5 Problems That Every Honda City Has | Honda City Negatives by Owner | DriveShrive
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- Popular demand pe is bar Honda City negatives pe video ayi hai. Ye wo Honda City cons hain jo humne 8 saal me face kre hain, dusri gadiyo se compare b kre hain.
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U hav amazing communication skills n clarity of presentation. Keep it up.
@@ashwinspeaks he is absolutely correct bro ..
Driving Honda City ivtec for more than 11 years and clocking over 110000 km. Absolutely no problem till now and at minimal maintenance expenses. Engine still feels like new. Only negative with the model is ground clearance.
Sahi mein bro bass yahi prob hai
It is pretty much solved due to slightly higher profile tyres and suspension buffer. Recently, took it to hills and off roads too, no problems faced with GC
@@DriveShrive how much did it cost ?
5500
@@DriveShrive oh ok
My city with all these problems got me here, he’s addressing all these problems I am facing........truly great judgment by you as said by 5 years owning the car.. 👏
Thanks bro 🙃
You not gave the negatives of the car...but also how to fix them as well :) amazing and valuable content. Thanks for sharing - keep up the good work!
🙃
I have had 3rd generation and now 4th generation Honda City and i agree with all the points 100% ! My family hate city's suspension ! My father has stopped sitting on the back seats altogether ! None of the reviewers mention these points.
Bhai kafi stiff h kya suspension City ka jaise mtlb normal suspension kaam krte without khat pat h to cabin me avaz ati h na ? Esa kuch h kya
3rd generation ka jyada stiff h and 4th ka yada soft h imo
Very straight forward 👍 no glorifying or fancy review also it is better to purchase second hand Honda City
It's a great choice even now. Thanks for the appreciation. Subscribe for more videos. 🙃
@@DriveShrive bhai, Verna sx le loon? Please ek review banado, yaar. Thank you, safe gaadi chahiye, around 12-14. Koi aur ho to bata dena.
U r right ....even when i started petrol engine ..there was vibration I feel . Comparatively hyundai petrol cars are silent
Hyundai cars have more insulation under hood and engines have more midrange. Petrol Ivtec is more rev happy though.
I have petrol city never felt any vibration at all. check your car engine.
no engine vibration in petrol ivtecs lmao
very well explained i m from Pakistan 🇵🇰♥️ main ne bhi apni honda ki ground clearance k issue ko solve krne k liye 15" rims use kiye tyres bhi baray lgae or jo jo chezain ap ne btai wo sari hi honda main hain..✌️👍 road noise k liye main ne charcoal use kiya hai or doors k andr sheets pehle se hain . comfort main ye gari toyota se boht better hai suspension main weak hai no doubt 👍
Wow, perfect..I faced almost all issues he mentioned..but never cared to look for another brand..ab Ford, TATA, VW hi dekhta hun
We don't come across such intelligent videos generally.. Brilliant
Hii !!
using same car rom long time.. All of yours points are 101% true. You have missed headlight throw it is twin candles, nothing else. I ❤️ my city because it is perfect due to:
1. Tyre 195/60 R15. **Perfect match to stock tyre profile( 0.4% hight increase) more air in tyres. better shock absorbation air>liquid>metal to absorb shocks. So mre cabin comfort with double handling n breaking confidance.
2. Head lamp changed to 20,000 lumen led on stock fitting, perfct beam as my taste, city has given up-down, Left- right beam setting screw on both lights. i love pure japan tech.
3. Engine low rpm are having low pickup, but this is vital part of ivtec to perform 13-16 kmpl in city, 17-19 kmpl in Highway.
4. Cabin noise is half after i dampen my car myself in 2k ruppes. dampening material purchased frm china website directly. Build quality of this legend car is still much much better than ciaz, swift. But verna shell is better nor engine.
5. Thank you for suggesting that for painted under body or arround wheel periphery.
run 1.75 lakhs 2014 prtrol model.no major issues..drive it slow 80 90s put 195 r15 tyres...check suspension suddenly when starting sounds !!!better than others!!!
I do agree with you in each and every point especially with the cabin noise its a big headache on highways
In my entire life, this is the first time where i'm subscribing your channel... Good Job
Looking forward to see more videos
Thanks a ton bro.❤️🙃
@@DriveShrive 🙂
Can u also help me for Honda city Idtec 2015 heating problem and all
Please make detail video on honda city build quality
Absolutely true for 2012 model. Each and every point is genuinely true.
I own a 2014-15 model Honda City VX CVT. I observed the rattling dashboard and road noises just after 1 month from the date of delivery, and the service guys are just helpless to resolve it.
Second biggest issue with the stock tyre. You rightly pointed out that the stock tyre sizing is just like a wagonr / tiago / dezire. Why the hell someone supply 175/65/R15 tyre with a D-segment sedan.
The sheet metal is so thin that there will be a dent even if you hit by tiny bird.
Also, suspension of the city is not upto the mark as well.
All issues you face are part of this video. Sadly that's the reality which I pointed out here and some tricks to partially solve them
@driveshrive Hi, I have been driving the Dolphin (ZX 2007 model) for a few years now. I admire the intricacies that you have highlighted and couldn't agree more with those. However, I have 14" alloys, what do you suggest which ratio would suit my car the most? Will 185/65 work the best? Another thing I'm concerned about... I ride for comfort, and polyurethane bushings usually hardens the impacts, so by silicon bushes were you referring to suspension modulators? As I feel, till now rubber bushings in the control arms are much softer than polyurethane ones.
175/70/r14 Yokohama try kro .. using since 3 years .. earlier i had the same as yours in mrf ..
Is the 8th generation civic better than this version of city?
Sir, i agree with you with the built quality. I had diesel version Honda city 4th generation. Its paint was very poor. Even I could see rust in some locations. The biggest failure with Honda city service centres are the people who are going to attend the car are not well trained and hence the problems remains there itself. Honda service is interested to replace any part and make money but they do not like to repair . This Honda is successful because of its parent company is coming from Japan. Otherwise this vehicle would have failed badly with its performance.
True. They are lazy in product launches as well
Bhai ne Honda city k negative point btaye ….. with proof
Keep it up Bro
Can you tell me about which android player you installed in city and price?
Ekdum parfect bro I have allready done this changes in my car now it feels more better and smooth ride thanks for detail clarification of these problems
Thank you so much bro 🙃
Exactly bro….fed up of the road noise. Now going to use acoustic material inside the fender linings. Let’s see how much impact will it make.
That's great. Let me know the result. What tyres are you using?
Nice video. Thanks. You can also add to your list, the gap that develops in the front bumper on both sides near the front tyre. 8 out of10 cities after a couple of years in action, develop this. The authorized service engineers comment that these are something which cannot be fixed. Even if fixed, this will again occur. Though its not as severe as the problems you have mentioned, its still a problem...
if possible expain in detail. i have fixed my bumper after dameges 6-7 times.
All Guys.. if you all agree or disagree fully or partially....
Drive 5th gen. You will praise this video for sure.
What r u getting millage after 185/65r 15 this tyer size fitting???
Overal it's reduced from 13.5 to 13kmpl
Sir I m planning to buy honda city diesel...is it worth buying it
Just because I want 500 plus boot space in diesel
How can I increase suspension
It's decent but not great, if you can do with 480L boot then buy Verna diesel.
About suspension, Gen 5 City has very good setup now but search about Roger suspension buffer, they help in increasing GC height
Test drive Hyundai CRDI engines and see the difference for yourself before you buy
Great communication skills... I. M buying zx petrol 5th genratiom.. Confused on automatic or manual. Also pls guide on other points I need to take care while taking the delivery.. Thanks
Nice and perfect video. I have same color same model EMt version . Which size of silicon bushes suitable ?
It’s the first video I ever gave a like on TH-cam. I have 2017 updated Honda city. And after viewing so many tOp car review videos I bought it for its handling. But we can’t get any idea about the car in the test ride vehicles. I than realised that it’s handling is not so great. the steering is direct I agree but it is so light and sensitive even when you gain speeds that there is no or little feedback from the front end. And other points are the same as discussed in the videos. And this is the thing when I have changed my tyres from 175 to 195 Michelin. And one more thing is that what you call in Hindi K gaadhi Bandhi Bandhi si in laggti. Every time you go through a pothole or any irregularities u feel like K gaadi Puri khul Jaegi. this takes away the confidence from the so called premium 12 lakh car offered by Honda. Rest space inside. Boot seats comfort is top notch. But I don’t call it drivers car atall.
Yes, because after 1st gen, Honda decided to make City a jack of all trades. So they toned down the steering response but kept the stiffer setup, increased space and made it a no-nonse reliable product to stay in the market which it did. You cant get everything in a car like Germans provide drive experience but service and reliability is hit or miss. Verna has features but very vague steering and hatchback like space. City has a balance including looks and I personally like these jack of all products more so no problem for me. You should've gone for a German one back then.
Loved your video...totally different from others...keep uploading about other cars too.
Thanks bro. 🙃 Will upload when I get hands on them.
well pointed negatives except the ivtec engine...I agree that the mid punch is a bit low but low and top end is too great to justify that ....vtec means variable valve timing electronic lift control... so it has got 2 camshafts one for low end shifting and one for high end or late shifting...if you want to drive in city drive it by short shifting just before 2000-1900 rpm following this practice you are utilizing the camshaft for low end rpm shifting thus providing you smooth and linear power without any lag and as soon as you get on the highway try shifting around 5000 rpm then you use the other camshaft ....
Sounds great to say to shift around 5000rpm on highway but practically it's not possible. 3rd gear stretches to 150kmhr at 5000rpm so car is always around 2-3k rpm where the ivtec isn't at its happiest place
@@DriveShrivethats where it gives most average
Yr new Honda City 2020 lene ka mood h but apne jo -ive point bataye vo isme improve h kya please tell me
Bro maximum chezo me improvement hai ab. Bs tyres abhi bhi patle Hain Baki mast hai new City. Test drive lelo
Proud to be a Honda Owner❤
Hey Shreyas , Wonderfully done ! I always felt the same . The fact is I don’t really want to get away with my 2013 city. Love it for many reasons. Will it be possible for you , to have a 15 minute chat ? Would help me a lot
Felt suspension issue after test driving 5th gen. Are these still negatives for 4th and 5th gen.
Bhaai sheet aise pichak ri hai to kya sheet bhi mazboot lagata hai kya...Pls bataye....
Don't just expect a City to give the ride Quality of a Verna/Ciaz.
Stiff bani hai, uske characteristics ke liye bani hai
185/195 swap karne ke baad jo handling hoti hai, uske liye toh stiff ride jhel hi sakte hain
Stiff to Bani hai but load dalne pe ghus b jaati hai kafi neeche. Handling is nice but suspension me damping quality Kam hai starting se.
@@DriveShrive yes wo load daalne pe ghus jaane waali baat mai khud relate karta hun..
4 suitcases daale the aur 4 jan baithe the Trip pe,
Literally wo Stance cars jaisi dikh rahi thi 🤣
Damping ki baat mai bhi maanta hoon yaar. Kya fek deti hai khadde !
Literally wo Poora Dashboard vibrate hone waale feels aate hain, itna bura lagta hai kya hi bolna
@@DriveShrive honestly bhai, har point perfectly mention kiya hai, acchi video banaayi hai
Thanks bro! 🙃 Subscribe for more..
Haha u are amazing .. i think u are mechanical engineer am i right ?
Yeah. 😬
Bro, please suggest me that can I buy skoda Rapid...? And it's suspension and build quality, AC...
Or shall I go with new Honda City...?
Bro, you should focus on requirements and compromises. Go for Rapid if you love driving torqy engines and solid build but can compromise on resale, less features and high maintenance.
New City is for those who don't want to compromise much on any area and ready to spend extra for it. You get excellent resale, space, low maintenance with it.
Han bro aap bilkul sahi bol rahe ho suspension ka masla hamare saath bhi hua tha 100+ Ki speed Pe driver aur passengers car KO roof Per zor se takrai tha
Super review... Best of all Indiaan channels
Bhai aapke bolne ka andaaz bahut pasand aaya aur content toh shaandar hai hi 👌Crisp & to the point. Very well presented 👍
What you said is very correct. I am using honda city ivtec 2016 model and I am also not that satisfied with it's built quality. Lots of cabin noise plus braking power is not that efficient. Tyre also looks so thin. Bhai is it good to upsize tyre size from 175/65 R15 to 185/65/R15. Steering column kharab to nahin ho ga na. Mileage I am not much care about. How about pick up and ride quality?
One more thing which car can you suggest for me in the same segment with good ride quality, build quality with a super silent cabin.
Go for Ciaz Alpha.
Sorry to say but Ciaz has the worst build quality in segment.
Nahi Bhai, khud socho tyre wall badi hogi to jerk Kam aega steering pe bhi aur cabin pe, suspension pe. Isse zyada mat badhana. It's the perfect size hum 10k Kms se Chala rahe Hain. Hmari to mileage b nai drop hui Bridgestone Ecopia tyres se.
Bro silent cabin chaiye to aap ek bar Creta ya Seltos test drive kro. Sedans se bohot shaant Hain wo.
@@DriveShrive thank you bhai. I will definitely take a test drive of both seltos and creta.
@@rediff281 The suspension of SUV and their ground clearance plays a part in reducing cabin noise.
Hi, Which tyre brand u hv upgraded to 185/65-R15? Can u pls suggest the best brand tyres for reduce road noice for Honda city?
Michelin for least road noise
Can u tell me which car has the best suspension within 10-12 lkh budget. along with the solid body built and safety features. thanks
Xuv300 has the best compromise between slow speed plushness and High speed stability.
Except ground clearance no negative points.But when you purchase sedan you have to consider it
🙏🙏🙏🙏 I almost bought city. U saved me. Thanks bro
Excellent points Suyash! This is kind of a real review.
I need your suggestion. I have a 2012 city and wanted install the touchscreen stereo and navigation system. I saw that you have one in your car. Can you please suggest some good options regarding the same.
Hypersonic!
@@DriveShrive Thank you Suyash!
Hey Suyash, can you also please suggest good tyres in 185/65/15. I am about to change my stock tyres and upgrade to the size you mentioned.
Hi bro, from our experience, I trust only Bridgestone and Continental for our Indian conditions. If you want more quiter and softer experience, you can check Michelin too.
@@DriveShriveThanks for your opinion bro. It'll surely help.
Request you to make more honda city content, if it is possible for you. Obviously because I own the same car and would love to have deep insights which generally aren't available.
You mentioned about making a detailed video about built quality of City. Hope you are working on it. I am waiting for that and I am sure many city and also Honda (relativity of being same manufacturer) car owners will be waiting for that.
Should we add Rogerab Buffer in rear alone or front too? In Amazon.com 4 Pieces comes to Rs.7600..
All 4 would be good. It will enhance the life of the front suspension from sudden potholes.
Sir 4th generation honda city pe video banayiye pls, lena hai honda city.....
Bhai sirf ground clearance hi prob hai,
Mid range me tagda pickup kyu chahiye traffic me tumhe, mid range me race lagani hai kya ??
Tyre noise ki koi prob ni hai, 150 ki speed me sheeshe kyu kolke rakhne hai bhai ??
pickup na chaiye ho to admi 1.5 kyu lega? 1.2 se kaam chala le, overtake krna hota hai.
Road noise 99% city owners agree krte hain kyuki insulation poor hai wheel walls me. sheeshe main kbhi nai kholta bdw. 100 k upar music kafi tez krna pdta
Completely exposed the hype of the Honda City..... Accurate
All cars have -ves, so does City.
Bhai mere ko waja maaloom nahi lekin video dekh ke maza aya🥴😂
Can we install 185 tyres in same rim which has 165 tyres?
Yes but you won't get the same benefits of a wider tyre as the rim will bend the extra width and make it rounder. A higher profile tyre will be better for better ride quality
Bhai mere...I just lovedd youu....esa laga apki video dekhkar ke Yaar Kisi ne to samjha aur mere dil ki saati baten City ivtec ko lekar jo hain wo same aur log bhi fave kar rhe hain..thank god m not alone here. Tyres maine bhi 195 65 15 Karlie thy jise absorber bhi improve hua hain
Thanks Bhai.. apki konsa model hai aur kitne ki pdi thi if I may ask?
From Pakistan.
Very good explanation
Thanks bro. Hope you are alright from the flood situation.
@@DriveShrive thanks
Yes but massive destruction resulted eye witnessed, returned from floor areas as a volunteer.
Which car do you suggest in same segment
Please don't commit
@@khetisahnewal8759 commit?
This single video is enough for subscribing your channel
Crisp and detailed information
Thanks for this informative video 👍
The built Quality of Honda City is very good , few years back a truck hit my front fender not at speed but in traffic, but just a scratch no dent .
It depends, I have experience of other sedans as well, less flex in sheet metal in others but City is also good in other areas. It depends
Can you please advise the correct tyre number for using with Honda City 2011 model
You can use the same as mine, 185/65-15
somehow in my honda city 2013 water getting accumalted directly in boot near stepney, not able to figure out from where water is entering
Water Drainage blocked, please have it checked at svc
Minute he said about suspension.
Me: Subscribed 🥲
Thank you 🫶🏻
Amazing points and agree to all these on 2017 model ..which I believe is one of the worst of all
Yes, it is apart from the looks. New Gen City is nicer with suspension and midrange punch.
What certified technical knowledge you have against describing flaws from you or it is just experience and observations?
Observations with my own car from 12yrs
@@DriveShrive If this is with your own car then it is experience not observation.
It's both. Many of my friends own the 5th gen as well.
@@DriveShrive Great.
Very detailed video bro.. very informative great job 🙏
Glad you liked it!
Only ground clearance is the negative that we can accept
Metal sheet is not such a big problem as you compair it with Suzuki
Most people choose honda for its engine reability, low maintenance
If you get a hard metal sheet ,it will cost you a more money to fix it in any accidental case. It is also for the safety of pedistrians , that if you accidentally collide any person walking by its some amount of impact is absorbed by tha weak metal , if the metal is harder it will cause more damage to the pedistrian
Not true. Do you think Hyundai, Ford, VW etc cars with thick sheet metal don't follow pedestrian safety norms?
We buy insurance to fix any kind of damage, thick or thin right
It was really nice explanation, it was so detailed in every problem.
Can you also make video on Hyundai i20? Old models (2009-2012) models?
Will make when I get my hands on one. Do subscribe for upcoming videos. 🙃
One of the major draw back is the headlights. Good for nothing even at high beam.
It feels like you own a honda car. Deepness of issues. I am a honda user since 12 years. Recent purchased Jazz which is third honda in house and drove more than 3,00,000 kms including all three cars. The points you are telling can be described by only owners not by the reviewer.
Yes, I own the car in video.
I use a 195/60 R15 on my Honda Jazz, you can certainly feel the difference.
But i think steering feedback will harder from previous time... Is it so?
Hondas have light steering so it doesn't make a huge difference overall
I am planning to buy all new city. Kya ye negative points remove hue kya jo apne bataye ???
Bro ride quality mast ho gyi hai Baki more or less same hai. But positive points in negatives se zyada hain
Very true and honest opinions.. facing exactly same issues with my city as well after 3.5 years..
🙃
Try ARC suspension kit. It saved me from selling my 2016 CVT model because of the bad suspension.
Wow. Thanks for the input.
@@DriveShrive Cost is 35K. Look up on TH-cam - ARC suspension Honda City
@@DriveShrive Did you check them out?
What is cost of 2012 honda city 1lakh km complete.
No accident 2nd owner.
What is ideal price? Can qe buy petrol and convert into CNG?
yes you can convert but isuggest not to because our 2009 city gives 20+ stock
Correct.... I hv 4th generation honda city n I m facings these issues...
Confused which one to buy, Yaris or City? both have some Plus and some Minus.
Yaris has just more cabin insulation but overall City is definitely better.
@@DriveShrive Thank you.
Sir I have city Ivtec 2013..... have some questions
Hi…!! Planning to buy the 4th gen Honda city petrol v variant manual transmission. My requirement is very clear. It is offering me all the features I want. Need a no nonsenses engine. And most importantly no rattles over a period of time to which I am fed up with my Tata altroz 2020. Can I rely on the newer updated 4th gen Honda city for it…?? Do let me know as I am planning to book Tomorrow.
Stretch your budget and go for 5th gen. After a long time, the resale value will cover up the extra expense. 5th gen base variant is also well loaded with all the safety and useful tech and it is better in every single count especially suspension
@@DriveShrive this is my at Max budget.. won't be able to strech any further. Or the other option I have with me is S-Cross Zeta petrol
@@saurabhmane6194 new Scross is coming very soon. You can wait for that if you want. But I don't recommend new gen 4 City now.
Your handsome, you have excellent communication and articulation skills.
I looking to upsize my Honda City tyres, currently they are running on stock 175/65/R15... How has been your experience with 185/65/R15...do you also think 195/60/R15 will be good upgrade
Yes 195 will provide even more grip and better handling if you prefer that, 185 is just the right size for most needs though. Ps- A good quality 185 will come at the same cost as cheap 195 and will provide better experience overall. 🙃
@@DriveShrive thank you :)
Bhai ye kaun sa infonant system hai ispe video banao
One of the best and genuine Video. Thankyou sir !❤
Is there any way to soften my suspension.
Steering returning issue bhi hain
Bohot common nai hai kyuki humari gadi me nai hai koi issue steering bohot acha hai
@@DriveShrive steering is ok. After full turn it won't come back to its centre position
That's weird. Mine does return properly. Which generation?
@@DriveShrive 4th Gen (V model)- 2015
bai .abhi kosa gadi no.1 bolow lenekeaaa plzzz.20 lakshmea pls tell me achha gadi.
Spot on .
..... ground clearance is the bigger trouble I face
bro its a sedan why u r looking for ground clearance in a sedan if u want ground clearance then consider SUV or CRossOver
According to my Car's Multi information display my City Ivtec petrol gives 7.5 to 8 KMPL in city, Is there a Fault in MID or its accurate?. Also any suggestions to increase Mileage in City. I am not a Rash driver by the way.
Bro, there's only one way to find out. Try tank to tank calculation method. Tank full then set trip to 0, drive normally for some days and fill again. Trip reading divided by fuel used to fill again is your average. I always do this and get around 11-12kmpl
@@DriveShrive By the way, what mileage does your car multi information display shows?
12-13
Agree with your comments as i own a 2018 city.. i have got a query on engine heating and i noticed that if you run engine for an hour with ac on, the outside temperature is too high to touch the bonnet.. i compared the same test in tata nexon and it was not.. can you guide me on this.. i felt that city was heating a lot.. any test which i can do to check this or shall i take it to services station to get it diagnosed electronically through their systems
Take it to service centre bro. If that's a problem then it should be fixed by expert technicians.
New city ki ground clearance 165 h kya its ok for india roads??
Yes, it ok as long as the car isn't loaded with people and luggage. With 2-3 people, it's decent for our roads
Jo Quality samajte hain wo Vento/Rapid lete hain. Baki to bhed chal wale hain. Great video
There is NO perfect car - every car has some weakness, it depends on the buyer where they want to compromise.
Way to go bro...very well explained...👍👍
Mere pas new honda amaze diesel v variant hai aur app jo bata rahe hai o sab sach hai
Suspension height jada chhiye aur o damdar chhiye
Tyre hight jada chhiye seat ka cusion thoda naram chhiye
Ground clearance jada chhiye
www.amazon.in/dp/B01MTR8DCG/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_fab_BJxFFbVDKJF5C
Ye try kro shayad Apke kafi dukh dard theek ho jaen. Ab next tyre change krna to 185/65 lgwa lena mza a jaega
Sir Honda city 5th gen. Kise hai
Build quality of honda is much better than maruti Suzuki and almost equivalent to huyndai and others on proof is rating provided by European standards and 2nd point you said in mid range speed it's pic up is low because in 5th gear you can run honda 20 km/h which is not possible in any other car !!! If you have doubt you can just try it honda and other car. you 1st go to 80 km/h with 5th gear and come down to 20kn/h for few sec.
Build quality mein mention karna zaruri hai.. rust.. aap bahut gaadiya dekhenge jahan front door ke lower part mein rust hojata hai.. even through n through hole hojaata hai..
Bhai meri me nahi hua isliye maine mention nai kia. Title me hai 'every Honda City'
Thx bro best video for honda owners❤
Thanks bro. Subscribe to the channel!
Is it wise decision to buy Honda City 2020 ?
We have Tata Zest and want to upgrade.
Yes totally. It's a great product and a perfect upgrade for you
@@DriveShrive Thank you 🙏
Please look for other options ..like compass or seltos .. unfortunately I have brought 2 city ..one for me and other for my brother and we both are not satisfied at all. We earlier had 2010 model ..which was better and we thought 2017 would be the same ..unfortunately it’s not .. 25 lacs wasted for 2 cars
@@nangiasharad Thank you 🙏
Good talk ,, a person can sit and listen what you are talking,