They have it! Check out 'Fake or Fortune'. Ostensibly, it's about authenticating 'lost' paintings, but they do a lot of figuring out who is in each painting.
Ooo, picture curator! I used to be a curator at the National Portrait Gallery in Washington, DC. So I appreciate the mysteries and stories of portraits! Thank you so much for sharing!
I love how the royal society has generally speaking very well documented histories. I just adore seeing the past and peoples thoughts and words. It makes me feel so connected to the past and those people. It transforms historical figures into real people you can imagine having a conversation with.
Wow, that shield in the middle of the coat of arms is the shield of my home city in Germany, Halle(Saale). It's a salt city and the shield with the 2 stars and the crescent represents in vertical order from the bottom the fire, the salt pan and the salt crystals in the pan.
Oooo, maybe the materials in the signature will fluoresce under ultraviolet light. I could 'swing by' with my longwave and shortwave UV flashlights, and we could do a quick test!
The idea of narrowing a portrait down to a specific decade just by the clothing sounds far-fetched, but now think of the phrase "1980s fashion." You see it now, don't you?
Yeah, but good luck distinguishing 1960s from 1970s, or 1990s from 2000s. Also, I thought we had agreed, as a species, to pretend 1980s fashion had never happened.
off the top of my head, carbon dating is simply not precise enough to narrow down by decade, much less year... tho there may be some complicated mix of other radioactive elements that could increase precision?
They glossed over the question of why they thought (or how they knew?) that they were wedding portraits. If they don't even know which wedding doesn't it cast some doubt?
Wonder if you could do a bit of ancestry on these families and track the widow's peak and detached earlobes on children with the different wives. Wouldn't be definitive, but could give a probability.
Counting all main expenses are just artist time, I would guess more or less the equivalent in XIII century money as how it would cost today. Today, big portraits by qualified artists can coust around 10k - 20k , depending on the prestige of the painter. THe smaller ones maybe half of that...
I couldn't find any data for the early 1700s, but around 1775 a portrait of this size by one of the top painters in England would have cost you 30 to 50 guineas. That would be the equivalent of 2700 to 4500 pounds today.
It's amazing how you could narrow down to the decades based on the fashion trends from centuries ago.
Art historians are legit-cool people!
They need to get some of the TH-cam costubers on this. Like Bernadette Banner and Abby Cox et al
I hope that I someday get to drop the knowledge "Yeah, I think this is probably from the 1650s, you can tell from the bright colors."
lets hope they weren't retro fans or second hand enthusiasts. like those late 90ies early 00s becoming a thing again nowadays...
This is fascinating! I could watch a whole documentary of someone explaining how they figure out things like this
They have it! Check out 'Fake or Fortune'. Ostensibly, it's about authenticating 'lost' paintings, but they do a lot of figuring out who is in each painting.
Watch anything by Bendor Grosvenor
Ooo, picture curator! I used to be a curator at the National Portrait Gallery in Washington, DC. So I appreciate the mysteries and stories of portraits! Thank you so much for sharing!
Loved the content of this episode!! The investigative thinking process was very interesting to hear!
I love how the royal society has generally speaking very well documented histories. I just adore seeing the past and peoples thoughts and words.
It makes me feel so connected to the past and those people. It transforms historical figures into real people you can imagine having a conversation with.
I'm extremely enthralled by the idea of an unknown portrait. It could almost be the plot of a novel, finding whose secrets lie in this.
Sounds like there needs to be a RS, Objectivity and Fake or Fortune crossover.
Yes!! Or we need to send up the Bendor Grosvenor Bat Signal!
Wow, that shield in the middle of the coat of arms is the shield of my home city in Germany, Halle(Saale). It's a salt city and the shield with the 2 stars and the crescent represents in vertical order from the bottom the fire, the salt pan and the salt crystals in the pan.
Fascinating
Her voice is incredibly calming
She could have her own portrait analysis channel, and I'd watch the heck out of it
That was just great. 11 straight minutes of brain candy.
This would be fun as hell.
Lovely video
extremely cool
That’s a mystery for Baumgartner!
ayo brady looks fitter than ever
Sure does
Oooo, maybe the materials in the signature will fluoresce under ultraviolet light. I could 'swing by' with my longwave and shortwave UV flashlights, and we could do a quick test!
The idea of narrowing a portrait down to a specific decade just by the clothing sounds far-fetched, but now think of the phrase "1980s fashion." You see it now, don't you?
yep what but if you see dress in 80's fashion in 2023, not saying i do, not saying i don't
Yeah, but good luck distinguishing 1960s from 1970s, or 1990s from 2000s. Also, I thought we had agreed, as a species, to pretend 1980s fashion had never happened.
This is so cool
I wonder if it would help much to radiocarbon date the canvases?
off the top of my head, carbon dating is simply not precise enough to narrow down by decade, much less year... tho there may be some complicated mix of other radioactive elements that could increase precision?
Cyril is basically Boris by the sounds of it.
They glossed over the question of why they thought (or how they knew?) that they were wedding portraits. If they don't even know which wedding doesn't it cast some doubt?
Wonder if you could do a bit of ancestry on these families and track the widow's peak and detached earlobes on children with the different wives. Wouldn't be definitive, but could give a probability.
what if his coat of arms refers to his first wife and a statue of her is the one you see in the background. Please follow-up when she figures it out?
Excuse me. Which is Wyche?
I love that identifying the portrait is asking the question "Which Wyche?"
Good episode this laddies voice was especially soothing 🤤🤤🤤🤤
This was fascinating, but I was distracted by a meta-mystery: Ellen’s accent. Irish + …something?
how much would it cost back then to comission painter to do these?
Counting all main expenses are just artist time, I would guess more or less the equivalent in XIII century money as how it would cost today. Today, big portraits by qualified artists can coust around 10k - 20k , depending on the prestige of the painter. THe smaller ones maybe half of that...
I couldn't find any data for the early 1700s, but around 1775 a portrait of this size by one of the top painters in England would have cost you 30 to 50 guineas. That would be the equivalent of 2700 to 4500 pounds today.
@@RFC-3514 thanks, not that much actually
Ellen seems nice
Her accent is fascinating: I'm thinking very upper class Scottish or extremely upper-class Anglo Irish from around Dublin.
Is there not a record of children? And to whom those children belong?
I thought both paintings were of the same woman. They look very much alike.
Wow real life mysteries a la daVinci code but far more interesting
Minor point but you should swap Cyril with his wife so that they face each other
Geez, you really spoiled the mystery of that last portrait by putting Einstein's name on the caption. We wouldn't have known who it was otherwise.