Sham was truly a great race horse!! He could have won the triple crown in any other year. He could have won the Belmont if he hadn’t cooked himself trying to keep up with the “tremendous machine”. A horse like Secretariat is outside any norm. Sham was unfortunate to be born the same year. In any other year he would have been a true champion. And certainly he was in his own right a truly great horse. He also broke the Kentucky Derby record and given he was only 2 lengths behind Secretariat in the Preakness he may have also broke the Preakness record too. (I am not sure by what margin Secretariat broke the Preakness record.) Alydar was also a great horse but he too raced against a greater horse in Affirmed. Sham wouldn’t have finished last in the Belmont if he hadn’t injured himself during the race. He had speed, stamina and courage. He too had the large heart gene. He was a truly great horse.
Sham did not get his larger heart from Man O’ War. He got it from his broodmare sire Princequillo as did Secretariat. Sham’s heart weighed 18 lbs while Secretariat’s was 22 lbs.
I thought the large heart needed to be passed down on the X chromosome. So Princequillo passed it down to his daughters and they passed it to their sons? Cool. Was Riva Ridge related to them? I read he had a large heart too.
What is the background of the large-heart thing? How did they know what size a horse’s heart was during racing? Measuring a horse when it’s dead 20 years later is specious. Just how many racehorses had their hearts weighed, anyway?
@@lucybarrington4634 The extremely large heart, the "X-Factor", is a genetic condition that is traced back to a horse named Eclipse, who died in the late-1700s. Secretariat's dam-line traces back to a daughter of Eclipse, as does Sham's. Riva Ridge was not part of that dam line and did not have an extremely large heart.
Sham war a very GREAT racehorse , and except for the year he was born, could have won the Triple Crown. I would like to add that the great Secretariat won by 31 lengths, not 25. I personally don’t believe any horse could have beaten Secretariat that day at Belmont. Love to both of these wonderful, beautiful animals!❤
Secretariat won Belmont by 31 lengths and Sham got his large heart gene from the same place Secretariat did, from Princequillo other than that it’s a good video
While I agree that Secretariat is the greatest racehorse that ever lived, and I own one of his double descendants, he is not a descendant of Man o' War. They both share Fair Play in their pedigree, with FP being the sire of Man o' War, and a distant grand sire for Secretariat through a different son. Also, while Phar Lap, Man o' War, Secretariat and Sham did have the large hearts, the source is commonly identified as being passed on by an English mare named Pocahontas from the 1800s. She is the common link. It is also an X linked gene, which is why it is called the X-Factor. Mares can pass it onto sons and daughters, but sons that get it, like MoW and Secretariat can only pass it onto their daughters. This is why Secretariat is such an excellent broodmare sire. His daughter produced farm foundation stallions by passing on these genes to their sons, including Gone West, Storm Cat, A.P. Indy, Dehere, Chief's Crown, and a number of others. Secretariat did have a son, Risen Star, that won the Preakness and Belmont Stakes, but Secretariat could not pass the large heart onto him. He would have to get it from his dam, if he had it. He may also have had a large heart, since when he ran the Belmont, his time was second only to his great sire, Secretariat. RS's time is now the 4th fastest Belmont Stakes. Secretariat's grandson, A.P. Indy has the 3rd fastest Belmont Stakes time. Sham and Secretariat were "first cousins", to use the human term. Their mothers, Sequoia and Somethingroyal, respectively, shared the same sire, Princequillo, a champion distance running horse, who passed the large heart genes onto the daughters. They passed it onto their famous sons.
@@vincentflauto7650 Glad to share. My love of Secretariat caused me to buy one of his double descendants. She looks a lot like him with the flashy chestnut coat and 3 white sock on the same legs. She is expecting a Tonalist foal any day.
@@Brick-so1ig except it does. The X factor large heart gene is only on the female line. Secretariat had it, but could not pass it to any sons, only daughters. Males cannot pass X linked chromosomes onto sons. Only Y linked.
Sham’s Derby was a great race, but on the topic of Triple Crown bridesmaids, Alydar accomplished far more on the track and way, way, way more in his stud career.
Well Sham might have won in another year. BUT Alydar would have won Triple Crown without Affirmed being around. I loved Sham, he was all heart and deserved a better fate.
Thank you, I always say that after Secretariat I take Sham as the second best and don't look back. It is time to give Sham his rightful credit and recognition.
Thank you so much for this video. Sham deserves so much recognition -- in any other year, he would have and deserved to win the Triple Crown and enjoy a significant career at stud!
I love horse racing. And during my teens and through my thirties I weighed 113 pounds! I wish I'd tried it, but I was nervous even in my first riding class. I always loved Sham and felt sorry for him. It was like being good at calculus, but this guy named Einstein was also in the class.
Good video, but you left out the Wood Memorial. It was ran 2 weeks prior to the Kentucky Derby. Sham ran a good race and finished ahead of Secretariat, but was beaten by a head by a horse named Angle Light.
Sham was Amazing ❤ Wow interesting information. But he didn’t need the whip. He could have ran faster without it. Maybe the problem was the trainer 😮 Sham was a Great Horse ❤
Agreed, Sham already had all the tools. Whipping is one thing, but whipping out of stride and excessively is not. Sham was a warrior, ripping his teeth out in the Derby then nearly winning anyway. Like I always say, Secretariat makes my heart fly, Sham makes it weep.
Damascus was an INCREDIBLE racehorse. I'm glad somebody else mentioned him! There have been MANY great racehorses who didn't win the Kentucky Derby, INCLUDING Man o' War, who didn't run in the Kentucky Derby.
Secretariat also had the "X-factor", and Big Red's heart was larger than Sham's heart by about 4 lbs. Sham never suffered a "serious injury", until he was eased-up/slowed-down by Laffit Pincay in the Belmont Stakes, after he broke a cannon bone during the race, which was not discovered until a few weeks later. As for Sham being the "greatest horse to never win the Kentucky Derby", that is VERY debatable. How about Man o' War (OK, he missed the race)? Alydar? Seabiscuit? Easy Goer? How about the racehorses who won the Preakness and Belmont, but not the Derby, such as Afleet Alex? Point Given? Tabasco Cat? Hansel? Risen Star? Little Current? Damascus? Nashua? Native Dancer? Capot? And the list goes on and on and on.............
OMG. Implying that Secretariat got an allegedly big heart from Man O’War? Secretariat was not descended from the real Big Red, Man O’War. Perhaps you’re thinking of his sire, Fair Play? Which I don’t know if that applies anyway.
This whole "X-factor" thing is NOT proven. It all comes from a horse named ECLIPSE, who died in the late 1700's, and the necropsy showed that he had a heart that weighed twice as much as normal horse hearts. Eclipse passed this "X-factor" down through his daughters. Secretariat's dam-line traces through one of Eclipse's daughters, and so did Sham's.
Not only did Sham have the bad luck of racing against Secretariat and had the misfortune of having Pincay as a jockey. 🤬 And the trainer let him. I hope Sham had a better retirement and was treated well in his remaining years.
@@janetgallo5720 Pincay also saved Sham's life in the Belmont Stakes, by recognizing that something was wrong with Sham during the race and slowing him down.
No. Native Dancer. His only defeat in 22 starts was his second place loss by a head in the 1953 Kentucky Derby, in which he was bumped badly and given a poor ride. Forego, 4th in Secretariat's Derby, would be the second best Derby starter to lose. Forego, NOT Sham, was, hands down, the greatest horse Secretariat ever beat. Forego was still developing in the spring of his 3-year-old year, however, and not the monster he would be at 4/5/6. He skipped the other Triple Crown races because of Secretariat. He tied with Sham at the end of the year in the Eclipse Award voting as the 2nd best American 3-year-old male of 1973. Native Dancer is ranked 7th among the 100 greatest American-raced Thoroughbreds of the 20th century by the 7-person panel of racing experts put together in 1999 by BloodHorse. Forego (57: 34-9-7, and an 8-time Eclipse Award champion, including 3 Horse of the Year titles) is ranked 8th. Alydar (26:14-9-1) was ranked 27th. At least three other horses who lost the Kentucky Derby were ranked above Alydar: Damascus (#16 on the BloodHorse list, 32:21-7-3, 3rd in the 1967 Derby); Round Table (#17 66:43-8-5, 3rd in the 1957 Derby); and Bold Ruler (#19 33:23-4-2, 4th in the 1957 Derby) were ranked higher than Alydar. Sham (rightfully) did not make the top 100. Not with a career record of 13:5-5-1, and 1 G1 win (and only 1 other graded stakes win). He's not in the U.S. Thoroughbred Racing Hall of Fame, either, which of course all the others are.
Yes, I hate the new economics of horse racing. Colts are retired at 3, before they are really mature. Few people would remember Dr. Fager is he didn’t run at 4, and Forego would have been virtually unknown. Plus, the fans would have been robbed of the experience of seeing them in their greatness.
Give me a break. Sham was better than Man O’ War, Native Dancer, Dr. Fager, Damascus, Buckpasser, Kelso, Forego, etc.? He was an excellent horse. “Great” is a serious overstatement. Look at his race record outside the Triple Crown events. You could make a very good argument that he wasn’t as good as his sire.
Definitely not better than any of the ones you mentioned. But Man o'War, Dr. Fager, Kelso and Buckpasser never ran in the Kentucky Derby. The best horse to enter the K. Derby and not win was Native Dancer...his head loss in the Derby was his only defeat in 22 starts. Forego, 4th in Secretariat's Derby, is arguably the second greatest horse to start in the race and not win.
@@marysueeasteregg Native Dancer is my favorite horse, and it hurts to think of that loss. If you are going to limit the discussion (quite understandable) to horses that ran in the race, two great sons of Nasrullah, Nashua and Bold Ruler, also came up short. And Native Dancer’s grand sire, Discovery, finished second in 1934. The next year, he became the only winner of Horse of the Year over a Triple Crown winner, Omaha.
@@johnhoie-hj7cg I drafted last night a very long discussion of Derby starters better than Alydar (much less Sham) who failed to win the Derby. Wiped it out accidentally before posting. Forgot Bold Ruler! If I ever redraft it, I'll have to include him. (edit: I had already included Bold Ruler, at least in another post.) Alydar is a legitimately great horse, though, and a deserving Hall of Famer. Sham was, at best, a late-developing horse who might have proven he was great if his career had not been cut short by injury. Forego and plenty of other Hall of Fame runners would not be remembered if they had never raced beyond early June of their 3-year-old season. Sham is also, at best, the 4th best horse Secretariat ever beat. Maybe lower.
What does Man O’War have to do with either Sec or Sham? Nothing! Sham doesn’t even have sire Fair Play in him! Sec does. But I’ve not heard about MOW being some X-factor horse, though honestly I don’t know nearly enough about that stuff. Maybe FP did. And sham wasn’t born exactly 53 years after MOW. MOW was March 29. Perhaps you meant Sec, foaled March 30. And again, only 53 years, not 83.
@@theOlLineRebel Actually, it proves how tough the Kentucky Derby is to win, because of the number and quality of the horses. The KY Derby brings out the best, and worst, in racehorses, because up to 20 horses can run in the race, you never know what the track conditions will be because of the spring weather in Kentucky, and nowadays running the 10 furlongs is a question mark for many horses.
@@TheProfessorOfLife It was ND's only loss, by a hair, and Broker's Tip's only win. Broker's Tip was a lousy horse. Also, despite the alleged conditions of so many "top" races, including Breeder's Cup, there are MANY lousy horses running them every single year. I'll never understand it. Far too many losers and local yokels in these races who really don't amount to "Derby horse". I'm just saying, the Derby is very, very overrated for many reasons, the "quality" being one of them.
It's highly likely he would have been capable of it in many years. "Any" other year? I'd eliminate 1977-1979. In any case, winning that series is always a matter of luck as well as talent, as Native Dancer and Spectacular Bid patently demonstrate. There's no way to know if Sham would have held up to 12 furlongs absent the suicidal pace of the Belmont, and/or absent the injury he may have sustained in that race. We also don't know if a still-developing Forego would have entered the 1973 Preakness and/or Belmont, absent the presence of Secretariat. Forego's trainer was candid that he wanted to avoid Secretariat after Forego's 4th place finish in the Derby. In Eclipse Award voting at the end of the year, Forego tied with Sham as second best 3- year-old male in the nation.
@@marysueeasteregg I meant to say, and should have said most any other year, 19 out of 20. Sham still has the second fastest time ever in the Kentucky Derby. I think Sham would have had a good chance of beating Affirmed. The pace in the 1973 Belmont would have been suicidal for any horse but The Great Secretariat.
That track was hard rolled, and blazing fast that day. If you would have put Seattle Slew or Spectacular Bid on that surface, it would be one of them holding that record. There were 2 other track records that day. That surface was smoking fast!.
You mean Belmont, right? Even if not, little discussed is how many BEL TRs were set that very year, from about 6f to 1-1/2 mi. Most distances had records in that range that very year! In fact one of them had several records set and equaled all within a very short time, that year! Truth is the 2:24 was probably greased. Far too many show “1973” at the end of that year, and no, they are not all Secretariat!
@@theOlLineRebel Atta Boy!! Somebody with some knowledge. Yes Belmont redid their surface for 1973. Removed the sand from *Big Sandy" lol. I know that times were exceedingly fast for the whole meet. Not sure of the exact ratio of records. But I know for a fact, that they hard rolled the track for 3 days leading up to the Belmont. 1st race, Maiden Special weight, 1 Mile, 1:33 1/5...track record set for 6 furlongs, and the 1 1/16 miles as well. That track was smoking!! I always imagined what horses like Dr. Fager, or Spectacular Bid would have done on that speedway!! What?? 2:21 and change?? Me maybe faster.
@@david1044 HA! Dr. Fager running 12 furlongs? NEVER would have happened. He was a miler, and once in awhile he could squeeze out 9 or 10 furlongs. He only ran FIVE races at 10 furlongs, and ZERO races greater than 10 furlongs. He ran in NONE of the Triple Crown races during his 3-year-old season.
Sham would not have won the Belmont big heart or not . There were two other horses in the race that he had to beat . No one will ever know but I don't think so .
Well, jockey error certainly played a role in the result, and trainer instructions. Nevertheless, Sham still went all out because he was asked to and because he was a warrior. Unfortunately those instructions nearly killed Sham that day.
Of Sham's 13 races, he won five races, with only ONE of those races being a graded stakes race, the Grade 1 Santa Anita Derby. Yes, Sham finished 2nd to Secretariat in two of the three Triple Crown races, but to call Sham "the greatest racehorse to never win the Kentucky Derby" is a gross overstatement. You are completely IGNORING DOZENS of other horses who had a much better horseracing resume' than Sham had, that also failed to win the Kentucky Derby for a variety of reasons, INCLUDING Man o' War, who did not even run in the Kentucky Derby.
Sham Was "5 for 13" Lifetime Getting Beat by Other Horses and Fields Too....He Won The SA Derby is All...Sham Ran Some Fast Times "Behind" Secretariat But Shams Overall Resume is Very Mediocre at Best...Sham is NOT Even Close to 2nd Best Horse Not to Win Derby....That Title Probably Goes to Easy Goer
@@thorne1239 Easy Goer is My Favorite All Time Horse (Not Saying He Was The Best....But Secretariat Over 50 Years and Still Holds Record in All 3 Crown Races Including The 30+ Length Romp in an INCREDIBLE "2:24" Flat For 12F....He Was Also BRILLIANT on The Grass
@@thorne1239 I agree about Sham. But Secretariat doesn't need Sham to prop him up. He was impressive enough at age 2 he was voted Horse of the Year, only the second 2-year-old to get that honor. He defeated 3 Hall of Fame horses, an additional American champion, and a Canadian Hall of Fame horse. He won twice at age 3 against top older horses. He dominated on turf as well as dirt. (He won Turf Horse of the Year in 1973, and Turcotte has said the horse was 10 to 15 lengths better on grass than dirt.) He set 5 track/course records (one was a turf record for the track), and 2 world records, both on dirt.
@@thorne1239 Secretariat most certainly does NOT need to be "propped up". He is the G.O.A.T.. When Big Red was 100% healthy, he was absolutely UNBEATABLE. Period. End of story.
I’m sorry this guy is just making a story😢 but if you want the truth, he’s one of the greatest Sham is not so much😢 o These horses are much better than sham down below😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮🎉😂 winks the greatest turf horse to ever race😜 Melair. Beat snow, chief like a one legged stepchild both of those horses were girls.😮 John Henry what a monster Kona Gold what a beautiful sprinter of alltime. Flight Line incredible American Farrell did they forget about you🎉 where are arrow gate😮 yes 👍 you have the wrong idea by saying only the greatest you have no proof you have no factual information you don’t even know these horses. Do you know who megahertz is one of the best closers on turf black caviar Tepin where is your monster, Mark Cassie😮 this is what people talk about. They don’t know what they’re talking about. I’ve been gambling since I was nine years old. Don’t try to flex. There’s no guarantee. This is the greatest unless you run the race and obviously you don’t know these horses I’m talking about.😮 there’s 100 different horses that at any given time through history they could’ve played with secretariat i’m sorry, John Henry this guy is lost precisionist where are you 😮 candy ride? Charismatic.
You're the first person to mention overseas horses. As far as i know, we were only talking about American-bred and American-raced horses. Save your snarky attitude for the overseas horse people. They'll love you for it. Just for the record, Charismatic won the KY Derby.
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Can we get to 1000 subs this video? 👀
Sham was truly a great race horse!! He could have won the triple crown in any other year. He could have won the Belmont if he hadn’t cooked himself trying to keep up with the “tremendous machine”. A horse like Secretariat is outside any norm. Sham was unfortunate to be born the same year. In any other year he would have been a true champion. And certainly he was in his own right a truly great horse. He also broke the Kentucky Derby record and given he was only 2 lengths behind Secretariat in the Preakness he may have also broke the Preakness record too. (I am not sure by what margin Secretariat broke the Preakness record.) Alydar was also a great horse but he too raced against a greater horse in Affirmed. Sham wouldn’t have finished last in the Belmont if he hadn’t injured himself during the race. He had speed, stamina and courage. He too had the large heart gene. He was a truly great horse.
Sham did not get his larger heart from Man O’ War. He got it from his broodmare sire Princequillo as did Secretariat. Sham’s heart weighed 18 lbs while Secretariat’s was 22 lbs.
I thought the large heart needed to be passed down on the X chromosome. So Princequillo passed it down to his daughters and they passed it to their sons? Cool.
Was Riva Ridge related to them? I read he had a large heart too.
What is the background of the large-heart thing? How did they know what size a horse’s heart was during racing? Measuring a horse when it’s dead 20 years later is specious. Just how many racehorses had their hearts weighed, anyway?
@@lucybarrington4634 The extremely large heart, the "X-Factor", is a genetic condition that is traced back to a horse named Eclipse, who died in the late-1700s. Secretariat's dam-line traces back to a daughter of Eclipse, as does Sham's. Riva Ridge was not part of that dam line and did not have an extremely large heart.
I always respected sham secretariat was a freak athelete ❤❤
Sham war a very GREAT racehorse , and except for the year he was born, could have won the Triple Crown. I would like to add that the great Secretariat won by 31 lengths, not 25. I personally don’t believe any horse could have beaten Secretariat that day at Belmont. Love to both of these wonderful, beautiful animals!❤
Secretariat won Belmont by 31 lengths and Sham got his large heart gene from the same place Secretariat did, from Princequillo other than that it’s a good video
You are correct!!!
And steroids
While I agree that Secretariat is the greatest racehorse that ever lived, and I own one of his double descendants, he is not a descendant of Man o' War. They both share Fair Play in their pedigree, with FP being the sire of Man o' War, and a distant grand sire for Secretariat through a different son.
Also, while Phar Lap, Man o' War, Secretariat and Sham did have the large hearts, the source is commonly identified as being passed on by an English mare named Pocahontas from the 1800s. She is the common link. It is also an X linked gene, which is why it is called the X-Factor. Mares can pass it onto sons and daughters, but sons that get it, like MoW and Secretariat can only pass it onto their daughters. This is why Secretariat is such an excellent broodmare sire. His daughter produced farm foundation stallions by passing on these genes to their sons, including Gone West, Storm Cat, A.P. Indy, Dehere, Chief's Crown, and a number of others.
Secretariat did have a son, Risen Star, that won the Preakness and Belmont Stakes, but Secretariat could not pass the large heart onto him. He would have to get it from his dam, if he had it. He may also have had a large heart, since when he ran the Belmont, his time was second only to his great sire, Secretariat. RS's time is now the 4th fastest Belmont Stakes. Secretariat's grandson, A.P. Indy has the 3rd fastest Belmont Stakes time.
Sham and Secretariat were "first cousins", to use the human term. Their mothers, Sequoia and Somethingroyal, respectively, shared the same sire, Princequillo, a champion distance running horse, who passed the large heart genes onto the daughters. They passed it onto their famous sons.
Wow great info 🙏 thank you
@@vincentflauto7650 Glad to share. My love of Secretariat caused me to buy one of his double descendants. She looks a lot like him with the flashy chestnut coat and 3 white sock on the same legs. She is expecting a Tonalist foal any day.
Makes No Difference...The Blood is There and Bloodlines are Bloodlines Period Regardless
@@Brick-so1ig except it does. The X factor large heart gene is only on the female line. Secretariat had it, but could not pass it to any sons, only daughters. Males cannot pass X linked chromosomes onto sons. Only Y linked.
@@shopahauliquewithjacquelin7025 Okay...Who is Your Favorite Thoroughbred of All Time?
Sham was something special.
Sham’s Derby was a great race, but on the topic of Triple Crown bridesmaids, Alydar accomplished far more on the track and way, way, way more in his stud career.
Agreed
Alydar was a phenomenal horse in every respect
No, Sham got his big heart from Princequillo.
Well Sham might have won in another year. BUT Alydar would have won Triple Crown without Affirmed being around. I loved Sham, he was all heart and deserved a better fate.
Secretariat and Sham pushed each other to create those remarkable times
Thank you, I always say that after Secretariat I take Sham as the second best and don't look back. It is time to give Sham his rightful credit and recognition.
Thank you so much for this video. Sham deserves so much recognition -- in any other year, he would have and deserved to win the Triple Crown and enjoy a significant career at stud!
I wish this reporter had his facts straight!
I love horse racing. And during my teens and through my thirties I weighed 113 pounds! I wish I'd tried it, but I was nervous even in my first riding class. I always loved Sham and felt sorry for him. It was like being good at calculus, but this guy named Einstein was also in the class.
Good video, but you left out the Wood Memorial. It was ran 2 weeks prior to the Kentucky Derby. Sham ran a good race and finished ahead of Secretariat, but was beaten by a head by a horse named Angle Light.
That was only because secretary had an abscess in his mouth
Sham was Amazing ❤ Wow interesting information. But he didn’t need the whip. He could have ran faster without it. Maybe the problem was the trainer 😮
Sham was a Great Horse ❤
Agreed, Sham already had all the tools. Whipping is one thing, but whipping out of stride and excessively is not. Sham was a warrior, ripping his teeth out in the Derby then nearly winning anyway. Like I always say, Secretariat makes my heart fly, Sham makes it weep.
This film is full of errors. Not misleading statements, errors. Hard to take it seriously. Already noted some gargantuan problems earlier.
I thought this would be about Damascus.
Damascus was an INCREDIBLE racehorse. I'm glad somebody else mentioned him! There have been MANY great racehorses who didn't win the Kentucky Derby, INCLUDING Man o' War, who didn't run in the Kentucky Derby.
The large heart goes back to Pocohantas
Starts off with “greatest racehorse of all time”, which is a Sham, perhaps a fortuitous name.
It is a shame Sham was born at the same time Secretariat was born.
Secretariat won the Belmont by 31 lengths.
Secretariat also had the "X-factor", and Big Red's heart was larger than Sham's heart by about 4 lbs. Sham never suffered a "serious injury", until he was eased-up/slowed-down by Laffit Pincay in the Belmont Stakes, after he broke a cannon bone during the race, which was not discovered until a few weeks later. As for Sham being the "greatest horse to never win the Kentucky Derby", that is VERY debatable. How about Man o' War (OK, he missed the race)? Alydar? Seabiscuit? Easy Goer? How about the racehorses who won the Preakness and Belmont, but not the Derby, such as Afleet Alex? Point Given? Tabasco Cat? Hansel? Risen Star? Little Current? Damascus? Nashua? Native Dancer? Capot? And the list goes on and on and on.............
OMG. Implying that Secretariat got an allegedly big heart from Man O’War? Secretariat was not descended from the real Big Red, Man O’War. Perhaps you’re thinking of his sire, Fair Play? Which I don’t know if that applies anyway.
This whole "X-factor" thing is NOT proven. It all comes from a horse named ECLIPSE, who died in the late 1700's, and the necropsy showed that he had a heart that weighed twice as much as normal horse hearts. Eclipse passed this "X-factor" down through his daughters. Secretariat's dam-line traces through one of Eclipse's daughters, and so did Sham's.
Sham might have been scared but from his Jockey's whip . He beat Sham in all three triple crown races .
Not only did Sham have the bad luck of racing against Secretariat and had the misfortune of having Pincay as a jockey. 🤬 And the trainer let him.
I hope Sham had a better retirement and was treated well in his remaining years.
@@lucybarrington4634I hope so too. Pincay really whipped Sham. Poor horse.
@@janetgallo5720 Pincay also saved Sham's life in the Belmont Stakes, by recognizing that something was wrong with Sham during the race and slowing him down.
One of secretariats grand sire is a son of fair play the sire of man o war
Specifically, one of his great-great grandsires.
Santa Anita race track not Santa Ana
You gotta make a very good case for alydar.
Alydar Was Better Than Sham
@@Brick-so1iglol
@@Brick-so1igI don’t think so they were close
No. Native Dancer. His only defeat in 22 starts was his second place loss by a head in the 1953 Kentucky Derby, in which he was bumped badly and given a poor ride.
Forego, 4th in Secretariat's Derby, would be the second best Derby starter to lose. Forego, NOT Sham, was, hands down, the greatest horse Secretariat ever beat. Forego was still developing in the spring of his 3-year-old year, however, and not the monster he would be at 4/5/6. He skipped the other Triple Crown races because of Secretariat. He tied with Sham at the end of the year in the Eclipse Award voting as the 2nd best American 3-year-old male of 1973.
Native Dancer is ranked 7th among the 100 greatest American-raced Thoroughbreds of the 20th century by the 7-person panel of racing experts put together in 1999 by BloodHorse. Forego (57: 34-9-7, and an 8-time Eclipse Award champion, including 3 Horse of the Year titles) is ranked 8th. Alydar (26:14-9-1) was ranked 27th.
At least three other horses who lost the Kentucky Derby were ranked above Alydar: Damascus (#16 on the BloodHorse list, 32:21-7-3, 3rd in the 1967 Derby); Round Table (#17 66:43-8-5, 3rd in the 1957 Derby); and Bold Ruler (#19 33:23-4-2, 4th in the 1957 Derby) were ranked higher than Alydar.
Sham (rightfully) did not make the top 100. Not with a career record of 13:5-5-1, and 1 G1 win (and only 1 other graded stakes win). He's not in the U.S. Thoroughbred Racing Hall of Fame, either, which of course all the others are.
@@marysueeasteregg what about Easy Goer Pat wait all Day killed his chances
I will argue that Point Given was the best horse to NOT win the Kentucky Derby.
Point Given was an absolute BEAST! Unfortunately, he passed away last year at the Kentucky Horse Park, where he lived a happy life in retirement.
Yes, I hate the new economics of horse racing. Colts are retired at 3, before they are really mature.
Few people would remember Dr. Fager is he didn’t run at 4, and Forego would have been virtually unknown. Plus, the fans would have been robbed of the experience of seeing them in their greatness.
A lot of the handicap horses were, and still are, GELDINGS.
Give me a break. Sham was better than Man O’ War, Native Dancer, Dr. Fager, Damascus, Buckpasser, Kelso, Forego, etc.?
He was an excellent horse. “Great” is a serious overstatement. Look at his race record outside the Triple Crown events.
You could make a very good argument that he wasn’t as good as his sire.
Sham was not better than Dr.Fager.1.32 mile.
Definitely not better than any of the ones you mentioned. But Man o'War, Dr. Fager, Kelso and Buckpasser never ran in the Kentucky Derby.
The best horse to enter the K. Derby and not win was Native Dancer...his head loss in the Derby was his only defeat in 22 starts. Forego, 4th in Secretariat's Derby, is arguably the second greatest horse to start in the race and not win.
@@marysueeasteregg Native Dancer is my favorite horse, and it hurts to think of that loss.
If you are going to limit the discussion (quite understandable) to horses that ran in the race, two great sons of Nasrullah, Nashua and Bold Ruler, also came up short. And Native Dancer’s grand sire, Discovery, finished second in 1934. The next year, he became the only winner of Horse of the Year over a Triple Crown winner, Omaha.
@@johnhoie-hj7cg I drafted last night a very long discussion of Derby starters better than Alydar (much less Sham) who failed to win the Derby. Wiped it out accidentally before posting. Forgot Bold Ruler! If I ever redraft it, I'll have to include him. (edit: I had already included Bold Ruler, at least in another post.)
Alydar is a legitimately great horse, though, and a deserving Hall of Famer. Sham was, at best, a late-developing horse who might have proven he was great if his career had not been cut short by injury. Forego and plenty of other Hall of Fame runners would not be remembered if they had never raced beyond early June of their 3-year-old season.
Sham is also, at best, the 4th best horse Secretariat ever beat. Maybe lower.
What does Man O’War have to do with either Sec or Sham? Nothing! Sham doesn’t even have sire Fair Play in him! Sec does. But I’ve not heard about MOW being some X-factor horse, though honestly I don’t know nearly enough about that stuff. Maybe FP did. And sham wasn’t born exactly 53 years after MOW. MOW was March 29. Perhaps you meant Sec, foaled March 30. And again, only 53 years, not 83.
Point Given was the greatest horse not to win the kentucky Derby
Or Native Dancer.
@@theOlLineRebel The ONLY race Native Dancer lost in his career was the Kentucky Derby, where he finished 2nd.
@@TheProfessorOfLife Yes. Along with Broker's Tip, kind of proves the Derby is not all THAT.
@@theOlLineRebel Actually, it proves how tough the Kentucky Derby is to win, because of the number and quality of the horses. The KY Derby brings out the best, and worst, in racehorses, because up to 20 horses can run in the race, you never know what the track conditions will be because of the spring weather in Kentucky, and nowadays running the 10 furlongs is a question mark for many horses.
@@TheProfessorOfLife It was ND's only loss, by a hair, and Broker's Tip's only win. Broker's Tip was a lousy horse. Also, despite the alleged conditions of so many "top" races, including Breeder's Cup, there are MANY lousy horses running them every single year. I'll never understand it. Far too many losers and local yokels in these races who really don't amount to "Derby horse". I'm just saying, the Derby is very, very overrated for many reasons, the "quality" being one of them.
So he is saying Sham liked little boys?
Santa Ana?
No, Santa Anita.
Any other year, Sham would have won the Triple Crown.
It's highly likely he would have been capable of it in many years. "Any" other year? I'd eliminate 1977-1979. In any case, winning that series is always a matter of luck as well as talent, as Native Dancer and Spectacular Bid patently demonstrate.
There's no way to know if Sham would have held up to 12 furlongs absent the suicidal pace of the Belmont, and/or absent the injury he may have sustained in that race.
We also don't know if a still-developing Forego would have entered the 1973 Preakness and/or Belmont, absent the presence of Secretariat. Forego's trainer was candid that he wanted to avoid Secretariat after Forego's 4th place finish in the Derby. In Eclipse Award voting at the end of the year, Forego tied with Sham as second best 3- year-old male in the nation.
@@marysueeasteregg I meant to say, and should have said most any other year, 19 out of 20. Sham still has the second fastest time ever in the Kentucky Derby.
I think Sham would have had a good chance of beating Affirmed.
The pace in the 1973 Belmont would have been suicidal for any horse but The Great Secretariat.
The greatest has to be Native Dancer. 10 in a row lose the Derby by a nose and then 10 in a row! Also Alydar better than Sham and Easy Goer very good.
Zenyatta had 19 in a row.
@@janetgallo5720 All but 1 of her wins was against females. Not the same as running against males.
@@janetgallo5720irrelevant. How many horses accomplish 10 straight anyway? That was the point.
53 years, not 83. Come on. So many errors, how can I take this seriously?
That track was hard rolled, and blazing fast that day. If you would have put Seattle Slew or Spectacular Bid on that surface, it would be one of them holding that record. There were 2 other track records that day. That surface was smoking fast!.
And yet, Seattle slew couldn’t touch the time in the Belmont
You mean Belmont, right? Even if not, little discussed is how many BEL TRs were set that very year, from about 6f to 1-1/2 mi. Most distances had records in that range that very year! In fact one of them had several records set and equaled all within a very short time, that year! Truth is the 2:24 was probably greased. Far too many show “1973” at the end of that year, and no, they are not all Secretariat!
@@janetgallo5720check all the TRs that were set at Belmont in 1973 itself. Different spin if you know that.
@@theOlLineRebel Atta Boy!! Somebody with some knowledge. Yes Belmont redid their surface for 1973. Removed the sand from *Big Sandy" lol. I know that times were exceedingly fast for the whole meet. Not sure of the exact ratio of records. But I know for a fact, that they hard rolled the track for 3 days leading up to the Belmont. 1st race, Maiden Special weight, 1 Mile, 1:33 1/5...track record set for 6 furlongs, and the 1 1/16 miles as well. That track was smoking!! I always imagined what horses like Dr. Fager, or Spectacular Bid would have done on that speedway!! What?? 2:21 and change?? Me maybe faster.
@@david1044 HA! Dr. Fager running 12 furlongs? NEVER would have happened. He was a miler, and once in awhile he could squeeze out 9 or 10 furlongs. He only ran FIVE races at 10 furlongs, and ZERO races greater than 10 furlongs. He ran in NONE of the Triple Crown races during his 3-year-old season.
Sham would not have won the Belmont big heart or not . There were two other horses in the race that he had to beat . No one will ever know but I don't think so .
Well, jockey error certainly played a role in the result, and trainer instructions. Nevertheless, Sham still went all out because he was asked to and because he was a warrior. Unfortunately those instructions nearly killed Sham that day.
Think Sham's owners would have run a different race if secretariat wasn't in race, tried to burn him out, but came back on him
Of Sham's 13 races, he won five races, with only ONE of those races being a graded stakes race, the Grade 1 Santa Anita Derby. Yes, Sham finished 2nd to Secretariat in two of the three Triple Crown races, but to call Sham "the greatest racehorse to never win the Kentucky Derby" is a gross overstatement. You are completely IGNORING DOZENS of other horses who had a much better horseracing resume' than Sham had, that also failed to win the Kentucky Derby for a variety of reasons, INCLUDING Man o' War, who did not even run in the Kentucky Derby.
Sham Was "5 for 13" Lifetime Getting Beat by Other Horses and Fields Too....He Won The SA Derby is All...Sham Ran Some Fast Times "Behind" Secretariat But Shams Overall Resume is Very Mediocre at Best...Sham is NOT Even Close to 2nd Best Horse Not to Win Derby....That Title Probably Goes to Easy Goer
5 for 13 lifetime and never won in open company. The lengths people go to prop up Secretariat is getting crazy.
@@thorne1239 Easy Goer is My Favorite All Time Horse (Not Saying He Was The Best....But Secretariat Over 50 Years and Still Holds Record in All 3 Crown Races Including The 30+ Length Romp in an INCREDIBLE "2:24" Flat For 12F....He Was Also BRILLIANT on The Grass
So many greats. But no horse but 1 can hold 50 year records in all three races
@@thorne1239 I agree about Sham. But Secretariat doesn't need Sham to prop him up. He was impressive enough at age 2 he was voted Horse of the Year, only the second 2-year-old to get that honor. He defeated 3 Hall of Fame horses, an additional American champion, and a Canadian Hall of Fame horse. He won twice at age 3 against top older horses. He dominated on turf as well as dirt. (He won Turf Horse of the Year in 1973, and Turcotte has said the horse was 10 to 15 lengths better on grass than dirt.) He set 5 track/course records (one was a turf record for the track), and 2 world records, both on dirt.
@@thorne1239 Secretariat most certainly does NOT need to be "propped up". He is the G.O.A.T.. When Big Red was 100% healthy, he was absolutely UNBEATABLE. Period. End of story.
Yeah there’s no man o war in his pedigree at all
The gene is carried on the female side.Not the male side need to do your homework
The gene is carried by the daughters of a horse named ECLIPSE, who died in the late-1700's.
Dislike stupid snapping background noise. I'm not a dog being called to attention.
I’m sorry this guy is just making a story😢 but if you want the truth, he’s one of the greatest Sham is not so much😢 o
These horses are much better than sham down below😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮😮🎉😂
winks the greatest turf horse to ever race😜 Melair. Beat snow, chief like a one legged stepchild both of those horses were girls.😮 John Henry what a monster Kona Gold what a beautiful sprinter of alltime. Flight Line incredible American Farrell did they forget about you🎉 where are arrow gate😮 yes 👍 you have the wrong idea by saying only the greatest you have no proof you have no factual information you don’t even know these horses. Do you know who megahertz is one of the best closers on turf black caviar Tepin where is your monster, Mark Cassie😮 this is what people talk about. They don’t know what they’re talking about. I’ve been gambling since I was nine years old. Don’t try to flex. There’s no guarantee. This is the greatest unless you run the race and obviously you don’t know these horses I’m talking about.😮 there’s 100 different horses that at any given time through history they could’ve played with secretariat i’m sorry, John Henry this guy is lost precisionist where are you 😮 candy ride? Charismatic.
You're the first person to mention overseas horses. As far as i know, we were only talking about American-bred and American-raced horses. Save your snarky attitude for the overseas horse people. They'll love you for it. Just for the record, Charismatic won the KY Derby.