Just used a plunge router for the first time today. During my practice run, after going through the entire operator's guide, my bit slipped out. So thank you, thank you, thank you! Because I needed this tip.
Two more things. 1. Never tighten the collet without a bit in place or you can damage it. 2. Clean the collet (a blast of air) and the arbor cone (wipe out with a clean cloth) whenever you change the bit, especially if you are using the router upside down in a table where debris can fall back into it. If you have a CNC, using the two wrench method makes it much less likely to move the router out of zero when changing bits because the forces counteract each other vs. pushing against the router.
I remember that show. It was a great show. Father and son as I remember. A lot of great info. I've always followed their advice about not bottoming the bit.
Coming back to watch this video again, I use the same method...now was that because of John’s tutelage or not, idk, but this method is tried and true. Thanks for sharing John.
What a great tip, thank you for this video! I will do this in future 😁. There's another great tip in this video though which you didn't elaborate on - the reasoning behind why the bit shouldn't be bottomed into the holder. I picked this up elsewhere, and it's because the bit is drawn into the holder very slightly during the tightening process, and if it's already bottomed out before you start tightening, then you can't get the best possible tightening because the bit is jammed against the back of the holder. For newbies like me watching videos like this, having the reason for doing something a particular way helps make it stick in the memory and avoid mishaps later. I know you know why you have to back off the bit, this is just for the benefit of watchers who haven't picked up on that yet 😃. I have a battery powered drill made by Stanley (Fat Max) which is excellent but has one annoyance, if I let go of the trigger quickly to stop the drill when I'm done with a hole, the chuck stops so violently that the sheer inertia of the spinning chuck is enough to loosen it no matter how tightly I've done it up (keyless chuck). I've noticed that this is more likely to happen if I've tightened the chuck with the drill bit fully inserted in the chuck, so it's the same issue - the bit is jammed and the chuck isn't fully tightened. That's just annoying with a drill doing 1,000 rpm, but a router bit coming loose at 15,000 rpm is "a little more concerning", hehehehe!
Hmmm, I've never known my bits to be loose and I've always used the bin to lock it. But, now that I've said it. It will probably happen first thing tomorrow morning. I'll keep this trick in my back pocket! Thanks!
I built a CNC machine using the Makita palm router. I keep ruining projects bit keeps working it's way out. I figured out I had 6mm bits in a 1/4" collet. Changed to 1/4" bit still worked it's way out. Ordered new collets. I'll try this tomorrow! Wish me luck.
Thanks for this tip John. I actually busted my knuckles once, trying to loosen a router bit. They hurt to this day. I shall try your trick of squeezing the wrenches with the fingers.
Cool tips! I don't use a router much, but I had a bit come loose just a few days ago. Now I'm annoyed that I threw away the second wrench that came with my router, thinking "what do I need this for when I can just use the spindle lock?"
I don’t remember who to credit, but a TH-cam tip I use is putting a rubber washer or O ring in the bottom of the collet. This gives the bit room to cinch down, without having to hold it up off the bottom while tightening.
Thanks man, just got a new Makita edge router and it wouldn't hold my 8mm bit properly at first but using two wrenches instead of the built-in chuck thingy did the trick!
I bought an ER that has only one locknut for the collet. I have stripped the spanner they included to try and loosen it. I used a proper spanner and even that doesnt open or close collet when you press the lock button....
I have a Ridgid router. In the past I had some bits come loose, ruining projects. Turns out the nut that holds the collet is so wimpy that it broke. Top cracked right off, rendering the thing useless until I could order the overpriced replacement part.
If I may ask. I too have rigid and ordered a 1/4 collect today for the 1/2 opening. Some come loose. Some stay if I make it close enough to the router that it wont make it past the table. Any advice?
Cheers John I’ll never use the just one spanner again .good vid thanks 🙏 it’s nightmare if you using a sled flattening jig doing a slab and the depth changes .especially if you,ve got down to your desired thickness .hopefully I won’t have that issue again .👍
Got rid of the pin long time ago on my cheap router. My good one (Bosch) uses 2 wrenches. But the burning question is of course how do you keep the Collet clean? Compressed air or ''the magical BJ '' as demonstrated in the amplifier video ??? To be honest i used both but only one really works!😀 As always big 👍
This two wrench squeeze method is also good for tightening and loosening hydraulic, air and water fitting. Actually works exceedingly well on stuck fittings..
John recovering from a loose router bit in jury, two fingers broken at tips and stitches . Now I am trying to learn how to make sure it does not happen again .
I only have a problem with one bit - a solid carbide 1/4 inch upcut spiral bit. It comes loose in my Triton, de Walt and bosch routers and also in my Mafell spindle on the CNC. My theory is that the upcut action of the bit means it is trying to screw itself into the wood, and eventually pulls itself out of the collet. I have to take very careful light cuts when using this. Is this a general problem with upcut bits?
Do you think it can also come loose due to the RPM and speed at which it gets pushed? Say you push it too fast and don't let it eat up the wood first? Had mine come loose quite a few times on my bosch while not bottoming. I always bang out the collet to clear it of debris.
If I may ask. I too have rigid and ordered a 1/4 collect today for the 1/2 opening. Some come loose. Some stay if I make it close enough to the router that it wont make it past the table. Any advice?
The reason not to bottom the bit is that there is usually a small radius at the transition from the shank to the cutter and it will slip down that radius..
Meh not really, I know sone of mine have that. the main reason is because the collet is drawn in towards the motor when you tighten it. If the bit is bottomed out, the collet has to work against the friction on the bit because the bit isn't going anywhere. so most of that grunting when you thighten it up is just the bit being harder and harder to slide in the collet, when you cant give it no more, the collet is barley holding on. If you give the bit around 4 mm, all that grunting goes into the collet choking up on the shank of the bit.
no problem John I have a Triton 3 hp router with an smooth bottom ring for the tightening of the bit it's an auto lock bit system How am I suppose to Not Use the Pin LOCK ???
Great tips. The first time I ever used a router the bit flew off just missing my head and putting a nast dent in my front steel door. User beware the can be dangerously deadly if not used and secured properly .
I have a related issue - the nut below the collet (sort of flat looking) comes loose and works its way up the shaft until my bit then comes loose. Could moving in the wrong direction while taking an aggressive cut cause this?
@@taylorsessions4143 My Dewalt with a button lock is doing this. I'm making two passes with a 3/8" straight bit to make a ~ 3/4" wide dado, and the depth changes between passes! So annoying. I have to unplug the router, readjust the depth, plug it back in, etc. I haven't attempted to fix the existing dados since I haven't been able to isolate the problem. The bit is not bottomed out and it feels like I'm tightening it well enough. There's no visible dust, but I'm going to try cleaning everything with alcohol. Once I know what's wrong I'll try to make the dado depth uniform.
@@RyanLovettInSpace I ended up replacing the collet and it's definitely helped, but it can still come loose. Next I'm going to try teflon tape, wish me luck! And to you, I wish good luck! I'm still secretly shopping for a router that won't let go of my bits though.
@@taylorsessions4143 Good luck to you too. I tried with a larger plunge router today with 1/2” shank (previous was 1/4”) and had no trouble. I’ll have to figure out the issue with the other one at some point.
Not sufficiently tight is the first problem with a loose bit but there is a second reason. A bit that overhangs the shaft (ogee, chamfer, roundover etc.) does not transition from the vertical shaft to the horizontal base directly, there is a slight roundover where the two meet. If your collet seats on this roundover it will never tighten completely. Remedy: go to the hardware store and get some small o-rings ( 1/4" or 1/2" to match your collet) slide it on the shaft to the top. Problem solved, the collet can't go all the way up the shaft.
I had this problem today it ruined the pattern I made the collet was tight as can be it still slipped, I thought it was the plunger but that was bottomed sigh gonna hire a millwork company to cnc my stuff I have several pieces I need dont have time for any hassle
I was recently gifted a pretty cheap router. When I went to "play" with it yesterday I couldn't get the collet to bite down on the bit. Upon further inspection I realized the collet is solid with no compression slit. Assuming a step was missed at the factory. I am going to get a better quality router but I hate to see this go to waste. Would it be dangerous/reckless of me to cut my own compression slit into the collet? I'm 50/50 on the idea, even if it bites I dont know if itll hold at 2000rpm.
I think it's because there's a radius where the shaft meets the bit, and it can prevent the collet from gripping the shaft fully. Another trick is to put a small o-ring on the shaft, then you don't have to hold it up while tightening
Why don't more videos on youtube cover useful stuff like this? Without having anyone experienced helping you out you need more instructions like this instead of 100 more ppl ripping on a sawstop.
A small o ring on the router bit shank will stop you from putting the bit in to far so you do not tighten the collar on to the small radius of the cutter shank
LOL, at first I was like "man were did you get the Makita router with the removable cord". Tuns out to be a wireless 18V version. How long can you work with one charge?
Blimey.? I haven’t had to the two wrench thing for years,my routers have a flat plate that works like a spanner when you push in the button,and they also have the Elu style collet where you have to release the nut twice to get a cutter out.never had a problem. Smashed a few small cutters off though !
yep.... but what about the arbor....? I just noticed my arbor was loose (but the bit tight), I can screw the arbor back on, but not tight, as the motor shaft just spins, that's what it needs to do... Has no one else had this happen...? The thread on the motor shaft is quite short, there is no evidence of locktite.....
The squeze trick is the way to go on anything. You have full control , your not gonna punch thru a wall with one hand and throw a spanner in your teeth with the other. You also get more force and more on axis acurate force. Also causes less motion on other parts connected to it. As a plumber, it pisses me off when the manufacture doesn't provide a flat to anti spanner.
I am watching this as I've just put in an order for a new windowpane :/ Where were you like 2 hours ago? Stupid lock pin... I am taking the f*n thing out.
Logo threw me off. But the content was dead on. Once those tricks were shown to me as a 1st year apprentice I've never even thought of doing it any differently. The spindle locks on the trim routers are terrible also.
I came here for cooking videos, and now it's about tips and tricks? Something on brand? I'm unsubscribing! Just kidding, of course, although I still am looking forward to that cooking channel, if you're still doing that.
Just used a plunge router for the first time today. During my practice run, after going through the entire operator's guide, my bit slipped out. So thank you, thank you, thank you! Because I needed this tip.
Two more things. 1. Never tighten the collet without a bit in place or you can damage it. 2. Clean the collet (a blast of air) and the arbor cone (wipe out with a clean cloth) whenever you change the bit, especially if you are using the router upside down in a table where debris can fall back into it.
If you have a CNC, using the two wrench method makes it much less likely to move the router out of zero when changing bits because the forces counteract each other vs. pushing against the router.
I remember that show. It was a great show. Father and son as I remember. A lot of great info. I've always followed their advice about not bottoming the bit.
Coming back to watch this video again, I use the same method...now was that because of John’s tutelage or not, idk, but this method is tried and true. Thanks for sharing John.
Good stuff. I should have watched this video two years ago, would have saved me a lot of heartache.
Great tip John. I remember that show. He could do everything with a router.
What a great tip, thank you for this video! I will do this in future 😁. There's another great tip in this video though which you didn't elaborate on - the reasoning behind why the bit shouldn't be bottomed into the holder. I picked this up elsewhere, and it's because the bit is drawn into the holder very slightly during the tightening process, and if it's already bottomed out before you start tightening, then you can't get the best possible tightening because the bit is jammed against the back of the holder. For newbies like me watching videos like this, having the reason for doing something a particular way helps make it stick in the memory and avoid mishaps later. I know you know why you have to back off the bit, this is just for the benefit of watchers who haven't picked up on that yet 😃. I have a battery powered drill made by Stanley (Fat Max) which is excellent but has one annoyance, if I let go of the trigger quickly to stop the drill when I'm done with a hole, the chuck stops so violently that the sheer inertia of the spinning chuck is enough to loosen it no matter how tightly I've done it up (keyless chuck). I've noticed that this is more likely to happen if I've tightened the chuck with the drill bit fully inserted in the chuck, so it's the same issue - the bit is jammed and the chuck isn't fully tightened. That's just annoying with a drill doing 1,000 rpm, but a router bit coming loose at 15,000 rpm is "a little more concerning", hehehehe!
I use to watch that router show, it was amazing what they could do with a router.
Great tip. I had never seen the one hand trick before.
I remember that show, John. He and his son worked together if I recall correctly. Many great tips they had!
Billy
Hmmm, I've never known my bits to be loose and I've always used the bin to lock it. But, now that I've said it. It will probably happen first thing tomorrow morning. I'll keep this trick in my back pocket! Thanks!
Good tip John. Some people would call this common sense, if sense in fact, was common.
I built a CNC machine using the Makita palm router. I keep ruining projects bit keeps working it's way out. I figured out I had 6mm bits in a 1/4" collet. Changed to 1/4" bit still worked it's way out. Ordered new collets. I'll try this tomorrow! Wish me luck.
Thank you so much for this video. It put my router back in service!
I remember The Router Workshop. They did some amazing work. Largely jig-based but very cool stuff.
Great narrative that resolved my issue
Bill D
Thanks for this tip John. I actually busted my knuckles once, trying to loosen a router bit. They hurt to this day. I shall try your trick of squeezing the wrenches with the fingers.
I came to this same way of doing this on my own. You are correct. This is the best way I've found. tnx!
I used to watch the 'Router' show and "New Yankee Workshop" on PBS. I think it was a father and son on the router show I watched.
Cool tips! I don't use a router much, but I had a bit come loose just a few days ago. Now I'm annoyed that I threw away the second wrench that came with my router, thinking "what do I need this for when I can just use the spindle lock?"
I don’t remember who to credit, but a TH-cam tip I use is putting a rubber washer or O ring in the bottom of the collet. This gives the bit room to cinch down, without having to hold it up off the bottom while tightening.
Nice tip John. I’ve been doing it that way for years and it’s definitely the best way!
Thanks man, just got a new Makita edge router and it wouldn't hold my 8mm bit properly at first but using two wrenches instead of the built-in chuck thingy did the trick!
Oh how I needed this video! Thanks so much.
I bought an ER that has only one locknut for the collet. I have stripped the spanner they included to try and loosen it. I used a proper spanner and even that doesnt open or close collet when you press the lock button....
Thanks - that was exactly what I needed to know.
I have a Ridgid router. In the past I had some bits come loose, ruining projects. Turns out the nut that holds the collet is so wimpy that it broke. Top cracked right off, rendering the thing useless until I could order the overpriced replacement part.
They should be a free replacement if they break. The cheapos!
:)
If I may ask. I too have rigid and ordered a 1/4 collect today for the 1/2 opening. Some come loose. Some stay if I make it close enough to the router that it wont make it past the table. Any advice?
Another great video with great advice! Thanks John!
Great video John! and good tips :) Thanks for sharing them with us.👍😎JP
Cheers John I’ll never use the just one spanner again .good vid thanks 🙏 it’s nightmare if you using a sled flattening jig doing a slab and the depth changes .especially if you,ve got down to your desired thickness .hopefully I won’t have that issue again .👍
You are a true wealth of great information 👍🏻
Fantastic tip! Thank you!
Great tip!
That's huge! Thanks for posting this.
Got rid of the pin long time ago on my cheap router. My good one (Bosch) uses 2 wrenches. But the burning question is of course how do you keep the Collet clean?
Compressed air or ''the magical BJ '' as demonstrated in the amplifier video ??? To be honest i used both but only one really works!😀
As always big 👍
I put some tape around the axle when I put 3mm into a 1/8" colet. But I found some straws work better!
This two wrench squeeze method is also good for tightening and loosening hydraulic, air and water fitting. Actually works exceedingly well on stuck fittings..
Great tip, even though I have accidentally been doing this for years- you know? Knuckles!!
Fantastic tip cant be leave I never thought of this
John recovering from a loose router bit in jury, two fingers broken at tips and stitches . Now I am trying to learn how to make sure it does not happen again .
Great advice, thanks.
I only have a problem with one bit - a solid carbide 1/4 inch upcut spiral bit. It comes loose in my Triton, de Walt and bosch routers and also in my Mafell spindle on the CNC. My theory is that the upcut action of the bit means it is trying to screw itself into the wood, and eventually pulls itself out of the collet. I have to take very careful light cuts when using this. Is this a general problem with upcut bits?
Great info John thank you
Do you think it can also come loose due to the RPM and speed at which it gets pushed? Say you push it too fast and don't let it eat up the wood first? Had mine come loose quite a few times on my bosch while not bottoming. I always bang out the collet to clear it of debris.
Good tips, don't bottom out the bit, and 1 hand 2 wrench squeeze, got it.
If I may ask. I too have rigid and ordered a 1/4 collect today for the 1/2 opening. Some come loose. Some stay if I make it close enough to the router that it wont make it past the table. Any advice?
Could this also apply to dremel tools; the not bottoming out the bit thing?
Yes ur right I miss that show
The reason not to bottom the bit is that there is usually a small radius at the transition from the shank to the cutter and it will slip down that radius..
Meh not really, I know sone of mine have that. the main reason is because the collet is drawn in towards the motor when you tighten it. If the bit is bottomed out, the collet has to work against the friction on the bit because the bit isn't going anywhere. so most of that grunting when you thighten it up is just the bit being harder and harder to slide in the collet, when you cant give it no more, the collet is barley holding on. If you give the bit around 4 mm, all that grunting goes into the collet choking up on the shank of the bit.
Great tip sir!
no problem John I have a Triton 3 hp router with an smooth bottom ring for the tightening of the bit it's an auto lock bit system How am I suppose to Not Use the Pin LOCK ???
Great tips. The first time I ever used a router the bit flew off just missing my head and putting a nast dent in my front steel door. User beware the can be dangerously deadly if not used and secured properly .
I have a related issue - the nut below the collet (sort of flat looking) comes loose and works its way up the shaft until my bit then comes loose. Could moving in the wrong direction while taking an aggressive cut cause this?
I didn't have that problem YET! But I will stop using the lock pin. Make sence you can apply lot more force this way. Thanks again.
I’ve never once had a problem with router bits coming loose.
I never did until I did.
What brand is your router? You can guess why I'm here. So mad at this router for wrecking another project
@@taylorsessions4143 My Dewalt with a button lock is doing this. I'm making two passes with a 3/8" straight bit to make a ~ 3/4" wide dado, and the depth changes between passes! So annoying. I have to unplug the router, readjust the depth, plug it back in, etc. I haven't attempted to fix the existing dados since I haven't been able to isolate the problem. The bit is not bottomed out and it feels like I'm tightening it well enough. There's no visible dust, but I'm going to try cleaning everything with alcohol. Once I know what's wrong I'll try to make the dado depth uniform.
@@RyanLovettInSpace I ended up replacing the collet and it's definitely helped, but it can still come loose. Next I'm going to try teflon tape, wish me luck! And to you, I wish good luck! I'm still secretly shopping for a router that won't let go of my bits though.
@@taylorsessions4143 Good luck to you too. I tried with a larger plunge router today with 1/2” shank (previous was 1/4”) and had no trouble. I’ll have to figure out the issue with the other one at some point.
Passing on knowledge.. Thanks
I remember that show, him and his son! They used those Hitachi routers!
Thanks for the video.
My Skil router has the pin and it only has one nut so how would I tighten that because the bits are slipping in it!
Not sufficiently tight is the first problem with a loose bit but there is a second reason. A bit that overhangs the shaft (ogee, chamfer, roundover etc.) does not transition from the vertical shaft to the horizontal base directly, there is a slight roundover where the two meet. If your collet seats on this roundover it will never tighten completely. Remedy: go to the hardware store and get some small o-rings ( 1/4" or 1/2" to match your collet) slide it on the shaft to the top. Problem solved, the collet can't go all the way up the shaft.
Thanks for sharing !
cant use two wrenches on mine, just cant seem to get the thing tight enough
One of those classic "this is just obvious to anyone who knows, and completely unguessable to those who don't" tips
I had this problem today it ruined the pattern I made the collet was tight as can be it still slipped, I thought it was the plunger but that was bottomed sigh gonna hire a millwork company to cnc my stuff I have several pieces I need dont have time for any hassle
great tip
I was recently gifted a pretty cheap router. When I went to "play" with it yesterday I couldn't get the collet to bite down on the bit. Upon further inspection I realized the collet is solid with no compression slit. Assuming a step was missed at the factory. I am going to get a better quality router but I hate to see this go to waste. Would it be dangerous/reckless of me to cut my own compression slit into the collet? I'm 50/50 on the idea, even if it bites I dont know if itll hold at 2000rpm.
Wow. I’ve had the corded version of that Makita router for years and always wondered what the second spanner/wrench was for. Slightly embarrassing.
They say you can put a rubber O ring in where the bit goes to keep it from bottoming out.🤔
Why don't you bottom out the bit? Does that lead to friction in the base of the receptacle or something?
Thanks for the video.
I think it's because there's a radius where the shaft meets the bit, and it can prevent the collet from gripping the shaft fully. Another trick is to put a small o-ring on the shaft, then you don't have to hold it up while tightening
The son on that show always reminded me of John Candy.
You only have to bark your knuckles a couple of times to figure out the two wrench one hand method. But good tip for those who have yet to learn.
Why don't more videos on youtube cover useful stuff like this? Without having anyone experienced helping you out you need more instructions like this instead of 100 more ppl ripping on a sawstop.
Thanks. Good to know.
A small o ring on the router bit shank will stop you from putting the bit in to far so you do not tighten the collar on to the small radius of the cutter shank
LOL, at first I was like "man were did you get the Makita router with the removable cord".
Tuns out to be a wireless 18V version. How long can you work with one charge?
Does anyone know how to tighten a craftsman's bit without using the locking mechanism? Mine is wearing out!
And.... Rebranded. Ps maybe you missed it or maybe you want it that way but the water mark is still red logo :o
takes time for YT to catch up with that stuff. should change soonish :)
Wonder if the worlds caught on to using all three drill bit key holes to hold a drill bit in the chuck yet?
That's how I do it too, learned it the hard way... But why not bottom out the bit?
as you tighten the nut the collet and bit it will get pulled in further, if it is already bottomed out it can't do that.
excellent
Thank, didn't know
That will save my knuckles
Blimey.? I haven’t had to the two wrench thing for years,my routers have a flat plate that works like a spanner when you push in the button,and they also have the Elu style collet where you have to release the nut twice to get a cutter out.never had a problem. Smashed a few small cutters off though !
Nice.
Hey! New name for the Red Channel!?
Trying something out to see how it goes :)
@@IBuildIt Change is scary, so are clowns.
May I suggest a name for this method? "The ol' double wrench squeeze and snug"
Maybe you should mention that you need to make sure that the bits and the collets are squeaky clean
yep.... but what about the arbor....? I just noticed my arbor was loose (but the bit tight), I can screw the arbor back on, but not tight, as the motor shaft just spins, that's what it needs to do... Has no one else had this happen...? The thread on the motor shaft is quite short, there is no evidence of locktite.....
Does anyone know how to add LED lights to an old router, as most new tools come with them. Let me know
I see you have done some rebranding on this channel.
What's the reasoning of not letting the bit touch the bottom?
The collet pulls the bit in slightly when it tightens. If the bit is already bottomed out the collet can't seat properly.
The squeze trick is the way to go on anything. You have full control , your not gonna punch thru a wall with one hand and throw a spanner in your teeth with the other. You also get more force and more on axis acurate force. Also causes less motion on other parts connected to it. As a plumber, it pisses me off when the manufacture doesn't provide a flat to anti spanner.
*sigh* Guys, this is why they make loctite... 😎
Now that is a good trick! Can you make a video on busting your knuckles trying to loosen them?
If you use the two wrench method you're unlikely to bust your knuckles.
I am watching this as I've just put in an order for a new windowpane :/ Where were you like 2 hours ago? Stupid lock pin... I am taking the f*n thing out.
Logo threw me off. But the content was dead on. Once those tricks were shown to me as a 1st year apprentice I've never even thought of doing it any differently. The spindle locks on the trim routers are terrible also.
What's your next video, "How to breathe air"???
If you need that video I will make it, I can also make one to teach you how to be polite.
I came here for cooking videos, and now it's about tips and tricks? Something on brand? I'm unsubscribing!
Just kidding, of course, although I still am looking forward to that cooking channel, if you're still doing that.
Be some "manly meals" videos on my scrap bin channel :)
Chances are that when a router bit comes lose that the collet is stuffed and deeds to be replaced.
Great tip, thanks brother!