Why Starliner is NOT SAFE to Return Astronauts from the ISS!
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
- The Starliner has several leaks from one of its high-pressure helium manifolds, and while it was able to dock with the ISS, it should NOT be trusted to bring our astronauts safely home! China is on the far side of the Moon sending back samples, while America is risking the lives of its astronauts unnecessarily. The Terran Space Academy's analysis shows that the only safe option is to return the astronauts on Dragon or Soyuz, before we have another deadly catastrophe in American spaceflight.
Credit SpaceX, ULA, Boeing, NASA, PBS, Space.com, Hazegrayart
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You are correct. The risk is unacceptable. If they try to return starliner with crew and astronauts die then someone should go to jail. I watched the starliner crew board ISS and their relief was clearly visible, almost uncontrollable. This capsule must not be used to return crew. I hope NASA makes the safe decision.
They were so uncomfortable the crew took a nap on the way up.
We don't know the state of their sleep. They were scheduled to sleep and so of course they have to follow the schedule. But if you look at their faces and body language when they entered ISS they were clearly relieved.
They need to add a whole wing to the jail for all the Boeing people who deserve to be in there.
@@maq6144 probably cramped space ... i see those capsules being a bit small.. strapped to a seat and not much space for anything else
@@loudelk99Which they ended early so the crew could help with troubleshooting…
So many leaks in the helium pressurization system implies both poor workmanship and poor acceptance testing.
Maybe it sat too long... Seals need to function or they contract sometimes.
I think it's just a bad design of the valves redo the whole system before they perish!
Seems like Boeing's quality control manufacture, testing & validation have been corrupted by insane profit motivations where "good enough" is their corporate goal. Boeing needs to fire all their inept corporate hierarchy & restructure their new hires with QUALITY Precision as job 1. Apparently the 737 Max MCAS horrendous debacle was one of several hidden "train wrecks" waiting to blast on scene. There is no way that software will bridge alleged corporate malfeasance.
The lowest bid got the job.
Boeing's diversity hiring is showing results
My issue with this is the pre-launch press briefing. They discussed in detail the risk mitigation of the seal issue, as well as talking to the manufacturer about the seal “batches” and how they intentionally avoid using all seals from one batch in redundant systems to avoid a single-point failure, etc. They believed they had it nailed down to a single seal, wasn’t going to be a big deal. They were VERY wrong about a VERY important element of the vehicle. It clearly wasn’t scientific, it was an assumption to justify a launch ASAP.
To have THIS MANY leaks (post launch, when lives are on the line) is bad enough, but to have them after risk-mitigation measures were already undertaken AND “understood” - with the go-ahead being given, is simply ABSURD.
This is “get-there-itis” at its best, and classic Boeing. I know it’s NASA’s call, but we know that’s not how it really works, especially with the unbelievably terrible press that Starliner has been getting (justifiably so.) It’s another 737 MAX for them. This thing HAD to fly - it was making NASA look bad as well, so it was in everyone’s interest to launch.
Except it didn’t pan out, and they shot themselves in the foot yet again.
Lucky for them, the media doesn’t really care about this stuff (till it results in a disaster) - it launched, they’re safely at the ISS, news cycle is over.
If the single leak had persisted I would not be so worried. Three new ones in flight and its time to stand down.
If protocol was followed, i.e. to use components from different manufacturing runs, these multiple faults must point to a design problem, either in the valves, the manufacturing methods and/or methods of quality verification.
if anything happens , these 2 astronauts were NOT suicidal.
Just brave...
One could argue that getting in a Boeing space vehicle that has had so many problems and was launched with known issues to try and save some face.... is a clear sign of being suicidal. Perhaps they felt they had no choice now... I note they didn't blow any whistles before they left. Or did they....
@@phedders Very good question!
@@pheddersyou had me at Boing…😒
Well that didn't work the last time Boeing was involved so....
Dream chaser is on the way
Ya. But the first one is not human rated. Only for cargo.
yes, have that baby on stand by .... for exactly such incidents, repairs or retrievals of craft and or crew ✊ 😑
NASA missed the boat on that one.
@@terranspaceacademy dragon is great for cargo and transport but it’s not able to boost stations orbit which star-liner was suppose be able to do. (I am hoping dream chaser works well )
@@jamskinner Yep sounds like Dragon..an if it fails no one gets to die..or would that be DEI on Starliner
New landing footage of spacx starship booster in the ocea. Was spot on!!
Amazing wasn't it! Gives me hope!
I'm curious to learn where the "Terran Space Academy" is produced. It provides a very balanced as well as well-informed perspective on space flight. It's too unbiased and subtle to be an American production. Great video. Thank you.
Thank you Phillip.
Your presentation expresses what the whole planet would wish to be a reference leading to a difficult and controversial decision to let go the Starliner float away from the ISS and without any passengers on board let it burn on a controlled re-entry.
I watched all of your presentations about the Starliner and I consider that you present a guiding light of the most important factors to be considered in this extremely difficult decision that has to be made in the coming hours. Let the thing go and burn, this spacecraft is not safe and every extra second it is attaches to the ISS puts the crew at a very high of dying due to the high probability of a catastrophic explosion of the Starliner leading to the total destruction of the International Space Station.
Your presentations are soooo well documented. You possess an exceptional talent at conceiving, assembling/creating pure jewels.
Thank you Robert.
Starliner is a total shitshow.
STAY-liner.
It is indeed so far... The sunk cost fallacy on full display.
I wonder if the astronauts will speak funny on re entry because of the helium leak……
😂
Absolutely, the Starliner has had too many issues to ignore. As an alternative to Dragon, I hope the 2nd version of Sierra Space's spaceplane (they say it could be crew rated in the future) gets up and running soon, and I hope it's safer than the Starliner. Can't wait for Dreamchaser's first launch, it's supposed to be on my birthday but I doubt it will actually launch then
Sierra Space is doing some amazing stuff! Dream Chaser should absolutely have a reserved parking spot @ ISS for incidentals. Whatever happens I just hope that we get a chance to see starship attached to iss bc that chit would look absolutely hilarious!
I think even the Europeans will have something up before Starliner is safe.
Re helium leaks - Risk Analysis needed.
1. What exactly are the risks / potential failures?
2. What are the impacts of each risk if realized?
3. Which impacts are acceptable; which are unacceptable?
4. Can all unacceptable risks be fully mitigated?
(In this analysis, would not look at probabilities of risks with unacceptable impact being realized, because any possibility is unacceptable where an alternative without such risks is available.)
NASA already noted that it could have resulted in a "mission ending" failure that threatened crew lives.
Hopefully NASA will make the safer choice to send Falcon 9 up to return the astronauts. Safety first NASA. Please 🙏
Elon should volunteer a Dragon if NASA is too cheap, he can afford it, and we cannot afford to lose those heroes.
@@terranspaceacademy I disagree. Elon should not pay for it. The Boeing fat cat bean counters should pay for it. The whole Starliner project from start to finish reeks of bloated costs and inefficiency, milking the taxpayers. NASA needs to grow up and face reality.
Boeing and NASA should pay. They are responsible for the fiasco. The rescuers should be paid. If I may vent a moment. I'm getting a little sick of hearing people dump on Elon. You should thank your lucky stars that you are alive while this guy is doing his thing. Here's my point. When it comes to engineering, engineers and objective, leadership is key. Certainly there are fine engineers working on Starliner. I do not doubt that. Actually the best of them probably feel handcuffed. If they were led by Elon Musk, and not bean counters, you would have a different result. If there is blame it is on the financial leadership, nto the engineers. IMO
Well, If the Starliner crew does come back on Dragon or more embarrassingly on Soyuz...and the empty Starliner has a catastrophic failure coming back.....Gee...how many "Early retirements and resignations" will there be at Boeing?
Boeing, Wow...a legacy aerospace company in the United States, Maker of the B-17, 747... way back when....held hostage by suits pushing the bottom line and stock value (What will that value be if this goes tits up?)
Well, let the Starliner crew chill at the ISS for a later flight back and fingers crossed that the over-budget, under-performing Starliner returns intact.
If they do the safe thing there's no reason for heads to roll. If they force it like the did Challenger. It's jail time.
The Starliner uses old and supposedly proven technology and still hasn’t solve basic problems. They had helium leaks in the service module on previous launch attempt but still didn’t resolve the issue. SpaceX has already proven it’s reliable Dragon crew capsule.
Starship is using the latest innovations and fails at times but it resolves the issues at the next launch and makes significant progress going forward. The virtual landing test of the booster and Starship was a success and show great progress.
I think the problem is time... The long delay between construction and use. Imagine building a care, letting it sit for ten years then firing it up and heading out for a cross country tour. Probably not a good idea.
@@terranspaceacademy I would have thought Boeing would have test fired the thrusters and all other systems after taking it out of moth ball. It shows a lot of Boeing’s management problems along with their airline mishaps. Can NASA and the taxpayers bear continuing problems with Boeing? Maybe Dreamer Chaser can fill the bill.
I was surprised they made it there
I was too.
I like that ideal. Extend their stay and bring them down on the Dragon.
No harm in being safe.
The astronauts looked scared when they left.😢
You are not the only one to make that remark.
Good video. So many today are AI generated, narrated and published without benefit of editing this was very refreshing. Subscribed, liked and commented.
I know. It makes it hard to get a chance with so much chaffe and we appreciate you. Welcome aboard.
Good point. Cheers. 😎
Thank you Tony!
Starliner is good. We just have to find out what it is good for.
Tours on the ground I think. Step right up and see the $5 billion dollar waste of taxpayer money! Right here folks!
Use this one to bring some waste back from the ISS.
Is the dragon capsule constantly pressurised with oxygen?
Yes, unless they are "spacewalking" it has normal 13.9 to 14.9 psi pressure so standard N2-79/O2-21 mix.
@@terranspaceacademy so in an emergency situation like no spacex suits , could they possibly return without or am I missing something
its gonna blow for sure
I really hope not but I don't trust it.
I am in 100% agreement that the Starliner crew need another way home. However, I seriously doubt Boeing's CEO would ever let that happen considering his prioritizing stock prices over lives. Just the fact that they launched with so many known problems is proof of that.
NASA needs to ground Starliner, again, and force them to redesign the capsule to a standard worthy of the billions of dollars they have been paid to make a safe, cost effective, capsule. The estimated price per seat of Starliner should have been grounds to never consider it in the first place.
The most likely best option, Sierra Space and Dream Chaser should be awarded some more development funding, taken from Boeing's billions. The Dream Chaser has the potential to not only delivery cargo and crew, but also functions we likely don't know about yet. Having two vehicles that cover a wider range of functionality would be so much better than having two that do the exact same thing.
We agree. The decision should be out of his hands.
Superb thank you.
You are most welcome!
As far as I'm concerned, you aren't being too cautious. History shows you REALLY can't mess with space safety. Clearly there are issues with Starliner and they aren't trivial either. Personally, were I in charge, I'd bring it down unmanned with the crew in an alternative that was safe.
We agree. There's no downside to being safe.
"Thiokol engineers warned NASA not to launch when it was too cold." Yes, and then after launching, NASA kept that information from the Congressional investigation. It took some Thiokol engineers intervening to tell the investigators that they warned them hours earlier and were browbeaten by NASA bigwigs to change their story.
Which should have been a crime. Would have been if we had done it.
@@terranspaceacademy Indeed.
Can anyone explain to me why the Chinese Rocket didn't have any gases venting from it before takeoff with the Astronauts going to their Sp ace Station? Also why was there no lighting around it? It looked like a toy Rocket that just suddenly took off.
Because it is! Seriously, the Long March 2F is completely hypergolic. No cryogenics, no boil off.
Very well stated. One very important point to be made though. The achievements of the former Soviet Union and China are government sponsored projects. SpaceX is entirely the vision of one brilliant man. It has achieved much history making progress toward the largest 100% reusable space ship in history without the backing of any government and often in spite of the efforts of the US government.
NASA, once the technological leader in space exploration has decayed into a bureaucratic morass that is incapable of making progress at any reasonable pace or cost.
The truly sad thing is that Pete Conrad was on the way to a fully reusable system with DCX when he was canceled for political reasons (The X-33 has more support in congress).
One technical advance in rocket science is how to grow all that high-quality ganja that Elon likes to smoke.
He's only smoked it once from what I can see but he had to do that on video so...
Do you think the SpaceX crew dragon capsule would have to do a rescue mission?
I think it would be an excellent test of the capability.
@@terranspaceacademy dragon has already flown 23 flights with 49 total astronauts. The one that's docked to the ISS now has already been on 5 flights. They are more than capable. The only one that was destroyed was an on ground abort thruster test. Not a single one to have an issue during a mission.
Do you have any advice for getting a foot in the door at a space company? I want to work in propulsions.
identify as a mexican, spencer rodriguez. DEI will take care of the rest
We have a few contacts... What type of engines? ion or chemical?
I dont understand your take that Starliner is not safe. That is not the finding. The fact that NASA is slowing the return and retesting is the proper method for learning about this system and how to handle it. StarShip has had four flights, not one has met the design expectations. Sure they are improving as they go. Starliner is going through a troubled test flight. But its still operating and the Bruce has commented on how precise it flies. It definitely has success in this test mission. The helium system is not a up to par, a redesign is obviously coming. The leak rate on the helium tank is low, very low, the return mission needs 7 hours of helium, the tank has approximately 70 hours remaining. Starliner is far from unsafe.
The problem is not just the helium, that's just a symptom of a bigger problem. It's the repeated pattern of new and sometimes critical errors and faults. The two software errors on flight one could have killed a crew. Malfunctioning thrusters are never ok. If it would just fly once with no problems I would feel a lot better.
The Starliner crew have signed off on relying on it through their forthcoming landing..... We'll see....
Anyone seriously in the field surely know the risks..... :)
The problem is that I don't think anyone knows the risks at this point... Too much is failing unexpectedly, John.
Great video...👍
Prototype vessels that are still in development should not be used to carry people. Plain and simple.
We agree. At least a half dozen cargo runs would be a lot safer.
Wow! You just have to love Elon Musk and SpaceX.
Not really. Just acknowledging accomplishment.
Elon Time vs ULA & and blue origin time.
Elon Musk tends to be optimistic about time to when a product becomes available and may be 1 or 2 yeagrs late.
ULA finaly launched in 2024, the delay is 10 lyears so far.
Jeff Bezos blue origin was founded in 2000 it has been 24 years so far no launch.
So so why is no one talking about ULA or Blue origin time and?
Scientia Habet Non Domus,
(Knowledge Has No Home)
antiguajohn
There is no time before the Big Bang! :-) The BO universe of true spaceflight has not even started yet :-)
Yep, I'm definitely not a rocket scientist. So, it's the helium leaks that are the problem for returning astronauts? I watched the whole video but don't recall a clear statement that the Starliner, "...couldn't safely bring back the crew," or words to that effect; as the title suggests.
If I've got it right then Boeing and NASA would be taking an totally unacceptable risk.
We don't know for sure how many cosmonauts have been lost on missions but we do know for sure that America has lost way too many good men and women, on the ground and in orbit.
What is it with Boeing?
I'm old enough to remember the 60s advertising catch phrase, "Its Boeing or I'm not going." Well, we now know that phrase has a tragic double meaning.
Anyone who knowingly sits atop large tanks of chemicals that ignite on contact with air deserves my genuine admiration; but they don't have to do it if the risk factors are suddenly increased due to faulty systems.
If these problems are not fixed, with a great deal of certainty, then the sacrifice of those who went before and lost their lives died in vain. Anyone who publicly coined the phrase "Space Race" should be languishing in a Federal prison. I thought we had out grown that kind of thinking. Apparently not. Bill H.
You didn't see the impressive side panel blow off demonstration (borrowed from Apollo 13)? That's my point. A worsening leak can lead to an overpressurization explosion under the skin of the ship or an explosion of an overpressurized hypergolic tank or torn line... It's just not worth the risk.
Proudly made by Boing.....
Flying you to the Great Beyond! Boeing!
I hope those astronauts aren't whistleblowers
Ouch! They do have a habit of coming up without a metabolism don't they.
It would be a hoot if Space X had to launch a rescue mission for Starliner.
It would indeed be a "sick burn" as they say :-)
Better safe than sorry
We agree.
Who said this?
We did.
Well it returned to earth. On the last flight. That was unmanned.
Indeed. No downside to flying it back uncrewed.
To MBAs dividends are job one. After CEO and Board compensation
That's right... Only the next quarter exists.
The impression I get of MBAs from the space community is that they're so damaging to an economy that you would *swear* the profession was invented (by the USSR or someone else who hates the west) as a sleeper plot to weaken and destroy countries. Problem is its way too old for that.
Unfortunately, people will die in this thing before folks come to their senses.
It is a distinct possibility.
Boeing did not design the any of the Atlas family of launch vehicles and, as a aircraft designer and builder, has historically had little experience with ex-atmosphere space projects. Starting in the early 1950's, General Dynamics designed and gradually perfected the Atlas family of boosters. Boeing got into the act because Lockheed Martin (who bought Atlas from General Dynamics) wanted to limit their involvement by partnering with LM. Not having the decades long experience with the tricky business of ex-atmospheric vehicles, Boeing has had to play catch-up and had to learn for themselves all the tricks of the trade that General Dynamics Atlas engineers worked out years earlier. At least, that's how I see it.
As a former engineer with the Atlas and Delta launch vehicles, working with McDonnel Douglas and General Dynamics and (ugh!) Lockheed Martin, I've dealt with both hydrogen and helium and while hydrogen is very difficult to store and contain, helium gas is the most difficult gas there is or possibly can be to confine. Gaseous He will take advantage of the tiniest orifice in a valve or connection to give you a blowing leak. Obviously, the leaks experienced by the Starliner are going to result in a major investigation and a re-design of the He plumbing of this vehicle.
Which vehicle vehicle would I go up in? The Starliner, when the bugs are worked out.
Very good point.
Overly cautious should be the mantra of human space exploration. I hope you’re wrong here, but if the word Boeing is associated with one more misstep, I think we will be left far behind.
It would indeed set us back a decade I think
Absolute clickbait nonsense about Starliner. SpaceX Dragon routinely flies with helium leaks. The Space Shuttle routinely flew with helium leaks. Helium is a non flammable gas - it's used to pressurise systems. I will take bets on the crew of Starliner returning safely to Earth.
Would you like to step onto Flat Earth for a minute? Everyone isn't needing a refresher course on steps for FAA or NASA Certification. Everything has never been about how to build and assemble ANY rocket.
You have the right to express as much doubt as wish though. And we are not upon any flat Earth platform that is, was, and has always been very nicely done as well. History doesn't repeat itself for long.
Many times, nobody is a fool for anyone's leading Art of entirely more important unification and normalization plan at ANY COST WHATSOEVER.
I like rockets too. And the Spaceplane.
Presume only what you have actually personally experienced. Prepare to live far past any expected or pronounced date of expiration despite all presumed Authority to dictate your or anyone else's need to be sailing along with the Good Lord or anyone in the afterlife.
Remember China's Tiananmen Square massacre which occurred on 4 June 1989 , known in China as the June Fourth Incident, were student-led demonstrations held in Tiananmen Square, Beijing, China was suppressed by the People's Liberation Army cracked down where hundreds of students were killed.
Yes, Tim. I remember it well. Just out of the Marines and heading toward Officer Training School.
I'm afraid you are right. Starmax
Thank you!
Everyone is dumping on Boeing. And for good reason. If there are more than one helium link, the task isn’t to repair it. The task is t discover the reason and redesigning it. One time is a repair. Two times is a redesign. Consider this. If the astronauts are lost, a root cause analysis will include a reluctance by Boeing to address the valves at the source of the issue. Not just “fix” stuff. The video is clear how reliable such engines are. That suggests that a helium leak raises huge flags and that there is something different about that engine. If I bake a cake from a well known recipe and it tastes terrible. I don’t go looking for ways to fix it. I throw it out and start over. It’s clear I did it wrong.
It just doesn't stop...
NASA does not yet have two American ways to get Astronauts to and from the ISS.
To yes.
Return is still pending.
Whats a starliner?
Boeing Spacecraft for ISS resupply and personnel transfer.
Not overly cautious. Maybe a tad over generous. Push that junk into the ocean and send SpaceEx. We can't replace the people who are our Astronauts. Tell Boeing to come back when management is staffted with more tech.
Very true. We don't need another preventable disaster.
sighhhhhhh roscosmos and space x to the rescue ig
I don't think the astronauts will mind riding on two types of capsules :-)
I concur, bring the spacecraft down without the astronauts and get SpaceX to recover the crew.
Thank you.
Can you say SNAKEBIT?
I can indeed... But why would I?
Boeing is not exactly covering itself in glory lately.
Sadly no... And they used to be so awesome.
It's far past the time when the Starliner program should have been canceled. End it now before we lose astronauts.
Agreed
Boing is a liability!
How the mighty have fallen...
Well... 1 crewed and 1 crude spacecraft.
Agreed. Also, I love the concept at the end. I’ve been idly day dreaming about something similar but several air breathing jet powered 1st stage boosters that return to land similarly leaving the center core stage also air breathing but scram jet powered that would separate and land in some fashion but idk how you would propulsive land a scram jet powered booster stage…
Unless of course it’s one that can somehow convert over to a simple high bypass turbo jet engine at lower altitudes and speeds like quarter horse or whatever its name is. Then upper stage would be either similar to starship or perhaps even a starship sized upper stage that’s propelled and lands similar to Stoke Space’s planned Nova upper stage. Those techs all seem to be the most efficient, easiest to rapidly reuse w/out refurbishing, and potentially safest technologies in their given use cases.
And if I’m incorrect in that then who cares…I enjoy day dreaming about it…🤷🏾♂️
That's a good thought.
A good video on... umm ... everything _except_ the title.
Helium leaks worsening... potential for boom. That was my point.
@terranspaceacademy That's a vast oversimplification. And the potential disaster would not be "boom".
You didn't say anything new about the situation.
This vid is completely right. We can't send these 2 heroes back to earth in a broken ship. Haven't we learned our lessons yet? Let E L. handle it. Bring up a Falcon..
I fn love your style of narration man, it's a throw back to the 1960s golden years of spaceflight. Keep up the good work, from a fan in Australia.
Will do my friend from down under! I have visited once but still miss the beauty of Sydney.
I agree with your take on the Starliner crew staying on the ISS until they can return on another craft and bring back the liner under remote programming. Why risk it any other way. Pride needs to take a back seat with this.
We agree Mark.
The DOOMLINER is a disaster in the waiting, I hope NASA acts responsibly.
If BOEING has a small problem, the passengers have a big one
NASA looks best if this thing is a success, especially after giving Boeing more money than SpaceX initially.
That’s the crappy part, it’s in their best interest to ride it out. 🫤
It would be nice to have a domestic method for ISS re-boost though, that is a legitimate concern.
clearly long time politcal and business cronies keeping this ancient effort alive for $$$.
It's just a "door plug" what could go wrong?
dude , don't be such a killjoy , we have to celebrate the successful launch and docking of Boeing crewed space capsule . Now America has a backup plan to launch or bring astronauts back to earth in the case SpaceX would be "incapacitated " . It's better that flaws show up early rather than years later when everybody is off guard
@@tunkunrunk……..🙄🤣
Spacex to the rescue ? Bring the astronauts back to earth alive !!!
really, they need amother docking port up there and a capsule and crew on stand by in case of any emergency that may arise 🤔
Not practical. The connections between the vehicle and suit are vastly different between the NASA suit and the SpaceX suit. Plus right now the SpaceX suits are individually tailored so it would not even be possible to send up new suits for the 2 NASA astronauts to use to come home. Nope! The only way those 2 are coming home is in the vehicle they came in. All we can do is wish them luck.
@billmullins6833 Oh yeah, because it's so hard to just ask Boeing for their tailoring measurements and craft suits for them in 6 months. Rather send them home in a death trap than wait 6 months and send them home in a safe capsule 😂😂
We should start a movement!
They need a Dream Chaser crew vehicle on standby... Fly anytime and land on any runway.
It always bothered me that NASA insisted that Crew Dragon only lands on the water but Starliner is allowed the ability to land on land.
I never asked about this from anyone but it still bothers me.
If I recall correctly, it was a decision made by SpaceX because it would’ve taken too long to human rate the land landing system, and it was easier and faster to go with the water landing.
Space-X wanted to do propulsive landing and NASA didn't like the idea (they initially didn't even want to have parachutes at all, lol). Starliner uses big airbags instead of rockets. It was Space-X's decision.
@@takanara7it's also got small retro rockets like on the BO New Sheppard, to slow it down softly at the last second.
@@mbmurphy777It was definitely NASA'S decision to go with a water landing. Check the historical facts.
I think SpaceX should start landing cargo Dragons propusively to prove the technology.
Even though SpaceX made history, the mainstream media's reporting of this history making event was rather sparse or even overly critical. On the other hand they were gushing positive Starliner news and reporting live during the Starliner docking sequence, which happened to be at essentially the same time as the history making Starship double soft landing attempts, and successes.
I would imagine that the attention was on Starliner because it was manned, when starship goes up with a crew you can bet the media will pay attention.
Once you see the hypocrisy, it is imposible to not see it.
First manned flight vs fourth unmanned test. Starship was more impressive but Starliner was more important.
@@patricklewis7636 How was Starship successful ? Four tests, four lost heavy booster/Starship. A flying dust bin vs a manned crew that docked with the iss.
They weee covering the StarLiner in case it failed. The only good news is bad news.
Come on SpaceX…….. offer to rescue our astronauts for free. You’ll make 10X more for it later .
😎
They won't make 10 times more later, because whether they perform the rescue or not they are going to end up being the dominate US space access provider, and if ULA and BO don't seriously step up their game, SpaceX may be the only one.
You can not rescue someone who does not need rescue and who has not asked for it.
These problems are by all accounts small problems that are not mission critical. It is just such a good story now due to all the other problems that Boeing has faced.
The unpopular truth is that spacecrafts are extremely complex, and that small issues happen all the time. And yes that also includes SpaceX.
SpaceX does just not have the openness and the spotlight that Boeing has right now (due to prior mistakes).
NASA won't accept it, but Elon should make the offer anyway so NASA will be on record as turning down the rescue.
Rockets are dangerous for any equipment any company.
Thanks for showing all of the intricate details about how the pressure fed system works with helium!
The debrief sessions gave some details, but the high-level overview helps to put everything into perspective
You are most welcome my friend.
"starliner" is an artifact from a different era. Their organizational structure, culture and overall execution capabilities have been eclipsed by modern SpaceX.
Indeed. Not Apollo or SpaceX but that dead zone in between...
Do you have any idea how many rocket explosions and spacecraft anomalies Spacex has observed over the last decade??? Take a guess
@@element720 They just completed thier 300th launch. Not bad for a non Government funded space program. I'll take SpaceX over Boeing.
I want to see several more Statship tests before people board it.
@gryph01 I'm a big SpaceX fan, and am totally amazed by that last flight, but I think I needs a lot more then a few flights until they stick people on it. Even if a person could have maybe survived that last landing.
This is going to be embarrassing if SpaceX has to come and rescue these astronauts from their Starliner flight. I'm not at all surprised by this. These people cannot stop screwing up.
Not possible!
Indeed. But I'll take embarrassing over heartbreaking any day...
@@billmullins6833SpaceX capsule is fully automated. They can send it up with some additional supplies and bring them back. Then the starliner capsule can be released and sent back empty.
Starliner should not have been cleared to launch with a know helium leak.
@@billmullins6833it’s not possible to embarrass a company without shame such as Boing? Is that what you’re saying…? If not, care to explain? You have me on the edge of my seat wondering what you could possibly mean by that…🤔
Send Starliner back unmanned (womaned) with 400 Lbs. of ISS trash. See how that goes before risking lives. Give these 2 astronauts Kudos for getting on that thing in the 1st. place. # Apollo1..
Ever notice that these types of major problems rarely happened with manned vehicles?
Maybe we should find a new word that Boeing can't misinterpret as "crude vehicle".
They're American heroes alright. Anybody who'd voluntarily ride to space on a Boeing product are deserving of a Congressional Medal of Honor.
Or a Darwin award...
Or a straight jacket
How about all of the above?
Or a stalk of bananas.
They deserve better than good enough
Starliner is built by Boeing for more than double the cost of the dragon. What could possibly go wrong?
Nothing that can't be fixed by giving Boeing even more money.
And launched by old Soviet engine that they probably get for 100 liters off vodka
id feel safer riding super heavy back to the gulf than i would riding starliner
You can’t “ride a super heavy” back to the gulf, on the return it’s just a regular F9 lol, pick a booster.
Also they still reach 6g deceleration in spite of being nowhere near orbital velocities (as in, you wouldn’t even really be in space.)
An F9 could never even remotely return from orbital velocities - even as a joke, it doesn’t make sense lol.
@@EstorilEm"Super heavy" means the booster paired with Starship.
Also, super heavy clears well above 100km, so, it has been in space without any doubt.
Hey! Don't say we can't ride Super Heavy! I saw Tommy Lee Jones ride one to the Moon! (Or something like that)
@@EstorilEmright dafuq over your head there, eh bud….?🙄🤷🏾♂️
@@parkershaw8529that’s right! If Jeff Bozo’s customers can be lauded as “astronauts” for riding his rocket propelled pogo stick, then riding a SpaceX booster ironically should also count…😒
Thanks for saying what many reasonable people have been thinking! Stay bold!
This spacecraft bothers me. I fear for anyone riding in it.
We do too... It has never had a flight without serious problems that could end the mission catastrophically.
@@terranspaceacademy
There’s possibly another solution to fix starliner while in flight on the station. Likely an Eva of some sorts just to fix the leaks.
But I don’t know the heat shield is damaged. But I hope starliner does return home and likely have the starliner project fall into the hands of someone like Lockheed Martin which also worked with Boeing on a few projects.
Starliner seems to be working fine… but there’s a lot of room for improvement until it’s properly ready to fly again.
But one thing is certain, the atlas program had its first crewed flight since the 1960’s. And I’m at least happy with that.
For now…. We wait.
The situation for me is like Apollo 13 but it’s closer to home.
But in the terms of the situation, it’s just another reminder to everyone that space is hard, that doesn’t mean it’s impossible
@goldgamercommenting2990 this Atlas is nothing like the 60s version,, mainly it uses Russian engines
I think you are right about starliner, it should never have flown with known flaws.
They should have had their contract pulled almost 2 years ago…😒
I really appreciate the way you were able to explain the helium system/ leaks and possible consequences. Thank you
That ship has more leaks than a sieve. Boeing quality personified
It's honestly such a joke.
@@takanara7 it's embarrassing
Far as i read the gas leak was discovered before the lift off and the ship was examined and cleared to fly. Every system on the starliner is operating perfectly with the exception of one or 2 gas leaks. The Soyuz has gas leaks as a matter of course yet no one say a word. I worked at Boeing for 25 years and there isn't one of their products I wouldn't be willing to fly on.
The only shit ship more leaky is Trump.
I'd make screen door on a submarine jokes if it wasn't so serious.
I got dressed down by a guy claiming to be a former SpaceX maintenance engineer and a current NASA engineer, on another channel. Your video is so well done I doubt he will have anything to say here. On the matter of the sleep cycle. It was cut short to allow time for them to close two values. Now they have closed the closed the helium mainline value. Do you know whether they are going to attempt a repair while on orbit? It sure seems like there must have been some cost cutting on the helium side of the manifold. All I said was I felt there was a failure of QR testing on the part of Boeing. Makes me wonder if it was turned over to this guy at NASA and that's why he got so defensive.
😂
It is difficult to repair a helium leak on orbit. Helium is the 2nd smallest atom, is totally inert (cannot join molecules), has zero "stickiness" (viscosity) and can leak through the smallest, most microscopic crack imaginable in a container.
It's not like repairing a leaky faucet in your kitchen.
@@petergibson2318I'm well aware of that, thanks. I did study chemistry in college. What's the molarity of Helium in a vacuum? "In a near vacuum, helium gas is easily released from the surface of the wall due to its small desorption activation energy of 590 J/mol-1. This means that helium gas is not significantly trapped in vacuum vessels." Is that what you mean?
Still, it seems like they tried tightening those flanges and it makes me wonder if they are using compression rings and the vibration keeps loosening the joints. It's not like astronauts haven't done stuff like this before. Yeah right, just whip out the Teflon tape and crescent wrench in micro-gravity, LMAO. As a diy'er, I really get tired of drips under presser, pun intended.
@@OldBillOverHill Sit down and relax Old Bill. You might burst a blood-vessel if your blood-pressure goes any higher. You need to take care of yourself when you are Over the Hill.
@@petergibson2318 Man, you sure can't have any fun with you kids anymore. Is that the best you can do? I expect something a little more intellectual. Like molality and molarity aren't the same and gases in solution are better measured by molality. It was a little too sophisticated of bait I guess I expect too much these days. Typical X response. LMAO Thanks again for the entertainment.🤣😂😅
I think calling them heroes is a bit much. But then again they did get on Starliner. Maybe brave would be a better word? I see it as them just doing their job.
I would have gotten on but there would have been a lot of sobbing involved :-)
Agreed. The word hero is thrown around far too loosely these days, too often in reference to people doing literally what they were trained to do.
Unless they can test the valve manifold and thrusters in space, there is no way in hell they should bring back Astraunauts using StarLiner. It should still be in the testing phase at this time.
impossible to do that when docked, maybe they can remotely undock, test, redock - but that's a whole lotta risk
@@lolbots I totally agree however, all of the tests should have been done before it ever went into space. I risk is just too great to allow astronauts to fly StarLiner back into the atmosphere.
Another fantastic and informative video.
Thank you so much Dean!
I feel like these 2 astronauts are like the crew of the Columbia in orbit after the insulation had struck the wing. Hopefully this won't be a repeat of Columbia.
Agreed...
Dramatize anything to get people to click this video,..huh.
Yes, yes... All is fine. Go back to sleep. I'm sure it will all be ok.
An unsafe product from modern day Boeing? Who could have guessed? 😂
I'm shocked! SHOCKED I say! :-)
Thank you for the additional details. I am really inclined to agree. Too me the whole Starliner project was NASA: ego building and self interest. I think that the amount of money wasted on this project could likely have the Spacex Starship Sittin' Pretty on the moon right now!!! P.S. To all the Scientists and Techs involved in the Starship, who honestly were giving their all to the project, I do not fault you in this. It's just too much pride, greed & arrogance on the part of an arrogant few.
4:32
To be a bit pedantic the RD-170 still flew a bunch of times under the name off the RD-171 (only real difference was that it could gimble on two axis rather than just one like RD-170) as the first stage engine of the Zenit launch system, so it wasn't really retired.
Energia was also intended to be partly reusable from the very start, with its boosters landing sideways on the Kazakh steppe using a mixture of parachutes, retro rockets and landings legs (the two big dark gray compartments on the side of the booster contained the landing hardware). But during its two only flights the landing hardware was replaced with various telemetry instruments hence it never were able to test this capability (first test would have been the third flight if it ever flew). You can read about this in the book "Energiya-Buran: The Soviet Space Shuttle" by Bart Hendrickx if you're interested in exactly how this would have worked out.
That's a very good point... I need a Zenit lesson. I haven't looked at them since Sea Launch folded. Thank you!
Great video! I like how you gave the background of the launch vehicle and engines.
I agree, it’s not worth risking the lives of the two astronauts on Starliner.
Indeed. The test is the same if it comes back uncrewed.
Starliner astronauts need to wait till the next dragon rotation and come back on dragon. The Starliner can come back automatically. The astronauts can put their lucky rabbits foot on Starliner before attempting to return to earth.
We agree Johnnie.
But how cramped is up on the ISS as the Starliner joked on where they were going to sleep on it. Plus the food supply etc to feed the extra two now on ISS. Maybe the Starliner crew took up some food and supplies?
@@MissX905 I would rather skip few dinners then burn in space
Excellent stuff bro
Thank you so much Clarence!
SpaceX is an example of a company run by engineers, not by a bunch of MBA's. They only hire young ambitious engineers. And at the helm is Elon guiding all those talented engineers.
Into an Abyss of bankruptcy.
My dude. Thanks for uploading another good video. Food for thought! Ad astra pot terra.
Thank you my friend! Feeling snacky? :-)
@@terranspaceacademy Always! lol