Can't wait to see the HSU RESEARCH VTF-TN1 Subwoofer get tested. On the other side I would have liked to have scene the Rythmik G25HP Direct Servo subwoofer.
I have had 2 Monolith V1 15" subs for 4 years now and a 1-year old 16", they've all been flawless performers and tremendous value. I bought them based on these reviews 👍 Thanks for all the hard work James, contact me if you ever need help moving those 200 pound Kaiju subs 😂
@bkrhino1 Actually, this is pretty much an apples to apples comparison. Both subs are 15" - 16" woofers. Regardless of whether the PB16 is 7 or 10 years old, Svs is still selling it as their flagship. They need to update the sub or continue getting outperformed by lower costing subwoofers. Market competition is what makes manufacturers improve their products or go out of business. For most consumers, performance at a lower cost trumps build quality.
@@troystevens9506 - With that logic, a 2017 Corvette should be compared to a 2024. Based on SVS’s introduction of the Evolution Series at a significant price point, really do not care about the PB16 being outperformed as they made their money back. Technology counts.
I saved for 2 years to get the SVS PB16 Ultra and it’s worth every single penny. The problem is is now my other speakers sound like crap. This sub goes insanely low and pulls it off with zero effort. I really really wanted to keep it but it’s just too much of a sub. My townhouse is a decent size and we live on an end unit so I don’t have neighbors that would bitch if I cranked that thing up. I ended up replacing the Ultra with their PB2000 and it’s the perfect size for the space we have. Anything bigger and it would be too much. I love that I have access to the subwoofers settings via the app. For a $1,099 purchase price as opposed to the almost $3,000 purchase price for the Mac Daddy sub I was able to get a great subwoofer that delivers the sound I sought after and save hundreds to be put towards something else. I still have to adjust our china in our cabinet because that sub will rattle those dishes out of place and they’re a priceless family heirloom. All of the subs featured in this video are excellent for high end home theater setups but for me I just don’t have that kind of money to toss $20K into a system. I’ve tried SVS’s high end and mid priced equipment and the subwoofer I settled on is perfect for my wife and I.
Had the PB16 as well but ended up returning it and grabbing the Monolith 15 and built 2 DIY 18" Ultimax. Overall pleased with these subs and it outperforms the single pb16, of course and in the process ended up saving a couple hundred $$.
Outstanding review. I have the HSU Research VTF-3 MK5, which is an incredible extreme rated sub for $900 back in 2015. Looking forward to the HSU Research TN1 review, Love the burst test average vs each sub comparison... so handy
Love this! Please do one for sealed 15’s please Very much interested in the new HSU TN1 🎉 can’t wait for that review. Appreciate all you and the crew do😊
Thanks for the wonderful comparison guys, James is absolutely peerless & the king of subwoofer reviews, a couple of small errors to note is that the SVS PB16-Ultra's amplification is rated at 1500W RMS not 1600W & Monolith 13 THX Ultra is rated at 2000W RMS not 1800W ;)
Great video, as always! 👍 Regarding the Tone Winner D6000, it appears they do all their warranty support through one company. I brought this point up on another channel, and the reviewer was none to happy with me to say the least. He even bashed me in a segment of one of his Tone Winner videos. 😲 I've never spoken ill about Tone Winner subwoofer performance, as I've never heard one. All I merely was pointing out was the value of other manufacturers who offer manufacturer backed warranty service, not putting the burden on one sole distributor. Nice to know we have unbiased reviewers out here still. Keep up the good work! 👍
Great sub showdown, just wish you'd have included the Monoprice 16" as well. It's performance is second to none and it's much cheaper than the PB16Ultra.
I bought two Monolith 16's and was not happy! Long story short, they were buggy; I returned them. Monoprice is hiding my review and will not let me post again! My heart dropped after that, knowing now that Monoprice manipulates their review scores.
I was on board at first, but I heard lots of bad things about that company’s customer service and the amplifier section not holding up. I think I’m gonna try the HSU VTF TN1
@@woohunter1 Two months ago I bought two Starke SW15 subs (sealed) for $500ea, new from the manufacturer. They go on sale all the time. I'm quite pleased w them! They are nowhere near "the powerhouse" subs I wanted like the JTR Captivators, you know, 120db @ 10hz levels, but these SW15'S should satisfy me until I make a sub purchase of that level (though that price looks to be in my dreams). I recommend giving the SW15 some attention on your research journey.
You should test smaller ”new rp” Klipsches too. Just got the rp1400sw and it performs on par or bests my prior SVS PC13 ultra. Also had PB3000 before but it cannot compete under 20hz
I've got a pair of SVS SB-1000 and they are complete failure imho. I managed to set dem flat to 20hz but max listening spl is 65dB with peaks to 80dB. Anything above that is too much distorted for my taste. So overpriced and overhyped brand.
Yes sir I 100% agree my friend SVS is a good sub maker but I do believe all there subs or a bit over priced but don't get me wrong there good but $$$ I think you can save some cash going with others out there just my opinion 🍺🍺👍
Setting up home theater in non-dedicated space is tough, but doable. (Florida-style floor plan here) Buying tip for subs: For 4 subs - sell the wife on the first one, then bring in the next three slowly. It's the initial shock you have to get past. The real tough part is selling the acoustic treatment on walls and ceiling. Try matching the room color scheme for easiest sell...
I got 2 of the last gen klipsch rp 15inchers for 500$ a piece and I know they dont measure as well as the new models but for 500$ a pop pick up two and man i dont feel like im missing anything.
I have the Monolith M-215 and I got it on sale for $1525 direct from Monoprice.. The only complaint I have is why it wasn't rated DOMINUS. I don't really push it much, mainly because my neighbors say it shakes their teacups in their cupboard! it is WAY more bass than I need. It really is overkill for my modest Atmos system. To me it is my endgame sub. Also you guys (and others) review on it made me pull the trigger. It is so big and heavy, now that I have it where I do, I will NEVER move it again! its like 216lbs!
I had 2 HSU vtf2-mk5 and pre ordered a TN1 right away.. Now that I have been using myTN1 for a few weeks, I want a second.. I love the Sub but I just cant get even coverage in the room with a single.
I love these types of comprehensive and comparison videos. Thank you! My suggestion in this case: I think it would be worth mentioning the RSL 12S based on its performance, preferably in the main list with measurements, or at least as an alternative. I think it definitely compares in performance, and it beats all of them for the price, shipped. (But I'll happily keep my Hsu subs for now!)
@@jameslarson2277 I thought it dug down to 16Hz. Am I wrong about that? Or is it that it can't match the others in output or group delay or distortion?
@@jameslarson2277 I believe the RSL 12S' overall output does exceed the Def Tech Descend DN15 according to your measurements James & the fact it has true 16Hz extension with usable output which the Descend DN15 does not & rolls off steeply at only 20Hz & this is despite the RSL 12S having a smaller more sensitive driver & slightly smaller cabinet, it's amazing how RSL offers such tremendous value with the 12S & the only niggling issue you had with it was its mid-bass response was a bit restrained which would have been solved with more muscular amplification of at least 1000W RMS ;)
Have you tested any tonwinner subs? I have 2 15" monolith v1 because of your recommendation. Thanks in advance Guess i should of watched entire video before asking a question.
Great roundup. Thanks guys. I think it might be worth mentioning you might want to really consider the watts unless you have a dedicated power that is separate from your other home theatre gear. Otherwise you might see some light dimming and possible other distortions in your room on high excursions like James mentioned.
I own the XS15, and the only way I was able to make it work was with the balanced connection (Emotiva MR1). The rear port makes it difficult to set up. You are correct. It rocks. Emotiva is supposed to have a new series of subwoofers later this year.
What a great review guys. Wow some really nice subs. I did feel for Larson. I believe that's his name 😳 The thought of that poor little guy moving subs that might be heavier than him is scary. I really hope he doesn't hurt his back like mine. It really changed my life and I don't mean for the good. 🙏
Really good video. I think it captures the major players in the 15in subwoofer space. Starke Audio has a 15 inch offering that I think would perform well against many of these. Ascendo also has a 16in subwoofer that would also compete here too.
I have two HSU VTF2-MK5's and I love them. I only got them to distort once. The low tone at the start of Edge of Tomorrow. 10Hz I think that is. 😀 There you go. That would make for an interesting experiment. Two 12" $700 subs vs one $1400 15" sub.
I wonder what your takes are on Monolith’s support of their subs. On various internet forums, you see people complain about having amp issues and Monolith often not providing for amp-only replacements (I.e., people usually have to ship back THE ENTIRE SUB if there’s an issue). It seems like some people have had some luck recently with getting amp-only replacements, but in my opinion, this is something Audioholics should really bring to Monoprice’s attention as being a priority for this line, if they want to compete. I personally purchased two Monolith m15 v2’s in large part due to James Larson’s reviews of the original, and they’ve been problem free and absolutely wonderful for 2-3 years now. I was just curious as to whether you’ve heard of higher-than-average QC issues with Monolith, or if you think the internet complaints are blown out of proportion. As always, keep up the awesome work!!
Unless we know the actual failure rate of Monoprice subs (only Monoprice knows this), I have to assume it's the internet blowing it out of proportion. What exacerbates the issue is Monoprice's customer service is not on the level of companies like Hsu and SVS, and people having to send the entire sub back makes them far more likely to voice their complaints. Until we get some hard data, or we see complaints of failures become overwhelming, anything we could say would be baseless speculation.
@@jameslarson2277 Makes sense. Like I said, mine have been flawless and besides the greater output compared to my older 12 inch subs, the lower distortion was immediately noticeable (I was probably pushing my older ones a little too hard, hah). Of course, I know my experiences are also somewhat anecdotal as well. Anyways, thank you again for all work you do!
Not a lot of accolades for the Hsu other than being an average performer for a good price. That and the smaller footprint is why I pulled the trigger when the TN-1 became available for preorder. I wanted an upgrade from my 10" sub but I don't have enough room for some of the fridge sized subs from Monoprice. Btw, the Paradigm X15 used to be an amazing deal at $1500 and I was seriously considering that one until they jacked the price up by $500.
Great video and all of the information. Let’s get some reviews on Tonewinner amps. I am amp shopping and like the look of them and the advanced Paris amps.
Have two VTF-15H MKII and getting two VTF-TN1 getting delivered next week. I hope TN1s are as good or better than 15H. The 15H MKII integrates well and completely disappears.
Pretty high probability that Emotiva and Monoprice just has Tonewinner manufacter their products. Im almost certain they do for their amps and processors. Most likely the subs as well
Thanks Gene and James. Could they make these subs lighter by using other material (i.e. aluminum, carbon fiber, etc.) or is the heavy weight necessary for good performance?
Weight may be necessary in order to stop the moving mass of the driver from rocking the sub. You may remember those older microsubs from Sunfire, Polk, Deftech, etc. The problem they had was that the passive radiators they employed were so heavy that they could end up walking around in place. So you need enough mass to make the moving assembly of the driver negligible in comparison. This can be solved using dual-opposed woofers, and in that case, yes, lighter materials such as carbon fiber could be used as cabinet material (aluminum is much heavier than MDF). Unfortunately, cool as it would be, a carbon fiber subwoofer enclosure would be extremely expensive as you might imagine.
I own the Monolith 13 Ultra. The drivers measures 15" from side to side even though it's rated as a 13". Upgraded from a 15 year old VTF3MK2. Not even a fair comparison. Using it in a 2500 cubic foot room. The thing is ridiculous. I can't imagine the 16". The smaller 13" will outrun my Klipsch ref base layer speakers. I just added a sealed Rel HT1205MK2 nearfield behind the couch. It's a killer combo! Nearfield needs to be sealed and has a tremendous kick in the back for punches and kicks ect.
I am the master of the cheap audio system and I enjoy resurrecting stuff if it is capable of doing the job as well as modern machinery. For instance, my amp is an old Luxman I purchased nonfunctioning at an estate sale for 30 dollars. With subs however, you can't go too cheap or you get bad boomy bass response originating from having a cheap basket and motor (I have never listened to a 300 dollar sub that didn't sound like a 300 dollar sub). I purchased that that Hsu VTF-15 for many years ago now and it has been moved across country 2x to my present home. Still rock-solid sound and when I needed a new port plug I call and get Dr Hsu of the company on the horn. If my sub ever does die, I'm buying another Hsu.
@Audioholics - I am getting the Monolith M-215 delivered today... I don't see how the size matter much... I wasn't going to put anything above it anyway... In fact, it will be easier to dolly around because it's taller.. The foot print is all that matters unless you're putting it below a TV or screen... But I want function over form any day. They are $2500... ON SALE NOW for $1800! Come on Gene.. footprint is 20" W x 28" D... the 42" H...big deal, lol. An SVS PB-300's foot print is 18.3" W x 26" D... ONLY 2" both ways on footprint! The PB-4000 & PB16-Ultra are BIGGER! And the M-215 has much more below 20Hz then the PB16 for $1k less at my sale price... hopefully no defective issues for me but you need to rethink this GENE, lol!
The DN15 is technically not a ported sub, explains why its 3db shy of the subs listed here. I used to run dual SVS SB4000’s and now I run dual Def Tech DN12’s. The Def Techs sound much cleaner to me than the SVS, definitely an underrated sub.
@tcamm9812 That is really rather bizarre & seems like quite the substantial downgrade, the SB4000 has 1200W RMS & slightly larger cabinet enclosure, are you sure your not missing out on the much higher SPL output? Was curious if you've played Bladerunner 2049 with your dual DN12s & have experienced any clipping, the DN12 will display "LIMIT" during the opening "Eye" scene with the sustained 35Hz response at a listening volume of -10dB below Reference? My dual DN12s do not like that scene at a level of -10dB but are fine at -15dB, they seem to be very poor at -10dB below Reference volume at not so deep frequencies of 30Hz & above :(
@tcamm9812 I don't believe that is correct, the DN15 with its passive radiators is more akin to a ported sub, it has port-like abilities just not nearly as efficient as a port & obviously won't have a port's sheer SPL output ;)
@@oniiz8685 I have never experienced clipping on them. I always keep the volume on them around 25-27, I have my anthem subwoofer outputs cranked up to around +10db and it’s a dream. Sounds like yours may not be properly calibrated/ in phase with each other/ front stage. What volume are you setting the actual subwoofers to displayed on the front? I would also much rather have bass radiators than a port, much cleaner bass in my opinion.
@@tcamm9812 Thanks for your response, so your dual DN12s have never displayed "LIMIT" on their LED displays at all? I have my dual DN12s at around 23-25 which is far too low but Audyssey set them at -12dB (Maxed Out) & -10dB, I then boosted them 6dB each, so now there -6dB & -4dB with Dynamic EQ engaged with a Reference Level Offset of 0dB which I've now realised that is far too much bass boosting of the signal, the Def Tech Descend subwoofer models require a high gain setting of around 30 or so (Maximum is 40) for decent dynamics, I'm really surprised by you wanting to downsize from SVS SB4000's 13.5" woofer 1200W RMS each to the DN12's 12" 500W RMS, I know watts aren't everything but surely you'd miss the greater headroom & overall much higher SPL output of the SVS SB4000 subs?
@@tcamm9812 Hey there again, I was just curious by your comment where you mention that the Anthem AVP/AVR's sub trim level is set to +10dB which seems abnormally high which will likely induce clipping & will affect the headroom of the DN12s, I think it would be best to raise the DN12's gain level to at least 30 (40 Max), I've adjusted my dual DN12s to a gain level of 30 & made sure my Denon X8500H AVR's sub trim levels are set to -11.5dB so I can effectively maximise headroom & won't induce any clipping that way, I understand this will reduce the input sensitivity & will affect the Auto-On behaviour of the subs but that is why I have utilised the DN12's stereo L/R RCA input which effectively doubles the input signal gain sensitivity, anyway I know these Def Tech Descend DN12 subwoofers are quite limited with their low frequency extension as well as SPL output but are fairly clean for their frequency response of around 18Hz-100Hz, I'm a bit surprised your not concerned by missing out on the SVS SB4000's much deeper extension & substantially higher SPL output with their 1200W RMS amplification. ;)
Should we look for THX SPEAKER TOWERS if we want to hit reference levels with out compression and distortion? Maybe you guys should talk in future videos if we should invest our money for Home Theater on THX MODELS ONLY. They seem to be the real thing.
There are products that have very low compression and distortion that are not THX certified, but THX certification ensures that whatever you get will have good compression and distortion characteristics. You would just want to look at 3rd party data for anything not THX certified to be sure it has that level of performance.
I have an SVS SB4000 (2nd hand £1300). I was considering the Monolith 13" THX Ultra before getting the SVS. How would the 2 compare for Films/Music 50/50.
Versus a SB-4000, the Monolith 13" THX Ultra would have a huge output advantage. Far higher performing overall. SB-4000 is good for the size, but if size isn't a factor, the Monolith 13" blows it out of the water.
Thank you. I'm considering the swap over then to the 13 ultra. May cost a fair bit to import to England, but as it punches around the pb16 (£3500), this 13 ultra could be a steal..
Gene, The nearest Audio Advice to me is in Charlotte (Pineville) three hours away. 6 hr round trip. I plan on purchasing my last set of speakers in two weeks. My budget is $12,500. What speakers in this price range have the best measurements ? Please note that I have a large listening space with 10ft ceilings and I enjoy blu-ray rock concerts turned up to near concert levels. (no neighbors) I need something that plays both loud and clean . Am I asking for too much at this price range ? I am open to suggestions from this channels intelligent viewers.
feel free to reach out to me to discuss at: info@audioholics.com I'd be happy to give you some options if you'd be so kind to use our affiliate links when you go to Audio Advice. Put Audio Advice speaker demo in the subject line.
get a stereo integrity sql15, an nx3000d amp, build a box. at around 1000 bucks this will obliterate any of those in spl and sql as long as u build right.
Don't buy Bluetooth Subs at all, they really are awful!, Have A 2 S10EQ Elac Sub only can adjust the controls though bluetooth. (the worst!) I switch to a android phone down the bluetooth app it did not work at all talk tech support at Elac said download the older version did not wok because this app doesn't work with newer phones and older version was only for iPhones called Elac tech support ask me what type phone using then said android app should work just fine I went to the supported Elac subs on the app download info (NO) mention of my Elac sub only newer models was listed, I thought ripping out the amplifier putting a new amplifier with analog controls! A $400 dollar paper weights and getting very annoyed with thumping noise when the Elac sub turns off!
@@Audioholics ,it’s a video with these 2 guys with more clout then your guy shows klipsch rp1600 beat both svs pb 16 and the other svs 16 in a fair non bias video all three was up against the wall in the same spot klipsch won,so take a long walk on a short pier fool
I completly don't understand why americans deny Klipsch subwoofers. On every place in the net people are saying "don't buy Klipsch, go SVS instead". EVERYWHERE! But when it comes to the real tests like here it shows that they produce high output, extremely low distortion, low delays subwoofers with reasonably prices. And think about Klipsch's rich history and their invents like horn speakers, they realy are proper HiFi manufacturer. I don't want to go into conspiracy theories place but i think there might be many payed trolls on audio forums and groups.
@@kevinb_420 Is it really such a big problem? I mean, what percentage of their suvwoofers fail? They are big company and sell a lot of stuff so it's obvious some would fail. And consider that they have very cheap - wallmart tier models which people buy and abuse to the ground.
@@KimmoJaskari Historically they have been on the market since 1946. Maybe one of the oldest and still kicking company. To be specific what a SPL serie is lacking? To be clear I do NOT possess a single Klipsch equipment but I've tested some and they are freaking awsome. Waaaay better than SVS when we compare the prices. My next subwoofer will be definettly a pair of RP1200
@@kevinb_420yes back years ago you are correct but the new RP1600 has a different amplifier and Damn they have a all, around 5 year warranty so take it for it's worth I think they have stepped up there game in. The sub world but yes the older ones did die all the time because of there amplifier cheers🍺🍺
Great review and always love your content. Been shifting to Monolith last couple of years based on your reviews. 2-7 channel amps ( amazing) ..and running 2-13” ultras for past year. They are awesome but feel I’m not maximizing the potential, thinking room issues and cancellation challenges…so hear is my question: I was going to look into getting a mini DSP to correct things but I am using the balanced XLR cables on the two MP 13” subs, …any thoughts on how I can introduce room correction and cancellation challenges to maximize my sub presence? ( I’m running GE triton one up front using LFE rca signal to those for front subs and the 2- MP 13” ultra in rear behind seating area. ). Given power and capability of running essentially 4 subs, it should be thunderous, and it is good, but sometimes I think they are fighting each other….your expert opinion on how to time phase and output of these, would be very appreciated, Especially seeing nice using XLR to the two rear subs. Thanks, Curtis from Canada.
These so-called subwoofer wars are a good thing because... What everyone should do is look for absolute bottom Dollar when purchasing these things I love them myself but you know what I'm not giving anybody what's some of these companies are asking for them it's absolutely ridiculous in a total rip-off.. if you knew what the profit margins were on these things.. you would think twice before handing over your money for something that is ultimately simply not worth it.. when I'm using right now,. Gives plenty of Base to the point where I have to turn it down from 120 DB to about 90 DB in order to keep the nails from being pulled out of my foundation and I love it.. for me it's all about the high prices nothing more so bottom dollar is an absolute make sure you do that
Can't wait to see the HSU RESEARCH VTF-TN1 Subwoofer get tested. On the other side I would have liked to have scene the Rythmik G25HP Direct Servo subwoofer.
I have had 2 Monolith V1 15" subs for 4 years now and a 1-year old 16", they've all been flawless performers and tremendous value. I bought them based on these reviews 👍
Thanks for all the hard work James, contact me if you ever need help moving those 200 pound Kaiju subs 😂
Same here great subs
Same. Excellent subs. I'm on my third. They're all still going strong.
I have 2 of the Monolith 12s and a 15 (got the 15 for I think 1049) all fantastic. I may add another 15 one of these days who knows...lol
I have 2 monolith 15s and 1 v2 15 love them
Needs a part 2 with more 15inch subs. =)
Tonewinner and Starke Sound 15" would be a great addition to this list....TEST them!
i must say the tonewinner amps look nice with the blue vu meter ...kinda want one lol
Tonewinner is definitely trying to put a boot on the neck of the big boys and doing it for less.
The SVS PB16 is seven (7) years old. Is it really an apple to apple comparison with newer technology subwoofers?
@bkrhino1 Actually, this is pretty much an apples to apples comparison. Both subs are 15" - 16" woofers. Regardless of whether the PB16 is 7 or 10 years old, Svs is still selling it as their flagship. They need to update the sub or continue getting outperformed by lower costing subwoofers. Market competition is what makes manufacturers improve their products or go out of business. For most consumers, performance at a lower cost trumps build quality.
@@troystevens9506 - With that logic, a 2017 Corvette should be compared to a 2024. Based on SVS’s introduction of the Evolution Series at a significant price point, really do not care about the PB16 being outperformed as they made their money back. Technology counts.
I saved for 2 years to get the SVS PB16 Ultra and it’s worth every single penny. The problem is is now my other speakers sound like crap. This sub goes insanely low and pulls it off with zero effort. I really really wanted to keep it but it’s just too much of a sub. My townhouse is a decent size and we live on an end unit so I don’t have neighbors that would bitch if I cranked that thing up. I ended up replacing the Ultra with their PB2000 and it’s the perfect size for the space we have. Anything bigger and it would be too much. I love that I have access to the subwoofers settings via the app. For a $1,099 purchase price as opposed to the almost $3,000 purchase price for the Mac Daddy sub I was able to get a great subwoofer that delivers the sound I sought after and save hundreds to be put towards something else. I still have to adjust our china in our cabinet because that sub will rattle those dishes out of place and they’re a priceless family heirloom. All of the subs featured in this video are excellent for high end home theater setups but for me I just don’t have that kind of money to toss $20K into a system. I’ve tried SVS’s high end and mid priced equipment and the subwoofer I settled on is perfect for my wife and I.
Had the PB16 as well but ended up returning it and grabbing the Monolith 15 and built 2 DIY 18" Ultimax. Overall pleased with these subs and it outperforms the single pb16, of course and in the process ended up saving a couple hundred $$.
James is badass lugging all these subs around
Outstanding review. I have the HSU Research VTF-3 MK5, which is an incredible extreme rated sub for $900 back in 2015. Looking forward to the HSU Research TN1 review, Love the burst test average vs each sub comparison... so handy
Love this! Please do one for sealed 15’s please
Very much interested in the new HSU TN1 🎉 can’t wait for that review.
Appreciate all you and the crew do😊
Too bad we didn't see a Rythmik sub in this roundup. I hope you include one in the 18" roundup you will be doing...hint hint.
Thanks for the wonderful comparison guys, James is absolutely peerless & the king of subwoofer reviews, a couple of small errors to note is that the SVS PB16-Ultra's amplification is rated at 1500W RMS not 1600W & Monolith 13 THX Ultra is rated at 2000W RMS not 1800W ;)
Thanks for sharing Gene. Battle of the 15" sealed subwoofers - NEXT?
Awesome! Thanks for the video. Will there be a video like this one for sealed subs? Thanks!
I have the HSU TN1, did the preorder and dang it’s flipping amazing!
I want it, but can't find any reviews
Yeah I knew it would be just a slightly better Version of previous one in a better form factor for me.
Waiting on mine. Second Round!
What did you have before the TN1?
James, your delivery has vastly improved. Keep up the great work
Great video, as always! 👍 Regarding the Tone Winner D6000, it appears they do all their warranty support through one company. I brought this point up on another channel, and the reviewer was none to happy with me to say the least. He even bashed me in a segment of one of his Tone Winner videos. 😲 I've never spoken ill about Tone Winner subwoofer performance, as I've never heard one. All I merely was pointing out was the value of other manufacturers who offer manufacturer backed warranty service, not putting the burden on one sole distributor. Nice to know we have unbiased reviewers out here still. Keep up the good work! 👍
Great sub showdown, just wish you'd have included the Monoprice 16" as well. It's performance is second to none and it's much cheaper than the PB16Ultra.
It sucks you guys don’t Emotiva stuff anymore. I really like these analysis and compares. Lots of information! Thanks!
Where is Rythmik? Probably one of the best 15 inch subs out there.
Ah... I was hoping for a Rythmik.
Likewise.
agree
So weird how little love they get
Rythmik all the way!
Me 2
Monolith M-215 is indeed still available. They say its "on sale" at $1999 right now. Regular price $2499.
The V2 model subs look far better don't know why they haven't updated them.
1799 right now on their site. That's a freaking steal!
@@Voltis-5 yep! Crazy!
Wanted to go bigger but for now two RP1400sw will have to do. Hard to go wrong for 1400 a pr.
That is a killer deal, I think you will be very happy.
That was some good information guys, thanks!
I bought two Monolith 16's and was not happy! Long story short, they were buggy; I returned them. Monoprice is hiding my review and will not let me post again! My heart dropped after that, knowing now that Monoprice manipulates their review scores.
Precisely why I never purchased one. Peace of mind is priceless.
@@kevind4061 Oh man is so sad to hear that. I almost bought one, it was on my list.
I was on board at first, but I heard lots of bad things about that company’s customer service and the amplifier section not holding up. I think I’m gonna try the HSU VTF TN1
@@woohunter1 Two months ago I bought two Starke SW15 subs (sealed) for $500ea, new from the manufacturer. They go on sale all the time. I'm quite pleased w them! They are nowhere near "the powerhouse" subs I wanted like the JTR Captivators, you know, 120db @ 10hz levels, but these SW15'S should satisfy me until I make a sub purchase of that level (though that price looks to be in my dreams). I recommend giving the SW15 some attention on your research journey.
You should test smaller ”new rp” Klipsches too. Just got the rp1400sw and it performs on par or bests my prior SVS PC13 ultra. Also had PB3000 before but it cannot compete under 20hz
I've got a pair of SVS SB-1000 and they are complete failure imho. I managed to set dem flat to 20hz but max listening spl is 65dB with peaks to 80dB. Anything above that is too much distorted for my taste. So overpriced and overhyped brand.
Yes sir I 100% agree my friend SVS is a good sub maker but I do believe all there subs or a bit over priced but don't get me wrong there good but $$$ I think you can save some cash going with others out there just my opinion 🍺🍺👍
Setting up home theater in non-dedicated space is tough, but doable. (Florida-style floor plan here)
Buying tip for subs: For 4 subs - sell the wife on the first one, then bring in the next three slowly. It's the initial shock you have to get past. The real tough part is selling the acoustic treatment on walls and ceiling. Try matching the room color scheme for easiest sell...
I prefer telling my wife to get over it this is happening.
I got 2 of the last gen klipsch rp 15inchers for 500$ a piece and I know they dont measure as well as the new models but for 500$ a pop pick up two and man i dont feel like im missing anything.
What a great review! WOuld love it if you did this with sealed subs.
They did with sealed subs.
th-cam.com/video/5K2yVnOXah8/w-d-xo.html
I have the Monolith M-215 and I got it on sale for $1525 direct from Monoprice.. The only complaint I have is why it wasn't rated DOMINUS. I don't really push it much, mainly because my neighbors say it shakes their teacups in their cupboard! it is WAY more bass than I need. It really is overkill for my modest Atmos system. To me it is my endgame sub. Also you guys (and others) review on it made me pull the trigger. It is so big and heavy, now that I have it where I do, I will NEVER move it again! its like 216lbs!
I had 2 HSU vtf2-mk5 and pre ordered a TN1 right away.. Now that I have been using myTN1 for a few weeks, I want a second.. I love the Sub but I just cant get even coverage in the room with a single.
I love these types of comprehensive and comparison videos. Thank you! My suggestion in this case: I think it would be worth mentioning the RSL 12S based on its performance, preferably in the main list with measurements, or at least as an alternative. I think it definitely compares in performance, and it beats all of them for the price, shipped. (But I'll happily keep my Hsu subs for now!)
The RSL 12S is a very good sub indeed, but its performance is in line with a 12" and not these 15"s.
True😊
@@jameslarson2277 I thought it dug down to 16Hz. Am I wrong about that? Or is it that it can't match the others in output or group delay or distortion?
@@joes3800 It does dig down to 16Hz, but its overall output isn't on the level of these 15"s. It does have unusually low extension for a 12".
@@jameslarson2277 I believe the RSL 12S' overall output does exceed the Def Tech Descend DN15 according to your measurements James & the fact it has true 16Hz extension with usable output which the Descend DN15 does not & rolls off steeply at only 20Hz & this is despite the RSL 12S having a smaller more sensitive driver & slightly smaller cabinet, it's amazing how RSL offers such tremendous value with the 12S & the only niggling issue you had with it was its mid-bass response was a bit restrained which would have been solved with more muscular amplification of at least 1000W RMS ;)
Have you tested any tonwinner subs? I have 2 15" monolith v1 because of your recommendation. Thanks in advance Guess i should of watched entire video before asking a question.
Great roundup. Thanks guys. I think it might be worth mentioning you might want to really consider the watts unless you have a dedicated power that is separate from your other home theatre gear. Otherwise you might see some light dimming and possible other distortions in your room on high excursions like James mentioned.
no emotiva xs 15? dang that thing slaps..you should get one! been putting one through the paces
I own the XS15, and the only way I was able to make it work was with the balanced connection (Emotiva MR1). The rear port makes it difficult to set up. You are correct. It rocks. Emotiva is supposed to have a new series of subwoofers later this year.
@@Roddy451 make it work? just curious mine worked using the sub out rca on a emotiva pt1 for me
What a great review guys. Wow some really nice subs. I did feel for Larson. I believe that's his name 😳 The thought of that poor little guy moving subs that might be heavier than him is scary. I really hope he doesn't hurt his back like mine. It really changed my life and I don't mean for the good. 🙏
Excellent roundup. I was hoping to see a column in the table showing the dimensions.
Really good video. I think it captures the major players in the 15in subwoofer space.
Starke Audio has a 15 inch offering that I think would perform well against many of these. Ascendo also has a 16in subwoofer that would also compete here too.
I got both my PB-3000s for 750 each on used market so can't complain
I have two HSU VTF2-MK5's and I love them. I only got them to distort once. The low tone at the start of Edge of Tomorrow. 10Hz I think that is. 😀 There you go. That would make for an interesting experiment. Two 12" $700 subs vs one $1400 15" sub.
I wonder what your takes are on Monolith’s support of their subs. On various internet forums, you see people complain about having amp issues and Monolith often not providing for amp-only replacements (I.e., people usually have to ship back THE ENTIRE SUB if there’s an issue).
It seems like some people have had some luck recently with getting amp-only replacements, but in my opinion, this is something Audioholics should really bring to Monoprice’s attention as being a priority for this line, if they want to compete.
I personally purchased two Monolith m15 v2’s in large part due to James Larson’s reviews of the original, and they’ve been problem free and absolutely wonderful for 2-3 years now.
I was just curious as to whether you’ve heard of higher-than-average QC issues with Monolith, or if you think the internet complaints are blown out of proportion.
As always, keep up the awesome work!!
Unless we know the actual failure rate of Monoprice subs (only Monoprice knows this), I have to assume it's the internet blowing it out of proportion. What exacerbates the issue is Monoprice's customer service is not on the level of companies like Hsu and SVS, and people having to send the entire sub back makes them far more likely to voice their complaints. Until we get some hard data, or we see complaints of failures become overwhelming, anything we could say would be baseless speculation.
@@jameslarson2277 Makes sense. Like I said, mine have been flawless and besides the greater output compared to my older 12 inch subs, the lower distortion was immediately noticeable (I was probably pushing my older ones a little too hard, hah). Of course, I know my experiences are also somewhat anecdotal as well.
Anyways, thank you again for all work you do!
i have a pair of the HSUs and have been very pleased.
Not a lot of accolades for the Hsu other than being an average performer for a good price. That and the smaller footprint is why I pulled the trigger when the TN-1 became available for preorder. I wanted an upgrade from my 10" sub but I don't have enough room for some of the fridge sized subs from Monoprice. Btw, the Paradigm X15 used to be an amazing deal at $1500 and I was seriously considering that one until they jacked the price up by $500.
@@Smellslikegelfling 😂😂😂
I've had the HSU VTF-15H (mkI) for almost 10 years now, and the windows of my house rattle before the sub starts to distort.
Tonewinner d6000 review plis 😊
Isn't ultra-deep bass mainly applicable to low-frequency effects in movies?
Great video and all of the information.
Let’s get some reviews on Tonewinner amps. I am amp shopping and like the look of them and the advanced Paris amps.
Have two VTF-15H MKII and getting two VTF-TN1 getting delivered next week. I hope TN1s are as good or better than 15H. The 15H MKII integrates well and completely disappears.
Pretty high probability that Emotiva and Monoprice just has Tonewinner manufacter their products. Im almost certain they do for their amps and processors. Most likely the subs as well
No ATI makes Monoprice amps.
@@stevenfox5250 It depends on the product, ATI only makes specific amps for these companies not all of them.
Thanks Gene and James. Could they make these subs lighter by using other material (i.e. aluminum, carbon fiber, etc.) or is the heavy weight necessary for good performance?
Weight may be necessary in order to stop the moving mass of the driver from rocking the sub. You may remember those older microsubs from Sunfire, Polk, Deftech, etc. The problem they had was that the passive radiators they employed were so heavy that they could end up walking around in place. So you need enough mass to make the moving assembly of the driver negligible in comparison. This can be solved using dual-opposed woofers, and in that case, yes, lighter materials such as carbon fiber could be used as cabinet material (aluminum is much heavier than MDF). Unfortunately, cool as it would be, a carbon fiber subwoofer enclosure would be extremely expensive as you might imagine.
Wish you would review the svs SB4000.
Please review the Tonewinner SW-D6000. I have heard great things about it, but would really trust your opinion. 🤔🤔
I own the Monolith 13 Ultra. The drivers measures 15" from side to side even though it's rated as a 13". Upgraded from a 15 year old VTF3MK2. Not even a fair comparison. Using it in a 2500 cubic foot room. The thing is ridiculous. I can't imagine the 16". The smaller 13" will outrun my Klipsch ref base layer speakers. I just added a sealed Rel HT1205MK2 nearfield behind the couch. It's a killer combo! Nearfield needs to be sealed and has a tremendous kick in the back for punches and kicks ect.
I needed movers to get my Monolith THX 13 into the house! Also if you watch out for sales, you can get it for closer to $1200
Did you guys test the rsl 12s? Would love to see it compared to these beasts too.
I am the master of the cheap audio system and I enjoy resurrecting stuff if it is capable of doing the job as well as modern machinery. For instance, my amp is an old Luxman I purchased nonfunctioning at an estate sale for 30 dollars. With subs however, you can't go too cheap or you get bad boomy bass response originating from having a cheap basket and motor (I have never listened to a 300 dollar sub that didn't sound like a 300 dollar sub). I purchased that that Hsu VTF-15 for many years ago now and it has been moved across country 2x to my present home. Still rock-solid sound and when I needed a new port plug I call and get Dr Hsu of the company on the horn. If my sub ever does die, I'm buying another Hsu.
Wish RSL would make a speedwoofer 15", I think it would be fantastic. I have 2 SVS subs, they are very nice quality.
I love my Monolith 13. It knocks the sock off of everyone who visits my house 😂
Why rythmik is not mentioned in this list?
Watch the entire video before ASSuming.
Good stuff I was hoping for the Monoprice Monolith 16 but from what Ive read the driver is actually an 18 inch driver
No the Monoprice 16" really is a 16" driver.
I like how James never asks Gene how he's doing when being introduced 🤣.
Great comparison! I was really hoping to see Power Sound Audio (PSA) and Rythmik included... next time?
Rythmik likely, PSA don't count on it.
@Audioholics - I am getting the Monolith M-215 delivered today... I don't see how the size matter much... I wasn't going to put anything above it anyway... In fact, it will be easier to dolly around because it's taller.. The foot print is all that matters unless you're putting it below a TV or screen... But I want function over form any day. They are $2500... ON SALE NOW for $1800! Come on Gene.. footprint is 20" W x 28" D... the 42" H...big deal, lol. An SVS PB-300's foot print is 18.3" W x 26" D... ONLY 2" both ways on footprint! The PB-4000 & PB16-Ultra are BIGGER! And the M-215 has much more below 20Hz then the PB16 for $1k less at my sale price... hopefully no defective issues for me but you need to rethink this GENE, lol!
The DN15 is technically not a ported sub, explains why its 3db shy of the subs listed here. I used to run dual SVS SB4000’s and now I run dual Def Tech DN12’s. The Def Techs sound much cleaner to me than the SVS, definitely an underrated sub.
@tcamm9812 That is really rather bizarre & seems like quite the substantial downgrade, the SB4000 has 1200W RMS & slightly larger cabinet enclosure, are you sure your not missing out on the much higher SPL output?
Was curious if you've played Bladerunner 2049 with your dual DN12s & have experienced any clipping, the DN12 will display "LIMIT" during the opening "Eye" scene with the sustained 35Hz response at a listening volume of -10dB below Reference?
My dual DN12s do not like that scene at a level of -10dB but are fine at -15dB, they seem to be very poor at -10dB below Reference volume at not so deep frequencies of 30Hz & above :(
@tcamm9812 I don't believe that is correct, the DN15 with its passive radiators is more akin to a ported sub, it has port-like abilities just not nearly as efficient as a port & obviously won't have a port's sheer SPL output ;)
@@oniiz8685 I have never experienced clipping on them. I always keep the volume on them around 25-27, I have my anthem subwoofer outputs cranked up to around +10db and it’s a dream. Sounds like yours may not be properly calibrated/ in phase with each other/ front stage. What volume are you setting the actual subwoofers to displayed on the front? I would also much rather have bass radiators than a port, much cleaner bass in my opinion.
@@tcamm9812 Thanks for your response, so your dual DN12s have never displayed "LIMIT" on their LED displays at all? I have my dual DN12s at around 23-25 which is far too low but Audyssey set them at -12dB (Maxed Out) & -10dB, I then boosted them 6dB each, so now there -6dB & -4dB with Dynamic EQ engaged with a Reference Level Offset of 0dB which I've now realised that is far too much bass boosting of the signal, the Def Tech Descend subwoofer models require a high gain setting of around 30 or so (Maximum is 40) for decent dynamics, I'm really surprised by you wanting to downsize from SVS SB4000's 13.5" woofer 1200W RMS each to the DN12's 12" 500W RMS, I know watts aren't everything but surely you'd miss the greater headroom & overall much higher SPL output of the SVS SB4000 subs?
@@tcamm9812 Hey there again, I was just curious by your comment where you mention that the Anthem AVP/AVR's sub trim level is set to +10dB which seems abnormally high which will likely induce clipping & will affect the headroom of the DN12s, I think it would be best to raise the DN12's gain level to at least 30 (40 Max), I've adjusted my dual DN12s to a gain level of 30 & made sure my Denon X8500H AVR's sub trim levels are set to -11.5dB so I can effectively maximise headroom & won't induce any clipping that way, I understand this will reduce the input sensitivity & will affect the Auto-On behaviour of the subs but that is why I have utilised the DN12's stereo L/R RCA input which effectively doubles the input signal gain sensitivity, anyway I know these Def Tech Descend DN12 subwoofers are quite limited with their low frequency extension as well as SPL output but are fairly clean for their frequency response of around 18Hz-100Hz, I'm a bit surprised your not concerned by missing out on the SVS SB4000's much deeper extension & substantially higher SPL output with their 1200W RMS amplification. ;)
No Rythmik? Booo
Should we look for THX SPEAKER TOWERS if we want to hit reference levels with out compression and distortion?
Maybe you guys should talk in future videos if we should invest our money for Home Theater on THX MODELS ONLY. They seem to be the real thing.
There are products that have very low compression and distortion that are not THX certified, but THX certification ensures that whatever you get will have good compression and distortion characteristics. You would just want to look at 3rd party data for anything not THX certified to be sure it has that level of performance.
I bought a Yamaha Dxs15XLF.. Still experimenting with placement
Why no Dayton Audio SUB-1500 ($300, including shipping)?
It's nowhere near these subwoofers. I have one, it's great. But not in the same conversation as these.
@@justinbeamon6624 same it's pretty weak ...was not happy with mine at all ...still have it tho.
Something about bass. Not even in the market but like to hear about the boom !
The Monolith 15 occasionally goes down to under 1100, that's when I picked one up.
Perfect video! Thank you.
I have an SVS SB4000 (2nd hand £1300). I was considering the Monolith 13" THX Ultra before getting the SVS. How would the 2 compare for Films/Music 50/50.
Versus a SB-4000, the Monolith 13" THX Ultra would have a huge output advantage. Far higher performing overall. SB-4000 is good for the size, but if size isn't a factor, the Monolith 13" blows it out of the water.
@@jameslarson2277 thank you for the quick reply, much appreciated.
Thank you. I'm considering the swap over then to the 13 ultra. May cost a fair bit to import to England, but as it punches around the pb16 (£3500), this 13 ultra could be a steal..
i upgraded from SVS PB 16U to Perlisten D15s with both properly calibrated...D15s outperformed SVS in all areas significantly
Gene, The nearest Audio Advice to me is in Charlotte (Pineville) three hours away. 6 hr round trip. I plan on purchasing my last set of speakers in two weeks. My budget is $12,500. What speakers in this price range have the best measurements ? Please note that I have a large listening space with 10ft ceilings and I enjoy blu-ray rock concerts turned up to near concert levels. (no neighbors) I need something that plays both loud and clean . Am I asking for too much at this price range ? I am open to suggestions from this channels intelligent viewers.
Suggest checking out Perlisten speakers and subs
feel free to reach out to me to discuss at: info@audioholics.com I'd be happy to give you some options if you'd be so kind to use our affiliate links when you go to Audio Advice. Put Audio Advice speaker demo in the subject line.
@@BobbyBass-x6i doing that now. Thank you
Where is the Tonnewinner?Don't they have 15"
Perlisten didn't make the cut?
If a rythmik fv-15 is not in the mix it's not a real battle. BOOOO or how about a Starke SW15P those 2 need to be in to make it credible.
How about Ascendo?? They have a new 16...
I didnt get the pb16's i got a pb3000. The 16 was to big and heavy. The pb3000 shakes my whole house at 20hz
Can get the klipsch at 899 on sale
get a stereo integrity sql15, an nx3000d amp, build a box. at around 1000 bucks this will obliterate any of those in spl and sql as long as u build right.
No Starke Sound?
SVS HANDS DOWN IDC 🙌🏾💪🏽✊🏾
I wish rythmik send their subs out for measurements
Don't buy Bluetooth Subs at all, they really are awful!, Have A 2 S10EQ Elac Sub only can adjust the controls though bluetooth. (the worst!) I switch to a android phone down the bluetooth app it did not work at all talk tech support at Elac said download the older version did not wok because this app doesn't work with newer phones and older version was only for iPhones called Elac tech support ask me what type phone using then said android app should work just fine I went to the supported Elac subs on the app download info (NO) mention of my Elac sub only newer models was listed, I thought ripping out the amplifier putting a new amplifier with analog controls! A $400 dollar paper weights and getting very annoyed with thumping noise when the Elac sub turns off!
This makes no sense. SVS have shown to be inferior to other subs when it comes to sub 20hz. What is your definition of deep bass?
4 ohm speakers & ported subs until death💥💥💥💥💣💣💣💣
Why was Rel not in this comparison… 🤔
When yall gone tell then to lower their prices
These prices. So much Money.
Luckily God gave me 2 hands to build and a Head to think before.❤
I most say i prefer sealed subs love my Arendal 1723 1s
I am praying that Audioholics can let bygones be bygones and review some Power Sound Audio equipment.
Save your prayers for more important matters. Thanks
@@Audioholics Yikes. They don't call him mean Gene for nothing folks.
Preach brother. PSA makes top notch equipment.
PSA didn't fall for the audio grifter Mean Gene.
Don't understand why psa comes out with a new sub every other month ?
James need Sun :(
He is dam liar about the klipsch rp1600 sw I play it down well below 20hz to 14hz high volume it do not chuff
You're a darn idiot. James objectively tests products to their limits, and his findings are accurate.
@@Audioholics ,it’s a video with these 2 guys with more clout then your guy shows klipsch rp1600 beat both svs pb 16 and the other svs 16 in a fair non bias video all three was up against the wall in the same spot klipsch won,so take a long walk on a short pier fool
Playing at 14 hz high volume in your room is different than at the subwoofer limit, with only the subwoofer playing.
All due respect this fellow named James is very difficult to listen to it's annoying so sorry.
You are the best dude
Can't listen to this guy, sounds like my wi-fi is cutting off...i want to speak for him and finish his words...😮💨
I have retired my 12inch sub, for a pair of 8inch DIY bass transducers mounted inside my couch.
I completly don't understand why americans deny Klipsch subwoofers. On every place in the net people are saying "don't buy Klipsch, go SVS instead". EVERYWHERE! But when it comes to the real tests like here it shows that they produce high output, extremely low distortion, low delays subwoofers with reasonably prices. And think about Klipsch's rich history and their invents like horn speakers, they realy are proper HiFi manufacturer. I don't want to go into conspiracy theories place but i think there might be many payed trolls on audio forums and groups.
amp failures 🤷♂
@@kevinb_420 Is it really such a big problem? I mean, what percentage of their suvwoofers fail? They are big company and sell a lot of stuff so it's obvious some would fail. And consider that they have very cheap - wallmart tier models which people buy and abuse to the ground.
Arendal offer 5 year warrenty on their sub amps witch speaks quality,
@@KimmoJaskari Historically they have been on the market since 1946. Maybe one of the oldest and still kicking company. To be specific what a SPL serie is lacking? To be clear I do NOT possess a single Klipsch equipment but I've tested some and they are freaking awsome. Waaaay better than SVS when we compare the prices. My next subwoofer will be definettly a pair of RP1200
@@kevinb_420yes back years ago you are correct but the new RP1600 has a different amplifier and Damn they have a all, around 5 year warranty so take it for it's worth I think they have stepped up there game in. The sub world but yes the older ones did die all the time because of there amplifier cheers🍺🍺
This dude is hard to listen to
Why? Do you suffer from hearing loss 🙄.
One of the best reviewers in the business, all facts no BS.
Great review and always love your content. Been shifting to Monolith last couple of years based on your reviews. 2-7 channel amps ( amazing) ..and running 2-13” ultras for past year. They are awesome but feel I’m not maximizing the potential, thinking room issues and cancellation challenges…so hear is my question: I was going to look into getting a mini DSP to correct things but I am using the balanced XLR cables on the two MP 13” subs, …any thoughts on how I can introduce room correction and cancellation challenges to maximize my sub presence?
( I’m running GE triton one up front using LFE rca signal to those for front subs and the 2- MP 13” ultra in rear behind seating area. ). Given power and capability of running essentially 4 subs, it should be thunderous, and it is good, but sometimes I think they are fighting each other….your expert opinion on how to time phase and output of these, would be very appreciated, Especially seeing nice using XLR to the two rear subs. Thanks, Curtis from Canada.
Could we get thoughts on powersound? @audioholics
These so-called subwoofer wars are a good thing because... What everyone should do is look for absolute bottom Dollar when purchasing these things I love them myself but you know what I'm not giving anybody what's some of these companies are asking for them it's absolutely ridiculous in a total rip-off.. if you knew what the profit margins were on these things.. you would think twice before handing over your money for something that is ultimately simply not worth it.. when I'm using right now,. Gives plenty of Base to the point where I have to turn it down from 120 DB to about 90 DB in order to keep the nails from being pulled out of my foundation and I love it.. for me it's all about the high prices nothing more so bottom dollar is an absolute make sure you do that