I've read several reviews of this and you're the first to mention the dropout issue while using Roon. I'm very glad you covered this as that is how I'll be using it.
Good review, however I do have an issue with describing a cymbal sound as smoother and more believable, which is incorrect. If you stand in a room with a real drummer hitting cymbals, you'll quickly realize that the natural cymbal sound is actually bright and in your face! This is also true for trumpets and saxophones, their sound has a grainy texture. Smoothing out a sound is not natural at all. It may be more pleasing but it's not natural.
That was a really in-depth review, thanks for that! The Fiber optic receiver built into the device is cool, and that they also provide a converter is a slick thing indeed.
You sir are one diligent fellow. Along with your own informed opinion, the comparisons give us a feel for the quality of the digital output. Comparing it to the DDC was very useful. Thanks! I looked at this a while ago and wondered why there were no inputs if it had a good DAC onboard, you answered that question too. I thought I could probably do better with something like a Magna Mano Ultra.
A very thorough review. Great job. A lot of my questions were eventually answered. I believed you covered this but...I understand one of the benefits of Audirvana is to bypass noise and poor audio processing of laptops. Maybe Audirvana and Roon should been taken out at some point. This seems like an incredibly expensive and complex way to stream music. Your review convinced me that a DDC is the way to go. My “system” is a Lenovo M8 tablet as control center with video, ifi Purifier 3 as reclocker to my DAC and a BT mouse as remote control. My Sundara tells me this works pretty well.
Yes, another great review! PERFECTLY informative! I have the Zen streamer and I use a linear power supply which made incredible sonic improvements. Also, I am using fiber optic via an SFP to RJ5 media converter from the Zen into (via optic cable) the SFP on my network switch (see Gabster's TH-cam video for instructions and links to gear). I think its the same effects as the Optibox. Basically an extra $200 worth of improvements. I think that brings the Zen pretty close without the extra $700 more for the Neo. Worth a try for Zen owners before you spring for the Neo.
Nice! I've been curious to try out something like that now that I've heard optibox on Neo. The downer is that if you want the high sampling rates (for HQ Player) or DSD you need to use the USB output. That could be a limiting factor for some.
thank you for your elaboration on the matter. Does the zen stream still come with the premium anc switch mode psu, or just the generic one? If it’s the former, Is the linear psu really that much of an upgrade?
@@jirihorsky9600 The Zen now comes with a standard (read noisy!) switch mode PS. The switch mode PS made the sound stage bigger, more base, cleaner sound. Very noticeable to me.
Like with the Gustard A26/R26 I don't like the looks of the front part of the Neo stream. In addition I don't want to pay for the inferior DAC built in. Very helpful review.
Drop the DAC, keep the screen. It showing the IP address of the device once it's set up so you can easily access it, makes the screen more than worth it.
If the on board DAC is not that good then it’s way over priced as a streamer. What a pity ,it’s a nice product with good connections. I guess I will keep my Bluesound node
A few comments: - I think not testing this over wifi is a bit of a miss. My guess is the majority of Neo Stream buyers are going to use this wirelessly. I understand the purist approach is hardwired. - Ifi Neo stream doesn't support amazon HD either natively through the app or a 3rd party app like Blue OS does which was a completely deal killer for me. I'm not a roon guy, I'm anti pi, and I don't f with dlna - did you notice any improvement using a DDC between this streamer and you Berkeley dac? Something like the Matrix spdif3 or Singxer Su6/SU2kte ?
Thanks for the comment. I'll keep the wifi thing in mind for future streamers. As for using a DDC between Neo and DAC, I didn't get to that. Both of those may have turned this into a 4 month process over a 3 month. Some decisions have to be made. But if the community needs things I didn't prioritize then the feedback is helpful. If iFi doesn't ask for it back anytime soon I hope to do a follow up when/if they release new firmware to see if the Roon issue is solved and can report on wifi performance then. The Amazon thing is partially (largely?) on Amazon. In general Amazon has done a poor job integrating their music streaming platform into audiophile level gear. I imagine many hardware makers would be keen to integrate Amazon given its popularity and thus expanding the customer base in this already niche market. Since Amazon is so good at diversifying and making money they must think that such audiophile integration is not worth it to their bottom line?
excellent review I have come to rely on your channel for info.👋 QUESTION.am I right in thinking that I could connect a subwoofer out as well as an external DAC?
i went through hell with the Zen Stream,. hope this is more dependable. no drop outs? i ended up with a Bluesound that just works. solid software. i use Roon btw.
Thank you so much for this in depth review! I was wondering, how would you compare it to Cambridge CXN v2? That one doesn’t support dsd and mqa, but the sound I read it supposed to be superb! Thanks!
Cant belive the dac inside is not better. I have the neo idsd. That has outbest alot of other dacs in my system. Just incredible for the money. I Even chose it over Gustard r26, and bifrost 2 wasnt even a competition. Is this not the same dac as the neo idsd?
Just a quick note, the (iFi) IPower Elite Power Supply does a nice job with the Zen Streamer, adding resolution and making things sound more true and organic. It takes a while to break in to soothe the highs, but after that there is no going back the stock power supply. (I have not heard the iPower-X.)
Thank you for that very detail review. I've been looking to upgrade my zen stream my current set up is a non upgraded bifrost 2 hook up to a Topping A90 amp and a Lyr+ I have narrow it down to two streamers the Neo stream and the Eversolo dmp-a6 streamer besides wanting to upgarde my streamer i also want to dip my toes into DSD format and my Bifrost 2 doesn't decode DSD files so the internal dac on the streamer is important. By any chance did you play any DSD files through the Neo stream dac? if so how was the sound quality?
Is sound improved by a streamer in general compared to using a DAP spdif output to a DAC coax input ? If so what is going on exactly that explains such sonic difference ? Thanks.
Is the DAC different in the streamer than the NEO DAC by ifi that shares the same case? That DAC is supposed to be MQA and multi bit with Burr Brown chips I believe?
I don't think they are the same. If you go to iFi's website for each and ctrl+F "burr brown" there are no hits on the streamer page but the burr brown multibit shows up for the DAC version. I think the bigger problem is iFi has a lot of "step down redundancy" in their product lines. In the Zen, Neo, and Pro lines, they have a device that is primarily a DAC, yet they all have a lower-level head amp in them. They also have standalone head amps in the Zen and Pro lines. If you're buying the stack of each, you end up with an unused head amp. That's one example. They do similarly across their product range. Each added redundant thing eats away at what the device's primary function arguably should be capable of at the price point of the device.
I’m new to streamers. Can someone explain if optibox Ethernet would help at all with Apple Music Airplay? My assumption is that Apple Play goes via WiFi and hence, it wouldn’t benefit from Ethernet to optical. How exactly does one get music through Ethernet to Optibox to the streamer from a non-noisy source?
OK then.................................... Ifi made up the name "Optibox". It IS a new type of digital cable connection to be found on streamers but it is mainly known as a copper ethernet cable to optical ethernet converter (a type of "bridge") readily available on Amazon. Ifi just made it proprietary by crossing two pins or something like that. One needs a pair of converters to function. The first, copper to optical & the second, optical back to copper, if one only has copper ethernet connectors between two components. The Ifi Neo is unique because it has included one of the converters into the finished chassis, so there is a direct connection with the optical cable, thus skipping the 2nd converter on that end of the signal stream. On a side note, this is the very same reason XLR connections are so superior to RCA's. Other digital to digital converters work well to reduce noise in the stream too but it's the optical with the advantages. It's coming to all, evolving & the reason never to mix Analog with Digital components in one chassis/case/box. Wifi is fine but getting to that next "audiophile" level isn't possible with it in the stream. 🔈🔉🔊
![ว้าว!ลุงบีมแบกทองมารับขวัญหลานกันยกบ้าน [cc] แดนแพทตี้ SS2 | EP.49 |](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Osihq1OAs-4/mqdefault.jpg)
iFi please listen to this man, drop the low end dac, screen and price.
Drop the DAC 🙏 we need more 'just' streamers
Best, most thorough review of this product on YT. Period.
Well done!
I've read several reviews of this and you're the first to mention the dropout issue while using Roon. I'm very glad you covered this as that is how I'll be using it.
Good review, however I do have an issue with describing a cymbal sound as smoother and more believable, which is incorrect. If you stand in a room with a real drummer hitting cymbals, you'll quickly realize that the natural cymbal sound is actually bright and in your face! This is also true for trumpets and saxophones, their sound has a grainy texture. Smoothing out a sound is not natural at all. It may be more pleasing but it's not natural.
That was a really in-depth review, thanks for that! The Fiber optic receiver built into the device is cool, and that they also provide a converter is a slick thing indeed.
You sir are one diligent fellow. Along with your own informed opinion, the comparisons give us a feel for the quality of the digital output. Comparing it to the DDC was very useful. Thanks! I looked at this a while ago and wondered why there were no inputs if it had a good DAC onboard, you answered that question too. I thought I could probably do better with something like a Magna Mano Ultra.
A very thorough review. Great job. A lot of my questions were eventually answered. I believed you covered this but...I understand one of the benefits of Audirvana is to bypass noise and poor audio processing of laptops. Maybe Audirvana and Roon should been taken out at some point.
This seems like an incredibly expensive and complex way to stream music. Your review convinced me that a DDC is the way to go. My “system” is a Lenovo M8 tablet as control center with video, ifi Purifier 3 as reclocker to my DAC and a BT mouse as remote control. My Sundara tells me this works pretty well.
Yes, another great review! PERFECTLY informative! I have the Zen streamer and I use a linear power supply which made incredible sonic improvements. Also, I am using fiber optic via an SFP to RJ5 media converter from the Zen into (via optic cable) the SFP on my network switch (see Gabster's TH-cam video for instructions and links to gear). I think its the same effects as the Optibox. Basically an extra $200 worth of improvements. I think that brings the Zen pretty close without the extra $700 more for the Neo. Worth a try for Zen owners before you spring for the Neo.
Nice! I've been curious to try out something like that now that I've heard optibox on Neo. The downer is that if you want the high sampling rates (for HQ Player) or DSD you need to use the USB output. That could be a limiting factor for some.
thank you for your elaboration on the matter. Does the zen stream still come with the premium anc switch mode psu, or just the generic one? If it’s the former, Is the linear psu really that much of an upgrade?
@@jirihorsky9600 The Zen now comes with a standard (read noisy!) switch mode PS. The switch mode PS made the sound stage bigger, more base, cleaner sound. Very noticeable
to me.
I'm sorry, I meant the Linear Power supply made the sound stage bigger....
In that price range pay $200 more and get the Gustard A26
Like with the Gustard A26/R26 I don't like the looks of the front part of the Neo stream. In addition I don't want to pay for the inferior DAC built in. Very helpful review.
Drop the DAC, keep the screen. It showing the IP address of the device once it's set up so you can easily access it, makes the screen more than worth it.
Good point. Knowing the IP address at any given time is a plus.
If the on board DAC is not that good then it’s way over priced as a streamer. What a pity ,it’s a nice product with good connections. I guess I will keep my Bluesound node
Epic review 💪👍👌
A few comments:
- I think not testing this over wifi is a bit of a miss. My guess is the majority of Neo Stream buyers are going to use this wirelessly. I understand the purist approach is hardwired.
- Ifi Neo stream doesn't support amazon HD either natively through the app or a 3rd party app like Blue OS does which was a completely deal killer for me. I'm not a roon guy, I'm anti pi, and I don't f with dlna
- did you notice any improvement using a DDC between this streamer and you Berkeley dac? Something like the Matrix spdif3 or Singxer Su6/SU2kte ?
Thanks for the comment. I'll keep the wifi thing in mind for future streamers. As for using a DDC between Neo and DAC, I didn't get to that. Both of those may have turned this into a 4 month process over a 3 month. Some decisions have to be made. But if the community needs things I didn't prioritize then the feedback is helpful. If iFi doesn't ask for it back anytime soon I hope to do a follow up when/if they release new firmware to see if the Roon issue is solved and can report on wifi performance then.
The Amazon thing is partially (largely?) on Amazon. In general Amazon has done a poor job integrating their music streaming platform into audiophile level gear. I imagine many hardware makers would be keen to integrate Amazon given its popularity and thus expanding the customer base in this already niche market. Since Amazon is so good at diversifying and making money they must think that such audiophile integration is not worth it to their bottom line?
@@wavetheorysound thanks for the response especially in regards to amazon. Strange how BlueSound and wiim can work it out with them but not ifi
excellent review I have come to rely on your channel for info.👋 QUESTION.am I right in thinking that I could connect a subwoofer out as well as an external DAC?
great review as usual. too bad that RJ5 > optical converter box isn’t POE.
i was hoping that iFi would have made a Zen Stream MK2 streamer only with a i2s output..and sell it for under a grand.
Great review thank you, just wondering how this one would compare to much more popular bluesound node streamer (only)
i went through hell with the Zen Stream,. hope this is more dependable. no drop outs? i ended up with a Bluesound that just works. solid software. i use Roon btw.
Feature packed with no XBass - One of the main reasons I didn't buy it. For that price it should have EVERY bell and whistle!
Thank you so much for this in depth review! I was wondering, how would you compare it to Cambridge CXN v2? That one doesn’t support dsd and mqa, but the sound I read it supposed to be superb! Thanks!
I hope IFI sends you the Pro iCAN Signature
Cant belive the dac inside is not better. I have the neo idsd. That has outbest alot of other dacs in my system. Just incredible for the money. I Even chose it over Gustard r26, and bifrost 2 wasnt even a competition.
Is this not the same dac as the neo idsd?
Just a quick note, the (iFi) IPower Elite Power Supply does a nice job with the Zen Streamer, adding resolution and making things sound more true and organic. It takes a while to break in to soothe the highs, but after that there is no going back the stock power supply. (I have not heard the iPower-X.)
Thank you for that very detail review. I've been looking to upgrade my zen stream my current set up is a non upgraded bifrost 2 hook up to a Topping A90 amp and a Lyr+ I have narrow it down to two streamers the Neo stream and the Eversolo dmp-a6 streamer besides wanting to upgarde my streamer i also want to dip my toes into DSD format and my Bifrost 2 doesn't decode DSD files so the internal dac on the streamer is important. By any chance did you play any DSD files through the Neo stream dac? if so how was the sound quality?
Is sound improved by a streamer in general compared to using a DAP spdif output to a DAC coax input ? If so what is going on exactly that explains such sonic difference ? Thanks.
Is the DAC different in the streamer than the NEO DAC by ifi that shares the same case? That DAC is supposed to be MQA and multi bit with Burr Brown chips I believe?
I don't think they are the same. If you go to iFi's website for each and ctrl+F "burr brown" there are no hits on the streamer page but the burr brown multibit shows up for the DAC version. I think the bigger problem is iFi has a lot of "step down redundancy" in their product lines. In the Zen, Neo, and Pro lines, they have a device that is primarily a DAC, yet they all have a lower-level head amp in them. They also have standalone head amps in the Zen and Pro lines. If you're buying the stack of each, you end up with an unused head amp. That's one example. They do similarly across their product range. Each added redundant thing eats away at what the device's primary function arguably should be capable of at the price point of the device.
I’m new to streamers. Can someone explain if optibox Ethernet would help at all with Apple Music Airplay? My assumption is that Apple Play goes via WiFi and hence, it wouldn’t benefit from Ethernet to optical. How exactly does one get music through Ethernet to Optibox to the streamer from a non-noisy source?
OK then....................................
Ifi made up the name "Optibox". It IS a new type of digital cable connection to be found on streamers but it is mainly known as a copper ethernet cable to optical ethernet converter (a type of "bridge") readily available on Amazon. Ifi just made it proprietary by crossing two pins or something like that.
One needs a pair of converters to function. The first, copper to optical & the second, optical back to copper, if one only has copper ethernet connectors between two components. The Ifi Neo is unique because it has included one of the converters into the finished chassis, so there is a direct connection with the optical cable, thus skipping the 2nd converter on that end of the signal stream. On a side note, this is the very same reason XLR connections are so superior to RCA's.
Other digital to digital converters work well to reduce noise in the stream too but it's the optical with the advantages. It's coming to all, evolving & the reason never to mix Analog with Digital components in one chassis/case/box.
Wifi is fine but getting to that next "audiophile" level isn't possible with it in the stream. 🔈🔉🔊
What is in it?
did you A/B test on ZenStream vs NeoStream with same power supply ipowerX ?
Yes
... does it make a good coffe too?
It's British. You might get it to make tea 😜🤣