Was I Wrong? I Revisit Porsche's 991.1 Generation 911
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ส.ค. 2024
- In today's video, I drive an extremely orange 991.1 Porsche 911 Carrera 4S. The last time I drove a 991.1 that wasn't a GT3, I was left bitterly disappointed - will this have me feeling the same way, or was I too harsh on the old car?
#Porsche #911 #991
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991.1 is the best non-gt3 911 of the last 20 years.
I think the 991.1 is underrated, sounds phenomenal, normally aspirated, lighter than the 997, my c2s is listed T 1415 kg, I have paddles and find the gearbox intuitive in auto and quick in manual, had a 997 but haven’t driven one for years so steering feel is fine (my is a late 991.1 so perhaps improved), agree about price mine is at Alexander’s Prestige SOR for £77k!!
Yeah but the steering feedback is shit. The new electric rack is wank. Hate it compared to the 997
A 991 S beats 997 gt3 Nurburgring time
End of discussion
Driving 991.1 since 8 years I cannot even understand that you did not like it in the first place. It drives magnificent. The interior is by far the best looking 911 up until now and you can even see the reference to the Carrera GT. All in all it is awesome and I find it hard to imagine any new one will ever merge looks and emotion of the 911 in a better way! Cheers!
The 3.8 DFI engine is pure science fiction.
That thing is butter smooth, even at 5000 rpm. And then it's all eargasm all the way to 7500 rpm. And then you have the PDK reading your mind.
@@mro9466 Well said!!
@@mro9466 honestly the 3.4 and 2.7 have the same experience just much less torque. BEAUTIFUL sounding and feeling engines
The 991 got a lot of stick when new, and the steering just isn't *quite* as good as it should have been, or as it was
@@JayEmmOnCars Have you ever driven one with GT3 steering remap? Its pretty popular on 991 and 981 forums, but I never tried it myself as you need the dealership software
One of the best generations 911🤩
idk this is probably the best 911 to own longterm. No turbos, the 9A1 engine is dead reliable and the chassis changes to the 991.1 and 981 are super solid feeling and the car rides wonderfully. I have a 981 and adore it
I own a 991.1 2S and love it. A common upgrade which my car has is the GTSteering wheel with the metal paddle shifters. Cost to upgrade is only £1k including fitting.
Values have softened this summer (thanks to the 2022 cost of living crisis and people now having spent all of their covid savings) so low £50s will get you a nice, well equipped 2012/13 Carrera S with 55-70k miles. If you want a garage queen with 30-40k miles you will pay for it, but it won’t be any more reliable or cheap to run than a more used example. The 991.1 is a very reliable car by 911 standards and I cannot recommend them enough.
I've got a 2014 C2S 991.1, purchased in 2018. I think it is a great car. It is firstly the most reliable car I have ever owned. In four years only one sensor has failed. I have it serviced at Porsche and have maintained a warranty. I've done 45K kms in it (28K miles). I have PDK, sports exhaust, sports PASM and a few other bits. Basically it was specified to GTS without the engine power upgrade. I bought it after trying 991 GTS, GT3 and GT3 RS's and the Turbo S (both generations). It was clear to me that the 991 911 was a better than or equal to drivers car than a 458 and the AMG GTs (both of which I tried on track). I use it all the time for all sorts of things, as my main car. In our house we have a CLS63S and a Yaris GR (with track pack). With the 911, I don't use the Yaris. The 911 is much, much more fun. And the Merc is great for a more comfortable longer trip if required. I've got a 992 GTS on order, but I will be very sad about giving the 991.1 up. BTW - I run it on Pzeros, which I like, and I have the other steering wheel (it is much better).
The 991.1 is the best 911 of all time, dude!
Totally agree :)
I have one of these..... 991.1 4S. It's a really special thing. Great just pootling around and fantastic when you are on it. Still the best sports car, very practical, reasonable running costs a great looking wide body and a fantastic interior.
It’s the last naturally aspirated generation. Hence the price tag. Only one way to go for a good one of those.
Exactly. The last of its kind. Just like the last air-cooled 911s, the 993 which commands a premium. Rumor is the next 718 will be electric. Those last naturally aspirated 4.0s with a manual will be priceless.
You can change the « ugly » multifunction steering wheel by the Sport Design Steering wheel with paddles, it was an option on 991.1 (same steering wheel as the 997.2 Turbo you drove).
That's the one I have but honestly never really use the paddle shifters because the PDK is much better at shifting than I am.
My dad has this exact spec of car only as a convertible with the sport design steering wheel. A set of PS4S and a proper alignment all around transformed the dynamics, and everything that the heavy folding roof takes away is gained back ten fold in the enjoyment gained from listening to that engine. Absolutely love it.
I had a 991.1 C2S with pedal shifters. I really liked my car and the NA exhaust notes were really nice.
I have to give you a compliment Jay because I always watch your videos when I see them. Doesnt matter my mood or what I'm doing I can listen in the background if I'm working or enjoy the excellent video editing when I'm free.
Have to say I really appreciate the honesty and balance in your reviews. With some reviewers I seem to come away either feeling car X is the best thing since sliced bread, or car Y is fundamentally flawed. With you I feel I'm getting an honest appraisal of the pros and cons. Thanks!
Thanks Jason!
Love the sense of humour in the colour scheme😁👍
I recently moved from a 997.2 to a 991.1 C2S. The PDK is significantly better in the 991 and the interior feels a lot nicer.
I also have the steering wheel with the buttons and not the paddles. It is probably one of the ugliest steering wheels out there, but I have got used to the buttons and actually appreciate how little you need to move your hands to change up and down. Looks awful, but works ok when you get used to it
Fantastic engine notes 🎶
Had one of the button equipped steering wheels on a Porsche Tour in Italy a number of years ago...hated it for the first day or so...but once I got used to it, I liked it quite a bit. The PDK script on top...yes, that's atrocious.
You could consider retrofitting a more recent wheel with paddles.
Nice review and agree with what you say. I drive a 991.1 C4S, my third Porsche and second 991.1, took some time finding one with the right spec. Paddles really are better and a £1k retrofit. I got an X51 car, which meant it came with everything else too. And as options add relatively little to value it seemed a good plan. The glass roof on the 991 is pretty special too if you have a car with a dark interior, or like looking up without having the wind mess up your hair. The last NA Porsche, apart from the GTs, is a thing and probably keep values strong. But these are getting old and bits break, nothing big but it all adds up. But people who can afford £60k can probably pay a couple of grand a year for mending too.
Beautiful 911 that was NA. It was overlooked.
Cant agree with those stripes, however.
Yeah, gotta wonder what the guy who ordered those was thinking. Should only be on a white car, and should only be on a track car.
Loved my time in the 991.1 carrera manual ended up putting 138k on the clock never missed a beat and felt tight as a drum . Those tyres need to replaced with pilot 4s 👌🏻👌🏻 such a difference it would make and a slight geo tweak! I only sold mine as I couldn’t find anyone to shorten the ratios in the box
Love my 991 S. I affectionately call it the poor man's gt3. Sport exhaust is riveting, and it has the same torque as a gt3. Fantastic naturally aspirated car, one of the best!
Those stripes on that orange 🤮
I’m in 100% agreement , I’ve only just started watching , I hope he announces that it’s a wrap so it can easily be put back to standard !
It sounds good though and the interior is still rather tasteful 👍🏻
Edit:; thank god it is a wrap !
The martini stripes would look better on a white car
(my autocorrect almost took the W from white and swapped it with S)
Martini stripes have to be on white Porsche. Black and grey as a substitute, but white looks best - by far.
I was just about to post the same thing🤮🤮🤮
Trying way too hard
Great Spirit and clear content again. Thanks.
Love the way this car looks that orange is fantastic, the black interior is a little claustrophobic I’d need a lighter colour and a sun roof. Nice video. Keep up the good work.
Colour with those graphics is completely unacceptable. Makes an expensive car look cheap and that’s not easy well done…….
Good job it isn't yours then 😜
The martini stripes would look better on a white car (I feel like I've said this before)
I have a 2014 C4S with the X51 Power kit 430bhp, I absolutley love it, the noise is so adictive.
Great review as always, great car !
Great review. My 2012.5 991.1S came with a the sport design steering wheel which has the paddles but I honestly almost never use them. The pdk is pretty excellent even at the track.
Was watching this with bated breath James. Bought my 991.1 c4s 2 years ago. In the 3 years previous had an e63s, XKR and then an M6 comp. Only car I have ever really connected with before was my mx5 about about 20 yrs ago but just love "Otto". Had a few niggles, all covered mainly by warranty and it's the only car I've had which I won't take a bath on when I eventually sell. Have 67k miles, bought at 54k miles and I still regularly just head out for a drive on my tod. Have the Michelins P4s on having replaced p zeros and night and day, just an all round excellent car. Agree with the steering wheel, test drove one witb the buttons and just weird so swerved that one and mine has the sports wheel with the paddles. Appreciate the quality review as always
Jay, you need to review a 991.2 - tuned (with over 500 bhp). Turbo feel - yes; but better in every other way. The turbo torque is addictive too.
That orange paint is very pretty
Glad to see you corrected yourself. I finally bought the 991.1 C2 S convertible with all 7 buttons which to me means it has all the cool options and it was all of $80k. I love it every day, it took about 8 months to find a yes it’s my 40 year dream to get a silver c2s with black 20s and it just happen to pretty fresh set of pilot sports and new breaks all a bonus. It is getting harder to find a nice 911s with all 7 buttons, just to sports exhaust is close to 5k unless you put it in yourself. Oh yeah probably two months ago I drove my buddies 993 convertible and it’s a stick and I think in my opinion I am tired of shit because I’ve done it my whole life that PK is an awesome thing and electric power steering I don’t feel the difference I don’t really drive high-speed I just drive lots of tight technical roads and it’s perfect in that car stiff I’ll tell you that much enjoy your videos I like that you Dissect a car from different angles pros and cons and then even make a correction when you revisit them.
Competition winner for longest sentence. 🎉
JAMES! All of this Porsche content is treat overload! Will we see any on your partners 986?
An R8 manual V10 for only 60k. That sounds like a bargain. Such a great car. I drove the 1st of them when they were just released in Oz. Loved it.
That orange is FANTASTIC. Love it.
I own a 991.1 C2 and I’ve been considering replacing the steering wheel for something with paddles but I also want the multifunction stuff on the wheel to continue working.
Definitely possible to retrofit a better wheel - the one from the 9x2 gen works just fine. No idea of the cost but a previous owner fitted a 718 wheel to my 981CS and it's a game changer. Talking of the 981CS, can't think why I'd pay twice as much for the 991 over that.
On the price though, always worth considering that even though the list price is technically the same as that R8 so you'd still need the cash up front to get one. However, by the time you sell it you've probably actually spent half as much on everything including depreciation, that's a better way to measure car cost- hence a £15k E60 M5 is not the same price as a £15k Hyundai i30, it's about 14x the price really (if it was as cheap to own as an i30, then it wouldn't have depreciated at all!).
Macan wheel fits, cheapest and best upgrade
J you’re making happy that I ended up w a 997.1 2S man box w X51 pak. Same power as this, less weight w three pedals makes for a lively car 👍
that's a rare combination. Most x51's were optioned on the 4S.
Martini stripes on ginger orange body. Who’d thought this be a winning combo. I obviously love it.
The last of the NA Carreras, What’s not to like ?
Interesting review, would love to see you review a 997.1 C2S.. I currently have one of those at this moment in time, however I have been contemplating moving on to the 991.1 C2S for the newer feel of the cabin and power, however I love the shape of my 997.1 C2S and the soul the car has especially the exhaust note. Keep the videos coming, a joy to watch as always👏🏼👍🏼
Hang on to that 997.1 C2S especially if it’s the manual as good ones are going to be future classics. I’m not biased in any way. Ok I own one but hey ho! 😉
@@BarryCoombs1 the only thing is that it’s on 117k miles at the moment.. artic silver, manual, lobsters, sport chrono, Porsche badge in headrests, heated seats, sunroof, nav ect, I love the way it looks even for its age something about it, however I do like the 997.1 turbo and the 991.1 S not sure if the 997.1 turbos will rocket up at any point before it’s out of my reach🤔
@@tomwilkin6889 Might just be a steady increase on the Turbos - I'd do it as soon as you're able to. I just wish I'd been brave enough to have gone for a 997 GT3 during lockdown. I saw 2 at £65 & £70k but with no income and no idea how things were going to pan out, I left it. Now look at the prices of those things! They've since increased by more than I paid for my 997S last year. I really need to invest in a decent crystal ball 😃
I moved from 997.2 c4s to 991.1 c4s and 991 is head and shoulders better car in every aspect. From front end stability through interior quality and finish, much smoother and faster PDK to eshaust noise (with PSE). Unless you are a car journalist or drive 997 and 991 back to back, otherwise you will not notice steering wheel feel difference in my opinion.
I have a 991.1 S 2012. It has paddles 🤷🏼♂️ I adore it 😊
The reason these cars are holding value is due to them being the very last of the naturally aspirated cars. From the 2010 997.2 to the 2015 991.1, both have the 3.8 direct fuel injection engine. A mere 5 or 6 years for a production run spanning these two models. As far as I'm concerned they're the sweet spot for 911's. I've owned my 2015 4S Targa for almost 5 years now, and doubt I'll ever part with it.
that's technically incorrect, since the current 911 gt3 are still aspirate
Also I have a 2008 997.2 3.8. Your dates are off my man.
Love the Orange but the stripes make it look like it came from a council estate !
excellent 👍
every Porsche is a hero 🙌
the stripes ? Martini?
That orange is gorgeous and those Martini stripes are rather fitting on the orange.
Love the metallic paint on this 👌
I've had 2 Porsches including my current 2020 718 Spyder. I've never driven a 911 as I prefer a mid engined car. I may take one out some day. Thanks for your great review Jay.
Don't do it. Everyone who comes from a 718 that "tries" a 911 wants one xD
you could spec multifunction steering wheel as per whats in the test car, or you could spec sports wheel which had normal paddles, left down right up etc, just an option
New interior camera? I’m liking it
The only 911 i would ever consider purchasing, if i was ever in the market for such a vehicle, would be a 930 aircooled Turbo, from the 1970s.
One of the last ones, with the 5 speed box, in either Guards Red or dark Grey.
Jay, I wonder if you ever were to dismiss the 991R wich technically is also a 991.1???
I dont get the whole paddle thing the PDK is sublime as it gets the right gear each time. If you want to shift get a manual. I like my multi function wheel it is fer useful in daily use
Great review!! On a side comment, I am not a fan of those stripes on that particular car..makes an otherwise beautiful /classy car look tacky and tastless
If those were black stripes, without any advertisement (which always confuses me, why would anyone choose to be a rolling billboard for a company?!)
it would look superb.
@@barbarusbloodshed6347 martini on a porsche is the same as a Malboro liveried ferrari, its historic racing stuff, some people like that, I kind of do if it's on someone else's car. I like the look of the "racing livery" but not to drive around in it ( I still think it should be a white car tho)
@@JamesCairney or JPS in gold on a black Lotus🏆
@@Nord_Mann that always looks good
The Martini stripes would look good if the car body was in Championship White.
Like the Delta Integrale, that combination looked cool.
My 997.2 C2S with Sharkwerks center bypass and Fister exhaust is roughly the same HP as the stock 991.1 C2S. I have the Sport Design wheel with paddles. Driving in Sport mode, shifting manually, I did not notice anything better with the PDK in the 991.1. I did notice the 991.1 felt larger and not as nimble.
Its possible to change the steering wheel to a GT3 / GT4 PDK wheel. I've done the swap, and its the best upgrade.
Still love the eighties intro 😀👍
Thanks J 🙏
Good review
I had a 2012 991 2S. Beautiful in dark blue. Bloody loved it! Just ordered a 992 2S in Aventurine Green. Interesting differences, but from my test drives the undeniable truth is … The latest 911 is the best 911.
How do you compare the engine sound having experienced both? I went for 991.1 after all because all pointed at it sounding the best, but in real life I imagine 992 might be better than on youtube
@@GrzegorzStyczen For me, not enough of a difference to matter. The 992 is so much better on every other way though, as you’d expect 10 years on! Sometimes I think the press forget that your average 911 owner doesn’t spend every trip flat out listening to the engine to 7000rpm through every gear.
KEEP THE PORSCHE MATERIAL COMIN’, BRO.. 👏👏👏
Loving the rap 😊 what a stunner
Clearly a subjective perspective, but I think my 991.1 GTS 7MT is the best looking and sounding modern Porsche available. Never really ever liked the backend of my past 997S and I although 992’s look great from 20’ away, my god are they massive up close
Agreed on the 997 rear but look wise the 991 front and back does not compare to the 992 and surely does not drive like one. However, that na engine sound is just amazing
@@er98ah GTS has Sport Design front end; looks marvellous. No doubt the turbo 911’s have breakneck performance, but my current GTS can get me locked up from 3rd gear on in Canada, so I can’t imagine anything more lethal (especially the torque)… If used car prices pullback as predicted, I’ll try to get into a 991.2 GT3 Touring. Fingers and toes crossed. Failing that, I think I’m done with new 911’s, which breaks my heart.
@@yyz4165 why done with 911? I’ve never owned better cars than my 991 and 992. The improvements in the 992 are more than straight line related, they just have a better overall feel, grip etc.
I plan on selling my base 992 and just getting an m3 though. With the kids and the tightness of the car and a complaining wife it does not get driven enough.
@@er98ah … simply too big for me. Seems to be encroaching on turbo as a grand tourer. GT4 seems closer to the 911 ethos, size wise.
Love the wrap. Where was it done?
❤️jay Emm on cars
That's why when I bought mine I had to get the sport design steering wheel, it has normal paddles and if you pull them both it goes into neutral
I own a 2104C2S. The steering feel is awesome, so it's pure bullshit and journalistic jabber to say that it is bad. The 7 speed is also excellent particularly because it retains the PDK gear indicator. The wheel in the video is awful. Fortunately my sales guy convinced me to order the Speed Line wheel which feels fantastic. Shy of 70k kilometres and have loved every second.
Duh, 2014. Gotta read more carefully.
The steering is better with rear wheel drive on a 991.1. The multifunction steering wheel is an option. It could have been ordered with a wheel that had regular paddle shifters.
Jeff (home built) would approve of the exterior colours 😁
The orange is nice and the car is awesome! If I was friends with the owner, I would plead with them to remove the Martini livery.
I'm on the used market for a 991, 4s with pccb and sport chrono, manual possibly. Even though budget says 991.1, I would be happy to spend a little more and flirting with bankrupcty and getting a 991.2 4s. The turbo versions are just better in performances, fuel economy and reliability. Weight increase was also modest between 991.1 and 991.2
It takes driving the 997 then 992 then the 991 to appreciate the 991 fully.
991.1 or 991.2 ?
🔥🔥🔥 outro
I think potentially you were a bit harsh on the 997.2 Turbo. It likes needs a service on the pdk box which is very much neglected by most dealerships and independents. It smooths the gear change when the service is done. Obviously there was a geometry problem too on the car also.
Ultimately the 997 is one of the heaviest 911s there is. Heavier than the 996 and the 991.
First generation PDK, and the PDK was serviced and had its fluid change as part of the big 12 year service I had in April this year
@@stephenperry6024 👍🏻
All the beefed beetles seem to be the exactly the same for a non-connoisseur
Is 991 911 great for first Porsche to buy?im considering quatroporte 2009-2012 ZF or this model…
That is a great car with a horrendous color (wrap?) /stripe/etc. Just ruins it. Great video.
Come drive my car man. 2013 991.1 RWD C2S, Sports Steering wheel with steel paddles, where you'd expect them to be, dark blue with beige interior (extended leather option)
I found that the C4S does exactly what you described in the video, the front washes out way earlier than you'd expect in the turn.
Couldn't have picked a worse colour to put Martini stripes over. I mean ffs, are you blind?
Man...only snobs mistreat these cars. 👀 this is a perfect way for someone to get into 911's especially for a daily.
It's the childseat! It's the same in my 992. Also in the Panamera the only noise is the bloody childseat :P ;)
My 991.1 C2s as the Porsche sport design wheel with paddles. Wasn't an expensive option.
That Martini Guy 😎
Nice review, James. I’m thinking of moving up from my 981 Cayman to a 991 911 but I just can’t get my head round the price difference. I can’t see how this is worth twice/almost three times the Cayman. I mean, it’s almost the same car inside…
300hp to 400hp is a big jump
@@sonicsabbath 325 to 400 and the Cayman weighs a lot less…so not that much difference tbh…I went from a e92 M3 420hp to my 981 Cayman S 325hp and literally can’t feel a difference in power, in fact if I was to say the Cayman would get me from A to B quicker it wouldn’t be a lie
I have had the same thoughts, but my Boxster is a lot fun and I think handles better than a 911. I recently did a Porsche track day, jumping between the Boxster/Cayman and 911. All were great, but I’ll stay with the Boxster, a smaller and tighter package.
I own a 991.1 but I wouldn't choose it over an R8 V10 manual. In the us you can get a 991.1 c2s for around 65-70k pdk or manual while even a first gen e-gear v10 will cost 80-85k. A manual v10 R8 will cost well over 100k.
991.1 sport design steering wheel has beautiful levers with fantastic feel Jay!!
Love those stripes 😍
Drove a 991.1 S with PSE and proper paddles - sounded great and you would only miss the older generation steering if you drive a 997 just before - they are pricey though
A few years ago I rented a stage 1 991.2 GTS and went on a road trip with a friend and his 997 GTS, both pdk - two fantastic cars, the later generation car was very fast, but the 997 had the subliminal feel and made the bigger impression on everybody
I heard that it was Porsche's CEO Wendelin Wiedeking from 1993 through July 23, 2009, who overruled the engineers and insisted on buttons over paddles.
I had this color on my porsche in nfs... when I was 5yo
Interesting. What exactly was wrong with the 997.2 Turbo that you drove?
th-cam.com/video/vFvmh8F72Xk/w-d-xo.html
Having seen quite a lot of 911 in recent weeks, the 991 generation is the 911 where the cars started to look "off" to me. The 997 strikes me as a classic car at the very fast glance, the 991 just looks bland to me.
991 is the first cabriolet to not look way worse than the Carrera coupe. All 911’s look good, even 996, but we’re all definitely allowed our personal preferences 😊 to me the 993 was the “perfect” 911 for looks/size, but many think they’re the worst looking air cooled! I have a 991.2 Carrera T, beautiful car and drives amazing, very tight and precise, I prefer a lot of things about it over earlier models. Like I said, I think they all have redeemable qualities to enjoy 😊
@@joeracer302
You have one of the finest cars in existence, I am sure - all the best to you!
Interestingly enough, I also think the 993 was the most balanced 911 in terms of looks. This being said, I absolutely love the early 996s.
If you want to test the best modern non GT 911- it’s the 991.2 GTS. The noise is still spine tingling, gearbox brilliant, power (and delivery) fantastic. The interior feels special too. I’ve owned 997s and driven most other variants- including 992s- and I wouldn’t trade my car in for any of them. Let me know!
What year was this car? I had an early 991.1 and it wasn’t good. The steering was wooden and the 7 speed manual’s ratios are TERRIBLE. This being a PDK is better, sadly. And as it got toward the 991.2 changeover it got better. The 991.2 chassis is MUCH improved but then you get the turbo engine. Which isn’t bad…but doesn’t sound nearly as good as the 3.8.
A 4s is a stupid buy. The traction in a 2s is amazing and you bugger up the front end feel and add weight with the 4x drive.
Why does he have a tennis ball in his door compartment lol
Get the sport steering wheel instead of the multi-function and you get proper paddles
OK, NOW THAT I KNOW HIS YOUNG SON PICKED THE COLOR I CAN AGREE WITH THE ORANGE WRAP AND ITS STILL BLACK UNDERNEATH. CARS ARE ALL ABOUT UNIQUENESS AND DIVERSITY FOR SOME. I WOULD NEVER DO FREE ADVERTISING FOR A LIQUOR CO. WITH THOSE STRIPES UNLESS MASSIVELY COMPENSATED.
the 991.1 is awesome because its not a turbo fart can engine