The back pocket is for crampons and/or a shovel. Hence, a stiff/strong material that doesn't have mesh. And, the "water bottle" pockets are not water bottle pockets, but pockets for wands, poles and pickets. This pack is for mountaineering/climbing, etc. , not backpacking.
Anyone whose pad is less warm than they want; if you do want to use it again in cold temperatures because you invested heavily + can't _afford_ another, a quick-fix boost to its insulating properties is to stitch/glue 2 mylar blankets into a simple slipcover for it (which is what I've done to make my cheap Zoobelives pad warmer in Aussie Winter). If you're willing to redo it occasionally, then you can use the cheap, pocket versions of emergency blankets so that it packs down tiny & weighs almost nothing. Hope this helps someone!
@@daigonili earplugs. I honestly don't know why every hiker who complains about the noise of their/companions' pad/s doesn't just invest in a pair of 50c earplugs. I never go camping without mine; earplugs + a blackout mask weigh basically nothing & are invaluable to a decent night's sleep in the bush.
@@mysterylovescompany2657 a woman was just killed out west by a bear that came back to her tent looking for food after getting driven from camp earlier. There are animals out here that can kill you while you sleep.
I really like videos like this where you test & review gear while you are actually on a trial versus in your studio, plus the footage and editing were super duper! Thanks for giving honest reviews and keep up the great work!
So with my Sea to Summit pad (a different model but same valve system), you have to use the valve correctly to properly deflate it. You flip the valve so it allows air OUT but not IN, then roll OUT the air. At 10:14 you can see that you've got the valve just hanging open, which isn't how their valve system works. When you flip the valve, you can deflate it to a much smaller size. I can't comment on it's warmth, but I love my Sea to Summit pad.
I know one was mentioned when you read out the comments but I have a couple of Exped mats for the winter, they are down filled and one I have is rated to minus 38 celcius which is about the same in farenheight (excuse the spelling but we went metric in the UK ages ago) and it has a built in pump as well, I used it in slightly lower temperatures than it is rated for in Finland and it was great. It's a lot smaller than that thing you were using when it packs down and it is fairly light for a winter pad, oh and its lovely and quiet. Your channel has always been very good and watchable but I think that your man has definately helped to improve things!
There's a big difference between backpacking,hiking and alpinism.That a top of the line,summit series backpack,made for alpine environment.The pockets are not for water bottles,obviously not in winter,but for trekking poles,snow anchors,avalanche probes,etc. In alpinism you don't really want to hang things on the outside of your backpack..
+1 on the Ventus hoodie. I've been using mine for a couple months now. It's a pretty amazing mid-layer for cooler temps. Probably the first synthetic I genuinely like as much my high end down.
Solid video as always Dan. I recently did a backpacking trip and used the Big Agnes Q Core SLX based on your recommendation-such good sleep! I combined that with one of them egg crate pads and I was toasty in the low ‘30s. That’s a bummer this pad you reviewed isn’t great, considering the size and weight. Love the content! Gets me to vicariously live through you & gets me excited to plan more backpacking trips.
Just a tip on ferro rod use... hold the striker near your fuel and pull the rod toward you and away from the striker. That way, the sparks will all be directed right at your fuel. The opposite way, the sparks just go flying everywhere and you hope some hit the fuel. This is a very common mistake and easily remedied. Hope you and your family (and friends) had a great Thanksgiving!
I just got myself a hot tenting setup and am excited to push myself into colder months. I have to go back into your catalog to look for cold weather quilts.
Firstly, Gordon is the man! Happy to see someone is thinking for you 😉 Secondly, that pad is big enough it should never be cold. I stack a couple of thinner pads and a a review blanket layer to start warm, but I'm just sleeping on snow, nothing as cold as you experience.
Those are not water bottle pockets on the side of the pack but wand pockets. Wands are used in glacier travel for marking your route. A wand basically a stick with a piece of reflective tape. A group might carry a couple hundred wands to mark a route on a glacier.. The front pocket thing I suspect is a crampon pocket but I didn’t get a good look at it.
The etherlight xt extreme packs to about quarter of the size you showed. You just need to deflate it completely. The flextailgear pump doesn't have enough power to fill it all the way, you need to use the bag or give it a couple of blows. I've used it with no problem in sub-freezing temperatures, not expecting any problems as the winter goes on.
I have the same pad, and so far I haven't gotten cold, and that was in the teens in Colorado. It's bigger than expected, but worked well for what I was using it for
Oh thank god. Was about to buy freaking Xtherm. Probably just the bias which I respect. We all love our products. But for those of sticking with our StS EtherXtreme; should I get a CCell pad for car camping as well?
At least mine packs down to about 1/4 the size in the video. Maybe there are different versions, years, etc. Since I live in Florida staying warm in freezing weather is not at the top of the priority list. If I go camping in subfreezing weather I need a new equipment plan in general.
Winter backpacking is my favorite. The Nemo Tensor is my favorite 3 season pad, but if it gets near freezing or lower, I always take the Xtherm. Never been cold with that pad.
Great video work Gordon. I think my kids and I were in the same area last month when it was super cold. We did a short IAT segment while "car camping" so plenty of blankets for the kids, under and over their sleeping bags. I use an old wool army blanket wrapped around me and under the air pad, even with my Klymit static V I was warm with Temps in the low 30's over night.
My decision was between this and the Exped Downmat UL Winter LW. I went with the Exped and I love it! Taken it down to around 15F and it's very warm. Packs down quite a lot smaller than the etherlite by the looks of it too. Even happier with my choice now.
for winter I use the Big Agnes Diamond Park with one of the BA extra long/tall insulated core sleeping pads and I was toasty warm all night in the snow (30 degrees). the bag and pad are quite big (so comparable to the one you used in the video) but so worth it
Great videos- thank you Gordon!! Dan you have a great personality and so enjoyable to watch. I’m a new subscriber and am making my way through all of your trips. Thank you
Love the combo video Dan, thanks. I nearly bought this pad recently but went for the new Xtherm NXT Max instead, purely based on pack size and weight. The Thermarest has been lovely and warm and comfortable too. The summer Sea To Summit (3.2) I found cold at even 10 Celsius. Personally, I suspect the issue occurs when deflating slightly, yet this hasn't affected the Thermarest.
Have you tried wrapping your pad in one of the army surplus wool blankets before you put your bag on it? Their dimensions are spot on for pads. Helps muffle noise a bit, helps keep the bag from sliding around, and stops those drafts from seeping in between you and the pad. Might be worth checking out and using with some pads that sucked for you. A simple wool blanket like that can be worth their weight in gold.
Even though I haven't used it for extreme temperatures I love the Exped Synmat 9 LW. Coldest temperature I used it in was in the Ardennes, first week of january with a couple degrees below freezing. Paired it with a Forclaz down sleeping bag that was comfort-rated for 0-degrees and I didn't really feel cold. Little chilly maybe but still comfortable. It does help that I thrive in the cold though, even at 5 degrees Celsius I'll probably wear my shorts and just a vest or something. I don't even own any proper winter-jacket 😂
I have a Rab Microlight Alpine jacket. I've had it for 3 years and used it in everything the UK can throw at me. It's absolutely ace and well worth the money. I believe it's Nikawax down too which is great for the inevitable rain the UK produces every time I leave the house, lol.
I ended up returning my S2S Etherlight. I used it in 20-30 degree weather a couple weeks ago (paired with a 35 degree NEMO bag and a S2S compact liner) and it worked fine for me. I filled it up max on night one and it was too hard, and I deflated it a little bit the next night and it was much more comfortable. No chill either night. I returned it because the size of it in my pack was just too much.
I haven't done more than 20 nights of cold weather camping but it's all been on an StS uninsulated dual layer pad. I use a reflective windshield thing when OS and a thin foam thing with a reflective layer at home. That is for safety/backup in remote areas, solo. With a minus 10 deg c bag I am warm as!
Just ordered the pad, hoping I find it more comfortable!! Bought for winter camping in Wisconsin, was still planning to put a foam pad under it for warmth though.
Interesting. I just bought one and I had one night on it. I ended up with my hip on the ground but I suspect it was because I left the 2nd valve cap off after adjusting it. Compared to my Neoair (original-ish, over a decade old), this pad is SO QUIET. So nice and wide. I was not sleeping cold mind you, so I can't tell you what's going to happen there. About to take it alpine but don't expect it much under 35 as it's summer here. Decided I wanted the comfort and I'll take the size/weight hit for it.
Love the work you're doing Gord! Now you just need to find a new host 😉 I had a similar experience with a new sleeping pad this weekend. I was testing a Gear Doctors Apollo Air mattress that is supposed to be R value 5.2. The camp site has a wood tent pad, and it was WINDY and cold. I had a torso length CCF under the sleeping pad, but I was freezing. Temp went down to 3C/37F and I was miserable. My sleeping bag was warm, but all the cold wind coming up under the wood pad and right into my tent was not a fun night. I honestly don't know if the sleeping pad is any good because I haven't been able to test it on solid ground. I definitely won't be using it on any raised decks any time soon. 😝
Hey Dan, Keep up the great work. We just returned from a trip using the Etherlight XT Extreme Rectangular in a cold front of 18F (with 30mph gusts). We did run the pads at full inflation using the bag to inflate to reduce moisture from our breath to inflate them. No-one was cold on this trip. The sleeping bags we used in tandem were 10F and 20F enlightened equipment converts. I am guessing if we were to use the Xtherm pad based on your experience with both; we would expect to be able to go even colder. Thanks for all you do brother.
I bought a overmount sleeping pad from Amazon. It's a 5 R value. Sleep really well in the cold. It's price point is very good too. Especially if you're on a budget
Your sleeping pad review, makes me appreciate the 'thick' orange closed cell pad I had. Even well below freezing here in the east. I mean, this is super low tech way back in the day.
Like somebody else said, those side pockets were probably made to park the rear of the skis in to stop them from sliding down. Also, the big centered pockets is for crampons, trust med crampons Will kill mesh instantly. They could have made the side pockets multipurpose since skis bill also fit in deeper pockets
This is a Summit series backpack from TNF. It’s a mountaineering backpack. The very small ”pockets” on the sides are probably used for carrying wands. Wands are used to mark a trail in case of bad visibility, so you can find your way home, and not freeze to death on the mountain. Water bottles are carried inside the pack so that you by accident don’t loose a bottle and it comes tumbling down the mountain face and hits someone below. If you want to carry a water bottle outside your pack, a lot of people carry a bottle in an insulated sleeve and secures it to their climbing harness with a carabiner 🏔🌨🇳🇴
First Gordon is doing a great job. Second for winter I love the Granite Gear Blaze. 60 Liters plus the extension collar , lid and pockets, all the compression straps to lash gear and a 50lbs load rating? Nothing but love.
Currently researching for a winter sleeping pad for dog sledding. Based on the bulky size, when rolled, this thing better be outstanding and warm. Off my list for sure.
Being from Wisconsin as well I find myself wanting to leave the state to go find beauty forgetting how beautiful it can be in my own backyard. Looks like you were on the ice age trail somewhere, but I've never come across those shelters in my travels.
Love it that a company puts together a team to come up with a product that they feel will be what the consumer they are targeting wants. They build prototypes and test them and make modifications until they have it just like it should be. Then somebody with a TH-cam Chanel comes along and purchases their product and proceeds to evaluate it against their misunderstanding of what it actually is or how it functions. The company then gets to view their product being evaluated against the wrong set of criteria. Ain't America great.
Gordon is doing a great job and you must know it because you didn't try to pass off the pad with "Hey you should try out this pad tonight! ;-)" The size of that pad itself would be a NoGo, even if it weighed 2oz. Thank You again for recomending the Ventus hoodie, just ordered two more for Xmas presents. Not only is it warm but very comfortable because it is so thin.
I’ve used the S2S comfort plus with a lower R value to around -7c/20f without feeling cold. But I do like it firm. It’s the best mat I’ve used, the thermorests are almost double the price where I live.
Great review! … That pad does look super comfortable but I went for the Exped Synmat winter UL LW , the insulation is webbed to the top and bottom to ensure insulation is provided regardless of whether fully inflated, it sometimes feels like it’s plugged in 😁 the heat below is fantastic!.. I wonder if somehow the insulation wasn’t properly employed when you were feeling the cold from below ? 🤔
Hey Dan, thanks for your honest review of the sea to summit extreme pad. I also concur with your comments that this pad has been SOOOOHHH highly rated and reviewed by many back-country trekkers across the globe. I was torn between the sea to summit and the Xtherm. You have convinced me that for warmth, comfort, size and noise factors, I will be purchasing the Thermarest Xtherm. Keep up the good work bro'.
This isn’t an honest review, he’s improperly using the pad. He’s under inflating it and also isn’t folding it properly. Source: I own it. Also I own an XTherm and both are excellent choices
I just have bought one and had two nights on it and felt the cold both times , 1st night 7c 2nd night 0c , luckily my quilt is overkill so didn’t freeze lol so back to my thermarest extherm which I know is warm . I was sold on the hype , eBay here we come .
I've had LOTS of problems with the STS Ether Light XT. If it's not firm, it's cold. If it's firm, it's painful. If I make it firm repeatedly, it starts getting TONS of leaks right on the round parts at the corners of the air cells. I had one do this repeatedly, gave it a second try, and now the second is doing the same. Going to return it soon. One out of five! Too bad... it's nice in a lot of ways... but even in winter here (Taiwan - that's to say Michigan fall), I don't even consider it. I go straight to my Thermarest!
I just use a lightweight cot. It insures it won't deflate, my hot tent stove, rocks on the ground and pets I bring won't pop it. And before I go to sleep I stuff the warm clothing I'm not wearing underneath to insolate from the ground. I've gone out -25C° and was fine.
I added a foam pad underneath it on my first solo in coincidentally that same shelter about two weeks later and it got to 18 degrees that night and I felt a slight chill a couple times through the night
Just ordered the STS Ether Light XT Insulated for use with a quilt - found very little information of how the deep baffles might impact the overall performance when using a quilt. Your comment gives me hope that my experiment goes well =)
I'm not familiar with The North Face Cobra 65 backpack but if it is a dedicated Winter backpack most likely the side pockets are not intended for water bottles. I have owned several dedicated winter backpacks and none of them have external pockets for water bottles simply because external water storage will freeze in true winter temps. Most likely are intended for Pickets, wands and possibly for bottom of ski tips for slashing to the pack A-frame style. Same goes for the back pocket. Not intended as a general storage catch all as on most 3-season packs. Crampons slashing plus protecting from crampons spikes or an avalanche shovel body. I'm a little surprised you would not know this. Most winter backpacks fall under the mountaineering category where are you are usually slashing large bulky equipment to your pack.
The side pockets on the backpack are for wands, not water bottles. It’s a sport specific pack designed for climbing and mountaineering, where water bottles are carried inside the pack. Also, the crampon pouch is designed to carry - you guessed it, crampons. Stretch in that pocket would hinder its usefulness for that purpose (not to mention being destroyed by crampon points).
I have this model and others from Sea to Summit. For once, I disagree with you. The pack size, when done properly using the supplied stuff sack, creates a diameter about half of that you have shown Dan. My go to mat is the Ether Light XT Insulated for cold weather camping/hiking, perhaps you would reconsider this brand and try again? I would recommend you do as, as I am side sleeper, it's the best I have used and does pack really small. Edit: I rewatched the video, and wish to correct my initial statement. It packs about 1/3 less than have shown.
Yeah, same. You can see there's still a lot of air in it. My strategy is to roll it tight with the valve open, close it, unroll and then just fold a couple of times.
YUP , I start rolling the pad tight by the foot, so the air comes all out , and its tiny, but i have to admit i have the womans version... my BF 's is much bigger
@@melissaverdoni845 okay, now there's no need to show off about your BF's size... ;) As with any air mattress, you have to remove all air to pack it away in the provided stuff sack. I fold mine in 3 lengthwise (being careful to not create a crease) then roll. If I take my time, there's even room left in the sack. However, I can imagine stuffing it away when in a rush can be difficult.
@@treubuchet LOLL true, when i finish my trip and wanna pack to go home i hate taking my time ,,, so thats an issue. even putting the quilt in the compression sack it a fun game that takes time ,,, i have the ember.
Dan, great job, missing Wisc here. I see some drone shots, but did not see the drone model listed or linked in the list above; thanks for braving the cold for us.
I was going to say the same thing! Dan - in winter or mountaineering, you have to keep bottles from freezing, even during the day. I usually carry an insulated bottle holder (OR bottle parka) attached to the bottom of my shoulder strap so it stays at my hip, but I can slide it up to get the bottle in and out easily. Sometimes you have to carry the bottle next to your body. Some people carry it inside their pack to keep it from freezing, but I like to drink too often for that (and not have my stuff slide down the mountain when I dig into my pack!)
Thanks for that as I thought I was wrong , but I slept on the same mat with a foil mat under it and paired with the bandit 10f quilt and I could feel the cold striking through . It wasn’t mega cold around 30f yes it’s comfortable but it’s so big . So it’s back to to my trusty the thermarest extherm from now on and yes it’s tiny in comparison 👍 atb Dave
Great job Gordon! Really love your filming and editing, and the drone shots!! I have the Klymit Luxe Static V Insulated long and wide. I used it the first time last week. It got down to 28F, 18F wind chill. I used my Hyke & Byke 0 Degrees bag. I wasn't cold, but I wasn't warm either. Comfortable pad, very quiet. ASTM rating is only 2.4 while the company gives it an R-value of 5. Gordon said in the video that he was warm. What sleeping system did he use?
Gordon's doing a great job! I'm surprised you were cold on the Etherlite My wife has the women's version (which has a higher r-value) down to 16F, and she sleeps cold, and she loves it, but we're all different.
I think you need to try using the pad correctly. It needs to be fully inflated to get the true value of its warmth. It's way less noisy than the Thermorest neoair, and you have to fully deflate it and learn to fold it correctly. It packs down way smaller than you showed.
I have the s2s ether light XT and have used it in spring summer and fall. From temperatures varying from +20 °c to -3 °c and the only time I was cold was when my sleeping bag got wet.
I worked at a sport store couple of years agoo, and that was first time i tried Rab gear, cus we sold it there :D. But it has become my favorite brand. I have a down jacket, fleece hoodie and gore tex jacket + pants from them. And it is really good. But what i like most is how they just fits so good. And the hoodies on both the down jacket and gore tex jacket is really nice and big + adjustable all over
Neutrino jacket from Rab, best there is. Hydrophobic down, what else to say. Had one for years for a reason ;) As for the backpack, got same Cobra 60 when it came out in black and yellow, funny enough matching my Grivel axe. Crampons carry is great. Side pockets are more designed for poles than bottles as you would generally have a camelback inside the backpack rather than risking for a bottle to come out while climbing (which this backpack is designed for anyways).
I tested this mattress in mid-October. What I immediately liked about this mattress is that it is thicker, more comfortable than the UltraLight Insulated I had. I sleep on my side and the other mattress hurt my hips. I don't find it that loud when compared to the NeoAir XTherm MAX. But it's true, it is not very small, once in its storage bag! During my stay, at night the temperature was around 7C / 44.6F, which is not very cold. I used a -18C / -0.4F quilt and I slept very well. I did not feel any freshness coming from the ground. I will be testing it again in early December and the predicted temperature is around -12C / 10.4F. I will instead use a -29C / -20.2F sleeping bag. Hope to have a good night ...
I've given mine 4 nights now and every night was cold below me. from -3C (26F) down to -23C (-9F) and I had a CCF pad underneath. My bags rated down to -30C (-25F) The only time I was warm was when I put my CCF mat on top of the EitherXT Extreme Pad. I've had it fully inflated, and tried deflating it slightly to see if that would help. I'm pretty confused with the whole thing and at this point, I think I'm returning mine. I'm curious if you've taken the Pad out again and how did it go?
You guys are so much harder than me. I am a hyperosmiac (ever heard of a Super Taster? it's like that, but for smell), & from my experience with pit toilets, I would always rather go feral + dig myself a cathole than have to choose between holding my breath or getting seriously sick while using one. I know, ppl say, "they don't smell that bad, because of the lime" or whatever, but trust me, to _me_ - a person who has to leave the house for an overnight if my husband makes kippers, or who once vomited due to being stuck near a garbage truck at a particularly long red light - they really, really do. I just cannot hack it. Mad respect to anyone who can.
Test out the Duluth puffin jacket I’m thinking of getting one for my winter trips and your opinion weighs heavy on what I buy lol. I pulled the trigger on the rab rain jacket you showed and it rocks
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![[MIRRORED] LISA - ROCKSTAR 🎸 MV version #LISA #BLACKPINK #ROCKSTAR](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-U58DuCCtZk/mqdefault.jpg)
The back pocket is for crampons and/or a shovel. Hence, a stiff/strong material that doesn't have mesh. And, the "water bottle" pockets are not water bottle pockets, but pockets for wands, poles and pickets. This pack is for mountaineering/climbing, etc. , not backpacking.
@Super Shmov good thing he didn't ask you huh?
Seeing those water bottles trying to stay in the bottom side pockets was hilarious ... It's a mountaineering pack, Dan
Well dual purpose is the best tool.
Anyone whose pad is less warm than they want; if you do want to use it again in cold temperatures because you invested heavily + can't _afford_ another, a quick-fix boost to its insulating properties is to stitch/glue 2 mylar blankets into a simple slipcover for it (which is what I've done to make my cheap Zoobelives pad warmer in Aussie Winter). If you're willing to redo it occasionally, then you can use the cheap, pocket versions of emergency blankets so that it packs down tiny & weighs almost nothing.
Hope this helps someone!
He mentioned the “noise” the way it is, imagine if he put mylar? lol
@@daigonili earplugs. I honestly don't know why every hiker who complains about the noise of their/companions' pad/s doesn't just invest in a pair of 50c earplugs.
I never go camping without mine; earplugs + a blackout mask weigh basically nothing & are invaluable to a decent night's sleep in the bush.
@@mysterylovescompany2657 imagine being alone in the woods and plugging your ears so that you cant hear anything around you 🤦♂️
@@totenfurwotan4478 done it plenty of times, but then, I don't live on a continent with any large predators.
@@mysterylovescompany2657 a woman was just killed out west by a bear that came back to her tent looking for food after getting driven from camp earlier. There are animals out here that can kill you while you sleep.
I really like videos like this where you test & review gear while you are actually on a trial versus in your studio, plus the footage and editing were super duper! Thanks for giving honest reviews and keep up the great work!
Great video Dan, informative as usual. Gordon is definitely a positive addition to the channel.
So with my Sea to Summit pad (a different model but same valve system), you have to use the valve correctly to properly deflate it. You flip the valve so it allows air OUT but not IN, then roll OUT the air. At 10:14 you can see that you've got the valve just hanging open, which isn't how their valve system works. When you flip the valve, you can deflate it to a much smaller size. I can't comment on it's warmth, but I love my Sea to Summit pad.
Kudos to Gordon….And the drone “pull outs” really add to the video. Both artistic…but it also shows the surrounding countryside! Nice!
I know one was mentioned when you read out the comments but I have a couple of Exped mats for the winter, they are down filled and one I have is rated to minus 38 celcius which is about the same in farenheight (excuse the spelling but we went metric in the UK ages ago) and it has a built in pump as well, I used it in slightly lower temperatures than it is rated for in Finland and it was great. It's a lot smaller than that thing you were using when it packs down and it is fairly light for a winter pad, oh and its lovely and quiet. Your channel has always been very good and watchable but I think that your man has definately helped to improve things!
Yes! Trip video!!! And it was great to hear the update on the sleeping pad. Love the drone shots! Have a great Thanksgiving with the fam.
There's a big difference between backpacking,hiking and alpinism.That a top of the line,summit series backpack,made for alpine environment.The pockets are not for water bottles,obviously not in winter,but for trekking poles,snow anchors,avalanche probes,etc.
In alpinism you don't really want to hang things on the outside of your backpack..
+1 on the Ventus hoodie. I've been using mine for a couple months now. It's a pretty amazing mid-layer for cooler temps. Probably the first synthetic I genuinely like as much my high end down.
Great job Gordon. Great sound, nice drone shots, great info! ON WISCONSIN!🤩
Good job Gordon! Very good flow and nicely picked clips
Solid video as always Dan. I recently did a backpacking trip and used the Big Agnes Q Core SLX based on your recommendation-such good sleep! I combined that with one of them egg crate pads and I was toasty in the low ‘30s. That’s a bummer this pad you reviewed isn’t great, considering the size and weight.
Love the content! Gets me to vicariously live through you & gets me excited to plan more backpacking trips.
Just a tip on ferro rod use... hold the striker near your fuel and pull the rod toward you and away from the striker. That way, the sparks will all be directed right at your fuel. The opposite way, the sparks just go flying everywhere and you hope some hit the fuel. This is a very common mistake and easily remedied. Hope you and your family (and friends) had a great Thanksgiving!
I just got myself a hot tenting setup and am excited to push myself into colder months. I have to go back into your catalog to look for cold weather quilts.
Firstly, Gordon is the man! Happy to see someone is thinking for you 😉 Secondly, that pad is big enough it should never be cold. I stack a couple of thinner pads and a a review blanket layer to start warm, but I'm just sleeping on snow, nothing as cold as you experience.
Those are not water bottle pockets on the side of the pack but wand pockets. Wands are used in glacier travel for marking your route. A wand basically a stick with a piece of reflective tape. A group might carry a couple hundred wands to mark a route on a glacier.. The front pocket thing I suspect is a crampon pocket but I didn’t get a good look at it.
This, or for pickets. Water bottles on the outside of mountaineering packs are a good way to get some ice cubes :)
@@geoff5568 Absolutely pickets.
The etherlight xt extreme packs to about quarter of the size you showed. You just need to deflate it completely. The flextailgear pump doesn't have enough power to fill it all the way, you need to use the bag or give it a couple of blows. I've used it with no problem in sub-freezing temperatures, not expecting any problems as the winter goes on.
Same thought! In addition, I don't think I've ever slept well on a pad that's fully inflated lol, always deflate a little.
I have the same pad, and so far I haven't gotten cold, and that was in the teens in Colorado. It's bigger than expected, but worked well for what I was using it for
He don’t like it just because of the size , these ultra light guys have a bias over the size and weight of gear .
Oh thank god. Was about to buy freaking Xtherm. Probably just the bias which I respect. We all love our products. But for those of sticking with our StS EtherXtreme; should I get a CCell pad for car camping as well?
At least mine packs down to about 1/4 the size in the video. Maybe there are different versions, years, etc. Since I live in Florida staying warm in freezing weather is not at the top of the priority list. If I go camping in subfreezing weather I need a new equipment plan in general.
👍👍 for Gordon. Really like the drone shots.
Beautifully filmed and edited. Great work, a joy to watch.
Good to see you back out there!! Take it easy and a quarter mile at a time!! Have a happy thanksgiving!
Ha! That was just the first shelter. If you watch, we hiked the next day to another shelter! :-)
Winter backpacking is my favorite. The Nemo Tensor is my favorite 3 season pad, but if it gets near freezing or lower, I always take the Xtherm. Never been cold with that pad.
Excellent job! Beautiful videography! Well done!
Gordon deserves a raise. You're lucky to have him. Greeeeeaaat video once again❗
Great video work Gordon. I think my kids and I were in the same area last month when it was super cold. We did a short IAT segment while "car camping" so plenty of blankets for the kids, under and over their sleeping bags. I use an old wool army blanket wrapped around me and under the air pad, even with my Klymit static V I was warm with Temps in the low 30's over night.
My decision was between this and the Exped Downmat UL Winter LW. I went with the Exped and I love it! Taken it down to around 15F and it's very warm. Packs down quite a lot smaller than the etherlite by the looks of it too. Even happier with my choice now.
for winter I use the Big Agnes Diamond Park with one of the BA extra long/tall insulated core sleeping pads and I was toasty warm all night in the snow (30 degrees). the bag and pad are quite big (so comparable to the one you used in the video) but so worth it
Similar experience for me. The S2S pad was comfortable but cold in upper 20s. It was fine in the 40s, though. But, mine is not noisy at all.
Great videos- thank you Gordon!! Dan you have a great personality and so enjoyable to watch. I’m a new subscriber and am making my way through all of your trips. Thank you
Thank you!!
Love the combo video Dan, thanks. I nearly bought this pad recently but went for the new Xtherm NXT Max instead, purely based on pack size and weight. The Thermarest has been lovely and warm and comfortable too. The summer Sea To Summit (3.2) I found cold at even 10 Celsius. Personally, I suspect the issue occurs when deflating slightly, yet this hasn't affected the Thermarest.
Have you tried wrapping your pad in one of the army surplus wool blankets before you put your bag on it? Their dimensions are spot on for pads. Helps muffle noise a bit, helps keep the bag from sliding around, and stops those drafts from seeping in between you and the pad. Might be worth checking out and using with some pads that sucked for you. A simple wool blanket like that can be worth their weight in gold.
Even though I haven't used it for extreme temperatures I love the Exped Synmat 9 LW. Coldest temperature I used it in was in the Ardennes, first week of january with a couple degrees below freezing. Paired it with a Forclaz down sleeping bag that was comfort-rated for 0-degrees and I didn't really feel cold. Little chilly maybe but still comfortable. It does help that I thrive in the cold though, even at 5 degrees Celsius I'll probably wear my shorts and just a vest or something. I don't even own any proper winter-jacket 😂
I have a Rab Microlight Alpine jacket. I've had it for 3 years and used it in everything the UK can throw at me. It's absolutely ace and well worth the money. I believe it's Nikawax down too which is great for the inevitable rain the UK produces every time I leave the house, lol.
Watching from Australia 🇦🇺 Love your vids 👍 Great reviews & stunning scenery.
I ended up returning my S2S Etherlight. I used it in 20-30 degree weather a couple weeks ago (paired with a 35 degree NEMO bag and a S2S compact liner) and it worked fine for me. I filled it up max on night one and it was too hard, and I deflated it a little bit the next night and it was much more comfortable. No chill either night. I returned it because the size of it in my pack was just too much.
Get an Exped synmat HL Winter or Downmat HL winter series.
His drone shots are awesome! Beautiful scenery.
I haven't done more than 20 nights of cold weather camping but it's all been on an StS uninsulated dual layer pad. I use a reflective windshield thing when OS and a thin foam thing with a reflective layer at home. That is for safety/backup in remote areas, solo. With a minus 10 deg c bag I am warm as!
I like that Ventus hoodie. Gonna have to check that out. Nice bag too.
Gordon is doing a great job. I am loving my Ventus too.
Good honest review. Thanks Gordon for a great video
Just ordered the pad, hoping I find it more comfortable!! Bought for winter camping in Wisconsin, was still planning to put a foam pad under it for warmth though.
Interesting. I just bought one and I had one night on it. I ended up with my hip on the ground but I suspect it was because I left the 2nd valve cap off after adjusting it. Compared to my Neoair (original-ish, over a decade old), this pad is SO QUIET. So nice and wide. I was not sleeping cold mind you, so I can't tell you what's going to happen there. About to take it alpine but don't expect it much under 35 as it's summer here. Decided I wanted the comfort and I'll take the size/weight hit for it.
Thx for showing this ! Great vid
Love the work you're doing Gord! Now you just need to find a new host 😉
I had a similar experience with a new sleeping pad this weekend. I was testing a Gear Doctors Apollo Air mattress that is supposed to be R value 5.2. The camp site has a wood tent pad, and it was WINDY and cold. I had a torso length CCF under the sleeping pad, but I was freezing. Temp went down to 3C/37F and I was miserable. My sleeping bag was warm, but all the cold wind coming up under the wood pad and right into my tent was not a fun night. I honestly don't know if the sleeping pad is any good because I haven't been able to test it on solid ground. I definitely won't be using it on any raised decks any time soon. 😝
Hey Dan I ordered the Ventus Hoodie for my winter trip to backpack Grand Canyon. Looks like you really like it.
Hey Dan, Keep up the great work. We just returned from a trip using the Etherlight XT Extreme Rectangular in a cold front of 18F (with 30mph gusts). We did run the pads at full inflation using the bag to inflate to reduce moisture from our breath to inflate them. No-one was cold on this trip. The sleeping bags we used in tandem were 10F and 20F enlightened equipment converts. I am guessing if we were to use the Xtherm pad based on your experience with both; we would expect to be able to go even colder. Thanks for all you do brother.
Good to know! Thank you!
I'm sick living vicariously through this video. I need to get back out there. Haha i had a good laugh at the water bottle pocket for toddlers.
Great review and Gordon is doing a great job
I bought a overmount sleeping pad from Amazon. It's a 5 R value. Sleep really well in the cold. It's price point is very good too. Especially if you're on a budget
Emmet deserves a raise! He is doing awesome!
Your sleeping pad review, makes me appreciate the 'thick' orange closed cell pad I had. Even well below freezing here in the east. I mean, this is super low tech way back in the day.
Like somebody else said, those side pockets were probably made to park the rear of the skis in to stop them from sliding down. Also, the big centered pockets is for crampons, trust med crampons Will kill mesh instantly. They could have made the side pockets multipurpose since skis bill also fit in deeper pockets
Pretty sure they're not water-bottle pockets but are actually to hold the ends of trekking poles or ice axes.
This is a Summit series backpack from TNF. It’s a mountaineering backpack. The very small ”pockets” on the sides are probably used for carrying wands. Wands are used to mark a trail in case of bad visibility, so you can find your way home, and not freeze to death on the mountain. Water bottles are carried inside the pack so that you by accident don’t loose a bottle and it comes tumbling down the mountain face and hits someone below. If you want to carry a water bottle outside your pack, a lot of people carry a bottle in an insulated sleeve and secures it to their climbing harness with a carabiner 🏔🌨🇳🇴
First Gordon is doing a great job. Second for winter I love the Granite Gear Blaze. 60 Liters plus the extension collar , lid and pockets, all the compression straps to lash gear and a 50lbs load rating? Nothing but love.
I loooooove my Granite Gear Blaze 60 also!!!!
If you like the Rab jacket so much, try the Rab Ascent 1100 sleeping bag for winter. Its my go to winter sleeping bag so comfy and warm
Currently researching for a winter sleeping pad for dog sledding. Based on the bulky size, when rolled, this thing better be outstanding and warm. Off my list for sure.
Any air mattress is bulky when rolled if you don't get the air out. Just check out any other review. Everyone is praising this one.
Being from Wisconsin as well I find myself wanting to leave the state to go find beauty forgetting how beautiful it can be in my own backyard. Looks like you were on the ice age trail somewhere, but I've never come across those shelters in my travels.
Love it that a company puts together a team to come up with a product that they feel will be what the consumer they are targeting wants. They build prototypes and test them and make modifications until they have it just like it should be. Then somebody with a TH-cam Chanel comes along and purchases their product and proceeds to evaluate it against their misunderstanding of what it actually is or how it functions. The company then gets to view their product being evaluated against the wrong set of criteria. Ain't America great.
wow Dan, been watching for a while and your friend really does a great job
Gordon is doing a great job and you must know it because you didn't try to pass off the pad with "Hey you should try out this pad tonight! ;-)" The size of that pad itself would be a NoGo, even if it weighed 2oz. Thank You again for recomending the Ventus hoodie, just ordered two more for Xmas presents. Not only is it warm but very comfortable because it is so thin.
I’ve used the S2S comfort plus with a lower R value to around -7c/20f without feeling cold. But I do like it firm. It’s the best mat I’ve used, the thermorests are almost double the price where I live.
Nows the time to do that winter ski trek camp up north..!!!!
Great review! … That pad does look super comfortable but I went for the Exped Synmat winter UL LW , the insulation is webbed to the top and bottom to ensure insulation is provided regardless of whether fully inflated, it sometimes feels like it’s plugged in 😁 the heat below is fantastic!..
I wonder if somehow the insulation wasn’t properly employed when you were feeling the cold from below ? 🤔
Hey Dan, thanks for your honest review of the sea to summit extreme pad. I also concur with your comments that this pad has been SOOOOHHH highly rated and reviewed by many back-country trekkers across the globe. I was torn between the sea to summit and the Xtherm. You have convinced me that for warmth, comfort, size and noise factors, I will be purchasing the Thermarest Xtherm. Keep up the good work bro'.
You won’t be sorry!!!
This isn’t an honest review, he’s improperly using the pad. He’s under inflating it and also isn’t folding it properly.
Source: I own it.
Also I own an XTherm and both are excellent choices
I just have bought one and had two nights on it and felt the cold both times , 1st night 7c 2nd night 0c , luckily my quilt is overkill so didn’t freeze lol so back to my thermarest extherm which I know is warm . I was sold on the hype , eBay here we come .
I've had LOTS of problems with the STS Ether Light XT. If it's not firm, it's cold. If it's firm, it's painful. If I make it firm repeatedly, it starts getting TONS of leaks right on the round parts at the corners of the air cells. I had one do this repeatedly, gave it a second try, and now the second is doing the same. Going to return it soon. One out of five!
Too bad... it's nice in a lot of ways... but even in winter here (Taiwan - that's to say Michigan fall), I don't even consider it. I go straight to my Thermarest!
For me I use the big Agnes Q core, I absolutely love it. It keeps me warm and comfortable. I would defiantly recommend.
Loving Wisconsin in fall 👍🏻 Another great video Dan! Love from the 🇬🇧
Thanks Dan!!
That is one pimp backpack Dan. Well done for trying to pull it off.
Great job Gordon!!
I just use a lightweight cot. It insures it won't deflate, my hot tent stove, rocks on the ground and pets I bring won't pop it. And before I go to sleep I stuff the warm clothing I'm not wearing underneath to insolate from the ground. I've gone out -25C° and was fine.
I love my rab jacket. It has been my go to deep winter jacket for 2 years now
Excellent photography!
I added a foam pad underneath it on my first solo in coincidentally that same shelter about two weeks later and it got to 18 degrees that night and I felt a slight chill a couple times through the night
I used the Neutrino on my Rainier summit climb. Epic jacket and great value for the money.
I found my 7mm Foam Pad adequate even in the winter sleeping on the snow while backpacking in the Cascades.
I can see a major improvement since Gordon has been doing the videoing and editing.
Great shots and editing.
The STS Ether Light XT Insulated at various inflation amounts works great for me into the upper 20s/lower 30s using a quilt here in Wisco.
Just ordered the STS Ether Light XT Insulated for use with a quilt - found very little information of how the deep baffles might impact the overall performance when using a quilt. Your comment gives me hope that my experiment goes well =)
Dan Gordon is definitely a keeper. The vids are wonderful 😊
I'm not familiar with The North Face Cobra 65 backpack but if it is a dedicated Winter backpack most likely the side pockets are not intended for water bottles. I have owned several dedicated winter backpacks and none of them have external pockets for water bottles simply because external water storage will freeze in true winter temps. Most likely are intended for Pickets, wands and possibly for bottom of ski tips for slashing to the pack A-frame style. Same goes for the back pocket. Not intended as a general storage catch all as on most 3-season packs. Crampons slashing plus protecting from crampons spikes or an avalanche shovel body. I'm a little surprised you would not know this. Most winter backpacks fall under the mountaineering category where are you are usually slashing large bulky equipment to your pack.
The side pockets on the backpack are for wands, not water bottles. It’s a sport specific pack designed for climbing and mountaineering, where water bottles are carried inside the pack. Also, the crampon pouch is designed to carry - you guessed it, crampons. Stretch in that pocket would hinder its usefulness for that purpose (not to mention being destroyed by crampon points).
I have this model and others from Sea to Summit. For once, I disagree with you. The pack size, when done properly using the supplied stuff sack, creates a diameter about half of that you have shown Dan. My go to mat is the Ether Light XT Insulated for cold weather camping/hiking, perhaps you would reconsider this brand and try again? I would recommend you do as, as I am side sleeper, it's the best I have used and does pack really small.
Edit: I rewatched the video, and wish to correct my initial statement. It packs about 1/3 less than have shown.
Yeah, same. You can see there's still a lot of air in it. My strategy is to roll it tight with the valve open, close it, unroll and then just fold a couple of times.
YUP , I start rolling the pad tight by the foot, so the air comes all out , and its tiny, but i have to admit i have the womans version... my BF 's is much bigger
@@melissaverdoni845 okay, now there's no need to show off about your BF's size... ;)
As with any air mattress, you have to remove all air to pack it away in the provided stuff sack. I fold mine in 3 lengthwise (being careful to not create a crease) then roll. If I take my time, there's even room left in the sack. However, I can imagine stuffing it away when in a rush can be difficult.
@@treubuchet LOLL true, when i finish my trip and wanna pack to go home i hate taking my time ,,, so thats an issue. even putting the quilt in the compression sack it a fun game that takes time ,,, i have the ember.
Dan, great job, missing Wisc here. I see some drone shots, but did not see the drone model listed or linked in the list above; thanks for braving the cold for us.
Thanks! Here it is 👉 amzn.to/3DStgQS
Gordon is doing a great job indeed!
He’s sooooo good!! (ALMOST as good as Tuba Solo)
put a foil blanket underneath it stops it from sitting directly on the cold floor
great job on the video editing. what software is being used? the sleep pad is def. cold in cooler weather. keep the great vids. coming
Great stuff as usual. You are brave with a 3.2 r value pad in that cold damp. What kind of drone are you using? Great shots
Regarding the pack, if it's a winter alpine pack I very much doubt those are water bottle pockets, they look like snow stake pockets to me.
Youre 100% right lol
I was going to say the same thing!
Dan - in winter or mountaineering, you have to keep bottles from freezing, even during the day. I usually carry an insulated bottle holder (OR bottle parka) attached to the bottom of my shoulder strap so it stays at my hip, but I can slide it up to get the bottle in and out easily. Sometimes you have to carry the bottle next to your body. Some people carry it inside their pack to keep it from freezing, but I like to drink too often for that (and not have my stuff slide down the mountain when I dig into my pack!)
@@bihlygoat i think it's annoying that he reviews equipment but he doesn't know anything about it
Thanks for that as I thought I was wrong , but I slept on the same mat with a foil mat under it and paired with the bandit 10f quilt and I could feel the cold striking through . It wasn’t mega cold around 30f yes it’s comfortable but it’s so big . So it’s back to to my trusty the thermarest extherm from now on and yes it’s tiny in comparison 👍 atb Dave
Great job Gordon! Really love your filming and editing, and the drone shots!! I have the Klymit Luxe Static V Insulated long and wide. I used it the first time last week. It got down to 28F, 18F wind chill. I used my Hyke & Byke 0 Degrees bag. I wasn't cold, but I wasn't warm either. Comfortable pad, very quiet. ASTM rating is only 2.4 while the company gives it an R-value of 5. Gordon said in the video that he was warm. What sleeping system did he use?
Gordon's doing a great job! I'm surprised you were cold on the Etherlite My wife has the women's version (which has a higher r-value) down to 16F, and she sleeps cold, and she loves it, but we're all different.
I think you need to try using the pad correctly. It needs to be fully inflated to get the true value of its warmth. It's way less noisy than the Thermorest neoair, and you have to fully deflate it and learn to fold it correctly. It packs down way smaller than you showed.
I have the s2s ether light XT and have used it in spring summer and fall. From temperatures varying from +20 °c to -3 °c and the only time I was cold was when my sleeping bag got wet.
Just got my Ventus Hoodie, love this thing. Do you find it comfortable to hike in, or does it get too hot?
I worked at a sport store couple of years agoo, and that was first time i tried Rab gear, cus we sold it there :D. But it has become my favorite brand. I have a down jacket, fleece hoodie and gore tex jacket + pants from them. And it is really good. But what i like most is how they just fits so good. And the hoodies on both the down jacket and gore tex jacket is really nice and big + adjustable all over
Neutrino jacket from Rab, best there is. Hydrophobic down, what else to say. Had one for years for a reason ;) As for the backpack, got same Cobra 60 when it came out in black and yellow, funny enough matching my Grivel axe. Crampons carry is great. Side pockets are more designed for poles than bottles as you would generally have a camelback inside the backpack rather than risking for a bottle to come out while climbing (which this backpack is designed for anyways).
Give the Florida Trail a try. Starting at the southern terminus, you won’t have to worry about sleeping cold.
I tested this mattress in mid-October. What I immediately liked about this mattress is that it is thicker, more comfortable than the UltraLight Insulated I had. I sleep on my side and the other mattress hurt my hips.
I don't find it that loud when compared to the NeoAir XTherm MAX. But it's true, it is not very small, once in its storage bag!
During my stay, at night the temperature
was around 7C / 44.6F, which is not very cold.
I used a -18C / -0.4F quilt and
I slept very well. I did not feel any freshness coming from the ground.
I will be testing it again in early December and the predicted temperature is around -12C / 10.4F.
I will instead use a -29C / -20.2F sleeping bag.
Hope to have a good night ...
I've given mine 4 nights now and every night was cold below me. from -3C (26F) down to -23C (-9F) and I had a CCF pad underneath. My bags rated down to -30C (-25F) The only time I was warm was when I put my CCF mat on top of the EitherXT Extreme Pad. I've had it fully inflated, and tried deflating it slightly to see if that would help. I'm pretty confused with the whole thing and at this point, I think I'm returning mine. I'm curious if you've taken the Pad out again and how did it go?
I wasn't impressed with mine. Cold at 7°c with a good and proven quilt. Sent it back
You guys are so much harder than me. I am a hyperosmiac (ever heard of a Super Taster? it's like that, but for smell), & from my experience with pit toilets, I would always rather go feral + dig myself a cathole than have to choose between holding my breath or getting seriously sick while using one.
I know, ppl say, "they don't smell that bad, because of the lime" or whatever, but trust me, to _me_ - a person who has to leave the house for an overnight if my husband makes kippers, or who once vomited due to being stuck near a garbage truck at a particularly long red light - they really, really do.
I just cannot hack it. Mad respect to anyone who can.
Test out the Duluth puffin jacket I’m thinking of getting one for my winter trips and your opinion weighs heavy on what I buy lol. I pulled the trigger on the rab rain jacket you showed and it rocks