Northern EXPLAINED - A Rail Operator Summary
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ค. 2024
- A brief summary of who Northern are, where they go, what they operate and any future developments. More of a information pack - this forms part of the Rail Operator Series I'm working on
Correct as of January 2023.
0:00 Intro
1:06 Timetabled Routes
9:07 Ticket Costs
9:18 Depots
9:40 Operator History & Franchise
10:29 Trains Operated
11:00 Future Developments
Twitter: ashley_rabot
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I think you should leave your timetabled route diagrams as pdfs in this series, they're quite helpful especially for an operator this complex
I have been toying with the idea. I shall put them online at some point! Link will be on descriptions and my twitter somewhere when I have a chance to do so
@@ashleyrabot maybe just do it for your patreon subscribers - no reason why you should give away all your hard work for free !
@@fToo what about us who can’t afford to pay?
@@Sophiebryson510 cheap freebie wanting oxygen waster
A minor correction on the Hadfield line ... at the end of the route, there's a triangle between Dinting, Hadfield and Glossop. For most of the day, trains run Manchester - Dinting - Glossop - Hadfield - Glossop - Dinting - Manchester, but the last train runs from Dinting direct to Hadfield and then to Glossop ... so Glossop does get a half-hourly service throughout the day. But well done for making sense of a very, very messy network!
The line between Manchester and Sheffield through the peak district is one beautiful route
This definitely deserves to be the popular upload from this channel. Very impressive.
I can't express just how underrated your content is. The fact that you have uploaded this one video in a long time, means that you put a lot of effort into it and tried to give as much detail as possible. I appreciate these videos. Could you do Southern maybe?
Thank you very much! Southern is on the table, but South Eastern will be next!
@@ashleyrabot southeastern is also a good one, can't wait to see it!
Only found your content in the last year or so, absolutely love your work, well presented and easy to understand, you deserve a lot more.subs and views than what you currently have...keep up the good work pal
Thank you very much! Hopefully plenty more to come
Another interesting fact is that they share tracks with the Tyne and Wear metro at various points in the Newcastle/Sunderland area. Great Vid 👍👍
you really need to do more of these , very useful
Nicely done, easy to understand and very informative!
When they aren't on strike, cancelled due to driver shortages, cancelled due to overhead wire damage, cancelled due to flooding, cancelled due to staff roster problems....
Nice vid, Subscribed!😊
Good video, very comprehensive.
Just a minor correction however on the company formation.
Northern is made up of two former franchises, Regional railways North West and North East Regional railways.
The North West was operated by North Western trains after privatisation and the North East was MTL (Merseyside transport limited). Arriva then bought MTL and therefore became the operator of the North East. North West became First North Western. Then both franchises were merged to form the Northern franchise.
Missed the parliamentary train from Stockport to Stalyvegas. Also some Wigan to Liverpool go via Newton le willows.
I believe that the limited Newton Le willows run is now used by Transpennine’s Liverpool to Glasgow services, but I could be wrong.
@@kieranstravels Liverpool to Glasgow go via St Helens Central normally.
@@AmandaOutThere Two of the three services go via St Helens, and the third is via Newton-Le-Willows
Great Video, but from Crewe a few northern trains go through Manchester all the way to Liverpool Lime Street, and the one train on the line that stops at Alderley Edge also goes to Liverpool Lime Street
Haha, having heard the pronunciation of some stations on some of your other videos like Salisbury you have got Colne spot on!
There's a sale on now ... I've just booked 3 mini-trips from Newcastle (Prudhoe, Hexham and Hartlepool) for February and March and only paid a total of £9 .. you can't beat that !
Nice video bro. You need to do Cross Country Trains, and also Transpennine Express... Some proper long journeys on those 👍🏼
York to Blackpool North uses Calder Valley Line Leeds City to Hebden Bridge via Halifax and Bradford Interchange. Darlington to Saltburn is Tees Valley Line. Calder Valley Line on the Northern Rail site is 35-37 on timetables. Class 170 is part of Turbostar trains
Northern still provides some good train services in Yorkshire, Greater Manchester, Merseyside, Lancashire, Cheshire, County Durham, Cumbria, Tyne & Wear and Northumberland. And they still do have good existing trains.
Great video mate! I'm a timetable planner at Northern. You forgot the Huddersfield - Castleford via Wakefield Kirkgate which has recently started again in the December timetable. Also, there isn't a Deansgate to Manchester Airport
So close yet so far! Thanks for watching
Nice video! By the way at 10:38, Northern have Bombardier Turbostars, not Electrostars. Just thought I may point this out. Great video nonetheless :)
It must take a lot of time to make sure that your timetabled route diagrams all align with eachother, but yet you can post videos at a faster rate than I'd expect for this quality
Fantastic Diagram. Just two minor points about the Colne service. Although timetabled as two seperate services Colne-Preston and Preston-Ormskirk they are effectively one service using the same rolling stock. And on Sundays the (Ormskirk)-Preston-Colne service becomes a Blackpool South-Preston-Colne service
Useful to know, thanks Paul!
Great video. Would love to see one for GWR at some point
Go ahead and check the channel out. There's one on GWR!
The fast train from Man to Sheff early and late as you say operated by East Midlands actually stops at Chinley
Cleethorpes to Sheffield is one of the parliament services Northern run, another is Stockport to Guide Bridge.
The thing that always confuses me
Half the Barrow-Lancaster trains continue to Manchester, half don't... and then there's an hourly service from Deansgate to the airport. Surely that could become an hourly service from Barrow through to the airport, adding extra links for Barrow, Lancaster, Preston, and Wigan to Manchester and Manchester Airport?
*seeing my commute* WOW!!!
One thing you missed was the fast hourly calder valley line service between Leeds and Manchester Victoria.
What about Liverpool to Manchester airport via Manchester?
And the regular service to Glossop, not just an extra one on the hadfield line?
What about LNER or London North Eastern Railway or southern Mersyrail EMR or East Midlands Railway
theire is also a service from blackpool north to Hazel Grove which is around every hour and quicker than the Blackpool north to liverpool lime street which only stops at poulton-le-fylde preston and bolton then onto MAN Ox MAN pic
I would love to see the cross country network next :)
4:58 whoo my local line
Actually, what about the Fenton flyer from Stockport to staybridge ?
I have been really enjoying this video series and the way you have been explaining the service frequencies for the different routes is a really great idea and for Northern must have taken ages. But based on what I had been reading on Real Time Trains some of the service frequencies you had listed in your map disagree with what I had read so I was wondering what the source was you had used for your video. As a couple of things I had noticed included that I had read that the Southport line had a frequency of 2tph compared to the 1tph you had listed. Also I had read that the line through Barnsley had 2tph forming a stopping service from Barnsley to Sheffield not the 3tph you had said.
I also noticed a couple of errors with the rolling stock Northern used as Class 170s are Turbostars not Electrostars and I was pretty sure that the Class 323s were built but Hunslet TPL Leeds not Holec but I might be wrong.
I've had a look at the current timetables and FOI's from Northern themselves. I'm sure some will be misaligned as it is complex, but to clarify, the summation is predominantly for off-peak Week day services only with a few exceptions!
Minor nitpick, 170s are turbostars ;)
what did you use to creat your map, its great
That map is huge
However you did forget the Huddersfield to Castleford service unless it got withdrawn but I still love the map
It literally just started back up last week!!
Oh that's good then :D
And now it makes total sense why some people think class 175s should go to Northern. Some of those routes are surprisingly long.
You missed out that there is a Depot in Wigan and Blackburn too
Can do do the video about the greateranglia network
Can we get a Manchester Metrolink video similar to your West Midlands Metro video? 👀
This would be good - and even better if it didn't follow the skewed perspective of the Metrolink Map that ignores the missing South East Quarter that Metrolink doesn't serve.
Just a correction on a station name, Wigan Wallgate not Wellgate
Those lines should have numbers or something. Just to make stuff more clear.
If it still runs Northern use to run a Sunday only Carlisle to Nottingham service which must have been their longest.They are mainly northern England with penetration into the north Midlands places like Stoke, Nottingham, Scunthorpe,etc..Their services into Scotland seem to have stopped now but until fairly recently some went to Dumfries and some Scot Rail ones to Newcastle a strange set up as the trains were Scot Rail but maned by Northern staff on the English leg!
There still is the Carlisle to Nottingham train on Sunday at a whopping 4 hours and 40 minutes
I’d love to see a greater anglia one next
all the train to hadfield stop at glosop, on the way to Hadfield they stop at Glosop and then they do the same on the way back
How about doing Scotrail next?
Can you do southeastern next?
Can you do re-nationalisation next?
The 170s are Turbostars. Turbo: diesel, Electro: electric.
Can you do swr next
theres a depot in blackburn
Also I noticed that Scunthorpe was spelt wrong lol it's not Scunthrope it's Scunthorpe
This network route map compared with the c2c.
😂
You pronounced ormskrik Kirkby and what is northerns hup
Cross County or emr next please
EMR next please, another commuter network?
Great video Ashley. You forgot to put Blackpool North to Hazel Grove and Liverpool Lime Street to Warrington Bank Quay. Is 170 turbostars not electrostars. Can you do LNER explained a rail operator summary
Does Blackpool North have a random Hazel Grove now its 2tph to the Airport in the new timetable? Certainly Lime Street - Bank Quay is merely a once a day and only from Bank Quay rather than to it and so barely worth talking about!
There was some stuff that wasn't quiet right in that pretty decent, but hard to do, description of services, but the two you mention are really minor omissions.
@@sihollett Hazel Grove, and Stockport and the rest of the south Manchester area have been unfairly punished with the Dec 22 timetable changes. All services from the Buxton line, and Hazel Grove now terminate at Piccadilly. Passengers who have bought in advance season tickets for a service that they thought would provide through trains from Hazel grove and lines along that route to Oxford Road, Deansgate, Salford Crescent and beyond now have to change same level at Stockport, or from internal platforms at piccadilly to 13/14 via different levels. Not really sure where the demand for through services to Piccadilly all going to the airport is coming from.
Did Arriva have the contract for all of these routes
It did, right up to 2022 when the Department for Transport took over
@@ashleyrabot so they had had the contract for all of that and never invested any money on trains they just bled it dry. The train to Blackpool was really old. Now they're using modern trains with enough carriages to get a seat.
Once your done Whith these please do former operators
*you're
*with
@@Inkyminkyzizwoz i was half asleep at the time i wrote that
Your summation of services on the Furness Line is wrong. There are trains most hours from Barrow to Manchester Airport. IN ADDITION there are half-hourly services to Lancaster at peak times.
When the d@mn things run that is...
Hourly from Stockport to Stalybridge!?! In our dreams! Of course, you meant Southport... Nice video though :)
Yeah I thought that
Northern has the curious distinction of actually getting worse under public ownership. Take the recent strikes which ran for two days, Northern managed to not run a single train in or out of Hull or the day after each strike period despite all their staff being at work, units being available and the lines being open. So, 4 strikes days in a week meant no Northern trains in East Yorkshire for 6 days. Absolute shambles! It’s like they have just given up even trying to provide a service.
It was the same on the lines near me in Cumbria.
There is areas that are completely wrong, not half hourly but hourly and then the amount of names that have been said massively wrong
You forgot the class 153 and the class 323
You pronounced colne right
You got Colne fine, but heysham is pronounced heeeeeysham, if that makes sense
Northern Trains do not own the trains they operate - they Lease from from Rolling Stock Companies (ROSCO) - mostly Porterbrook & Angel Trains, though the new CAF stock is leased from Eversholt.
CONNECT
Comprehensive? - blimey, it looks a right mess - worse than south London! I know that the argument for all the complications is that people prefer to have a choice of a few direct trains to different destinations, but I wonder if the 'people' who say that are in fact only the relatively small number who regularly use the trains and understand the ones they use? I mean - you couldn't use that map in the same way that - for a hundred years - huge numbers of passengers have used the London underground, with just the map, and not needing a timetable - confident that though, for many of the journey opportunities the network offers, changing trains will be needed, those changes will be well signed, and there are trains every few minutes on all lines. It does strike me that all the complications of the Northern service patterns must be daunting not only to passengers, but also to staff - drivers, ticket sellers, and other staff who may be asked how the services 'work'.
Could there be a simpler model, easier for - e.g. - staff rotas, and easier for travellers to comprehend? Perhaps a network of long distance services connecting the cities and main towns, with shorter local stopping trains plugged into it, like the popular Swiss taktfahrplan? But frequencies, and wayfinding signage, would have to be good, so that connections could be reliable.
Thanks for this by the way - must have taken hours to put together!
The only way to make a taktfahrplan service work would require colossal levels of investment - but it wouldn't be easy to achieve.
Several major stations are served by lots of routes - not just Northern but also TransPennine and intercity services, places like Leeds, York, Doncaster, Sheffield, Manchester, Liverpool, Preston - that don't have the capacity to accommodate the number of trains arriving and departing within a few minutes to make it work.
@@stevieinselby Well, a full-scale taktfahrplan would be ideal (and popular, judging by the Swiss scheme), and I think the benefits would add up to more than the cost; Jonathan Tyler came up with a workable taktfahrplan for the GN mainline plus its feeder branches. But I feel sure the current messy arrangements could be improved on by simplification, though I expect more money (maybe in line with what London & SE England get, per person) would help. The map itself would be a lot more useful if the frequency of trains was indicated, maybe by colour or thickness of line, or by a figure of trains-per-hour beside each section. Is there really a benefit in having TPE as a different company? It will be interesting to see what the joint effort by the northern mayors comes up with.
What a mess, lots of inefficiency there. Need to establish rail grids that cover the north.
Until they stop striking they don't even exist. I was a massive fan of the railways until Jan 2022.
We also like to call it Northern Fail
First
The 3 mersey rail stations names where butchered, good try but honestly great video a great imforatable video we all needed.
Northern Rail, one of the worst train lines in all of Britain.
It's a pitty they are always on strike or cancelled. Awful company and awful service.
What a colossal mess…..
Good videos and great graphics, but boy your pronunciations are terrible! It's like you don't look at the actual letters being used in the name. We all know that 'oo' makes n oooooo sound yeah? Sp why would you pronounce "Goole" as 'Goal'? Also, it's Bishop Auckland not BishopS Auckland. Also when referring to the routes that leave Southport as shown on your map, you said Stockport. (You also said Stockport for the errr Stockport youtes). The numbers you say on the narration often mismatch with the numbers on the graphics. The format is excellent but you just need to take a little more care with the content. And also look a little more carefully at the place names you're attempting to pronounce.
Awful company, they’re unresponsive and the trains they run through NE are horrendous but just a slightly better version of horrendous pre 2020
Absolutely useless service the last people who deserve a pay rise
Northern sucks, but the people who work there are good - lack of staff due to lack of pay is literally why they can't provide a good service
Every Hadfield stops at Glossop twice not just the last train of the day.