Glad you enjoyed it. But make sure to also check out all the videos by Steve Albini. He knows about a trillion times more about amps and mic placement than I do. Best, Felix
Going through a amp is really the secret sauce. Because most analog synths are solid state, they sound terrific and technically very clean. However a synth through the guitar tubes is going to give it a lot of overtones and overall human warmth we all love. It really can make your electronic tracks feel more alive and less robotic/cold.
The Minimoog through my Bassman sounds phenomenal. The Bassman reproduces every nuance of the frequencies but the only drawback is that it lacks the thunder of modern bass amps.
Brilliant, is my first thought! Second thought was ‘This makes even MORE sense for synths than it ever did for guitars’! With the purity of sound now, we are all aware of chasing a never-ending amount of computing and software sophistication, trying to warm-up/randomise/saturate etc the core synthesised waveforms…then this comes along as a technique crying out to be paired with that old CMI Fairlight I have in the cupboard (no, I really don’t). This is surprisingly one of the most interesting and compelling adventures into sound design and processing I have seen in ages. There is the slight drawback of course as I found doing vocals late at night. Next day cleaning up the tracks I realised the washing machine had been droning on the entire time, and I never noticed. Familiarity breeds deafness. But ambient intrusions aside, I freaking love this idea. I thought I was pretty intrepid back in the day, putting a tiny cheap Casiotone through a chorus pedal and a phaser pedal, and making it sound half-decent for the teenage band. Good work and a surprising number of commenters/contributors echo your views on this. Bad wordplay, sorry. Thanks! Keep safe, be well.
I do this in the DAW with ABL3 into an amplifier VST. That was how Roland was expecting musicians to use the TB303 in the first place. Can get some nice warm sounds.
@@ThomannSynthesizers Actually makes a lot of sense when you think how speakers roll off and color the sound. I sometimes drop IR's on a bass track to see if the contour of the speaker helps the part fit into the track better.
OMG did the same thing a few weeks ago while wanting to add my pedals in Ableton. Also for saturation or distortion this is a very good idea too. Thank you again for the clear and beautiful inspiration!
Great video! I was just watching some old footage of the late producer, Bruce Swedien (Michael Jackson's Off The Wall & Thriller), talking about how he used to always pump his synths through speakers in a studio that he would then record with mics
Jan Hammer in the 70's uses Twin Reverb with the Minimoog, and in the 80's I played bass in a jazz rock band where the keyboard player runs his Micromoog thru a Twin too. But for this style, the Moog where used mainly for soloing, so the bass sounds where not used as in techno styles. For this kind of bass sounds, you need a good bass bass amp, and of course, you always do bi-amplification routing to a guitar and a bass amps, cutting bass in the guitar amp and cutting highs on the bass amp. And for the budget, you always run your synth thru a SansAmp.
@Pete Testube I was using a Gallien Krueger MB112, it is very powerful class D combo and you can handle pretty wall because its size and weight. there are many brands in the market, Fender has some Rumble models that can fit well too.
@Pete Testube may be, I never used those amps but they are reliable, try to check first, I think that the most important thing is that the speaker no less than 12 inches to have more air in movement.
geddy lee always put his synthesizers through speaker cabinets. he said without it they sounded empty and thin. a real speaker that's moving real air adds so much more space
I have been playing various synths, samplers and drum machines through different instrument amplifiers and guitar pedals for years… That Moog would sound amazing though my bass amp I know mine always has It is nice to see this level of explanation for the reason behind its benefits
can you please suggest an amp or monitor that has very full bass sound for a moog sub 25 / sub phatty? I read a bass amp wouldn't pick up the high pitch stuff
@@SureFeelsGood I have a Yorkville XM200 bass amp that also has a tweeter Although I have a Peavey Duel Two Twelve tube guitar amp as well…. If my memory serves correctly you have more than one audio output on your synth At the very least a headphone jack if not two direct audio outputs I would send one output to a bass amp and a second output to a guitar amp…. This is something I have done for years and years For example My Yamaha DX fm synth has a great organ sound I like to send my left output into my bass amp and my right output into my guitar amp with tremolo activated for a very realistic Leslie rotary speaker sound I hope this makes sense
Awesome, I used to just play my synths through my tube amp all the time because I love the grit that it gives it. I find that oftentimes distortion pedals on synths can be overly grating but running them through the tube amps gives them that grit that im looking for without it being too overwhelming. I especially liked your comment about the complexity and nuance it imparts, you out words to a sensation I could never quite put my finger on or describe to others. Now I’ll have an explanation when someone asks me why I’m risking blowing out my amp to run my synth through it hahaha.
I just put my 303 through my Fender Bassbreaker 15 tube amp and it sounds incredible. The amp has a direct Line Out so no need for microphones. I bet this was a secret standard practice in 80s and 90s recording studios.
Way back when, I had to play my Acetone organ through a guitar amp. It added grit and almost made it sound like an overdriven Hammond. It's really the only way that I view as providing grit. By the way, the amp was a cheap 2 12 inch speaker Lafayette amp with just tremolo (which I never used) and tone controls.
I wish this would be incorporated more with synths. Barely charted territory. Build in speakers still seem like a gimmick for toys but I really hope one day it will be part of the overal design of the instruments. A synth could be an acoustic instrument.
Really enjoy these synth production videos you guys do. I have 2 amps I do this with, often utilising the effects on the Fender for more extreme amp type sounds.
Good video 👍. I find that when the other instruments are being recorded in a room, synths will blend better in the mix if they are also "moving air". The reduced bandwidth and ambience also helps for synths with patches that have audible artifacts such as the DX7 or DX27.
I defintely agree with this. Many times I've buggered around with sounds on a synth, trying to find something that fits with everything else, and once recorded it doesn't sound right, because it just ends up so very dry. Sure one could bung effects at it, but you can end up losing things that way. By using an amp and real "moving air" as you say, it can add such a great ambience and cure this problem in one fell swoop.
I plugged some synths into my guitar amp years ago but haven't tried my DX7 yet. Sadly, half of the internal sounds on my beautiful and mint condition DX7 have disappeared. The battery voltage is good but it looks like the data is corrupted. Any ideas on a fix for that?
@@fixedfocusmediaofficial Cool, I still have one old hardware synth a 90s Kurzweil K2000, it loads patches from floppy disk, lo, The DX7 was the first synth I owned and it was magic at the time. At the time everyone was predicting the death of analog, oh well, lol! cheers!
You should really add a disclaimer that one could easily blow a guitar speaker with bass frequencies from synths. Others are questioning only amps for some reason, but it is the speakers that can be damaged.
@@csharp57 nope. its not about level signal, it is about frequency range. while statement about hot signal is true, guitar speakers are not designed to reproduce low frequency range that much, and playing very low frequenices from a synth could blow it
I honestly doubt you're going to destroy them. I ran my 1000 watt power amp through 2 V30s for over 100 shows with synths/synth bass at full volume and my speakers are fine. I was literally shaking the stage.
Nice vid! I have to amp my synths for what I do. I compose for TV and film. If I just DI, A & R or music library editors & managers always say, "You need more up-to-date plugins". And they're not even plugins. If I amp and mic, they always accept the sound of my track pitches
I tried guitar amps next to the set-up I use which is a PA with EV speakers. That sounds great but the vocals struggled to get through so I added a subwoofer.
thats why your job as a sound designer is to design the room too! just as important as the initial sound is the space you create for it :) thats the magic of synthesis
I record sometimes my modular drummaschine/synth Monster into my huges&kettner amp and the built in spring reverb sounds amazing! Very good Results.. Grüße aus Wien 🤟🇦🇹 Euer Herr Fuchs
I literally have been doing this for a couple years after I jokingly plugged a microphone directly into my amp input and started singing while messing around with the digital effects like tremolo and shit haha
That’s all I ever use with my portables. Guitar amps, though I much prefer solid state. The new Hiwatt Crunch 150 combo 1x12 sounds amazing, plus it has an 1/8” preamp bypass, and a spring reverb.
I would be curious about your opinion on the Korg OpSix Guitar Amp effects. To my amateur ears, they sound absolutely wonderful on just about any patch and add so much character and liveliness to it. I was honestly blown away by the many different models of amp you can select from as well.
As always an excellent explanation Felix. Much appreciated. Loving you little riffs as well. I wonder what you make of software emulations like NI Guitar Rig? I also watched a video interview of Pole recently (dub techno / electronica legend!) where he explained that he places his mics behind the amp for the optimal dub bass. I suppose it's one of the downsides of software emulations that you cannot use it wrong intentionally :) Anyway, thanks for the tips!
As I said in the video, take care of the volume of the line level signal. Too high volumes will damage any speaker. If you wanne be sure use a reamp box to convert it to an instrument level signal. Regarding low frequencies make sure to check the specifications of your amp. The Twin Reverb for example can handle a very wide range of frequencies. Your mileage may vary.
Great vid! I know Battles did this on at least one or two of their albums from an Ableton vid I watched with them. It certainly creates a timbre that is way different than going direct.
It always will. It's a completely different routing that uses that unsterile space that is otherwise denied to you when you run it all just through wires. This was quite normal back in 70's and 80's when technology was where it was. I ran my keyboard back then lime that because it simply could not be done the other way with the equipment we had. When you then fed the mic signal to the PA system, the results were quite shocking. Using this technique on modern equipment is more labor intensive but it's also much more fun - if your neighbors are not right next to your house. I almost exclusively never play through monitors anymore because my neighbor's are very annoyed by my "stuff".
This is genius, but any long term guitar players also know.. everything sounds more amazing through tubes to begin with. Personally I don't have the money, but have always wanted tube preamps for dj gigs and studio production. Apparently a cheap one can be made with some 6L6s. (Would love to see any future videos demo-ing any thing like this please!) Have a buddy who can do this for me. It's also worth mentioning that a lot of the boutique guitar amps that are very pricey are made from the fender bassman circuit. Add a spring reverb and you have a very rich sound. Tubes create submarmonics which really fatten up the sound. This can be done with very high quality mosfets as well. It's why a lot of the recordings from the 60s and 70s sound so rich. Lenny kravitz for example...as soon as he had the money from his first album made an entire studio with only tube gear.. including the mixers. Thanks for this video!!!
A really good example Of synthesizers being miked up in acoustic spaces Is the Depeche Mode construction time again album Too many of the new recordings Sound sterile
Great video! I am a guitar player and found this very informative. Many tube/valve amps have an inherent hissing sound and I've had trouble with this in the past...any hints on how to deal with tube/valve amplifier hissing when recording with microphones? Your sound is very clear and I didn't pick up on much hiss at all. Thanks!
I used to do that, but some people told me at the time that some frequencies of synths can cause damages on amp. Maybe it's not true, don't really know.
I have a question, Felix (or anyone). Generally speaking, how loud do you need the amp to be? I've been wanting to try this technique for a while, but I live in an apartment building with close neighbours who I don't want to annoy. Do you need to have the sound cranked up or will this technique work well at more modest volumes?
any volume will do but if you want to be more complex... most guitar amps, but definitely all valve/tube amps, are designed to have a "sweet spot" where there is a characteristic breakup at a certain volume that many people find to be pleasing. it's likely that your amp will sound its best around this volume which is why almost all studios have small tube amps in them and almost all stages have large tube amps on them. note that this principle works the exact same for studio grade preamplifiers with transistors or valves (telefunken v72 or neve 1073 for example) where often producers like to run the signal in at a specific volume that is around the sweet spot. plugins are modelled on these principles though so dont feel like you have to spend wild money to get similar effects
This is an amazing video. Can anyone recommend any starter synthesizers? I have experience with Sylenth and Serum but I would love to get into the hardware synth space. Thank you Thomann for the video
well known technique since day one:), but say bye bye to the low end using guitar amps... some synthesizers like whole freq range, I wouldn't plug my model D into the guitar amp, probably bass amp can give nice growl, but entire freq range equipment allows you to hera how the synthesizer sounds in 'real' :). I like to send drums through amps though, cool effect.
I read up on it in advance and reamp boxes can be a nice improvement but aren‘t necessarily required. I didn‘t have any issues with signal to noise ratio etc. But yes, I think with a reamp box you‘re gonna be on the safe side and run into less problems in the long run. Best, Felix
@@ThomannSynthesizers you are correct it's not required to pass the signal as you've demonstrated with these amps, but it is more about optimizing the signal transfer, ensuring all the harmonics, tonal quality from the source get through properly to the speaker, allowing the amp's circuit to function, sound, colour the signal as intended. Not just about the SNR. This difference is more apparent on the lower end of the frequency spectrum. maybe it can be said with mis-matched impedance It's like you put a leather glove on the microphone, sure it's gonna work but... To expand on the technique which also benefits from having the fuller signal the reamp box gives is mixing one or more reamped signals, in parallel with the original recording in the DAW.
@@Rareos I mean sure you can agonize over the tiny details but the differences are fractional and the introduction of more gear makes things less attainable for amateurs.
@@Claidheambmor Well it's not always fractional.. depends on the amp, what speakers are in the cab, is the signal a synth, maybe a modular synth which is much hotter. Either way it's not agonizing for even an amateur to be aware of the few types of signals they are working with, and helpful for their entire journey. Also you can do the same thing with any cheap buffered stomp box in bypass, which anyone with a guitar amp and a synth probably already owns.
It's really hard to mix that signal with other parts of a song bc it sounds so different. Furthermore the guitar amp filters out bass frequencies and takes away power from the synth signal. If you can though overdriving the tubes in the amp and recording it through a line out would be great.
It depends on the amp. The twin reverb can handle them easily, but always be careful with volumes and maybe look it up for your own amp in advance to avoid unnecessary risk.
Hi, that a very interesting approach and surely very sonically contributive due to the different types of microphones and amps used. Being quite new in the synth world, I'm wondering which type of cable do you use to make the connection between the synth and the guitar amp a studio line cable or a guitar cable ? In addition when the guitar amp has 2 types of input Low Z and Hi Z which one has to be selected . Thanks for the interesting video, for reading my comment and maybe your answer. All the best Christian
Nice video! I own a Fender Twin Reverb. I Want to star experimenting. Could the Twin Rev. be damage if I send low bass synth to its speakers? or there is no problem for that? Thanks in advance.
Love this video. Question: I have a fender reverb deluxe that I feed my synth through for practices but I don’t really like the sound of it. The sounds feel thin and cheap. When played through my monitors, the synth has more body and presence. What amps offer a more robust and hi-fi sound? I’ve been told by a friend that the reason my fender amp sounds bad with the synth is that, with it being built of guitar, it’s not designed to carry that low-end. But there’s something about the sound quality across the frequency spectrum that feels kind of gritty in an unappealing way. Thoughts?
In Ableton there are two internal effects called AMP and Cabinet which have various settings for guitar and bass combos. For example set AMP to ‚clean‘ and set Caninet to ‚2x12‘ and you have something approximating a Twin Reverb. Icing on the cake would be to route a spring reverb plug-in between the two (for example Eventide Spring)
This is how we always recorded sinths in the 80's pre acid. First guitar amps then we sliced the speakers, then we used distortion , flangers. Then Acid came (10 years later). Im Martain Hannets ex sound engineers form the 80's Manchester. The pre acid sound was also in Indian electronic dance music at the same time th-cam.com/video/sB4RYBpwV0A/w-d-xo.html.
The way you demonstrated mic placement was great. It's funny that one of the best mic placement videos on a guitar amp was a synth video!
Glad you enjoyed it. But make sure to also check out all the videos by Steve Albini. He knows about a trillion times more about amps and mic placement than I do.
Best, Felix
@@ThomannSynthesizers RIP Steve Albini
Going through a amp is really the secret sauce. Because most analog synths are solid state, they sound terrific and technically very clean. However a synth through the guitar tubes is going to give it a lot of overtones and overall human warmth we all love. It really can make your electronic tracks feel more alive and less robotic/cold.
The Minimoog through my Bassman sounds phenomenal. The Bassman reproduces every nuance of the frequencies but the only drawback is that it lacks the thunder of modern bass amps.
Do both! To hell with money who needs that anyway!
@@SaumBodhi I don't necessarily need thunderous bass because I don't gig.
The new cheap basemen are excellent clean/pedal platform amps.
@@thomaslthomas1506 '64 6G6b.
@@Rhythmicons nice.
I made a guitar amp for my keyboardist. It became part of his lead sound, and can't live without it. :)
Brilliant, is my first thought! Second thought was ‘This makes even MORE sense for synths than it ever did for guitars’! With the purity of sound now, we are all aware of chasing a never-ending amount of computing and software sophistication, trying to warm-up/randomise/saturate etc the core synthesised waveforms…then this comes along as a technique crying out to be paired with that old CMI Fairlight I have in the cupboard (no, I really don’t).
This is surprisingly one of the most interesting and compelling adventures into sound design and processing I have seen in ages. There is the slight drawback of course as I found doing vocals late at night. Next day cleaning up the tracks I realised the washing machine had been droning on the entire time, and I never noticed. Familiarity breeds deafness. But ambient intrusions aside, I freaking love this idea.
I thought I was pretty intrepid back in the day, putting a tiny cheap Casiotone through a chorus pedal and a phaser pedal, and making it sound half-decent for the teenage band. Good work and a surprising number of commenters/contributors echo your views on this. Bad wordplay, sorry. Thanks! Keep safe, be well.
Actually I found this very relaxing - the musical ideas are very nice - I like the idea of using physical space with synth sounds
I do this in the DAW with ABL3 into an amplifier VST. That was how Roland was expecting musicians to use the TB303 in the first place. Can get some nice warm sounds.
Crazy, I never thought about that, but retrospectively it makes sense that roland would have expected people to send it through bass amps.
@@ThomannSynthesizers Actually makes a lot of sense when you think how speakers roll off and color the sound. I sometimes drop IR's on a bass track to see if the contour of the speaker helps the part fit into the track better.
OMG did the same thing a few weeks ago while wanting to add my pedals in Ableton. Also for saturation or distortion this is a very good idea too. Thank you again for the clear and beautiful inspiration!
Thanks for the video!! I'd love to watch a part two comparing the DI output with the wet output :)
Great video! I was just watching some old footage of the late producer, Bruce Swedien (Michael Jackson's Off The Wall & Thriller), talking about how he used to always pump his synths through speakers in a studio that he would then record with mics
Jan Hammer in the 70's uses Twin Reverb with the Minimoog, and in the 80's I played bass in a jazz rock band where the keyboard player runs his Micromoog thru a Twin too. But for this style, the Moog where used mainly for soloing, so the bass sounds where not used as in techno styles. For this kind of bass sounds, you need a good bass bass amp, and of course, you always do bi-amplification routing to a guitar and a bass amps, cutting bass in the guitar amp and cutting highs on the bass amp. And for the budget, you always run your synth thru a SansAmp.
@Pete Testube I was using a Gallien Krueger MB112, it is very powerful class D combo and you can handle pretty wall because its size and weight. there are many brands in the market, Fender has some Rumble models that can fit well too.
@Pete Testube may be, I never used those amps but they are reliable, try to check first, I think that the most important thing is that the speaker no less than 12 inches to have more air in movement.
geddy lee always put his synthesizers through speaker cabinets. he said without it they sounded empty and thin. a real speaker that's moving real air adds so much more space
I have been playing various synths, samplers and drum machines through different instrument amplifiers and guitar pedals for years…
That Moog would sound amazing though my bass amp
I know mine always has
It is nice to see this level of explanation for the reason behind its benefits
can you please suggest an amp or monitor that has very full bass sound for a moog sub 25 / sub phatty? I read a bass amp wouldn't pick up the high pitch stuff
@@SureFeelsGood
I have a Yorkville XM200 bass amp that also has a tweeter
Although I have a Peavey Duel Two Twelve tube guitar amp as well….
If my memory serves correctly you have more than one audio output on your synth
At the very least a headphone jack if not two direct audio outputs
I would send one output to a bass amp and a second output to a guitar amp….
This is something I have done for years and years
For example
My Yamaha DX fm synth has a great organ sound
I like to send my left output into my bass amp and my right output into my guitar amp with tremolo activated for a very realistic Leslie rotary speaker sound
I hope this makes sense
Awesome, I used to just play my synths through my tube amp all the time because I love the grit that it gives it. I find that oftentimes distortion pedals on synths can be overly grating but running them through the tube amps gives them that grit that im looking for without it being too overwhelming. I especially liked your comment about the complexity and nuance it imparts, you out words to a sensation I could never quite put my finger on or describe to others. Now I’ll have an explanation when someone asks me why I’m risking blowing out my amp to run my synth through it hahaha.
I just put my 303 through my Fender Bassbreaker 15 tube amp and it sounds incredible. The amp has a direct Line Out so no need for microphones. I bet this was a secret standard practice in 80s and 90s recording studios.
Just use a reamp box to bring the signal down to instrument level. Radial PRORMP works great for this.
Yeah, do yo7u nead this with a Synth signal? It has never been a Hi Z signal to beginn with.
Was looking for exactly this. Thank you for posting. Very calming and informative delivery!
Get an Roland JC-120 and crank the built in chorus and reverb. TRUST. Best sounding amp to run a synth through.
Sure. Roland JC are synth amp in the first place, reason why you can even run a bass with them i(f you are not after a very bassy sound).
I was thinking of picking up a Roland JC22 Jazz Chorus as a practice amp for synths and keyboards ? Hmm 🤔
how about a PM-100 or KC-200 for a moog sub 25? for playing at home for fun
Yeah I didn’t do this.
I used to run my Micromoog through my Mesa back in the day because that's honestly the amp I had available haha
I've been using an acoustic guitar amp with my cz101 recently so this was a nice video to see
Way back when, I had to play my Acetone organ through a guitar amp. It added grit and almost made it sound like an overdriven Hammond. It's really the only way that I view as providing grit. By the way, the amp was a cheap 2 12 inch speaker Lafayette amp with just tremolo (which I never used) and tone controls.
Very nice demonstration but I was waiting for a distorted amp example. I’m sure it would be cool. Thanks for your time and most thorough explanation.
I wish this would be incorporated more with synths. Barely charted territory. Build in speakers still seem like a gimmick for toys but I really hope one day it will be part of the overal design of the instruments. A synth could be an acoustic instrument.
I agree
Really enjoy these synth production videos you guys do. I have 2 amps I do this with, often utilising the effects on the Fender for more extreme amp type sounds.
Good video 👍. I find that when the other instruments are being recorded in a room, synths will blend better in the mix if they are also "moving air".
The reduced bandwidth and ambience also helps for synths with patches that have audible artifacts such as the DX7 or DX27.
I defintely agree with this. Many times I've buggered around with sounds on a synth, trying to find something that fits with everything else, and once recorded it doesn't sound right, because it just ends up so very dry. Sure one could bung effects at it, but you can end up losing things that way.
By using an amp and real "moving air" as you say, it can add such a great ambience and cure this problem in one fell swoop.
The DX7 is amazing through guitar amps and effects, something about the cold preciseness.
I plugged some synths into my guitar amp years ago but haven't tried my DX7 yet. Sadly, half of the internal sounds on my beautiful and mint condition DX7 have disappeared. The battery voltage is good but it looks like the data is corrupted. Any ideas on a fix for that?
@@fixedfocusmediaofficial No, my actual DX7 is long gone, I use DEXED a VST that loads DX7 patches, not perfect but pretty close!
@@davetbassbos I just found a way to restore the patches. I plan on doing it today.
@@fixedfocusmediaofficial Cool, I still have one old hardware synth a 90s Kurzweil K2000, it loads patches from floppy disk, lo, The DX7 was the first synth I owned and it was magic at the time. At the time everyone was predicting the death of analog, oh well, lol! cheers!
hi! currently looking for an amp for my DX7, do you have any recommendation???
Awesome video. Very interesting and helpful. I would like to work with this guy right here.
Cool. When I got my first synth, all I had was a Fender amp. Played on it for quite a bit and now actually prefer the sound to monitor speakers.
Very cool sound design fun.
You should really add a disclaimer that one could easily blow a guitar speaker with bass frequencies from synths. Others are questioning only amps for some reason, but it is the speakers that can be damaged.
He did. 2:36 mark
@@csharp57 nope. its not about level signal, it is about frequency range. while statement about hot signal is true, guitar speakers are not designed to reproduce low frequency range that much, and playing very low frequenices from a synth could blow it
Bass amps are supposedly better for synth frequency range
Просто предусилитель перегрузится.
I honestly doubt you're going to destroy them. I ran my 1000 watt power amp through 2 V30s for over 100 shows with synths/synth bass at full volume and my speakers are fine.
I was literally shaking the stage.
Amazing! Now all I need is a nice Fender amp and Moog synth 😢
Sehr gut und nett video. Ich habe ein Twin Reverb kürzlich gekauft. Es war aus diesem Grund. Roland JCs sind auch gut für synths.
Very cool! I love this idea. Hope to get a chance to try it out.
Loved this vid ❤
Nice vid! I have to amp my synths for what I do. I compose for TV and film. If I just DI, A & R or music library editors & managers always say, "You need more up-to-date plugins". And they're not even plugins. If I amp and mic, they always accept the sound of my track pitches
Interesting. So they naturally find the mic'd sound to be more authentic and pleasing
@@eleven9286 Yep. pushing air seems to be the thing
@@elyot4010 definitely going to be recording my synths this way now. Ive just been getting started.
Legit planned to test this out today for the past week
I tried guitar amps next to the set-up I use which is a PA with EV speakers. That sounds great but the vocals struggled to get through so I added a subwoofer.
Habe dich grade entdeckt und finde dein Video MEGA! Keep on
I love putting analog monosynths through tube amps and distortion/fuzz!
Thanks for inspiring me to use IRs! 😄
Mixing synths is so hard because it doesn’t exist in a space. It’s too pure
While I agree to an extent the blank slate gives you infinite possibilities. Also they usually cut through the mix nicely
A touch of pre-delay can save the day.
thats why your job as a sound designer is to design the room too! just as important as the initial sound is the space you create for it :) thats the magic of synthesis
Gary Numan did this on The Pleasure Principle
I run everything through my practice amp because pedals but also I just think its more convenient
I record sometimes my modular drummaschine/synth Monster into my huges&kettner amp and the built in spring reverb sounds amazing!
Very good Results..
Grüße aus Wien 🤟🇦🇹
Euer Herr Fuchs
I literally have been doing this for a couple years after I jokingly plugged a microphone directly into my amp input and started singing while messing around with the digital effects like tremolo and shit haha
You could try connecting the synth to the 'low inputs' (input 2) of the amp
That’s all I ever use with my portables. Guitar amps, though I much prefer solid state. The new Hiwatt Crunch 150 combo 1x12 sounds amazing, plus it has an 1/8” preamp bypass, and a spring reverb.
Cool idea!!
Great stuff! Thanks for sharing this worth info!
I might do this because I'm having a rough time getting FL studio to record my Microfreak.
thomann couldn't get you a second mic stand for that royer mic?
Nice playing and sounds dude
sick! great vid man!
I would be curious about your opinion on the Korg OpSix Guitar Amp effects. To my amateur ears, they sound absolutely wonderful on just about any patch and add so much character and liveliness to it.
I was honestly blown away by the many different models of amp you can select from as well.
the current generation of guitar amp modeling effects is excellent. it has really come a long way from even just 5 years ago.
Nice track for the demo, you should release it!
As always an excellent explanation Felix. Much appreciated. Loving you little riffs as well. I wonder what you make of software emulations like NI Guitar Rig? I also watched a video interview of Pole recently (dub techno / electronica legend!) where he explained that he places his mics behind the amp for the optimal dub bass. I suppose it's one of the downsides of software emulations that you cannot use it wrong intentionally :) Anyway, thanks for the tips!
Great video but just one doubt... it means that I can play my synth through my guitar amp ??.. I'd not like to spoil my amp or synth..
As I said in the video, take care of the volume of the line level signal. Too high volumes will damage any speaker. If you wanne be sure use a reamp box to convert it to an instrument level signal. Regarding low frequencies make sure to check the specifications of your amp. The Twin Reverb for example can handle a very wide range of frequencies. Your mileage may vary.
Great vid! I know Battles did this on at least one or two of their albums from an Ableton vid I watched with them. It certainly creates a timbre that is way different than going direct.
It always will. It's a completely different routing that uses that unsterile space that is otherwise denied to you when you run it all just through wires.
This was quite normal back in 70's and 80's when technology was where it was.
I ran my keyboard back then lime that because it simply could not be done the other way with the equipment we had. When you then fed the mic signal to the PA system, the results were quite shocking.
Using this technique on modern equipment is more labor intensive but it's also much more fun - if your neighbors are not right next to your house.
I almost exclusively never play through monitors anymore because my neighbor's are very annoyed by my "stuff".
synth players also use guitar pedals like fuzz or a wah
The problem I have with recording synths with a amp is I don't have the extra money for room treatment and bass traps
This is genius, but any long term guitar players also know.. everything sounds more amazing through tubes to begin with. Personally I don't have the money, but have always wanted tube preamps for dj gigs and studio production. Apparently a cheap one can be made with some 6L6s. (Would love to see any future videos demo-ing any thing like this please!) Have a buddy who can do this for me. It's also worth mentioning that a lot of the boutique guitar amps that are very pricey are made from the fender bassman circuit. Add a spring reverb and you have a very rich sound. Tubes create submarmonics which really fatten up the sound. This can be done with very high quality mosfets as well. It's why a lot of the recordings from the 60s and 70s sound so rich. Lenny kravitz for example...as soon as he had the money from his first album made an entire studio with only tube gear.. including the mixers. Thanks for this video!!!
reason why i´m studying sound engineer
Great video thanks!
I also have a Casio digital piano that has a place for a thumb drive would that be easier.
That’s how Depeche Mode recorded their debut ‘Speak & Spell’.
A really good example Of synthesizers being miked up in acoustic spaces Is the Depeche Mode construction time again album Too many of the new recordings Sound sterile
Jan Hammer played through guitar amps a lot when he recorded music for Miami Vice.
great technique
I imagine if we use synths apps from ipad it's the same concept or we must considerer other details?
Great video!
I am a guitar player and found this very informative.
Many tube/valve amps have an inherent hissing sound and I've had trouble with this in the past...any hints on how to deal with tube/valve amplifier hissing when recording with microphones? Your sound is very clear and I didn't pick up on much hiss at all.
Thanks!
I have an oldish amp with three inputs: Mic, Low and High. I wouldn’t know how to choose for doing what you did.
Tubeie valveie goodness is for everybody!!! Mmm at7’s
kind of what ben harper's will to live was used ? nice
I used to do that, but some people told me at the time that some frequencies of synths can cause damages on amp. Maybe it's not true, don't really know.
Lorn is the god of this
Awesome video! How about drum machines going through an amp? Same principle???
Could I hook my marshall cabinet with my grandmother Moog?
I have a question, Felix (or anyone). Generally speaking, how loud do you need the amp to be? I've been wanting to try this technique for a while, but I live in an apartment building with close neighbours who I don't want to annoy. Do you need to have the sound cranked up or will this technique work well at more modest volumes?
It will work with modest volumes
Crank your preamp to compensate for volume
You would obviously want to make sure you set it all up so weren't running the signal in the red on your DAW.
You could use amp sims. Or get youself a two notes torpedo and record amp silently.
any volume will do but if you want to be more complex... most guitar amps, but definitely all valve/tube amps, are designed to have a "sweet spot" where there is a characteristic breakup at a certain volume that many people find to be pleasing. it's likely that your amp will sound its best around this volume which is why almost all studios have small tube amps in them and almost all stages have large tube amps on them. note that this principle works the exact same for studio grade preamplifiers with transistors or valves (telefunken v72 or neve 1073 for example) where often producers like to run the signal in at a specific volume that is around the sweet spot. plugins are modelled on these principles though so dont feel like you have to spend wild money to get similar effects
Isobox.
This is an amazing video. Can anyone recommend any starter synthesizers? I have experience with Sylenth and Serum but I would love to get into the hardware synth space. Thank you Thomann for the video
Behringer analog synths are great. I have the neutron and it makes amazing leads and really deep basses. It's a tricky mistress tho
If you mean analog and polyphonic, try Korg Minilogue or Prologue
Arturia Microfreak, Korg Volca series, Pocket Operators
yeah, but am I stupid? how can you monitor the output without cans on without feedback?
This would work for home studio recording where volumes don't have to be so loud.
well known technique since day one:), but say bye bye to the low end using guitar amps... some synthesizers like whole freq range, I wouldn't plug my model D into the guitar amp, probably bass amp can give nice growl, but entire freq range equipment allows you to hera how the synthesizer sounds in 'real' :). I like to send drums through amps though, cool effect.
mate, I'm 50yo, I tried it in 90s first time:)
Minimoog + Bassman is very nice.
better results if you convert the signal to high impedance before going into the amp.
I read up on it in advance and reamp boxes can be a nice improvement but aren‘t necessarily required. I didn‘t have any issues with signal to noise ratio etc. But yes, I think with a reamp box you‘re gonna be on the safe side and run into less problems in the long run. Best, Felix
@@ThomannSynthesizers you are correct it's not required to pass the signal as you've demonstrated with these amps, but it is more about optimizing the signal transfer, ensuring all the harmonics, tonal quality from the source get through properly to the speaker, allowing the amp's circuit to function, sound, colour the signal as intended. Not just about the SNR. This difference is more apparent on the lower end of the frequency spectrum.
maybe it can be said with mis-matched impedance It's like you put a leather glove on the microphone, sure it's gonna work but...
To expand on the technique which also benefits from having the fuller signal the reamp box gives is mixing one or more reamped signals, in parallel with the original recording in the DAW.
@@Rareos I mean sure you can agonize over the tiny details but the differences are fractional and the introduction of more gear makes things less attainable for amateurs.
@@Claidheambmor Well it's not always fractional.. depends on the amp, what speakers are in the cab, is the signal a synth, maybe a modular synth which is much hotter. Either way it's not agonizing for even an amateur to be aware of the few types of signals they are working with, and helpful for their entire journey. Also you can do the same thing with any cheap buffered stomp box in bypass, which anyone with a guitar amp and a synth probably already owns.
It’s really nitty-gritty. I run my Taurus pedals through the front of my bass amp and I don’t notice any real difference.
Everything sounds better with a little overdrive.
Do you plug the synthesizer in the amp with a aux in cable ?
It's really hard to mix that signal with other parts of a song bc it sounds so different. Furthermore the guitar amp filters out bass frequencies and takes away power from the synth signal. If you can though overdriving the tubes in the amp and recording it through a line out would be great.
You mean like using for example the TwoNotes Captor X?
do the lower frequencies that the synths can produce not run the risk of damaging the amp itself?
It depends on the amp. The twin reverb can handle them easily, but always be careful with volumes and maybe look it up for your own amp in advance to avoid unnecessary risk.
Hi, that a very interesting approach and surely very sonically contributive due to the different types of microphones and amps used. Being quite new in the synth world, I'm wondering which type of cable do you use to make the connection between the synth and the guitar amp a studio line cable or a guitar cable ? In addition when the guitar amp has 2 types of input Low Z and Hi Z which one has to be selected . Thanks for the interesting video, for reading my comment and maybe your answer. All the best Christian
Yes it’s just a guitar cable Aka a 1/4 in instrument cable.
@@patgriffin542 Thanks so much, look forward to try. stay safe and Happy NewYear
Nice video!
I own a Fender Twin Reverb. I Want to star experimenting. Could the Twin Rev. be damage if I send low bass synth to its speakers? or there is no problem for that?
Thanks in advance.
2:15 or live performance ! ;p
Did not know there was a difference
Bernie Worrell used Gallien Krueger amps...
That's what Jan Hammer did with Minimoog when playing solo.
Love this video. Question: I have a fender reverb deluxe that I feed my synth through for practices but I don’t really like the sound of it. The sounds feel thin and cheap. When played through my monitors, the synth has more body and presence.
What amps offer a more robust and hi-fi sound? I’ve been told by a friend that the reason my fender amp sounds bad with the synth is that, with it being built of guitar, it’s not designed to carry that low-end. But there’s something about the sound quality across the frequency spectrum that feels kind of gritty in an unappealing way. Thoughts?
I would like to do this in the DAW, I'm syre its possible!
In Ableton there are two internal effects called AMP and Cabinet which have various settings for guitar and bass combos.
For example set AMP to ‚clean‘ and set Caninet to ‚2x12‘ and you have something approximating a Twin Reverb. Icing on the cake would be to route a spring reverb plug-in between the two (for example Eventide Spring)
KB300 pretty good amp tho
should you use an instrument cable or a TRS?
This is how we always recorded sinths in the 80's pre acid. First guitar amps then we sliced the speakers, then we used distortion , flangers. Then Acid came (10 years later). Im Martain Hannets ex sound engineers form the 80's Manchester. The pre acid sound was also in Indian electronic dance music at the same time th-cam.com/video/sB4RYBpwV0A/w-d-xo.html.
What do you think about recording synths through bass amps?
The Royer is sooo expensive, an industry standard way of doing things but it’s double the price of the MOOG synth 😅