What Makes Celeste's Assist Mode Special
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 พ.ค. 2024
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Developer intention can often come at the expense of accessibility and player preference. In this video, I look at some recent games that have found a middle ground.
=== Before you watch ===
Disclosure: Celeste Switch code was provided by the game's developer
=== Sources and Resources ===
Let’s Talk About the Corpse in the Room | Darkest Dungeon
www.darkestdungeon.com/lets-ta...
Heat Signature’s Fair Points Update | Pentadact
www.pentadact.com/2017-11-22-...
Frictional on designing SOMA's new monster-free Safe Mode | PC Gamer
www.pcgamer.com/frictional-on...
Why The Very Hard 'Celeste' is Perfectly Fine With You Breaking Its Rules | Waypoint
waypoint.vice.com/en_us/artic...
=== Chapters ===
00:00 - Intro
01:39 - Cheats and Mods
03:07 - Case Study: Darkest Dungeon
05:15 - Case Study: Heat Signature
06:34 - Case Study: SOMA
08:16 - Case Study: Celeste
11:58 - Mixing Developer Vision and Accessibility
12:49 - Conclusion
13:16 - Patreon Credits
=== Games Shown ===
Dark Souls (From Software, 2011)
Dead Rising (Capcom, 2006)
Far Cry 2 (Ubisoft Montreal, 2008)
The Swindle (Size Five Games, 2015)
Dishonored 2 (Arkane Studios, 2016)
Hellblade: Senua's Sacrifice (Ninja Theory, 2017)
Uncharted 4: A Thief's End (Naughty Dog, 2016)
LA Noire (Team Bondi, 2011)
Rayman Origins (Ubisoft Montpellier, 2011)
Horizon Zero Dawn (Guerrilla Games, 2017)
Super Meat Boy (Team Meat, 2010)
Darkest Dungeon (Red Hook Studios, 2016)
Celeste (Matt Makes Games, 2018)
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 3 (Neversoft, 2001)
Duke Nukem 3D (3D Realms, 1996)
Shadow Warrior (3D Realms, 1997)
XCOM 2 (Firaxis, 2016)
Soma (Frictional Games, 2015)
The Binding of Isaac: Rebirth (Nicalis / Edmund McMillen, 2014)
Metroid (Nintendo, 1986)
Heat Signature (Suspicious Developments, 2017)
Subnautica (Unknown Worlds Entertainment, 2018)
Fire Emblem Awakening (Intelligent Systems, 2012)
BUTCHER (Transhuman Design, 2016)
Cuphead (Studio MDHR, 2017)
Wolfenstein: The New Order (MachineGames, 2014)
Super Mario Odyssey (Nintendo, 2017)
Invisible, Inc. (Klei Entertainment, 2015)
Nioh (Team Ninja, 2017)
=== Credits ===
Music used in this episode
First Steps (Celeste OST)
Checking In (Celeste OST)
The Hamlet (Darkest Dungeon OST)
The Other Side (Heat Signature OST)
Reach for the Summit (Celeste OST)
Heart of the Mountain (Celeste OST)
First Steps (Celeste OST)
k. Part 2 - 01 untitled 1, animeistrash
=== Subtitles ===
Contribute translated subtitles - amara.org/v/C3BEh/ - เกม
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What I like about Celeste's difficulty is that just like Super Meatboy, you get to try again immediately. No load times, no replaying long levels, and no excessively long boss fights, just die and try again.
josh
And just like Super Meatboy, it swiftly stomps all over that ideology in the post game where you have to beat an entire level, including B-sides and C-sides, without dying once to collect the golden strawberries.
No replaying long levels? *laughs in C side*
That’s where other platformers fail (the Super Mario Bros series where you wait up to a minute before playing (and dying) again)
C side didn't really feel like a legit gamemode, more like an arcade bonus stage if you really wanna keep playing.
@@Raoul1808. I agree with you but I think that in celeste you are much more likely to want short times than in Mario, due to the amount of things that can kill you and how fast they can do so
I had the honor of participating in an AMA of the devs of Celeste. I’m disabled and used to be unable to play games...their response to me was that everyone has their own mountains to climb, and that’s okay. They understood.
Aww..
ooh... this got me a little bit weepy, thanks for sharing
This is why I like it when game companies make an endeavour to make more people able to enjoy their games or play their games.
echoing what @@blaise931 had to say
👍
Another thing about these kind of features is they can be fun to play around with after you finish the game
I can't tell you how fun it was for me to blast off like Sonic after putting Dash to Infinite in Celeste.
After you beat all the C sides, you get variant mode. It's like assist mode but with even more options, and you can make the game harder too.
I love that Celeste solved the whole "intended play" situation by just... Telling the players what the deal was.
And not being an asshole about it.
I'm happy that Celeste did that instead of having like an easy and hard mode. I probably would've chose easy and missed a big part of the game.
@@_00_36 that's literally the opposite of what this whole video is trying to say
@@MarioFRC32 ssh let him. His whole personality depends on him being a GamErZ, don't take that away from him.
@@_00_36 I mean, you're the one replying to a 2 week old comment lol
12:46 "I just made that up! I'm very clever."
Ooh, I like that! That's a good way to put it. I should steal that.
Please. Stealing quotes? Are you on Easy mode in real life?
@@xhantTheFirst r/wooosh yourself.
@@markmayonnaise1163 r/wooooshception
Gaunt r/wooooshceptionception
@@ZAPANIMATIONS shut up
You should do a video on the reverse of this: Difficulty enhancing options that players impose on themselves, like Nuzlocke.
Yeah
It should still work the same as an assist mode but it makes the game harder instead of easier
yea, so many options for that like low percent runs, no healing items,speedruns,ect.
Oooooh! Yes!!!!! Yes 1000!!!!
That's not exactly game design...
I think my favorite thing about celeste's assist mode is that I was able to adjust the game to the extent I needed. For me, the normal game was downright impossible, but with assist mode I was able to adjust it to the point where it was still challenging, but I could also still have fun with it and experience the story
Agreed. I played most of the game normally but every so often I'd toggle an extra dash or the speed down to 80% to give me that extra oomph to get to the next screen, then set it back to default.
I think this is where difficulty tweaking is at its finest - when it allows the player to enjoy the game at whichever level they're comfortable/competent with
Same, i could beat the main game normally, but Chapter 9 FORCED me to use assist mode (slowing down the game speed)
@@chartbox6497sometimes i wonder if the assist mode makes people a little too accommodated, and instead of using it because they need it, they use it because they feel like they need it.
Celeste isnt a easy game, you are supposed to struggle at what look impossible but with patience overcome it, and i know very well how feeling like i cant do a screen at the heat of the moment feels like, but after i cool down i reallize that i indeed can do it.
8 minutes in, and Celeste (title game) is verbally mentioned for the first time.
...and I still enjoyed the lead-up immensely!
8:24 to be exact.
Edit: Scratch that, 8:25
I literally forgot the video was supposed to be about Celeste, lol. Good video, but horrible title...
Sometimes I forget what the video is about until half way through
👍
@@0Fyrebrand0 A lot of the video before and after Celeste is first directly mentioned is contextualizing it. The video isn't titled "Celeste's Assist Mode", but rather "What Makes Celeste's Assist Mode Special".
And _that_ is being talked about throughout the video. What makes the assist mode special, against the context of historical efforts to the same end of reducing game difficulty without confusing the artistic vision of the developer.
The title is fine.
Just to explain the Far Cry 2 comment - That was my way of saying that I'm well aware that I mention certain games very often on GMTK (namely Mario and Zelda, Hitman, Spelunky, Far Cry 2, etc). I'm trying to mix it up more!
One of my professors at university was always referring to Aquanox in his lectures. The "Aquanox Example" basically became a meme among the students.
Mark Brown you can pin a comment you know?
If a game is super good and done well, why not mention it often?
You've kind of touched on this during the FAQ section but I can't help but express that I would absolutely love to collaborate with you and/or the people around you working on these pieces. I'm a game design student halfway through my 4th year right now with plenty of development experience. Whether it'd be working on a game, a video, a written piece or simply discussing various subjects I'm more than willing to offer my time and knowledge to you and this channel. Please hit me up if there's anything I can do.
Cheers, Kevin
Great video! I'll probably have to play Celeste, but atm I'm playing Dark Souls to learn about level design principles like back tracking and balancing stress with relief. Any other games I should look at?
Easy Mode:
This difficulty is for people who don't feel like they need to prove anything to themselves or anyone else. Playing Shadow Warrior 2 on easy mode is perfectly fine, if by the end of an exhausting day, all you need is to feel like a goddamn superhero.
-shadow warrior 2 devs
Dank indeed to fish for attention by calling those with disabilities (explicitly the primary users of the mode in the context of this comment section) bitches.
@@dankmans8793 accessibility options being increasingly added to games are for more than just bitches, such as people who are unable to complete rapid tap QTEs due to physical or neurological ails, something Spider-Man PS4 gives the option to disable for example
@@baitposter Removing QTEs was one of the best things ever about Spider-Man. I've hated them since their inception and it was nice to see a dev who, once foolish enough to add them, later realized they should allow us to turn them off. Now if only Spidey didn't have tissue thin armour in the second half of the game.
Well, if you like video games that convey the feeling of being an absolute badass, go for it.
Personally I like games with a preset challenge, so I can feel joy from accomplishing something by improving myself.
Yes that's ONE reason someone might choose an easy mode. But it's also a perfectly reasonable possibility they might have to choose that mode because they aren't capable of completing it at a higher difficulty. Not just from disability as everyone likes to jump to, but simply lack of commitment and effort, and that's not something which should just be ignored either.
When I was a kid I always played games on easy mode because I thought it how you were supposed to start, and when you got good you should replay the game on higher difficulties. The result was that many games I only beat on easy mode, never even experienced normal or hard, simply because I didn't feel like replaying it.
Yeah. This is why I sometimes start games on a harder difficulty, even though it's good to choose a lower difficulty if you know you might end up beating youself over a tough challenge, rather than enjoying the game itself
My kid logic was "why pick anything but easy? I'm trying to beat the game, right, and picking easy helps with that?". Not technically wrong, buuuuuut yeah.
And this is the problem with title screen difficulty modes.
I play every game on the highest difficulty and hate it when it is not unlocked from beginning. I want to play a game so long as possible and a higher difficulty force me to use more of the game mechanics.
this is why other difficulties on games suck
this feels particularly important for celeste as a game. celeste is a game about personal achievement and about mental health. It's a game about how when you have a mental illness, finding success in traditional ways is either impossible or unfulfilling, so you should look for personal success at your own goals instead. that's shown through the story and the gameplay. the game is built to be hard but achievable. it's all about learning from your failures and taking your screw-ups in stride. in a game about that, it's important to give accessibility options. the game is about mental health, what's the point if a lot of people can't play it because of their mental health issues.
I think even more beautifully to the message of the game, too, as much as it is a personal journey, it can also be perceived as a cooperative one. Not everything is possible alone, and sometimes we need a little push, shove, or even a lift to get us where we need or want to go. And Celeste makes you feel like that's okay, and I think that's what I really love about it. The devs put so much love and care into their game, and I respect them so much for what they made.
Genuinely one of my favorite games ever made, and probably the most powerful and profound experience I've ever had in my life up to this point.
@Fred Fred I mean, reading about the developer and such would tell you that it's not *intended* to be "just" a hard game. But, hey, if your preferred experience omits that, you do you.
this game is about jumping, dashing and climbing, that mental health story bullshit is just an excuse to the gameplay, it doesn't matter really. It's like John Carmack said - the story in a game is like a story in a porn, you expect it to be there, but it's not that important. Another thing is the easy mode is always an odd choice for indie games like these for me, cause they are meant to be challenging and are clear in their marketing about that, so when someone buys some difficult game like Celeste for example and just puts on easy mode, like why even did you even buy this? i don't really care that much, i am not mad because someone likes easy games, since i am not forced to play that way, but it's just weird.
If people get offended over a games difficulty being called "baby mode," that's their problem
@@zarrowthehorse no one got offended. it's just kinda a stupid way to implement that. the point of games is to be played, why are you insulting the player for trying to play the game the way they want to.
i'm disabled, and my disabilities cause my processing/reaction times very slow at times & it also makes my hands hurt a lot. i just finished celeste mode, and i'd say i used assist mode in some form for about 20% of the game. it's such a great feature. games need to be more accessible for disabled people, it's not all about abled people and whether they're good at video games or not.
Fellow disabled person here, what you say is a huge mood. I'm bad enough at reactions and have lots of pains that I die to Undertale monsters in the Ruins (first area). So easy modes is always something I support. Abled game developers need to see our existence smh. Don't they want us to also have fun? Don't they want our money?
That's why I think assist mode is amazing in Celeste. Everyone should be able to fully enjoy the game
I also have a physical disability affecting my nervous system and coordination, and I couldn't agree more that games need to be more accessible. It doesn't remove anything from other players, just makes life easier for us.
Video games arent for everyone.
@@chickenflavor9880 Games are for everyone, though. As an interactive medium for telling stories that would otherwise be impossible through movies or text, they are at times outright necessary for said stories. Barring people with a certain handicap from playing them is, at best, extremely misguided and at worst horrifically ableist.
Assist modes in games are analogous to having braille and audio books for blind people, and subtitles for those who are deaf or hard of hearing, it's about giving people who need it the opportunity and ability to enjoy the things that able-bodied people do.
Not to mention, giving a clearly communicated means for someone to enjoy a game at a level that, while still difficult for them, is 'easier' for an able-bodied person, maintains the overall 'level' of difficulty, evening it out.
And yeah, an able-bodied person could use an assist mode or accessibility options to make it easy for them, but the biggest and most important aspect of a game isn't to be some uber hardcore tryhard who can beat a game via a difficult challenge run, it's to play a game, enjoy it for its story or gameplay, and just have fun.
Celeste's assist mode just feels kind, like I loved the game without it but knowing that a game I loved is open to basically everyone is a good feeling
"kind" yet it's disabled in pico-8 and probably the other challenge modes I haven't played yet 🙄 very frustrating 😣
@@HUYI1 Actually, the pico-8 secret is just... well, the pico-8 version of Celeste, and it didn't have assist mode. Also, the pico-8 version of the game is much easier and shorter, and it's not needed to complete the game or anything. There's an achievement for completing it, but, again, it's much easier than the "full" game (not saying that you should be ashamed of yourself if you can't complete it). I'm not saying that nobody needs assist mode on pico-8, just the fact that there's no assist mode in this version doesn't mean that the whole mode is bad.
As for the "other challenge modes" I'm not sure what you meant, but I'll just assume that you meant the optional chapter (the core), the B-sides, the C-sides and Farewell. The assist mode is present in all of them.
This is why I don't like whole "easy mode mockery"
Sometimes I have a terrible day and just want to breeze through a game while feeling like an unstoppable God.
I don't want to have a terrible day, load up a game that's supposed to be a fun distraction, and be greeted with "oh does the little baby need his pacifier to play this game?"
I actually love it. It shouldn't make you feel sad that they're calling you a baby. It should be pretty funny
There is a reason why cheat code exist....
@@randomkidonyoutube9665 unless your willing to dig out fossils like NES then answer this. How many modern games still have those?
Horzinicla Well if you are a disabled person that needs that mode for accessibility that can be pretty brutal. Disabled people are already picked on and made fun of due to their disability a game that you wanna enjoy shouldn’t be making fun of you.
Ignore any mockery. However don't confuse people who simply dislike the confusion and loss of cohesive vision that some difficulty modes can introduce with assholes mocking you. Sometimes we can't express ourselves as well as Mr Brown does, and he has a whole video where most people just have a one line comment.
So when someone says, easy modes ruin games just get good. They might be mocking you, or they might be trying to condense a complex subject as discussed in the above video into a single line, without thinking about how others might see what they say as insulting.
Edit: The Duke Nukem pacifier thing is a throwback to their old games, it's supposed to be funny and encourage players to take on harder modes but it certainly does seem condescending. At the same time, it's just a little joke, they put the mode in the game so clearly they don't think that it shouldn't be used or they would not have wasted time on it. It could do without the joke but they left it in, choices.
Just finished Celeste. At one time I was pretty pissed by one level and just said fuck it I'll turn on assist mode. But then, the screen where it explains what assist mode does to the game, I felt so much respect for the devs to finish it as intended. It was so worth it. Greatest game I've played this year.
Yeah but dont feel ashamed with assist besides help always can be good
I love the game but I'm not going to grind my ass off for weeks or possibly months just to complete the last 2 chapters
@@seantaggart7382 I kinda disagree, assist mode in Celeste is made for people who can't complete the game as is, and it is a great option but I think it'll take away from your experience if you turn it on whenever it gets hard. It's your call in the end but the intense difficulty of that game is what makes it so rewarding when you finish it. I wouldn't say feel "ashamed" necessarily but I think you will definitely feel letdown, regret or at least miss out on the rewarding feelings if you have that mentality.
Tracy Stevens speak for yourself. I never play games on easy mode but i never judge anyone who does. Each person have fun on their own way, and some people will not have fun dying 1000 times and still stuck in the same phase for then after hours have the psychological reward
@@tracystevens6930 To each his own. If someone enjoys the game with assist mode then they enjoy it. Not everyone even likes that overcoming a tough challenge feeling. Some people just like to goof around and have fun without stressing out.
Not me, I am an addict to challenge. But I was not always. I used to play easy mode in most games. Dark Souls broke me. Now I NEED the challenge. Cliche I know, but I don't think I am alone. I also grew up on NES. So I went from hard AF games, to hey we can just choose easy to easy mode is for scrubs hard all the way to my current "to each his own". It's been a journey, we all grow and change over time, that is important to realize.
This is the best new channel I've seen in a LONG time on here! Your perspective is so unique and I feel like I'm learning a lot of new things, while at the same time seeing older games in a whole new light.
Oh hey mr *Friend of chugga* Seriously that's your name
I recommend you to check out brackeys!!!
👍
I have a friend who literally could not get past Rom the Vacuous Spider in Bloodborne because he has legitimate arachnophobia and the setting + all the spiders got him so sweaty and uncomfortable that he couldn't even hold his controller properly. I ended up beating Rom for him and only then could he proceed with the rest of the game. He's a really good player and if it wasn't for this one thing, he would've beaten the entire game by himself.
The point is, people have disabilities and that could be physical or emotional or psychological. All of these can happen situationally too: your hand-eye coordination and reflexes might be top-notch right now but what if you suffer an injury that causes irreparable damage to your nerve endings on your fingertips? Would you be okay with the fact that you won't be able to play games like Cuphead, Celeste, or Dark Souls anymore, was it not for these assist mode options? Hats off for the great video!
I have never gotten past the FIRST huge spider in....I think it's Skyward Sword? One of the Wii Zelda games anyway, I have arachnophobia too and that particular spider enemy is constantly swinging towards the camera and you have to get super close to actually hit it, and it just stresses me out so much that I can't focus any more
It's incredibly frustrating, I remember one time I was playing it with a walkthrough and the only thing it said about that part was 'Kill the skulltula' and I was like 'I WISH IT WAS THAT EASY'
@@Lic021 Im afraid of bugs and have been around enough irl spiders to know the difference, but video game spiders just never look as real or scary. And I've played a ton of games with spiders in them. It makes me think severe arachnophobes that get scared of the fakes dont actually remember what a real spider looks like.
Insane Pryo “hmm I see your brain suffers from a chemical imbalance that causes severe depression. Mmmmmm I’ll have you know that I was sad one time, but *I* got over it just fine. From this singular cursory experience I have determined that people who ‘have depression’ simply don’t understand how to deal with sadness like *I* do.”
This is you. This is what you sound like. Don’t be this guy.
@@IanZWhite00 THANK YOU. I /know/ the spiders/skulltulas in LoZ are stupid and cartoony and don't look like real spiders. Logically, I know that. But I have a PHOBIA. Phobias are NOT LOGICAL. That is literally the definition of them. That 'adorable' animated 'Lucas the spider' thing? That also scares me, I don't care if he's 'cute'.
If I got injured I would work hard to restore my previous ability, otherwise I would constantly feel inadequate. Not being able to play a game due to psychological triggers is understandable, it's happened to me before, but it's not comparable to physical injury. People with injuries find all sorts of workarounds.
I just played though Celeste with some (but not all) of the Assist Mode options. This was mainly because the discussions around mental health hits close to home and I knew I needed to play it, but in an unintended positive consequence, the Assist Mode allowed me to play the game in a way that didn't fire up my own anxiety. And the best part? I still found it challenging!
“Originally they called it cheat mode, but they thought that was too judgemental - they’re Canadian.”
thanks im deaf
You’re acting as if that line isn’t in the video for us all to hear.
You guys must be new to TH-cam. Everyone knows to get top liked you just quote something from the video
outphase78 XD
They say that but assistmode still taints your save file with a winged sticker that if I'm not mistaken used to be pink in early stages...
Have I ever mentioned how much I appreciate your sense of humor? You've got a wonderful mix of dry tone and genuine playfulness, and it feels like you only throw jokes into the script when you think that you actually have a worthwhile one and there's just enough to loosen up the feel of the video, with no damage to its pacing. It's quite masterful really!
Fawriel The little "they're Canadian" he slipped in when discussing the name of Celeste's easy mode gave me a good chuckle. I agree.
I concur!
I never thought about that but when you say it that way I completely agree.
Fawriel ỹ
I like this comment. It's a good way to put it. I should steal it.
Nintendo is doing another genius version of an assist mode with the donkey kong switch port and the Funky Mode. They allow you to play as Funky Kong, an invincible, infinite jumping, perma floating, easy rolling god under the belief that you get all of these new mechanics because Funky Kong is simply too cool to die.
they previously did something similar with Nabbit in new super luigi U.
Let's just hope Funky doesn't have all those abilities if he's ever added to smash.
Kody Jackson that.... strangely makes sense
Thanks a ton for bringing this one up.
I hate how they implemented it though. Funky mode is the default setting. I had a friend who hadn't played the Wii U version and didn't want to read the menus, so he just started the game in Funky Mode. After playing a few worlds I convinced him to start over in regular mode and he enjoyed it much more.
I played 90% of Celeste without Assist mode, but there were some parts I tried 50,000 times and was never getting closer, I was getting frustrated and angry and wanted to quit and never play again. Assist mode helped me in those moments, I could flick it on, adjust the difficulty in the slightest way to get past that one speedbump, then flick it off again. A lot of the time I knew what i had to do, and if I tried it another 50,000 times I could do it. But it was making the game unenjoyable and the option to move past it really helped me enjoy it. To the point I recommended the game to my friend who loved the idea of the game, but has trouble with stuff like Celeste and Super Meat Boy.
Accessibility is important, I remember being a little kid and my parents would play Diablo II, me, wanting to play myself to feel included, would never handle it at my age with how hard the game was, so my dad gave me a god mode cheat, and I could feel included. It means a lot to someone when they can enjoy the game just as much as someone else, even if they're not as skilled.
I still remember back when original DOOM first came out. Our PC at the time probably couldn't run it (not that it mattered - Mom and Dad had it on veto) but a friend had a newer PC that could, and one day visiting we binge-played through it using just the invincibility cheat, but that didn't matter.
I did wind up with a bit of nausea, however -- at the time I blamed it on the graphics, but now I realize that it was probably due to it being a 3D game and me playing it uninterrupted for a few hours on end.
I beat the whole game 100% all strawberries b-sides, c-sides but then I played Farewell, Farewell is actual cancer. It took me about 3 days of binge playing during my free time to beat two-thirds of it. And the parts I beat were the easy parts so I realised it would take another two weeks to beat the game and just turned on infinite dashes so it would still be decently hard but way easier, I then beat it that same day. I was not skilled enough to do the hardest part of the game but assist mode made it fun instead of infuriating
😂
In other words you couldn't do it and instead of getting better and rising to the challenge you simply bitched out and went to easy mode
@@lordcommissar7813 But what's wrong with that? Someone beating the game in a way - even if that means they 'cheated' - that they can enjoy sounds great to me! It's not like there's any money on it or they're submitting a speedrun or whatever.
Something about Celeste's optimistic, brave, "this is hard but I believe in you" music coming on while the explanation for assist mode occurred just...oof, really got to me. Love that approach
Personally I prefer when games incorporate difficulty in a more organic way, such as having the main areas relatively easy, but allow players to try side areas or bonus zones that are clearly meant to be more challenging and/or more rewarding if they feel up to it. In New Vegas for example there are about a dozen warnings telling you NOT to try and cross the northern quarry full of deathclaws early on, but you can still try it anyway (and get mauled horribly as a result).
Though I suppose that's more classic game difficulty and doesn't do much for actual accessibility.
Reminds me of Mario Oddysey. The hardest parts are all post game content.
That's exactly what happens in Celeste, Strawberries, B- and C-Sides, Golden Strawbs
New Vegas is actually a fairly good example of accessibility because most quests can be completed peacefully and because you can use VATS. VATS isn't a win button even on the easiest setting either - your choices as to how you allocate your stats still matter so if you fail to kill a bad guy before they kill a quest essential character or whatever when you've got a motor disability and depend on VATS that's still on you. It's not exactly what the devs intended but it does remind me of how in XCOM and Fire Emblem and how RNG alone never damns your unit andthat your choices always have a hand in their death.
New Vegas is just gobshite for colour blindness though. It's ugly normally but without colourblind modes it can be tough to make out the wasteland.
@@Cellyestial. Damn those golden strawberries in C-Sides…
Celeste pretty much does that with strawberries and cassettes. Main game is pretty basic without going for any of those
Mark that bit at the end about players not being good at designing their own games was very smart and insightful.
Yeah, I hate it when games force you to choose difficulties (you don't even any reference on the base difficulty) from the get-go. And most tell you that NOT choosing difficult would rob you off of the full-game experience and endings!
I wish more devs would let players get a taste of their game on the first segment and maybe when the player hit their first death or lose or dead end, the subtly suggests there are options or whatnot. Also, I hate those assist options with quirky names and don't have secondary explanation on what that option does.
yeah, letting you actually play at least a little bit before choosing difficulty would be much better than making you choose without knowing what you're really doing. they can start you on the intended difficulty that way as well
Underrated comment
I think that a game should let you play on optimal difficulty first, then if you lose (in rougelikes), you can choose a new difficulty (or in other games, change difficulty during the game).
Mario and Luigi kinda does this, if you die to a boss too many times, it gives you easy mode
Yeah beside a game is meant to be FUN
Hearing you say “Who cares about achievements anymore.” Physically hurt when I remember how much time I spent getting all the achievements in A Hat In Time.
I spent hours getting as many achievements as possible per run in Long Live the Queen, I feel your pain. Still, I don’t even care about achievements normally but did for that game, so maybe there’s still value in getting the achievements you got if A Hat in Time made it feel valuable.
Kinsey Lise Well actually, you do get a prize after 100%-ing the game, but since I was a console player I didn’t get the prize because of some stupid glitch,
But hey I still felt accomplished so idrc
Lol I had the same feeling when I remember that I got "Rare Specimen" in Black mesa
Yep. I love achievement hunting, so when one of my friends used a tool (Steam Achievement Manager) to unlock all achievements for every game they had, it was quite the gut punch.
same i spent 7 hours getting all the achievments in minecraft bedrock education
Great stuff as always! Totally agree with your position on this. I have lots of friends who enjoy the narrative aspects of games, but can't hack challenging combat or platforming. Allowing causal players to progress through a game instead of resorting to watching Let's Play videos seems like a totally reasonable idea. I don't know how hard it is to implement granular difficulty systems, but they Celeste's system certainly seems like a best in class option
BRICK 101 you hit the nail on the head! You are intuitive.
BRICK 101 The issue is why not have separate modes? Having an everpresent cheat system available might be great for people who want to sleepwalk through the game, but for those that don't they have to put up with the temptation to skip the filing hard parts.
Just seperate the nodes.
Great video. Regarding the Simple mode that Cuphead offers, perhaps if they called it Training mode we would be having a different conversation
that's a much better name for it
That is a straight up UX communication problem. Like mark said in the video, communication is key and "Simple" doesn't communicate what is actually happening nor does the term infer the right idea of what is happening in a gaming context. Something like training mode implies by it's meaning that this isn't the proper thing. Great idea.
I'm not sure that solves the fundamental problem of treating it as a "not real" version of the game, artificially and unnecessarily blocking access to content because it wasn't played on the right mode.
A training mode, however, would be much better, when you couldn't die in training mode to fully experience the phases of a boss to then finish it in regular mode.
I would called it "Less Hard but still fucking too Hard mode"
I also hate choosing difficulty at the beginning. It makes me feel like I might be making a mistake and ruining my own gaming experience.
I’m not talking about picking easy mode necessarily. For instance: in The Last of Us I picked normal mode at first and then realized the game felt way better in hard mode-since it transmitted the survival intend much better that way-thus making me feel like I sent a lot of my gaming experience to the dump by playing in normal mode.
EDIT: Thanks a lot for the likes guys; I'm glad to know we feel the same.
God, same. I saw he had Subnautica as an example on the video and that's one I experienced recently that really pissed me off when I booted it up for the first time. It had all these difficulties listing what is and isn't changed, but because I'd not started the game I had literally no concept or how important each component was or wasn't to the game. How am I meant to know how difficult enabling or disabling hunger and thirst will make the game without actually playing it? I ended up picking survival because I assumed that's how it's meant to be played, but even that wasn't really made clear.
I really agree they should give a much clearer idea of the difficulties if they're gonna give them at the beginning. I don't need a description about Hard mode that says "This is a difficulty that is more difficult than medium." that is very unhelpful and I have played many games on too easy modes because I tend to air on the side of caution when I have absolutely no info.
It's funny that you mention the last of us because I actually just played the second game on moderate, but the resources were way way to common, and I'm playing it on survivor now and It is really getting my heart pounding in a way the easier mode never did. I'm not sure what the solution is but I think games should either seriously explain what each mode is, what it does, exactly, and how it relates to an ideal experience, or just don't put difficulty options at the beginning of the game and integrate those options some other way.
This was true for me with doom. I almost never touched the game again after being bored out of my mind with it on my initial try. I still can't say I love it as much as others but I finally got some genuine enjoyment when I played it on hard.
@@tracystevens6930 In the first game it's just as you say too-playing The Last of Us in Normal Mode feels like resources' pinata. It kills a lot of that "manage yourself smartly to survive" feeling I get the game is trying to convey. It really is like TLoU in Survival Mode is more what TLoU is meant to be than Normal Mode.
I play every game on the highest difficulty and hate it when it is not unlocked from beginning. I want to play a game so long as possible and a higher difficulty force me to use more of the game mechanics.
Great analysis. Another example of "assist mode" is the customizable worlds in Don't Starve. I usually get rid of a few of the most horrendous features, such as smoldering and Dragon in the summer (I also turn up flower gen, but don't pick them -I just think it looks cool). MY goals are impeded by these things, and I've had games ruined by them, so I "nerf" the game. But Ive put more time into that game than any other, largely due to these assists.
Customisable gameplay is a good way to make certain games more accessible. I like (and with 1800 just out, it's a current example again) the Anno series and have played them since the first. Most of them have a large range of options for a new play (sandbox being the regular game type, anyway) and you can decide who you want on the map, how much resources you start with, how small or large the islands are, and a lot of other things. Like this, it's easy to have a custom game tailored to your needs as a player (and slowly rise the difficulty as you grow more experienced in the game).
True. The only feature I change in Don't Starve is the hounds, because something about them really freaks me out hard, to the point of quitting the game. I play the rest of the game as intended and have a blast without them.
that moment when you realise marks youtube channel is called McBacon1337
stopppp
McMakeUs
Dude, how did you figure that out?
I expect the information was found in the URL in the search bar on the channel page.
Thaaaaaat's pretty amazing. lol
This was great Mark! I've been thinking a lot about this topic lately as well, it's important to give people as many options to enjoy an experience as possible, but communication is key.
Glad you're bringing more attention to a phenomenal game too:)
Snoman Gaming Nice seeing you here man! Why wouldnt you watch mark brown afterall? I start to really get the feeling that most of the game design centered channels here on youtube support each other and have a genuine apreciation for everyones work, and thats just an amazing thing to do. And not just game design channels, i sometimes see some familiar faces pop up in channels like errant signal and extra credits, so thats also pretty cool. Anyway, cheers ;)
Luis Chaves
I think you are right about game design channels supporting each other. I reckon it's because game design on TH-cam is still a pretty small niche comparatively and it's not something you get into unless you are genuinely interested in the technical of how games work.
What? 😳 Snowman Gaming and Mark Brown? I am humbled by your collective presence 😵
Yeah, we’re all big fans of each other’s work
Mark Brown Ok, thanks for "clearing it up" ;)
I used assist mode on celeste when I first played, and that helped me undestand the game better so i could play it without assist mode on my second playthrough.
Celeste is too fast-paced for me, so I usually play the game at 80%-90% because my reaction time and information processing isn't the fastest.
Slowing it down does make sense. I usually end up memorizing the inputs, mostly through trial and error, because I can't react to much in that game.
But I'm not going to touch the extra dashes. Those completely break the game.
@@HalNordmann What's giving you trouble?? that seems very slow
they actually want to make it hard to feel the emotion of madelines current state you have to try and try again to face the level and finish it
same. i play it at 70%, it feels more proper to me
@@martinacuna9556 i mean... don't you think proper is 100% speed? it just makes sense
I fell in love with this game. I had one moment where I almost turned on assist mode, but I didn't, and it made beating the game all the more gratifying.
I got really close to using assist mode during my play through of Celeste when I reached chapter 9. I was literally hovering over the ‘turn on assist mode’ button.
But honestly, after the whole talk about what the devs intended with the games difficulty I decided against it even though I *really* wanted it on. I died over 3000 times that level but, in the end, yeah it was worth it.
I played celeste for the first time after watching this video, and I honestly don't think I would've made it past the first level without assist mode. I'm terrible at platformers and have never been good at being precise in games that absolutely require it. With assist mode activated, I made it through the whole game on about 3 hours and I loved it. The story, music, and environments were so great that it upsets me I would've missed it otherwise. I wouldn't want a mode like this in all games, but I'm damn glad I was able to experience a great game with it.
I like how in Everspace, normal difficulty is described as "the way you're meant to die", efficiently communicating that it's the intended experience and that dying is normal.
I knew you was ganna make a video about Celeste but i didn't expect you to make a video about it's assist mode. You make very unique videos.
Were going* its assist mode* (removed the apostrophe because it's means it is while its is a possessive s)
hi mark - loved the video! just a thought - Celeste's Assist Mode fits really well with the theming of the game as well. the mountain climbed by Madeleine is something she tackles on a purely personal level - the standard for success is set purely by her - and the mountain YOU (the player) climb is similarly self-enforced, right? and that gels well with the themes of anxiety and depression presented - it's not about the size of the mountain, but the fact you're climbing it at all.
love your videos :)
I read an article a while ago in a Game Informer about someone who's disabilities hindered their ability to play most games, as desperately as they wanted to. Their muscles simply didn't allow them to, no matter how hard they tried. That really stuck with me, as I'd never considered the perspective of someone who was disabled in regards to difficulty in games. Nowadays, I really appreciate game developers for adding in these kinds of customizable experiences - it might be difficult but doable for me, but it could be impossible for someone who simply wasn't born as able as I am, and that really sucks, so any way game developers try to alleviate that roadblock is really cool in my book. After all, trying to gate off people from experiences because you had to go through a tough time is kind of silly, just in general. Why can't we make things just a little more accessible for those who need it?
I've always thought choosing a difficulty level with NO context and before even playing a game is an awful idea. What is "hard"? Is it Mario Kart hard? Or Bloodborne hard?
I think games should have a cleverly designed intro level, which assesses your skill and, after completion, tells you _"based on your performance, we've assigned a hard (or whatever) difficulty setting. Feel free to override this in the options menu"_
Or, alternatively, ALL games which offer difficulty settings should have your standard "easy", "medium" and "hard" as well as a fourth option - "adaptive" (like Resident Evil 4). Although, I will admit, this might be harder than I understand to program (I don't make games so I don't know).
Resident Evil 4 is really good at hiding it's adaptive difficulty too. I didn't even notice until after I helped dad with a section and noticed it was way easier. Then it hit me after I looked into it.
In titanfall 2, after you beat the tutorial, it recommends you a difficulty option for the game
This happens in th witcher 2 if u do the tutorial
As someone with a disability, I really appreciate this approach to difficulty.
@@ddd-op5wy That wasn't very cash money of you.
ppfresh in my case I have unilateral cerebral palsy, which affects my fine motor skills so certain movements of joints in my left hand are near impossible. So a mode like this is highly appreciated for me. There is also no need to belittle and berate someone for there own specific needs. So could you please understand that your elitist attitude is not welcome.
@@ddd-op5wy I have colorblindness, so some games that deal with color are completely out of the question unless they have accessibility modes. i also have seizures that make playing action time based games pretty difficult at times, so i like when RPGs that use that system let me switch to turn-based instead :)
@@ddd-op5wy Dude, chill. There are literally some people who cant even move their body, so you dont need to act like him having a disability is not a reason.
Utterly agreed. My own issues (anxiety and lack of fine motor control) keep me from enjoying almost any game that isn't a turn-based RPG. I'm delighted to see this recent trend towards accommodation.
Beyond that, as listed in the Mario Odyssey example, imagine how many younger kids will be able to get into games because the mechanics are on their skill level? I love that!
Even outside of accessibility for handicaps I just wish difficulty settings gave us a better concept of what they would be before I play them. I'm finding recently now that I'm older I have to restart a lot of games to change the difficulty. Usually, for me, this means making it harder. For instance (yes I know I'm way way behind) I recently started Kingdom Hearts 2 and found the game boring to unplayable until I restarted on critical. But if I put every game on the hardest difficulty I don't think I'd get very far. I wish they'd just tell you what changes specifically with each adjustment. If all your going to do is put waves and waves of same looking enemies that act the same way between normal and hard than I don't really feel like playing hard. If enemies are smarter, if I have to play more tactical and less button mashing than I may have a better experience on hard.
Yeah, I don't know what this isn't more common. Some games *do* do this, mainly old CRPGs, where it's very transparent about what changes, but most others. Nothing.
I'd like it if there were "test sections" or something, so you could compare them and figure out what feels good to the player before they start, especially since, for a variety of reasons, a lot of games have locked difficulties.
Iirc the witcher 2 has an arenaat the start, and how well you do in it gives you a difficulty suggestion.
I would never have played Minecraft on hard mode if I didn't accept it to play on most servers.
Being able to change the difficulty mid-game should always be a thing, too. Who cares if it disables achievements for beating the game on certain difficulty? I'd rather beat a game and not get a stupid achievement that doesn't mean anything to me than not beat the game at all because I don't want to continue on the difficulty I picked but also don't want to start over to try another setting.
As a gamer with a disability that at times can really impact my reaction time, having options like this so I don't have to put a game down entirely until I'm having a good day and am able to actually make progress means so much to me. I want to be able to play the games as intended, but sometimes I'm just not able to, and having the option to make certain things a little bit easier on bad days means so much to me.
"Hey, who cares about achievements anymore." He said, as I was listening to Game Maker's Toolkit while trying to get the "WOW" achievement for Celeste. Sigh.
I’m really happy that developers are catching onto how to do accessibility right.
I never would've seen the second half of my most foundation game, Jedi Knight, without cheats. I became a famous FAQ writer because I had a memory card with all GFs and cards unlocked in FF8 on the first screen. It allowed me to learn how to game the game and write really slick guides and start people down paths to write their own. I strongly highly encourage games to have "lab" modes that let you break them.
oh my god. i love you.
"assist mode let my four year old nephew complete the game all by himself" - exACTly. when people are against easy modes, all i can hear is "get lost children, this is MY toy". as someone who is really terrible at videogames, i empathise with the kids more than the bully. i bought dark souls 3 and cant even make it to the first boss. i do understand that the difficulty is necessary for this game, and thats why so many people love it. but to me, its just a waste of £40 and makes me feel really bad about myself. having said that, i completed celeste on normal difficulty and this video makes me feel proud of that :) anyway, im rambling. but the point is, i love you.
I remember being like, 6 years old, and my parents would play Diablo II and I couldn't because it was too hard, dad found a god mode cheat and I got to feel included. It's a small thing, put games should be enjoyable.
casual
Feeling like a hero or an overpowered entity in a single player game with a storyline is the main dish of the game. Agree, i luv u 2 bro.
You also have to incentivize people to improve... even adults tend to take the path of least resistance. The problem is, usually nothing in a game tells you how to do so. I remember (was born in the 80s) going to the library and going through nintendo powers to try to find tips on games I was struggling with. The Street Fighter games are a good example... I didn't understand the game of "footsies" and how animation frames played a role in which attacks landed; I was mashing buttons. It wasn't until playing with someone who understood this and taught me HOW to play a fighting game that it started to make sense.
Level design can often accomplish teaching the player.... one of the reasons Celeste is such a great game, but certain games have more obtuse mechanics are are far more in depth. I remember when I was a child that the mindset was to take no mercy on anyone else, but it was part of your job to teach them how to get better. It is really a different mindset between those who demand an easy mode because they feel like they inherently "deserve" to beat a game, and the idea that failure is part of the process and it was your job to get better.
So where does that leave us today when we want difficulty in games to exist? People are far more atomized these days, we don't sit down next to each other and play, and we might not have an adult or older sibling sitting next to us to help us learn how to play. Perhaps part of game design can help with this. To go back to the Street Fighter example, something like Skullgirls is AMAZING. The order of fighters you face off with helps you learn certain concepts. The training options are also fantastic and completely transparent to the player. Even better, it has fantastic tutorials that TEACH you how to play the game one step at a time. It isn't "baby's first fighting game".... it has a tremendous amount of depth and complexity and stands alone as a title worth playing, but it is accessible at any level of play.
I wish I would have had something like that years ago, even with help from others. Seriously, I challenge anyone who has never played a fighting game to give Skullgirls a try. It combines the best of all of these ideas. It teaches you from the ground up how to play a fighting game, has different difficulty levels, and incentivizes you to improve at the game. It doesn't hand anything to you, but helps you get better. Instead of a conversation about whether or not games should have an easy mode, I think we are better served to ask how games help players improve.
It's not so much "get lost, this is my toy," it's more "not everything has to be for everybody." And I mean that with all the good sentiment in the world. You shouldn't feel bad about yourself for not being good at Dark Souls. Something about it just didn't click with you and that's super okay. I just don't think devs need to change their design philosophy to accommodate. The world is full of other great games.
"At one point, it was going to be called 'cheat mode', but the devs thought that felt judgmental. They're Canadian."
As a Canadian, I can confirm that this is accurate.
As an Asian, I can also confirm that they are Canadian.
😅
Always a delight seeing the name "arin hanson" in your patron list.
He could learn a thing or two
Arin is a terrible person and "comedian"
Is he a terrible person or just annoying?
to me he's both. He's a always acting like an asshole to Dan by constantly interrupting him and not caring about his stories. He's such a contrarian by saying anything anyone likes is bad and this in turn because Dan never plays games, influences his idea of them. Sometimes he sees through his bullshit but man, Arin is just out to be annoying. He even insulted his fans unironically. Like, How can you even stand someone like him?
Wait why the comment “but who cares about achievements anymore?” Why not do a GMTK on that? I personally love the challenge of achievement hunting and getting that 100% in a game like, for example A Hat in Time. In that game, very few of the achievements are mandatory and almost all of them force you to think of new strategies on how to win. They also bring a new optional difficulty to those players that want it. Hat in Time obviously isn’t the next Dark Souls, but defeating a boss without getting hit once certainly adds a challenge that I wouldn’t have gotten otherwise. I’d love to hear a GMTK from my favorite TH-camr about how achievements affect a players enjoyment of the game or how they allow developers to bring in the experience they believe is best for the player.
Mark Spangler a video on achievements would be nice. Generally I'm not a fan, the achievements break my immersion, but there are a couple games like TF2 and Bulletstorm that do it really well.
The one problem with achievements is people who care about other people's achievements.
Who cares about achievements? Um... I do?
Exactly!
That is a good point, I hope he would bring it up in his video.
I really like that assist mode is _not_ buried in a menue, but is instead clear and noticable. A lot of the players that would need an assist mode are new to gaming, or just not as experienced in it, and those people aren't very likely to find an option buried in a menue, especially if they don't think that option exists at all. Putting the assist mode option in a clear place, but properly communicating it's intention, makes sure that everyone who might need assist mode knows it's available to them.
I'm someone who typically play on easy mode, or hacks the game to make it easier (usually infinite lives, although I am currently playing Hollow Knight with an invulnerable mod on)
This isn't because I'm bad at games or anything. In fact, I played Dream Drop Distance, on its hardest mode once or twice
I play games that way, because I have disabilities that can make games, a nightmare to play
However, I also want the game, to be at least a "little" difficult for me
When I played Celeste, I did play with Assist Mode on. However, I rarely had invincibility on
This is because, I wanted it to be easier for me to play, but I didn't want it to be... Too easy?
I have played hollow knight( i have 72 hours) and i do not have a disability in any way, hollow knight can sometimes be really fast paced which is pretty hard
I wish i could've just got an invincibility mod but(i own it on the nintendo switch)
I wish i could've just got an easy mode but im playing it the way team cherry wanted me to play it.
( i apologize if my English is bad)
@@bort3624 Just want to say your English is good, and you do not need to apologize.
@@bort3624 As someone who is progressing throught the game without much trouble, I do think an easy mode or even two easy mode should have been offered. Do you struggle only with combat or is exploration also an issue?
I'm a completely able-bodied (although neuro-divergent with an anxiety disorder), but I do have the debug mod installed for hollow knight. I installed it for the white palace, and I really don't regret my choice. I did all of the climb legit, but I took breaks in between, and the bench system means that if you stop after room 1 of the ascent, you lose all of your progress. I'm just not about that life.
@@blaise931 I did something like that for a platforming segment with even fewer checkpoints. No debug mod, but I did leave the game on in the background and put the computer on hibernate instead of shutting down and having to exit the game. Unfortunately, minimised HK still makes my laptop run hot, so eventually I had to abandon ship and go do something else.
I think cheat codes are the best option. They're more fun to use than a simple toggle, there's absolutely no margin for miscommunication, they're a trademark of vidya as a medium, and they allow for much wackier changes than might otherwise be included.
I love the cheat codes in Age of Empires
I don't think you should use cheat codes in place of accesibility option since cheat codes by their very nature are hidden. But I'm all for bringing back fun and engaging cheat codes.
@@hedgehog3180 I would love cheats and accessibility options to be equally available and clearly marked. It would make games so much more fun!
Again, it is in the name, "cheatcodes." New players may not understand that they are not just a way to cheat in a game, but just a way to have fun in your own way. They alienate the people that need the cheats the most.
totally. i grew up with spyro dotd on ps2 and since me and my bro was 2 young 2 rlly b any good, our older brother showed us the cheats and i remember feeling like a hacker every time i put them in hahaha.
Hey Mark! what do you think about "getting over it"?
I'm over it
:D Not exactly what i was expecting but good answer :D
badum tss
Is this an internal joke?
It is a game called "getting over it"
It'd be interesting to see you delving into difficulty in games, and different ways to go about it.
- Personally, I don't think Dark Souls needs an "Easy, Normal, Hard" option, because that's not how it handles difficulty. Rather, through items, weapons and armor you have a lot of control over the difficulty you experience. This was very apparent to me, as a friend of mine killed Gwynn, the last boss, in two-three hits using Greater Magic Weapon, while I had about 5-6 attempts before beating him.
- The penalty of dying is also interestingly enough called "punishing." You lose all the souls upon death, yes, but enemies respawn meaning you will potentially double those souls. A more skilled player will have less souls to spend, where the ones that die more often actually get extra currency to spend. I certainly did my first time around with the game.
I think challenge in games and the failure state, which is unique to the interactive medium, is taken for granted by a lot of players and developers.
I don't really agree with this. Dark Souls may be made slightly easier by using certain weapons, but they usually come with their own penalties. A stronger weapons will have much slower swings, for instance. Plus people love to parrot that magic user = easy mode, but not only is this removing all flexibility in the game (what if someone struggles with the game but doesn't want to use magic? what if they want to play as a hulking knight with a huge sword?), but it's also not knowledge that's made known to the player in the game itself. The only way you can know this is by going online and searching for ways to make the game easier.
The base game even with the 'best' weapons and armour is still difficult for some players. I had a friend who absolutely loved everything about Bloodborne from the design to the music to the lore, but even when overlevelled they were still struggling to even get through some of the maps, let alone make it to the bosses (not to mention BBs vial system was extremely punishing to those that struggled). I ended up joining their game as a second player and basically carrying them through most of it just so they could experience the game in full. Not everyone has the luxury of finding second players to carry them, and not everyone wants to play with others.
The souls example is also not a great one, because its counter productive. Like you said, you lose souls on death. You're saying this is great for unskilled players? But what about the ones who lose all their souls and aren't able to get back to where they were without dying. Again. And again. And again. They're not rewarded for that, they're left with 0 souls and a lot of frustration. The only way a less skilled player could take advantage of this is killing some of the easier mobs, running back and resting at the bonfire, and repeating this over and over until they can level up, and that's not fun or what the games intention is.
Absolutely nothing would be removed from the game if some accessibility options were added to the game. They could have something tucked away in the menus that halved health, and the standards players would never even have to consider it's existence. The trouble with things like the Soulsborne series is people have started measuring their e-peen over their achievements in games. And the other trouble is that people are constantly moving those goal posts to suit their ego. "Oh, you finished Bloodborne? Well I bet you had help from other players, only true fans play it solo. Oh, you finished it solo? Well I bet you used Ludwigs blade, that's easy mode, true fans never use that. etc etc"
@@Spamhard Yeah, I have a platinum in Bloodborne, an extremely over leveled character and a +10 whirligig saw with amazing blood gems. The game can still kick my ass if I make a mistake. Example: The Watchdog in the defiled chalice can one shot me even at 50 vitality, so I still need to have good enough reaction times to avoid it. An easier difficulty in a soulsborne game definitely would not involve better equipment or stats.
Personally I think an easier setting would probably involve things like more lenient parry windows, more I frames when you dodge, enemies react slower, etc. I also think the way they could impliment it would involve a dynamic difficulty scale like in Resident Evil 4. So the game on that mode can still be a good challenge but it's more fine tuned to the player's ability.
I finished the game on my own but I've also helped people get the platinum too, there's no shame in needing a little help if it allows people to enjoy the game.
@@ConfettiCasket Absolutely agree. I also got platinum for BB because it's one of my fave games an I was willing to endure the chalice dungeons for it :P But yeah, same, my first character is very high levelled because of all those chalice dungeons, hit the soft cap for all skills and even the hard cap for some, and some of those bosses still wrecked me- same as you the watchdog took me out a few times, and I think I resorted to cheesing amigdala (the ol' run through the legs tactic, hit, repeat) just because one wrong step was virtually impossible to recover from and the flailing limbs phases were tough to position in a small room. (Plus by that point I just wanted to be done with the fucking chalice dungeons, I hate them so much haha)
So yeah, even if a player was struggling and grinded to soft capping all skills, that still doesn't guarantee they'll have an easy time. I agree with things like parry windows and i-frames and stuff. I remember in stuff like batman there used to be parry button prompts to help learn timing, and then they were removed in harder difficulties so that's a potential thing some players could switch on perhaps.
I'll just never personally understand the gate keeping of harder games. Completing BB on the original/hard setting would still be an achievement that you can be proud of, I'm not sure how someone playing on an easier setting removes that achievement. I'd much rather be able to share one of my all time favourite games with other people without the fear they'll not be able to play it.
@@Spamhard I'm not saying it is "great" for unskilled players. I'm am very consciously using the word "potentially double those souls", if you make it back to the place you lost them, this time knowing enemy placements, moves and the level.
Magic IS absolutely an easy mode. You can do heavy damage to most enemies from a long range. Buff up your longsword with magic, and already there you've got a significant stat increase. I'm not saying you have to choose it, though. My friend was very much power playing, when he did that. I chose the playstyle I liked, because I was more likely to stick with the game using that. But the game lets you choose various ways to approach the challenges. I don't think that's a bad thing.
The big difference in how weapons feel makes it an even tougher balancing act. What does an easy mode with a Greatsword vs. magic look like? Each weapon has different timing and stats. If my friend could two shot Gwyn with Greater Magic Weapon and literally pummel him into the ground with a greatsword, does that need to be a one shot instead? There are many ways the mechanics interact, and it isn't as easy as just lowering the numbers.
I'm not one of those, who brag about having finished a souls game. Many people have completed it, and it mostly requires a bit of patience and learning the placement and timing of enemies and your own weapons. Don't presume I'm comparing "e-peens" here. I don't think every game needs an easy mode. I don't think every game needs a "hard mode" either. There are well done "assist/easy" modes and horribly done "hard" modes out there.
@@ConfettiCasket I like your ideas here. More lenient parry windows and more i-frames when dodging could actually work very well. Enemy AI could also work, but FromSoft has mostly placed enemies so that they provide an interesting challenge or reward paying attention to your surroundings.
My main gripe isn't that people need a bit of help or having an easy mode, per se. I notice some people asking what this "souls" experience is, not understanding that people like it because that they have to struggle a bit with it. It's not a game "for everyone" in that sense. I've seen people just disliking it for being "too slow".
In that sense, I'm unsure what exactly it is that they dislike. The fact that they can't just hack'n'slash their way through it, or because they like the gameplay but are struggling way harder than they should (in which case, lets look at what an easy mode should look like).
The discussion seems to be these hypothetical "purists" vs. the hypothetical "whiners". I'd really rather the discussion moved in more of a direction to the ideas you lay forth here. It's more interesting to discuss how the genre might best move forward, because as you say, I don't think it's through stats or equipment, but rather more lenient i-frames and parry windows. Thumbs up from me.
I really liked the easier mode system in Hades. It doesn’t actually change anything about the game, but it gives you 20% damage resistance and increases by 2% each time you die. This doesn’t let you just instantly win and still requires you to play a lot and die a lot in order to increase your abilities, and feels similar enough to the other ways your character powers up after each death that it perfectly integrates into the game
Personally, I love the way The World Ends With You handles this problem - changing the difficulty is not just an option, but an integral part of the game experience. You can both change the overall game difficulty (which results in different item drops) AND also lower your characters' level to get more experience. And while this does mean some content gets locked behind a difficulty gate, the game offers so much stuff to do it really doesn't matter unless you're a total completionist.
*fracturehill* The issue with TWEWY and locked content that you're talking about actually one of the reasons I appreciated that with NieR Automata, Yoko Taro outright refused to punish or reward altering the game's difficulty
TWEWY's only major issue beyond that was just that the overall difficulty scaling was fairly unintuitive early on and required a lot of early-game fumbling for the uninitiated
*Grilac* Kid Icarus Uprising is one of my all-time favorite games, but you're also right about the fumble-in-the-dark difficulty assessment there as well
One of the nice things about optional bosses in World of Final Fantasy - another surprisingly well-designed game in regards to the use of its' mechanics - is that the game goes out of its' way to make level recommendations known for coliseums, optional bosses and side-story bosses
fracturehill also, after a bit of struggle with the difficulty up and your level at 0 you have eventually eaten so many hamburger pizzas that you've practically become a god
The easy mode of Dark Souls is titled “magic user”, the penalty is that it makes you useless in pvp.
Yet most still use swords we play for the challenge.
Sure we could throw a few chaos bed Vestages or we can run up to it and smack it with a sword while we roll and dodge it's attacks
At least in Dark Souls 1, magic user can be deadly in PvP with the right gear and set up.. Feels great to home crystal spear on the enemy then swap to a dark orb to make them in the obligation to roll/block it, and use that to your advantage for a well timed attack with moonlight greatsword.
Not really. Yesterday I had a good fight with a sword user and he was cautious in approaching me and I hurt him a few time. I ended up dying but was a good fight.
@@mrgreen027 My friend you do not know the horror when a melee build sees a magic user, and pulls out a crowsbow.
i fucking s u c k at magic in dark souls lol
I keep coming back to this video and honestly I think it's some of your best work. To my mind it perfectly captures the conflict between two tricky extremes and comes to a solution that works perfectly.
With my issues with fine motor skills, hand-eye coordination, and inconsistent reaction times, I'm so thankful that there's an assist mode, as Celeste would be pretty much unplayable for me later on otherwise
Then play a game that don't demand that much reflex.
@@danieladamczyk4024 I usually do. Assist mode just allowed me to play a game I usually wouldn’t be able to play
@@atticusbulan3508 That wise. Still i want to know, why you want to play games that you aren't able to play.
And what you do after found out that game is beyond your abilites?
@@danieladamczyk4024 ADHD probably. I like playing some games for the story, and it feels different playing the game versus watching someone else play
@@atticusbulan3508 Thank you for your answer.
From my perspective watching and playing story focused games, feels this same.
Experince based video games in other hand must be played. That was Celest is a experince.
Poeple forgeth the experince can be bad. And we don't always are gona win.
Losing is this same important as wining.
Accepting that you can't climb this mountain and deciding what to do with it create a different story, that only you have.
For me "Assist mode" Should be a part of main campain where Madeline accepted that she can't climb this mountain alone and asked for help.
I always say "You're giving people options if they need them, but you're not asking them to design how the game should work."
I came up with that all by myself.
Mister Apple My Grandpa used to say the same thing before he died.
you are very clever :^)
That quote is from Hippokrates actually
I always say "You're giving people options if they need them, but you're not asking them to design how the game should work." I came up with that all by myself.
Wow, same!
thank god you tweeted about this because it wasnt showing in my sub box!
Fantastic Video!
This really resolves an issue I've been considering for literally years!
After watching an Extra Credits video arguing against formal difficulty settings, I found myself disagreeing but unable to express exactly why or what the solution should be instead.
Thank you for explaining exactly where the issue lies and how to resolve it!
Great video! I've only discovered your channel recently but they're just so insightful and amazing! :D
This is one of the better videos I've seen in this already fantastic channel. It applies not only to video game design, but I feel that many parallels can be drawn to UI/UX changes in software that usually leave the users feeling abandoned and frustrated.
Hammerwatch is the game that does this the best imo. When you are about to start a game, there is an optional menu you can go into with 2 columns. one column has various things you can tick a box to turn on similar to celeste's assist mode, but doing so gives you a score multiplier of something like .9 or .75 so you get a slightly decreased score. The other column has things you can tick that make the game harder and have score multipliers of 1.1, 1.25, and 1.5 so you get a higher score. I can only ever beat the game with infinite lives ticked, and I know my score suffers from it, but I wouldn't enjoy the game without it, and I don't really care about the score anyways because I suck at it.
Like skulls in halo?
*The most well rounded argument I've heard about difficulty*
When I think of difficult, I think *player skill lvl* vs. *game skill requirement lvl* .
Players with low skill lvl will have a relatively same experience on Easy mode, as more skilled players will have in Normal mode, as well as highly skilled players at Hard modes.
I finished *Devil May Cry 3 SE* on Easy mode and it as as much as thrilling as it was playing on Normal and higher much later with more experience.
I've always upheld dev/team's vision over my own accessibility, because I used to think the "magic" of video games can not come if we don't meet the dev team's vision.
It wasn't until playing games like *immersive sims* and *RPGs like Mount and Blade* is when I found that player customization WAS the magic.
Given your love for *Far Cry 2* , it reminded me of another grounded FPS called *Vietcong* . Game has a campaign mode, but also mode called _Quick Fight_ . In it, you can choose any map of your liking, customize yourself and your crew with any weapon you like, play as either US or Vietnam, and set how long the session would be.
I thought that was a genius feature, for people who just want a bit size fun after they come from work or something.
This mode could also work well for people who want too experience the grounded nature of the combat in a relatively safe environment before starting the campaign.
It's funny that you mentioned *Dark Souls* , because the game is quite customization with it's difficulty (at least as much as it can be). You can master certain weapons and character builds and complete the levels with them. And it a number of routes that you can take that have different levels of difficulty, some focus on enemies, other focus on environmental traversal.
But:
1. Just like the world, it keeps most of that vague. You need to figure things for yourself. This can be a double edge sword.
2. Trying new stuff and routes will lead to trial and error. And not everyone has the patience for that.
Also, *Devil May Cry 3/4* and most *Platinum Games'* automatic mode, where game will do many combos for you in an unobtrusive fashion.
Sorry for such a long comment, I get blinded by my thoughts.
I used to be adamantly anti-cheat and anti-easy mode in my youth as a gamer. It wasn't until I got older and was diagnosed with CTS that I realized many games are inaccessible to physically disabled folks (ie, I can't play most mouse and keyboard only titles or extremely demanding action games). Thank god devs are starting to adapt by making their games easier to play, allowing players to remap controls or use other controllers, etc.!
This video was expertly made with quality commentary. I showed my parents who never, if not *avoid* playing games and they perfectly understood your purpose. Nicely done. Subbed.
With celeste's assist mode there descriptions made it so I only used it once because of how they wanted me to use it. I turned on double dash for one room. I felt that if I used it I would be breaking the game, so I didn't want to because I wanted to play the game like they intended
i mean, you did use it
I just looked at this comment and went matching profile pictures
@@dangerousboop I’ve seen one person other then you with my profile picture…every time I think did I comment that?
@@FirstNameLastName-gh9iw same but then I realise
Great video, as always. I've personally wondered about balancing difficulty and accessibility, but never even considered a solution as tidy as yours. Using Celeste as a framework to show each of the elements functioning together was also a very clever way of structuring the argument.
I've been watching multiple videos from this channel for the past week since I'm growing the courage to start my first project and learn how to design games, but this has been a promoting channel for celeste. What a game, what a content creator.
Thanks from 2021.
I re-watch this video a couple times a year. It's really good, and I really appreciate what you do and your opinions. A positive light in the gaming community.
(10:55) I heard that part and thought hey maybe my 6 year old cousin could beat the game on assist mode. He was stuck on the sand kingdom for an hour in front of these three sand pillars that couldn't cross and I am very dissapointed
Spot on analysis. Game designers TYPICALLY know how to best create a curated experience, but not always for everyone. Communicating clearly is the key. Love your work!
Loved every part of this video. It really helps folk understanding the importance in assist mode in games and how it should never be a problem.
Wow, this was a great video. It also convinced me to give Celeste a try since I'm I love platforming games but dislike the insane difficulty some of these modern takes have been. Knowing I can tweak that difficulty if I need to is really assuring. So maybe I can see how far I can get before tuning it down. Awesome!
For a long period of my life I've played though the Campaigns of the Call Of Duty games on the easiest difficulty, Recruit. It wasn't because I was bad at the game, but because I just found it more fun to mindlessly sprint from one battle to another and focus on the story of the Campaign. When in multiplayer I could hold my own against stronger bots and actual players and I enjoyed that challenge, but that doesn't mean I'm always looking for it. Easy Modes and Hard Modes are great for people who really want to focus on a specific aspect of the game, while Normal Mode is the Perfect Balance as the developers saw it.
At least that's how I see it.
I had a somewhat similar experience. My aunt basically said she might buy me Jedi:fallen order or something else that i would enjoy more for the holidays, i don't get triple A games often, usually like 1 or 2 a year, so i looked up a plethora of reviews to see if it was something it was my cup of tea. A lot of reviews mentioned that if you didn't like uncharted you probably won't like fallen order.My ps4 came with uncharted 4 as a bundle, and i bought minecraft and a pool game (which where the only games i played on it) a friend came over a few weeks later and was like "hey i have a wii u and can't play this game, do you mind if i play it"
(And me being a very manipulatable 11 year old was like "sure")
So we got to the part where the main character meets up with his presumed dead brother, who was shot like 15 minutes ago, i was really not liking the story, (I was an easily emotionally provoked 11 year old so cut me some slack) he left shortly after that moment and i uninstalled the game not wanting anything to with it. (Four years passed)once I heard these reviews about the similarities between these two games I very reluctantly reinstalled the game and deleted the save data, the thing was i was painfully terrible at shooter's, the only one i had played was fortnite, which i didn't really click with that well and I only played because friends wanted to include me only to kick me later for being an incompetent teammate. So knowing uncharted was a shooter I played the introductory sequence with a tremendous amount of the "I'm probably really going to hate this" feeling. But the Game had a feature called "lock-on aim" which was very accurate aimbot. So i played the game essentially skipping the combat that wasn't melee and that allowed me to foucus on the story puzzles and climbing which seemed a lot better to me probably because I matured or something like that and after the part i had already experienced from 4 years ago i was completely immersed I loved the story and was thrilled to learn that uncharted 1,2 and 3 where free for ps plus members, the catch for me was that aimbot wasn't in the older games, but that was a good thing for me, I became better at aiming because I wanted to progress the story. Eventully I played a spinoff game that was originally going to be dlc for uncharted 4 off of a friend's account, aimbot was an option but i no longer wanted it because I became used to aiming and felt confident enough to play at moderate difficulty and i really enjoyed It and felt a perfect amount of challenge.
So If it wasn't for this aimbot or "assist mod feature" if you want to call it that i would never have gotten into the shooter genre, and my friends rarely kick me from their fortnite party's now so i think more games should have something like this. And on the topic of fallen order the easy difficultly is super pathetic while if I raise the difficulty by one it becomes impossibly difficult, while i still enjoyed it I would have liked it more if there was a middle ground, between really inexperienced and somewhat experienced sort of how uncharted 4 and celeste let you alter many or just a few factors of gameplay making them easier to approach as genre's and help you decide wether or not that is a game genre you enjoy.
Yeah! Easy mode could very well also be for the people who are in for the story or just to relax after a hard day. You don't have to prove yourself to anybody. Bless easy mode.
This reminds me when I just played GTA Vice City with cheats and no intents to actually solve the plot (because I suck), and I just wanted to buy a mansion and kill a bunch of people. I also liked going to "inaccessible" parts of the game and trying to enter with certain cheats, I even got into a blocked island with a water car cheat.
EDIT: I also loved hunting easter eggs lmao
Great vid as usual, but I just wanna say that your comment "Who cares about achievements any more?" at 10:14 kind of really stood out to me as a bit of a weird oddity in the video. Part of the point of this video is that Players should be able to play games however they want, however, that comment feels at odds with this point since it's brushing away a whole portion of achievement hunters that exist across a variety of communities and platforms. Having seen the developers comments on the Steam Forums about why they chose to have Achievements unlockable in Assist Mode, I can understand the decision, however, I think that it's a really interesting discussion point, because it's one of the few scenarios where having an assist mode can truly affect the experience for others, since there is no way to differentiate whether someone earned the achievements in a much more challenging, non-assist mode scenario, or with assist mode on, and comparatively little challenge, which overall has a detrimental affect to the achievement because it will always be assumed that it was achieved using the "easy" method. It doesn't distinguish whether someone has earned the achievement the intended way or not, and unlike simply playing a game for personal enjoyment, how you like it, with achievements in an achievement hunter's world, being able to use an assist mode to earn something that is supposed to indicate completing some part of the game the intended way to others kind of cheapens the whole of the achievements for that game. Does that ruin the game entirely? Of course not, but it's still an interesting and difficult to approach situation I feel.
Interesting, it makes me wonder though: Is achievement hunting about comparing to other players? Or collecting for oneself?
The rarity of an achievement can be an exciting feeling, but I don't feel like it's the reason people hunt for them. I see achievement hunting as more of a completion than competition goal, so it makes sense that completing a part of the game in any mode still gives an achievement for that.
I think people get achievements for multiple reasons.
I like looking at the global stats on steam to see what the rarest achievements in games are, because I feel more pride in a chiev that 2% of players have rather than what 80% of players have.
All assist mode does for achievements is makes them easier to get, so now when I'm looking at how many other people beat a really hard level, I'm also looking at people who beat it on assist mode, making a rare achievement less rare.
@CatandBonez the point is that that doesn't show up on achievements stats. It artificially inflates the number of people who got a particularly difficult achievement
I feel like if you're using an assist mode for its intended purpose, getting a particular achievement should take exactly the same amount of effort as it would for anyone else.
Sure, people will use assist modes to get an advantage, but ultimately achievements are personal. Having a separate leaderboard (or at least an option to filter leaderboard results) for assist modes would be wonderful though!
I don't care about how other people got any achievements, all that matters is you know that you did it legit!!
Great topic and very well made video discussing it. I'm really impressed by the quality.
I think they should lock off achievements to harder settings. Not all achievements like beating a level should be on everything, but beating the game on the hardest should be an achievement. I hate when games dont include achievements for difficulty. Sure it can make it so some people can't get those, but people who grind for achievements are usually more hardcore type people who likely are generally decent at games. I can see a counter argument for the other side but that side is such a small side for this you should go with the side that has a majority of players.
Great video Mark, as ever. Is it weird that I have very little general interest in game design, yet I enjoy these videos? I think they're just well written and interesting essays based loosely around something I really like (games, obvs) and that resonates with me. Keep up the good work. Really enjoyed Celeste, didn't use the assist mode, but it's still a cracking game. It's weird also being a youtube creator, in a totally different field mind, who also has a patreon yet still getting excited to see my username in the endboard credits ha.
I think Tom Francis's other solution in Heat Signature was a good one too: in addition to having the permadeath option, some missions also have a Glitchback Guarantee, meaning that if you get hurt, you'll be instantly teleported home, but the mission is failed. You can also choose each mission with a separate difficulty, each time you choose a mission. I highly recommend reading the Fair Points update blogpost on Pentadact.com, as it explains all the additions really well.
Hey Mark, this I think is the first video I've seen from you and I just had to say that you did an impressive job at it, while introducing me to some games I might like as well.
Great job, man!
I love your work! Thank you, your content is very valuable for me
The only thing I don't like about Celeste's assist mode is that it labels your save file as using it as soon as you turn the option on, even if it's just to see what it can do. I feel like there should be a bit of leeway there, even if it's as small as clearing a room with it marks the file, but just turning it on to see what the options are, even if you don't actually use them shouldn't permanently label your save file as being assist enabled.
Really it's a Badge Of Not Much, all it affects is itself.
Oh I know it doesn't really affect anything. All it does is exist on your file once it's been turned on. However, beating the game without it is as much an achievement as anything else in that game, and even if you haven't used it to actually do anything (like I did) people can still see Assist Mode on the file and thing "Well they didn't actually beat it themselves, they had help."
It’s literal like, being labeled with a disability kind of, or a criminal record.
It's akin to the "I'm a baby mode" thing that Mark said we should avoid. Why ridicule your players?
Well it got patched, it actually disappears now if you turn it off again
I stil can't get my head around people caring or even getting offended about how another person plays a single player game.
It doesn't change their own experience, so why care?
I prefer the traditional tank controls in traditional Resident Evil & when they added the new style AS AN OPTION in Resident Evil remake HD I laughed because it makes it so much easier.
But I didn't take offense, go online & harrass strangers. I can see why they did it.
That means you're not experiencing the internet as its designers intended. Which I guess is fine, if that's how you choose to enjoy the internet. As long as you realize harassing strangers is core to the intended experience.
Tank controls or GIT GUT SKRUB
People who make the game easier for themselves shouldn't get the same rewards as people who choose to grind through the tough parts with their skill.
Personal insecurity, or an infatuation with the idea of Big Men, in this case the developer, who get to tell others how things should be. I honestly hold no respect for anyone arguing the other position on this question.
It goes even beyond gameplay. I once asked for controller support in a game and got scorched verbally for it. It's rather silly. If others don't want to play with a controller, then don't. But why remove that option from other people? I'm not sure where this attachment or need to control other people's behaviour comes from, but it's rather disturbing.
Another thing worth noting, Assist Mode was also used to reduce frustration. On top of the other good things it helps with, being frustrated is just not how some people like to be. Maybe it lingers or isnt released after completeing the challenge. Maybe its not hood for their health, but they still like games. I think its important we recognise the validity of not wanting to be frustrated
Bro, that's a great way to look at this problem. Thanks for sharing this out look on difficulty.
This video really made me come to terms with ponderings I've had myself on the subject. I'm still a bit reluctant towards the culture of some of these things and how, for example, some mods can be very derogatory towards developers by naming mods things like "Make X better mod" and such. Not the mods themselves but the discourse surrounding it, but also realizing that I've been kinda stupidly judgemental and adding to the bad discourse. It's hard sometimes to separate the actual thing and the buzz surrounding it.
So, thank you for making this video and making me understand where I've been narrow minded!
After giving up on trying to make games a while back because I thought I wouldn’t ever have the stuff to do it, I watched your videos and it sparked my interest in it again and I’ve never been more excited to learn to make games. You’ve taken my favorite games and showed what was so good about them and it makes me feel like I can make great stuff too one day. I can’t thank you enough your videos are amazing!
Hooray!
What a great video! I have never really thought about the many nuances of the developers intended experience and difficulty.
Nicely paced vedio. I really liked it lot.
This is the first vedio I have seen form your channel. Congrads on 1 mil subscribers
You know, the way Celeste explains that assist mode is super uplifting. They are basically like "If you can't fly, we'll give you the wings! Now go and fly!"
I wish a certain other game I find myself unable to enjoy at all right now had such a mode too. Alas.
I find that pretty insulting. (the assist mode, not your comment)
How is assist mode insulting? If you don't need it, you don't have to mess with it. From what was shown in the video, you don't even have to read about what it is unless you try to turn it on. You can just see the words "assist mode" and make a pretty good guess what it is just from that name, and never try to turn it on if you don't want assistance, and then it never has to hurt your precious feelings by explaining it.
Whatever game journalist , back to walking simulators with ya.
Which other game would that be?
Well I know some people who where too bad to play the game properly and used that mode only to be left unsatisfied, because there is no longer a real fixed obstacle what they have to overcome they just maniuplate the game.
Instead the obstacles should get easier, not giving you debug tools. That's insulting because it's like they giving you support wheels although you haven't asked for them.
honestly I loved celeste, but I did get stuck on some levels. I’m glad I didn’t really know what assist mode was, or I might have used it when I was feeling frustrated to just get past a level
Never used the mode personally, even when I was super frustrated by stuff like chapter 9 part 2 and the golden strawbs(especially chapter 3 why was that so hard). It’s all about the challenge for me and I love learning and going back to levels I struggled at and destroying them. Stuff like wavedashing and the golden strawberries were awesome. That moment when I went back to chapter 1 and 2 that I remember struggling in and then goldening them in like an hour and only a few deaths. It really has that feeling of progress and accomplishment.
I really liked this video. The break down of different ways to approach the topic. The solution really is in the context of the game being designed. I think it gets really muddied though when games start getting changed post release with content patches. An example would be MMOs or the space strategy game Stellaris, which overhaul the entire game changing the experience from what may have been bought and enjoyed. Early access games run into that problem to, since players experience multiple versions of the game rather than the one and only released version. The vision of the game is hard for players to appreciate when they watch something they may have liked change too much. It would be like watching an artist paint over their own masterpiece over and over again.