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Spiked growth definitely works with forced movement. That’s part of what thornwhip is for. The idea of forced movement not counting for damage effects seems to be based on misunderstandings about spells, forced movement, and opportunity attacks. The following is a list of spells that have the same wording for causing damage when moved into the spells area. A few of them are like spiked growth in that they do not have saving throws. Create bonfire Cloud of daggers Cordon of arrows Moonbeam Spiked growth Evards black tentacles Guardian of faith Sickening radiance Wall of fire Cloudkill Insect plague Blade barrier Forbiddance Investiture of flame Wall of ice Wall of thorns Whirlwind Dark star Incendiary cloud Ravenous void It can be strong, but it usually only strong if your table actually works together to force movement. Most ways that force movement cost resources in some way, either spell slots, ki points, or even potential damage from choosing to try a shove instead of attacking with a weapon. the exception of warlocks with invocations for movement effects being added to Eldritch blast should not be used to prevent other classes from working together.
there is a difference between movement and entering so no spike growth doesnt work with thornwhip. pulling/pushing through moonbeam would trigger dmg but not through spiked area
Moonbeam: "When a creature enters the spell's area for the first time on a turn or..." ; Spike Growth: "When a creature moves into or within the area..."
@@binolombardi yes pushing or pulling is a effective way to Enter a creature into an area. But Spike growth specifies movement as trigger for damage e.g. (walking, running..) with movement rules on difficult terrain. U can use thorn whip to pull creature into spiked area but damage occurs only when creature decides to move across spiked area squares. This is my understanding at least.
contris1 This is untrue. For an example of what a spell description looks like that supports the effect you’re describing, I’d take a look at the booming blade cantrip. “As part of the action used to cast this spell, you must make a melee attack with a weapon against one crea- ture within the spell's range, otherwise the spell fails. On a hit, the target suffers the attack's normal effects, and it becomes sheathed in booming energy until the start of your next turn. If the target willingly moves before then, it immediately takes 1d8 thunder damage, and the spell ends. This spell's damage increases when you reach higher levels. At 5th level, the melee attack deals an extra 1d8 thunder damage to the target, and the damage the target takes for moving increases to 2d8. Both damage rolls increase by 1d8 at 11th level and 17th level.” There are two important factors. 1. It specifies “willingly” moving. 2. There are more ways to move than there are creature speed types. Falling, teleportation, being pushed, or being carried are all ways you could potentially be moved. Spiked growth doesn’t care how you move through it’s affected space, it damages you regardless of your mode of travel.
I like to combine this spell with plant growth to almost completely deny movement while I pepper them with arrows and the barbarian unleashes his nigh infinite amount of javelins. It uses two slots but it’ll really mess up any attempts to flee from or ambush us
I'm about to play a nature cleric that has both spike growth and plant growth. We also have a warlock in the party that absolutely loves using sickening radiance. So the plan is when he casts sickening radiants to drop plant growth and make It super difficult to leave and the next turn drop spike growth on top of that so they take damage if they stay in there they take damage if they leave there and it's extremely difficult to leave.
Centaur Moon druid with rogue dip for bonus action dash. You take mobile feat and cast Longstrider before combat. When you have Spike Growth up, you grapple one creature and dash with it , dragging the creature through the AoE for some boom you are dead damage :)
Ow shit I've only realised just now, but imagine this: the enemy is a small creature, you have the mobile feat, cast longstrider before combat, during combat you cast Spike Growth and Wild Shape into a warhorse. When you grapple the enemy and on his turn he fails to ungrapple himself, you can use your whole turn to dash, which will produce the following movement: 60 ft. movement as a warhorse which is not halved since the creature is 2 sizes smaller than the large warhorse, times 2 because of dash action, +10 because of mobile, and +10 because of longstrider. This results in 140 feet of movement, which is 28d4 damage!! The average of this would be 70 damage
I instantly think about using this spell on a chest plate that someone is wearing. Have the thorns grow on the inside of the chest plate, and the bad guy gets impaled by its own armor. I was inspired by the Medeval torture device called the Iron Maden.
Spells like spike growth and snare, that say they are hidden and require a check to discover: do they automatically do the roll? If a player runs into a snare, do they automatically do the roll to try and find it, or does it use passive perception unless they are actively searching?
There's nothing stopping you from casting this right as someone enters the area you're going to cast in. The average low-level movement rate is about 30 and difficult terrain eats 15, so not only will they be slowed down, but they'll take damage. Compound that with DM permission for it to be effective on spells that force movement like Thorn Whip or Eldritch Blast w/ Invocations or Gust of Wind, and you can basically cherry tap a boss to death.
Hey man, I'm a relatively new DnD player (4th level ranger) and I've found your videos extremely helpful! Quick question regarding "spike growth". For the 2d4 damage, would I roll that once, and use that damage amount for the duration, or would I reroll for damage every 5ft of enemy movement? Thanks again for all the great content, hope to here back from you soon!
Is this spell camouflaged on a non natural setting? What If cast on a ball room floor? Can this be cast when you are up in the branches of a big giant tree? Can this be cast on the deck of a ship? The second floor of a building? On a wall? On a cliff wall? How steep does the ground need to be before it stops working? Does Spike growth affect friends?
it shouldn't because the reason it's difficult terrain is because you get caught on the spikes and if you don't get caught on the spikes you shouldn't take damage
Well your on horseback, being chased by whoever. Summon familiar Put familiar between you and the pursuers on the ground. Cast spike growth throw your familiar in a straight line. And let your pursuers run into it.
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Spiked growth definitely works with forced movement. That’s part of what thornwhip is for. The idea of forced movement not counting for damage effects seems to be based on misunderstandings about spells, forced movement, and opportunity attacks.
The following is a list of spells that have the same wording for causing damage when moved into the spells area. A few of them are like spiked growth in that they do not have saving throws.
Create bonfire
Cloud of daggers
Cordon of arrows
Moonbeam
Spiked growth
Evards black tentacles
Guardian of faith
Sickening radiance
Wall of fire
Cloudkill
Insect plague
Blade barrier
Forbiddance
Investiture of flame
Wall of ice
Wall of thorns
Whirlwind
Dark star
Incendiary cloud
Ravenous void
It can be strong, but it usually only strong if your table actually works together to force movement. Most ways that force movement cost resources in some way, either spell slots, ki points, or even potential damage from choosing to try a shove instead of attacking with a weapon. the exception of warlocks with invocations for movement effects being added to Eldritch blast should not be used to prevent other classes from working together.
Very interesting, I'll have to pin this comment. Thank you sooo much my friend!
there is a difference between movement and entering so no spike growth doesnt work with thornwhip. pulling/pushing through moonbeam would trigger dmg but not through spiked area
Moonbeam: "When a creature enters the spell's area for the first time on a turn or..." ; Spike Growth: "When a creature moves into or within the area..."
@@binolombardi yes pushing or pulling is a effective way to Enter a creature into an area. But Spike growth specifies movement as trigger for damage e.g. (walking, running..) with movement rules on difficult terrain. U can use thorn whip to pull creature into spiked area but damage occurs only when creature decides to move across spiked area squares. This is my understanding at least.
contris1
This is untrue. For an example of what a spell description looks like that supports the effect you’re describing, I’d take a look at the booming blade cantrip.
“As part of the action used to cast this spell, you must make a melee attack with a weapon against one crea- ture within the spell's range, otherwise the spell fails. On a hit, the target suffers the attack's normal effects, and it becomes sheathed in booming energy until the start of your next turn. If the target willingly moves before then, it immediately takes 1d8 thunder damage, and the spell ends.
This spell's damage increases when you reach higher levels. At 5th level, the melee attack deals an extra 1d8 thunder damage to the target, and the damage the target takes for moving increases to 2d8. Both damage rolls increase by 1d8 at 11th level and 17th level.”
There are two important factors.
1. It specifies “willingly” moving.
2. There are more ways to move than there are creature speed types. Falling, teleportation, being pushed, or being carried are all ways you could potentially be moved. Spiked growth doesn’t care how you move through it’s affected space, it damages you regardless of your mode of travel.
I like to combine this spell with plant growth to almost completely deny movement while I pepper them with arrows and the barbarian unleashes his nigh infinite amount of javelins. It uses two slots but it’ll really mess up any attempts to flee from or ambush us
Haha I like it!
Great spell! And good job! Keep up man! :)
Thanks, will do!
I'm about to play a nature cleric that has both spike growth and plant growth.
We also have a warlock in the party that absolutely loves using sickening radiance.
So the plan is when he casts sickening radiants to drop plant growth and make It super difficult to leave and the next turn drop spike growth on top of that so they take damage if they stay in there they take damage if they leave there and it's extremely difficult to leave.
Great combo!
Centaur Moon druid with rogue dip for bonus action dash.
You take mobile feat and cast Longstrider before combat. When you have Spike Growth up, you grapple one creature and dash with it , dragging the creature through the AoE for some boom you are dead damage :)
Ow shit I've only realised just now, but imagine this: the enemy is a small creature, you have the mobile feat, cast longstrider before combat, during combat you cast Spike Growth and Wild Shape into a warhorse. When you grapple the enemy and on his turn he fails to ungrapple himself, you can use your whole turn to dash, which will produce the following movement: 60 ft. movement as a warhorse which is not halved since the creature is 2 sizes smaller than the large warhorse, times 2 because of dash action, +10 because of mobile, and +10 because of longstrider. This results in 140 feet of movement, which is 28d4 damage!! The average of this would be 70 damage
I will be playing a Druid in Tomb of Annihilation and I am *really* looking forward to using this spell!
Haha Let me know how it turns out!
Raw and rai force movement does work
I instantly think about using this spell on a chest plate that someone is wearing. Have the thorns grow on the inside of the chest plate, and the bad guy gets impaled by its own armor. I was inspired by the Medeval torture device called the Iron Maden.
Spells like spike growth and snare, that say they are hidden and require a check to discover: do they automatically do the roll? If a player runs into a snare, do they automatically do the roll to try and find it, or does it use passive perception unless they are actively searching?
I think Thunderwave would work well with spike growth as long as you position yourself nicely.
One thing I would also rule is that if the creature hovers or is flying he does not take the damage.
That's a fair homebrew!
I probably would use it with earth tremor
Difficult terrain does not stack. FYI
I know just thought to make people fall on spike floor
Good idea!
There's nothing stopping you from casting this right as someone enters the area you're going to cast in. The average low-level movement rate is about 30 and difficult terrain eats 15, so not only will they be slowed down, but they'll take damage. Compound that with DM permission for it to be effective on spells that force movement like Thorn Whip or Eldritch Blast w/ Invocations or Gust of Wind, and you can basically cherry tap a boss to death.
Haha that strategy is why a lot of DM's hate it!
Hey man, I'm a relatively new DnD player (4th level ranger) and I've found your videos extremely helpful! Quick question regarding "spike growth". For the 2d4 damage, would I roll that once, and use that damage amount for the duration, or would I reroll for damage every 5ft of enemy movement? Thanks again for all the great content, hope to here back from you soon!
...just asked Reddit, got 4 replies in the first minute, lol. All sorted out now, thanks anyways!
How do you reconcile traveling diagonally with the simplified movement rules allowing you to move out of the 20ft radius with 15ft of movement?
Is this spell camouflaged on a non natural setting? What If cast on a ball room floor? Can this be cast when you are up in the branches of a big giant tree? Can this be cast on the deck of a ship? The second floor of a building? On a wall? On a cliff wall? How steep does the ground need to be before it stops working? Does Spike growth affect friends?
Can I just check, so if you cast this spell in an area where a creature already stands, do they immediately start taking damage?
Not as written, they would only take damage when they move!
@@ChancesSpellbook Do you need to SEE the point where you want to put it?
Question if you are immune to difficult terrain does spike growth still affect you?
it shouldn't because the reason it's difficult terrain is because you get caught on the spikes and if you don't get caught on the spikes you shouldn't take damage
Well your on horseback, being chased by whoever.
Summon familiar
Put familiar between you and the pursuers on the ground.
Cast spike growth throw your familiar in a straight line. And let your pursuers run into it.
Very interesting!
Casting through a familiar requires the spell to be Range Touch..
Merilwen’s meat grinder
I call BS! The only way you can make tha claim is if you somehow rule that "being pushed" doesn't count as movement!
1st
Haha nice!