The contrast between KDE and Gnome lmao. KDE: "This protocol is not really for us, but you've done well, so ACK" Gnome: Any protocol that doesn't fit us gets NACK'ed
@@cyberturkey77If it's for window or desktop behaviour one NACK means it won't be merged. Then everyone has to accommodate them even if they don't want to implement it. One of the biggest Gnome troublemaker didn't even have NACK powers, but acted like it. Luckily, that became a temporarily bannable offense and they are only allowed to be used for technical reasons now.
@@qlx-i if Gnome doesn't want it there must be good reason to not want it thats why I like Gnome. Doesn't listen to the community that thinks they know everything. KDE runs like shit.
All video: "I notice Gnome isn't even considering support…" Brodie: "Don't hold your breath." Me: Of course not, it's a standard, why would Gnome touch it?"
Slight correction: Under the multitasking settings in Gnome, there is a toggle for either "Workspaces on primary display only" and "Workspaces on all displays". Gnome dose have the ability to turn off having workspaces on all display and instead only the primary display will change when changing workspaces, you're not forced to have workspaces on all displays.
Never thought I'd be seeing what amounts to a "do we support xinerama and virtual desktops" discussion 30 years after these and other similar systems started being used heavily. For people who want to contest this, there were both graphical and text mode implementations even under DOS. It's completely reasonable for smaller projects like Xfce (let alone the dozens of smaller ones) to want these basic functions available rather than hacking together some cludge.
Workspaces predate linux and were a UNIX thing back in the 1970's... It is part of what made UNIX a "multitasking" OS compared to other competitors at the time. Why is this still so hard for linux 50 years later ?
The earliest reference I can find is a hardware based solution on the Amiga 1000, which supported multiple in memory displays, as for a software based approach that takes me to 1990 with a UNIX solution called vtwm
Personally, I find that workspaces are one of those features you tend to either ignore completely or depend on it MASSIVELY. So yeah. It's great that we'll get it more standardized.
its insane that i remember hearing YEARS AGO that wayland is the future and X11 is very much dead already, yet here we are STILL having fundamental issues like this, and also lot of DEs still do not have wayland support yet. to be honest im pretty much fed up with the fragmentation of the linux ecosystem...
I started on AmigaOS in the late 80's and was used to multiple screens (above and below, not side by side) so when it came time to jump ship in the early 90's, the early versions of X11 window managers ALL had a giant desktop area that could be scrolled around or partitioned up into virtual desktops. The idea that win3.11 and mac had no such concept, at all, blew my mind, so that sealed the deal for me. Been using Linux ever since.
OS/2 had a thing where the desktop could be arbitrarily large and you could just scroll it, but it would also auto-adjust to the bounding box of all windows and the monitor aperture.
I'm glad this wasn't part of the core. Small core APIs allow for better modularity, API improvements, higher quality and faster development. It also allows for incremental development for future unwritten implementors.
There is a third way for workspaces and it’s the right way because I say so. Its they way xmonad does it: there is a set of workspaces and they are not bound to a monitor. Each monitor displays one of those workspaces. If the user requests that a workspace that is already shown on a monitor to be shown on a different one, the two workspaces of those monitors get swapped for each other. This is the best approach because it decouples monitors and workspaces completely.
4:25 he means supporting workspaces and tags. X11 doesn't support tags, only workspaces (virtual desktop) as a standard that window manager agnostic bars can use. But it's a minor thing, tags and workspaces are mostly used in the same way.
4:40 he means that you never could have a panel that works with all the window managers because they report their stuff all in a different way. Sure there were things like polybar and whatnot, but that was all because they had modules to adapt to each window manager.
I mean, this is better than GNOME's previous behavior, where they would just NACK anything they didn't want to use. If they don't want to use it, then just not involving themselves is the best course of action for everyone else involved.
Would be great if global hotkeys worked too. To use hotkeys in obs I have to switch to x11 and lose the individual scaling for individual monitors that x11 has. I have a 4k primary with a 1080p second monitor and its either tiny text on the 4k or wumbo on the 1080p then again going back to Wayland can't use recording software hotkeys. There is a work around but I could not get it working for the life of me.
The standard it GNOME is that only the primary monitor changes when changeing workspace... Secondary monitor can't be change workspace by default. But both seperate and joined workspace are suported.
Gnome does not handle workspaces like KDE! You have a fixed workspace on one screen, and can switch workspaces on your main screen independently. That works really well for your use case, like having notes, OBS or status information stuck on one screen while doing stuff that includes switching workspaces on the other one. When I switched from KDE to Gnome, I saw that as a big improvement. It's just not possible to switch workspaces on secondary screens. So you'll only have workspaces on your main screen, and the rest is stuck on one workspace. But this always sufficed for my use cases.
One thing trying out the Cosmic alpha has really thought me is how much I hate that their implementation requires them to be contiguous. I like to have stuff open on very specific numbers, like a browser on 3 and music player on 0. The way Cosmic does it doesn't allow gaps of empty workpaces and will move windows around to different workspaces in order to enforce that.
They are currently missing a lot of options as an Alpha. You can always ask if they'd be willing to implement it or if it's in thenroad map on the github repository or the discord.
I hope they implement workspace grid support at some point (even though I haven't tried Cosmic yet because it's too alpha and my GPU is too ancient to run Wayland).
I agree per screen Workspace is the best way by far. If you want it the other way just make the screen switch two workspaces simultaneously, and allow windows to overlap in a logical manner.
As a new Linux user running Debian 12 with Gnome since a few weeks back, I expected and really wanted my secondary monitor to be able to switch workspaces independently of the primary monitor. Was disappointed when I had to choose between only the primary monitor changing or both monitors changing at the same time. Would be nice to see that getting fixed in the future.
Hey ! I don't think this will change anytime soon. If this feature is a deal breaker for you, you can try switching to KDE (which is the other major linux desktop) !
from the discussions I've followed on waylang (i.e. your videos) I'd say that GNOME simply not paying attention to this protocol was the best outcome for it lol
I'd like to switch fully to Wayland but the more videos I see about Wayland the more I'm convinced that it should still be considered in early alpha, there are way too many things that seem either half-implemented or not even started implementations on. I will stick with X11 for as long as I can because Wayland still lacks some basic functionality, such as remembering on which desktop a window was when I restart.
One major part of the "Per Monitor" Workspaces I think you failed to highlight is how you can transfer a workspace from one monitor to another because they are not per any monitor.
Actually I do not understand why there needs to be a workspace protocol in the first place. I mean kwin and mutter and probably any other wayland compositor (minus gamescope?) has workspaces. Without the protocol. My question is more like, what issue does a workspace-protocol actually solve? I mean ppl are not gonna develop their own workspace manager to replace the one from the desktop environment aren't they?
this protocol matters a lot, LXQT and labwc team rejoiced and celebrated. really dont care about the rest but others should celebrate as well as implement it too....
Waylands HDR colors in Plasma 6 are finally looking correct to me. Somehow SDR colors now look muted. I'm finally switching to wayland. Only remaining issue I have is that I'm getting some game crashes with gamescope+HDR but I think it's an Nvidia issue.
8:00 ah yes, isnt it fun that companies never make mistakes and weird things like randomly using the wrong language in translation strings never happens in projects with financial backing XD
Why is it that everyone says "Wayland is ready, XOrg is dead", and then just as I start to listen and look into moving, something like "Wayland protocol to support non-black and white displays merged" comes out? How much else is still missing? Maybe next year 😝
Wayland is ready, but compositor maintainers have to work around the terrible upstream management like with workspaces. XOrg is also kept together by hacky workarounds that have now become standard, so I don't think it's fair to point to this as a reason for Wayland not being ready.
Usuability wise, it is ready, but feature parity wise with X11, it's not, but not all features in X11 will also be implemented on wayland so the feature parity wise will not be fulfilled but rather it will be close enough....
Most of the major compositors have had workspaces the whole time, lack of a protocol just means there was no standardized way for other software in the ecosystem to communicate information about the workspaces present, so a status bar that wanted to represent workspaces would have to either have different implementations for different compositors, or be explicitly intended for only one specific compositor.
I won't use Wayland until I can move my Audacious in XMMS mode window with a normal left mouse button drag and Audacious doesn't spawn outside of the visible area of either of my monitors on Wayland. Seriously, it's been years and years. Why hasn't this been fixed? I don't feel it's too much to ask that we can use Audacious in XMMS mode with full functionality.
you didn't fully mention it, but there are actually 3 (kinda 4) different ways to do workspaces 1. all workspaces on all monitors are connected (windows, kde) 2. there is a global list of workspaces, but they are mapped to a monitor. so if you change to workspace 2 on your first monitor, but workspace 2 actually belongs to your second monitor, then it will focus the second monitor and switch to workspace 2 there. this is how sway and hyprland do it. 3. there is a list for every single monitor, so you can switch your outputs independently, but you have a workspace 2 for every single monitor. this is how niri does it. (4.) this is basically like 2, but you always pull the workspace you are requesting to your currently focussed monitor. i think this is how qtile and xmonad do it?
@cameronbosch1213 thats compositor I'm talking about tool for scripting where you do 1script which operates with window classes and positions and people on any wayland environment will be able to run it.
Why not to make options instead of the hardcore? Linux is far too long in development to be that broken. Yet I have found Cachy OS to be working surprisingly fine!
When will merge request 216 Action binder bee accepted man.... Also idk what you expect from wayland, they stone wall so many protocols for no reason, things that should be well. Basic functionality are stone walled all the time. But don't worry guys, THIS is the future of the linux desktop!!!!
From my reading of most issues and MRs for wayland-protocols it's not that anybody stonewalls (aka NACKs) proposed protocols very often. Most delays are due first discussing the protocol, then some compositors and toolkits must implement it. During that implementation the protocol develops further until it can be merged. Also, progress can only occur when people have time to work on it, which given the nature of open source is not something people always have. Hopefully the experimental protocol stuff they introduced will help speed things up!
I mean wayland IS the future of the linux desktop and no amount of whining from x11 users is going to change that. Also i dont think most people realize x11 has been in development since the 80's and wayland only started development in 2008. Its not really fair for anyone to compare 40 years of dev time vs 16 years.
@@theWeirdo__ Quite the opposite, I use wayland daily. Doesn't mean I'm not going to complain about complete lack of functionality, especially when their is literally a protocol proposal that fixes it.
Wow. You're getting big. (I say having just seen Richard Vobes from a decade ago, rotund, compared to his current svelte shape.) Ever considered going on a ketogenic diet? Or at least just prioritising nutrient complete protein first, fat second, and only having carbs once had enough protein and fat? Life feels lighter when not carrying around an extra 30kg or so.
Not a fan of this one, the realm of possible workspace implementations and corresponding rules is pretty much unbounded. We shouldn't limit it with an arbitrary standard just for the sake of patchwork desktops which were and always will be clunky by the nature of the very concept.
Man maybe they could tackle actually important yet eternally stalled things. enter ext-zones !264, action binder !56/!216, xdg-pip !132 etcetera, it's honestly frustrating
The contrast between KDE and Gnome lmao. KDE: "This protocol is not really for us, but you've done well, so ACK"
Gnome: Any protocol that doesn't fit us gets NACK'ed
So Gnome is better then lol
@@cyberturkey77If it's for window or desktop behaviour one NACK means it won't be merged. Then everyone has to accommodate them even if they don't want to implement it. One of the biggest Gnome troublemaker didn't even have NACK powers, but acted like it. Luckily, that became a temporarily bannable offense and they are only allowed to be used for technical reasons now.
@@cyberturkey77 no, because NACK means there's a reason protocol SHOULD NOT BE merged. Even if there already are people that want it.
@@qlx-iIsn't that one of the reasons Wayland server side window decorations were regulated to extensions that every non GNOME compositor implements!?
@@qlx-i if Gnome doesn't want it there must be good reason to not want it thats why I like Gnome. Doesn't listen to the community that thinks they know everything. KDE runs like shit.
Brodie Waylandson posted again! Yay!
Brodie Cosmicson
@@0xDEADBEEF Brodie76?
@@softwarelivre2389 Brodie "Soldier76" Cosmicson
It's nice to see an episode in the "Wayland soap opera" where people don't just argue and create needless filler drama out of selfish petty reasons.
Gnome wasn't there, so civility was guaranteed.
That is until Vaxry came in the comments, lol
Count yourself lucky -- it was a Christmas special ....
"Gnome is absolutely nowhere to be seen in this discussion."
oh, so that's why it all looks so mature compared to the usual Wayland shenanigans.
All video: "I notice Gnome isn't even considering support…"
Brodie: "Don't hold your breath."
Me: Of course not, it's a standard, why would Gnome touch it?"
0:37 Is ThePrimeagen
we appreciate someone even more cooked to spot these
The timestampagen
I know the channel yet I still don't get it. Anybody care to explain?
@@Max24871 He ends his streams/videos with "The name...... is theprimagen"
Wayland protocols feel like treaties between sovereign nations. About the same level of negotiations involved.
Lmao true
Slight correction: Under the multitasking settings in Gnome, there is a toggle for either "Workspaces on primary display only" and "Workspaces on all displays". Gnome dose have the ability to turn off having workspaces on all display and instead only the primary display will change when changing workspaces, you're not forced to have workspaces on all displays.
Right but then the other monitors have no workspaces, right?
I didn't realize you could toggle that on GNOME
@@aqua-bery yeah, with this only the primary monitor has workspaces, the others don't
Never thought I'd be seeing what amounts to a "do we support xinerama and virtual desktops" discussion 30 years after these and other similar systems started being used heavily. For people who want to contest this, there were both graphical and text mode implementations even under DOS. It's completely reasonable for smaller projects like Xfce (let alone the dozens of smaller ones) to want these basic functions available rather than hacking together some cludge.
Workspaces predate linux and were a UNIX thing back in the 1970's... It is part of what made UNIX a "multitasking" OS compared to other competitors at the time.
Why is this still so hard for linux 50 years later ?
The earliest reference I can find is a hardware based solution on the Amiga 1000, which supported multiple in memory displays, as for a software based approach that takes me to 1990 with a UNIX solution called vtwm
i really like your wayland videos, please make more about the protocols , etc.
Personally, I find that workspaces are one of those features you tend to either ignore completely or depend on it MASSIVELY. So yeah. It's great that we'll get it more standardized.
its insane that i remember hearing YEARS AGO that wayland is the future and X11 is very much dead already, yet here we are STILL having fundamental issues like this, and also lot of DEs still do not have wayland support yet.
to be honest im pretty much fed up with the fragmentation of the linux ecosystem...
Man videos on Wayland really make me happy, added to my playlist 👍🏻
I started on AmigaOS in the late 80's and was used to multiple screens (above and below, not side by side) so when it came time to jump ship in the early 90's, the early versions of X11 window managers ALL had a giant desktop area that could be scrolled around or partitioned up into virtual desktops. The idea that win3.11 and mac had no such concept, at all, blew my mind, so that sealed the deal for me. Been using Linux ever since.
OS/2 had a thing where the desktop could be arbitrarily large and you could just scroll it, but it would also auto-adjust to the bounding box of all windows and the monitor aperture.
this is so epic that even Wayland May Cry
If KDE implements it and adds support for per-monitor workspace, I will jump back in a heartbeat.
I'm glad this wasn't part of the core. Small core APIs allow for better modularity, API improvements, higher quality and faster development. It also allows for incremental development for future unwritten implementors.
There is a third way for workspaces and it’s the right way because I say so.
Its they way xmonad does it: there is a set of workspaces and they are not bound to a monitor. Each monitor displays one of those workspaces. If the user requests that a workspace that is already shown on a monitor to be shown on a different one, the two workspaces of those monitors get swapped for each other.
This is the best approach because it decouples monitors and workspaces completely.
Workspaces are nice but ext-zones (previously ext-placement) would be nicer.
cage mentioned, lets go!
4:25 he means supporting workspaces and tags. X11 doesn't support tags, only workspaces (virtual desktop) as a standard that window manager agnostic bars can use. But it's a minor thing, tags and workspaces are mostly used in the same way.
ah yeah tags i miss that sometimes
4:40 he means that you never could have a panel that works with all the window managers because they report their stuff all
in a different way.
Sure there were things like polybar and whatnot, but that was all because they had modules to adapt to each window manager.
I mean, this is better than GNOME's previous behavior, where they would just NACK anything they didn't want to use. If they don't want to use it, then just not involving themselves is the best course of action for everyone else involved.
Would be great if global hotkeys worked too. To use hotkeys in obs I have to switch to x11 and lose the individual scaling for individual monitors that x11 has. I have a 4k primary with a 1080p second monitor and its either tiny text on the 4k or wumbo on the 1080p then again going back to Wayland can't use recording software hotkeys. There is a work around but I could not get it working for the life of me.
Amazing that we have now basically something like Vulkan where the core can't actually do anything useful besides compute.
The standard it GNOME is that only the primary monitor changes when changeing workspace...
Secondary monitor can't be change workspace by default. But both seperate and joined workspace are suported.
Gnome does not handle workspaces like KDE!
You have a fixed workspace on one screen, and can switch workspaces on your main screen independently.
That works really well for your use case, like having notes, OBS or status information stuck on one screen while doing stuff that includes switching workspaces on the other one. When I switched from KDE to Gnome, I saw that as a big improvement.
It's just not possible to switch workspaces on secondary screens. So you'll only have workspaces on your main screen, and the rest is stuck on one workspace. But this always sufficed for my use cases.
One thing trying out the Cosmic alpha has really thought me is how much I hate that their implementation requires them to be contiguous. I like to have stuff open on very specific numbers, like a browser on 3 and music player on 0. The way Cosmic does it doesn't allow gaps of empty workpaces and will move windows around to different workspaces in order to enforce that.
They are currently missing a lot of options as an Alpha. You can always ask if they'd be willing to implement it or if it's in thenroad map on the github repository or the discord.
I hope they implement workspace grid support at some point (even though I haven't tried Cosmic yet because it's too alpha and my GPU is too ancient to run Wayland).
So what else does Wayland need to be able to do to fully replace X11 ?
I agree per screen Workspace is the best way by far. If you want it the other way just make the screen switch two workspaces simultaneously, and allow windows to overlap in a logical manner.
As a new Linux user running Debian 12 with Gnome since a few weeks back, I expected and really wanted my secondary monitor to be able to switch workspaces independently of the primary monitor. Was disappointed when I had to choose between only the primary monitor changing or both monitors changing at the same time.
Would be nice to see that getting fixed in the future.
It is possible on some wms, maybe even on gnome with extensions
Hey ! I don't think this will change anytime soon. If this feature is a deal breaker for you, you can try switching to KDE (which is the other major linux desktop) !
We are so back with Wayland development 🎉🎉🎉
1:35 is something I think about a lot of protocols.
from the discussions I've followed on waylang (i.e. your videos) I'd say that GNOME simply not paying attention to this protocol was the best outcome for it lol
We need an episode about Kdenlive, please
It's funny how you'd think that XFCE is 30 years late to the party but in reality they're still too early because wayland is still in beta
I'd like to switch fully to Wayland but the more videos I see about Wayland the more I'm convinced that it should still be considered in early alpha, there are way too many things that seem either half-implemented or not even started implementations on. I will stick with X11 for as long as I can because Wayland still lacks some basic functionality, such as remembering on which desktop a window was when I restart.
I wonder if this is why gkrellm doesn't span workspaces in plasma?
One major part of the "Per Monitor" Workspaces I think you failed to highlight is how you can transfer a workspace from one monitor to another because they are not per any monitor.
Actually I do not understand why there needs to be a workspace protocol in the first place. I mean kwin and mutter and probably any other wayland compositor (minus gamescope?) has workspaces. Without the protocol. My question is more like, what issue does a workspace-protocol actually solve? I mean ppl are not gonna develop their own workspace manager to replace the one from the desktop environment aren't they?
i think a video about debian testing or unstable would be nice
Will wlroots also have these? user escalation seems to be borked
this protocol matters a lot, LXQT and labwc team rejoiced and celebrated. really dont care about the rest but others should celebrate as well as implement it too....
Waylands HDR colors in Plasma 6 are finally looking correct to me. Somehow SDR colors now look muted. I'm finally switching to wayland.
Only remaining issue I have is that I'm getting some game crashes with gamescope+HDR but I think it's an Nvidia issue.
8:00 ah yes, isnt it fun that companies never make mistakes and weird things like randomly using the wrong language in translation strings never happens in projects with financial backing XD
Still want Wayland Screen Savers. :/
Xfce will support them eventually.
Whoa virtual desktops per monitor? Gnome and cosmic have it?
Might be a good time to start testing them out. Remains to be seen if it's goodbye KDE.
Was it recently merged or months ago?
A bit over a week ago
Thanks for reply❤
well, i guess wayland stuff might actually become usable the next decade, good news
Yesssss. Maybe no need for the whole environment variables so games don't stop rendering on inactive workspaces!
Gnome is nowhere to be seen. Shocker.
*Surprised GNOME face.*
They probably don't want to get banned, so staying away from protocol discussions that don't directly affect them.
That's a good outcome isn't it; with the alternative being malicious nacking.
@@SianaGearz literally true
forever waiting on pointer warp protocol
not coming
what's workspace?
What i am more interested in is for KDE to implement this so that we can get separate virtual desktops per monitor... sigh!
Why is it that everyone says "Wayland is ready, XOrg is dead", and then just as I start to listen and look into moving, something like "Wayland protocol to support non-black and white displays merged" comes out? How much else is still missing? Maybe next year 😝
Wayland is ready, but compositor maintainers have to work around the terrible upstream management like with workspaces. XOrg is also kept together by hacky workarounds that have now become standard, so I don't think it's fair to point to this as a reason for Wayland not being ready.
Usuability wise, it is ready, but feature parity wise with X11, it's not, but not all features in X11 will also be implemented on wayland so the feature parity wise will not be fulfilled but rather it will be close enough....
Most of the major compositors have had workspaces the whole time, lack of a protocol just means there was no standardized way for other software in the ecosystem to communicate information about the workspaces present, so a status bar that wanted to represent workspaces would have to either have different implementations for different compositors, or be explicitly intended for only one specific compositor.
People in linux will use broken things and pretend that its okay. wayland is far from being ready
@@saygo-png How is that any different than using proprietary software?
I won't use Wayland until I can move my Audacious in XMMS mode window with a normal left mouse button drag and Audacious doesn't spawn outside of the visible area of either of my monitors on Wayland. Seriously, it's been years and years. Why hasn't this been fixed? I don't feel it's too much to ask that we can use Audacious in XMMS mode with full functionality.
you didn't fully mention it, but there are actually 3 (kinda 4) different ways to do workspaces
1. all workspaces on all monitors are connected (windows, kde)
2. there is a global list of workspaces, but they are mapped to a monitor. so if you change to workspace 2 on your first monitor, but workspace 2 actually belongs to your second monitor, then it will focus the second monitor and switch to workspace 2 there. this is how sway and hyprland do it.
3. there is a list for every single monitor, so you can switch your outputs independently, but you have a workspace 2 for every single monitor. this is how niri does it.
(4.) this is basically like 2, but you always pull the workspace you are requesting to your currently focussed monitor. i think this is how qtile and xmonad do it?
now make 1 tool that implements all protocols like xdotool
Wlroots based Wayfire or labwc?
@cameronbosch1213 thats compositor I'm talking about tool for scripting where you do 1script which operates with window classes and positions and people on any wayland environment will be able to run it.
"proper" is a long stretch, this is a bare minimum protocol that kinda sucks IMO.
But it's ✨official✨
It is a proper and official protocol, if it sucks/is functional or not is another issue completely.
hey look it's the guy that got banned from contributing to freedesktop projects
Better a compromise that exists than an ideal that does not.
@@deadwillowtree the only person losing on that is you, the user, you know.
Because they can't start every standard protocol at the same time is my guess.
8:06 😆
Why not to make options instead of the hardcore? Linux is far too long in development to be that broken. Yet I have found Cachy OS to be working surprisingly fine!
Very hard to work on a Protocol, need like eight eyes, all agree with..
wayland needs the ability to make an auto clicker
When will merge request 216 Action binder bee accepted man....
Also idk what you expect from wayland, they stone wall so many protocols for no reason, things that should be well. Basic functionality are stone walled all the time.
But don't worry guys, THIS is the future of the linux desktop!!!!
From my reading of most issues and MRs for wayland-protocols it's not that anybody stonewalls (aka NACKs) proposed protocols very often. Most delays are due first discussing the protocol, then some compositors and toolkits must implement it. During that implementation the protocol develops further until it can be merged. Also, progress can only occur when people have time to work on it, which given the nature of open source is not something people always have. Hopefully the experimental protocol stuff they introduced will help speed things up!
It's not the future. It's already here.
I mean wayland IS the future of the linux desktop and no amount of whining from x11 users is going to change that. Also i dont think most people realize x11 has been in development since the 80's and wayland only started development in 2008. Its not really fair for anyone to compare 40 years of dev time vs 16 years.
at least wayland is actually being developed on, I dont think I've seen a proper Xorg update in a while.
@@theWeirdo__ Quite the opposite, I use wayland daily. Doesn't mean I'm not going to complain about complete lack of functionality, especially when their is literally a protocol proposal that fixes it.
Brodie time to learn a foreign language :)
Not supporting obvious and crucial functionality is basically the entire story of Wayland.
you should get more exercise. once you start to put it on it gets harder and harder to get it off again
Am I the only one that never uses workspaces
Wow. You're getting big. (I say having just seen Richard Vobes from a decade ago, rotund, compared to his current svelte shape.)
Ever considered going on a ketogenic diet?
Or at least just prioritising nutrient complete protein first, fat second, and only having carbs once had enough protein and fat?
Life feels lighter when not carrying around an extra 30kg or so.
X11 diehards are running NoWayland.
Not a fan of this one, the realm of possible workspace implementations and corresponding rules is pretty much unbounded. We shouldn't limit it with an arbitrary standard just for the sake of patchwork desktops which were and always will be clunky by the nature of the very concept.
Michael McIntyre's "silent letter day" is over, Brodie. You can go back to not pronouncing the silent G in GNOME..
X11 is so much simpler.
One day, one day I will use Wayland for sure.
It has a cooler logo.
Am I just dumb? Kde didn't need this, so why does this need to be a protocol?
Wlroots, mir and COSMIC exist, and KDE is on board with looking into supporting it
You clearly have a Wayland agenda. The fact that you push it so hard diminishes the credibility of your channel.
Man maybe they could tackle actually important yet eternally stalled things. enter ext-zones !264, action binder !56/!216, xdg-pip !132 etcetera, it's honestly frustrating