Solve Your Story Structure Problems In 11 Steps - Pat Verducci [FULL INTERVIEW]
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 พ.ค. 2024
- 0:00 - Great Movies Have These 3 Essential Story Elements
13:53 - Writing Can't Be Taught
26:29 - If I Don't Write I Don't Feel Good
34:28 - How To Find The Emotional Spine In A Screenplay
45:05 - Theme Comes Last In The Writing Process
55:20 - 11 Step Story Structure Made Easy
1:09:27 - Story Structure Is A Form Not A Formula
1:21:00 - A Writer's Job Is To Create Questions, Not Give Answers
1:29:58 - How To Figure Out What A Character Wants
Writing Coach, Teacher, Mentor and Screenwriter Pat Verducci teaches two Advanced Screenwriting courses at UCLA TFT. She has written scripts for Touchstone Pictures, Witt-Thomas Productions, and Walt Disney Animation Studios. She has also worked as a story consultant for Disney/Pixar. She wrote and directed the feature film True Crime, starring Alicia Silverstone, and her writing credits also include documentary shorts for HBO and Showtime. She co-produced Somewhere Between, a feature documentary about four teenaged girls transracially adopted from China, and served as a story consultant on the Tinkerbell franchise for Disney. She is currently the script editor on several feature film projects for Film Victoria and Screen Australia, and is writing Citizen Bella, a documentary on the life of modern dancer Bella Lewitzky. Verducci serves as a mentor at Cinestory and the Meryl Streep funded IRIS/New York Women in Film and Television’s Writer’s Lab for Women. She’s a member of the Writers Guild of America.
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The woman who conducts these interviews does a PHENOMENAL job! I always leave these videos feeling like I swindled a free month of film school.
Thank you, Michael.
I agree. Good interviewing is nearly a lost skill, and it doesn't get nearly enough applause.
I agree. The interviewer is an amazing listener. She allows her expert guest to finish speaking before asking her next question. Also, She never interrupts, too. Her interviewing skills makes it so easy for me to listen to hours of FC interview videos.
a lovely conversation between two lovely ladies, the flow so natural and palatable, it's deceptive in how chalk full it is, their wise and measured discourse imparts their hard earned lessons in craft.. the honest and mindful reflection required for such deep understanding of personal strengths and weaknesses was hugely inspiring.. i love returning to this channel to catch up, I always take something away, even if it's not hard and fast advice, but abstract musings I can try to apply to myself.. how can i think about my own blind spots and natural talents as they do about themselves, and grow from such introspection.. bravo
@@Inkironnrum That’s exactly how I ended up down the FC rabbit hole. It’s such a nice listening experience without constant interjections.
I’m at work doing patient care and listening when she said “whether you’re getting paid or not, if you’re writing, you’re a writer” I effing LOST it.
When I’m not writing I don’t feel good … ooft! All I think about is writing. It’s to the point that it physically hurts.
I needed to hear this.
great to hear that... but if you don't mind me asking, what do you do with what you write? i am trying to do it myself but i feel demoralized when i think i have nothing to do with it afterwards ☹
Even though I have nothing to do with the film business (I write Novels only) I still find this one of the best channels about writing and storytelling. I love listening to the guests you have on here, they have a wealth of knowledge that can only be gained by extensive experience in the field telling stories to an audience. Also, love the interviewer, your questions, tone and pace are excellent.
Agreed. I find storytelling is helping me figure out life's challenges.
I have listened to this interview multiple times and it is easily one of the best on this channel. The amount of information and wisdom is incredible! And so much of the wisdom applies to creativity in general and other artforms. One point in particular that rings so true about the 20 minute mark is that "the magic doesn't happen unless you are in the chair". I am an artist who is interested also in writing - mostly I do digital art and comics but used to do a lot of traditional art also - but I have learned this lesson over the years that one must be in the drawing chair (or for other artists behind the easel) every day just making the work. Some days are not as good or less inspired and some days are good and a few are great. The progress is made through the daily practice of making the work. There are in fact a few days I struggle to start, but once I do the "magic" usually flows. You are always making progress and some improvement but is gradual so you sometimes won't feel like it. But you must keep moving forward. The daily schedule is also important because as you see yourself making progress you become motivated by that progress and that makes you want to continue on, finish a project, and start another one. So keep working! Start something, finish it knowing it's imperfect, and take what you learned and make another one! Also don't compare yourselves to others in a harsh way or you are robbing yourself of what is unique about you - and finding your own voice is definitely the point of being an artist - that's the entire point. So learn the rules, keep working to master them but enjoy becoming who you become - embrace your own voice and enjoy the process. It took me 30 years to figure this out!
I could watch this interview forever. And I will never write a screenplay. Very interesting and fufilling to hear a true professional talk about her craft.
No, watch it again.
she's so lovely and honest
This was a terrific interview. Initially, I thought it was going to be 14 minutes long but it was 1 hour 40 minutes. I listened to the entire dialog and even backtracked on some points. I especially found the info on plotting structures the most informative. Thanks!
Great to see that this interview kept you engaged to watch it all the way through on your first viewing!
I’m literally 14 mins in and was thinking the same thing. Love it though.
I just love Film Courage.
Film Courage is the best ever!!!
Produced three short films and a docudrama since I began in 2019. Now there is another film being prepped.
Learned more in 10 min then in a whole semester lol
As a filmmaker who wants to start writing, this interview is really helpful and it clarifies in my mind a lot of things. I always say that I can't write. But now I will try. Thank you so much.
"It won't happen unless you are sitting in the chair." AMEN. Wonderful words. This makes her lecture. Thank you
1:11:50 It actually speaks to me this part about just writing it, and not overthinking. I'm also the type that has a board with all the connecting red lines and structures inside the structure. I had that one scene which didn't feel like it had come to an end. I already knew what scene came after it next, so I really didn't want to dwell on the current one anymore because I was on a bucket list type of journey, and furthermore had no idea where to park it anyway. Against my first instinct, I just started devolving in what i though would be a boring campfire slow time, but it ended up being so much more fun to write, and important to the rest of the plot once I just threw it out there. Definitely take chances if in doubt.
I definitely think that you need to give yourself the freedom to find new things as you go along. Give your character a goal but don't worry about how they get there until you actually start writing it.
I like this take. I'll keep it in mind when I get the chancr to write again. Cheers!
I've been watching Film Courage for the past three months. I love the advice given by the guests that come onto this channel. It is great getting advice and listening to their story's and writing process. It helps me in figuring out my own writing process.
It's crazy how far and back I can relate to the struggles of even these experts in the field! Like the Spine, right, well that is something writers in the field or just starting out almost never hear about. What this interview said is spot on, and what I'd like to add, is that Spines only occur for a character's arc _if_ there's a defense mechanism in place, a way for the character to cope with something that happened in their past(their backstory/Ghost).
I know how this interview, she was talking about that struggle to find the Want, the character's ultimate external plot goal that thinks "makes them happy" but it doesn't. Well, the Spine is a character's Flaw, and that Flaw goes hand-hand as the core reason externally why they can't get what they Want internally to satisfy making them happy. It's going on this journey from beginning to end if it's a positive change let's say, they shed this Flaw, the Spine, and replace it with a Strength after attaining the Need they find in the Climax, what truly makes them happy to sacrifice what they Want(and by extension, conquering that inner demon of the Ghost to shed their Spine in this too).
This allows for the transformation of their character Lie at the start to their character Truth they learn in the end. Beautiful Truth, innit?
Main character. Obstacles. Emotions. (Check, check and check)
I am only 11 minutes into this and I already got a great clarity about my WIP. Paused the video to go back and change the first chapter. Thanks a lot for the upload.
Writing even a half-decent story involves so many moving parts that it's easy to simply follow a template based on a genre or a previously successful movie. So, to write anything with fresh elements requires a degree of intuition or talent so great that most of the process of writing takes place under the surface, while the tip of the iceberg would involve the editing and rewriting process.
Pat's brilliant - she's a genius but also incredibly warm and supportive - super rare. If you haven't consulted with her it's worth it
Some years ago a ‘genius’ meant someone like Da Vinci, Einstein or Shakespeare. Now everyone on TH-cam is a genius.
@@Mr.Monta77 amen!!
@@Mr.Monta77 had they lived now they'd be interviewed just like this, and people would take it for granted like you are just bc access is easier now
I find it overwhelmingly ironic
@@nailinthefashion No, I don’t think this has anything to do with irony.
You are making a circular argument fallacy. You are basing your assumption on what you claim is already assumed true. But it is not. The problem in question was if Pat’s a genius. I agree that there is a fundamental similarity in quality between Pat and Einstein. They are both human, but importantly, one is perhaps a gifted screenwriter and the other a uniquely intelligent man who when working as a clark in a patent office, formulated the theory about the priciple of relativity, proposing that gravity is a curved field in the space-time continuum created by the existence of mass, etc.
If Einstein was interviewed here, he would still be a unique man who through the incredible power of his mind, could predict and describe central principles of the Universe.
I seriously doubt that you can prove that the circumstance of their interview and in what place in time it took place, would neccessarily change the difference in quality, so that they would be mutually exclusive. Even at a veeeery long distance, there would be a fundamental difference. Imagine two works of Pat and Einstein are discovered in the future, on a different planet and they could be deciffered precisely. The difference would still remain fundamental: the one would be a good writer, and the other would be a genius describing the Universe and its principles, in which these creatures of the future also live.
The only thing overwhelming here is Einstein’s profound importance for mankind itself.
Perhaps if Pat was on a train moving through space-time, but that was a joke.
@@Mr.Monta77 lmao
The most "problematic" thing about "classic" dead authors (like Patricia Highsmith) is how we look down on them because they don't agree with current cultural norms. Current cultural norms aren't going to stay for long because they're worthless in living a life one can be content with. Most of it is based on judging others rather than any real attempt to improve oneself. This is why so much writing nowadays is crap. Because if you don't understand what life is about, you certainly cannot write a story that is valuable to the individuals that constitute our society. We're built around story--story is hardwired into our brains and bodies so if the stories we write don't fit within the paradigm of what our biology considers a good story they will be rejected eventually, if not right from the get-go.
28:27 my new hero. Yes in every word and way!!
I am first time to the university I named. I am not good in English but I understand almost all of them. Because it's simple and clear everyone can understand. I like also the interviewer she know how to get from others. Thanks so much you guys make clear that I could not see.❤❤❤❤
Interestingly enough, Jeff Kitchen said one of his teachers told him "The way in which the protagonist resolves the dilemma expresses the theme of the story" (th-cam.com/video/KJoF_zB_og8/w-d-xo.html). There's a connection to wich she sais about "Theme" coming last. I think that is a great way to think about, even if you don't have much "scenes" in your head, if you know how the story ends, you can develope the story backwards, like reverse ingeniering it, but you have to fuel it with experience and emotional openess. It's a bit hard sometimes, but a great way to go.
that is very useful. ty
Alan Watts is big on dilemma. It drives the arc. A problem that can’t be solved unless…the hero changes
This lady is SO good.
This interview probably taught me everything about "How to write a great story" a huge thanks to the team and the writing coach for sharing this phenomenal experience.
LOVED this interview. Sharing it with the writers in my life. Bravo Karen for a masterful interview! Thanks to Pat for her transparency and sharing.
Immediate fiction by jerry cleaver is the best how-to book on writing ive ever seen. His book breaks down stories in the most clear way ive ever found, and he explains each aspect in detail, so you understand where your story is working and where it isnt, and also gives great tools to edit your work to actually strengthen it, plus how to defeat writers block, and how to commit to writing daily.
Conflict (life determining want vs obstacle)
Action (what is the character doing to overcome the obstacle)
Resolution (victory, loss, or mixed)
Emotion (what are the characters feeling)
Showing (living their experience, not 'telling')
Check it out, for all our sakes. I want to watch great movies being made, and great books being written.
I like her perspective about organizing scripts with color pencil ..infact I use different colors font ..for a specific charecter ..
Cannot thank you enough for these. Truly. Honestly. Thank you.
Pat is an intelligent storyteller! Thanks for this.
Great practical writing advice!
I watch this interview over and over again and still get something new inspiration. Thank you so much.
Wonderful interview. So helpful❣️
Brilliant. Thank you.
This is excellent. Thanks for sharing.
I’m halfway through and loving this interview!! I could listen to you both for hours.
Excellent and interesting. I think it is worth noting that the advice about your main character wants/needs being the foundation or start point isn't an absolute principle. There are many tremendous stories that are not founded upon this, but instead upon an event or series of events that collide with an unwitting protagonist. The character reacts to these, and the relatable emotions and learning/development comes via their navigating through an overarching circumstance.
This is absolutely excellent advice!! Growing characters' wants out of their fears will be something I'll definitely experiment with.
Wow, this is a GREAT interview. Pat Verducci makes a lot of sense. I can almost see in my mind what she's saying. You could learn a lot from her. Bravo!!
Incredible interview wow
Happy weekend everyone. This interview was very interesting and enlightening.
I love how you all outline the index by the minutes for us review some of her main topics. Impressive 💯 👍🏾👍🏾
God, I love listening to Pat Verducci. She's AWESOME.
Just the interview I needed! One of the best since Corey mandell, Jen grisanti and Pilar Alessandra. Thank you film courage for this priceless material.
Another great interview!!!!
Thank you for these interviews! Thinking about acting
Fabulous and very helpful.
I really dont know how to thank you for these amazing advice!
Very helpful and suggestive of line of action to follow.
At 20;20 lol it was nice to hear her say how writers create the so-called ;writer's block' because I have told fellow writers/film makers that I have never gotten 'writer's block' because I simply do not believe in it. Great that she touched on that nonsense. Good video over all.
Thank you. I learned so much. I kept pausing the video to excitedly apply each insight to my own project.
Thank you for saying everything you have here!!!! You've reaffirmed that what I've been doing is not a gesture of futility.I am grateful. My thanks a thousandfold, truly.
As far as the talented Mr. Ripley is concerned I rented it, turned it off half way through gave it another chance and loved it. My nephew went to see it and actually walked out, then saw it all at a later time and loved it to
Great stuff!
AWESOME !!...boy...did i NEED this...!! so clearly direct AND USEFUL...many thanks for a great help. a 5 STAR presentation Thank YOU...SO much !!
Love this
Very helpful, thank you so much for making these and sharing them for free!
Love this interview! Thanks for watching!
Wow. I got a TON out of this one. I'm a concept artist/illustrator trying to understand story-telling to further my craft, and have a story I'm working on. Some things Pat said about "what the character wants" have made me consider what I'm up to in a whole different light. Great interview too!
We're glad you found this one Joe!
Great interview. And I love the discussion of Patricia Highsmith.
Replaying now! Have a wonderful day
Engrossing. Thank you.
Pure gold. 🙇🏻♂️
What do you like about this video?
No fade out/fade in intro! Best thing ever!
What I like most about this video is that it's discussing screenwriting, movie, and what your main character wants.
That it is published and can be watched for free!
What I don't like is she says the word "like" 345 times throughout the video.
thats fascinating
What a great video. Super well explained, thanks! Any video in your channel on how to record yourself with soft soft? I'm under the
Never wrote a film ...applying this to my drama series..hope it works
WAY into your " I LOVE my PENCILS "".....WAY AWESOME....SO. cool... i finally hear someone else about loving theie pencils.... i also LOVE my pencils...thank you SO much !!
Very insightful and useful interview. And your guest the interviewee is just wonderful in her presentation and clarity. Not just for playwriting but also stories in general. Wish there were more like her! 😉
Thanks for posting Jakob! We love that this one found you.
These Rock!
This really is exceptional content content!
Thanks for watching and posting Simon!
Is there a story structure you use most often in your work?
I am a student of Joseph Campbell.
Yes, the myth of the hero/ine is in most movies, especially in action/adventure epics. So, I’m drawn to that since I love that genre.
However, I’ve learned to appreciate other genres after I took Robert McKee’s screenwriting classes.
I write as I wish and fix it later. Don't get me wrong, there is always a plan. But sometimes the plan is trash. If you desire success, you have to sacrifice your initial vision for something greater. Never compromise, only make it better.
Leaders have things they want, and the minions just try to figure out what the can do, and when they meet other groups that follow other logic, it looks like a mess with many kinds of beings,,,
For me story structuring is what I need to work on a little more..
The conversation at about 31:40 about listening to music, while writing, and it being distracting or not, I really relate to. I am a composer, who is also a writer, and I found that I am too distracted by songs with lyrics as well so I began composing my own original music to write with. Even when I listen to soundtrack music, like I said I am a score composer, so I have trouble detaching myself from the movie it is connected to if I recognize it. I have benefited greatly from creating songs from scratch to write with because I can apply any situation to those songs! I know a lot of you don’t know the first thing about making music so obviously that’s not a great tip for everybody but those of you who can I suggest you try this! Especially if you’re someone who thinks well in trailer format
Wow thank you. This was an incredible helpful interview. It was really helpful to think about my memoir project. Really appreciate it.
Love to hear that! We're glad this one found you!
I love this lady. I could listen to her for hours. So relatable. And I would marry her if she wasn't married, oh, and if I wasn't married either 😬🤣🤣
By the end she was saying she didn’t actually know what the theme of the talented Mr ripley actually is, I would say the theme is “materialism and celebrity can’t actually make you happy and the work you’ll have to do to keep them will make you even unhappier”
Just wow!!
Cheers!
I feel like it’s worth pointing out that one of the most popular characters in all of genre fiction is a character named Snake-Eyes, who doesn’t speak a single word and whose face you never see. He’s positioned with the same iconic status as a (mask-on) Rorschach. A kind of aspirational absolutism that we project ourselves onto. I suppose we could even put The Predator into that mix.
The Predator does have a distinct drive, a distinct want, but it also fundamentally expresses both compassion and justice, which are humanity’s fundamental tenets of its continued existence.
In terms of listening to music, the only songs that have lyrics I listen to are in Latin. And I also organize songs based on the mood of the characters/scene that I'm writing. So I will have sad, quirky, happy, dark, action playlists that I can choose from to help with the feel of what I'm writing in the moment.
3:45 Wishful Thinking > I am Perfect > etc
Thanks!
Wow! Thank you so much Littlebit Gardener! It's great to see you find so much value in our interview with Pat! Our best to you and your creative work!
The law of attraction works so crazily when it comes to videos popping up that you need or care to hear. It seems like the world is telling my main character is not full enough, and not driving the plot enough.
17:01 FACTS!!!!!!!
I wish the interviewer would do this for novelists too
Hi Nick, here are a few segments on novel writing, adaptations, etc. - bit.ly/3Bh2H9N
Wants and drives can be overused, not all drives are exploited equally .
"what do they want" might mean "how am i, as a reader or audience member, relating to this story and getting something out of it".
edit: i dont think a main character needs to elicit empathy from audiences. generally, empathy is useful for audiences to be invested in how a character responds or affects the plot. but a main character could be also a catalyst for events.
gregory house in house md elicits empathy and sympathy for his character, and the story is greatly enhanced through the audience feeling invested in house as well as interested in seeing each episode or story arc resolve.
but bbc's sherlock holmes is not a character that garners much empathy from its audience. but people wanted to see what would happen next regardless.
edit again: the magic of writing is, to me, cooking something up from, mainly, your subconscious. you cannot control fully the ingredients of your thoughts, feelings, mood, perspective, and style. but you can develop practices to refine your sense of storytelling, as well as find assurance on well paved and lit roads.
but thats also why stories can be so magical. they are unique expressions of humanity that someone or a group of people have manifested into the world. and it trickles back into more peoples subconscious, and into their own invisible ingredients bubbling away inside their mind.
Very youthful spirit.
When adding stakes and assessing Linda Seger’s list, we can sorta read through them and note down where parts of our story could be improved by aligning with one of the stakes? So instead of a scene just being uncomfortable because what happened was bad, we can adjust it to be more empathetic by adding stakes, yeah?
Not just stakes but context-- why is it happening to THEM? What's the lesson or how does it obstruct your goal? Maybe it can even strengthen their end state if they go through more or less but the most important part imo is to remember we have the power to make the problems a character themself, and to make the tragedy meaningful whereas in real life it can be just a bad coincidence.
Writing coincidences can be meaningful even if they're random, if you give them as much attention as your other assets.
@@nailinthefashion precisely, and with all the information I’ve been looking through with this channel and others I think I understand more of what I was unsure of before: that I may have story plans that aren’t as meaningful, but are then improved with what you’ve said and by making sure these things that happen are meaningful
don't give up!, there are more difficult programs then tNice tutorials one
32:32 nicotine actually increases your ability to focus. It's not just a placebo. Some people actually use nicotine chewing gum when they study. I've tried it myself but I only got headaches. It also messes up your ability to be attentive when you're not smoking. So I wouldn't suggest that. But it's interesting.
Thanks
Thank you so much Ramon! Happy to see you find value in this conversation. We appreciate you supporting this channel.
Don’t write on a laptop. Write with a fountain pen on paper.
Don’t drink coffee.
Do have a ritual though.
♾
It doesn't happen until you are sitting on the chair.
Ouch.
Like when I think and thing and process all the practical stuff but seems like doing a homework and somehow everything just feel right but not alive. I don't K ow if it has a sense.
You have maybe the good beats, but you can feel (and people certainly will feel it too) that you are just writing and everything is monodimensional.
I will forever love writing and screenwriting for the magical side, but ironically it's also the most difficult side to light and grasp.
book title "Screenplay: Building Story Through Character" by Jule Selbo - from part "11 Step Story Structure Made Easy".
27:14 - What about the idea that it's selfish to set time for yourself for something like writing?
It’s OK to be selfish. That’s something we all deserve. - Kyoko Honda
Being selfish sometimes-it’s no big deal. I wouldn’t like it if somebody was selfish every single day, but that isn’t the way you are. You can be selfish every once in a while. I figure you deserve that much at least. - Kyo Sohma
Oh my god
Importantly: We need to repair the damaged Psyche that makes people yearn to watch horrific horror movies. There's something imparted deep in the psyche where people have an addiction to intense morbidity. A major reason why there is such fervor for Darkness is that we have never been taught any form of Light. The future version of Hollywood is going to produce positive films that completely shift the entire psyche of Humans. We will look back on this era of Humanity as being a very disturbed, disoriented, malnourished and quaint time period.
The mystery of writing is sitting and writing
I found it interesting when she said that one writer's politics made her a bad person despite her skill lmao. Very revealing little moment
No joke. Notice how 16 Candles is "very problematic" now ha ha . Notice also that she says that a young mother whose "job" is to raise a family should prioritise writing, whilst other peoples money pays for her and her kids, and pretends that here real "job" is being a writer and thats the most important narcissistic thing at that stage of her life... All whilst her kids are utterly dependent on her and other people are working THEIR jobs to free her up to be with her loved ones. Truly a narcissistic cult member. And everyone whose product she pushes and most writers she references are all from her same ethnicity whilst because genuine strong female lesbian writer Highsmith had a dislike of her ethnic group and their influence, she says that Highsmith alone, not anyone else, was a "terrible person".. :) :) Totally unable to find the theme of Talented Mr Ripley as well ha ha ha
Yes people can be crappy people but still have talent.
Im suprised she never worries about people stealing her stuff when she shares it in hollywood
k but how can i do it in