Episode 312: Quarterback Outlook with Perk
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ต.ค. 2024
- SI Fan Nation Dolphins Publisher Alain Poupart is joined by South Florida Sun-Sentinel Dolphins writer Chris Perkins to break down the Dolphins quarterback situation, starting obviously with Tua Tagovailoa but also including Mike White and Skylar Thompson, heading into training camp. You can follow Poupart at @PoupartNFL or check out Dolphins coverage at si.com/nfl/dolphins.
With all this negativity on Tua, I kinda wish he pulls a Wilkins and balls out without a contract this year and moves to another team so we can go back to the Hennes and the Culpeppers and Pat Whites. This coming from a Dolphins fan that wants everyone to succeed... Hell, I even rooted for Tannehill when we drafted him.
I would like to see the OL move to the next level. They have a good OL coach so I am hopeful.
Good to see you two again.
We still here 🎉❤
Thank you both
I been wanting this team to draft a qb for the last two seasons and want them to draft one every season from now on no mater who or how good the starting qb is.
I don’t normally defend Tua, but for Hoyer to say he’s a system quarterback…
How many systems did Hoyer really succeed in?
What does that have anything to do with his ability to analyze QBs. Under that premise, we need to also dismiss Orlovsky’s statement that not five QBs can run the offense like Tua.
@@alldolphinspodcastnothing, but on the flip side, calling him a system QB isn't really an "analysis" either. It's a statement that is true for the majority of QBs in the NFL. Sometimes it can be used as a pejorative, but a QBs job first and foremost is to run whatever offensive system is in place at a high level. Besides, the OP has a point since Hoyer mentioned that he played in the same system that Tua plays in. Well, he was a career backup that has a 16-25 record as a stater playing in the QB friendly Shanahan system. For all the natural ability and athleticism Trey Lance has, a 7th round QB was able to overtake him in that system, ultimately ending his tenure in SF.
You know what a system qb is? Tua can only be in one system. He can't adjust and does when the middle and timing are screwed up.. he plays like a back up. Tua doesn't have a strong arm and can't do audibles... just throw to a spot. he is a future back up
@parrott113 since you've already got the answers, what's the use in having a reasonable discussion with you?
Poup you got the introduction right!
The only place I have to disagree with you Poup is about Goff. He MAY be a product of his surroundings, but he did go to a SB with a different team and an NFC championship with his current team. That makes him much better than Tua. Tua has an all-star squad and can’t get out of the WC and can’t win his division when it’s handed to him. Granted, Goff has a good situation, but the QB still has to go do his job and Tua was SO terrible agains KC in the playoff game, it’s laughable that he wants Goff kind of money
Tua literally looked like trash in that playoff game. Looked like he didn’t even belong on the same field as Goff or Jordan Love. There’s no excuse for that if this dude considers himself a franchise QB, deserving “market money”
Did Tua really have “magic” at Alabama?? Everyone references the time that Tua came in for Jaylen Hurts and won the Natty. He didn’t win another Natty with them the whole time he was there bc when the competition gets tough, he disappears! Of course he put up number with Alabama, just like he is with our tailored system. Chris Simms has a QB review of when Tua came out in the draft. He had Tua ranked with 4th in that class. His analysis was so spot on and nothing has changed with Tua since that review. He was in a fortunate situation in Alabama. When I heard we were tanking for him, I went to watch Tua and thought “…we’re tanking for this guy?!”
You still talking crap online...lol.
@@TuatagaloaTeoI see you still are too. 🙄…although I don’t know you.
Chris Simms? Herbert has been a lot less than advertised. Burrow, while excellent has had more injuries than Tua. If Jalen Hurts was in that draft, no way he’s as talented. He has the luxury of a great OLine, and an overall better system. IMO. Their run game is winter ball successful.
Joe Montana was a so called “system QB.” Does that mean he was less than a guy like Josh Allen, who plays his own system. Last I checked……The point is Bill Walsh built his team from the Lines out. A more solidly constructed team than the competition. Not so the Dolphins. The roof and walls are not solid.. lots of flashy players.. but when the wall cracks… as it did last year….?
@@robertjason6885 I don’t know what you’re saying. Your paragraph isn’t coherent.
Again, not a single word from either of them about the o-line. The o-line is key to the progression of Tua and this offense.
That’s why these guys are casuals. Do we all watch the same games lol? Tua will get rocked on almost all his passes if he holds the ball .2 seconds longer. What other QB is surviving behind this OL, let alone succeed? If ur lazy, just watch the first 3 plays on offense vs Dallas and tell me who the problem(s) are. It’s a common thread in all big games. Don’t listen to the morons that wanted tannehill for 7 years. They kept him and want to move on from an actual QB 😂 It’s asinine
The online is key to the QBs personal development?? 🤔 leave it up to TuAnon to jump in the comments to pass the blame for Tua’s lack of development
5th year for Tua.
Chris Grier the Dolphins need to build that FOUNDATION of the offense which is the O-line. For Tua and the offense to progress, they need to better solidify that o-line especially in the interior. The o-line last season had one of the lowest win rate if not the lowest in the NFL. The o-line relied heavily on Tua getting the ball out quickly. Opposing defenses learned that by taking away Tua’s first read, there was a good chance that their defensive front will get to Tua. Can anyone recall a single play last season that you thought Tua had time to go through all of his progressions OR thought that Tua had all day to throw??? Lamar could have had some tea and cookies in the backfield against teams last year especially against the Dolphins. Mahomes too. Good Coaches and organizations know that building that foundation is paramount. Look at Jim Harbaugh, he got Joe Alt with the fifth overall pick because he gets it. Miami hasn’t had a good offensive line since the Marino years and a great offense line since the 1970’s. 2016 had a decent group as well last season’s starting 5.
Thanks Alain great show c u soon ❤
Tua threw 1 TD on a busted coverage at Bama. There was no magic in his 2nd natty appearance. He sucked
we don't have a backup qb, neither White nor Skylar can carry the team...McDaniels hasn't learned that lesson yet.
I usually think you use solid logic but this statement that you want to wait another year to pay Tua and you’ll be happy to pay him even more money if plays well. If Tua plays better this year than last you’re likely making him the highest payed qb in the league probably 10-15 more than you would know. That is a Holland level player that you would be losing out on. Paying a qb who’s answered every question is easy. A 10 year old could do that. It’s Griers job to project what Tua’s worth and pay him a fair price. It’s why he gets payed millions. There is only one qb in the league who has answered every question and that is mahomes. If you’re not comfortable paying him now you’re not going to be comfortable paying more next year no matter what he does this season
🏈🌎📰✊🏾💪🏾🐬
There was magic against the Ravens… Tua gave us one of the greatest 2nd half performances in Dolphins history. The question is… can he give the Dolphins more performances in a similar fashion?
Yes we don’t know about White but we don’t want to find out either.
@Alain Poupart - Can you talk about Mike McDaniel’s play calling ability on one of your upcoming shows? The good, the bad, and the ugly. Much appreciated!
Much better than the other 2 guys...
Poup. I understand your position on Tua. It's one of the few things that I tend to agree with you about. My beef with you here is that you never pose what you think they should do if it's decided that Tua's not the answer. I personally think they should just sign Tua. But short term. Can we have an out after 2 or 3 seasons. Throw out the fifth year. But definitely spend a 2nd or 3rd pick in 2025 on a solid developmental qb to eventually compete.
You are Right Perk and Poup FACTS 💯
Poop,
interesting discussion again on the QB position with the Dolphins.
And although I believe that because of some of those good games he had, they brought in Mike White to be the backup quarterback paying him about I think five million dollars a year, that's not cheap. But to think, though, that he can run this offense and have a high success on the level of Tua, I just think it shows your lack of respect basically for Tua's abilities. And then also your Trevor Lawrence comment, about 'well we don't know what he is, and while I agree with that as well, we don't, but he's still overpaid. You seem more comfortable with paying guys with great athletic talent than what they've shown you on the field, you can't pay a guy up there with Burrow, based upon 'oh, he's got the physical abilities to be great' but he hasn't shown you that he can be great on the field yet. Granted that first year was a wash, but still, if you're a great quarterback, it shows regardless of what your coaching situation is, no excuse for that. Especially if he has all these physical tools that you seem to love to rely on so much in you, giving guys a benefit of a doubt. His stats were God awful as a rookie and nothing spectacular since, yet you defend him getting paid, right up there with Burrow..?
You may say I didn't say that. But you kinda did. Maybe you meant if you had to pay someone that's unproven that kind of money, you'll do so with Lawrence over Tua because you believe his cealng appears to be higher due to his athleticism. You see how scewed your lense is to physical abilities. If Tua had the same meh numbers as Lewrence, you'd already would be saying to yourself, time to move on because of those meh numbers and Tua's non freakishness athleticlly. I just think you put way too much weight on physical abilities and not enough on the intangible things that you can't quantify. And there has been so many quarterbacks that have come through the league that has not been great or Champions regardless of how physically talented they are that it's proven to me it sometimes it has more to do with feel for the game feel for the throw, feel for the pocket, proper footwork that the Penten Mannings, Eli Mannings the Drew Brees the Tom Brady's, Joe Montana, those guys they sensed the game, knew the game, felt the game and how to play the position. That's what made them great, not being freaky athleticlly. They won games with their mind.
If you think throughout history the Ryan Leaf's, Mike Vick, Donovan Mcnabb, Randall Cunningham, Cam Newton, Vince Young, and more recently Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen, Kyler Murry, they're not having success as far as winning championships. Except for Ben Roethlisberger, Steve Young, and now Mahomes to a lesser extent. Most of the championships have been won by non freaky QB's than by freaky athletic quarterbacks. And part of that reason in my opinion is maybe like you, the QB and the teams that has that type of talent rely too much on that freakishly athletic, arm talented QB, than playing more team oriented ball. Like complementing that talent with a good run offense, defense, special teams, like the Cheif's do with Mahomes. Especially last year, when Mahomes was more of a high-end game manager due to his lack of quality receiving weapons.
Tua is Tannehill 2.0
Both have Major Anxiety under Pressure. 2 Minute Left on the Clock, 3 Down with everything on the Line. They Shrink !!!!
That is not true at all.
@@TuatagaloaTeoTua Is not what he is when the Pressure on.... i Love for him to Fix that.
@rapidrecoveryrapidrecovery719 he has it in him...always has...that is how he got famous. He needs to do it and people that know him.... know!
SF went to Super Bowl with Purdy last pick in the draft it’s the system!!!
Skylar time is coming ❤
27:39 27:40 27:41 27:41 27:42 27:42 27:42 27:42 27:43 27:43 27:43 27:43 27:43 27:44
I thought went u serground with your stupid takes...Skylar is #3 and struggling.
I want to see Skylat and White play and split every pre-season game because right now if Tua got injured it's SEASON OVER. Who is really the true playable back up quarterback on this team. Both McDaniels and Tua don't give me alot of confidence at this point this has to be a break out season for both of them.!!!!!
Every single QB has a system Taylor made for them. You are suppose to create a system based on your QB’s strengths. It’s such a dumb thing to continue saying.
Philbin may not have been a great head coach, but the dude could spot a candy wrapper from 50 yds away. Eyes like an eagle....
There are a couple UFL quarterbacks that will get looks.
Hat tip to Mr. Poupart for the excellent youtube intro
I don't see Tua's ceiling as taking you to a Super Bowl, unfortunately. I would let the 5th year option play out 🤔
There is a lot he can improve on, his filed vision , the deep ball, his mobility , grit etc , I dont think hes reached his cieling , I belive he can grow more, Brees came into his own around year 4 , this is technically Tuas 3rd year at best , first year a wash never should have played , second year Flores handcuffed etc , give him least one more year and I believe people will be shocked
Thank you thank you thank you Alan and company for speaking the damn truth. The eye test for Tua is So crap. He is NOT ELITE! shit he doesn't even own the division. I haven't seen him uplift anybody and keep arguing that with reason who stats Tua uplifted dvp, giseski ,Michael Perry etc etc... I'm sorry, I would Not pay Tua either. 5th yr option all day long. Not worth 40 million. We seen all we can see with him. Imagine without reek and waddle. How would Tua look😂
Okay, so we’ve brought in a new coach and a bunch of players to complement what Tua does well and then we don’t lock him up to maintain that investment? Apologies but the cost for a good starting quarterback is to set a new cost. Blame Cleveland. Blame the Giants. Blame Jacksonville. But the market, is the market.
Yeah I don't get this Tua should take less or doesn't deserve BS. He delt with more adversity than any other QB still producing a winning record. Ridiculous
@@LKS-M9323 not to mention but it needs to be mentioned, Tua is a great face of the organization. Good kids. Stays outta trouble. Family oriented. If you want someone to represent the organization’s ethos and help increase its valuation, Tua makes sense. Sign the guy before the market resets again.
I get that and I like Tua but this system is qb friendly. Something I have been saying since Mike Shanahan was in San Francisco. If league catch when and more qb’s play in this system. The qb market will go down bc of it.
@@Bobby-gk3nk so is Lamar. The system is designed for a running qb, not a drop back, quick decision qb. So too Buffalo. Every good offense plays to their QBs strengths. If they don’t, you get dysfunction. How many reporters thought Mac Jones was the next Brady? Better than Tua. Perfect location and coach. Dud. Tua is a QB that plugs in the hole. We have a QB we can built with. Pay now before the market resets.
Don’t even sweat it and mark my words they will sign Tua. Otherwise everything they’ve done this offseason is wasted.
If Skylar can be swamped for a 6th or 7th, still a good pick.
Negative Nancy x2
If I’m Tua…my back hurts and all of my passes will be off. This management sucks. If you don’t want to pay him…trade him. I play at the tune of my worth. Let Ross tamper away. The market is the market.😂 No freebees. You get EXACTLY what you pay for. They don’t want to get an offensive line for the man to shine. The coach can’t even get the plays in on time consistently!!!
The market is the market 💰🚫🥋🧔🏾🤡🗑🚮
No extension
I always agree with poup but today I disagree when he said Tua is better the Goff in absolutely no aspect! Is he better then Goff
You don't need all the pieces, you need to change the qb and get a QB who can threaten a defense with running and escaping blitzes and pass rushes. Tua is really good, he just isn't great because of arm talent. Marino could slide but he has an arm that could throw it accurately deep under duress. Tua does not have the arm strength. When he gets in trouble its either a sack, poor throw or an interception.
Poup u come off as a tua hater, he got big because the noise was loud had 2 check that box the yr before he was performing like himself... he just got injured but every qb get injured give him a chance
Do these clowns understand that Tua was coming of a career ending dislocated hip the first 2 seasons in an unfriendly situation.
So you are saying Tua is not a top 5 draft pick? He should have went 2nd round. Explain Tua's stats vs the good teams and how come he always gets shut down .. down the stretch.
You are CRAZY. Tua hasn’t improved since his rookie year and Mike White can lead the team to a similar record?!? I hope Tua demands a trade and balls out somewhere else and Mike White tanks this team and makes Tyreek demand a trade as a result
I want him here at San Francisco
So now you don’t pay a QB unless they’re a HOF QB? This discussion about Tua being paid is so dumb, Tua was right when he said the Market is the Market, he is in the same pay bracket as Goff, Lawrence, Burrow, Hurts, it is what it is
Allen I love everything you ever put out but I have to disagree not everyone can do this offense. Also you don’t value the qb quick delivery enough which is also quick thinking. It’s Brady esc and without that he doesn’t win a majority of his rings imo.
And that semi, Omar Kelly eyeroll when it came down to paying Goff, and the subsequent comment that anybody can run that offense with that type of talent on his team, is extremely dismissive and disrespectful to what Goff, has accomplished over there in Detroit. Maybe you're right others can run that offense but that's just speculation and it's not necessarily true that anyone can run it to his success level, you may say they can run it better, but they also could run it worse. The FACT is that they have someone playing at a high level with that offense and they're not willing to take the risk of bringing in someone that may or may not be able to run that offense as well as Goff has so far. It's easy for us at home playing NFL TH-cam GM to speculate on these things where real team GM's have to go with what's actually working‼️Think about it. Do you really think it would be prudent to say, you know what, lets stand our ground now and risk this window of opportunity to fix what's not broken. Can you imagine what would happen if you brought in someone, YOU THINK, can run that offense because of your belief that Goff isn't worth the money the market requires you pay a franchise QB, only to discover the guy you brought in in his place, can't run the offense, but now your season is over⁉️
Now is not the time to take that chance Poop. Not for Detroit, and not for Miami.
This is why Miami ultimately will pay Tua in my opinion because they aren't willing to take that risk either. There's speculation and then there facts. Teams go with facts most of the time vs speculation. That's why you pay market Value for good QB play. And because these windows of opportunities are that rare. Think about the injuries that happened to Miami last year. A injury to Gibbs or La Porta or both can close that window very quickly‼️So hold your nose, close your eyes and pay the price but don't forget to keep one eye open occasionally to see what happens.😂😅🫣
Put our back up QB Skylar in the game against teams we play in the cold Tua can't win in the cold
MIAMI....... Fuck around and find out.
First
For the record fellas: Tua has zero playoff victories.
He Only Played In One Dumb Take
For the Record Tua Shrinks in Big Games.
@@rapidrecoveryrapidrecovery7197 Lamar Herbert Allen Trevor And More
@@FranklynStubbs that's even worse
@@FranklynStubbs…and looked like he was Skylar’s back up. “…the market is the market”. 🙄 not for QBs that can’t even compete against good teams! He thinks teams are just rolling out dough just bc he’s the next QB up for a contract extension?? That’s like me trying to sell my son’s 2006 Mazda 6 for $45,000 dollars today.
Hardison will beat out Skylar for the QB 3 spot.
At some point we have to just look at what Tua has delt with what he's overcome and what he still needs to work on. But to highlight the scheme as a reason for his production to me is just unfair and lazy. There's a bit of merit to it but to say he shouldn't get this or that based on that is ridiculous. Other coaches don't get highlighted for their scheme. Like Patrick Mahomes doesn't get any pull back having Andy Reid as his coach. So to me, doing it to Tua is simply a desperate reach for a reason to not give him the bag.
Please read the following story and come back and tell me if you still think the scheme shouldn't be a factor at all in the decision-making process. www.si.com/nfl/dolphins/news/addressing-the-biggest-tua-question-of-all-01j21y40rs7j
@alldolphinspodcast Great article. It was a good read with good info. Hopefully more people read and it can spark dialog that can create different perspectives. I've said the scheme thing has some merit, but I think it's overblown. I also think the QBs listed are actually good QBs who benifited from the scheme as well as competency around them overall. Let's not forget Jimmy G was pretty good in NE for his short time there. Also if we allow that argume, t then where does it stop?. Would that then mean any QB under those coaches shouldn't get the bag simply because they are utilizing the scheme . Also what would be the criteria be for a QB under those coaches to qualify for the bag without any real push back?
Tell us a game to watch where tua balled out against a winning team.... Ill wait. In fact, tell us a game where he did even decent against a winng team last year... Ill wait.... Oh , thats because it doesnt exist.
Tua is a good QB but he's far from elite.... He doesn't deserve 1 cent more than Baker Mayfield
remove waddle and tyreek... what is Tua? Mediocre at best.
You are my # 1 Fins Podcast, but sometimes I get so frustrated wanting to have a VERBAL conversation with you. I can make a comment, you and your guest can disagree for 5 minutes and I have no rebuttal time. Be the first podcast to have some "real fans" on ..maybe a fun roundtable, something......Oh, FinFan since 1968, seen it all.
this is Finfan in Bills Territory, had wrong sign in
WHY are you guys so apologetic to speak the truth about Tua. He fuccin sucks in the big games point blank. Stop being scared of tuanon
No matter what TUA does you both will fined negative thing 👎👎👎👎👎 really not like this podcast anymore.i have been watch from day one every episode but it's taken a really negative and only looking for negative
No one is hating….you have to do the eye test. He is good but not great. If Miami get rid of Tua and get another qb and the same results happen then you will be looking crazy. This system they run is a qb friendly system. Look at the qb’s in San Fran that succeed. And none of them are great just good.
@@Bobby-gk3nk if Miami get ride of TUA we will spend the next 20 years looking for another TUA.. I have followed this team since the early seventies people need to start supporting TUA and wake up
Weren’t the dolphins top 3 in scoring offense?
@Bobby-gk3nk
The problem is there aren't that manny great QB'S in the league. Right now there only one, Mahomes. That's it. So while you're wating on a savoir your teams window of opportunity is closing. Your anything can happen opportunity is closing.
Stop allowing your search for the great to cause you to take for granted the very good.
The two biggest Tua haters on the Internet. Lol.
Weak minded response
I believe in Skylar Thompson 🫡
Noone else that matters does...he is 3rd on the chart.
Aren’t you tired of repeating the same stats about Tua over and over and over again come up with some new material