What do you think the Erdtree is? "The fallen leaves tell a story.." This is a re-edited version of a script written many months before the DLC, as the previous work was somewhat rushed to completion. We hope you enjoy it!
i wonder if miyazaki was talking about the original erdtree being cut down when he mentioned that there was a "big piece of the lore" that the community was still missing. maybe that was marikas sin? maybe radagons "golden order" was him reconstructing the illusiory erdtree we see in the lands between. also the original erdtree is much thinner and smaller than the illusiory one, similar to the tree in sote being choked out by the scadutree. the golden order is nothing more than a giant cover up, an illusion. i wonder what the lands between would look like without the golden orders influence? perhaps quite similar to the shadowlands, maybe even directly connected to them.
The erdtree is a literal splinter in perfected order, its whole purpose as the crucible or gate of divinity was to bring about a redistribution of life through sacrifice, from life death, and from death power, now it’s just a big tree that founts with life while never truly receiving any energy back, thus why it’s perceived as parasitic, it lacks half of its purpose now, it’s funny that it’s a tree because it acts like a tree tap
And also the vision that the prophets have, and that 2 of Marikas children have, it seems the flame of ambition is really just the ability to bring a new age, the ability to bring about change. At least symbolically, in lore it might be a literal vision LMAO
Hawkshaw might have the single best thematic and philosophical content about Elden ring. There are many talented creators, and they’re all amazing at what they do. Hawkshaw is without a doubt among the best of the best
The edited version is much better! I had a hard time making sense of your point and flow in the first one. This one is really good! I'm glad you took the time to go back and polish it up, it shows your dedication to your craft and makes for a much more engaging listen.
I think what changed my perspective on the theme of the game the most post DLC is Ansback's line when he falls in the final battle : "Righteous Tarnished. Become our new lord. A lord not for gods, but for men." So now my headcannon is that the "best ending" is whatever variation of the base ending you get. For in those you become a lord wiout a god. A lord that killed the previous god and left the land fractured, free to stumble and chose their own path liberated from the clutch of gods
Most of the endings pretty much are an Elden Lord without a God, never noticed that before. Ironic that the Frenzied Flame ending is the only one where you're still pledging to one of the Gods then... I wonder if that's intentional. The Nihilistic Route that players take is the only one where you're still allowing a God to rule.
In that case, Ranni's ending is the best, as you definitively kill Radagon and the elden beast, and explicitly leave for the stars to ward off outer gods. In all the other base endings, Marika is STILL your god, even being just a shell of herself...
@@gnawingfetus612 But you are there to rule, im curious how Ranni's ending imply the warding of outer gods influence ? The way I see it without the power of the elden ring wielded by an elden lord it would be open field for all kind of outer gods to do their shit
I mean, Ranni's ending's whole point is she wanted to take the concept of a known order, Gods, Lords, etc. and move them away from the earth so that people would be free of the shackles of faith, I feel like that's more fitting in a sense
I like his interpretations a lot, but, how condescending, snarky, and even just downright rude to his peers, fans of the series, and even his own fans, gives him a bit of a negative. He seems to look deeper into his research than most, but him mounting a high horse isn't needed.
My best guess is that it’s the ego. That’s why we have to destroy it to ascend to Elden Lord and beat the game. And also why aside from the lord of frenzy ending it never truly dies but simply assumes new forms. It also makes sense that it has a “shadow” counterpart.
The Golden Order no longer shines in Ranni's ending, it's taken away forever to remove it's power and influence over the land, hiding it away from outer gods. Lord of Frenzy flame is still a manipulation of an outer God, looking to turn everything back to a singularity. Basically, nothing truly dies in the lord of Frenzy ending, it just gets reformed back into what it once was before the golden order, before the dragons, before everything it once was. Whose to say it won't just one day go back to the golden order? A type of infinity where everything returns to a singularity? Frenzy flamed doesn't truly kill anything, it just turns back the clock.
Honestly should just stick to Souls like music. Kind of takes me out of it when I'm listening to Skyrim but trying to hear more about Elden Ring or Dark Souls.
Ok bro. Seamlessly blending patches core philosophy into the video. Pure art. He has been my favorite character for a reason. It’s sometimes disheartening when people almost intentionally disregard this. This is one of if not the core messages of these games. The greed of humans, always brings us to ruin. Such a heart warming message. Especially as the greed of men is literally bringing our current world to ruin….again.
The roots being physical, yet the trunk being illusory, whilst the "doorway" is again physical. The fallen leaves are physical gold, not glowing like the rest. Minor erdtrees that come up from the roots below are physical, but the leaves seem illusory. The tiny tree sprouts caused by golden seeds are golden illusions. It is really confusing with how inconsistent its existence seems. What makes it glow? What makes it see-through at a distance? I cast doubt on the tree being an illusion - wouldn't the falling leaves dissipate like other dying illusions? It contradicts itself against the established "rules" of other illusions and such..
A mass delusion doesn't go away easily. Look at Communism, for example. People know what it does, the most selfish & ignorant of us don't care about that reality. They want to bask in the solipsism of a mass delusion, for it to give them comfort, like a watered down religion. Much like junk food, it doesn't actually sustain anyone, but their urges don't tell them otherwise.
The golden branches are revealed to still be made out of brown wood after Maliketh's defeat, so the major Erdtree is just bioluminescent. Some of those branches even fall from the canopy, like the one with the Erdtree's Favor + 2 or the branches in the bay near Rykard's Divine Tower. The trees near the Golden Seeds are solid too. Only the Shaman Village tree is truly illusory, being transparent with no mass.
@@nightscout9979 That tree is rather unique. It moves when the player rubs up against it. You also cant walk right throught it. That's pretty real to me. The Incantation being right there seems less like a "this tree isn't real" and more like a "this tree was made by Merika"
@@gankspanker4204 IIRC, you actually can move through the Shaman Village incantation tree, but it does shift from the wind and contact with the Tarnished. It's still always transparent though, and is sourced from an incantation that isn't creating a true tree. That tree is unlike the literally solid, wood Erdtree in the Lands Between with branches that still exist even after being burned and broken off.
I platinumed elden ring and Im still playing it. Best game ever, and it wouldnt be the best without these lore videos. Who wouldve thought fans can make a game better.
I appreciate your hard work and I love listening to the videos and the effort you spend to make these amazing videos. Thank you! If you don't plan to. Could you make an Elden Ring timeline video? With all the information from the base game and DLC?
I love the alternative look at elden ring. Liek the colour theory vid, the boggaet video or this one. Honestly a look at elden ring's mushroom theory would be super cool too for a video
I am now fully convinced, that Elden Ring is WoW classic-cataclysm. With the player starting after cataclysm and only given broken information of the past. You start at the human start, walk past gatefront/goldshire to see stormveil/stormwind in a similar state as when Deathwing attacks and changes the world. The Erdtree is the Sunwell, invaded and infected by the prince of death. Leyndell is Lordran and undercity. The flame of the fell god is the remnants of the burning legion, Marika commanded a burning crusade. And in a world of death you fight the black dragonflight, that turned on it's dragon fellows. I'm still deciding if Godwyn and Marika are Arthas and Sylvanas
I like the aspect of the erdtree being a representation of society in a cheeky way Miyazaki makes us the players the rejects of society by being tarnished 🤣
I think Marika was Aizen. Got High Ranked in Soul Society, did research on existence, Saw the Spirit King, decided it was bullshit, then made subtle plans to weed it out from the world.
Always has been, she even told us directly. The Echoes of Marika at the Third Church of Marika and Church of Pilgrimage state: “My Lord, and thy warriors. I divest each of thee of thy grace. With thine eyes dimmed, ye will be driven from the Lands Between. Ye will wage war in a land afar, where ye will live, and die.” “Then, after thy death, I will give back what I once claimed. Return to the Lands Between, wage war, and brandish the Elden Ring. Grow strong in the face of death. Warriors of my lord: Lord Godfrey.”
Wonderful work. Some more thoughts: A strong theme that isn't tied into your view is the theme of who and what are allowed to be remembered. Remembrances are an essential part of the story. The Erdtree governs rebirth, and the golden order seems to have stamped out all other forms of burial rite. Their power is more than material, it is in the imagination of their people. By deciding what gets remembered and how, they shape through world. Look at Godfrey: we fight his remembrance. A noble lord, civilised and loyal. But his true form was beastial, a brutal warlord. The DLC seems to be a dumping ground for all the things the golden order wishes to be forgotten.
For some reason your videos never show up in my subscription feed. Which is a shame because this is one of my favorite channels, sometimes I miss videos for weeks
The erdtree fits the marxist concept of superstructure perfectly. It is the set of beliefs and institutions (church, state, academia) that holds society together and ensures its reproduction, for a time at least. Everything that grows builds up contradictions and eventually dies, which you illustrated perfectly with the dried wood analogy, which calls back to the working population of the lands between who cannot die but have nowhere to go, becoming social kindling eventually leading to unrest, just like capitalism creates wealth for a few but misery for the working class, creating the conditions for its own destruction. Elden ring (and souls games in general) are about historical materialism, about the cycles of growth and collapse of society, of revolution and counter-revolution, and how resisting change (gwyn, radagon) cannot prevent the inevitable, and actually makes everything worse. Like Gramsci said: the old world is dying, the new world struggles to be born. Now is the time of monsters.
I like your analysis except the part about capitalism making only a few people wealthy and making the working class miserable. Capitalism is the only reason we live fairly comfortable lives, it is fair to say only a few people get really wealthy but the entire world is factors richer then it were before the industrial revolution and that is thanks to capitalism. I mean what would you rather do. A: Work a field all day every day for food on the table and nothing else or B: Work 8 hours every week day and be able to buy whatever you like? Arguably the working class is better off then any other of the "lowest" classes in history like slaves, serfs, etc.
@@philiphellzen7319you didn’t disprove the fact that only a few benefit from capitalism. Capitalism benefits from slavery so no idea why you act like capitalism wasn’t a thing until after slavery was somewhat reduced.
@@philiphellzen7319 my guy, it's possible to acknowledge the flaws in a system that is buckling under the pressure of its failures AND the benefits that it has brought to our society. it has certainly improved the quality of our living, so far, but with the growing class divide, it's almost impossible to get work that can support a comfortable lifestyle without nepotism or manipulation. put simply, a system made to encourage every-man-for-himself competition and constant growth, as is what we have, encourages not an improvement to our quality of life, but to play it like a game, and that kinda makes the rich terrible at being human beings. i do not have an alternative, but don't act like this economic system isn't the source of a lot of current day problems, because it certainly is
No. The red Crucible and the golden Erdtree are the same tree. Its appearance and properties simply change based on the rules imposed by the god of the era through their manipulation of the Elden Ring.
@@XIII_Vanitas Its easier for some to believe loretuber BS than to actually use their own critical thinking. Anyone who still believes in great tree theory now will never be convinced.
@GonadsOfGodrey I mean it's not that hard to imagine it's still happening. The archtrees are present in game. The erdtree/crucible do supercede them. The grafting is probably the stretch too far. But like in souls the dragons exist before the age of fire and in this game they predate the crucible. Archtrees in souls have the dragon connection. Farum azula has no visible tree symbolism that I can see but it's also separated from the earth itself so who knows if they had an archtree motif in mind for it or not.
And there we have it, the best Elden Ring lore video yet and someone who finally understands the depth of this interconnected tale of history, evolution and nature.
i feel like if dragons are seen as the pinnacle of evolution, then humans under the erdtree were seen as the surpassing of it, hence why the crucible is seen as a curse and a deevolution
Well-presented video to be sure, but I don't think the argument of the parasitic nature of the Erdtree and its potential ties to some kind of standardized cosmic "seeding" is anything new at this point, I'm afraid to say, people have been speculating that from pretty early on once we saw the final boss arena with the many Erdtrees and its implications, so trying to come across as pioneering this theory isn't really fair or accurate at all (I don't think "world first" works when it comes to lore interpretations that are purposefully steeped in ambiguity and unsolvable, that's a bit ridiculous). I think the thematic emphasis on the representation of society through things like the Crucible or the Golden Order (and Orders in general) is far more interesting conceptually, but it's also nothing new. Again, the presentation of your videos is great, but they do tend to meander a lot without really saying much, it's less substantive than it purports to be at times, which has always been my problem with the content this channel creates, it's more about the flowery language and hot takes than it is about great analysis with notable depth, though I do see improvement on that front, at least.
Yeah this is just a recompiling/poetic retelling about everything we already knew, I liked it but kept waiting for the new information, of which there was none
My thoughts as well. The "world first" comment was really strange to hear as that's practically impossible to say two years after release. It felt really unnecessary, because I personally wouldn't and don't mind hearing the same information I've heard already. I can play the game, read the item descriptions, notice changes in architecture, and make my own conclusions, but a presenter can tie it all together in a way that makes it really special, which is why I love how Hawkshaw creates videos. They are more than just a guy reading a script with dictionary definitions; his videos are very pretty, and that's what has continually drawn me back ever since the Havel video was first uploaded. FROM games deserve that beauty. But today, even when there is a lot of depth, the substance of these videos feels drowned out by that flowery language. It's like icing on a cake: it looks beautiful, but if it's too sweet and if the cake is too airy, the icing will completely overwhelm it. That's how I feel watching some of Hawkshaw's newer videos.
Im not kidding , the skyrim music gave me a hadache seeing as my brain had to work on septating Elden Ring from Skyrim as you spoke. Please dont do that.
I used to fully subscribe whole worldtree that's been grafted upon thing but now I'm not so sure there ever was a physical crucible before the Erdtree and that given how the dlc presents the Crucible as more an abstract esoteric intangible energy a current of sorts so thanks to that I'm now not sure what to believe
I want to know where the Maidens that greet us come from.Our was killed by either Ranni Melina or Varre,but i want to know who sends them there to wait?Something literally controls grace,is it Marika or the greater will.That little gold light jumps into our hand by someone.
The DLC reveals that the Greater Will abandoned the Lands Between even before Marika became a god. The guidance of grace is either her doing or a spontaneous phenomenon.
Color out of the space. But in greater scale and with ton of carefully constructed deception. Let the Tree burn down to the roots, get rid of it. The Lands Between won't be any happier nor worse. It will be free again.
ok what is up with the hateful comments on this video? what is going on here? why are 5 year olds crying in the comments? this is a 40 minute lore video about a video game that YOU CLICKED ON, and you are gonna say its boring?? hawkshaw is an OG souls lore maniac, i doubt you elden ring only tourists could comprehend what hes talking about if you tried! the disrespect is unreal. this video is excellent hawkshaw im not understanding whatsup with the weirdo children whining in the comments.
Kids wouldn't play Elden Ring. At the end of the day, positive and negative critiques are just opinions; they can say it's boring, and you can say it's excellent-both are just opinions. Either way, all interactions in the comments are good for the algorithm. Also, grow up, dude. Do you really think a grown man needs you to defend him over some words? Google "parasocial" and reflect.
@@zetokaiba5867 next youll tell me kids dont play call of duty either 🤣 and while yes everyone has opinions, everyone also has the right to criticize those opinions and call them blindly hateful. i can go in circles with you all day bud. strawman arguments and logical bad faith fallacies dont work against me. nice try tho
@@scragglieThere's no 5-year-old playing Elden Ring. Obviously, you didn't reflect on yourself. I disagree; I wouldn't talk in circles with someone with broken grammar and a biblical faith toward someone who doesn't know you exist.
Hawkshaw I watched your video on Domhnall years ago and really enjoyed it. So many deep insights and connections I never would've made myself. This video and Midras are a testament to how much time, effort, thought and passion you put into your videos. I just want you to know you're deeply appreciated and no other channel i've seen reaches the level of depth yours does.
This has my brain thinking. Elden Ring is a powerful metaphor for the modern world while still being its own self-contained world with deep stories. Thank you for firing up my brain!
You are a wizard, Hawkshaw, that I am sure. You described it perfectly - the Erdtree is both Miyazaki's symbol of Faith and Society. The Erdtree is cosmic and beyond comprehensions. Calling it a parasite, mycelial or floral is a fallacy. I love the theory that it's a gigantic rune drop from an earlier God, but it is what it is. It is both illusory and solid gold.
It can be both. The Greater Will itself is mycelial in nature, and saying otherwise is a fallacy. The Erdtree, on the very top, is brown, and the gold fades out into curling gold vines/ feelers are that are either growing or receding. The Elden Beast itself appears to be based on the very same amoeboid that constitutes yellow slime mold.
you almost get it if society and faith in “order” are a parasite??? what does that mean? order according to whom? at what cost? an omen or a race that existed before the erdtree if they could knew the truth of its nature would absolutely see the erdtree as a parasite and be justified in the disdain this game does to fantasy “civilization” what bloodborne did for industrialized europe: undercuts it with cosmic horror
The Erdtree is just a metaphor for things growing, flourishing, and decaying.The Tarnished has the least "vision" of any FromSoft protagonist. We're completely blank slates without agency, doing fetch quests and acting as dogsbody for bland people who don't even care about the order of the world. It's probably the most boring and mind-numbing concept for a hero in all FS games so far. In Demon's Souls we're a brave adventurer choosing to enter the Fog and find out what has happened to Boletaria, maybe save it. In DS1 we at least wish to know the Fate of the Undead, because Oscar said it's basically all we can do now we've escaped the Asylum. To find out what will become of us all. In DS2 we want to find a way to not go hollow, to recover our memory, our very selves... then to become a True Monarch. In DS3 we're failures who tried to save the world once, and our Duty to try again is imposed eternally until we succeed. In Bloodborne we seek healing in Yharnam, then Paleblood, to escape the Dream. In Sekiro we wish only to serve our liege-master to the end. In Elden Ring... a disembodied voice tells us to become Lord. Then we spend the rest of the game fulfilling other peoples' visions in a world gone stale. There's no vision. We fight the Tree Sentinel because he just happens to be there, and hates Tarnished. I can't wait for FS to get over this GRRM era and make something new.
I really don't see how you can think that the Chosen undead following a fake prophecy means he has more "vision" than the Tarnished. Chosen undead has less "vision" than all other souls protags. You are going to link the flame because you have nothing else better to do and your life would be meaningless without this quest, at least the other undeads like Logan and Laurentius have dreams and personal quests of their own. You can eve find Kaathe and discover that the prophecy is fake, meaning your entire journey to link the fire is built on lies, lies told by people who just want to use you as the next useful idiot. In Demon's Souls your character can be a church warrior trying to save Boletaria, or you can be a mage like Yuria, someone who seeks power and cares nothing for Boletaria. You can even side with the Old one and finish your ascension into a Archdemon. Save Boletaria by remaining human or give up your humanity and ascend to demonhood, the choice is yours, you have agency of your own. Dark souls 2 has your character seeking the cure, and eventually you can at least halt your hollowing and leave it all behind in the Aldia ending, after learning that the linking of the fire is just providing life-support to an age of fire that should have ended thousands of years ago. The curse of undeath will never go away unless they can find a new path, linking the fire is not the answer. Dark souls 3 has your character turning his back on his "duty" and starting the age of hollows, finally shattering the curse the gods placed on mankind ages ago. You can also just let the flame fade and finally allow this diseased and rotting age of fire to end. Your choices define the ending. Bloodborne and Sekiro protags at least have the excuse that they are dying or need to defend their lord, so they have no choice but to follow what other people want. And even those two have more agency and vision than Chosen undead. Elden ring has your character siding with Ranni to destroy the old order, joining the Dung eater into cursing everyone, or melting the entire planet into ashes with the Flame of frenzy after deciding that this world no longer deserves to live. Chosen undead is the only souls protag that never got to do anything but be a useful idiot for others to sacrifice for their own ends.
We're never really given a reason to believe that the Erdtree was grafted onto a separate tree. "Greattree" is a mistranslation, as the Erdtree is only called the "golden tree" or "great tree" interchangeably in the Japanese text. The Finger Reader outside Leyndell even still calls the Erdtree the "great tree" in her dialogue. The Erdtree's branches are revealed to be made of brown wood after Maliketh's defeat too, and some even fall into Leyndell. Whenever the Erdtree looks transparent from a handful of spots in the game, if you use the Telescope at its highest zoom setting, the Erdtree will instantly become solid, implying that the transparency is a glitch. You can see something similar with windows reappearing on fortress walls. Even the trees with Golden Seeds are solid, have the audio of striking wood when attacked, and have brown bark fly off when hit. The only tree that seems to be a true illusion, lacking any mass and constantly being transparent, is the one at the Shaman Village. Marika seems to have given the Erdtree a new direction and a new name, but she didn't destroy a prior tree or graft something onto it. Even the statues of monks with blooming sprouts show that the central sprout's bloom is actually larger on the statue with multiple sprouts, thus depicting a later event. The Erdtrees in the Elden Beast's arena, seemingly representing Erdtrees across the universe, match the color of the modern Erdtree, but Hyetta reveals that the Greater Will created life in general, even in the Lands Between. Therefore, whatever Marika first did with gold, she probably wasn't grafting anything, but instead inheriting the next step of a blueprint provided by the Two Fingers, Metyr, and the Elden Beast. A lot of your symbolism in this video can still work, but parts of it sound founded on the idea that certain events in the game outright happened in certain ways. In the case of the Erdtree's nature, that doesn't line up. Also, regarding the "Flightless Bird" Painting, some data analyzers have looked into the painting list, and "Flightless Bird" and "Prophecy" are right next to each other. Since the former leads to Fire's Deadly Sin, referring to the prophecies the Prophet class sees, and the latter leads to the Warhawk summon that has had its wings injured, it's possible that the names accidentally got flipped in the final game.
I have seen a interesting thing after my 100th playthrough. Melina and connection to the Smouldering flame. Margit calls us out «.. smouldering with thy meagre flame» is he referencing Melina? Melina has clear connection to the Smouldering butterfly. You also has the Smouldering Church on the edge between Limgrave and Caelid, with a invader and holy scorpion talisman. Connection to Melina maybe? The same smouldering type of flame is used on the wall in Caelid to keep out the rot.
I think he refers to fire generaly as the opposite of Order, you can't contain fire, only let it grow or extinguish it, it's violent, ever-changing and of course, it is the thing that burns the Erdtree at the end of everything. The "flame of ambition" being an opposition between egoistic ambition and the notion of Order, and the survival of the Golden Order as Morgott cherish it.
The more lore videos the more it just looks like the dev team was just throwing stuff in without purpose lol, and we analyze it and give it purpose lol
I’ve long assumed that the erdtree isn’t as important as it might seem, or that it is an antenna for cosmic power. But I realize now that it’s actually broadcasting, not receiving if you catch my drift. The tree reflects the age in many of the endings, so maybe it’s a broadcasting point from which the “signal” of Marika emanates.
The zeroth dynasty was the age of Dragons. They had contact with the outer god of primordial raw power. They ruled for a time. Many peoples had kingdoms all over the Lands Between, never all unified, never all conquered. The Storm King, Raya Lucaria, Calid, Mountain top of the giants. The Shadow Lands were and are a part of the Lands Between. Merica vailed the Shadow Lands, separating it form the LB, no longer seen. This happened when she caused the third impact at the gate of divinity (see more info bellow). With that action she hid thousands of years of ancient history, almost completely lost. The first people to rise to power in the lands between were the dynasty of spirals, they created the spiral city (Enir Ilim). They worshipped the crucible which rose up as a Great spiraled tree. The spiraled people made the gate of divinity and caused the first impact, someone ascended to godhood by contacting an outer god, likely the god of spirals. They ruled for a time. Then the Knox people took over. They used the gate of divinity to cause the second impact. They contacted the outer god of Knox, this god had gravity defying power, someone ascended to godhood. The Knox added gravity defying architecture to the spiral city after taking it from the spiral dynasty. They kept the Great Sprial tree. The Knox dynasty (2nd) spread across the Lands Between establishing the cities of Knoxstella, Knoxron, and the Namless city. The horn sent were guided by the outer god of the crucible which now gave beast powers like horns and wings. The horn sent took over the spiraled city from the Knox. They took over the Sprialed Great tree. They started to get the gate of divinity ready to welcome the outer god of the crucible and (disordered) beast powers. But Merica, a slave, betrayed their hopes. As a slave Merica never had loyalty to the horn sent so this betrayal was one sided, for her it was just revenge. She also had Mesmer during a relationship with a serpent beast crucible being. Merica destroyed the horn sent's plans and did the exact opposite. She welcomed the outer god of order (the Greater Will) as opposed to the disordered horny crucible outer god. Merica took over, she sacrificed the hornsent at the gate of divinity, she caused the third impact by contacting the outer god of the Greater Will of Golden Order, and ascended to godhood. She did not conquer the spiraled city from the horn sent, no she wanted to destroy all previous history, all previous dynasties erased, she was going to start over, new and fresh, with the Greater Will. She would restructure the Lands Between and fully conquer it in the third Dyansty. Then Merica with the Greater Will, cut the roots of the great spiral crucible tree, stole the roots and grafted them onto the new Erdtree, stole the crucible current power of this world, feeding the Erdtree and gaining ultimate power over the Lands Between, the Scaduetree (aka sprial tree) has been dieing eversince. She also destroyed destined death which was a designed part of the old crucible sprial great tree. In her conquest she vailed the ancient lands now called the shadow lands. True destined death still exists in the Shadow Lands. She established the Third Dyansty. She banished the Knox into the ground similar to the Shadow Lands. Merica's Golden order ruled for a time, until we, the tarnished are called to determine the fourth dynasty. We can also help Miquella start the fourth impact to welcome in his godhood and the dyansty (4th) of compassion. These notes are rough, some things are wrong, but this is the big picture (ancient history) I see.
Reading some of these comments.. I despair that many minds have become lumpen and bereft of art and grace. Truly some here are "those who live in death"
I appreciate this whole interpretation of the Erdtree as representing both life and society - a lot of readings of these games are overly literal even when they factor in the real-world inspirations, and you guys are better at this than most even when you’re reading a lot into things. I still don’t think we have evidence for a separate “great tree”, though. Not only are the references in the base game clearly just allusions to the same Erdtree, but the DLC doesn’t indicate a previous tree at all, even when we’re getting information about the world before Marika. I also don’t think we have enough information to suggest there are other worlds where this is taking place, and especially not the kind of inferences you vaguely put in near the end. The Greater Will and its servants aren’t a conquering empire, they’re a divine creator embodying Order that tries to give guidance to its creations. Unfortunately, with such a distant and impersonal creator in charge, it’s easy for that guidance to be lost, and the tools it provides to be left in the hands of fallible humans. The Metyr story in the DLC indicates that’s precisely what happened to the Elden Ring.
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What do you think the Erdtree is?
"The fallen leaves tell a story.."
This is a re-edited version of a script written many months before the DLC, as the previous work was somewhat rushed to completion. We hope you enjoy it!
I thought I was going crazy like "I think I've heard them say some fo these lines before"
great stuff as always man. keep it up
i wonder if miyazaki was talking about the original erdtree being cut down when he mentioned that there was a "big piece of the lore" that the community was still missing. maybe that was marikas sin? maybe radagons "golden order" was him reconstructing the illusiory erdtree we see in the lands between. also the original erdtree is much thinner and smaller than the illusiory one, similar to the tree in sote being choked out by the scadutree. the golden order is nothing more than a giant cover up, an illusion. i wonder what the lands between would look like without the golden orders influence? perhaps quite similar to the shadowlands, maybe even directly connected to them.
Was wondering why I heard this before lol :P
The erdtree is a literal splinter in perfected order, its whole purpose as the crucible or gate of divinity was to bring about a redistribution of life through sacrifice, from life death, and from death power, now it’s just a big tree that founts with life while never truly receiving any energy back, thus why it’s perceived as parasitic, it lacks half of its purpose now, it’s funny that it’s a tree because it acts like a tree tap
Just realized that this “Vision” that the Tarnished has is what Morgott sees as the “Flame” of Ambition.
doesn’t he say that in his dialogue?
And also the vision that the prophets have, and that 2 of Marikas children have, it seems the flame of ambition is really just the ability to bring a new age, the ability to bring about change. At least symbolically, in lore it might be a literal vision LMAO
Hawkshaw might have the single best thematic and philosophical content about Elden ring. There are many talented creators, and they’re all amazing at what they do. Hawkshaw is without a doubt among the best of the best
Smoughtown is amazing at pure lore timeline work, but hawkshaw has a special something with his deep analyses
The edited version is much better! I had a hard time making sense of your point and flow in the first one. This one is really good! I'm glad you took the time to go back and polish it up, it shows your dedication to your craft and makes for a much more engaging listen.
I think what changed my perspective on the theme of the game the most post DLC is Ansback's line when he falls in the final battle : "Righteous Tarnished. Become our new lord. A lord not for gods, but for men."
So now my headcannon is that the "best ending" is whatever variation of the base ending you get. For in those you become a lord wiout a god. A lord that killed the previous god and left the land fractured, free to stumble and chose their own path liberated from the clutch of gods
Most of the endings pretty much are an Elden Lord without a God, never noticed that before. Ironic that the Frenzied Flame ending is the only one where you're still pledging to one of the Gods then...
I wonder if that's intentional. The Nihilistic Route that players take is the only one where you're still allowing a God to rule.
In that case, Ranni's ending is the best, as you definitively kill Radagon and the elden beast, and explicitly leave for the stars to ward off outer gods. In all the other base endings, Marika is STILL your god, even being just a shell of herself...
A-fuggin-men
@@gnawingfetus612 But you are there to rule, im curious how Ranni's ending imply the warding of outer gods influence ? The way I see it without the power of the elden ring wielded by an elden lord it would be open field for all kind of outer gods to do their shit
I mean, Ranni's ending's whole point is she wanted to take the concept of a known order, Gods, Lords, etc. and move them away from the earth so that people would be free of the shackles of faith, I feel like that's more fitting in a sense
38:20 Out of all the things I expected to hear in this video, "The greater will is running an interdimensional Ponzi scheme" was not one of them!
og fromsoft fans know hawkshaw is the goat. thank you for this wonderful video.
his DS1 lore videos are still the best Souls Lore content on youtube
@@joesaiditstrue fax
Factual
I like his interpretations a lot, but, how condescending, snarky, and even just downright rude to his peers, fans of the series, and even his own fans, gives him a bit of a negative.
He seems to look deeper into his research than most, but him mounting a high horse isn't needed.
*_"TO OUR HOME!!!! BATHED IN LORE OF GOLDDDDDDDDD!!!!"_*
Why do I hear gold member from Austin powers while reading this 😂
@@daydr3amer120 lol thanks, now i have that stuck in my mind.
@@daydr3amer120shave me from myshelf
why did i picture the chopper meme here
My best guess is that it’s the ego. That’s why we have to destroy it to ascend to Elden Lord and beat the game. And also why aside from the lord of frenzy ending it never truly dies but simply assumes new forms. It also makes sense that it has a “shadow” counterpart.
The Golden Order no longer shines in Ranni's ending, it's taken away forever to remove it's power and influence over the land, hiding it away from outer gods.
Lord of Frenzy flame is still a manipulation of an outer God, looking to turn everything back to a singularity. Basically, nothing truly dies in the lord of Frenzy ending, it just gets reformed back into what it once was before the golden order, before the dragons, before everything it once was. Whose to say it won't just one day go back to the golden order? A type of infinity where everything returns to a singularity?
Frenzy flamed doesn't truly kill anything, it just turns back the clock.
The Skyrim music in the background just does something to me man
Gay
your mom
Honestly should just stick to Souls like music.
Kind of takes me out of it when I'm listening to Skyrim but trying to hear more about Elden Ring or Dark Souls.
Ok bro. Seamlessly blending patches core philosophy into the video. Pure art. He has been my favorite character for a reason. It’s sometimes disheartening when people almost intentionally disregard this. This is one of if not the core messages of these games. The greed of humans, always brings us to ruin. Such a heart warming message. Especially as the greed of men is literally bringing our current world to ruin….again.
Best Elden Ring lore video I’ve ever seen.
The roots being physical, yet the trunk being illusory, whilst the "doorway" is again physical. The fallen leaves are physical gold, not glowing like the rest. Minor erdtrees that come up from the roots below are physical, but the leaves seem illusory. The tiny tree sprouts caused by golden seeds are golden illusions. It is really confusing with how inconsistent its existence seems. What makes it glow? What makes it see-through at a distance? I cast doubt on the tree being an illusion - wouldn't the falling leaves dissipate like other dying illusions? It contradicts itself against the established "rules" of other illusions and such..
A mass delusion doesn't go away easily. Look at Communism, for example. People know what it does, the most selfish & ignorant of us don't care about that reality. They want to bask in the solipsism of a mass delusion, for it to give them comfort, like a watered down religion. Much like junk food, it doesn't actually sustain anyone, but their urges don't tell them otherwise.
Ziostorm has released an inreresting video a few days ago that may answer your questions. It's about mushrooms.
The golden branches are revealed to still be made out of brown wood after Maliketh's defeat, so the major Erdtree is just bioluminescent. Some of those branches even fall from the canopy, like the one with the Erdtree's Favor + 2 or the branches in the bay near Rykard's Divine Tower. The trees near the Golden Seeds are solid too. Only the Shaman Village tree is truly illusory, being transparent with no mass.
@@nightscout9979 That tree is rather unique. It moves when the player rubs up against it. You also cant walk right throught it. That's pretty real to me. The Incantation being right there seems less like a "this tree isn't real" and more like a "this tree was made by Merika"
@@gankspanker4204 IIRC, you actually can move through the Shaman Village incantation tree, but it does shift from the wind and contact with the Tarnished. It's still always transparent though, and is sourced from an incantation that isn't creating a true tree. That tree is unlike the literally solid, wood Erdtree in the Lands Between with branches that still exist even after being burned and broken off.
I platinumed elden ring and Im still playing it. Best game ever, and it wouldnt be the best without these lore videos. Who wouldve thought fans can make a game better.
I appreciate your hard work and I love listening to the videos and the effort you spend to make these amazing videos. Thank you!
If you don't plan to. Could you make an Elden Ring timeline video? With all the information from the base game and DLC?
I'm hoping I'll be able to update the complete timeline video we released with the new DLC lore at some point!
@@Hawkshaw No rush, I'll always and diligently watch all your content in support.
The skyrim music was 👌 perfect
Damn you were 53mins earlier then me.
I should have read the comments before adding a new
I was just about to type this in the comments
He used Witcher music as well
Skyrim or Oblivion music elevates every video closer to absolute peak.
@@TinyAnnieLeonhart
Nah
Can we all agree that the music of skyrim (spliced into this video) is fecking timeless and epic. ❤
You did a fantastic job with this. The Consort killed me again and again because I was distracted by the quality of this video. I swear it.
I love the alternative look at elden ring. Liek the colour theory vid, the boggaet video or this one. Honestly a look at elden ring's mushroom theory would be super cool too for a video
I am now fully convinced, that Elden Ring is WoW classic-cataclysm. With the player starting after cataclysm and only given broken information of the past. You start at the human start, walk past gatefront/goldshire to see stormveil/stormwind in a similar state as when Deathwing attacks and changes the world. The Erdtree is the Sunwell, invaded and infected by the prince of death. Leyndell is Lordran and undercity. The flame of the fell god is the remnants of the burning legion, Marika commanded a burning crusade. And in a world of death you fight the black dragonflight, that turned on it's dragon fellows. I'm still deciding if Godwyn and Marika are Arthas and Sylvanas
I like the aspect of the erdtree being a representation of society
in a cheeky way Miyazaki makes us the players the rejects of society by being tarnished 🤣
The top of the erdtree is still brown, with the gold overtaking it only on the surface.
I think Marika was Aizen. Got High Ranked in Soul Society, did research on existence, Saw the Spirit King, decided it was bullshit, then made subtle plans to weed it out from the world.
Exactly...
How long...
Have you been under the illusion that I wasn't using Kyoka soigetsu?
based
@@bereft0fdev278rip Hinomori
Always has been, she even told us directly. The Echoes of Marika at the Third Church of Marika and Church of Pilgrimage state:
“My Lord, and thy warriors. I divest each of thee of thy grace. With thine eyes dimmed, ye will be driven from the Lands Between. Ye will wage war in a land afar, where ye will live, and die.”
“Then, after thy death, I will give back what I once claimed. Return to the Lands Between, wage war, and brandish the Elden Ring. Grow strong in the face of death. Warriors of my lord: Lord Godfrey.”
Except you don't do that in the normal endings, so...
Wonderful work.
Some more thoughts:
A strong theme that isn't tied into your view is the theme of who and what are allowed to be remembered.
Remembrances are an essential part of the story. The Erdtree governs rebirth, and the golden order seems to have stamped out all other forms of burial rite.
Their power is more than material, it is in the imagination of their people. By deciding what gets remembered and how, they shape through world.
Look at Godfrey: we fight his remembrance. A noble lord, civilised and loyal.
But his true form was beastial, a brutal warlord.
The DLC seems to be a dumping ground for all the things the golden order wishes to be forgotten.
For some reason your videos never show up in my subscription feed. Which is a shame because this is one of my favorite channels, sometimes I miss videos for weeks
Maybe unsubcribe and resubscribe or unclick and then reclick the bell or both?
@@nbmoleminer5051 I’ll try that, thanks
Wow…this was quite moving. Thank you.
Love that Skyrim music at the start.
“HONEYED RAYS OF GOLD, DELIVER MY SPIRIT” 🗣️🗣️🗣️
The erdtree fits the marxist concept of superstructure perfectly. It is the set of beliefs and institutions (church, state, academia) that holds society together and ensures its reproduction, for a time at least. Everything that grows builds up contradictions and eventually dies, which you illustrated perfectly with the dried wood analogy, which calls back to the working population of the lands between who cannot die but have nowhere to go, becoming social kindling eventually leading to unrest, just like capitalism creates wealth for a few but misery for the working class, creating the conditions for its own destruction. Elden ring (and souls games in general) are about historical materialism, about the cycles of growth and collapse of society, of revolution and counter-revolution, and how resisting change (gwyn, radagon) cannot prevent the inevitable, and actually makes everything worse. Like Gramsci said: the old world is dying, the new world struggles to be born. Now is the time of monsters.
Oh my God you're right 💀
I like your analysis except the part about capitalism making only a few people wealthy and making the working class miserable. Capitalism is the only reason we live fairly comfortable lives, it is fair to say only a few people get really wealthy but the entire world is factors richer then it were before the industrial revolution and that is thanks to capitalism. I mean what would you rather do. A: Work a field all day every day for food on the table and nothing else or B: Work 8 hours every week day and be able to buy whatever you like? Arguably the working class is better off then any other of the "lowest" classes in history like slaves, serfs, etc.
@@philiphellzen7319you didn’t disprove the fact that only a few benefit from capitalism.
Capitalism benefits from slavery so no idea why you act like capitalism wasn’t a thing until after slavery was somewhat reduced.
@@philiphellzen7319 my guy, it's possible to acknowledge the flaws in a system that is buckling under the pressure of its failures AND the benefits that it has brought to our society. it has certainly improved the quality of our living, so far, but with the growing class divide, it's almost impossible to get work that can support a comfortable lifestyle without nepotism or manipulation. put simply, a system made to encourage every-man-for-himself competition and constant growth, as is what we have, encourages not an improvement to our quality of life, but to play it like a game, and that kinda makes the rich terrible at being human beings. i do not have an alternative, but don't act like this economic system isn't the source of a lot of current day problems, because it certainly is
@@philiphellzen7319 there aren't two options, there are so many more, know that the better of the two isn't necessarily good, it really isn't.
the amount of video clips recorded to make this 40min long video while matching the script is insane!
I don’t know why but I always get so distracted by the Skyrim soundtrack
This video was like a long poem. It was very lovely, and I think captured the spirit of the story Elden Ring is trying to tell.
So tarnished archeologist was, right there was a great tree on which the erdtree was grafted.
of course
No. The red Crucible and the golden Erdtree are the same tree. Its appearance and properties simply change based on the rules imposed by the god of the era through their manipulation of the Elden Ring.
@@XIII_Vanitas Its easier for some to believe loretuber BS than to actually use their own critical thinking. Anyone who still believes in great tree theory now will never be convinced.
@GonadsOfGodrey I mean it's not that hard to imagine it's still happening. The archtrees are present in game. The erdtree/crucible do supercede them. The grafting is probably the stretch too far. But like in souls the dragons exist before the age of fire and in this game they predate the crucible. Archtrees in souls have the dragon connection. Farum azula has no visible tree symbolism that I can see but it's also separated from the earth itself so who knows if they had an archtree motif in mind for it or not.
Me when a single finger reader crone disproves the entire great tree theory 😮
And there we have it, the best Elden Ring lore video yet and someone who finally understands the depth of this interconnected tale of history, evolution and nature.
i feel like if dragons are seen as the pinnacle of evolution, then humans under the erdtree were seen as the surpassing of it, hence why the crucible is seen as a curse and a deevolution
The fact that we don't get a Draconic age is infuriating
Loved this video, unique and deep.
All this really cool poetry and I’m sitting here “wait that’s Skyrim’s music” 😂
Well-presented video to be sure, but I don't think the argument of the parasitic nature of the Erdtree and its potential ties to some kind of standardized cosmic "seeding" is anything new at this point, I'm afraid to say, people have been speculating that from pretty early on once we saw the final boss arena with the many Erdtrees and its implications, so trying to come across as pioneering this theory isn't really fair or accurate at all (I don't think "world first" works when it comes to lore interpretations that are purposefully steeped in ambiguity and unsolvable, that's a bit ridiculous).
I think the thematic emphasis on the representation of society through things like the Crucible or the Golden Order (and Orders in general) is far more interesting conceptually, but it's also nothing new. Again, the presentation of your videos is great, but they do tend to meander a lot without really saying much, it's less substantive than it purports to be at times, which has always been my problem with the content this channel creates, it's more about the flowery language and hot takes than it is about great analysis with notable depth, though I do see improvement on that front, at least.
Yeah this is just a recompiling/poetic retelling about everything we already knew, I liked it but kept waiting for the new information, of which there was none
My thoughts as well. The "world first" comment was really strange to hear as that's practically impossible to say two years after release. It felt really unnecessary, because I personally wouldn't and don't mind hearing the same information I've heard already. I can play the game, read the item descriptions, notice changes in architecture, and make my own conclusions, but a presenter can tie it all together in a way that makes it really special, which is why I love how Hawkshaw creates videos. They are more than just a guy reading a script with dictionary definitions; his videos are very pretty, and that's what has continually drawn me back ever since the Havel video was first uploaded. FROM games deserve that beauty. But today, even when there is a lot of depth, the substance of these videos feels drowned out by that flowery language. It's like icing on a cake: it looks beautiful, but if it's too sweet and if the cake is too airy, the icing will completely overwhelm it. That's how I feel watching some of Hawkshaw's newer videos.
2:16 i know Secunda when i hear it
Well done sir, very excellent video!
lol skyrim music in elden ring lore video is just perfect
Thy lore befits a crown.
I saw the erdtree on my first playthough and by the time I discovered deep root depth I had concluded that the erdtree was a parasite.
So the frenzied frame ending is like looking at society and being like “yeah let’s start over from unicellular life”
Im not kidding , the skyrim music gave me a hadache seeing as my brain had to work on septating Elden Ring from Skyrim as you spoke. Please dont do that.
The Erdtree serves as the Vascular Plant of the Lands Between.
Damn, that one went down like hot butter. I was paying full attention and yet, now that it's over, it feels like I just woke from a dream.
Thanks for putting so much effort into your content! Love it!
I used to fully subscribe whole worldtree that's been grafted upon thing but now I'm not so sure there ever was a physical crucible before the Erdtree and that given how the dlc presents the Crucible as more an abstract esoteric intangible energy a current of sorts so thanks to that I'm now not sure what to believe
You have such a way with words.
Is this a reupload or an update to a previous video?
I want to know where the Maidens that greet us come from.Our was killed by either Ranni Melina or Varre,but i want to know who sends them there to wait?Something literally controls grace,is it Marika or the greater will.That little gold light jumps into our hand by someone.
The DLC reveals that the Greater Will abandoned the Lands Between even before Marika became a god.
The guidance of grace is either her doing or a spontaneous phenomenon.
Is GoldMember a child of Marika?
Color out of the space. But in greater scale and with ton of carefully constructed deception. Let the Tree burn down to the roots, get rid of it. The Lands Between won't be any happier nor worse. It will be free again.
Because at the end of all this, WE ARE ALL GROOT
Thank you for the video, friend (and production team if you have one??)
Keep up the hard work :)
I love the Witcher 3 Nilfgaard music and then the Skyrim music. Love your stuff ♥️
One of the best lore channels out there, keep it up!
So we basically play Kill la Kill and the Life Fiber is replaced with the Earthtree.
ok what is up with the hateful comments on this video? what is going on here? why are 5 year olds crying in the comments? this is a 40 minute lore video about a video game that YOU CLICKED ON, and you are gonna say its boring?? hawkshaw is an OG souls lore maniac, i doubt you elden ring only tourists could comprehend what hes talking about if you tried! the disrespect is unreal. this video is excellent hawkshaw im not understanding whatsup with the weirdo children whining in the comments.
Kids wouldn't play Elden Ring. At the end of the day, positive and negative critiques are just opinions; they can say it's boring, and you can say it's excellent-both are just opinions.
Either way, all interactions in the comments are good for the algorithm. Also, grow up, dude. Do you really think a grown man needs you to defend him over some words? Google "parasocial" and reflect.
@@zetokaiba5867 next youll tell me kids dont play call of duty either 🤣 and while yes everyone has opinions, everyone also has the right to criticize those opinions and call them blindly hateful. i can go in circles with you all day bud. strawman arguments and logical bad faith fallacies dont work against me. nice try tho
@@scragglieThere's no 5-year-old playing Elden Ring. Obviously, you didn't reflect on yourself. I disagree; I wouldn't talk in circles with someone with broken grammar and a biblical faith toward someone who doesn't know you exist.
This was deeply soothing to listen to this morning. Hawkshaw never disappoints
Hawkshaw I watched your video on Domhnall years ago and really enjoyed it. So many deep insights and connections I never would've made myself. This video and Midras are a testament to how much time, effort, thought and passion you put into your videos. I just want you to know you're deeply appreciated and no other channel i've seen reaches the level of depth yours does.
This has my brain thinking.
Elden Ring is a powerful metaphor for the modern world while still being its own self-contained world with deep stories.
Thank you for firing up my brain!
You are a wizard, Hawkshaw, that I am sure.
You described it perfectly - the Erdtree is both Miyazaki's symbol of Faith and Society. The Erdtree is cosmic and beyond comprehensions. Calling it a parasite, mycelial or floral is a fallacy.
I love the theory that it's a gigantic rune drop from an earlier God, but it is what it is. It is both illusory and solid gold.
It can be both. The Greater Will itself is mycelial in nature, and saying otherwise is a fallacy. The Erdtree, on the very top, is brown, and the gold fades out into curling gold vines/ feelers are that are either growing or receding. The Elden Beast itself appears to be based on the very same amoeboid that constitutes yellow slime mold.
you almost get it
if society and faith in “order” are a parasite???
what does that mean?
order according to whom?
at what cost?
an omen or a race that existed before the erdtree if they could knew the truth of its nature would absolutely see the erdtree as a parasite and be justified in the disdain
this game does to fantasy “civilization” what bloodborne did for industrialized europe:
undercuts it with cosmic horror
more like birdtree
Hawkshaw and SmoughTown are the best lore creators in FS history
It sure ain’t Vaati
The Erdtree is just a metaphor for things growing, flourishing, and decaying.The Tarnished has the least "vision" of any FromSoft protagonist. We're completely blank slates without agency, doing fetch quests and acting as dogsbody for bland people who don't even care about the order of the world. It's probably the most boring and mind-numbing concept for a hero in all FS games so far.
In Demon's Souls we're a brave adventurer choosing to enter the Fog and find out what has happened to Boletaria, maybe save it.
In DS1 we at least wish to know the Fate of the Undead, because Oscar said it's basically all we can do now we've escaped the Asylum. To find out what will become of us all.
In DS2 we want to find a way to not go hollow, to recover our memory, our very selves... then to become a True Monarch.
In DS3 we're failures who tried to save the world once, and our Duty to try again is imposed eternally until we succeed.
In Bloodborne we seek healing in Yharnam, then Paleblood, to escape the Dream.
In Sekiro we wish only to serve our liege-master to the end.
In Elden Ring... a disembodied voice tells us to become Lord. Then we spend the rest of the game fulfilling other peoples' visions in a world gone stale. There's no vision. We fight the Tree Sentinel because he just happens to be there, and hates Tarnished.
I can't wait for FS to get over this GRRM era and make something new.
I really don't see how you can think that the Chosen undead following a fake prophecy means he has more "vision" than the Tarnished. Chosen undead has less "vision" than all other souls protags. You are going to link the flame because you have nothing else better to do and your life would be meaningless without this quest, at least the other undeads like Logan and Laurentius have dreams and personal quests of their own. You can eve find Kaathe and discover that the prophecy is fake, meaning your entire journey to link the fire is built on lies, lies told by people who just want to use you as the next useful idiot.
In Demon's Souls your character can be a church warrior trying to save Boletaria, or you can be a mage like Yuria, someone who seeks power and cares nothing for Boletaria. You can even side with the Old one and finish your ascension into a Archdemon. Save Boletaria by remaining human or give up your humanity and ascend to demonhood, the choice is yours, you have agency of your own.
Dark souls 2 has your character seeking the cure, and eventually you can at least halt your hollowing and leave it all behind in the Aldia ending, after learning that the linking of the fire is just providing life-support to an age of fire that should have ended thousands of years ago. The curse of undeath will never go away unless they can find a new path, linking the fire is not the answer.
Dark souls 3 has your character turning his back on his "duty" and starting the age of hollows, finally shattering the curse the gods placed on mankind ages ago. You can also just let the flame fade and finally allow this diseased and rotting age of fire to end. Your choices define the ending.
Bloodborne and Sekiro protags at least have the excuse that they are dying or need to defend their lord, so they have no choice but to follow what other people want. And even those two have more agency and vision than Chosen undead.
Elden ring has your character siding with Ranni to destroy the old order, joining the Dung eater into cursing everyone, or melting the entire planet into ashes with the Flame of frenzy after deciding that this world no longer deserves to live.
Chosen undead is the only souls protag that never got to do anything but be a useful idiot for others to sacrifice for their own ends.
That's a cool story. Maybe try tapping into your own imagination and sense of wonder and play the games again, you might enjoy them.
Reupload?
I thought I was going crazy thinking this lolll
So in allegory to life us citizens are the tarnished?
10/10 would fall asleep to this later
Hello Hawkshaw from sleepy time videos
We're never really given a reason to believe that the Erdtree was grafted onto a separate tree. "Greattree" is a mistranslation, as the Erdtree is only called the "golden tree" or "great tree" interchangeably in the Japanese text. The Finger Reader outside Leyndell even still calls the Erdtree the "great tree" in her dialogue. The Erdtree's branches are revealed to be made of brown wood after Maliketh's defeat too, and some even fall into Leyndell.
Whenever the Erdtree looks transparent from a handful of spots in the game, if you use the Telescope at its highest zoom setting, the Erdtree will instantly become solid, implying that the transparency is a glitch. You can see something similar with windows reappearing on fortress walls. Even the trees with Golden Seeds are solid, have the audio of striking wood when attacked, and have brown bark fly off when hit. The only tree that seems to be a true illusion, lacking any mass and constantly being transparent, is the one at the Shaman Village.
Marika seems to have given the Erdtree a new direction and a new name, but she didn't destroy a prior tree or graft something onto it. Even the statues of monks with blooming sprouts show that the central sprout's bloom is actually larger on the statue with multiple sprouts, thus depicting a later event. The Erdtrees in the Elden Beast's arena, seemingly representing Erdtrees across the universe, match the color of the modern Erdtree, but Hyetta reveals that the Greater Will created life in general, even in the Lands Between. Therefore, whatever Marika first did with gold, she probably wasn't grafting anything, but instead inheriting the next step of a blueprint provided by the Two Fingers, Metyr, and the Elden Beast.
A lot of your symbolism in this video can still work, but parts of it sound founded on the idea that certain events in the game outright happened in certain ways. In the case of the Erdtree's nature, that doesn't line up.
Also, regarding the "Flightless Bird" Painting, some data analyzers have looked into the painting list, and "Flightless Bird" and "Prophecy" are right next to each other. Since the former leads to Fire's Deadly Sin, referring to the prophecies the Prophet class sees, and the latter leads to the Warhawk summon that has had its wings injured, it's possible that the names accidentally got flipped in the final game.
Damn I got here early for once
I have seen a interesting thing after my 100th playthrough. Melina and connection to the Smouldering flame. Margit calls us out «.. smouldering with thy meagre flame» is he referencing Melina?
Melina has clear connection to the Smouldering butterfly.
You also has the Smouldering Church on the edge between Limgrave and Caelid, with a invader and holy scorpion talisman. Connection to Melina maybe? The same smouldering type of flame is used on the wall in Caelid to keep out the rot.
I think he refers to fire generaly as the opposite of Order, you can't contain fire, only let it grow or extinguish it, it's violent, ever-changing and of course, it is the thing that burns the Erdtree at the end of everything.
The "flame of ambition" being an opposition between egoistic ambition and the notion of Order, and the survival of the Golden Order as Morgott cherish it.
The more lore videos the more it just looks like the dev team was just throwing stuff in without purpose lol, and we analyze it and give it purpose lol
But is the Ashen Lake, llayndel and the bottom of the world with all those trees and ds 1 (forgot the name) 😅.
Color me intrigued. Love seeing these analysis
did you have to hide previous version of this video because you has to add sponsor ad? the previous one was 4 mins shorter
No, this is a new edit as we felt we could do better on that side of things! The partnered sponsor is only the first few seconds.
@@Hawkshaw oki thank you :)
Take a shot on the word life, I dare you!
What is the music played at 2:30 it sounds very familiar?
is this a reupload?
great narrative as usual, good work man
fire
Great work! It was very convincing
Great video as always
Please consider throwing some oblivion music in your vids lmk I know all the best songs
Shouldn't every Elden Lord have a god that can roam in spirit form!
Could it be that Bayl was pressudissax god who is now in shadow world !
It’s actually a tree
Absolute banger bro
This is dope!
I’ve long assumed that the erdtree isn’t as important as it might seem, or that it is an antenna for cosmic power.
But I realize now that it’s actually broadcasting, not receiving if you catch my drift.
The tree reflects the age in many of the endings, so maybe it’s a broadcasting point from which the “signal” of Marika emanates.
Always love your use of the Eastshade soundtrack.
Pretty sure I just dashed by the erdtree sentinels, bye lol
this a reupload or m I trtippin'?
🎉
Why no 'be as succinct and as brief as you can be' elden ring lore youtubers
The zeroth dynasty was the age of Dragons. They had contact with the outer god of primordial raw power. They ruled for a time.
Many peoples had kingdoms all over the Lands Between, never all unified, never all conquered. The Storm King, Raya Lucaria, Calid, Mountain top of the giants. The Shadow Lands were and are a part of the Lands Between. Merica vailed the Shadow Lands, separating it form the LB, no longer seen. This happened when she caused the third impact at the gate of divinity (see more info bellow). With that action she hid thousands of years of ancient history, almost completely lost.
The first people to rise to power in the lands between were the dynasty of spirals, they created the spiral city (Enir Ilim). They worshipped the crucible which rose up as a Great spiraled tree. The spiraled people made the gate of divinity and caused the first impact, someone ascended to godhood by contacting an outer god, likely the god of spirals. They ruled for a time.
Then the Knox people took over. They used the gate of divinity to cause the second impact. They contacted the outer god of Knox, this god had gravity defying power, someone ascended to godhood. The Knox added gravity defying architecture to the spiral city after taking it from the spiral dynasty. They kept the Great Sprial tree. The Knox dynasty (2nd) spread across the Lands Between establishing the cities of Knoxstella, Knoxron, and the Namless city.
The horn sent were guided by the outer god of the crucible which now gave beast powers like horns and wings. The horn sent took over the spiraled city from the Knox. They took over the Sprialed Great tree. They started to get the gate of divinity ready to welcome the outer god of the crucible and (disordered) beast powers.
But Merica, a slave, betrayed their hopes. As a slave Merica never had loyalty to the horn sent so this betrayal was one sided, for her it was just revenge. She also had Mesmer during a relationship with a serpent beast crucible being. Merica destroyed the horn sent's plans and did the exact opposite. She welcomed the outer god of order (the Greater Will) as opposed to the disordered horny crucible outer god.
Merica took over, she sacrificed the hornsent at the gate of divinity, she caused the third impact by contacting the outer god of the Greater Will of Golden Order, and ascended to godhood. She did not conquer the spiraled city from the horn sent, no she wanted to destroy all previous history, all previous dynasties erased, she was going to start over, new and fresh, with the Greater Will. She would restructure the Lands Between and fully conquer it in the third Dyansty.
Then Merica with the Greater Will, cut the roots of the great spiral crucible tree, stole the roots and grafted them onto the new Erdtree, stole the crucible current power of this world, feeding the Erdtree and gaining ultimate power over the Lands Between, the Scaduetree (aka sprial tree) has been dieing eversince. She also destroyed destined death which was a designed part of the old crucible sprial great tree.
In her conquest she vailed the ancient lands now called the shadow lands. True destined death still exists in the Shadow Lands. She established the Third Dyansty. She banished the Knox into the ground similar to the Shadow Lands. Merica's Golden order ruled for a time, until we, the tarnished are called to determine the fourth dynasty. We can also help Miquella start the fourth impact to welcome in his godhood and the dyansty (4th) of compassion.
These notes are rough, some things are wrong, but this is the big picture (ancient history) I see.
Where did you get this information from? Especially the part about Marika having Sexual relations with a serpent I've never seen that anywhere.
Reading some of these comments.. I despair that many minds have become lumpen and bereft of art and grace. Truly some here are "those who live in death"
@@beardfistthegoldenone7273 💀 so true
I'm still disappointed we haven't got a Crucible or Draconic themed ending
I appreciate this whole interpretation of the Erdtree as representing both life and society - a lot of readings of these games are overly literal even when they factor in the real-world inspirations, and you guys are better at this than most even when you’re reading a lot into things.
I still don’t think we have evidence for a separate “great tree”, though. Not only are the references in the base game clearly just allusions to the same Erdtree, but the DLC doesn’t indicate a previous tree at all, even when we’re getting information about the world before Marika.
I also don’t think we have enough information to suggest there are other worlds where this is taking place, and especially not the kind of inferences you vaguely put in near the end. The Greater Will and its servants aren’t a conquering empire, they’re a divine creator embodying Order that tries to give guidance to its creations. Unfortunately, with such a distant and impersonal creator in charge, it’s easy for that guidance to be lost, and the tools it provides to be left in the hands of fallible humans. The Metyr story in the DLC indicates that’s precisely what happened to the Elden Ring.