Glad that you mentioned Helios as a viable support as well. I'm currently working on a twins team as my second team using (in order of their position): Markus, Krista, Lars, Dorian, Helios - insane damage output and quite good survivability with the two healers. Dorians vampiric aura works very well when he's being positioned between Lars and Helios, who both deal much damage.
Your byline is a little misleading, I think you need to talk about what Lars and Krista do and timing and how to make them do different things with different team builds.
One thing I found building the twins is that Nebula doesn't have that much synergy with them (talking about arena, manual could be argued here, to some point). Also you can't put Lars in the back, there's so many ways to attack him if he's in the 5th position. So for me, the best (or at least the most consistent) twins team out there is Martha-Lars-Jorgen-Krista-Astaroth. Just my opinion :). Great video Charles. Keep up the good work.
I have a good team line up i have is martha,faceless,lars,krista,astaroth or martha,lars,nebula,krista,astaroth so martha heal astaroth is the tank and revives when lars dies lars and krista is the main damage and faceless if face less copies lars ult is a double damage and it deals more damage its a good counter for teams who has some tanky hero or some great healing abilitty i dont recommend using this lineup for bosses or squishy team and its also great for high chapters in the adventure mode and the tower and arena/grand arena and nebula can heal and support lars and krista at the same time hope this help for the other twins user and the pet should be oliver or biscuit biscuit is like an anti heal with his skill and his passive is throwing snowball at the enemy and oliver heals astaroth so astaroth could last abit more longer in the battle feild
I just pulled cleaver, so I haven't tested it out yet, but one of my thoughts previous to pulling him was the twins, cleaver and peppy, and either celeste or Jorgen. Cleavers main ability moves people across the ice field adding counters, and gets them all in the same area for lars spin/tornado ability
Nebula with Twins is Good. However the problem is the sync timing during the first 30s or minute is a bit off. Lars never seems to get her buff when unleashing his first chain lightnings or blue skills. It takes a little bit before they start syncing up the abilities.
I realized that Dark Star is really nice when facing twins. She will keep on stunning Lars and slow down Krista. You should try something like Dorian / Dark Star / Nebula / Keira / Astaroth
@@mohamadchaaban4116 It's not the best combo in the game -but it is a solution especially because most of them you can get them in the shop. Maybe instead of Dorian you can use other healer. I have been using this quite successfully, but on mobile - not facebook version so i cannot be sure of the outcome on facebook. But for sure an interesting team !
9:03 Sebastian is the best hero in the game, and it's not particularly close. He probably shouldn't be used in every attacking team, but he absolutely should be used in every defense team. If you don't have Sebastian in your line, it becomes really easy for the attacking team to bring in heroes like Jorgen, like Thea and just lock you out of the game with status effects. Sebastian hoses such a large numbers of heroes and strategies that it becomes that much harder for attacking teams to beat you if you have him on defense.
we have a player (in FB) in the guild with a strong twins team: Asta-twins-jorgen -martha+axell... 860K power. in guild war she looses against much weaker teams (625k power) like twins-jorgen.martha. sebastian. +axell what should she change.. but still having a tank would be good.. would this means removing jorgen or marhta...adding dorian for martha ? using other tank ??
What about judge for middle support versus nebula or any others......with kristas water mark that intensifies Lars electric attacks isn’t judges electric attack also intensified or whatever
Twins is a late game team unless you get them thru an event like this. No mention of pairing them with Orion? The artifact synergy would be beast with twins-orion-celeste-asta
I am still waiting to aquire Krista via the campaign. I got Lars early on in the hero chest? Was I lucky with this? Does he usually need to be ground...grinded....thing...stones..aquired via the campaign too?
I noticed that you did not mention Faceless as support. My twins team works nicely with him and Dorian as healer or Neb if I want to hit stronger. Do you think it's a bad idea?
I have the twins with Ziri, Orion, & Celeste. But the later two I was going to move to another team. Should I add Satori & Kai? Kai can drop enemies into Krista’s frost needles & Satori can attack more then one enemy and build up the magic penetration
I think it takes time for astrid to use rage on lucas(except if you're going for tower). Depending on enemy's nuke in the early phase, lars or healer could die first.
I really want to make a twins team for my second team. I considered playing with adding other heroes that maximize the “moving through the field” aspect. But idk how well those will do. We’ll just have to see.
1:23 When fully maxed out Astaroth only has 697K health which is the lowest in the game for any tank. He also has neither enough armor or enough magic defense to mitigate any damage from commonly used heroes and strategies; he's generally too squishy to use as a main tank in a maxed out metagame. He also brings no DPS, and has no way of dealing with Martha. . Conversely: Luther, Aurora, and Cleaver, have 811K, 813K, and 837K health respectively. All of them can deal with Martha, Luther jumps in front of her, Cleaver hooks her to him, and Aurora does lots of AE damage, especially with extra energy from Cain, that ensures she never keeps her teapot up. All of them bring a lot more DPS than Astaroth, and in the case of Aurora, she does the most DPS of any tank and actually does more DPS than a lot of the actual DPS characters, using her as your tank is like having another DPS on your team, especially in a twins team where she gets extra magic attack and magic penetration buffs. . Luther and Aurora also mitigate damage in ways that Astaroth can't. Luther has the second best armor in the game and is just 1 of three heroes in the game, the others being Ziri and Galahad, who doesn't take pure damage from a maxed out Keira when he himself is maxed out; same with Cain's nightshards, he actually has enough armor to mitigate some of that damage when patroned with Oliver. None of the tanks have even close to enough magic defense to mitigate magic damage, Chabba has the best magic defense at 26K, which is not really anywhere near enough, Luther can patron with Mara and take his magic defense to 30k, which is the highest magic defense you can get on any tank which is still insufficient when the magic attack team is going to be putting up 32K magic penetration buffs up. . Aurora is the only tank who mitigates magic damage, her Rainbow Halo skill gets her amazing mitigation versus magic and it doesn't matter how much magic penetration the enemy teams brings, because she doesn't mitigate that damage through magic defense. Aurora is also the only tank who has the dodge stat, this allows her to completely evade physical attacks, much like Rainbow Halo, dodge ensures that Aurora will always mitigate a portion of incoming physical damage regardless of how much armor penetration the enemy team brings. With Rainbow Halo and dodge, Aurora has the best overall mitigation of any tank in the game, and she backs that up with the 5th best health in the game, add in the fact that she brings the best DPS of any tank in the game, and she's the complete package, and there just isn't a better tank. . Astaroth just doesn't bring enough or survive well enough to want to bring him in a high level metagame, he does okay as an off tank in certain lineups, but I wouldn't recommend him as a main tank right now. He got robbed on his Lunar Skin, it should have been a health skin but instead they gave him a second magic attack skin which doesn't really do anything. Aurora and Luther have got lots of things to make them even better over the last 6 months and Astaroth hasn't got much of anything and is falling behind. He might be fine on mobile version, but on Facebook with maxed out pets and heroes, he's just not good enough anymore.
But I use astaroth not because of his tank(just partly). I use him because of his passive and ultimate. So if my backline dies first, he can revive. Which can make longer teamfights. But that is my opinion. Surely you have a good point.
@@WeNeedAPeaceWorld1 ArcticSlicer is right in many ways but also agree with Kai. And Asta at least doesn't trigger Aurora's team dodge immediately. Not using twins myself and since their new skins plus the Aurora/Cain dodge update it has been really difficult to beat them. Phys/Crit teams don't stand a chance and my mages sometimes break through but since being on a twins server to many different make-ups. So a request for Charlie, we all know how strong the twins are so maybe a video on how to beat them?
Have read in several different sites that talk about Kris always having more intelligence than Lars. Sounds easy enough but in practice it's rather complicated maintaining that ratio/aspect
I’m doing well so far ... but only if I could just spend a big chunk on certain teams I want to build and really get them strong enough to use against anybody it would be awesome to mix it up all the time or have that “”I can beat any team squads “”
I'd probably rock Astaroth, Nebula and Martha...or Jorgen in place of Nebula, since those heroes are ones I have and already put a bunch of resources into...
@@WeNeedAPeaceWorld1 I play on mobile...I ended up getter her during a spring event for her, Markus and skin stones about 2 months ago. Otherwise, I haven't really been able to get much in the way of soul stones for her either.
I like the idea of pulling Lars into 4th position. Also Krista as a tank is clever- leveled up Celeste is interesting in that sense to as the right combo could put her in 2nd position behind Krista. Don’t sleep on Celeste.
The good point of Twins Is that they are incredible flexible. So you can really change the team composition depending on your Opponent. Btw I use Twins as my second team (1st is Ishmael) and I love them with Astaroth-Jorgen-Martha. The really good thing Is that both Jorgen and Martha need very Little investment to work properly (unlike Nebula that need tons of resources) and this Is perfect for a 2nd team because I don't have many resources to drop on It. With this set-up I can often beat much more powerfull enemy and I still Need to find anyone Who could beat my Twins with a team of equal Power. Last good thing is that Jorgen Is very good vs K'arkh, that Is the Natural enemy of Twins.
I do not think it is a very good option to use Krista as a tank. If you do that, she spends half of the time in her Crystal which kind of slows her down and messes her synergy with Lars.
I'm around level 70 and with Celeste, Jorgen, Astaroth and Twins I sucks every fight. Most teams uses double healer and they easily destroy me, replacing jorgen with Markus its slightly better but still a pain. On auto fights they pretty sucks, which makes them a terrible choice. At least for early-mid game, expecially now that we have jasmine
Galahad + QingMao + Martha + Arachne + Celeses always win against Galahad + Twins + Astaroth + Martha after 10 tries. The outcome is the same. Team 1 only has QingMao died. Team 2 all died. (of course I tested with max level 130). I wondering if replacing Galahad by Jorgen, the outcome will be different ????
Charlie - How about some builds with Krista tanking (mobile)? Who would you sub in if you have Krista (tank)/Nebula or Jorgen/Lars/Martha? @ #herowarsmobile
Glad that you mentioned Helios as a viable support as well. I'm currently working on a twins team as my second team using (in order of their position): Markus, Krista, Lars, Dorian, Helios - insane damage output and quite good survivability with the two healers. Dorians vampiric aura works very well when he's being positioned between Lars and Helios, who both deal much damage.
liked how you discussed the pros and cons of each heroes in the lineup! gives us a more holistic view as to what to look out for
Your byline is a little misleading, I think you need to talk about what Lars and Krista do and timing and how to make them do different things with different team builds.
After getting Lars from Krista from the hero chest, I almost want to switch my main team to a twins team
Thank you for all your help, suggestions and putting these together for all of us. Very much appreciated :)
it's unortodox, but Andvari Yasmine twins can cause a lot of headache.
One thing I found building the twins is that Nebula doesn't have that much synergy with them (talking about arena, manual could be argued here, to some point). Also you can't put Lars in the back, there's so many ways to attack him if he's in the 5th position. So for me, the best (or at least the most consistent) twins team out there is Martha-Lars-Jorgen-Krista-Astaroth. Just my opinion :).
Great video Charles. Keep up the good work.
There was a twins event about a week after I started to play and I legit spent everything I had on it. So glad I did tho
What do you think with throwing the Judge in there with the twins? With the extra magic defense pentration?
I have a good team line up i have is martha,faceless,lars,krista,astaroth or martha,lars,nebula,krista,astaroth so martha heal astaroth is the tank and revives when lars dies lars and krista is the main damage and faceless if face less copies lars ult is a double damage and it deals more damage its a good counter for teams who has some tanky hero or some great healing abilitty i dont recommend using this lineup for bosses or squishy team and its also great for high chapters in the adventure mode and the tower and arena/grand arena and nebula can heal and support lars and krista at the same time hope this help for the other twins user and the pet should be oliver or biscuit biscuit is like an anti heal with his skill and his passive is throwing snowball at the enemy and oliver heals astaroth so astaroth could last abit more longer in the battle feild
I just pulled cleaver, so I haven't tested it out yet, but one of my thoughts previous to pulling him was the twins, cleaver and peppy, and either celeste or Jorgen. Cleavers main ability moves people across the ice field adding counters, and gets them all in the same area for lars spin/tornado ability
what twins team would you use for your 2nd team if your first team is your bob team (Astaroth, Karhk, Nebula, Faceless, Martha)
Nebula with Twins is Good. However the problem is the sync timing during the first 30s or minute is a bit off. Lars never seems to get her buff when unleashing his first chain lightnings or blue skills. It takes a little bit before they start syncing up the abilities.
Love the explanation of the though process in building the Twins team.
Just got the twins in back to back chests, gonna grind to make them part of my main team 💪🏼
For a team Twins -astharot-Celeste- and Jorgen wich pet could be the best? Axel or Oliver, or which can be even better?
What about faceless as support? The extra magic pen worth it?
So what's the best team to use to beat Lars and Krista?
I realized that Dark Star is really nice when facing twins. She will keep on stunning Lars and slow down Krista. You should try something like Dorian / Dark Star / Nebula / Keira / Astaroth
Do you think that this team can beat twin team?. Cz own all but darkstar... so you recommend upgrading her?
@@mohamadchaaban4116 It's not the best combo in the game -but it is a solution especially because most of them you can get them in the shop. Maybe instead of Dorian you can use other healer. I have been using this quite successfully, but on mobile - not facebook version so i cannot be sure of the outcome on facebook. But for sure an interesting team !
What do you think about twins, helios, orion with the last hero being either dorian, jorgan, or celeste?
9:03 Sebastian is the best hero in the game, and it's not particularly close. He probably shouldn't be used in every attacking team, but he absolutely should be used in every defense team. If you don't have Sebastian in your line, it becomes really easy for the attacking team to bring in heroes like Jorgen, like Thea and just lock you out of the game with status effects. Sebastian hoses such a large numbers of heroes and strategies that it becomes that much harder for attacking teams to beat you if you have him on defense.
we have a player (in FB) in the guild with a strong twins team: Asta-twins-jorgen -martha+axell... 860K power.
in guild war she looses against much weaker teams (625k power) like twins-jorgen.martha. sebastian. +axell
what should she change.. but still having a tank would be good.. would this means removing jorgen or marhta...adding dorian for martha ? using other tank ??
Doesnt Cleaver help their attacks putting the enemies close to one another?
Lars already does that with his ultimate, assuming same or lower lvl.
What about judge for middle support versus nebula or any others......with kristas water mark that intensifies Lars electric attacks isn’t judges electric attack also intensified or whatever
Twins is a late game team unless you get them thru an event like this. No mention of pairing them with Orion? The artifact synergy would be beast with twins-orion-celeste-asta
I am still waiting to aquire Krista via the campaign. I got Lars early on in the hero chest? Was I lucky with this? Does he usually need to be ground...grinded....thing...stones..aquired via the campaign too?
great video. twins are awesome and sooo flexible. crazy.
what i hate about HW mobile is you can see ranking, but cant see their combo setup :(
I noticed that you did not mention Faceless as support.
My twins team works nicely with him and Dorian as healer or Neb if I want to hit stronger.
Do you think it's a bad idea?
Thanks Charlie for all your help understanding this game!
The twins are great but what’s the next best team to pair with them besides who is in your meta twins team?
I have the twins with Ziri, Orion, & Celeste. But the later two I was going to move to another team. Should I add Satori & Kai? Kai can drop enemies into Krista’s frost needles & Satori can attack more then one enemy and build up the magic penetration
My twins are still infants. Mobile takes so many resources to level new heroes. Thanks for the video, Charlie!!
What are best new cyber skins or old skins
What do you think about putting Astrid & lucas in for tank support and armor buff? So Krista, Nebula, Lars, A&L, healer?
I think it takes time for astrid to use rage on lucas(except if you're going for tower). Depending on enemy's nuke in the early phase, lars or healer could die first.
Hey Charlie. What do you think of Judge. His violet ability is kind of a good support skill？
I really want to make a twins team for my second team. I considered playing with adding other heroes that maximize the “moving through the field” aspect. But idk how well those will do. We’ll just have to see.
And whats the opposite , how do you counter the twins
Any one tried elmir as twins tank, or opinions on using elmir?
Which server is your account and when did the server start ?
Are there any else twins?
Interesting, I think I will have to look into leveling up Nebula as well as the Twins.
1:23 When fully maxed out Astaroth only has 697K health which is the lowest in the game for any tank. He also has neither enough armor or enough magic defense to mitigate any damage from commonly used heroes and strategies; he's generally too squishy to use as a main tank in a maxed out metagame. He also brings no DPS, and has no way of dealing with Martha.
.
Conversely: Luther, Aurora, and Cleaver, have 811K, 813K, and 837K health respectively. All of them can deal with Martha, Luther jumps in front of her, Cleaver hooks her to him, and Aurora does lots of AE damage, especially with extra energy from Cain, that ensures she never keeps her teapot up. All of them bring a lot more DPS than Astaroth, and in the case of Aurora, she does the most DPS of any tank and actually does more DPS than a lot of the actual DPS characters, using her as your tank is like having another DPS on your team, especially in a twins team where she gets extra magic attack and magic penetration buffs.
.
Luther and Aurora also mitigate damage in ways that Astaroth can't. Luther has the second best armor in the game and is just 1 of three heroes in the game, the others being Ziri and Galahad, who doesn't take pure damage from a maxed out Keira when he himself is maxed out; same with Cain's nightshards, he actually has enough armor to mitigate some of that damage when patroned with Oliver. None of the tanks have even close to enough magic defense to mitigate magic damage, Chabba has the best magic defense at 26K, which is not really anywhere near enough, Luther can patron with Mara and take his magic defense to 30k, which is the highest magic defense you can get on any tank which is still insufficient when the magic attack team is going to be putting up 32K magic penetration buffs up.
.
Aurora is the only tank who mitigates magic damage, her Rainbow Halo skill gets her amazing mitigation versus magic and it doesn't matter how much magic penetration the enemy teams brings, because she doesn't mitigate that damage through magic defense. Aurora is also the only tank who has the dodge stat, this allows her to completely evade physical attacks, much like Rainbow Halo, dodge ensures that Aurora will always mitigate a portion of incoming physical damage regardless of how much armor penetration the enemy team brings. With Rainbow Halo and dodge, Aurora has the best overall mitigation of any tank in the game, and she backs that up with the 5th best health in the game, add in the fact that she brings the best DPS of any tank in the game, and she's the complete package, and there just isn't a better tank.
.
Astaroth just doesn't bring enough or survive well enough to want to bring him in a high level metagame, he does okay as an off tank in certain lineups, but I wouldn't recommend him as a main tank right now. He got robbed on his Lunar Skin, it should have been a health skin but instead they gave him a second magic attack skin which doesn't really do anything. Aurora and Luther have got lots of things to make them even better over the last 6 months and Astaroth hasn't got much of anything and is falling behind. He might be fine on mobile version, but on Facebook with maxed out pets and heroes, he's just not good enough anymore.
But I use astaroth not because of his tank(just partly). I use him because of his passive and ultimate. So if my backline dies first, he can revive. Which can make longer teamfights. But that is my opinion. Surely you have a good point.
@@WeNeedAPeaceWorld1 ArcticSlicer is right in many ways but also agree with Kai. And Asta at least doesn't trigger Aurora's team dodge immediately. Not using twins myself and since their new skins plus the Aurora/Cain dodge update it has been really difficult to beat them. Phys/Crit teams don't stand a chance and my mages sometimes break through but since being on a twins server to many different make-ups. So a request for Charlie, we all know how strong the twins are so maybe a video on how to beat them?
What about Maya as healer in Twins team?
I cant wait to start focusing on my 2nd team of the twins later this month
When I first started this game, I sold the twins soul stones away. Biggest mistake ever.
I like using twins have to explore more with the others still building them
I think Gala-Twins-Neb-Dorian would be a really fun team, but Dorian goes into my Keira team when I get him for sure
Have read in several different sites that talk about Kris always having more intelligence than Lars. Sounds easy enough but in practice it's rather complicated maintaining that ratio/aspect
I’m doing well so far ... but only if I could just spend a big chunk on certain teams I want to build and really get them strong enough to use against anybody it would be awesome to mix it up all the time or have that “”I can beat any team squads “”
I may try to get Ziri up to tank for Krista. It is about time to bump up a second team.
On mobile you cant check teams through the rankings list
How about a twins and Orion Dorian Helios. I don't really know about it. But was just checking..
Yeah, I was thinking about this combo as well, not sure how it actually performs though.
Good guide I personally use Celeste, Neb, Twins,Aurora
I started leveling up my krista to match my Lars in power, having a hard time figuring who else to use in this team comp.
you can try nebula
The twins' devil skins are so cool. Too bad it's double the skin certs needed. Fingers crossed I get lucky this week!
I'd probably rock Astaroth, Nebula and Martha...or Jorgen in place of Nebula, since those heroes are ones I have and already put a bunch of resources into...
Do you play on mobile? If so, how can I get Martha? Doesn't seem to have any chance of getting her soulstone. Not even the chest.
@@WeNeedAPeaceWorld1 I play on mobile...I ended up getter her during a spring event for her, Markus and skin stones about 2 months ago. Otherwise, I haven't really been able to get much in the way of soul stones for her either.
I like the idea of pulling Lars into 4th position. Also Krista as a tank is clever- leveled up Celeste is interesting in that sense to as the right combo could put her in 2nd position behind Krista. Don’t sleep on Celeste.
Andi tanking for Twins good?
Thinking about the Twins for my 2nd team, Sebastian with them I like the idea of.
Thanks. Looking forward to the event.
This info is appreciated! Have you ever tried using the Twins with Bob & Faceless on the same team??
You going to do rufus and Cornelius on the new server Charlie?
Pink pirates
I'm going to have to!
The good point of Twins Is that they are incredible flexible. So you can really change the team composition depending on your Opponent. Btw I use Twins as my second team (1st is Ishmael) and I love them with Astaroth-Jorgen-Martha. The really good thing Is that both Jorgen and Martha need very Little investment to work properly (unlike Nebula that need tons of resources) and this Is perfect for a 2nd team because I don't have many resources to drop on It. With this set-up I can often beat much more powerfull enemy and I still Need to find anyone Who could beat my Twins with a team of equal Power. Last good thing is that Jorgen Is very good vs K'arkh, that Is the Natural enemy of Twins.
idk why but i did a asta, twin, karkh and faceless and it reckted so many twin teams
I never put much into the twins on mobile but plan on building them into my web account, thanks.
I think I tried Auroa , Twins, Celeste, and Helious and that team kicked booty.
What did the lawyer name his daughter?
Sue.
Just started getting nebula. Woot woot. Going all out on the 4x+twins this week
I find Astaroth, Lars, Krista, Celeste, and Martha are a fairly good combination.
For fun try Lars, Krista, Orion, Helios, and Dorian.
Krista, Jorgen, Celeste, Lars, Martha
how many times can he say "you Know" :D
Been working on a twins team so some good info
i use twins + nebula, asta and martha, some times celeste or jorgen.
I do not think it is a very good option to use Krista as a tank. If you do that, she spends half of the time in her Crystal which kind of slows her down and messes her synergy with Lars.
What about martha + lars + jorgen + celeste + krista? No tank at all, but two healers should take Krista alive.
I'm having interesting luck w/ Luther, twins, Jorgen & Celeste.
Can hardly wait for the Twins event soon.
I'm around level 70 and with Celeste, Jorgen, Astaroth and Twins I sucks every fight. Most teams uses double healer and they easily destroy me, replacing jorgen with Markus its slightly better but still a pain. On auto fights they pretty sucks, which makes them a terrible choice. At least for early-mid game, expecially now that we have jasmine
I am using twins since August 2019 and I think they really shine very late
Thanks Charlie! Need to ramp up my twins!
Galahad + QingMao + Martha + Arachne + Celeses always win against Galahad + Twins + Astaroth + Martha after 10 tries. The outcome is the same. Team 1 only has QingMao died. Team 2 all died. (of course I tested with max level 130).
I wondering if replacing Galahad by Jorgen, the outcome will be different ????
It's possible? Give it a try!
Hoping to get them at the upcoming event
I like the Galahad as lead team to use with my Twins as a second team in Grand Arena
I added Heidi. S/He deals a lot of damage.
Charlie - How about some builds with Krista tanking (mobile)? Who would you sub in if you have Krista (tank)/Nebula or Jorgen/Lars/Martha? @ #herowarsmobile
Here's my take on Twins Team.
Lilith
Maya
Judge
Lars
Krista
Sebastian for mobile in a twins team definetly isn't good yes, I really like Astaroth, Krista, Celeste, Nebula, Lars for offense
Need them for my second team but I have them with low lvl
Good stuff man. Thanks
Twins rules! but kinda expensive dude
Maya seems like she would a good hero to go with the twins based on her skills. I also think Luther would be great.
lol I'm still trying to get their SS
The one that you like the most is the best
Very nice combos.
Lots of people are using andvari to tank twins
Lol yah andvari blocks clevar!
I certainly want to use twins for my 2nd team, event waiting room here
Thanks Charlie !
The Twins, Celeste, Luther, Astaroth
Andy is another option with twins
Will be maxxing this week