiting, though). Thanks for watching!
@@AcuityEcommerce Where are you visiting? I'm on the Gold Coast in Queensland
@@EnthusiaBookkeeping Been here since 17 March. Sunshine Coast, Gold Coast, Melbourne, and now I'm in Sydney. Just missed you, I guess.
Thanks for this video! A client introduced me to Profit first and I was wondering how one would do this practically. I like not having all the bank accounts, but does seem a bit complicated. Maybe it is just about getting into the habit of splitting all income that way. It does feel as if one will double up on actual transaction processing. E.g.if you pay an expense, I guess you pay it from the savings account, but then also need to do transfers from the current asset account for sales taxes as the expense reduces the sales tax...I guess if I draw T-accounts it will become clearer.
Glad you liked it! Just so you know it doesn't work for everyone... see my follow-up video on the same topic.
A big part of the system is establishing the habits to be profitable. The system, as is, is practical. The ones most resistant to it are those that keep the books (accountants and bookkeepers). Most claim it's "too difficult", then offer options that are 1,000 times more difficult for the average business owner without a finance background.
What could be more simple than 5 accounts, all earmarked for different activities? On the bookkeeper end it's a little more work, but they have simple transactions, easy to reconcile, and, YOU GET PAID MORE for the additional accounts... I personally like to get paid more, especially when the additional work is minimal.
This is really useful to me thank you! But - wouldn’t that make bank recs more difficult? Don’t you have a bunch of extra transactions that get ignored each month, and don’t they just keep adding up?
They don't get ignored, but yes, they can add up. This process doesn't work for everyone, and it's definitely a more advanced technique geared more for accountants.
There are several banks (i.e., relayfi.com) that have now caught on to this need for small business owners and are offering additional free accounts for this purpose. You might want to check that out if this method isn't resonating with you.
I enjoyed your video but I don't think this is a good process for me because I don't even know how to use zero and moving all this stuff around. As an Accountant, you are well verse and I do understand where you are coming from. I wish you were my accountant, than perhaps You could teach me this process but i will probably use multiple account. If you do come up with another solutions, please I would love to know. I will be following you on youtube.
You're spot on and that's one of the reasons why I created a follow-up video that you might want to check out. :)
th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html
It's much easier to just set up the accounts and setup auto sweep with your bank on the 10th and the 25th.
I'm an accountant and I just don't get it. I feel the learner curve would be way to steep for someone not fluent in accounting.
You're not wrong. There are a hundred different ways to address this same problem. This video was intended for people who didn't want to set up all the bank accounts.
I also did a subsequent video talking about why Profit First is a great solution for some people.
th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html
I used to do this exact same thing with my personal accounts when I first started out working and as a new home owner. However, I found reconciling my bank account inside the software was a bear with all of the “fake transfers” so I stopped doing it after finances weren’t quite so tight but I still love the theory. How do you get over the reconciling part?
Maybe I have fewer fake accounts or maybe I do less transfers or maybe I stay on top of it more regularly? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I don't know why - I just don't have that problem.
This is all Greek to me and I read that book, too.
Sorry to hear that.
Thanks for the video! Why is it only 15% for taxes? I keep hearing 30% and it's killing me lol! I would love to only save 15% if possible, but don't want to not have enough saved up in the end!
I'm going to have to the defer to the author of the book on that one. But if you feel like you need to save more, save more. The worst that can happen is you have an extra, unexpected windfall of savings at tax time. :)
Bill Gallagher thank you! So saving 15% on the total revenue should be plenty, it sounds like. That makes sense. Thanks for the explanation!
Thanks for the video. I use Profit First with bank accounts now and like the idea of not having to reconcile so many accounts by manual transaction import into my Wave accounting software. If I use one bank account that holds the actual funds and create current asset accounts for all but the Operating Expense account, won't my accounting software show that I have double the assets for the funds I transfer to the Current Asset accounts?
No, because the funds would "move out" of the bank accounts to get into the current asset accounts.
I use envelops for this.😁
Yep! This is totally the "envelope method" for businesses. I've been saying that for years.
Thanks for sharing this video Patti! I'm curious which account houses money that will be reinvested into more inventory, etc should be held? Is that the Operating Expense (45%) account?Thank you.
Nope. I would set up a separate subaccount under savings (so "Savings: Inventory") and then transfer it out to your checking account as you need to buy more product.
So your splits might be more like: 15% Profit, 25% Owners Comp, 15% Income Tax, 25% Inventory, 20% Operations (or whatever percentages work for your business).
@@AcuityEcommerce got it! Thank you for replying so quickly. I was thinking "maybe the 15% profit is used for that". I'm assuming Operating Expenses would be spent on Warehouse rent, supplies, etc (retail example of course). Thanks for clarifying!
@@boba5559 Yep. Operating expenses are all the overhead things like rent, supplies, legal fees, meals & entertainment, etc.
@@AcuityEcommerce Awesome! Thank you again for sharing your knowledge!!! I am on a mission to binge-watch all your videos 😁
Hi, I'm currently reading profit first and I noticed that he says to set up an income account I noticed that you didn't set up this income account so I decided not to either. I was just curious why you decided not to set up a separate income account? I assume it's not really useful to have an income account since it would kinda double the work. Instead of just coding the money into our Opex, Profit, Tax and Owner's Comp accounts we would first have to code in into the Income Account and then into the other accounts which is kinda just more work...
Yeah, if you hadn't noticed, I'm a big fan of less work wherever possible. In my mind, I guess I just treat my checking account as the income account and transfer funds out of there to the savings account as they show up. I don't really need a separate account for that, but maybe some people do.
Alright thanks so much. I have one very last question. When you go to your balance sheet, I noticed that the word "Savings Account" is highlighted in blue while mine is actually in just plain black font (which means I can click on it like you can with the blue text). I was curious how you got your savings account to appear blue like this on your balance sheet. Thanks so much! :)
I'm not sure I know what you mean, but maybe it's because I created a "Savings Account" group and put all the accounts underneath it. Is that what you mean? (Maybe if you can share the time in the video that you're looking at, that'll help me see what you're getting at.)
Great tips! I hate the idea of having what seems like 10 different bank accounts for profit first it just seems to make extra work when our clients are trying to minimize things to begin with. I use YNAB for my personal budgeting and there are some posts where people have used Profit First with YNAB without all the bank accounts as well.
I used to use YNAB too, but they had enough glitches when they first launched their cloud system that I switched over to Xero. :)
So, to clarify, in Xero, you are creating ‘imaginary’ bank accounts in order to calculate, manage and visualize the math behind the financial decisions for your business? This could be genius. Is Xero a free software?
Yep. That's exactly what I'm doing. And no, Xero isn't free. Here's a link to their pricing: www.xero.com/us/pricing/
Have you had any success stories from entrepreneurs who have shifted to "Profit First" system? My launching a new business and want to convince my partners to using the profit first system, but they are very set in their ways, haven't found 1 testimonial online that isnt associated to a book review or from ones of Mikes websites.
I've heard from a few other sellers who use it and are very happy. We also use it (although tweaked here and there for our purposes), and we're really happy too. It's a good, common sense approach.
thanks!
Look at the Amazon reviews. Profit First has been implemented in well over 100K companies.
I implemented Profit first from the beginning. I never have a single quarter that I don't have a profit. What did I do with the profit distribution, I took my family on vacations. Don't be afraid of the accounting part either. I have clients who have 10 checking and savings accounts and I handle their books. Reconciliation is a breeze. Just make fully use of your accounting software capability. I use QBO for all of them.
Is allocating 15% for income tax the standard allocation in the US?
I believe that's what the author recommends, but each person should talk to their tax advisor about what should be the appropriate amount.
I think the idea is that you take a (somewhat) conservative percentage based on your income tax rate. For the US, Mike suggests 35% might be a good ball park figure. Now, you don't want to set aside 35% of all incoming revenue, as your operating expenses are all deductible. So, you take 35% of your revenue, minus operating expenses. If you determined your operating expenses are 45%, then you take 35% of the remaining 55% and that will be your allocation for taxes. (35%*55%=19.25% --> Maybe use 20% as your percentage).
Furthermore, if your revenue is subject to sales tax, I would advise to set aside all sales tax in full first before doing the allocation process. Call it "sales tax first", if you want ;-)
Remco Rijnders thank you! Very helpful
what if you don't use xero?
Profit First is adaptable to any software you use. I recommend you start with the book and go from there.
i read it different bank accounts but at the same bank
Yeah it is--except for 2 accounts. You transfer the Profit and the Taxes to 2 other accounts at a different bank where it's a pain in the butt to get the money out(like, make yourself visit the bank to get the money out). That way you don't touch the money or even see it until quarterly estimates are paid and you pay yourself a bit of the profits as a bonus.
Nice video. Wich platafform or software are you using??
Xero. :)
This is more complicated than the book. Its so much filler i had to stop so as to not get confused with the accounting.
I totally agree with you. This version definitely works better for accountants.
Where in the process do you set aside money to pay Sales Tax?
Never mind, I see the Savings: Sales Tax account. Shoulda listened closer...
This is more complicated
Yep. 100%.
Very confusing
You might want to try following the way it's done in the book instead then. :)
You are really missing the point!!! Do you really think this is about accounting methods? Nooooooo! It's about having the right prospective of your business, which is the reason most people fail! That's why its called Profits First. Not Accounting First!! Most accountants will not get this very well because of their mechanical personality.
No - not missing the point. Just not talking about the point you wanted me to make. ;)
Check out this follow-up video for more context: th-cam.com/video/Z6EiEPlm6SY/w-d-xo.html