This is the best review of water heating options for vans on TH-cam. Concise yet complete, opinion based but objective. Food for thought for anyone researching what to put in their van.
This was an exact replacement for the old one that lasted about 10 years. th-cam.com/users/postUgkx7yWIKcrbA9KMHkGSfcgxW2lsjHT6B8Sh The top of my mitigation tube by my roofline was just a 90 elbow which allowed too much debris to fall down into the fan, eventually ruining it. Without this issue, I bet it would have kept running another 10 years. When I replaced this fan, I added an extra elbow joint so the top tube now it does a 180, which should solve that problem. The radon guys around here wanted to charge me a $300 diagnostic fee, then parts/labor (probably close to $600 total). I installed this all by myself in about an hour for the cost of the fan; it would probably be even easier/faster with two people. FYI the manufacturer's warranty greatly differs depending on whether you install it yourself (1 yr warranty) or have a licensed installer do it (10 yrs).
A tankless water heater is by far the easiest and cheapest for indoor showers. I actually have a camplux and an Evershower. I just turn my rooftop fan on for ventilation. So simple.
You need to revist Bobil Vans. Their hybrid system includes insulated tank and heating from diesel heater via heat exchanger and either 12v or 240v element. We have 12v element, so we can use excess solar production. Obviously, we can run the 12v element whilst driving as well. It's a fantastic product, and support from Ed is 1st class.
ive go the bobil vans heat exchanger system and you can can control the tempreture very accuratley actually, it has its own thermostatic control panel and shuts off periodically when it needs to, very good system, and very reliable, had it seeral years no issues. nice video
@@madetoexplore I bought the original kit so it's going back a fair few years, but it was £220 at the time. Still takes 15 mins to heat up but it can keep it at that temperature quite Easily. The new systems they do are much better than that as well, worth the money in my book
ive been going back and forth with this for years but i still maintain that its just easier to heat up water on the stove. I find a full pan of boiling water poured into 9 liters of cold water gives a nice shower temperature and about 4 minutes of shower time. I use a portable, rechargeable shower head so i can shower outside if im in the middle of nowhere or in the van if im in public. Whole set up cost less than $30 and is just sooooooo much simpler. Nothing plumbed in so if anything goes wrong its an easy swap out. Doesnt drain my battery bank at all. Takes about 5 minutes to set up and doesnt take up any real space in my van. I've yet to see a set up I prefer.
I, too, bought a regular electric water heater that you install in your house and mounted it on my RV. Mine is 8 gallons and has a 1500w output. I have a 12v 300ah battery and I have a 3000w inverter and I have not experienced any of the problems you say. I don't want to use any gas or fossil energy products.
I've got one of those water heaters too, and I also went through the hassle of the hot water only lasting for a few minutes. Except the one I bought runs on 120volt house power. The Hot Water Heater stopped working in the Apartment Building I'm in , and I got fed up with the Hot water only lasting for a few minutes. I had better luck with a 40 cup Coffee Dispenser like you see used in Cafeterias or at Weddings, as it KEEPS the water hot. Maybe try that with a Rechargeable Power Box.
I don’t know if you managed to find a solution. But take a look at the 10L ac/dc water heater from Australia. Called duetto. I have it installed and I normally use 12v. But if needed it can be run on AC for faster water heat up.
Yeah I could do this but I’m trying to avoid wasting energy by heating water up, just to cool it down again. I do understand that we could have longer showers this way though!
@@madetoexplore A mixing valve doesn't cool the hot water, it mixes in cold with the hot. You can heat the water to a higher temperature so you use less hot water when you take a shower or wash dishes. Your water heater becomes more of an energy storage device.
hey man like you vids. i went with the big dollar marine hot water calorifier which i have not tried yet but think it's by far the best way to go due to all my extensive research and having multiple ways to heat it was a big selling point for me.
Good video, thank you. We also have a Camplux right now and I agree a bottom drain would be useful. Also, I tried to ge a replacement anode from Camplux, and they will not provide it, nor indicate where to find one. The Rheem point-of-use conversion looks appealing, but unfortunately, there does not seem to be a 4 gallon version on the Canadian or US Rheem sites…
Another option which I'm going to go with is a heat plate exchanger. Quite cheap and could be fixed to a tank. I'm just going to run the piping from the exchanger to the tap. One problem would be that you need to drive to get hot water. I see it as a matter of timing, or use a flask to keep that water hot. A cheap setup if you are always driving and not static for any length of time. I would also add a expansion tank from a radiator too. Great video as always, the pros and cons of van life hey!
12v water heaters work mostly on only 300watt….so it would take even more time to heat up the same amount of water. If that is not an issue i would also go for the 12v water heater.
Yes, the time it takes to heat the hot water will increase to about 1.5 hours but that isn’t an issue for me if it means being able to have hot water for majority of the time
@@rroosenFB for me, the gains would be a larger tank, higher efficiency, less power consumption from my inverter, and access to hot water more frequently.
Svan-keil 12v 200 watt 5 litre insulated from Germany 4hr heat up and upto 30 hr worth of insolation 1.5 amp hour is on I have gone for. For my narrowboat taking lpg boiler out...
I just got a 4 gal Bosch tank. Have not installed it yet not sure if it’s worth it. Might just return it. We would like hot water in the can but in the snow and freezing temps it’s hard to justify all the energy, batteries, antifreeze wires and tank pads, big project.
Find a straight section of piping in your exhaust system. Buy an 18" to 24" piece of pipe that can be used as a "repaired" replacement. Wrap that piece with 20ft or so of 1/4" copper tubing to create a water loop that can be fed up to your water tank. You would have to use a couple of 2 way solenoid valves shut off the "tank side" while opening the copper "exhaust side" to allow it drain out and purge since you would be dealing with upwards of 500 degree superheated steam if left unchecked and you went for a drive. Boom is bad
Thanks for the idea! Winterize good this might be a little tricky but I’m sure I could blow it out with a compressor. Maybe I’ll give it a try this winter.
Do the math. A 2.5 gal Rheem heater using a 600 watt DC element (largest I’ve found) will take 34 mins to heat water from 55F to 110F assuming no heat loss from the tank. That’s a best case scenario though, so assume 35-40 mins to heat a tank of water. A 4 gal tank will take about an hour to heat up. That’s going to be about 10 amp-hrs, for 1 shower. 400 watts of panels mounted on a flat roof is going to produce about 200 watts of output so you’re going to need about 2 hrs of full sun, for 1 shower.
I’m not worried about the waiting time because i would have the heater turned on majority of the time. The point of this is not having to wait for hot/warm water at all. I’d also go with the 300 watt element because it’s more reliable. We also charge mostly off the alternator, not the 540 watts of solar I have installed.
The biggest benefit of using a 12V boiler would be that it can be switched on when your solar system or alternator is charging your batteries. Put a voltage-controlled relay in the boiler loop and you can automatically turn the boiler on when your batteries are charging. This way you lose less energy during the day, if you might otherwise have a surplus.
You don't need a calofier. In ice cream vans we build our own simple system. We need hot water for food hygiene certification. And you can expand on this to create a water system that will give you hot water even when you wake up in the morning the next day after parking up. What you do is like a calofier you take 2 x T junctions off your van coolant system. One before the radiator and one after it which is the return line. You then connect these to a tank. You can buy a tank or just use a old plastic home brew barrel the brewing barrel has a oversized screw top on it with a hole for a bung. First fit a tap type connector near the bottom enduring a good watertight seal and connect your inlet hoes from the coolant to this ( the hot water before the radiator) . Then inside connect a coiled up hose or fashion a copper coil of some sort which the barrel hole allows you to place inside the barrel. Connect this to your bottom tap and the top of it to the pipe from the T piece from after the radiator. Thus you have created your heat exchanger unit for practically no cost. The coolant will just flow through the coil back to the coolant system. All you have done is extend the coolant system. Now take your system apart again. And buy yourself a few tins of foam spray. put a bit of heat resistant sealant around the inlet and outlet piece just for extra sealing protection. Next you need to create a water take off and a water inlet. Another tap on the bottom and drill a hole near the top that you can put a funnel in to fill, this hole will also act as a pressure relief valve. Now get a box or make a box of ply or some such thing where you can put your beer barrel into. Just make sure the barrel can sit in the box. You can use ply or even think cardboard box. Now spray some foam into bottom of box couple of inches deep and place the barrel in the centre. Now fill the rest of the box with the foam. Thus you have created your own insulated tank for the hot water that will keep it warm at least overnight even right into the next day. If you can find a small water tank you can skip all of this and just connect it directly to the coolant. So now you got your hot water tank. You can now draw the hot water off via a whale pump ( hand suction pump) or an electric pump but really no need for that a hand pump will be just as good. You can also put a T PIECE in and run to sink or electric shower unit, you can use and expand to have radiators or underfloor heating. Adding a circulation pump an do some pipework. You could create a fill cap on outside of van, put in a level guage and all sorts to suit.
The "instant hot water" claim is referring to a normal residential installation in a house under a sink. Instead of waiting for hot water to travel throughu all the plumbing in your house from the main water heater, this puts the heat source right where you need it - instant hot water.
Love this. I've actually done what you described with the Home Depot 6 gallon hot water heater. I built a custom controller for it, and used two relays to either use one heating coil on the 12 volt element(300 watts), or both(600 watts). The controller would also keep the water heater off if the voltage got too low(not enough power in reserve or coming in.) I had a "low voltage" set point, which kept the water at 140F of the voltage wasn't above a certain level, and had a "high voltage" set point that kept the water at 190F if you had max system voltage. 6 gallons at 190F was enough for 2 people to shower, turning off the water when not being actively used. Cutting the super hot water with cold water stretches it much further. I also plumbed the overheat vent straight through the camper floor. A relay failed and stuck open, causing the water to boil and vent outside. Currently working for a complete custom solution to the off grid water heating problem now. Designing the software, hardware, and web app interface now, actually. Anyway, you made a ton of great points that have helped guide me in development. Thank you for the awesome video.
@@madetoexplore Once I've got some prototypes tested, I would send a few out for beta testing. Should I add you to my list of possible testers? It has to be thoroughly torture tested before I'd send one for someone to rely on, so it's going to be a while.
To be fair I think any electric heater is kinda silly for a van build unless it's part of a larger system. For example because I live in a cold climate I want to do solar thermal + leach heat off the exhaust of a diesel heater when I am already heating the van with a diesel heater + an emersion heater to supplement the rest of the system and as a backup. Also at 15 - 20L very well insulated tank so that most of the time I should be able to get by with the solar thermal + diesel heater exhaust heat for heating water.
Our 12v hot water heater works great while driving. I turn it on after the batteries are charged to avoid overloading the alternator. We have yet to add solar. Curious if you have an update on how it worked with solar and how much solar you have? Thanks for the great video.
@@madetoexplore I have no need for a large inverter so it made sense to try the 12V water heater. I bought a Whale 3 gallon 110V tank and changed the element. The tank also has a heat exchanger if I decide later to run the engine cooling through it. If your 1500 watt heater took 15 minutes to re-heat, the 12V will take much longer unless the solar can keep it hot.
Then there's something wrong with an instant water means you turn it on and it gets hot within ten seconds, otherwise you might as well just have a normal water heater
Heater coils dont care about ac vs dc. Look at the ohms or caculate it out then use the ohms to figure out the wattage. Ig 1800w/120v= 15 ohms. If your batttery is 48v then 48vx15ohms=720 watts. So the water heater will run at 720 watts. If you run from the panels and they run at 72v then 72x15=1080watts
Heating water needs a lot of energy. If you want that to happen fast then you need a lot of power. It is really hard to squeeze a lot of power out of 12V.
Yes it’s very true! It all depends on how much battery storage you have. We have 400ah now so it’s easier to store power and apply a large amount quicker.
Dude for a high draw device chaging to 12V isn't that much of a saving, it's actually low draw AC 120/240V that are super inefficient with an inverter because you will ways have from 20 - 80W depending on the size and quality of the inverter just running the inverter, so if you have a laptop that generally only uses 20W yeh it's going to be ~22W because the inverter is only 90% efficient, but assuming you are not running any other AC loads thats an another 20 - 80W ontop so 42 to 102W 19.6% - 47.6% efficient. Those are the kind of thing that you want to move to low voltage DC.
On my camper water heater it's 120volt/gas direct igniting, but where the sacrificial rod is I was thinking of a threaded adapter I could screw in a 12v glow plug and wire to my solar overcharge dump. But I could just replace the 120v element with a 12 volt element and get lithium batteries like you say. Missouri Wind and Solar makes a nice one with a thermostat on the end of it, but you can use the units existing thermostat if you understand basic wiring.@@madetoexplore
Getting a 4 or 8 gallon Rheem with the 12V element swap seems good since you would be able to leave it on while driving or using solar (yes it will take longer as others have said) but the benefit would be that the water stays warm in the tank since insulated. Also having the water heater tank would be part of the overall freshwater capacity (water tank plus water heater). Verses the Camplux/Bosch doesn't insulate the hot water that wasn't used sitting in the tank, correct? Meaning if you heat up the Camplux water but don't use it all, it will cool much faster. Next time you want hot water, you have to heat it back up again? Is that what you are saying in the video? Also the Camplux/Bosch is hard to drain in the winter.
I think you need to alway keep it on at certain temp setting. When the water temp in the tank drops under the setting, the unit will auto-reheat the water so you can get hot water 'instantly'
@Made to Explore i say go with a high amp alternator, and a huge inverter(instead of huge water tank) that can dump over 15kw into an inline tankless (as needed) electric water heater. Split phase =D
how long is a piece of string Juan? You don't say what other power drain you will have on your system. Without that info there can be no full answer. It would also depend on which size tank and element you used
You could also vent through the side of the van. I don’t think it’s worth it to cut a huge vent hole, they aren’t very reliable, and I don’t want to risk having a propane leak. Let me know if you find a good one though! I’m sure one day they’ll be a good one.
@@madetoexplore do you think you could vent through the bottom? Another thought: I see a lot of people install the outdoor version inside their vans to use for outdoor showers only. What if you had that as well as a bucket and a detached 12v shower pump/head? You could open the doors, fill up the bucket, close the doors and then bring it into the shower stall with you. That way you wouldn’t even have to plumb the shower stall. Any specific risk to that? Or are you just not into that style of water heater at all?
Thanks for the review! We have the same Camplux, but have not gotten to install stage yet. Question: how often does the pressure relief valve vent (if ever)? Just wondering if a line should be plumbed from it to carry any released water out of the van.
My pressure relief valve has never gone off and I’m guessing that it probably won’t. I don’t have mine plumbed in but it is installed in my garage area which has a rubber waterproof floor.
@@madetoexplore thank you! I'm guessing it would probably only vent in the rare condition that the pressure has increased to an unusually high level where tank or fittings may fail.
Works great! I installed this one www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B06XPQZNXP?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title but I’d recommend this one www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B0184PH9TM/ref=sspa_mw_detail_0?ie=UTF8&psc=1&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9waG9uZV9kZXRhaWwp13NParams as it also has an on/off button.
It has a hot/cold water mixer on it, so it will not be boiling hot at the tap. And I understand it keep water hot for a day. I was looking at the setup you have now, a water heater for around $100, and to run the inverter to heat it while driving. It seams ok for the price. Anyway, got the isotemp, but still building, so not test it yet.
@@carolmaplesden916 Interesting. I updated the link again because it says online that they are still available? Maybe there was a parts shortage for a little while.
in short NO. Firstly you would need a mighty lithium battery bank and substantial wiring . Use a search engine and you can find the equation but I think you will be shocked. Good luck!
@@RustyCas999 I’m not worried about the time it would take to heat since it would be turned on majority of the time we are in the van. If I wanted “quick” hot water, I would leave my current setup installed.
Ok, let me explain something. At no point are these units advertised as HOT water heaters. They are water heaters, specially, cold water heaters. My plumbers OCD screams every time I watch people try and educate folks on water heaters and they can't even properly define them. And making the comment that you have to turn it on 15 minutes before use to "give it time to HEAT up the HOT water is ridiculous, because why would you need to heat up hot water if it's already hot water? It's cold, and all WATER HEATERS are COLD WATER HEATERS. They are all labeled and advertised as water heaters, not hot water heaters, and if you find one on Amazon labeled as a hot water heater, the seller is an idiot and I wouldn't buy anything from him.
Sorry but you need to educate yourself a little better. It's actually more efficient to heat the water as hot as you can get it, then mix it during consumption to the correct temp using a temper valve or mixer tap. My partner and I have consecutive showers from a tiny 6 litre 12volt HWS this way. Yet you're having one shower with a 16 litre system??? The water in the system must be heated to 75 degrees, not 38 degrees.
🤦♂️ your wasting energy by heating it up that hot just to cool it down again… how does that not make sense? In your case, it’s necessary since your hot water tank is so small. Also, we could have much longer showers if we did it your way but we choose not to waste energy and water.
@@madetoexplore Incorrect, the energy required to heat a 1 litre of water from 0 to 70 degrees is identical to heating 2 litres to 35 degrees. Just mix cold water from the main tank with the hot water for exactly the same result - but we don't need such a large hot tank, which is a deliberate decision by us to save space. The only difference between our systems is the RATIO of water. If I could buy a 95 degrees HWS, it would be even smaller for the same length shower, and consume identical energy. You can experiment with a bucket and thermometer to confirm all this, and it could be a new video where you finally fix your system.
@@madetoexplore I believe whether you're "wasting" energy or not depends on your source. My eventual plan is to use a calorifier and as John said, add cold water to get the temp I want because I will be utilizing heat from the engine which is produced when we drive anyway. This may effect the timing of showers since we won't be doing daily driving but it's definitely an efficient use of energy that would otherwise just be wasted. Also, I understand that the tank will still have "warm" water for up to 6 hours after you drive - too cool to shower but nice for hand/dishwashing.
@@johnleaste828 hey mate looking fitting a 12v 6 litre water heater to my canopy and ridding my joolca off. Can these heaters be hooked up to a water tank part time using a thermostatic valve to mix the water temp. Hook it to my tank under my ute via a pump to the heater when needed, disconnect from water tank when not needed?
This is the best review of water heating options for vans on TH-cam. Concise yet complete, opinion based but objective. Food for thought for anyone researching what to put in their van.
Thank you! Really appreciate it 😄
This was an exact replacement for the old one that lasted about 10 years. th-cam.com/users/postUgkx7yWIKcrbA9KMHkGSfcgxW2lsjHT6B8Sh The top of my mitigation tube by my roofline was just a 90 elbow which allowed too much debris to fall down into the fan, eventually ruining it. Without this issue, I bet it would have kept running another 10 years. When I replaced this fan, I added an extra elbow joint so the top tube now it does a 180, which should solve that problem. The radon guys around here wanted to charge me a $300 diagnostic fee, then parts/labor (probably close to $600 total). I installed this all by myself in about an hour for the cost of the fan; it would probably be even easier/faster with two people. FYI the manufacturer's warranty greatly differs depending on whether you install it yourself (1 yr warranty) or have a licensed installer do it (10 yrs).
Also the most expensive! Haha
A tankless water heater is by far the easiest and cheapest for indoor showers. I actually have a camplux and an Evershower. I just turn my rooftop fan on for ventilation. So simple.
You need to revist Bobil Vans. Their hybrid system includes insulated tank and heating from diesel heater via heat exchanger and either 12v or 240v element. We have 12v element, so we can use excess solar production. Obviously, we can run the 12v element whilst driving as well. It's a fantastic product, and support from Ed is 1st class.
That’s great to hear! I’ll definitely look into it. Thanks!
ive go the bobil vans heat exchanger system and you can can control the tempreture very accuratley actually, it has its own thermostatic control panel and shuts off periodically when it needs to, very good system, and very reliable, had it seeral years no issues. nice video
That’s awesome. How much did the product and install cost?
@@madetoexplore I bought the original kit so it's going back a fair few years, but it was £220 at the time. Still takes 15 mins to heat up but it can keep it at that temperature quite Easily. The new systems they do are much better than that as well, worth the money in my book
ive been going back and forth with this for years but i still maintain that its just easier to heat up water on the stove. I find a full pan of boiling water poured into 9 liters of cold water gives a nice shower temperature and about 4 minutes of shower time. I use a portable, rechargeable shower head so i can shower outside if im in the middle of nowhere or in the van if im in public. Whole set up cost less than $30 and is just sooooooo much simpler. Nothing plumbed in so if anything goes wrong its an easy swap out. Doesnt drain my battery bank at all. Takes about 5 minutes to set up and doesnt take up any real space in my van. I've yet to see a set up I prefer.
Love how simple that process is!
I, too, bought a regular electric water heater that you install in your house and mounted it on my RV. Mine is 8 gallons and has a 1500w output. I have a 12v 300ah battery and I have a 3000w inverter and I have not experienced any of the problems you say. I don't want to use any gas or fossil energy products.
That’s great to hear! You definitely have a larger system than I do. How much solar do you have?
Which water heater did you buy?
That was awesome so much info thanks man from the uk
Welcome!
When I start mine this yeah I'm going yo go through all you videos. Chances of using that one I think. I post them as I go
I've got one of those water heaters too, and I also went through the hassle of the hot water only lasting for a few minutes. Except the one I bought runs on 120volt house power. The Hot Water Heater stopped working in the Apartment Building I'm in , and I got fed up with the Hot water only lasting for a few minutes. I had better luck with a 40 cup Coffee Dispenser like you see used in Cafeterias or at Weddings, as it KEEPS the water hot. Maybe try that with a Rechargeable Power Box.
Thanks for the info!
I don’t know if you managed to find a solution. But take a look at the 10L ac/dc water heater from Australia. Called duetto. I have it installed and I normally use 12v. But if needed it can be run on AC for faster water heat up.
Thanks for the recommendation! Looks like a perfect option. I like that you can also easily install a drain on that tank too.
I bought a geyser shower..its 12 volt and saves water uses very little water
@@otter3246 that’s great!
Use a faucet with a built-in mixing valve (shower) or a single-handle faucet (sinks). You control the temperature at the point of use.
Yeah I could do this but I’m trying to avoid wasting energy by heating water up, just to cool it down again. I do understand that we could have longer showers this way though!
@@madetoexplore A mixing valve doesn't cool the hot water, it mixes in cold with the hot. You can heat the water to a higher temperature so you use less hot water when you take a shower or wash dishes. Your water heater becomes more of an energy storage device.
bingo
hey man like you vids. i went with the big dollar marine hot water calorifier which i have not tried yet but think it's by far the best way to go due to all my extensive research and having multiple ways to heat it was a big selling point for me.
Yeah! I completely agree. I think the price will be worth it for sure
Good video, thank you. We also have a Camplux right now and I agree a bottom drain would be useful. Also, I tried to ge a replacement anode from Camplux, and they will not provide it, nor indicate where to find one. The Rheem point-of-use conversion looks appealing, but unfortunately, there does not seem to be a 4 gallon version on the Canadian or US Rheem sites…
I believe the smallest one is 8 gallon? I think that’s the size of the one I saw in our local Home Depot.
Another option which I'm going to go with is a heat plate exchanger. Quite cheap and could be fixed to a tank. I'm just going to run the piping from the exchanger to the tap. One problem would be that you need to drive to get hot water. I see it as a matter of timing, or use a flask to keep that water hot. A cheap setup if you are always driving and not static for any length of time. I would also add a expansion tank from a radiator too. Great video as always, the pros and cons of van life hey!
Yeah, every solutions has its pros and cons for sure! I like the air exchanger but winterizing it would be very difficult. Thanks!
12v water heaters work mostly on only 300watt….so it would take even more time to heat up the same amount of water. If that is not an issue i would also go for the 12v water heater.
Yes, the time it takes to heat the hot water will increase to about 1.5 hours but that isn’t an issue for me if it means being able to have hot water for majority of the time
@@madetoexplore in amperage it will be 10-15% cheaper to make, but u also have to wait longer…where is the gain?
@@rroosenFB for me, the gains would be a larger tank, higher efficiency, less power consumption from my inverter, and access to hot water more frequently.
Svan-keil 12v 200 watt 5 litre insulated from Germany 4hr heat up and upto 30 hr worth of insolation 1.5 amp hour is on I have gone for. For my narrowboat taking lpg boiler out...
Thanks! I’ll have to take a look at that 👍
I just got a 4 gal Bosch tank. Have not installed it yet not sure if it’s worth it. Might just return it. We would like hot water in the can but in the snow and freezing temps it’s hard to justify all the energy, batteries, antifreeze wires and tank pads, big project.
I completely agree. I’ve recently installed heated cable and pipe insulation. Hoping to test it out this winter 👍
Find a straight section of piping in your exhaust system. Buy an 18" to 24" piece of pipe that can be used as a "repaired" replacement. Wrap that piece with 20ft or so of 1/4" copper tubing to create a water loop that can be fed up to your water tank. You would have to use a couple of 2 way solenoid valves shut off the "tank side" while opening the copper "exhaust side" to allow it drain out and purge since you would be dealing with upwards of 500 degree superheated steam if left unchecked and you went for a drive. Boom is bad
Thanks for the idea! Winterize good this might be a little tricky but I’m sure I could blow it out with a compressor. Maybe I’ll give it a try this winter.
Do the math. A 2.5 gal Rheem heater using a 600 watt DC element (largest I’ve found) will take 34 mins to heat water from 55F to 110F assuming no heat loss from the tank. That’s a best case scenario though, so assume 35-40 mins to heat a tank of water. A 4 gal tank will take about an hour to heat up. That’s going to be about 10 amp-hrs, for 1 shower. 400 watts of panels mounted on a flat roof is going to produce about 200 watts of output so you’re going to need about 2 hrs of full sun, for 1 shower.
I’m not worried about the waiting time because i would have the heater turned on majority of the time. The point of this is not having to wait for hot/warm water at all. I’d also go with the 300 watt element because it’s more reliable. We also charge mostly off the alternator, not the 540 watts of solar I have installed.
The biggest benefit of using a 12V boiler would be that it can be switched on when your solar system or alternator is charging your batteries.
Put a voltage-controlled relay in the boiler loop and you can automatically turn the boiler on when your batteries are charging.
This way you lose less energy during the day, if you might otherwise have a surplus.
You don't need a calofier. In ice cream vans we build our own simple system. We need hot water for food hygiene certification. And you can expand on this to create a water system that will give you hot water even when you wake up in the morning the next day after parking up. What you do is like a calofier you take 2 x T junctions off your van coolant system. One before the radiator and one after it which is the return line. You then connect these to a tank. You can buy a tank or just use a old plastic home brew barrel the brewing barrel has a oversized screw top on it with a hole for a bung. First fit a tap type connector near the bottom enduring a good watertight seal and connect your inlet hoes from the coolant to this ( the hot water before the radiator) . Then inside connect a coiled up hose or fashion a copper coil of some sort which the barrel hole allows you to place inside the barrel. Connect this to your bottom tap and the top of it to the pipe from the T piece from after the radiator. Thus you have created your heat exchanger unit for practically no cost. The coolant will just flow through the coil back to the coolant system. All you have done is extend the coolant system. Now take your system apart again. And buy yourself a few tins of foam spray. put a bit of heat resistant sealant around the inlet and outlet piece just for extra sealing protection. Next you need to create a water take off and a water inlet. Another tap on the bottom and drill a hole near the top that you can put a funnel in to fill, this hole will also act as a pressure relief valve. Now get a box or make a box of ply or some such thing where you can put your beer barrel into. Just make sure the barrel can sit in the box. You can use ply or even think cardboard box. Now spray some foam into bottom of box couple of inches deep and place the barrel in the centre. Now fill the rest of the box with the foam. Thus you have created your own insulated tank for the hot water that will keep it warm at least overnight even right into the next day. If you can find a small water tank you can skip all of this and just connect it directly to the coolant. So now you got your hot water tank. You can now draw the hot water off via a whale pump ( hand suction pump) or an electric pump but really no need for that a hand pump will be just as good. You can also put a T PIECE in and run to sink or electric shower unit, you can use and expand to have radiators or underfloor heating. Adding a circulation pump an do some pipework. You could create a fill cap on outside of van, put in a level guage and all sorts to suit.
Wow! That’s awesome, thanks for all the info. Definitely will have to look into doing this 😄
Great solution. The engine generates so much heat that is wasted in the radiator, it is a good idea to recover that heat
The "instant hot water" claim is referring to a normal residential installation in a house under a sink. Instead of waiting for hot water to travel throughu all the plumbing in your house from the main water heater, this puts the heat source right where you need it - instant hot water.
Makes sense!
Love this. I've actually done what you described with the Home Depot 6 gallon hot water heater. I built a custom controller for it, and used two relays to either use one heating coil on the 12 volt element(300 watts), or both(600 watts). The controller would also keep the water heater off if the voltage got too low(not enough power in reserve or coming in.) I had a "low voltage" set point, which kept the water at 140F of the voltage wasn't above a certain level, and had a "high voltage" set point that kept the water at 190F if you had max system voltage. 6 gallons at 190F was enough for 2 people to shower, turning off the water when not being actively used. Cutting the super hot water with cold water stretches it much further. I also plumbed the overheat vent straight through the camper floor. A relay failed and stuck open, causing the water to boil and vent outside. Currently working for a complete custom solution to the off grid water heating problem now. Designing the software, hardware, and web app interface now, actually. Anyway, you made a ton of great points that have helped guide me in development. Thank you for the awesome video.
Wow that’s awesome man! Would love to test that out in the future when it’s ready.
@@madetoexplore Once I've got some prototypes tested, I would send a few out for beta testing. Should I add you to my list of possible testers? It has to be thoroughly torture tested before I'd send one for someone to rely on, so it's going to be a while.
@@hotgarbageD yes for sure 👍
@@madetoexplore Very cool. I shall add you to the list and get a hold of you when I've got some prototypes working and ready to field test.
How is that prototype going? I’m also very very interested
To be fair I think any electric heater is kinda silly for a van build unless it's part of a larger system. For example because I live in a cold climate I want to do solar thermal + leach heat off the exhaust of a diesel heater when I am already heating the van with a diesel heater + an emersion heater to supplement the rest of the system and as a backup. Also at 15 - 20L very well insulated tank so that most of the time I should be able to get by with the solar thermal + diesel heater exhaust heat for heating water.
Yeah that’s a great idea! If you live in a van full time it would make more sense too
thanks for the point of use rec on here. There are some very affordable units at home depot.
Yes these are pretty affordable which is nice!
Our 12v hot water heater works great while driving. I turn it on after the batteries are charged to avoid overloading the alternator. We have yet to add solar. Curious if you have an update on how it worked with solar and how much solar you have? Thanks for the great video.
Nice! Which one do you have? I have 540w of solar but I haven’t been able to install the 12v element yet.
@@madetoexplore I have no need for a large inverter so it made sense to try the 12V water heater. I bought a Whale 3 gallon 110V tank and changed the element. The tank also has a heat exchanger if I decide later to run the engine cooling through it. If your 1500 watt heater took 15 minutes to re-heat, the 12V will take much longer unless the solar can keep it hot.
Check out the 11810Kuuma 120V 6 Gallon Water Heater. It’s $383 and heats off electric or engine coolant.
Thank you! Looks like a great product and much more reasonably priced for sure. Just gotta figure out how to run the coolant lines 🤔
Watched another U tuber do it. Looked pretty easy.
Then there's something wrong with an instant water means you turn it on and it gets hot within ten seconds, otherwise you might as well just have a normal water heater
Heater coils dont care about ac vs dc. Look at the ohms or caculate it out then use the ohms to figure out the wattage. Ig 1800w/120v= 15 ohms. If your batttery is 48v then 48vx15ohms=720 watts. So the water heater will run at 720 watts. If you run from the panels and they run at 72v then 72x15=1080watts
Thanks! Didn’t know this 👍
Heating water needs a lot of energy. If you want that to happen fast then you need a lot of power.
It is really hard to squeeze a lot of power out of 12V.
Yes it’s very true! It all depends on how much battery storage you have. We have 400ah now so it’s easier to store power and apply a large amount quicker.
Dude for a high draw device chaging to 12V isn't that much of a saving, it's actually low draw AC 120/240V that are super inefficient with an inverter because you will ways have from 20 - 80W depending on the size and quality of the inverter just running the inverter, so if you have a laptop that generally only uses 20W yeh it's going to be ~22W because the inverter is only 90% efficient, but assuming you are not running any other AC loads thats an another 20 - 80W ontop so 42 to 102W 19.6% - 47.6% efficient.
Those are the kind of thing that you want to move to low voltage DC.
Thanks for the info! 👍
You missed the JP Combi Unit, diesel H20 and air heater. What about use diesel glow plugs in the water heater.
Never thought of that! Wonder how well it would work 🤔
On my camper water heater it's 120volt/gas direct igniting, but where the sacrificial rod is I was thinking of a threaded adapter I could screw in a 12v glow plug and wire to my solar overcharge dump. But I could just replace the 120v element with a 12 volt element and get lithium batteries like you say. Missouri Wind and Solar makes a nice one with a thermostat on the end of it, but you can use the units existing thermostat if you understand basic wiring.@@madetoexplore
Thank you 🙏🏼
Welcome!
Getting a 4 or 8 gallon Rheem with the 12V element swap seems good since you would be able to leave it on while driving or using solar (yes it will take longer as others have said) but the benefit would be that the water stays warm in the tank since insulated. Also having the water heater tank would be part of the overall freshwater capacity (water tank plus water heater). Verses the Camplux/Bosch doesn't insulate the hot water that wasn't used sitting in the tank, correct? Meaning if you heat up the Camplux water but don't use it all, it will cool much faster. Next time you want hot water, you have to heat it back up again? Is that what you are saying in the video? Also the Camplux/Bosch is hard to drain in the winter.
Yes,l that’s what I’m saying. Although there is a glass insulation but I don’t think it works very well at all.
I think you need to alway keep it on at certain temp setting. When the water temp in the tank drops under the setting, the unit will auto-reheat the water so you can get hot water 'instantly'
@Made to Explore i say go with a high amp alternator, and a huge inverter(instead of huge water tank) that can dump over 15kw into an inline tankless (as needed) electric water heater. Split phase =D
Sounds like quite the price tag!
has anyone seen on TH-cam, someone actually making a water tank heater, I'm thinking someone has to have a custom tank for this
I’d like to see this as well 👍
In the link you post an electric hot water heater without a drain. What about the one you mentioned in the video that has a drain on the bottom?
I added the link in the description! It’s made by Rheem.
Hey! I'm in bc and would be interested in meeting up and filming a van tour with you for my channel, let me know if you would be interested
Hey! Yeah for sure although we’re going to be in Calgary for the next while. Where abouts in BC are you?
@@madetoexplore cool! I'm on Vancouver island right now and will be heading to Ontario in June
@@Differentmedia okay, let us know when your passing through Calgary and we could definitely meet up!
wait, wait, wait. 40Ah per 4 gallons?????
Heating water takes a lot of energy!
I wonder if with a 200ah Lithium battery bank (350w solar) will be enough power to use the Rheem set up.
Depends how much hot water you use and how much solar your getting!
how long is a piece of string Juan? You don't say what other power drain you will have on your system. Without that info there can be no full answer. It would also depend on which size tank and element you used
Have you tried the Rheem with the 12v element yet? I think I may give it a go!
No not yet 🙄 just haven’t had the time! Would love to hear how it goes though!
What about the indoor on demand propane water heaters? They require a vent through the roof of the van. Worth it?
You could also vent through the side of the van. I don’t think it’s worth it to cut a huge vent hole, they aren’t very reliable, and I don’t want to risk having a propane leak. Let me know if you find a good one though! I’m sure one day they’ll be a good one.
@@madetoexplore do you think you could vent through the bottom?
Another thought: I see a lot of people install the outdoor version inside their vans to use for outdoor showers only. What if you had that as well as a bucket and a detached 12v shower pump/head? You could open the doors, fill up the bucket, close the doors and then bring it into the shower stall with you. That way you wouldn’t even have to plumb the shower stall.
Any specific risk to that? Or are you just not into that style of water heater at all?
Thanks, nice video, will the water flow when the water heater is not "on?"
Yes it will still flow.
@@madetoexplore thank you thank you much appreciated.
Thanks for the review! We have the same Camplux, but have not gotten to install stage yet. Question: how often does the pressure relief valve vent (if ever)? Just wondering if a line should be plumbed from it to carry any released water out of the van.
My pressure relief valve has never gone off and I’m guessing that it probably won’t. I don’t have mine plumbed in but it is installed in my garage area which has a rubber waterproof floor.
@@madetoexplore thank you! I'm guessing it would probably only vent in the rare condition that the pressure has increased to an unusually high level where tank or fittings may fail.
Be careful lots of lv elements are not as they seem
Thanks for the advise
Would I need to have a constant water supply (we all know can/RV life that isn’t possible) or is it possible to fill up as I go?
You don’t need a constant water supply but you do need a fresh water tank.
@@madetoexplore so I wouldn’t be able to fill it up & close the cold water supply line off?
did you ever get the 12v hot water heater?
No, hoping to soon tho!
Any thoughts on propane water heaters?
Yes. I’m not a fan because of the exhaust factor mostly. If your only using the water heater for an outdoor shower then it would probably be okay.
thats not instant water heater. its a boiler if it takes 15mins to heat up. 2 different things.
I agree. Not sure why the advertise it is an instant water heater!
How has the timer switch held up on your water heater. What is the make and model?
Works great! I installed this one www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B06XPQZNXP?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title but I’d recommend this one www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B0184PH9TM/ref=sspa_mw_detail_0?ie=UTF8&psc=1&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9waG9uZV9kZXRhaWwp13NParams as it also has an on/off button.
Take a look at: Isotemp slim square
Thanks! That would also be a good option but fairly expensive still
@@madetoexplore here new sell for 660$. But yes, expensive, but hopefully quality and it will last a long time.
It has a hot/cold water mixer on it, so it will not be boiling hot at the tap. And I understand it keep water hot for a day. I was looking at the setup you have now, a water heater for around $100, and to run the inverter to heat it while driving. It seams ok for the price. Anyway, got the isotemp, but still building, so not test it yet.
Did you have a link to the 12 volt swap out for the Rheem one?
I added the link to the description! Thanks for watching 😄
@@madetoexplore they seem to no longer offer the one you provided a link to FYI
@@carolmaplesden916 Interesting. I updated the link again because it says online that they are still available? Maybe there was a parts shortage for a little while.
@@madetoexplore himm ok i will check agen later
Is it possible to heat up 30L of water to 60 Celsius with a 12v system in less than an hour?
Many thanks
I believe there are websites that can make this calculation for you!
in short NO. Firstly you would need a mighty lithium battery bank and substantial wiring . Use a search engine and you can find the equation but I think you will be shocked. Good luck!
Thank you guys so much for watching! Which water heater are you planning to use for your van build?
I was gonna ask you the same question. 😰
@@lel3450 I’m planning to purchase the 8 Gal Rheem hot water heater and swap out the 120v heating element for the 12v element!
@@madetoexplore Have you calculated how long it will take to heat a tank of water using a 12V element?
@@RustyCas999 I’m not worried about the time it would take to heat since it would be turned on majority of the time we are in the van. If I wanted “quick” hot water, I would leave my current setup installed.
I would not park on that bridge!
It wasn’t so bad! Haha
🤦🏻♂️ dude this isn't a traditional home water heater it will never perform the same stop holding it to the same standard
Not even sure what your talking about but thanks for watching! 👍
Ok, let me explain something. At no point are these units advertised as HOT water heaters. They are water heaters, specially, cold water heaters. My plumbers OCD screams every time I watch people try and educate folks on water heaters and they can't even properly define them. And making the comment that you have to turn it on 15 minutes before use to "give it time to HEAT up the HOT water is ridiculous, because why would you need to heat up hot water if it's already hot water?
It's cold, and all WATER HEATERS are COLD WATER HEATERS. They are all labeled and advertised as water heaters, not hot water heaters, and if you find one on Amazon labeled as a hot water heater, the seller is an idiot and I wouldn't buy anything from him.
You have wayyy too much time on your hands 😂
@@madetoexplore Oh, I agree!
Ditch the van get an rv
@@BrianSmith-ql5nj never haha
Sorry but you need to educate yourself a little better. It's actually more efficient to heat the water as hot as you can get it, then mix it during consumption to the correct temp using a temper valve or mixer tap. My partner and I have consecutive showers from a tiny 6 litre 12volt HWS this way. Yet you're having one shower with a 16 litre system??? The water in the system must be heated to 75 degrees, not 38 degrees.
🤦♂️ your wasting energy by heating it up that hot just to cool it down again… how does that not make sense? In your case, it’s necessary since your hot water tank is so small. Also, we could have much longer showers if we did it your way but we choose not to waste energy and water.
@@madetoexplore Incorrect, the energy required to heat a 1 litre of water from 0 to 70 degrees is identical to heating 2 litres to 35 degrees. Just mix cold water from the main tank with the hot water for exactly the same result - but we don't need such a large hot tank, which is a deliberate decision by us to save space. The only difference between our systems is the RATIO of water. If I could buy a 95 degrees HWS, it would be even smaller for the same length shower, and consume identical energy. You can experiment with a bucket and thermometer to confirm all this, and it could be a new video where you finally fix your system.
@@madetoexplore I believe whether you're "wasting" energy or not depends on your source. My eventual plan is to use a calorifier and as John said, add cold water to get the temp I want because I will be utilizing heat from the engine which is produced when we drive anyway. This may effect the timing of showers since we won't be doing daily driving but it's definitely an efficient use of energy that would otherwise just be wasted. Also, I understand that the tank will still have "warm" water for up to 6 hours after you drive - too cool to shower but nice for hand/dishwashing.
@@johnleaste828 hey mate looking fitting a 12v 6 litre water heater to my canopy and ridding my joolca off. Can these heaters be hooked up to a water tank part time using a thermostatic valve to mix the water temp. Hook it to my tank under my ute via a pump to the heater when needed, disconnect from water tank when not needed?
If you had a 3k wat inverter what would you think of this one?
It would definitely be better for my system! I’ve always recommended the 3k inverter because the cost increase is very minimal.