I experimented a lot with making dyes from indigo, cochineal, madder etc about 25 years ago for my spinning, dyeing and weaving projects. I'm now a watercolour artist and paint maker so these experiments are really fascinating. Thanks so much, fantastic videos
Could you help me determine why the cochineal that I ground up turned into more of a paste than a powder and what be done, if anything? @LoisDavidsonArt
If I remember any of my chemistry major stuff from half a lifetime ago, sodium carbonate is even more alkaline than bicarb. If you lost the purple tone after using tartarate (acidic), then the persistent purplishness of your second extraction might be due to the fact that you added a relatively small amount of acid to a reasonably alkaline solution. The tartarate was likely neutralized by the abundant carbonate before it even got a chance to interact with the cochineal. I think you might consider adding acid first, since it appears to have a greater effect on color tone, eliminating purple before pushing red past sanguine and into brown, and using your basic reactant (carbonate) both to create the lake, but also to stop the acidic reaction and preserve your color of choice.
Another option might be to make the "body" (AlCO3 or AlOH or CaSO4 or whatever your transluscent lake crystal is) of the pigment separately, and then sort of soaking it in the dye version of the colorant. I had no luck making weld lake specifically trying to form the body in situ like "normal" until I looked up an old winsor newton industrial recipe where they did it this way and it worked great. So I think it's an option to always consider any time that the pH or chemistry of that part of the process might conflict with the dye.
I am so happy you are doing this cochineal series. I am a violin maker in Cremona and i have been trying to make pigment out of it for the last year, with mixed results (it is thought that it is the pigment that Stradivari chose for coloring his varnish). I agree with a previous comment that it is very ph sensitive (tilting the ph higher makes it go truly purple). I am really looking forward to the follow up videos on this, keep up the great work! Cheers
You can buy that pigment pre-made. It’s called Carmine Naccarat. Kremer pigments make it from cochineal and alum. It’s an exact match for historic Crimson Lake.
Awesome start to the carmine experiments! I have been hoping you would play with this process (I've been considering getting some of those bugs for my own attempts) and you are very thorough in your approach; it is so appreciated. Keep up the great work!
I think I died a little every time that beaker overflowed. I certainly shouted "no" when the big chunk of foam just slid down into the puddle 😅 I'd love to know where you got the beetles from. I've been searching for a source and haven't found one that has stock/ships to Australia yet.
Now I'm curious if the process of using carmine in cosmetics (any non-vegan red, lipstick, eye shadow, blush etc.) is similar to this... Thank you for documenting your experiments like this!
Just found your channel. I live in the Arizona desert and have access to this beetle. In fact it's on some of my cactus. Years ago I scraped some off and added to a small container. I'm a soap maker and wanted to see if I could use it in soap coloring. It only say for a few days and the smell was so horrible I tossed it out. But mine was freshly squeezed bettles. And I now know that I needed a preservative....
Fascinating process. Can't wait to see the resulting pigments in binders. I previously bought the Bersch book after seeing one of your videos. It's very niche, but incredibly useful. Big thanks for all your videos, but is there any chance of stereo rather than mono sound in part 2? My laptop speakers are weak even at full volume.
a tiny bit of defoamer should do the trick, if you have frothing/foaming issues I am more into organic chemistry (e.g. azo dyes such as indigo carmine), but like to watch your videos, it's a different perspective, often inspiring
This isn't a question specifically about this particular video, but I'm hoping that you'll see it and respond. Could you tell me how you found your granite mortar? I'm trying everywhere to find a larger sized one to use as a muller as I've seen others using. I have several glass ones, but am really interested in finding a heavy, tall dark granite one. Thank you so much. -Jason
You are amazing! It is an inspirational job. I can't supply cochineal but There was some kind of oak beetle in the Mediterranean region where I live. This insect has been used in Anatolia for many years to obtain red dye. There are two types of Mediterranean oak, one has an oak gall and the other has a cochinal. I'm waiting for the picking season. I will try with this type too. Who knows, maybe I can hit it. If I can succeed, I will send it to you.
hey Us sign painters have not been able to do our jobs proper since they took our lead and mercury, how do we pigment clear enamel or varnish? Have you tried this with your lead pigments? What do we do, 3 coats on a pinstripe aint gonna cut it, and the art is coming back in demand! HELP!
Wow so insightful! Did I understand correctly that the first filtered liquid in the dish is the one you wanted to continue watching for some days? What happened with it?
Hi! In which proportions are your Sodium Carbonate/Water solutions usually made? As for me I tend to process by volume with roughly 10% of crystals for 90% water. Thanks a lot! :-) Gauthier
I experimented a lot with making dyes from indigo, cochineal, madder etc about 25 years ago for my spinning, dyeing and weaving projects. I'm now a watercolour artist and paint maker so these experiments are really fascinating. Thanks so much, fantastic videos
Could you help me determine why the cochineal that I ground up turned into more of a paste than a powder and what be done, if anything? @LoisDavidsonArt
If I remember any of my chemistry major stuff from half a lifetime ago, sodium carbonate is even more alkaline than bicarb. If you lost the purple tone after using tartarate (acidic), then the persistent purplishness of your second extraction might be due to the fact that you added a relatively small amount of acid to a reasonably alkaline solution. The tartarate was likely neutralized by the abundant carbonate before it even got a chance to interact with the cochineal. I think you might consider adding acid first, since it appears to have a greater effect on color tone, eliminating purple before pushing red past sanguine and into brown, and using your basic reactant (carbonate) both to create the lake, but also to stop the acidic reaction and preserve your color of choice.
Another option might be to make the "body" (AlCO3 or AlOH or CaSO4 or whatever your transluscent lake crystal is) of the pigment separately, and then sort of soaking it in the dye version of the colorant. I had no luck making weld lake specifically trying to form the body in situ like "normal" until I looked up an old winsor newton industrial recipe where they did it this way and it worked great. So I think it's an option to always consider any time that the pH or chemistry of that part of the process might conflict with the dye.
I am so happy you are doing this cochineal series. I am a violin maker in Cremona and i have been trying to make pigment out of it for the last year, with mixed results (it is thought that it is the pigment that Stradivari chose for coloring his varnish). I agree with a previous comment that it is very ph sensitive (tilting the ph higher makes it go truly purple). I am really looking forward to the follow up videos on this, keep up the great work! Cheers
Hello friend, were you successful? Cheers @juanugon1259
Spray bottle with water and light mist over foam downs it in seconds. Nice job great to see your work.
Whoo!!! I don't know anything about making carmine lakes!!! Amazing stuff!!!
You can buy that pigment pre-made. It’s called Carmine Naccarat. Kremer pigments make it from cochineal and alum. It’s an exact match for historic Crimson Lake.
Awesome start to the carmine experiments! I have been hoping you would play with this process (I've been considering getting some of those bugs for my own attempts) and you are very thorough in your approach; it is so appreciated. Keep up the great work!
Mind expanding on the Joseph Birch book?
Joseph birch has a book from the 19th century on the manufacture of a number of pigments. Its an invaluable research for pigment making.
There is nothing quite like the smell of boiling cochineal, it defies description
absolutely
I think I died a little every time that beaker overflowed. I certainly shouted "no" when the big chunk of foam just slid down into the puddle 😅
I'd love to know where you got the beetles from. I've been searching for a source and haven't found one that has stock/ships to Australia yet.
www.kraftkolour.net.au/cochineal-bugs
The mortar is the bowl, and the pestle is the pounding 'stick' 😊
🔥
Will we ever get an update on how these pigments turned out?
Now I'm curious if the process of using carmine in cosmetics (any non-vegan red, lipstick, eye shadow, blush etc.) is similar to this... Thank you for documenting your experiments like this!
Just found your channel. I live in the Arizona desert and have access to this beetle. In fact it's on some of my cactus. Years ago I scraped some off and added to a small container. I'm a soap maker and wanted to see if I could use it in soap coloring. It only say for a few days and the smell was so horrible I tossed it out. But mine was freshly squeezed bettles. And I now know that I needed a preservative....
Fascinating process. Can't wait to see the resulting pigments in binders. I previously bought the Bersch book after seeing one of your videos. It's very niche, but incredibly useful. Big thanks for all your videos, but is there any chance of stereo rather than mono sound in part 2? My laptop speakers are weak even at full volume.
a tiny bit of defoamer should do the trick, if you have frothing/foaming issues
I am more into organic chemistry (e.g. azo dyes such as indigo carmine), but like to watch your videos, it's a different perspective, often inspiring
THIS IS AMAZING
Wow!!! Again a great video!!! 😍😍😍
Excellent pigment good luck friend! Thank you!
I'm sorry, but, I can't help laughing at the strange berry soda that resulted from the foaming. It is certainly a lovely color.
+1 for an update 🖐 don’t loose the inertia ;)
Welp, time to hoarding dead bugs
*starts swatting and collecting flies and mosquitoes bodies*
This isn't a question specifically about this particular video, but I'm hoping that you'll see it and respond. Could you tell me how you found your granite mortar? I'm trying everywhere to find a larger sized one to use as a muller as I've seen others using. I have several glass ones, but am really interested in finding a heavy, tall dark granite one. Thank you so much. -Jason
thank you for this im so happy ive found your channel. Can you please tell me the name of this book and spelling of the authors name please?
You are amazing! It is an inspirational job. I can't supply cochineal but There was some kind of oak beetle in the Mediterranean region where I live. This insect has been used in Anatolia for many years to obtain red dye. There are two types of Mediterranean oak, one has an oak gall and the other has a cochinal. I'm waiting for the picking season. I will try with this type too. Who knows, maybe I can hit it. If I can succeed, I will send it to you.
hey Us sign painters have not been able to do our jobs proper since they took our lead and mercury, how do we pigment clear enamel or varnish? Have you tried this with your lead pigments? What do we do, 3 coats on a pinstripe aint gonna cut it, and the art is coming back in demand! HELP!
Wow so insightful! Did I understand correctly that the first filtered liquid in the dish is the one you wanted to continue watching for some days? What happened with it?
What is the name of book by Birch you are getting the recipes from?
What are the dimensions (cm) of your granite mortar? I can't find it in my city.
I wonder if we can make pigment from dragon blood resin? Can friends who know about this subject share?
What's the alum for?
What is the soda solution?
Hi! In which proportions are your Sodium Carbonate/Water solutions usually made?
As for me I tend to process by volume with roughly 10% of crystals for 90% water.
Thanks a lot! :-)
Gauthier
What is the title of the book you reference??
I suspect it would have been much easier if you'd wet the bugs before grinding them?
Can someone name the exact title and author of the book used here? Thx
I saw once that you have a book with these recipes for making paint pigments. What is the name and author of that book?
I just found it. It is called “The Manufacture of Mineral and Lake Pigments” by Josef Bersch
@@brenmatthews8491 Thank you so much for finding that book name for me.
Any updates on this process? I love your videos. Merry Christmas.
Soon I am just getting the channel back up and running.
Hellooo! Love your channel and your colour work and teaching! Where can I find that book please?!
I just found it. It is called “The Manufacture of Mineral and Lake Pigments” by Josef Bersch
Ph sensitive.
Comments for the algorithm
@NileRed