When it comes to Bird's influences, his mentor Buster Smith is probably the most important. The legacy is very obvious - and they even say, that in Jay McShann's band, it would sometimes be difficult to tell which of them were playing, if you were not looking
Can’t forget how groundbreaking Eddie Lang was as well. He basically is a big part of the reason for guitar replacing banjo in pop music (via Bing Crosby, as well as the possibly hundreds of recordings he appeared on). As far as I know, his style was unheard of at the time. His duets with Joe Venuti also apparently had a big influence on Django Reinhardt, which kinda goes into what you were talking about with influences of influences.
Great video! Love reading about these earlier players. Jimmy Dorsey was a monster alto player, and Johnny Dodds too. I have a bunch of books and saxophone studies from the 30s, by Ben Glassman, Benny Carter etc. All these great melodies by players that preceded Hodges, Buster Smith, Bird etc. There must be so many unrecorded masters from back then.
I once got into an online argument with a person who thought I was insulting the memory of Lester Young by noting that he acknowledged Frank Trumbauer as his main influence. The person said I should get together "a hundred skilled saxophonists" to talk about Lester Young and see if any of them mentioned Trumbauer. "I don't need 'a hundred skilled saxophonists' to tell me whether Frank Trumbauer influenced Lester Young," I replied, "I just need one - Lester Young."
Came across this by chance and it's nice to learn a bit more about Tram's playing! Want to mention that Tram used Alto mouthpieces with his C Melody which attributes to his sound on the recordings you showed. You can see both his C Melody and his mouthpieces at our museum. I would like suggest Don Murray as a potential lesser known influence on the early jazz world to look into due to his untimely death cutting his career short just as it was hitting off.
Oh thanks for that info on the mouthpiece and I'll definitely check out Don Murray! Great to see you have a museum dedicated to the earliest of jazz pioneers, lovely
@@SharpElevenMusic Always good to find people bringing awareness to the early jazz pioneers! You can hear Don on many famous Goldkette recordings with Tram and Bix. Although most known for clarinet, he was a good sax player as well.
Let me know guys, was this analysis anything helpful? To me it was at least clear there are some idiomatic origins starting there at Trumbauers fingers, even the groundworks perhaps t o bebop. But I'm ok if you think that to be too far-fetched. Have to thank Prez for sending me to Frankie Trumbauer, I do enjoy his light saxophone style of playing. Here are some links to dive deeper, here is the one of the double tonguing MRI scan: th-cam.com/video/MWcOwgWsPHA/w-d-xo.html Here you can find our Ebooks and video lesson packs diving deeper on improvisation and soloing (and saxophone and guitar too): www.sharpelevenmusic.com/store NEW! You can take lessons straight with me through a-synchronous video lessons here at XIP: xip.co/x/jorre-reynders And if you like that full "Trumbology" transcription: th-cam.com/video/G_2w5_BAvJ0/w-d-xo.html
I think you should have talked a lot more about phrasing, dynamics, slurring etc. I think the phrase you've analysed in this video is similar to bebop merely by chance. That does not take away from your point of bebop lines having been around in bebop, just less frequently used. Many thanks for making this video!
Hi Ernst, thanks for your thoughtful comment. I see what you're saying about the phrasing and expressions used by Trumbauer. This video's goal was actually to draw a recognisable parallel to something most jazz musicians of today could relate to, which is bebop idiom. Not to diminish all the other parameters that make Trumbauer so extraordinary, but I didn't think a lot of people would practically start using the rag/swing kind of straight swing for example, that has gone long out of fashion. And perhaps I made myself guilty of the tendency of jazz musicians to overly focus on the harmonic content over other parameters
When it comes to Bird's influences, his mentor Buster Smith is probably the most important.
The legacy is very obvious - and they even say, that in Jay McShann's band, it would sometimes be difficult to tell which of them were playing, if you were not looking
Another major influence on Parker was tenor saxist Leon "Chu" Berry. In fact Parker named his son after him.
I’m really glad you’re doing this series Jorre. Excellent work.
Thanks Lucas!
Interesting stuff. Well researched. Thanks.
Can’t forget how groundbreaking Eddie Lang was as well. He basically is a big part of the reason for guitar replacing banjo in pop music (via Bing Crosby, as well as the possibly hundreds of recordings he appeared on). As far as I know, his style was unheard of at the time. His duets with Joe Venuti also apparently had a big influence on Django Reinhardt, which kinda goes into what you were talking about with influences of influences.
Great video! Love reading about these earlier players. Jimmy Dorsey was a monster alto player, and Johnny Dodds too. I have a bunch of books and saxophone studies from the 30s, by Ben Glassman, Benny Carter etc. All these great melodies by players that preceded Hodges, Buster Smith, Bird etc. There must be so many unrecorded masters from back then.
My favorite unsung cat is warne marsh! Great player overlooked by most
You're absolutely right Konrad! Glad you remind me of his playing, I used to dig him but lost track of his music
One of my favorite players, he’s not well known enough
I once got into an online argument with a person who thought I was insulting the memory of Lester Young by noting that he acknowledged Frank Trumbauer as his main influence. The person said I should get together "a hundred skilled saxophonists" to talk about Lester Young and see if any of them mentioned Trumbauer. "I don't need 'a hundred skilled saxophonists' to tell me whether Frank Trumbauer influenced Lester Young," I replied, "I just need one - Lester Young."
Lester Young said so himself and is on record of having done so.
Came across this by chance and it's nice to learn a bit more about Tram's playing! Want to mention that Tram used Alto mouthpieces with his C Melody which attributes to his sound on the recordings you showed. You can see both his C Melody and his mouthpieces at our museum.
I would like suggest Don Murray as a potential lesser known influence on the early jazz world to look into due to his untimely death cutting his career short just as it was hitting off.
Oh thanks for that info on the mouthpiece and I'll definitely check out Don Murray!
Great to see you have a museum dedicated to the earliest of jazz pioneers, lovely
@@SharpElevenMusic Always good to find people bringing awareness to the early jazz pioneers! You can hear Don on many famous Goldkette recordings with Tram and Bix. Although most known for clarinet, he was a good sax player as well.
Loved this
Let me know guys, was this analysis anything helpful? To me it was at least clear there are some idiomatic origins starting there at Trumbauers fingers, even the groundworks perhaps t o bebop. But I'm ok if you think that to be too far-fetched. Have to thank Prez for sending me to Frankie Trumbauer, I do enjoy his light saxophone style of playing.
Here are some links to dive deeper, here is the one of the double tonguing MRI scan: th-cam.com/video/MWcOwgWsPHA/w-d-xo.html
Here you can find our Ebooks and video lesson packs diving deeper on improvisation and soloing (and saxophone and guitar too): www.sharpelevenmusic.com/store
NEW! You can take lessons straight with me through a-synchronous video lessons here at XIP: xip.co/x/jorre-reynders
And if you like that full "Trumbology" transcription: th-cam.com/video/G_2w5_BAvJ0/w-d-xo.html
Wonderful. I want to check out the Patreon subscriptions! BTW, what font and notation are you using? Thank you!
Thanks! I'm using Finale 2010 with the Handengraved font
I was his girl friend and I can confirm he had a very fast tongue.
Great work man
Thanks Nick!
the dominant bebop scale was also used by Johnny Dodds. Bebop scales are actually just a terrible misconception
A lot of Tram's most famous solos were played on alto, not 'C' Melody.
I think you should have talked a lot more about phrasing, dynamics, slurring etc.
I think the phrase you've analysed in this video is similar to bebop merely by chance.
That does not take away from your point of bebop lines having been around in bebop, just less frequently used.
Many thanks for making this video!
Hi Ernst, thanks for your thoughtful comment. I see what you're saying about the phrasing and expressions used by Trumbauer. This video's goal was actually to draw a recognisable parallel to something most jazz musicians of today could relate to, which is bebop idiom.
Not to diminish all the other parameters that make Trumbauer so extraordinary, but I didn't think a lot of people would practically start using the rag/swing kind of straight swing for example, that has gone long out of fashion.
And perhaps I made myself guilty of the tendency of jazz musicians to overly focus on the harmonic content over other parameters
Thanks for telling this to the people! Tram deserves a definitely bigger place in jazz players' mind (and Heart!!) !!! 🎶
Thanks for your analysis! I had C-melody sax for a few years, so that's why your video was especially interesting for me 🔥👍🙏
Ah, very cool! The sound of these are so unique
Interesting, do more of them 👍🏻
Kenny G? Jazz?
Lew Tabackin
Kenny G my god 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Deze gast is toch een Nederlander?
Bijna Roderick... ;) Vlaming, maar speel wel in best wat Nederlandse bands en vaak in Nederland