There is only one better feeling if you code something new and it just works right out of the box. The effect gets exponentially more intense the longer you coded before checking xD. It just doesn't happen very often though lol.
I can remember several times where I would go through find a bug, think about it for a second and realize what the problem was and scream “I’m a genius!!” just because of how happy I was to find the cause.
Fighting yourself, your motivation, the stress of real life, balancing all your responsibilities, focusing your priorities; these are all things that make game dev hard, these are the things that make being human hard. Shit is hard. Fuck.
Right there with you. The least we can do is make it easier on ourselves but there's only so much we can do. We just got to persevere and help each other as best we can.
Yep and I started making my dream game when I was in my parents house and when you have all that responsibility added with your game it’s not fun at all
It probably wasn’t the best idea to watch all these videos making it seem so easy when I was starting my journey, in the end it just made me think “wow Im so bad at this thing” and started to lose motivation to keep going until I eventually gave up
That's exactly why I wanted to make this video because I've felt like that too. If you've not given it another shot since giving up, try again! Remember this time that it's gonna take a while because you're not just learning "how to make a game", you're also learning how to program, model, texture, the engine, blah blah blah - they're entirely different areas! But most of all, don't take the perception of how easy it 'should' be from devlogs, some of them are good at being accurate but just as many are really not. You got this!
You definitely have a good point, but I do believe that its partially the viewer's job to make themselves not get demotivated from looking at other people's stuff. I know that if I didn't make devlogs, I wouldn't have anywhere near the same amount of motivation to make games, so I guess I don't really have the perspective of someone who just works on their projects quietly. Showing the full process behind making games can be pretty boring though, as I'd say at least 50 percent of my time goes into repetitive tasks like 3d modeling and level design. Good video, its always a good idea to take a step back and look at something from a different perspective, and yours is pretty interesting!
Thanks I really appreciate that! It definitely helps to have something alongside what you're doing that actively pushes you to keep doing it or gives self-sustaining motivation, but way more people don't, can't or just don't want to do devlogs (or similar) than those that do. You're right about elements that can be boring, it's all about balance which I'm sure those of us that make them struggle with every video haha.
I am so damn glad I found this video. Not only do devlogs drastically under represent the amount of time and effort going into making something look average. The devlogs themselves are an entire process to make that can take as long as the feature that you are covering in said devlog
There's so much effort that comes from so many different areas of life that at first seem irrelevant which actually are really relevant. Game Dev ain't easy, and neither is video creation.
You've clearly not watched many of mine! I don't feel like an outlier either; plenty of Devs in my feed give honest appraisals of the difficulties. It does depend on the aims of the TH-cam game Dev - whether it's purely to entertain, to teach, an actual log of work/life or cynical game marketing. Detail and strife don't fit in an entertainment video. Memes get in the way of tutorials. Some manage to blend them together but they tend to spend huge effort in editing. Great video, really enjoyed it.
James Dyson spent 15 years making 5,127 prototypes before he perfected the Dyson vacuum cleaner we know today. We don't acknowledge that perfect things don't just happen immediately, we like to see the final outcome yes, but as game developers we don't mind seeing the pitfalls in devlogs. Some people may think it's just useless filler to add in the problems and challenges faced, just to get the video past 10 minutes, however I think it's very important for everyone, no matter what skill level you're at, to accept that even the most professional developers face these kinds of issues at times. Failure is perfectly normal, if we just won at everything first time we would never learn from our mistakes. But it's up to you to turn that failure into success.
You speak right from my soul. I sometimes feel that some of the larger, entertainment-focused game dev TH-camrs make it seem easy to make a game and I feel that also discredits the effort and skill of some developers that really want to make a fun game for their community, instead of creating a prototype to use in a few videos. It's also confusing to see sometimes that people that want to deliver real value to people, in form of a game, get way less recognition, than people that just play the clown in front of the camera, talking about game dev.
I think we’ve all felt this way at some point. I try to avoid falling into the same trap but only others can say whether I achieved it or not. Your second point really hits home. I think it’s because more people are willing to watch random one offs than journeys to building an experience which is a shame. It’s easy to undermine your own effort with videos that don’t necessarily expose the difficulty than those you see naturally through genuine raw Devlogs.
@@DarkDax What I struggle with in particular is that I could just put all the effort into videos and be way more successful with them, but then there won't really be a game, but if you put the effort in the game, I can hardly turn that alone into something very entertaining to watch, at least for the mainstream gamers. I try to achieve exactly that for nearly two years now, but it's hard to turn such a technical topic, which game dev is, into something entertaining for everyone.
@Broco8 Yes, for example, I mean don't get me wrong, that guy definitely has some entertainment skills, but I was really disappointed to see him throw away his whole stickman game as he became popular. That shows that he didn't really care about the game.
@@arav7737 You are probably right, but honestly, he can already be sure his game will be financially successful with a following of a few million people, which make it pretty easy to stay motivated, also KARLSON, though looking fun, is a pretty simple casual game, you can probably create in 4-6 months, including marketing.
I found your channel like, 20 minutes ago, and I have to say you're now one of my favorite programming/game dev youtubers. Not only you care to deeply research a subject, you also present it in an entertaining way, I'm subscribing right now! (Also, sorry if my English is a broken mess, it's not my native language)
Wow thanks Stacklysm, that means a lot haha. Makes my day it comes across as intended, makes the effort that much more worth it! (Also your English is perfect and probably better than mine and I speak it hahaha)
Great points you made here. Posting videos and devlogs must take away a lot of the stress that people that work long hours alone in a dark room may face.
I’d love to see devlogs where they show the code, even sped up, just seeing them do it would be so cool. “So I just added a slide mechanic” - ok, that’d take me hours, I’d love to see how you do it. And then 5 seconds later they’ve moved onto the next thing they did
I think that’s one of the major things that can really affect how you view your own progress. It doesn’t need to be done for every single thing, but if the core of the video focuses on it I think it really helps to show how it works rather than just seeing it working.
The only problem is not everyone wants to see code. In my first few devlogs I had sections of the code getting typed at 10 times speed and the analytics would show that those are the times when people would leave. Take it I probably didn't execute it in the best way. I do agree that it's a problem and probably one that I fall for in my videos. In a tutorial I showed a function and someone mentioned how I must be pretty smart to do that but at the same time that function alone took me a few hours to get right and I never told anyone. I'll definitely try to start showing how it actually happens for me to help fix the problem.
@@arithmetic1938 To people who don't understand code, it looks like either garbled nonsense or a language of ancient gods that their tiny brains couldn't possibly comprehend. There's a game that I play that gets updated regularly, but it doesn't have an update log. I asked on discord how I would get a sense for what changes with each update, and they gave me a git hub link. I went there and found nothing of value because it was all either code or things talking about code. I think the code stuff should always be included somewhere, but it should be separated from everything else. Have one page that has the code, and another that explains what the code does. Simple as that, I hope?
I think it might also be due to the fact that some of these guys "hide" their code because they work hard on it and dont want someone to easily be able to replicate their result by essentially copying and pasting. I love to read and understand the code too but i see it from both sides :)
Hey mate! Thanks for the great video and for the shout out. I wish I saw this sooner, admittedly I don't watch a whole lot of dev tube for the reasons we both discussed, but I'm certainly glad a community member sent me this today! Very much enjoyed, wishing you the best with your channel.
Thanks man I appreciate it and thanks for being a such a great down-to-earth voice within in the game development community! I've been subbed for a while and your videos have been a great source of reset and motivation. Keep up the great work and good luck with your game!
Even though I'm not a game developer, I can totally relate with the message. Most videos and articles talking about big projects don't even mention typical struggles, and what they entail... unless it's for an entertainment purpose
Yeah, and I can understand why they wouldn't for entertainment (by literal definition haha). I know I do appreciate those videos that do acknowledge it regardless of whether it's a quick mention or a bit more detail. Just helps your mindset haha
I couldn't agree more Dax! As someone who's made over 30 devlogs, I feel I could have done a much better job at acknowledging just how excruciatingly hard it was. I can only speak for myself here, but I think many gamedev youtubers feel a pressure to make everything look easy so as to look competent, and to get boosted by the TH-cam algorithm. And with the high expectations of gamers, I have this fear that if you show even just a little bit of vulnerability then people will think you have no idea what you're doing and watch someone else. It really got to me because so many TH-camrs around me were pumping out new devlogs every week with ground-breaking new features while I had been stuck on a single mechanic for over six months. Nothing I ever did felt good enough; "I should have finished this by now" became my every waking thought. But when I started looking deeper, watching Bungie's old Halo 2 ViDocs and talking to my other game dev friends, I found that they all struggle with the same problems that I do, and I started to feel better about myself. Turns out game development is actually very hard. Turns out struggling is normal, and maybe I'm not a terrible developer just because I can't make a triple-A experience in two days. I'm relieved to know that there are people still who are hungry for an honest look into the game development process-warts and all. I strongly dislike the recent rise of the "I MADE MINECRAFT IN 1 MINUTE" videos because I know from experience that those don't accurately show what the process is like, but unfortunately that's what the TH-cam algorithm rewards. You nailed it right on the head-the less we acknowledge this effort in our videos, the more we skew other people's perceptions of their own effort-and because of this I've had to stop myself from watching devlogs altogether. I've bottled up these thoughts for a long time so I'm so glad I found your video today, you capture the sentiment perfectly!
So glad to see I'm far from alone in have this feeling haha. Like you say it's definitely something that's been lost for many a reason (entertainment factor being the main one) but I feel it could and should be slowly introduced into more devlogs again. Obviously I'm not talking about having a full 5-10 minutes analysis, but at least some form of acknowledgement that _this is bloody hard_ and you everyone goes through it regardless of how easy or hard a feature/system/mechanic is perceived to be. I really do agree with you on the time based title videos. Yeah they could be good to get more experience in lots of different areas, but you don't necessarily get to practice good practices under the constraint. I've actually did this for my Fall Guy clone but it's more of a technicality. Rather than 24 straight hours its 24 hours of overall work time. I bring attention to it at the end but I technically still did it. Wish you luck with your future developments man! I've actually seen a few of your devlogs before a good year or so ago! Glad to see it's all still going well :D
Jiminy Cricketing Christ why hasn't this channel gotten bigger yet?! Seriously, you've like single-handedly got me interested in these coding and Game Dev type videos and led me to other great channel that do the same. I'm not sure why you haven't exploded into the algorithm yet, but when you do, I'm glad to say I was here to see it.
Wow, that's made my day! It makes me really happy to hear that - there are so many amazing channels out there that deserve the attention too and I'm glad you've found some! If that day ever comes, I'll be glad you were with us!
The volume of dev logs TH-cam has started shoving in my face due to the almighty algorithm is actually giving me a lot of anxiety lol. Glad this video was in the mix, just what I needed to get back to work.
Someone else said that because you know it’s hard then you shouldn’t get affected by it, but that doesn’t account for the accumulated affect when you watch many Dev logs over time. Super important to remember that most aren’t showing you a similar struggle they went through making what they made to what you do when working in your projects. It’s hard to remember though, so acknowledgement is what we all need from time to time! Hope you work goes well!
from how much i've seen most devlogs make everything look too easy while real development looks like 'missing ";" at line 1042' and constant stackoverflowing
5:57: I literally spent at least 6 hours trying to figure this out in unity, the hard part when I got the cube to rotate sidways and have the camera follow it, because for multiple hours I missed transform.right and transform.up in the documentation, so I thought only transform.forward existed and when I tried to find out how to do it because I'm not entirely a math genius.
well, i already knew i couldn't do game dev before finding devlogs, so they're just kind of a fun thing to watch for me. but i have seen comments on them that say some variation of "how'd you do this?" or "wow, you made that look easy" or what have you.
Oh totally - different devlogs will represent different things to different people. Some just love watching them and others look to them for motivation and education. Very versatile!
You are nothing but right. I'll be starting up devlogs for a game i've been planning for a while. And i really want to show people all the things that can, will & might go wrong. Because mistakes are among the most valuable learning experiences.
That's exactly why I wanted to make this video because that's how I felt every now and then for the exact same reasons. Glad it helped you feel better!
Great video and really important topic :) I followed my life long dream and founded my own game studio in 2016. We began work on a few minor projects but never managed to get far as we constantly needed money for our salaries (which were below minimum wages). We helped grow and build other companies, got screwed over, lost a ton of money, got sued... Twice... Now I'm the only one left at the company and I've been been forced to take another job for my family's sake and I now work on my solo project every night and every weekend I can. I even made a deal with the company I work for to only work 4 days a week so that I might have an entire day's worth of work on my own project. Game development is hard, it requires a bunch of knowledge and a great understanding of many disciplines and their interconnectivity. Thanks for making this video mate! You earned a sub
Ahh thanks mate that means a lot! Thanks for sharing your experience, as stressful as it must have been at times it’s stories like this that need to be heard more. It’s great down-to-earth realism. I hope your project continues to go well and good luck!
@@DarkDax Thanks mate :) I agree, we need to stop visualising game development as the great life as more often than not people will have less money, less time and more stress than what should be considered acceptable. On a different note, I've been considering being more public about my project and my story on TH-cam for quite some time. I used to make unity and blender tutorials about 8 years ago, but video editing is really not my thing, do you do your own video editing or can you recommend someone?
@@kennethberle4265 anytime! I think it’s always a shock to people how little free time you get between projects and work too - at least that’s how I feel currently haha. Yeah you should do it! I do all my editing myself, it’s just years of on and off practice through this channel to be honest and it gets the job done haha. I don’t really know any editors but I can suggest finding a software that gets the job done and learning the basics (cutting and stuff) is all you really need! Audio is always more important at the end of the day. I look forward to hearing more about it! :D
@@DarkDax Yeah, especially the balance between family life, work and spare time projects is a tough one. Best of luck with it mate, it must be tough! You know what, I think I will : ) That sounds like a mouthful, but I guess it's worst the first couple of times : ) I've been using Da Vinci for a couple of months now, but if you have better suggestions please do let me know : ) How much time do you approximately spend on editing?
it seems like there's a sliding scale between "bulleted patch notes" and "livestream". and both of those take minimal effort compared to filming and editing a video to present a discrete segment of work, which probably sits in the middle. there are an awful lot of devlogs that go with the dude perfect approach of only putting in the final take, so to speak. but the ones that include the dev talking about the difficulties in the development process, i usually end up fast-forwarding through that part, even though i think more devlogs should address it. maybe it's for the same reason that so few scientists are decent science communicators. so are the best devlogs also stories, with a conflict arc and resolution?
This is all brilliant. It's really interesting you mention that about skipping those bits but would still appreciate if they were included anyway. You're right about your 'sliding scale', it's either one way or another or somewhere in-between. And it's true, when you think about it, some devlogs become virally successful based on factors outside the scope of the topic, whereas others manage to get the attention they deserve within the scope based on exactly that, the scope. I just hope it doesn't affect people's view of themselves like it has me in the past.
@@DarkDax maybe at the very least a devlog ought to include the computer clock in the screen capture, so the viewer can infer the passage of time. and i would imagine that more successful devlogs tend to be those that resemble video essays in their presentation.
Bruh I love this. I think that a lot of game players who don’t design games professionally know how game development works and devlogs kinda make it harder to break this perception
You are CRIMINALLY underrated. I love how you tackle these topics. I've been trying to get on gamedev as a hobbyist for a few years now and I never got the motivation to finish it because I went about things very very wrong. I stopped focusing on doing everything on tutorials and going auto pilot, and realizing that it's a skill that's going to take a while to create a strong basis of is great to give you a sense of reality. Note that I'm still going to pursue it, as it is definitely still in my radar or interest, I just haven't had the time to do so, though I'll be grinding it soon.
Thanks, I'm glad you enjoy these sorts of videos! Definitely try again when you get the chance, it's super hard to find the time but when you do you'll do great!
Yess emotionally engaging with our creative process is so essential and I think recognizing effort and frustration as obstacles are great ways to connect to that
As a struggling freelance digital artist myself, I always know how it feels like to meet the expectations of the industry. I personally think that it is a less artist-based problem rather than a media-industry problem. Time/Efficiency is more important than an in-depth exploration of deep unique character designs in our current freelance market - and departing from the path from functional design in a Million Dollar Project is just too risky and a simple No-Go for the companies. I personally crave to explore my full creative potential - but at the end of the day, I have to earn my living and do what I am paid to do.
This is a great follow-up to Lost Relic's video. People need to talk about the hardships more because they definitely used to make me feel like I was just not doing something right haha. Cheers!
That's one of the things I value about Sebastian Lague's videos; for most of it, it seems as though he's been granted the gift of omniscience with how easily he implements very complex-sounding things, but then he intersperses it with compilations of failed attempts that are quite relieving, lol.
Sebastian is honestly just a god of devlogs. Not only are his videos calmingly entertaining and attempt to explain his process (and failings), but he manages to sometimes create a story to tell or a cinematic masterpiece.
so I've been in working on my devlog, and I'm wondering if I should acknowledge a lot of the problems and it or not. If I spent time showing the problems and fixing them, that could get really boring to watch. But it would be more realistic. I'm not a 3D modeler, and it took me like 3 hours to model, Rick, and weight paint they pretty basic character, but I guess I'm going to have to speed that up to last about 2 minutes, and most of the time was actually spent troubleshooting issues like topology and weight paints
I think if the problem is relevant to the overall creation of what you're focusing on (as in what the video is actually about) then include it, but try and balance it. Obviously I'm not saying 3 minutes of talking about it (that's overkill), it's good enough to even have just a quick 20 seconds of genuinely mentioning the issues, but the balance will be different and you'll feel it while making each video. I think a few people will think I'm talking about adding an entire section of the video dedicated to issues, that's not it. It's rather the quality of the discussion we have about them within similar timeframe. It's reflective, supportive, and expressive - not depressive. It does everyone a load of good. At the end of the day, what you want to include in your video is ultimately up to you because it's yours. It's all about finding the balance that's right for the sort of angle you want to be at.
Absolutely, I am totally agreeing with you and am happy to see you highlighting this topic. I unfortunately see so many aspiring game developers quit just because they got a wrong perspective on how long games take to build. Even though these are high potential developers. 🙌
Whether you’re new or deep within it, it really does affect the perception of all. I think people see themselves as more tolerant to these sorts of things than they really are. Thankfully there is a big community where we can share and support each other across the internet! Just got to find them first!
This thing about "seeing a system that looks easy to do, just to try making it and finding out that you're absolutely wrong about it" it's one of those things that change my vision about a lot of games. Hell, once I tried to do a shell system like the ones in Super Mario Bros, just to get utterly frustated and give up. I came back the next day with my mind clearer and nailed. Such an amazing feeling.
That's exactly it! Everyone has those moments whether it's documented or not. Sometimes it just takes a break and a fresh mindset another day despite how much our brains tell us not to haha.
I started following Brackeys' tutorial on how to make a game in Unity and if I'm being honest it feels good. I was happy when I made a cube move, when the camera started following the player, how the collision worked nicely, how the movement stopped after hitting an obstacle. I knew game dev was hard but even small game mechanic as player controls was so hard to make into reality.
I never really thought about this before, but I 100 percent agree with you. I guess I'm also part of the problem, but from this day forward I'll try to help be the solution.
I can understand it being a real dilemma even in my own devlogs, because most of its mundane and doesn't speak to a wider audience, but also isn't that interesting and balancing the videos content can make it harder. If we put in every detail the video would just go on and on and on. I do try to say things like something took forever or I didn't know what I was doing to give perspective. Great video overall, something that a lot of aspiring people need to be aware of.
Thanks! Yeah I complete get where you're coming from. It really is a difficult balance to get right and sometimes it doesn't work without disrupting the whole video. Obviously it's not necessary but it would probably help a lot more people than you initially think.
solid watch, tbh I feel like watching other people almost inspires me to work harder, and be more consistent with working on coding ( even if it's just 15minutes a day), solid lessons to learn when it comes to being self taught at anything, and that's why it's always beneficial to find a group of people also sharing a similar goal, or at least that's what has been helping me ( I have joined many game dev discords, and they are all welcoming and willing to help if you get stuck). The community around the game dev space is awesome!! Subbed!!!
Oh definitely! There's no doubt that devlogs can be incredibly motivating (those I've watched today have been). Devlogs are all different and that's where it _can_ come from. This community is definitely one of the few that can genuinely come together and it's amazing. (Loved your most recent devlog btw!)
Great video! It gave me alot to reflect on. I feel like I'm at a stage now where I can make somewhat complex functionalities in my game, but as you say the context shouldnt go missing - the hours/days that I had to spend/struggle initially trying to solve "simple" problems were and are themselves an important piece in the puzzle that we should all appreciate and highlight
Keep up the good work! No doubt it took a lot to get to where you are and it's that I feel should be shared, applauded and talked about more. Got to respect what we've done regardless of the difficulty!
Really getting tempted now to make a "Real devlog of a real dev" showing how hard it is and taking a few jabs at the guys making it look easy on the way
Very true. Devlogs can often gloss over details, especially the boring ones. Some devs talk about it but the most part if they even try it will put off all but the most interested game dev.
That's really true. Like I say it's a balance between watching for entertainment value and including that informative and realistic side, but I believe there's a balance somewhere! Just got to find it haha
I'm not making games at the moment, but I make websites. They look pretty simple on the outside, but still took 200-300 hours to make because of the back end including the API. You can't see that if you look at a simple Bootstrap website.
Effort is often judged by how something looks. That’s how people start getting warped perceptions and when those who know no better start to pipe up. They’ve got no clue you’ve been navigating all these frameworks, learning and solving issues unique to your project.
I am here just impressed by all those people who have time and power left in them to ADDITIONALLY to making a game also make a high-quality presentation abut what they have done, which would probably took at least a week to make.
It's a very impressive grind that's not limited to those who make devlogs. Game Development is hard to do, but sticking with it is even harder. It's a real flex of the willpower muscle haha
Not gonna lie, it is often pretty disheartening given the prevalent emergence of devlogging nowadays that the vast majority of them is written from the perspecetive of post-mortem - or post-problem as I like to call it within the context. People come up with such crazy sophisticated solutions that it leaves you speechless, but hardly any devlog ever talks about the process of the problem-solving itself - which would be tremendous help for budding game developers. Heck, imo it got so 'perfectionalized' that it has detrimental effects on the Dev-Audience relation. I wish a lot of gruesome to my worst enemies, but stumbling over an incredibly convoluted bug to problem solve ain't one of them. Especially with an audience breathing down your neck that Appeals To Flawlessness - 'because hey look if XYZ can do it, why can't you'.
"XYZ can do it so why can't you" is definitely an issue with online culture in general. In a lot of communities it's not a common but there's definitely that pressure to 'match' if not 'top' another person, but it's simply has no bearing on anything really. It's that balance between keeping people through entertainment and educating through experience that's tricky to get right. Some devlogs are more one way or the other and it's possible that there may never be a true 'perfect balance' of both. I completely relate to the disheartening feeling and I find it comes from the voice in the back of your head that compares _everything_ . Over coming it can be done, but hell does it take time and effort!
I partially agree partially disagree with you if I may 😅 (as someone very new in devlog makery) Many devlog channels are more in entertainment category than blogs, they focus on the "wow effect" of the things to get to more people. So it would be more appealing, sharable and eye catching. Maybe main purpose is to make a video, but not to make the game for some. But I cannot judge or criticize anyone's decision. If you go too technical it slowly turns into a tutorial, if you barely post your progress it turns into some boring look at what I made video, adding a little fun and chat is definitely a need to keep people engaged. You'd want people to know about your product after all. I try to add details about technical difficulties I have sometimes, and I tell people about my struggles so they can maybe find some use of my experiences. I find my devlogs kind of boring and but balanced in showcase-tech details scale. Hope I can improve it by time.
Oh yeah there’s no doubt there’s a balance to get right with this sort of thing. I guess it depends on what your devlogs actual purpose is. The balance is hard, I definitely haven’t got it down yet so we’re in the same boat there mate hahaha. We’ll get there!
I mostly watch dev logs for entertainment and know like nothing about coding and defiently if a developer goes to much in to code on those videos i kinda jst zone out
Huh I never though about it that way when making devlogs. I do make it looks easy when people see me code or even do things that seems simple to me, but can be quite hard for someone just starting.
Of course it might not be the case for everyone and might not even apply to the way you make yours but I think it's just something super interesting to think about haha
I remember maybe a year ago I saw my first dani video and he made it look so easy that the next day I got myself unity, blender and visual studio. I watched like two tutorials and I tried to make a game. It went terribly and within a week I quit because I thought I just wasn't able to do this. But now, a year later I I actually working on my game and its going really well.
I know how that feels, it’s easy to fall into that trap even knowing about it. I’m glad you went back to your project and hope it keeps going well mate
@@DarkDax thank you so much. Only a few days ago I started learning mirror networking for my project called "shop drifting"( I have a channel for it on TH-cam) . Do you have any advice on where to start leaning mirror?
@@martyboi5609 when I did my fall guys video the documentation was actually pretty useful and clear (not all docs usually are updated or clear). But for extra understanding this series helped me out: th-cam.com/play/PLS6sInD7ThM1aUDj8lZrF4b4lpvejB2uB.html
Nice video. I like to think that there are two types of devlogs. Entertainment devlogs, and technical devlogs. Entertainment devlogs tend to get more views, while they pass off on the technical things to appeal to a wider audience, especially those not into game development themselves. While technical devlogs go in more depth on the technical side of things, and problems the developer faced. However, these videos can tend to get less views because essentially your audience is mainly made up of people who under stand at least a bit of game devlopment/programming. Not to say there aren't any successful technical devlog channels/videos though. Personally, I try to create a mix in my ongoing devlog series. I'm not just going to ignore a problem that I was stuck on for hours/days, but at the same time I don't want to focus on that issue too much, as I think a wider audience likes to see progress, not setbacks. Just my take though.
Oh definitely! Different channels will focus on different aspects of it and all are completely valid and great. There's no point in dragging out the issues you had in development and there's great ways to mention them without it sounding completely uninteresting haha. It's a puzzle of how we present talking about struggles without making it either too dull or giving the impression we're Jimmy Neutron haha
The more you think you can do something the more likely you are to try. Dev TH-camrs are inspiring people, and yes, they will get frustrated, but that’s part of being a developer in the first place.
If it's something you just want to do you'll get there eventually. Sure it's still gonna take a while and you'll have some challenges but you'll make progress no matter how big or small. It applies to everything!
Beautiful video I was thinking of making a channel for game Dev myself but still battling with c# game development creators deserve more that what they have
@@fkalanzay as long as you understand the concept of Object Oriented Programming, are familiar with the pillars of OOP, and learn the basics of C#, that’ll be a great runway to get started. You’ll always be learning so don’t wait until you’ve mastered anything because you’ll be waiting a long time haha. Try making Mario like game with C# first and then build your skills from there. The only direction is up!
This is a fantastic example of why my devlogs fail. Because they show the good and bad, so some of it is a bit rough to get through. Also my humor is the wooooorst! 😘
The way i percieve devlogs as is a marketing strategy to show off what you have done so far. I don't think you should base your skills base on that. I fully agree with your video and hope you prosper!
Oh there's no doubt some of them are or become that, but there's also those that share experiments and mini projects - the glorious Sam Hogan comes to mind. Thanks Syed, right back at you!
Randy is one of the most real ones on here. There is nothing more relatable than crawling through a project not understanding why it’s not working, only to find out you’ve been a dumb dumb haha
Sometimes always working hard makes it hard to appreciate when you do and that's when breaks are useful as difficult has it can be sometimes to take them!
Yea you did made me more aware that I am often under influence of this youtuber get's everything righ first time when I do on my own something I get into dead end way more often. To realize that this are edited or planed in advance video that hide many part's of development process.
@@openroomxyz definitely mate, it’s largely smoke and mirrors for some, sped up for others and lingers for the rest of them. Just takes some time identifying which is which!
Dreams is something I've always wanted to try out. Unfortunately I don't have it, however I might do some day (probably on stream!). If that does happen, it'll take me a while to work everything out (seeing as people have made some pretty incredible stuff using it) but I'd maybe consider doing a video if I get the hang of it - and even get it!
it took me 2 years to a make a working car phyiscs model, dani did in 2 weeks, I died inside when I saw him do so, but now thinking about it, after playing his and playing with mine, holy is my own physics model so much better, he used a step by step guide and a couple of tutorials. I studied vehicle dynamics and coding my own interpretation of my studies.
I know that feeling mate. Also it's important to remember that a lot of devs will search for third party solutions has they don't need a bespoke solution, whereas you did and you achieved it!
At 0:47 "Everybody knows not one aspect of game development is simple" sort of counter-arguing your own point. :) Assuming we all know game development is hard, why do you feel like we need to highlight the challenges more? I think for me, when I make a dev log I'm focused entirely on showing people the progress I've made, and not really thinking about talking about my struggles as much. I think this is probably the case for most dev logs.
Well for the reasons I mention in the video haha. While we all know it’s difficult, it’s still not entirely shown in a lot of Dev logs we watch which over time can possibly lead to the false interpretation that maybe what we find hard is because we’re bad or not ‘trying hard enough’. The less you see other people acknowledge their own struggles the more it can affect your perception of your own progress or experience. Like I said, not all Dev logs need to address it, some are purely more for entertainment or teaching or just showing something off which can’t really apply this sort of thing, but by acknowledging it more you’re probably helping and motivating more aspiring and current devs in the process.
Glad you enjoy them! The pacing is always something I fight myself over. Sometimes it feels fast or slow. Feedback from you guys is great for these sorts of things so thank you!
In my opinion devlog is marketing material in the order to make you and your game popular of course hides many off strangle game development have One off The reasons I don't do devlog for my own game is because the need spend extra work and time in the order to do that, and to be honest I don't have that extra time right now
Oh totally - there’s definitely a huge portion of devlogs that double up as marketing whether they start off as that or not. It’s definitely a viable marketing strategy. Yeah mate I feel that. It’s definitely time consuming and a massive reason why it’s not always a great option depending on your current situation or development strategy.
i have to say its in the game development educational content too, it actually plagues education as a whole, its in education as well... and most of the times human error plagues good intended efforts, do you have the heart to tell someone that didnt help at all while you dont have any clue what you are doing? its complicated and i think we need a new word for this feeling.
23 gamedevs got triggered n butthurt by the title, but didn't watch the vid 🙄 Great vid mate! I expose my flaws, difficulties n failures in my vids, coz it's real n the right thing to do. I don't understand why the fakest devloggers have the biggest following. Oh well, life goes on
Thanks mate! There's always a way to talk about these things without being boring or including too much detail, besides it's important for everyone's perception of the difficulty - even our own!
in my experience programming is "hmmmm okay" art is "oh God" and audio and music design is "aaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr"
And the flip side is people like BigFry or SydAlpha go after game dev's with very little understanding of what the games they are reviewing have taken to create, then give horrible reviews because they have a mindset that being a game dev is easy, This is not helped by some devs making it look that way.
I don't know those channels in particular but your point does point out general gaming channels that dedicate themselves to seeking out 'bad' indie games for an 'entertaining' video, throwing the effort that possibly went into that game (unbeknownst to the viewer) out the window. Sure there's a lot of bad games and some are bad because they just didn't care (some Steam Greenlight titles come to mind and probably a couple of my own), but there's no doubt that just as many of these games are stepping stones in someone's or a group of people's game dev journey. Context of the game's creation is key. Looking at it from that point of view makes it almost too hard to watch.
If you Program anything then you know programming is not easy .. why tell people what they should already know. It's like learning Mandarin Chinese or something :D If you've tried then you know what path you are on. There are some Amazing videos on the whole development process of a game which help so much with the later development processes. P.S - I find the only real hard part is the Time it takes .. which turns me off sometimes :P But Hard work is ALWAYS worth it :D
Sorry that I'm late to the party, but isn't this a problem with social media in general? Where everyone is perfect all the time- except for all the other moments in the day not captured in that witty tweet or insta photo.
Good video, but I think, much worse then devlogs - from this point of view - are all the videos like "I make minecraft in 3 hours" or "I make 99 games in a month" or "Hold my beer, I make 30 games per second"
As I mention in my video even though I did that for a video, I agree. I think it’s great for challenging you and limiting how long you spend doing it but you tend to stop following and learning good practices in order to ‘just get it done’.
Randy truly does show the success and struggles of game dev. What doesn’t look like much is actually pretty big wins. It’s a pretty realistic view into to how game dev actually goes. Some weeks you get a lot done, others not so much.
Everyone has different levels of experience, but that doesn't allow them able to create everything flawlessly. The idea that they can or that experience means you'll never struggle at some point I think can affect anyone's self reflection of their progress. That's why I think it's good to shine more of a genuine light on difficulties (of which a lot of devlogs already do very well).
It feels so good to fix a bug in a game you feel like you are the smartest person in the world 🤣
And that's exactly how it should be! Sometimes that bug takes some proper effort to figure out and fix, let alone find haha
There is only one better feeling if you code something new and it just works right out of the box. The effect gets exponentially more intense the longer you coded before checking xD. It just doesn't happen very often though lol.
I can remember several times where I would go through find a bug, think about it for a second and realize what the problem was and scream “I’m a genius!!” just because of how happy I was to find the cause.
@@PhodexGames when you've been going at it for several lines just to have that feeling taken away by a single missing comma
Fixing a bug is like solving a murder that you yourself did
Fighting yourself, your motivation, the stress of real life, balancing all your responsibilities, focusing your priorities; these are all things that make game dev hard, these are the things that make being human hard. Shit is hard. Fuck.
Right there with you. The least we can do is make it easier on ourselves but there's only so much we can do. We just got to persevere and help each other as best we can.
Yep and I started making my dream game when I was in my parents house and when you have all that responsibility added with your game it’s not fun at all
It probably wasn’t the best idea to watch all these videos making it seem so easy when I was starting my journey, in the end it just made me think “wow Im so bad at this thing” and started to lose motivation to keep going until I eventually gave up
That's exactly why I wanted to make this video because I've felt like that too. If you've not given it another shot since giving up, try again! Remember this time that it's gonna take a while because you're not just learning "how to make a game", you're also learning how to program, model, texture, the engine, blah blah blah - they're entirely different areas! But most of all, don't take the perception of how easy it 'should' be from devlogs, some of them are good at being accurate but just as many are really not. You got this!
@@DarkDax thanks for the words man, I’ll give it another try!
You definitely have a good point, but I do believe that its partially the viewer's job to make themselves not get demotivated from looking at other people's stuff. I know that if I didn't make devlogs, I wouldn't have anywhere near the same amount of motivation to make games, so I guess I don't really have the perspective of someone who just works on their projects quietly. Showing the full process behind making games can be pretty boring though, as I'd say at least 50 percent of my time goes into repetitive tasks like 3d modeling and level design. Good video, its always a good idea to take a step back and look at something from a different perspective, and yours is pretty interesting!
Thanks I really appreciate that! It definitely helps to have something alongside what you're doing that actively pushes you to keep doing it or gives self-sustaining motivation, but way more people don't, can't or just don't want to do devlogs (or similar) than those that do. You're right about elements that can be boring, it's all about balance which I'm sure those of us that make them struggle with every video haha.
I am so damn glad I found this video. Not only do devlogs drastically under represent the amount of time and effort going into making something look average. The devlogs themselves are an entire process to make that can take as long as the feature that you are covering in said devlog
There's so much effort that comes from so many different areas of life that at first seem irrelevant which actually are really relevant. Game Dev ain't easy, and neither is video creation.
You've clearly not watched many of mine! I don't feel like an outlier either; plenty of Devs in my feed give honest appraisals of the difficulties. It does depend on the aims of the TH-cam game Dev - whether it's purely to entertain, to teach, an actual log of work/life or cynical game marketing. Detail and strife don't fit in an entertainment video. Memes get in the way of tutorials. Some manage to blend them together but they tend to spend huge effort in editing.
Great video, really enjoyed it.
You're right, it's completely contextual on what the purpose of the video is - after all not everything fits. Thanks!
James Dyson spent 15 years making 5,127 prototypes before he perfected the Dyson vacuum cleaner we know today. We don't acknowledge that perfect things don't just happen immediately, we like to see the final outcome yes, but as game developers we don't mind seeing the pitfalls in devlogs. Some people may think it's just useless filler to add in the problems and challenges faced, just to get the video past 10 minutes, however I think it's very important for everyone, no matter what skill level you're at, to accept that even the most professional developers face these kinds of issues at times. Failure is perfectly normal, if we just won at everything first time we would never learn from our mistakes. But it's up to you to turn that failure into success.
You speak right from my soul. I sometimes feel that some of the larger, entertainment-focused game dev TH-camrs make it seem easy to make a game and I feel that also discredits the effort and skill of some developers that really want to make a fun game for their community, instead of creating a prototype to use in a few videos. It's also confusing to see sometimes that people that want to deliver real value to people, in form of a game, get way less recognition, than people that just play the clown in front of the camera, talking about game dev.
I think we’ve all felt this way at some point. I try to avoid falling into the same trap but only others can say whether I achieved it or not.
Your second point really hits home. I think it’s because more people are willing to watch random one offs than journeys to building an experience which is a shame.
It’s easy to undermine your own effort with videos that don’t necessarily expose the difficulty than those you see naturally through genuine raw Devlogs.
@@DarkDax What I struggle with in particular is that I could just put all the effort into videos and be way more successful with them, but then there won't really be a game, but if you put the effort in the game, I can hardly turn that alone into something very entertaining to watch, at least for the mainstream gamers. I try to achieve exactly that for nearly two years now, but it's hard to turn such a technical topic, which game dev is, into something entertaining for everyone.
@Broco8 i dunno much. but Im pretty sure he's taking KARLSON seriously and working hard on it though.
@Broco8 Yes, for example, I mean don't get me wrong, that guy definitely has some entertainment skills, but I was really disappointed to see him throw away his whole stickman game as he became popular. That shows that he didn't really care about the game.
@@arav7737 You are probably right, but honestly, he can already be sure his game will be financially successful with a following of a few million people, which make it pretty easy to stay motivated, also KARLSON, though looking fun, is a pretty simple casual game, you can probably create in 4-6 months, including marketing.
I found your channel like, 20 minutes ago, and I have to say you're now one of my favorite programming/game dev youtubers. Not only you care to deeply research a subject, you also present it in an entertaining way, I'm subscribing right now!
(Also, sorry if my English is a broken mess, it's not my native language)
Wow thanks Stacklysm, that means a lot haha. Makes my day it comes across as intended, makes the effort that much more worth it!
(Also your English is perfect and probably better than mine and I speak it hahaha)
Great points you made here. Posting videos and devlogs must take away a lot of the stress that people that work long hours alone in a dark room may face.
This video was definitely needed, great work 🙂
Thanks Reece! Really appreciate it man!
I remember the "I made minecraft in 24 hours" and it's frustrating because it was for me 4 months for a project in a university subject
I’d love to see devlogs where they show the code, even sped up, just seeing them do it would be so cool. “So I just added a slide mechanic” - ok, that’d take me hours, I’d love to see how you do it. And then 5 seconds later they’ve moved onto the next thing they did
I think that’s one of the major things that can really affect how you view your own progress. It doesn’t need to be done for every single thing, but if the core of the video focuses on it I think it really helps to show how it works rather than just seeing it working.
The only problem is not everyone wants to see code. In my first few devlogs I had sections of the code getting typed at 10 times speed and the analytics would show that those are the times when people would leave. Take it I probably didn't execute it in the best way. I do agree that it's a problem and probably one that I fall for in my videos. In a tutorial I showed a function and someone mentioned how I must be pretty smart to do that but at the same time that function alone took me a few hours to get right and I never told anyone. I'll definitely try to start showing how it actually happens for me to help fix the problem.
@@arithmetic1938 To people who don't understand code, it looks like either garbled nonsense or a language of ancient gods that their tiny brains couldn't possibly comprehend.
There's a game that I play that gets updated regularly, but it doesn't have an update log. I asked on discord how I would get a sense for what changes with each update, and they gave me a git hub link. I went there and found nothing of value because it was all either code or things talking about code.
I think the code stuff should always be included somewhere, but it should be separated from everything else. Have one page that has the code, and another that explains what the code does. Simple as that, I hope?
I think it might also be due to the fact that some of these guys "hide" their code because they work hard on it and dont want someone to easily be able to replicate their result by essentially copying and pasting. I love to read and understand the code too but i see it from both sides :)
Having code on screen is infamous for killing viewer retention in videos, so most people just don't do it.
What about the fact that making videos is also way harder than it looks?
This resonated in my soul
Hey mate! Thanks for the great video and for the shout out. I wish I saw this sooner, admittedly I don't watch a whole lot of dev tube for the reasons we both discussed, but I'm certainly glad a community member sent me this today! Very much enjoyed, wishing you the best with your channel.
Thanks man I appreciate it and thanks for being a such a great down-to-earth voice within in the game development community! I've been subbed for a while and your videos have been a great source of reset and motivation. Keep up the great work and good luck with your game!
This is why I try to cry at least once in all of my devlogs.
Don’t forget to apologise too I hear that really adds to it
Even though I'm not a game developer, I can totally relate with the message. Most videos and articles talking about big projects don't even mention typical struggles, and what they entail... unless it's for an entertainment purpose
Yeah, and I can understand why they wouldn't for entertainment (by literal definition haha). I know I do appreciate those videos that do acknowledge it regardless of whether it's a quick mention or a bit more detail. Just helps your mindset haha
I couldn't agree more Dax! As someone who's made over 30 devlogs, I feel I could have done a much better job at acknowledging just how excruciatingly hard it was. I can only speak for myself here, but I think many gamedev youtubers feel a pressure to make everything look easy so as to look competent, and to get boosted by the TH-cam algorithm. And with the high expectations of gamers, I have this fear that if you show even just a little bit of vulnerability then people will think you have no idea what you're doing and watch someone else.
It really got to me because so many TH-camrs around me were pumping out new devlogs every week with ground-breaking new features while I had been stuck on a single mechanic for over six months. Nothing I ever did felt good enough; "I should have finished this by now" became my every waking thought. But when I started looking deeper, watching Bungie's old Halo 2 ViDocs and talking to my other game dev friends, I found that they all struggle with the same problems that I do, and I started to feel better about myself. Turns out game development is actually very hard. Turns out struggling is normal, and maybe I'm not a terrible developer just because I can't make a triple-A experience in two days. I'm relieved to know that there are people still who are hungry for an honest look into the game development process-warts and all.
I strongly dislike the recent rise of the "I MADE MINECRAFT IN 1 MINUTE" videos because I know from experience that those don't accurately show what the process is like, but unfortunately that's what the TH-cam algorithm rewards. You nailed it right on the head-the less we acknowledge this effort in our videos, the more we skew other people's perceptions of their own effort-and because of this I've had to stop myself from watching devlogs altogether.
I've bottled up these thoughts for a long time so I'm so glad I found your video today, you capture the sentiment perfectly!
So glad to see I'm far from alone in have this feeling haha. Like you say it's definitely something that's been lost for many a reason (entertainment factor being the main one) but I feel it could and should be slowly introduced into more devlogs again. Obviously I'm not talking about having a full 5-10 minutes analysis, but at least some form of acknowledgement that _this is bloody hard_ and you everyone goes through it regardless of how easy or hard a feature/system/mechanic is perceived to be.
I really do agree with you on the time based title videos. Yeah they could be good to get more experience in lots of different areas, but you don't necessarily get to practice good practices under the constraint. I've actually did this for my Fall Guy clone but it's more of a technicality. Rather than 24 straight hours its 24 hours of overall work time. I bring attention to it at the end but I technically still did it.
Wish you luck with your future developments man! I've actually seen a few of your devlogs before a good year or so ago! Glad to see it's all still going well :D
I've been thinking this for so long finally someone said it!!
I think it might be an underlying feeling a lot in the game dev community have, and hopefully this video helps acknowledge that!
Oh man, I really can't understand those "dislike" reactions over there. This video is pure gold and needs to be shared more. Thanks!
No, thank you! Glad you found the video useful, hopefully others will too!
Jiminy Cricketing Christ why hasn't this channel gotten bigger yet?! Seriously, you've like single-handedly got me interested in these coding and Game Dev type videos and led me to other great channel that do the same. I'm not sure why you haven't exploded into the algorithm yet, but when you do, I'm glad to say I was here to see it.
Wow, that's made my day! It makes me really happy to hear that - there are so many amazing channels out there that deserve the attention too and I'm glad you've found some! If that day ever comes, I'll be glad you were with us!
@@DarkDax YOO, thanks for responding man, I feel honored! Trust me though, that days gonna come my man, you just gotta keep it up!
I don't know what's the feeling of coding because i only make pixel art and audio,but i think i can relate to this video
This definitely isn't limited to game devlogs, I'm almost certain it relates to all sorts of videos alike. So if you feel you can relate, you just do.
The volume of dev logs TH-cam has started shoving in my face due to the almighty algorithm is actually giving me a lot of anxiety lol. Glad this video was in the mix, just what I needed to get back to work.
Someone else said that because you know it’s hard then you shouldn’t get affected by it, but that doesn’t account for the accumulated affect when you watch many Dev logs over time.
Super important to remember that most aren’t showing you a similar struggle they went through making what they made to what you do when working in your projects. It’s hard to remember though, so acknowledgement is what we all need from time to time!
Hope you work goes well!
from how much i've seen most devlogs make everything look too easy while real development looks like 'missing ";" at line 1042' and constant stackoverflowing
Dude don't even get me started on trying to solve issues that suddenly disappear on restarting your IDE... after 45 minutes of debugging
Me crying here with OS compatibility. *Why doesn't (insert "X" library here) work with Linux?*
You always have a fantastic perspective on things like this. Well done, mate.
Thanks man! It's just something I think is easy to fall into the trap of having watched many of them myself too.
5:57: I literally spent at least 6 hours trying to figure this out in unity, the hard part when I got the cube to rotate sidways and have the camera follow it, because for multiple hours I missed transform.right and transform.up in the documentation, so I thought only transform.forward existed and when I tried to find out how to do it because I'm not entirely a math genius.
Wow mate, this is a nice video! How much truth there is in this video, I feel very identified!
Glad you enjoyed it mate! Love your Mario Odyssey 3D to 2D video!
@@DarkDax oh did you watch it? Thanks! 😃
@@Rhomita Yeah it was great!
well, i already knew i couldn't do game dev before finding devlogs, so they're just kind of a fun thing to watch for me.
but i have seen comments on them that say some variation of "how'd you do this?" or "wow, you made that look easy" or what have you.
Oh totally - different devlogs will represent different things to different people. Some just love watching them and others look to them for motivation and education. Very versatile!
You are nothing but right. I'll be starting up devlogs for a game i've been planning for a while. And i really want to show people all the things that can, will & might go wrong. Because mistakes are among the most valuable learning experiences.
Thank you for making this video. It really helped with that feeling of incompetence
That's exactly why I wanted to make this video because that's how I felt every now and then for the exact same reasons. Glad it helped you feel better!
Great video and really important topic :)
I followed my life long dream and founded my own game studio in 2016. We began work on a few minor projects but never managed to get far as we constantly needed money for our salaries (which were below minimum wages).
We helped grow and build other companies, got screwed over, lost a ton of money, got sued... Twice...
Now I'm the only one left at the company and I've been been forced to take another job for my family's sake and I now work on my solo project every night and every weekend I can. I even made a deal with the company I work for to only work 4 days a week so that I might have an entire day's worth of work on my own project.
Game development is hard, it requires a bunch of knowledge and a great understanding of many disciplines and their interconnectivity.
Thanks for making this video mate!
You earned a sub
Ahh thanks mate that means a lot!
Thanks for sharing your experience, as stressful as it must have been at times it’s stories like this that need to be heard more. It’s great down-to-earth realism.
I hope your project continues to go well and good luck!
@@DarkDax Thanks mate :)
I agree, we need to stop visualising game development as the great life as more often than not people will have less money, less time and more stress than what should be considered acceptable.
On a different note, I've been considering being more public about my project and my story on TH-cam for quite some time. I used to make unity and blender tutorials about 8 years ago, but video editing is really not my thing, do you do your own video editing or can you recommend someone?
@@kennethberle4265 anytime! I think it’s always a shock to people how little free time you get between projects and work too - at least that’s how I feel currently haha.
Yeah you should do it! I do all my editing myself, it’s just years of on and off practice through this channel to be honest and it gets the job done haha. I don’t really know any editors but I can suggest finding a software that gets the job done and learning the basics (cutting and stuff) is all you really need! Audio is always more important at the end of the day.
I look forward to hearing more about it! :D
@@DarkDax Yeah, especially the balance between family life, work and spare time projects is a tough one. Best of luck with it mate, it must be tough!
You know what, I think I will : )
That sounds like a mouthful, but I guess it's worst the first couple of times : )
I've been using Da Vinci for a couple of months now, but if you have better suggestions please do let me know : )
How much time do you approximately spend on editing?
it seems like there's a sliding scale between "bulleted patch notes" and "livestream". and both of those take minimal effort compared to filming and editing a video to present a discrete segment of work, which probably sits in the middle. there are an awful lot of devlogs that go with the dude perfect approach of only putting in the final take, so to speak. but the ones that include the dev talking about the difficulties in the development process, i usually end up fast-forwarding through that part, even though i think more devlogs should address it. maybe it's for the same reason that so few scientists are decent science communicators. so are the best devlogs also stories, with a conflict arc and resolution?
This is all brilliant. It's really interesting you mention that about skipping those bits but would still appreciate if they were included anyway. You're right about your 'sliding scale', it's either one way or another or somewhere in-between. And it's true, when you think about it, some devlogs become virally successful based on factors outside the scope of the topic, whereas others manage to get the attention they deserve within the scope based on exactly that, the scope.
I just hope it doesn't affect people's view of themselves like it has me in the past.
@@DarkDax maybe at the very least a devlog ought to include the computer clock in the screen capture, so the viewer can infer the passage of time. and i would imagine that more successful devlogs tend to be those that resemble video essays in their presentation.
Yeah any reference to length or effort would be good. Like I say it doesn't need to be dramatic but it at least needs to be more recognised.
As a struggling solo developer, It's always good to be reminded that none of us really know what we're doing
It’s definitely one of those things we all know but don’t realise we needed reminding until we are.
Bruh I love this. I think that a lot of game players who don’t design games professionally know how game development works and devlogs kinda make it harder to break this perception
You are CRIMINALLY underrated.
I love how you tackle these topics. I've been trying to get on gamedev as a hobbyist for a few years now and I never got the motivation to finish it because I went about things very very wrong.
I stopped focusing on doing everything on tutorials and going auto pilot, and realizing that it's a skill that's going to take a while to create a strong basis of is great to give you a sense of reality.
Note that I'm still going to pursue it, as it is definitely still in my radar or interest, I just haven't had the time to do so, though I'll be grinding it soon.
Thanks, I'm glad you enjoy these sorts of videos! Definitely try again when you get the chance, it's super hard to find the time but when you do you'll do great!
Yess emotionally engaging with our creative process is so essential and I think recognizing effort and frustration as obstacles are great ways to connect to that
It's really strange how we don't celebrate our own successes more in being afraid of coming across as egotistical. Creative stuff is hard, be proud!
As a struggling freelance digital artist myself, I always know how it feels like to meet the expectations of the industry. I personally think that it is a less artist-based problem rather than a media-industry problem. Time/Efficiency is more important than an in-depth exploration of deep unique character designs in our current freelance market - and departing from the path from functional design in a Million Dollar Project is just too risky and a simple No-Go for the companies. I personally crave to explore my full creative potential - but at the end of the day, I have to earn my living and do what I am paid to do.
This is a great follow-up to Lost Relic's video. People need to talk about the hardships more because they definitely used to make me feel like I was just not doing something right haha. Cheers!
Thanks! It's definitely easier to fall into that trap then most people think!
That's one of the things I value about Sebastian Lague's videos; for most of it, it seems as though he's been granted the gift of omniscience with how easily he implements very complex-sounding things, but then he intersperses it with compilations of failed attempts that are quite relieving, lol.
Sebastian is honestly just a god of devlogs. Not only are his videos calmingly entertaining and attempt to explain his process (and failings), but he manages to sometimes create a story to tell or a cinematic masterpiece.
so I've been in working on my devlog, and I'm wondering if I should acknowledge a lot of the problems and it or not. If I spent time showing the problems and fixing them, that could get really boring to watch. But it would be more realistic.
I'm not a 3D modeler, and it took me like 3 hours to model, Rick, and weight paint they pretty basic character, but I guess I'm going to have to speed that up to last about 2 minutes, and most of the time was actually spent troubleshooting issues like topology and weight paints
I think if the problem is relevant to the overall creation of what you're focusing on (as in what the video is actually about) then include it, but try and balance it. Obviously I'm not saying 3 minutes of talking about it (that's overkill), it's good enough to even have just a quick 20 seconds of genuinely mentioning the issues, but the balance will be different and you'll feel it while making each video.
I think a few people will think I'm talking about adding an entire section of the video dedicated to issues, that's not it. It's rather the quality of the discussion we have about them within similar timeframe. It's reflective, supportive, and expressive - not depressive. It does everyone a load of good.
At the end of the day, what you want to include in your video is ultimately up to you because it's yours. It's all about finding the balance that's right for the sort of angle you want to be at.
I always state how difficult something is. That's why I can't keep a consistent upload schedule.
Me neither mate hahaha
@@DarkDax 😂
Absolutely, I am totally agreeing with you and am happy to see you highlighting this topic.
I unfortunately see so many aspiring game developers quit just because they got a wrong perspective on how long games take to build. Even though these are high potential developers. 🙌
Whether you’re new or deep within it, it really does affect the perception of all. I think people see themselves as more tolerant to these sorts of things than they really are.
Thankfully there is a big community where we can share and support each other across the internet! Just got to find them first!
This thing about "seeing a system that looks easy to do, just to try making it and finding out that you're absolutely wrong about it" it's one of those things that change my vision about a lot of games. Hell, once I tried to do a shell system like the ones in Super Mario Bros, just to get utterly frustated and give up. I came back the next day with my mind clearer and nailed. Such an amazing feeling.
That's exactly it! Everyone has those moments whether it's documented or not. Sometimes it just takes a break and a fresh mindset another day despite how much our brains tell us not to haha.
I started following Brackeys' tutorial on how to make a game in Unity and if I'm being honest it feels good. I was happy when I made a cube move, when the camera started following the player, how the collision worked nicely, how the movement stopped after hitting an obstacle. I knew game dev was hard but even small game mechanic as player controls was so hard to make into reality.
I never really thought about this before, but I 100 percent agree with you. I guess I'm also part of the problem, but from this day forward I'll try to help be the solution.
This video! 🔥 I was just thinking bout how simple many of the game dev logs make it look.
Thanks mate!
I can understand it being a real dilemma even in my own devlogs, because most of its mundane and doesn't speak to a wider audience, but also isn't that interesting and balancing the videos content can make it harder. If we put in every detail the video would just go on and on and on. I do try to say things like something took forever or I didn't know what I was doing to give perspective.
Great video overall, something that a lot of aspiring people need to be aware of.
Thanks! Yeah I complete get where you're coming from. It really is a difficult balance to get right and sometimes it doesn't work without disrupting the whole video. Obviously it's not necessary but it would probably help a lot more people than you initially think.
solid watch, tbh I feel like watching other people almost inspires me to work harder, and be more consistent with working on coding ( even if it's just 15minutes a day), solid lessons to learn when it comes to being self taught at anything, and that's why it's always beneficial to find a group of people also sharing a similar goal, or at least that's what has been helping me ( I have joined many game dev discords, and they are all welcoming and willing to help if you get stuck). The community around the game dev space is awesome!! Subbed!!!
Oh definitely! There's no doubt that devlogs can be incredibly motivating (those I've watched today have been). Devlogs are all different and that's where it _can_ come from. This community is definitely one of the few that can genuinely come together and it's amazing.
(Loved your most recent devlog btw!)
Great video!
It gave me alot to reflect on. I feel like I'm at a stage now where I can make somewhat complex functionalities in my game, but as you say the context shouldnt go missing - the hours/days that I had to spend/struggle initially trying to solve "simple" problems were and are themselves an important piece in the puzzle that we should all appreciate and highlight
Keep up the good work! No doubt it took a lot to get to where you are and it's that I feel should be shared, applauded and talked about more. Got to respect what we've done regardless of the difficulty!
@@DarkDax right on!
True, everyone should be proud of they work, everything took huge amount of time until you have learned to do it.
This is just what I needed today. Thank you kind sir!
You're very welcome! Glad you got something out of it!
Really getting tempted now to make a "Real devlog of a real dev" showing how hard it is and taking a few jabs at the guys making it look easy on the way
that reminds me of that matrix style software dev video cutting to google haha
Bro I had this entire topic subconsciously in my mind but you put it words really well
Glad I was able to echo how you feel!
Very true. Devlogs can often gloss over details, especially the boring ones. Some devs talk about it but the most part if they even try it will put off all but the most interested game dev.
That's really true. Like I say it's a balance between watching for entertainment value and including that informative and realistic side, but I believe there's a balance somewhere! Just got to find it haha
I'm not making games at the moment, but I make websites. They look pretty simple on the outside, but still took 200-300 hours to make because of the back end including the API. You can't see that if you look at a simple Bootstrap website.
Effort is often judged by how something looks. That’s how people start getting warped perceptions and when those who know no better start to pipe up. They’ve got no clue you’ve been navigating all these frameworks, learning and solving issues unique to your project.
This is so true. Yesterday (Since I am a beginner) I was looking for 3.5 hours to find how to make a jump in a platformer.
Let's be honest, it's not exactly easy to do that either haha - especially with the different ways you can do it. I'm happy for you!
@@DarkDax Thank you!
I am here just impressed by all those people who have time and power left in them to ADDITIONALLY to making a game also make a high-quality presentation abut what they have done, which would probably took at least a week to make.
It's a very impressive grind that's not limited to those who make devlogs. Game Development is hard to do, but sticking with it is even harder. It's a real flex of the willpower muscle haha
Not gonna lie, it is often pretty disheartening given the prevalent emergence of devlogging nowadays that the vast majority of them is written from the perspecetive of post-mortem - or post-problem as I like to call it within the context.
People come up with such crazy sophisticated solutions that it leaves you speechless, but hardly any devlog ever talks about the process of the problem-solving itself - which would be tremendous help for budding game developers.
Heck, imo it got so 'perfectionalized' that it has detrimental effects on the Dev-Audience relation. I wish a lot of gruesome to my worst enemies, but stumbling over an incredibly convoluted bug to problem solve ain't one of them. Especially with an audience breathing down your neck that Appeals To Flawlessness - 'because hey look if XYZ can do it, why can't you'.
"XYZ can do it so why can't you" is definitely an issue with online culture in general. In a lot of communities it's not a common but there's definitely that pressure to 'match' if not 'top' another person, but it's simply has no bearing on anything really.
It's that balance between keeping people through entertainment and educating through experience that's tricky to get right. Some devlogs are more one way or the other and it's possible that there may never be a true 'perfect balance' of both.
I completely relate to the disheartening feeling and I find it comes from the voice in the back of your head that compares _everything_ . Over coming it can be done, but hell does it take time and effort!
ChrisseyTee - 1, frustrating gamedev problems - 1569
I always mention my struggles in my devlogs.
I partially agree partially disagree with you if I may 😅 (as someone very new in devlog makery)
Many devlog channels are more in entertainment category than blogs, they focus on the "wow effect" of the things to get to more people. So it would be more appealing, sharable and eye catching. Maybe main purpose is to make a video, but not to make the game for some. But I cannot judge or criticize anyone's decision.
If you go too technical it slowly turns into a tutorial, if you barely post your progress it turns into some boring look at what I made video, adding a little fun and chat is definitely a need to keep people engaged. You'd want people to know about your product after all.
I try to add details about technical difficulties I have sometimes, and I tell people about my struggles so they can maybe find some use of my experiences. I find my devlogs kind of boring and but balanced in showcase-tech details scale. Hope I can improve it by time.
Ah I finished and posted my comment when I was half way the video, now I agree with you more :D
Oh yeah there’s no doubt there’s a balance to get right with this sort of thing. I guess it depends on what your devlogs actual purpose is.
The balance is hard, I definitely haven’t got it down yet so we’re in the same boat there mate hahaha. We’ll get there!
I mostly watch dev logs for entertainment and know like nothing about coding and defiently if a developer goes to much in to code on those videos i kinda jst zone out
Thank you for sharing that and the awesome comedy!
Thanks for watching! I’m glad you enjoyed it!
Huh I never though about it that way when making devlogs. I do make it looks easy when people see me code or even do things that seems simple to me, but can be quite hard for someone just starting.
Of course it might not be the case for everyone and might not even apply to the way you make yours but I think it's just something super interesting to think about haha
I remember maybe a year ago I saw my first dani video and he made it look so easy that the next day I got myself unity, blender and visual studio. I watched like two tutorials and I tried to make a game. It went terribly and within a week I quit because I thought I just wasn't able to do this. But now, a year later I I actually working on my game and its going really well.
I know how that feels, it’s easy to fall into that trap even knowing about it. I’m glad you went back to your project and hope it keeps going well mate
@@DarkDax thank you so much. Only a few days ago I started learning mirror networking for my project called "shop drifting"( I have a channel for it on TH-cam) . Do you have any advice on where to start leaning mirror?
@@martyboi5609 when I did my fall guys video the documentation was actually pretty useful and clear (not all docs usually are updated or clear). But for extra understanding this series helped me out: th-cam.com/play/PLS6sInD7ThM1aUDj8lZrF4b4lpvejB2uB.html
Nice video. I like to think that there are two types of devlogs. Entertainment devlogs, and technical devlogs. Entertainment devlogs tend to get more views, while they pass off on the technical things to appeal to a wider audience, especially those not into game development themselves. While technical devlogs go in more depth on the technical side of things, and problems the developer faced. However, these videos can tend to get less views because essentially your audience is mainly made up of people who under stand at least a bit of game devlopment/programming. Not to say there aren't any successful technical devlog channels/videos though. Personally, I try to create a mix in my ongoing devlog series. I'm not just going to ignore a problem that I was stuck on for hours/days, but at the same time I don't want to focus on that issue too much, as I think a wider audience likes to see progress, not setbacks. Just my take though.
Oh definitely! Different channels will focus on different aspects of it and all are completely valid and great. There's no point in dragging out the issues you had in development and there's great ways to mention them without it sounding completely uninteresting haha. It's a puzzle of how we present talking about struggles without making it either too dull or giving the impression we're Jimmy Neutron haha
i was searching for something completely different, but then i saw it, & i couldn't stop, but it was a good video tbh :D
Thanks mate! Glad you enjoyed what you stumbled on haha
@@DarkDax Np :D
*Help i can't stop watching his old video's*
The more you think you can do something the more likely you are to try. Dev TH-camrs are inspiring people, and yes, they will get frustrated, but that’s part of being a developer in the first place.
If it's something you just want to do you'll get there eventually. Sure it's still gonna take a while and you'll have some challenges but you'll make progress no matter how big or small. It applies to everything!
@@DarkDax Exactly!
Still waiting for this channel to blow up
Beautiful video I was thinking of making a channel for game Dev myself but still battling with c# game development creators deserve more that what they have
If you want to do it, go for it!
@@DarkDax sure will I want to master c# first I think it's important I do that
@@fkalanzay as long as you understand the concept of Object Oriented Programming, are familiar with the pillars of OOP, and learn the basics of C#, that’ll be a great runway to get started. You’ll always be learning so don’t wait until you’ve mastered anything because you’ll be waiting a long time haha.
Try making Mario like game with C# first and then build your skills from there. The only direction is up!
@@DarkDax thanks man I'll do just that
This channel deserves more subscribers
Wow, thanks so much!
This is a fantastic example of why my devlogs fail. Because they show the good and bad, so some of it is a bit rough to get through.
Also my humor is the wooooorst! 😘
Very good content, love your channel!
Thanks, glad you enjoy it!
The way i percieve devlogs as is a marketing strategy to show off what you have done so far. I don't think you should base your skills base on that.
I fully agree with your video and hope you prosper!
Oh there's no doubt some of them are or become that, but there's also those that share experiments and mini projects - the glorious Sam Hogan comes to mind.
Thanks Syed, right back at you!
Meanwhile Randy giving us the authentic programmer experience.... two weeks of stress and defeat because of a single variable he forgot existed
Randy is one of the most real ones on here. There is nothing more relatable than crawling through a project not understanding why it’s not working, only to find out you’ve been a dumb dumb haha
Just found your channel. Adding you to my list of devs with cool content on their channel. New sub ;)
Welcome aboard!
man, I have been burnt-out because I keept on pushing to no end. I always thought that I wasn't working hard enough 😤
Sometimes always working hard makes it hard to appreciate when you do and that's when breaks are useful as difficult has it can be sometimes to take them!
Thanks for making this!
Thank you for watching!
Yea you did made me more aware that I am often under influence of this youtuber get's everything righ first time when I do on my own something I get into dead end way more often. To realize that this are edited or planed in advance video that hide many part's of development process.
@@openroomxyz definitely mate, it’s largely smoke and mirrors for some, sped up for others and lingers for the rest of them. Just takes some time identifying which is which!
Really enjoyed this video, good job :)
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!
Question, if you mind answering, would you ever consider trying to make a game using Dreams on PlayStation 4 and 5?
Dreams is something I've always wanted to try out. Unfortunately I don't have it, however I might do some day (probably on stream!). If that does happen, it'll take me a while to work everything out (seeing as people have made some pretty incredible stuff using it) but I'd maybe consider doing a video if I get the hang of it - and even get it!
@@DarkDax ok, thanks for responding.
@@channel45853 anytime mate!
it took me 2 years to a make a working car phyiscs model, dani did in 2 weeks, I died inside when I saw him do so, but now thinking about it, after playing his and playing with mine, holy is my own physics model so much better, he used a step by step guide and a couple of tutorials. I studied vehicle dynamics and coding my own interpretation of my studies.
I know that feeling mate. Also it's important to remember that a lot of devs will search for third party solutions has they don't need a bespoke solution, whereas you did and you achieved it!
@@DarkDax thank you man
Some good points Dark!
Thanks mate! Hope your game's going well it looks great so far!
At 0:47 "Everybody knows not one aspect of game development is simple" sort of counter-arguing your own point. :) Assuming we all know game development is hard, why do you feel like we need to highlight the challenges more? I think for me, when I make a dev log I'm focused entirely on showing people the progress I've made, and not really thinking about talking about my struggles as much. I think this is probably the case for most dev logs.
Well for the reasons I mention in the video haha. While we all know it’s difficult, it’s still not entirely shown in a lot of Dev logs we watch which over time can possibly lead to the false interpretation that maybe what we find hard is because we’re bad or not ‘trying hard enough’.
The less you see other people acknowledge their own struggles the more it can affect your perception of your own progress or experience.
Like I said, not all Dev logs need to address it, some are purely more for entertainment or teaching or just showing something off which can’t really apply this sort of thing, but by acknowledging it more you’re probably helping and motivating more aspiring and current devs in the process.
I like Randys devlogs, he takes one step forward into a pit and geeps on going.
Randy is a mad lad and dapper one at that haha
Sir I'm a game dev but my laptop died and now I can't afford a new pc can I get some help from you please ❤️
I can work for you too
These videos are great, my only wish is that the pacing was a bit faster
Glad you enjoy them! The pacing is always something I fight myself over. Sometimes it feels fast or slow. Feedback from you guys is great for these sorts of things so thank you!
In my opinion devlog is marketing material in the order to make you and your game popular of course hides many off strangle game development have
One off The reasons I don't do devlog for my own game is because the need spend extra work and time in the order to do that,
and to be honest I don't have that extra time right now
Oh totally - there’s definitely a huge portion of devlogs that double up as marketing whether they start off as that or not. It’s definitely a viable marketing strategy.
Yeah mate I feel that. It’s definitely time consuming and a massive reason why it’s not always a great option depending on your current situation or development strategy.
i have to say its in the game development educational content too, it actually plagues education as a whole, its in education as well... and most of the times human error plagues good intended efforts, do you have the heart to tell someone that didnt help at all while you dont have any clue what you are doing? its complicated and i think we need a new word for this feeling.
Tell me about it man. If you ever think of a word for it please let us know haha
23 gamedevs got triggered n butthurt by the title, but didn't watch the vid 🙄 Great vid mate! I expose my flaws, difficulties n failures in my vids, coz it's real n the right thing to do. I don't understand why the fakest devloggers have the biggest following. Oh well, life goes on
Thanks mate! There's always a way to talk about these things without being boring or including too much detail, besides it's important for everyone's perception of the difficulty - even our own!
in my experience programming is "hmmmm okay" art is "oh God" and audio and music design is "aaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr"
Well said.
You're like HBomberGuy if he was a game dev lol. Love the video, great message.
Now that's a compliment ahaha, thanks!
"Re-tired visblock in mid"
And the flip side is people like BigFry or SydAlpha go after game dev's with very little understanding of what the games they are reviewing have taken to create, then give horrible reviews because they have a mindset that being a game dev is easy, This is not helped by some devs making it look that way.
I don't know those channels in particular but your point does point out general gaming channels that dedicate themselves to seeking out 'bad' indie games for an 'entertaining' video, throwing the effort that possibly went into that game (unbeknownst to the viewer) out the window. Sure there's a lot of bad games and some are bad because they just didn't care (some Steam Greenlight titles come to mind and probably a couple of my own), but there's no doubt that just as many of these games are stepping stones in someone's or a group of people's game dev journey. Context of the game's creation is key. Looking at it from that point of view makes it almost too hard to watch.
devlogs are made for only one purpose , to start marketing the game, and that's it
If you Program anything then you know programming is not easy .. why tell people what they should already know. It's like learning Mandarin Chinese or something :D If you've tried then you know what path you are on. There are some Amazing videos on the whole development process of a game which help so much with the later development processes.
P.S - I find the only real hard part is the Time it takes .. which turns me off sometimes :P But Hard work is ALWAYS worth it :D
Time is one of the biggest enemies and it can be easy to fall to monotony of some tasks that take way longer than they really should haha
Sorry that I'm late to the party, but isn't this a problem with social media in general? Where everyone is perfect all the time- except for all the other moments in the day not captured in that witty tweet or insta photo.
You hit it right on the head!
Good video, but I think, much worse then devlogs - from this point of view - are all the videos like "I make minecraft in 3 hours" or "I make 99 games in a month" or "Hold my beer, I make 30 games per second"
As I mention in my video even though I did that for a video, I agree. I think it’s great for challenging you and limiting how long you spend doing it but you tend to stop following and learning good practices in order to ‘just get it done’.
I'd say the almighty randy does exactly what you say, so much so that he doesn't actually do all that much.
Randy truly does show the success and struggles of game dev. What doesn’t look like much is actually pretty big wins.
It’s a pretty realistic view into to how game dev actually goes. Some weeks you get a lot done, others not so much.
2 seconds into the video I disagreed and almost clicked off ended up watching it and you brought up some good points
Listen game delving is very hard but you have to remember that the Devs are extremely experienced
But I do see the problem with them.
Everyone has different levels of experience, but that doesn't allow them able to create everything flawlessly. The idea that they can or that experience means you'll never struggle at some point I think can affect anyone's self reflection of their progress. That's why I think it's good to shine more of a genuine light on difficulties (of which a lot of devlogs already do very well).
ahh, thank you. this is an important video.
Glad it was helpful!