Signs of the Last Days
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 17 ต.ค. 2024
- The Bible is clear that there will be certain signs that take place during the last days. However, the signs described are different in the passages that take place at the Rapture and at the Second Coming. At the Rapture, no signs must first take place. At the Second Coming, there will be many. In this session, guests Dr. Renald Showers and Dr. Jimmy DeYoung along with Dr. John Ankerberg look at the fifth difference between these two events-a difference between the number of signs that are given for each event-and why this difference matters.
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Eternity is A Very long time. I Don't want to Gain the whole World and Lose my soul! Praise The Lord.
Wow, I can’t believe this video was recommended to me today. I used to watch the show many years ago and remember Jimmy. RIP Jimmy
Praise God let us keep each other in prayer....
Greg Boardman Band : Amen, I agree. 7/29/17.
Trust in the LORD with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding.
Yes, very true!
I like Jimmy DeYoung, he always seems to knowledge & full of hope.
+Art Lover And very professional. The gentlemen featured on this show are learned men who have done extensive research and they back what they say with scripture. Some of the other so-called prophecy channels look like 3 ring circus' compared to this channel.
+Art Lover Not to mention full of lies. Where in Zechariah 14 does it say that Jesus or Christians come out of heaven to the Mt of Olives? The guy sits there, looks at the camera, and claims that the Bible SAYS this. It doesn't SAY that anywhere!!!!
Excellent contents! Thank you very much.
Love this ! Wake up world and listen ! In the words of Pastor John Hagee go back to the Bible ! Do you know what the word bible stands for ? Basic instrctions before leaving earth ! Think about it !!!!!
Tony, Jesus is already sitting on David's throne right now! Acts 15:13-21, Acts 2:29-36, Zechariah 6:12-13, Isaiah 16:5 and 9:7 and Psalm 89:3-4. Happy reading of God's Holy Word.
+PATRICK SHETLER AMEN!!!!
Patrick,
Um no David's throne is in Jerusalem israel on earth
This show was broadcast in 2014? Then, how CLOSE are we really, it's 7/29/17 at the time of me writing this comment. Hey, I've been waiting since 1973 when I first heard of the RAPTURE. What keep me going is the scripture that says that GOD IS NOT SLACK CONCERNING HIS PROMISE BUT IS LONGSUFFERING, NOT WILLING THAT ANY PERISH. The children of Israel "waited" 400 years before being DELIVERED from Egypt and IT DID HAPPEN BUT ACCORDING TO "GOD's TIMING" and that's the key words, according to GOD's TIMING. THY will be done, GOD, on earth as it is IN HEAVEN. It's about our LORD and not about us. Let's continue to PERSEVERE, go forth and be found FAITHFUL so whenever HE comes, we will be found WAITNG, WATCHING & WORKING ( occupying) til HE calls us. GOD BLESS YOU, SAINTS.
@4 ever This doesn't make any sense at all. The "last days" are just what they say...the last days. There is no meaning to the words if you apply them as you do here.
Jada Parks wait for gods time
God waits till all Repent the day only he knows you be ready for him
These shows are always good and I would expect no less from a ministry based in the great state of Tennessee !!...The discussions I have with people, shows to me great ignorance of Paul's letters. Why is this the case, when out of the whole Bible they are the very ones addressed TO THE CHURCH !!.....ie..."To the Church in Rome"...To the Church in Corinth".....and so on.....amazing !! Romans thru Thessalonians reveals the information and secrets behind the "Great Mystery" as mentioned in Romans 16:25. I am here to tell you, 95% of evangelical Christians do not even know what the Great Mystery is !! It has been sitting in your Bible for about 2000 years, yet your Sunday School teachers don't teach you about it...astounding !!! To understand Rapture doctrine crisply, you must grasp the Great Mystery folks......The Mystery time- bloc of grace was inserted in- between 2 Law time periods. It started on the Day of Pentecost circa 31 AD and will end with the imminent Rapture.....100's of verses fall into place when you understand what this is all about. The Pan- Hellenic athletic games of Corinth ended with a 'trumpet' blast....a RANDOM trumpet sound, and it meant the games were OVER. The last trumpet sound of 1st Thessalonians chapter 4 has NOTHING to do with the Feast of Trumpets, but everything to do with the Grace time- bloc...the Grace administration...the Grace dispensation...ceasing... and the believers DEPARTING for home...home in heaven, having been gathered together....(2nd Thessalonians chapter 2)
+Lonnie Christopher The Church was prophesied in old testament Jer 31:31¶
Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a NEW covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:Jer 31:33
But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.ze 36:26
A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. Eze 36:27
And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.Isa 59:21
As for me, this is my covenant with them, saith the LORD; My spirit that is upon thee, and my words which I have put in thy mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the LORD, from henceforth and for ever.Gen 17:7
And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.
Great teaching
Titus 2:13, you are decieved if you don't believe in the exit ressurrection or rapture. 1Thessalonians4 : 13 - 18 & 1Corinthians15 : 51-53 & John14 : 1-6.
Pre-trib exit ressurrection or Annastasis in the original language of the NT.
Wrong. The previous Temples were/are in the City of David. See the book, Temple. They have found Solomon's Temple. Herod's was completely destroyed. The Temple can be built at any time. The book has so many proofs that it is really indisputable.
very good I like jimmy DeYoung
I think the abomination of desolation is Al-Aqsa mosque on the temple mount.
+Medicint20 The thought has crossed my mind too, but when you read Daniel 12:11 and what Jesus said in Matt. 24:15, it can't be the Al-Aqsa. Daniel 12:11 is an amazingly specific prophecy, and says that from the time of the abomination of desolation, you can simply start marking off your calendar to the final consummation of all things, 1,290 days later. This abomination marks the sign of Jesus' second coming here on earth and standing on the Mount of Olives. :)
If the rapture is post trib, there would be no one left to replenish the earth. No one left to rule over. Why do you guys not point that out?
Maude White they do point this fact out in another video I just don't remember specifically which one I have been watching them all day while painting lol
I no Lord God is true so I don't have to say no more ! 😇🙏
The Old Testament does indeed predict a third temple, a messianic one. But the requirement is that it must be built "without hands" It must use the stone that the builders rejected. Mark 14:68.
I enjoy watching your show! I've been up against some 'hard nuts to crack' to convince some people that a rapture and second coming will occur.
The more i try to understand the more i feel lost, Holy Spirit please lead me into all truth, is there really a difference between the second coming and rapture
Mpho Machialwe you feel lost because they are lying to you, the Bible is just a book...an idol that is the mark of the beast King James and it is being used to destroy many, we are to follow the Spirit. God sent the Son who gave the Spirit not a book!
+A Voice why would you say this to her. the bible is for us to fome closer to Jesus. please keep your thoughts and ideas to yourself.
keep reading the bible. i find praying before reading helps. and it you dont understand the Holy Spirit will reveal what you need to know at the right point of your life. attend bible studies and there are alot of people that ask the same questions on google. im praying for you
Based on your response you are a bible worshipper. You do not worship the Creator who made everything. The real Jesus does not live in a book he lives in the invisible spirit realm. Keep your deception out of this.
Sister Mpho
The reason we've all been confused precious sister is because the doctrine of the rapture and the visible second coming is false doctrine generated by the Dispensational tele evangelists, and book writers. Hal and Pat and Jack and John etc. Christ's return was in judgment of Old Covenant Israel.
In Daniel 9:24 the phrase “makes an end of sin” is a gross mistranslation. The Hebrew word for sin there is khat-taw-aw and is translated 116 times in the Old Test. as “sin offering.” The correct translation should read “make an end of sin offering.” In Dan. 9: 27 the word “he shall cause the “sacrifice” to cease is the word “zeh-bakh” and means “slaughter, flesh of an animal, blood sacrifice.
So tell me, when did the animal sacrificial system stop in Jerusalem? When was the last time that animals were sacrificed by Jewish Priests in a Temple in Jerusalem? So they ended when? And why I now ask you did God stop them and how did He stop them.
The gap theory was created by the Zionist plot to rob Christ of His atonement replacing the Old Covenant with the New. One perfect sacrifice bringing now forgiveness to all who believe it. Jesus said, “Matthew 21:19 (KJV)
19 Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for ever. And presently the fig tree withered away.
Israel the vineyard of the Lord (Isaiah 5, Matt. 21) had received God’s personal gardening without fruit long enough and the time of judgment had come and was announced by Messiah Himself. The day the Temple is rebuilt will be the day Christ is shown a false prophet, and that’s not going to happen. Go online and read what happened in 363 AD. When Emperor Julian allowed the Jews to try and rebuild the Temple.
Rearrange one verse and see how clear Daniel 9 becomes:
Daniel 9:25-27 (KJV)
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate. and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Have you noticed when you read Revelation it starts out with Christ's clear statement it was for "things which must shortly come to pass," and then He repeats Himself in vs 3 and says to John, 'don't seal these words because THE TIME IS AT HAND. Have you noticed how we read over that in our minds because we've all been programmed by the doctrine of "futurism." Read the last chapter in Revelation, and try and read the words like you had never read them before, go slow and think of each word, and notice how Christ emphasized the time frame as "quickly, soon, and at hand, and notice how many times the Spirit mentions 'the words of the BOOK." Give Christ's words pre-eminence over the doctrine we've all been taught and watch how the words become clear. The book of the Revelation is about the wrath of the Lamb upon those who murdered Him. It was to be histories all time warning that if God would bring the apocalypse on His own people for rejecting Him then we better not do the same.
God bless and open your eyes with fresh anointing.
Brother Lee
Deyoung agrees with John MacAurther that during the tribulation, one can take the mark of the beast and still be saved. That is a lie.
One of the signs is that the children of Israel will wake up in the land of their enemies and remembering their selfs!
Im watching this a year after it was made. This war of Gog and Magog is now about to happen!! Its all in the news...The Most High is here!!!
Amen ~ Awesome video thanks for sharing. I believe in the Pre-Rapture of the church as well. Why would God's wrath be against his own children?
Exactly...and why would be caught up in the air and come right back down again
kwadwo bediakoPa, to answer your question; please read John 14:1-3
PATRICK SHETLER Patrick - Your question was: "Why would His wrath fall on Israel in 2015-2040?" The wrath will not fall on Israel specifically. It will fall on those which are not saved; That is to say those who have not accepted the Lord Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior. That includes all people of the world as God's grace is available to all. Even during the great tribulation, which will come after the rapture, 144,000 of Christ's followers will be saved (Revelation 7:3-4). Make no mistake about it my friend, the Father's will- will be be done on earth as it is in heaven.
Your comments regarding "no future tribulation and things getting better instead of worse," are not scriptural based. It is merely based on a man's human emotion or thinking. These things must come to pass before Jesus's reign here on earth. The book of Revelation is quite clear on this.
You mentioned, "Better yet how about the advancement of God's kingdom on the earth." I agree! We, believers in Christ Jesus, are his body and it is our responsibility to continue to spread the good news of the Kingdom of God. It is not God's will that even one should perish but have eternal life; It's the primary reason he gave his only begotten son. This is the importance of spreading the good news.
I urge anyone who may be reading this post to accept the Lord Christ Jesus and their personal Lord and Savior. Surrender your life to him in order that you may not be eternally separated from God. For not by our works have we been saved but by god's unfailing love and grace. Amen!
Orlando X ORLANDO we of coarse agree on the soteriiological issues of salvation by grace through faith in Christ alone. Blessings, thank you - for your response. Interested on your take of Matthew 23:33-39 due to postponement eschatology my thought was that the generation mentioned here would not be the 70 AD generation as in the preterist system but the tribulation generation. Right or wrong assumption?
PATRICK SHETLER Patrick - It is important to note that the book of revelation should be approached
with a futuristic perspective, as it was intended to be read. It is the most accurate interpretation.
As I read Mathew 23:33-39, I conceive Jesus was speaking of the generation of religious law teachers and the pharisees of the day, which were the official interpreters of the Law of Moses. I don't consider a preterist approach to be entirely invalid regarding this passage. We can see in verse 36 of chapter 23 where Jesus states, "I tell you the truth, this judgment will fall on this very generation." We skip down to verse 38 and 39 of the same chapter and we can see Jesus stated, "Now now look, your house is abandoned and desolate. For I tell you this, you will never see me again until you say, 'Blessings on the one who comes in the name of the Lord!'" And of course we know the temple was destroyed in 70AD.
We can be sure Patrick, that Christ's warnings to those present day religious leaders and pharisees can be applied to our generation and the generation that will endure the great tribulation. For we know from scripture that our heavenly Father is consistent and always keeps his promises. As the apostle Paul states, we are called to have a "clear conscious, a pure heart and genuine faith." We are not to be Hypocrites.
In light of my perspective, what do you think?
Please come Lord Jesus
What, in my opinion, our brother gets wrong:1. Jesus does come in the air for His elect, but then takes us all with Him, (after being gathered by the angels), to the Mount of Olives in Jerusalem since He comes with all of His holy ones (Zech. 14). 2. Christ does take His believers to be with Him, but He uses the angles to gather them. Brother John says the angels gather the wicked, but Matt. 24 does not say this, but His elect. Actually, Matt 13 says the angels gather the wicked and it is not clear how these two happen.3. Same as above, admittedly not clear how the two work together, but possibly the angels gather the wicked as they die in seals, trumpets and bowls of wrath. Then the righteous are gathered at the 2nd coming, the rapture.4. No scripture in context ever shows Jesus coming for His people before the Tribulation. At best one can say some are spared of trials since they keep the word of His perseverance. That does not equate to Him coming two times.5. Not all signs are given in each passage dealing with the subject. Paul makes it clear we will not be gathered unto Him unless the apostasy happen first, and the Lawless one be revealed.6. Where does it say Jesus can come at any moment? It does not say that. It says after certain things happen, then after that it could happen at any moment from the viewpoint of those not watching. We, however, are watching and that day will not overtake us like a thief. Just because He is standing at the door, does not mean He can come at any moment. He is at the door waiting for the right time to come in. 1 Jn. says to abide in Him so when He comes we will not be ashamed, still does not mean nothing has to happen first before He comes. Finally, if the writers of the NT had two separate comings in mind they sure were bad communicators.
Your teaching truly blesses me, but i have to disagree with your sweeping statement that 'The entire African continent is at war' Absolutely not true!
Your teaching truly blesses me, but i have to disagree with your sweeping statement that 'The entire African continent is at war'. Absolutely not true!
NOT once in the books for the body of Christ ( Romans 11 - Philemon) do I see us referred to as an army. Are these angles, like the 2 in the tumb when Jesus was resurrected? Go to Lonnie Martin on TH-cam to rightly divide God's Holy Word and please let me know if we are in error.
Debbie,
Nope rev 19 7 9 shows us in heaven as wife we are given fine Lenin white and clean because the fine linen is the righteousness of the saints, .
Rev 19 14 shows us on white horses still dressed in fine Lenin white and clean. Angel's dont need to ride horses. Look at mathew 25 31
All those signs as you say have happened.
I will always support the Jewish tribes ❤❤❤
question please many so call prophets from god says that jesus appeared to them saying that there are no rupture that the church will go tru tribulation// and as we know as christians belivers paul makes it so clear that we wil b cup up unto god before that.....so they teling us in revalation 13 where says who are those saits that are killed by the antichrst
His is sound doctrine. The Rapture. John 14 1cor 15 1 thess 4.2 coming zech 14 mathew 24. luke 21 and Jude.rev19.its so clear they are not the same event.
The show opens with the guest rattling off disjointed "proof texts" from various parts of scripture. Never gives a detailed exegesis of any of them. Totally unconvincing.
He can come at anytime? God is not a person imo I believe God is all of us and he makes things happend through us. We will never see him but will see his actions
The Great Harlot is not the Roman Catholic Church, in the Old Testament the Harlot is Israel who committed spiritual adultery against the LORD. The emphasis of the New Testament is upon the end of the Old Covenant and the gentile expansion of the kingdom which had as one of its goal making Jews jealous, thus leading them to repentance. This is why St. Peter was given the keys to the kingdom of heaven. He was the one who opened the gate of the New Jerusalem to the gentiles.
I am amazed that you can write off 500 million Catholics who love Jesus. I hope you are never my judge, jury, and executioner as you clearly do not believe in due process or any sense of justice.
+PATRICK SHETLER Again you are absolutely correct, although I don't think the Roman Catholic Church denomination is correct about many things. Your statements about the Harlot are spot on. Scripture agrees with scripture - no other entity was called a harlot by God except apostate Israel.
You might want to read zachariah 13 8 9 and Roman's 11 along with Isaiah 11 11 12 Isaiah 66 7 8, Ezekiel 36 20 40, deuteronomy 7 6 8 Jeremiah 31 35 37, Ezekiel 38 and 39
also in revelation i thing 6 where says keep u faithfull and i will keep u from temtation or else i will take your name from the book of life...i thing revalation is not talking to us the church,,,this is 1 more question for u
he who actually follows Jesus commands will be saved. he who follows mans commands shall stay. he who reads and truly loves God will see that scriptures are coming true. there shall be a one world religion, not by god but done by man. The AntiChrist . he shall deceive many plus come in peace and many will worship him. Right now they are talking about a one world order and religion, that alone should scare all because the bible is coming true. many people, religions shall follow the deceiver... and go against the true Christians for not following the False Prophets, Doctrines which will be the opposite of scriptures.
This show is totally unconvincing to anyone who has not accepted the dispensational system. Daniel 9:24-27 is not correctly interpreted and no exegesis is supplied to support a 2,000 year gap between the 69 and 70th week. No exegesis is supplied of Revelation 20:4-6. Ankerberg is acting as if dispensationalism is the only evangelical/protestant view in the modern world and as if the bulk of modern scholarship on these subjects does not exist. Arguing one side of a controversial and hotly contested issue is not fair and its not scholarship, it certainly is not an open discussion.
Even you post tribers put a 2000 year gap in there. You just do it with 3.5 years left which is not biblical. It clearly shows that after 69 weeks of years the Messiah is cut off. He can not all of a sudden come back to life live 3.5 years then die agian. Because that's basically what your saying. It says after 69 weeks the Messiah will be cut off. After he is cut off there is still one week left. The prince spoken of in verse 27 is not the Messiah he is not anointed. The prince in verse 27 is the anti christ. It is he who stops sacrifice 3.5 years into Daniels 70th week it is he who destruction is poured out on. Most all of you post tribers say jesus stopped sacrifice. This is not true. It was never Jesus intent to stop sacrifice in fact there will be sacrifice during the milenium kingdom. In order to understand end time events you have to look at scripture from a Jewish prospective. Alter all 64 of the 66 books of the bible was written by Jewish men.
Tony Eaton No the prince of verse 27 is the historic figure Titus who was to become emperor of Rome. It was policy of Rome to desecrate temples and terrorize their enemies. The believed in peace through power. Which is the philosophy of empire. Rome truly was a beast and the kingdom of God ultimately destroyed her as well but not with the sword victory through the gospel.
Tony Eaton So your biblical and anyone who disagrees with your interpretation is not biblical. Tony, everyone in this argument is taking Scripture seriously. No one's commitment to the Bible is in question. I seriously disagree with you and your interpretation of the Bible. I give more weight to the New Testament. Your theology is already set before Jesus comes and the NT authors speak. However my theology is also based on the OT. The OT points to Christ through types and shadows. You want to undo the gospel and return to them after the rapture. That interpretation makes no sense to me and those who hold to historic reformed covenant eschatology. Your entitled to your opinion, but don't act like you are the only opinion out there. If I was doing a show on this subject knowing it to be controversial I would have the best and brightest of both sides present so that the audience could come to an informed opinion on this important subject.
+PATRICK SHETLER All dispies have to act like there is no other view. They will never debate anyone, they will never produce any more than 1 or 2 responses to any single point a non-dispie makes. Why? Because they don't have the Bible on their side. They have a house of cards strung together with bubblegum and tape. And it's sad, too, because as more time passes and modern Israel continues to just be another country, those who use the May 1948 event as the basis for their belief in the Bible are going to see their world come crashing down. Not to mention the faith of many who listened to them.
The fact of the matter is, dispensationalism is a nice story, comfortable and reassuring to a western person. They do not WANT the truth, in the end. They want their fantasy which helps them escape the evils of the world without having to actually DO anything about them.
PATRICK SHETLER the reason we disagree is because you don't know what the purpose of Daniels 70th week is about and the fact that you follow the Roman Catholic churches doctrine of replacement theology.
Jesus' parable of the wheat and the tares totally refutes the rapture theory. God will never leave the earth to the wicked. He made that promise when he said: "The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever." (Ps 37:29). In the parable of the wheat and the tares, the tares are removed first and thrown to the fire to be burned then the wheat are harvested to join the Lord in heaven.
Martin Aquiles PenacoHello my friend,
When my Lord spoke of weed parable he was referring to the time after the tribulation period. This is true because when he explains the parable to his disciples he says "the harvest is the end of the world." Mathew 13:39
We know that from the supporting verses in this video that the Lord will spare us(his children) from the wrath to come.
"The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever." (Ps 37:29) Of course this is true my friend but it takes place after the tribulation period when the new heaven, new world and new Jerusalem are created.
Feel free to revisit John 14:3
Orlando X The period covered by the parable of the wheat and the tares includes the tribulation period, not just after. We know this because Jesus and his disciples began preaching and planting the gospel long before the tribulation period. The Christians escaped the Great Tribulation exactly as Jesus had warned they must do (Mat 24:16). While tens of thousands of Jews perished, none of the Christians was harmed. They were already in the mountains when the Roman army came to destroy the holy temple and killed thousands of Jews in AD 70. The tribulation period is a past event, not future.
John 14:3 is not about the Great Tribulation. It's Jesus telling his disciples about preparing a place in heaven for them.
My friend, the Holy temple was destroyed in the year 70AD and the New Testament was written between the years 70AD-75AD. The book of Revelation in particular was written around the year 95AD.
Your statement about the Christians escaping the tribulation exactly as Jesus had warned they must do (Mat 24:16) was true. This was not the great tribulation though. There has been tribulation among God's people since he created us as scripture indicates, but the great tribulation of the book of Revelation has not occurred.
In Mathew 24:35 Jesus states, "Heaven and earth will disappear, but my words will never disappear. So if your statement is correct, that the "great tribulation has already occurred," then why how is heaven and earth still here? What about the new Jeruselam and the sea being gone(Rev. 21:1-2)? What about verse Rev. 21:3 which says "I heard a loud shout from the throne saying, 'Look God's home is now among his people! He will live with them and they will be his people. God himself will live with them.'"
It appears you are are choosing take a Preterist approach to the book of Revelation which is a literal approach. This approach is flawed because it cannot answer the question I asked above.
In addition, read Revelation 20:1-3 and answer this question if you would please. If the great tribulation has already occurred as you stated; then when was the thousand years of peace? If possible give me a thousand-year time frame, that you know of, when Satan did not deceive the nations.
And remember my friend, Revelation 19:10 tells us that Jesus Christ is the spirit of prophecy. Chapter 1:1 of Revelation says "this is the revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants the events that must take place soon." Keep in mind, scripture tells us that 1 year is like a thousand years to our Lord and a thousand years is like a year to him. The words spoken in the book of Revelation are God's words which he gave to his son, then Jesus delegated those words to his angels for John to write them down on the island of Patmos. How blessed we are to have God's word. Amen
Orlando X My friend, I think you are mistaken about the date of Revelation's writing. From Revelation's own witness, it seems improbable that the vision came to John after AD70. First, we know that the temple was still standing when John received the vision (Rev 11:1-2). Second, John was addressing his prophecy to 7 specific churches that existed at that time. These 7 churches were located in Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamom, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia and Laodicea. Third, John specifically warned his audience that the events in the prophecy were to take place shortly and that the time was near. (Rev 1:1, 22:6). Finally, John was specifically warned not to seal up the words of the prophecy for the time was near (Rev 22:10). Compare that to the instruction given to Daniel in Dan 12:4. Here, Daniel was instructed to seal up the words of the scroll for the time of it's happening was still far into the future. All these passages will not make any sense if the prophecy came to John in AD 95. Tthere would been no temple to measure; no 7 churches to talk about, the warning about events soon to take place and that the time is near becomes meaningless and the urgency not to seal up prophecy becomes baseless.
Orlando X Jesus' warning to flee to the mountains was made precisely because of the soon to come great tribulation. Here's how Jesus put it:
“Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand), “then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. Let him who is on the housetop not go down to take anything out of his house. And let him who is in the field not go back to get his clothes. But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be." (Matthew 24:15-21).
The great tribulation is definitely a past event. It occurred immediately after the Christians had fled to the mountains, exactly according to Jesus' warning.
Zecaraih 14:4 says on that day....Not at the second coming.
If you continue to read verse five says he returns with his saints that doesnt happen till the second coming
Nineveh is a broken promise by extreme literalism. God clearly says Nineveh will be destroyed in 40 days. Only answer is to look at book from the point of view of literary analysis.
The real sign of Christ's second coming is when the world comes under the virtual influence of the Gospel. We know this from Jesus' kingdom parables (mustard seed, the yeast). Over time, the power of the Gospel takes control of peoples' lives and one by one, the vestiges of Satan's control falls to the Christians. "For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet." (1 Cor. 15:25)
Martin Aquiles Penaco Hello Martin - I hope you are in good spirits my friend. It has been quite busy for me but I was eager to pick up our conversation.
Lets begin with the parable of the mustard seed in chapter 4 of Mark verse 30-34. In these verses He is describing the Kingdom of god. Likewise verses 26-29 of the same chapter describe the Kingdom of God as well. As I have re-read some of your prior posts, it has been even more transparent to me that you have made a mistake that many people make and that is to take some verses out of context.
Let me explain: At the end of your reply located above, you finished off with 1 Corinthians 15:25. This verse has nothing to do with the parable of the mustard seed my friend. Jesus is not reigning at this time. He simply came to plant the seed of the Kingdom of God in people's hearts here on Earth. Jesus will reign when he returns here on earth (1 Corinthians 15:23-25).
Let me explain another example; if I recall correctly, you attempted to refer Mark 3:20-27 to Revelation 20:1-3. This is clearly a mistake Martin. Just revisit Mark 3:20 where the gospel states "Jessus entered a house." After the teachers of religious law entered the house they accused Jesus of being possessed by Satan(Mark 3:22). It says 'Jesus entered a house." This is to be taken literal as Jesus entered many houses and cast out demons. It is an absolute mistake to refer this verse to Revelation 20 when an angel comes down to bind Satan for the thousand years and throw Him into the bottomless pit so he cannot deceive the nations anymore. Jesus entered many house and tied Satan up and plundered his goods. That is to say "cast out demons." Because "his goods" refers to the people possessed by demons.
I once asked to you to explain your logic about Satan being tied up at this very moment. My question to you was that if he was tied up now, how could he deceive the nations which he is clearly doing to this day. You replied that he uses his "minions" to carry out his work. This is totally non-scriptural my firend. If Satan is bound how can he use demons to posses people or deceive nations.
Revelation 20:3 states Satan will not deceive the nations during this 1000 year time frame. My friend, as I have stated before, just look outside of your home or turn on the news and we can see that Satan is rampant even today.
Lets revisit 1 Corinthians 15:25. I want to look at this verse in light of your belief that Jesus is currently reigning. Keep in mind that the word reign is defined as the period during which a person or monarch is sovereign. Please read verses 20-26. Verse 23 and 24 says "but there is an order to this resurrection: Christ was raised as the first of the harvest, then all who belong to Christ will be raised when He comes back. After that the end will come when He will turn the Kingdom over to God the Father, having destroyed every ruler and authority and power." Then in verse 25 talks about His reign and humbling his enemies. From these verses alone Martin, it is crystal clear that His reign will not start until He returns. So lets look at the verses again and see what we have.... "When He comes back the dead will be raised".... "having destroyed every ruler and authority and power".... turn the Kingdom over to God the Father".... notice that verse 25 of chapter 15 comes after these verses I have stated.
You might say that, this simply will happen after he finishes His current reign but this cannot be. He is not reigning at this time. How do we know? The dead have not been raised and Satan is still deceiving the nations at this very moment. When Jesus came the first time it was to plant the seed of the Kingdom of God (Mark 4:30-31). As always my friend, I look forward to hearing from you.
Orlando X Hello Orlando, my basis for saying that Jesus reign already began at his first coming is this passage of the Bible:
"Then Jesus entered a house, and again a crowd gathered,T)" data-cr="#cen-NIV-24309T" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;"> so that he and his disciples were not even able to eat.U)" data-cr="#cen-NIV-24309U" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;"> 21 When his familyb]" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;">[b] heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, “He is out of his mind.”22 And the teachers of the law who came down from JerusalemW)" data-cr="#cen-NIV-24311W" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;"> said, “He is possessed by Beelzebul!X)" data-cr="#cen-NIV-24311X" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;"> By the prince of demons he is driving out demons.”Y)" data-cr="#cen-NIV-24311Y" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;">23 So Jesus called them over to him and began to speak to them in parables:Z)" data-cr="#cen-NIV-24312Z" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;">“How can SatanAA)" data-cr="#cen-NIV-24312AA" style="box-sizing: border-box; font-size: 0.625em; line-height: 22px; position: relative; vertical-align: top; top: 0px;"> drive out Satan? 24 If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. 25 If a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. 26 And if Satan opposes himself and is divided, he cannot stand; his end has come. 27 In fact, no one can enter a strong man’s house without first tying him up. Then he can plunder the strong man’s house." Mark 3:20-27.Orlando, if Jesus simply came to plant the seed of the Kingdom of God in people's hearts here on Earth, then why was he driving out demons? Why was he destroying the works of the devil (1 John 3:8) if all he came for was plant the seed of the Kingdom in peoples' hearts? And how could Jesus have driven away those demons without first tying up the strongman? Paul said that Jesus has disarmed principalities and powers. Who did he disarm if he was not reigning?You claimed the Mustard Seed parable has nothing to do with 1 Cor 15:25 but without providing the basis for your assertion. You simply asserted without biblical support that Jesus is not reigning at this time. But from the words of John, Paul and Jesus himself, it is clear that Jesus was already reigning when he first came. The Gospel would not have survived the onslaught of Satan's forces if Jesus did not bind Satan and drove out demons. But we know Jesus' reign as King of kings started at his ministry here on earth because he himself commanded his apostles to go and make disciples of all the nations and that he was with them the whole time.May God bless you my friend.
Martin Aquiles Penaco Martin -
You asked: "if Jesus simply came to plant the seed of the Kingdom of God in people's hearts here on Earth, then why was he driving out demons? Simply said, he cast out demons to save life and his good deeds brought glory to our heavenly Father. Let me offer the following verses:
- He gave his life to free us from every kind of sin, to cleanse us, and
to make us his very own people, totally committed to doing good deeds. Titus 2:14
- In the same way, let your good deeds shine out for all to see, so that everyone will praise your heavenly Father. Mathew 5:16
- Then he turned to his critics and asked, “Does the law permit good deeds on the Sabbath, or is it a day for doing evil? Is this a day to save life or to destroy it?” But they wouldn’t answer him. Mark 3:4
- Now someone may argue, “Some people have faith; others have good deeds.” But I say, “How can you show me your faith if you don’t have good deeds? I will show you my faith by my good deeds.” James 2:18
You asked: "Why was he destroying the works of the devil (1 John 3:8) if all he came for was plant the seed of the Kingdom in peoples' hearts?" This was not the only reason He came my friend. He also came to demonstrate God's mighty power, bring glory to the Father and do whatever the Father required of Him. Let me offer the following:
- Jesus cut him short. “Be quiet! Come out of the man,” he ordered. At that, the evil spirit screamed, threw the man into a convulsion, and then came out of him. Amazement gripped the audience, and they began to discuss what had happened. “What sort of new teaching is this?” they asked excitedly. “It has such authority! Even evil spirits obey his orders!” The news about Jesus spread quickly throughout the entire region of Galilee. (Mark 1:25-28)
- Give the people of Sidon this message from the Sovereign Lord: “I am your enemy, O Sidon, and I will reveal my glory by what I do to you. When I bring judgment against you and reveal my holiness among you, everyone watching will know that I am the Lord. (Ezekiel 28:22)
- Jesus said: "Father, bring glory to your name.” Then a voice spoke from heaven, saying, “I have already brought glory to my name, and I will do so again.” (John 12:28)
But I will do what the Father requires of me, so that the world will know that I love the Father. Come, let’s be going. (John 14:31)
- When you produce much fruit, you are my true disciples. This brings great glory to my Father. (John 15:8)
You also asked: "And how could Jesus have driven away those demons without first tying up the strongman? Paul said that Jesus has disarmed principalities and powers. Who did he disarm if he was not reigning?
As you are aware Martin, Jesus disarmed Satan. Jesus tied up the strong man(Satan) when He entered the house referred to in Mark 3:20. When Jesus used the illustration, it was relevant because He had just entered a house and was casting out demons as the crowds continued to gather. If we just read Mark 3:20-27 it becomes clear that he was speaking about any specific house, place, or person that was driven by Satan. It was not a coincidence that he had just entered a house Martin. The Scriptures are very clear and many times, very specific.
So let's, just for a minute, forget about the physical house Jesus had recently entered. And let's look at a specific individual that the demon was being cast out. If a demon is in possession of a human's body, would you not agree that it is the demon's house or temple or domain? In the same way, our bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 6:19).
So when Jesus cast out demons he first tied up Satan at that very moment and then cast out the demon. Let me offer this verse as an example of Satan being tied up: Mark 1:25 says - Jesus cut him short. “Be quiet! Come out of the man,” he ordered. Martin, this verse alone demonstrates His power over Satan, principalities, powers and all things.
Again, I believe the mistake you are making is attempting to relate Revelation chapter 20 with Mark Chapter 3:20-27. So I don not believe the issue is whether Jesus can tie up Satan because we know that God's power is sovereign, but the issue is in your timing of the two passages. Jesus was speaking about that very specific house he was in and the human body that the demon made his domain in.
When Jesus returns He will tie up Satan for the thousand years and reign for those thousand years. Then He will let him lose for a season.
We are living in clay toe smashing time.
Nowhere in Zechariah 14 does it say that either Jesus or the Christians come back down from heaven to step down on the mount of Olives.
MeatTheBible that's funny. The fact remains...and it is an indisputable fact...Zech 14 doesn't say anything about Jesus or anybody coming down to earth out of heaven. So the very idea that a person like this pastor who is supposedly learned in the scriptures, would claim that this passage SAYS this, means he is either deliberately lying or just uneducated.
MeatTheBible // no place in the word of God will you find a verse that says we leave earth AFTER Jesus returns.//
I have never said this.
//Nor will you find 3 advents of Christ.//
I have never said this.
//He returns to earth and the believers in heaven return with Him.//
No, Jesus never said this, Paul never said this, John never said this. And the only place that anyone other than "angels" are described as "coming with Christ" is in Jude - and the word Jude uses is the same word for both angels or saints.
At the second coming of Christ, He returns to earth and the believers on earth (and resurrected from the grave) go to meet Him in the clouds and escort Him back to earth where we will live forever.
//All you need to is read friend.//
That's all I am doing, is reading. It's you that wants to argue that Zechariah says something that it doesn't say.
//Make ready for the Tribulation.//
Why? How?
//Don't be a FOOLISH virgin.//
What's this mean?
MeatTheBible Zech says He will stand on the Mt of Olives. Not land. Not come down from heaven to stand.
MeatTheBible I appreciate your heart to reach people. I wish more people had your heart. But we should be ready to withstand tribulation at any time. Not some made-up "7 year great tribulation" where Satan runs a one-world government and one religion. It isn't in the Bible. It's only in the imaginations of some men. Somehow it has taken hold in people as if the Bible teaches it verbatim.
The Bible never says there will be a 7 year tribulation. Jesus defeated Satan at the cross and the Old Covenant has been replaced with the new and better one. That's what the Bible actually SAYS.
MeatTheBible The thing is, we need to read what scripture says first. Not what man says scripture means. You are assuming that what other people have taught you is what it means.
I encourage you to look at it for YOURSELF and really try to understand it. Don't take the easy way out.
If I could have just one thing stick in your mind, it would be this:
JESUS is the king of the world, the planet earth, right now. Today. He reigns over all. And He will win in the end. Satan is not running things and he will never run things. Hold fast to that. JESUS is the winner...He is winning now....and He will ultimately be victorious over all of His (and our) enemies including death.
GINOLJC, the second coming is the same as the gathering of the church, which is what the apostle points out in1 Thessalonians 4:16 "For the Lord himself shall "descend" from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: . the keyword here is "descend". which is, G2597 καταβαίνω katabaino (ka-ta-ɓai'-nō) v. 1. to walk down. 2. to descend. 3. to drop down. 4. to step down.
literally or figuratively from G2596 and the base of G93
KJV: come (get, go, step) down, fall (down)
the revelation is in the base of this word which is, G939 βάσις basis (ɓa'-sis) n.
1. a pace (“base”).
2. (by implication) *the foot*.
[from βαίνω baino “to walk”]
KJV: foot
which means our Lord's feet will touch down on the Mount of Olivet first. then, then, verse 17 "Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord". the scripture never said that we will meet the Lord on his descent from heaven to earth in the air. but we will encounter him in the clouds, as he lifts us up above the earth. I believe the experts need to look at that word "descend", again. for a descend is not a midway stopping point, his feet will touch the Mt first then gather his, and lift them up. for he is our ARK of safety.
in conclusion, the Lord will descend all the way to earth first, and put down all rule, and lift, or G726 ἁρπάζω harpazo his elect above the earth in the air for the destricution of the wicked. just as he did in the days of Norah. he swept away the wicked from under the feet of the righteous, by lifting up the ark in the air. for he is our ARK of safety.
No to 2 way solution.
UPLOADED FEBRUARY 18 2014
WATCHING APRIL 20 2017
AND THE WORLD KEEPS GETTING WORSE BUT YET WERE TO WATCH DAY AND NIGHT NO ROOM TO LIVE CAUSE THE WORLD IS EVIL SO WE SIT AND WATCH FOREVER AND EVER AND EVER. WAITING SINCE 1970!!!
23rd of september I'll be laughing in a bar
People have been strung along with the '' last days '' nonsense ever since religion came on the scene . The only people that believe in the last days or the ones that want it to happen , just like the way '' miracles '' show people what they want to believe .
Peggy Tagata Say what ?
So by your words that must mean the people who do not believe in the last days must be the ones who are afraid of what will happen to THEM if the others are correct!
Donna Castel I'll let the record speak for itself as far as predictions of such things like '' the'' last days'' and returning '' messiahs '' . The Hindus have been CORRECT waiting 10,000 yrs.for their risen messiah , Krishna , to return '' any day now '' , the Jews nave been CORRECT waiting 5000 yrs '' any day now'' for their messiah to show up and the Christians have been CORRECT waiting 2000 yrs " any day now '' for the End Times and for the return of their messiah , Jesus Christ, to return .
I'm afraid your chances of seeing your Jesus returning and your End Times are about as good as you being hit by the Good Year Blimp .
***** I've been hearing and have been ''warned '' about the " last days " for almost 60 yrs. now and my grandparents told me they heard it from their grandparents, so I guess it's any day now, right ?
sorry but this is false.. 2nd comin and the rapture is one the same not separate....sorry
+Lex Luther
The teaching is correct. The two events are not the same.
these old guys will not see this in their lifetime. Just like they did not see people saying this in 1980. :-) go and live your life. Your welcome.
John you know your fulfilling bible prophecy dont you?
Tony, your lack of respect for people different from you...what kind of Christianity creates that mindset and accepts those pre-suppostions? Answer? Dispensationalism. The average Roman Catholic priest has encylopedic knowledge of Scripture, backgrounds in Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek, and Latin. Not to mention church history and tradition. Their seminary training is extensive. This pope has all that plus a kind and gentle Spirit filled with compassion for the poor. Here is the problem with your eschatology, it justifies calling good people bad--it justifies ultra conservative politics in the name of the Lord, and that my friend is heresy. Don't call evil good, and good evil in God's name. This is why Jesus called down the woes against Israel in Matthew 22. The worse kind of bigotry always uses religion to make it feel good.
+PATRICK SHETLER Although I am not RCC, I think you are spot on. All good comes from God. Truth can be spoken by anyone. And dispensationalism is the bane of Christianity today. I hope it dies a quick death.
Everything that Jesus prophesied in Matthew 24 until verse 33 already happened IN HIS generation according to Jesus himself. We know this because in verse 34 he caps all these signs with these words:
"Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled."
And then he proceeded to answer the apostles' question about his second coming:
" But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only." (Matthew 24:36)
The events enumerated by Jesus from verse 1 through 33 of Matthew 24 were the events that signaled God's coming in judgement against apostate Israel for killing the prophets, for fornicating with pagan nations and for murdering the Son of God. It was a dramatic judgement that culminated in the destruction of the holy temple in Jerusalem in AD 70.
This interpretation harmonizes well with Nebuchadnessar's dream of the tree that was cut down in the book of Daniel and the vision given to John in the book of Revelation. The chosen nation Israel was represented by the tree that reaches to the heavens because of God's protection. But because of its sins, God judged it and decided to cut it down by using the Roman army to destroy the temple and kill hundreds of thousands of the chosen people. This was the dramatic event in the years leading to the the AD 70 destruction of the temple. In Daniel, while the prophecy was sealed, in Revelation the same prophecy was revealed and John was specifically warned not to seal the prophecy of the book as the events therein was about to be fulfilled. Daniel's prophecy, Jesus' olivet discrouse and the book of Revelation all pertain to the same event - God's judgement upon Israel and the birth of the Church.
Could the generation he his talking about be simply a reference TO THE GENERATION HE IS TALKING ABOUT? I am just wondering . Trying to learn all I can on a subject of much controversy.
Donna Castel The bible makes more sense if you interpret Jesus' words this way.
Can you tell me when did anyone sit in the temple of God and proclaim he was god? As far as I can see this has not happened yet.
Martin Aquiles Penaco Absolutely right Martin. The bulk of historic Christian scholarship agrees with you.
Tony Eaton Read Josephus the historian. The Romans desecrated the temple before destroying it. The General Titus offered a sacrifice to Jupiter. The Roman Emperor was worshiped as God. Titus later became emperor. In fact all the titles ascribed to Jesus were titles used by Rome for the emperor. Including King of Kings and Lord of Lords.
Oh boy, unreal..... some of you still believe in this false non biblical doctrine????? Tsk...
Fantactic that people spend so much time on stuff like this. I guess they make a living. Why dont these people get a proper job?
The so-called "rapture" and the second coming are one and the same event. When Jesus returns, everyone will be changed "in the twinkling of an eye". The dead will rise and join the living to face the final judgement.
The tribulation is a past event. There is no such thing as "7-year tribulation" in our future. The punishment that God unleashed on apostate Israel in the first century of the Church was described as "The great tribulation" in Scriptures because of its magnitude and significance to the plan of God. God's people that was once the tree that reaches to the heavens was cut-off from the Kingdom and utterly destroyed. And upon its root, the church was built.
Can you tell me when the 70th week of Daniel took place?
Tony Eaton Easy between 30-70 AD with special emphasis upon 661/2-70 AD. The famous Jewish War the singly most important event in world history. Why because Jesus predicted it, and his apostles taught it. No destruction of the temple in 70 AD and Christianity falls flat on its face and Jesus is called a false prophet and false messiah. A biblical generation is 40 years. 30 plus 40 equals 70. This event is the most important Christian evangelistic and apologetic tool available to the church today. It is provable historic fact. There is no postponement. That is dispensational invention that has no creedal support in church history.
PATRICK SHETLER Great answer Patrick.
Tony Eaton right after the 69th. There is no allowance exegetically for a 2000 gap this is why the majority of Christians around the world don't support this view. It is very much an American "escapist" theology.
Of all prophecy was fulfilled in 70 ad. Who were the 144000 Jewish men?