Jim, I deeply admire and enjoy your lectures and think you are a stable resource that does not bend to the wind of trends. I recommend you as the "Arc Flash Expert" in all my ESWP classes. You are a lighthouse in the storm of misinformation out there.
Engineering logic tells us that doors in the experiment that doors shall have sufficient lock or bolted for Engineering solution to safety. The part of the hinge clearly has sufficient strength. Require standard on how covers will be locked to sustain available short circuit arc flash. Also, there should be an Arc Flash rating on the metal sheet . If PPE has Arc Flash Rating. Metal Sheet used in panelboards and switchgears shall also have Arc Flash rating based on material used and thickness. Hope this will be in the next revision
Why? Hierarchy of controls suggests Eliminate the hazard. Have we all not looked at Doughty and Neal in the 90's and IEEE/NFPA collaboration of the early 2000's? 5-12 calorie arc flash 140 db SPL consistently. You guys can wear all the 100 cal stuff you want. My students are trained to reduce or eliminate the hazard. Their leaders need to be trained that convenience and prevention of financial loss still does not justify the risk. LOOK AT THE controls pyramid.. PPE IS THE TIP OF THE SPEAR!! I do NOT care about improvements in PPE, PPE at best is marginal to keep you from being dead. Sound is sound. 141 DB SPL is around 2160 psi pressure to the body. Why are we so adamant to make it electrically safe when in doing so we expose people to huge electrical explosion risk glibly "oh the PPE has improved!!" Really? The Psychics of the arc flash is the same as it was 40 years ago when Ralph Lee published "Arc Flash the the other Electrical Hazard". Yeah I hear you all this is some old guy. Yeah following the rules is why I am still standing at 72. Think about it. Oh, and remember all the whiz bang relaying and fiber loops you do still reduce the hazard but 5-12 calories (rather low values) still generate the maximum OSHA allowable exposure. Again think about it.
@@j81851 I was part of the steering committee of the final incarnation of the IEEE/NFPA collaboration and on the 70 Committee. There is quite a bit of inertia so veering from the existing categories in the near term is unlikely.
Metal enclosure covers, panelboards and switch gear do not have arc ratings like PPE. However, some equipment like switchgear can be designed based on standards such as C37. 20.7. This equipment, known as arc resistant, is designed to contain the energy during an arc flash if it is properly closed.
@@Brainfiller Right now it has no rating. However, if cover will have rating it will assure that the person in front of the switchgear. This may allow person in front of the switchgear just monitoring to be safe without a PPE. If PPE can have a test on Cal per m2 then enclosure covers should have this test too.
@@bobcocampo Equipment can go thought testing to be arc rated. This is not an arc rating. It is the ability of the equipment to contain the energy. PASS/FAIL not a specific arc rating like PPE. Two different things.
Also, I have discovered an alarming number of people who do not read the instructions from manufacturer on how to properly use a noncontact test instrument..for example the need to be properly grounded to avoid false readings etc. Thoughts of untrained people relying on this method?
Jim. I teach that shock is tramua forced on the body..like car accident, baseball bat upside head. etc. Electri shock is electrical trauma forced on body at spoed of light..Robert from Omaha
130.12? Is there any way to change this word salad? I understand the intent, but it looks like a team of HR/Safety, Lawyers and ISO freaks wrote this. It could simply say, "Before any work is done to electrical equipment/conductors, care must be taken to insure all possible electrical sources have been put into an electrically safe condition." It is suppose to address the possibility of multiple sources or back feeding on a circuit that is being worked on. Every qualified worker would be well aware of this hazard and will take precautionary steps.
The best way to initiate a change is to submit Public Input (proposal) for the 2027 edition a NFPA.org. The closing date is June 4, 2024. Thanks for your comment.
Engineering logic tells us that doors in the experiment that doors shall have sufficient lock or bolted for Engineering solution to safety. The part of the hinge clearly has sufficient strength. Require standard on how covers will be locked to sustain available short circuit arc flash. Also, there should be an Arc Flash rating on the metal sheet . If PPE has Arc Flash Rating. Metal Sheet used in panelboards and switchgears shall also have Arc Flash rating based on material used and thickness. Hope this will be in the next revision
Jim, I deeply admire and enjoy your lectures and think you are a stable resource that does not bend to the wind of trends. I recommend you as the "Arc Flash Expert" in all my ESWP classes. You are a lighthouse in the storm of misinformation out there.
Thank you for your kind words and support! Best Wishes!
Engineering logic tells us that doors in the experiment that doors shall have sufficient lock or bolted for Engineering solution to safety. The part of the hinge clearly has sufficient strength.
Require standard on how covers will be locked to sustain available short circuit arc flash.
Also, there should be an Arc Flash rating on the metal sheet . If PPE has Arc Flash Rating. Metal Sheet used in panelboards and switchgears shall also have Arc Flash rating based on material used and thickness. Hope this will be in the next revision
Can Philippines give a suggestion on the revision of NFPA70E
Thank you
Is there any chance that there will be higher categories of PPE added since we have more capable PPE? I honestly expected this update for 2024.
Nothing that I have seen is on the radar screen regarding higher catagories for NFPA 70E. Many lean towards calculated incident energy.
Why? Hierarchy of controls suggests Eliminate the hazard. Have we all not looked at Doughty and Neal in the 90's and IEEE/NFPA collaboration of the early 2000's? 5-12 calorie arc flash 140 db SPL consistently. You guys can wear all the 100 cal stuff you want. My students are trained to reduce or eliminate the hazard. Their leaders need to be trained that convenience and prevention of financial loss still does not justify the risk. LOOK AT THE controls pyramid.. PPE IS THE TIP OF THE SPEAR!!
I do NOT care about improvements in PPE, PPE at best is marginal to keep you from being dead. Sound is sound. 141 DB SPL is around 2160 psi pressure to the body. Why are we so adamant to make it electrically safe when in doing so we expose people to huge electrical explosion risk glibly "oh the PPE has improved!!" Really? The Psychics of the arc flash is the same as it was 40 years ago when Ralph Lee published "Arc Flash the the other Electrical Hazard". Yeah I hear you all this is some old guy. Yeah following the rules is why I am still standing at 72. Think about it. Oh, and remember all the whiz bang relaying and fiber loops you do still reduce the hazard but 5-12 calories (rather low values) still generate the maximum OSHA allowable exposure. Again think about it.
@@j81851 I was part of the steering committee of the final incarnation of the IEEE/NFPA collaboration and on the 70 Committee. There is quite a bit of inertia so veering from the existing categories in the near term is unlikely.
Mabuhay Philippines
Engineering logic tells us that the lock is not enough for the door. Should be calculated to sustain the fault
What are the arc flash ratings of metal enclosure covers of panelboards and switchgears
Metal enclosure covers, panelboards and switch gear do not have arc ratings like PPE. However, some equipment like switchgear can be designed based on standards such as C37. 20.7. This equipment, known as arc resistant, is designed to contain the energy during an arc flash if it is properly closed.
@@Brainfiller Right now it has no rating. However, if cover will have rating it will assure that the person in front of the switchgear. This may allow person in front of the switchgear just monitoring to be safe without a PPE. If PPE can have a test on Cal per m2 then enclosure covers should have this test too.
@@bobcocampo Equipment can go thought testing to be arc rated. This is not an arc rating. It is the ability of the equipment to contain the energy. PASS/FAIL not a specific arc rating like PPE. Two different things.
At speed of light
Also, I have discovered an alarming number of people who do not read the instructions from manufacturer on how to properly use a noncontact test instrument..for example the need to be properly grounded to avoid false readings etc. Thoughts of untrained people relying on this method?
It's like so many other things. Training is the key and without it, things can go terribly wrong.
Jim. I teach that shock is tramua forced on the body..like car accident, baseball bat upside head. etc.
Electri shock is electrical trauma forced on body at spoed of light..Robert from Omaha
Serious shock needs medical attention even if the person seems to be OK. Sometimes effects aren't noticed until sometime later.
130.12?
Is there any way to change this word salad? I understand the intent, but it looks like a team of HR/Safety, Lawyers and ISO freaks wrote this. It could simply say, "Before any work is done to electrical equipment/conductors, care must be taken to insure all possible electrical sources have been put into an electrically safe condition."
It is suppose to address the possibility of multiple sources or back feeding on a circuit that is being worked on. Every qualified worker would be well aware of this hazard and will take precautionary steps.
The best way to initiate a change is to submit Public Input (proposal) for the 2027 edition a NFPA.org. The closing date is June 4, 2024. Thanks for your comment.
Engineering logic tells us that doors in the experiment that doors shall have sufficient lock or bolted for Engineering solution to safety. The part of the hinge clearly has sufficient strength.
Require standard on how covers will be locked to sustain available short circuit arc flash.
Also, there should be an Arc Flash rating on the metal sheet . If PPE has Arc Flash Rating. Metal Sheet used in panelboards and switchgears shall also have Arc Flash rating based on material used and thickness. Hope this will be in the next revision