EEVblog
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ก.พ. 2025
- Dave tests the Uni-T UT-513 5000V high voltage insulation resistance tester with the PIntek 15kV HVP-15HF HV oscilloscope probe to see if it's suitable for crude multimeter overload testing, with some spectacular results on the ANENG AN8008
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In this episode: Dave stops fighting his irresistible urge to become a mad scientist. Maniacal laughter ensues.
Dave, you need to work on your evil laugh. How can you expect to become a proper mad scientist if you can't even cackle like a professional?
i thought the same too.
mozismobile
I thought Dave's impression of the Emperor from Star Wars was pretty good, no mad scientist here.
Normsweb.com Dave hates cats? Wow. UNSUBBED.
Robocat! Geeky *and* doesn't slaughter wildlife for fun. It's a win-win
I don't think it is possible to perfectly pull off the dastardly evil laugh unless the face is properly equipped with the waxed tash with which to twiddle. I'm putting it down to the different audio properties of the suitably tash equipped mouth.
If you want a sudden impulse, just turn the tester on fist then connect the meter. Much more likely to cause damage due to inductive ringing and capacitive coupling/flashover
Yeah, but would have to be safe and repeatable. So would need some form of switch based system, preferably electronic.
Mike ya legend!
Get back to making vids!
And add a hv capacitor in parallel over the output of the insulation tester so that once an arc does start there is plenty of energy available to flow trough it for a nice bang.
Some aluminum foil and plastic projector sheets makes a cap with a surprising amount of energy storage.
Mike, test it on your destruct-o-tron.
I was thinking that it would be pretty easy to charge up a capacitor to 5kV and then connect that to the meter with an insulating pole with the meter probe ziptied to one end. I don't know what the official CAT rating standard stipulates but I would imagine that something like a 10uF, 5kV pulse-rated cap would separate the men from the boys in regard to multimeter protection.
If you look at the scope trace for the arcing test, notice how the first spike is larger than all the rest. The initial arc was harder to start than the subsequent ones, as ionised air is more conductive.
I suspect the burns on the PCB were a bigger factor.
seems analogous to the coefficient of static friction being higher than kinetic friction
It's because air got hot. Ionization is easier if temperature is higher.
exactly what I thought Taras
Keep in mind the 8002 and 8008 place the PTC and clamp after the selector switch. The switch has to handle the entire voltage. Obviously it can't. These meters are a little odd in that respect as normally the first layer of protection is in front of the switch. The interesting thing from watching this video is how the 121GW appears to breakdown as well the first time you hit it. It's possible you blew out some contaminates around the switch assuming it was an older version of the meter. I never tried to push the unmodified prototype meter to higher levels after it was damaged. But I did have the meter far above this and would think if there was a clearance or creepage problem with the layout, I would have seen it in those tests. Strange. I'm guessing conductive particles.
We had same insulation tester at my previous work. It was freezing pretty often (had to be turned off by e-stop, nothing else worked) and cables were failing pretty often, so it shown much higher resistance than thermocouples in reality had.
Yep, stupid thing freezes all the time.
Meh, I bought an 8008 to both see what it was like in person (Reasonably pleasant, definitely a Harbor Freight $5 meter "killer", lol); the 1 microvolt and 0.01 ohm resolution is nice too. I also own an Amprobe AM-140-A, a HP 3456A (A 6.5 digit meter from the 80's and a genuine HP), as well as countless others over the years, so I'm reasonably experienced in that regard. The 8008 seems to be a good meter for sticking in your bag just in case you might need a cheap DMM and you don't want a nicer meter to get damaged or stolen. It's not particularly rugged, but for the price you could pick up a Pelican case for it and still have enough cash for dinner at McDonald's ;-) I get that it's cheaply built and doesn't have the standard MOV protection you might otherwise expect, but for me the vast majority of the work I do is with 12V and logic-level voltages so having CE-rated input protection just doesn't matter and I'm not going to knock a $25 meter for not having the same protection as a Fluke-- different market segments and use-cases. It just seems like being a meter snob to slam it for not being the same as more expensive meters when it has some very nice features that are unique to its price point. Being aware of its limitations is one thing (Especially if you ever have to deal with higher voltages!), but just refusing to consider it a "real" meter because it lacks some things is silly.
Dave wants to crap on it every opportunity to sell his own meter for 8x the price when the cheap one does 99% of the job
nice HV probe Dave.......may the force be with you!
Don't know why, but putting HV across multimeters and SMPSUs makes fun, everytime!
What NOT to do with a high voltage probe. Leave the probe overnight in a very cold vehicle causing condensation to form inside it then take the probe and insert it to measure 29 KV (thankfully low current) Somewhere from the handle it arced to me and exited at my elbow burning a hole in my jumper at that point i am also told there was an arc from the swivel leg caster to the concrete floor. Thankfully all I suffered was a lot of pain and fright.
5KPlus constant volt surge into the Aneng and it kept on ticking!!...definitely seems engineered well enough to me ;)
Great video, thanks!
I've got a Brymen 861 but I also bought the Aneg for £15 in the UK and leave on the bench or in the tool pouch as a regular simple meter.
Who would be crazy enough to test 5KV with a $25 eBay meter?
Someone named Dave. :)
OOoooooo, that's nice!
This is why I don't have a problem spending $800 for a Fluke and $10 for a replacement fuse.
Thank you Dave :-) intro is just awesome
That scope has a lovely sharp display
Dave's laugh while the arcs are going on - instalike
"Joe Smith" has some good videos on high voltage transient testing of multimeters. I believe he has also tested a pre-production EEVblog 121GW meter.
Thanks. Yes I ran several tests on what Dave is now calling a prototype 121GW. The video where the meter was tested to failure is still available but I have removed the others after apparently they caused some confusion about the meter. Glad you enjoy the videos.
Great Video!
I think I'd rather buy the Aneng then the Brymen. It looks like a great value.
I think Dave doesn't like it because its better value than the EEV blog meter.
Yeah, I hate it so much I did a whole review on it.
lol, I guess I stand corrected.
EE student notification squad. Hello from TX State Dave!
Hello TX State
is that next to RX state?
ATschTheCube - No, but it's close to the LA, AR, OK, and NM states! :)
such nerds
RX State* because capitalization.
Actually the AN8008 impressed me more than the insulation tester. At least its processor didn't crash, not even with arcing at the range switch. I don't think many top-brand products would pass that test!
Basically none of these meters, not even Cat-rated ones, should be used in the vicinity of >1kV supplies than can deliver any significant current. They are not rated to remain safe under such conditions. I guess one question that arises with the AN8008 is whether those very short fuses would arc after they blew with such voltages. Probably yes, in which case they're effectively not a fuse under those conditions.
IWRConsultancy All 3 meters are both supposedly rated to A. Measure intentional voltage up to 1000V peak/750V RMS/10A current. B. Not endanger the user if subjected to accidental spikes of at least 5 times that (voltage) / 1000x times (current) . Because those spikes might hit it while trying to figure out why there's no power to the house/office/lab. Similarly quality workwear coveralls are supposed to be OK up to 95°C, but must also provide reasonable basic protection if there's a fire or you are accidentally dragged behind a truck.
Your laughing sounds like Dr. Frankenstein playing in his lab with high voltage :-)
You should do a fun video where you build the largest capacitor bank you can for sensible money to blow things up.
That laugh is going to get programmed into "bobble Dave". Very interesting indeed.
Dave, you were taking entirely too much pleasure at torturing that poor defenseless meter.
Thanks for basics videos
But Aneng was the only multi meter that fought back to UNI-T...Respect
I suspect the switching wave from from both the 121GW and the Aneng were caused when these meters start to breakdown.
I knew you couldn't get enough of that.
And one more thing.
Always verify any questionable instrument .
Check your HV probe using 500 VDC setting on the IR tester and compare the reading to a direct DMM measurement.( use 2 DMM s)
No one else caught the 1.21 GW Reference from BTTF? Nice little reference Dave! And a nice name for what seems to be a nice meter. :)
That's one of the (few) sad things about the demise of CRT colour TV's... The supply of cheap 'hot dog bun warmers' has dried up... once was a time every service house had a HV probe good for 25kV :)
Love the authentic evil laugh @12:12
Shocking results!
So even you can't blow-up the 8008 $25 meter! What's next, the throw it off the dam test?
Let's watch as Dave tries to prove said multimeter sucks...By failing to destroy it.
It didn't die. But you will die.. Thats a FAIL LoL
Lawrence L there is no significant current available from the tester. Putting that meter on a 4KV source with a fault current well into the thousands (or tens of) of amps would definitely end poorly.
subtile, dave wana to say that the evv shit multimeter is superior to cheap ones
But who would do that? I worked with industrial electricians and they didn't use any kind of multimeter to check out 4KV equipment. High voltage probes on long sticks, rubber gloves, face shield etc. Why do people think using any multimeter on high voltage (KVs) low impedance sources is a safe practice?
POTENTIALY useful... sorry, couldn't hold back this pun
At 13:07 the BM 235 displays "InEr" when you turn it on. Is that normal, or did it perhaps suffer some damage from the test?
Really distracting that you didn't have the vertical scale divisions aligned with a zero voltage point instead of offset by -20 or -10 :P
The *triggering* is real.
I feel you. He was so close though at -10v at such a large y axis scaling xD It's not like -10v was the idle voltage either, it isn't even on the line xD
My plan worked a treat.
Figured you probably did that intentionally just to mess with people and see if it would get a reaction. Yep, it worked.
OCD squad about to explode their heads..
When I saw the intro I went back from fullscreen if I am not mistakenly watching photonicinduction...
Wow Dave, you need some minions now, these semi evil style videos recently and all. :-)
When you do your HVP-70 probe tear down how about showing it configured to and the result when viewing your AC mains? Thanks!
To get a energy dump you could have charged the insulation meter then connected the lead to the D.U.T
Connect an external cap to the tester, and then zap the meter with the cap. Breadboard style with 5kV would be nice.
It would help to go into more detail why someone would get these type of voltages anyway.
Maybe he should build Joe Smith's transient generator and use that...
Maybe. Did he even release details of that?
Unfortunately I don't think so.
That's a shame, did he give a reason why?
EEVblog Maybe he was concerned someone would slightly re-engineer it, then silkscreen their tradename on it and remarket it? LOL
I just don't think he's ever even bothered to release documentation for any of his projects. Shame though since he's such a good engineer.
At 12:10 Dave laughs maniacally. And to my shame - so did I.
"Potentially" useful. I see what you did there!
Dang, you didn't even try to light a cigar with it. :)
You can make a hv pulse generator like you want cheap. Use a car ignition coil. Coil one plug coils have a 3 or 4 prong connection. Ground, +12v, and +12v trigger and they will fire a pulse.
Not enough energy and we are looking for a controlled rise and decay shape. Best to just read the IEC standard where they explain the basic concepts of the surge generator. This is what based mine from.
UNI-T... Dave's favorite brand. But this might be a reasonable device, lets see if Dave has to say anything about it..
What about some content having as subject supercapacitors?
Dave you need to learn that MOVs are rated in operating AC voltage .
The clamping DC voltage is much higher 575VAC = 900 VDC clamp
Anyone using a DMM without HV probe should limit their probing to less than 1000V peak.( As per specs )
At 1kV both meters are just fine. MOVs or no MOVs.
Sorry but is there a video that would explain what is a MOV and how it operates to clamp a voltage on this situation? How can these things dissipate kilovolts? I thought this video would give more explanation.
a static shock is usually in the kilovolt range. The current this tester is outputting is minuscule, so the total output power is low, even if it's voltage is high. If the meter was able to do what eevblog wanted (dumping a highvoltage and high amperage shock to the meter) he would have got the explosion's he wanted :)
MOVs are specifically designed to clamp (conduct) and protect against surges and spikes. The transient voltages are typically very high voltage and amps, but really short duration. MOV "absorbs" the excess power as heat, but it's only for a few microseconds. The other thing that MOVs can do is sustain a high voltage at low current - in this case for many seconds. But what kills MOVs is when the voltage is "just" at their rated voltage, so they start to conduct and get warm... soon the thermal runaway happens and the MOV cooks itself to open circuit. So, MOV might survive 5kV or 10kV at
John Coops And this gives us the precious time for more common fuses to get ready for action...
I bought one of those Anengs for a laugh - I wonder if it'd be possible to add an aftermarket MOV to give it a bit more protection?
Geoff T Look inside, some of these have a clearly marked but unpopulated spot for a MOV or gas discharge tube, which was probably there during prototype testing.
Ahh that Rohde & Scharz is so beautiful! I want one!
Is there no ground connector on the HV probe? Does it use just the mains grounding?
I may be late to the game on noticing this, but I like the BTTF reference...Model 121GW .. EPIC!!
Geek Of Truth2 No good, it's not rated for it's stated usage!
Back to the Future >> 121 GigaWatts
But I wasn't born yesterday...I understand that is not for that type of usage...sheesh!
Nah, that's not HV testing, you need a Photonicindution Big Boy's Power Supply for that... :P
Right, enough teasing, when is the 121GW going to be released?
Could you make a vid comparing TVS Diodes and Varistors?
don't get why everyone is having ago at this video
this was way over my head but really enjoyed it
i don't care how accurate it is but i tell you
its got me trying theses types of tests myself
im happy with my crappy £10 meter
haven't got a clue how to use it
and yes the magic smoke has appeared more then once lol
I don't get it.. That looks like Gas Discharge Tube protection to me.. the gas is air, and the tube is the plastic case.. It breaks down at a predictable 3kv.. what's not to like?
Dave's new nickname is "Sparky"
Sounds like you need a TLP DAVE. Good thing I work at a boutique TLP solutions company.
was that classed as a eddy current at the beginning ???
Daiyve, Daiyve, Daiyve Lots of high voltage at Pine Gap, Australia. Load up your kit in the old Subaru and get out there.
Years ago, I have connected car ignition coil through thyristor in serial whit light bulb as a ballast, connected to 240V to Primary 12 V winding. Deadly Plasma Lamp Was Born.
Energise the IR tester before applying across the DUT.
Nice! Can you try it with one of the extremely cheap meters?
where'd the link for the diy hv-probe go???
So what happens if you discharge a flux capacitor into the 121GW meter?
Is HVP-70 on discount again? I missed BARGAINPROBE, hopefully this is my chance :-)
Oops, I'll add that now to the description.
TEAM UP WITH PHOTONIC INDUCTION AND BLOW THEM UP WITH HIGH VOLTAGE PROPERLY!
Ohhh, 'e pawped eet!
speaking of high voltage and multimeters, anyone know if joe smith is coming back? Great video, Dave, BTW!
I guess it has been a while. I had ordered a new 8002 and 8008 to run next. I had already ran the 8002 but a few people had asked about temperature drift and I wanted to do a few other comparisons with them. So stay tuned.
Thanks Joe! Thought maybe you grew weary of us! :) Thanks for checking in!
That was too many 'squizzes' for me. I'm not a young man anymore. :-D
В продаже есть модели мультиметров с газовыми разрядниками на напряжение выше номинала. Разрядники предназначены для маленького термоядерного взрыва предохранителя в цепи мультиметра.
Это не всегда спасает электронику от уничтожения огромным током. Но зато всегда является причиной инфарктов самого электрика.
Я думаю что производители поступили мудро. Пусть мультиметр умрёт тихой смертью, без взрыва щупов, без дыма и гари. Спокойствие электрика в таких случаях намного важнее.
Air Ion-channel clamped meter. Clever design. ROFL
It would be funny to see an EEV BLOG Aneng meter!
I'm thinking about hacking this 8008 by adding some movs etc. Could it benefit from that or it is just too crappy in design to ever achieve any sort of protection?
Maybe. Post what you come up with.
Clearly dielectric grease would make that an8008 basically the same as any other meter.
soupisgdfood But it obviously relies on that heavily encapsulated spark as a protection feature.
John Francis Doe just fill the whole thing with dielectric grease. No worries!
bro i have same multimeter and he dead for high voltage (400kv) how to fix it please !
how to know dead components
Your mmeter looks good. +1
Not so useful, but so funny :D Hey Dave is R&S your favorite now? ;) Regarding to previous comments ... who's care ... never will be almost every satisfied.
sooo... when do we get the newer meter?
kenabi Why would you want it, it's obviously only good for testing hack jobs cobbled together from cheap Japanese chips, ugly cars and flux capacitors.
+John Francis Doe flux capacitor you say? Welp, I'm sold.
it should be a capital crime for a female to allowed within 50ft of a multimeter.
the only meter a bitch should be touching is a cooking thermometer, and then it should be a mechanical one. if it has so much a Cr-2032 battery the it should be punishable by death
have Joe Smith build you a proper impulse tester. He loves that stuff.
It would be far less expensive to buy a new top of the line unit than contract me to design and build a one-off generator. Plus, he would have the added benefit of being able to have it calibrated, actually run some sort of safety test and a lot more drama!
Hmm, pedant: technically 700v is not HV, its MV
TheChipmunk2008 Anything under 1kV peak is Low Voltage! Under ~50V is Extra Low Voltage. 6kV~ and 10kV~ are typical MV voltages.
If you wanting some High Voltage (say it like ac/dc in the song dirty deeds(done dirt cheep)), just get ya a flyback transformer from an old CRT. Better yet, go out and swipe the ignition coil from the wife's car. I would recommend an HEI coil from older GM vehicles, or ford even but any will do, in fact the Coil Over Plug is easiest just need 12 volts and a trigger. There is even an output wire to detect misfires. Maybe this wire could be probed to see the voltages?
My „Voltcraft“ german crap multi sucked and arced at ~1200 V. Took three days getting the stench outa the room.
Should leave high voltage testing to Joe Smith he's the professional.
Thanks
13:20 T1 ROTARY_EEVBLOG
The cheap multimeter upsets the cheap insulation tester.
1.21 Gigawatt multimeter? I want one.
why did the cheap survive ? pure luck?
As I said, it's not that hard to protect against low energy high voltage stuff (like static electricity for example that is much higher voltage) using just series resistors and chipset clamp diodes. Multimeter chipsets are generally pretty robust in their own right.
the thing is a spark gap (unintentionally)
Spark gaps (intentional or not) are good protection against slow rise times. Charge the UT-513 before applying to the AN8008 and the result might be different.
Everything is a spark gap technically...
12:10 needs some Star Wars music.
The voltmeter also survives if we add a person in parallel to the high voltage tester! That is called a good engineering!
electrified video ever
"Potentially useful" .. I see what you did there
Edit: I guess I'm not the only one ;)
who designs that eevblog metre??
The EEVBlog BM235 meter is made by Brymen. The currently unreleased EEVBlog 121GW meter was designed (in part) by Dave himself and is being made by UEI Test Instruments.
never do that with a velman one fore sure....
9:45 Aneng AN8008:
How about trying soms of your own medicine? >:)
12:14 for the evil laugh.