A piece of advices, when using Chinese cleaver, always use your left hand knuckles to safeguard your finger tips while cutting with right hand holding the cleaver. In other words, always use claw hand gesture to hold whatever you are cutting. Because Chinese cleaver has the extended height compare to the western knife, the side of the cleaver will make contacts with your knuckles while you are cutting, therefore it greatly reduces the chance that you accidentally cut your finger tips as long as you make sure you cut straight down towards the chopping board without tilting the angle of the blade. And be aware of your pinky, I know some people's pinky finger is not fully retract when they use claw gesture.
Pinky? When I was a 17 year old apprentice, I once got told off for not tucking my thumb. I tend to learn better trying things out myself rather than getting a demonstration, which was the same in the case. Following day, there goes part of the top of my thumb. Luckily it was just thin slice
Forgot to mention that in a home invasion, arming yourself with this cleaver will debuff your opponent's leadership by 2 and increase their combat attrition rolls by 1.
But what if youre an internationally recognized agent that goes around telling people youre a secret agent and therefore, are constantly in danger?! *Cough*Archer*cough*
The Shi ba zi brand used to produce war swords/broad sword for warfare in China near a century ago. The whole township families were black smith. A few decades ago they started making chef knife they made fine chopping cleaver and rough/heavy ones with that traditional wood handle.
Thanks for this info! I have the smaller cleaver version of this blade from the same company. I've had it over a year, daily use. It has chopped through everything including bone. It didn't cost too much, and I have to admit I have been super surprised at what a great knife it has been.
Shi ba zi brand is originated in 557 AD as a weapon producer in Yangjiang when the sword-manufacturing technology of general Feng An's sabre spread to locals, but it has not become a corporation until 1983. Yangjiang is, however, still the largest knife production city in China today, but the world standard is totally different from the time the brand was established.
While I like Chinese cleavers.... com'on... what you said is true of any knives. French Chef's, German Chef's, Japanese Nakiri.... they all work in rain, snow....etc.
Love my Chinese style cleaver. I even nicknamed it, Choppy Chop because of how well it works on all sorts of fruits and veggies. Plus when it comes to sharpening, I prefer it to a traditional chef’s knife because I don’t have to worry about maintaining a point on the blade. It’s a great example of simplicity being king. Loved this video, and I can’t wait to watch more of your work!
Lived in Hong Kong 19 years, but only started using the Chinese cleaver in the final four years - absolute revelation. It is true that you can't put the tip down and rock it back and forth like a western chef's knife, which takes the weight off the wrist for sustained use - but for home cooking where you don't need to dice 100 onions at a time, the Chinese cleaver wins.
@@ozisike family moved there for Dad's job when I was very young. Left Hong Kong for college stateside after high school, but went back and worked there for 5 yrs in the 2010's.
As 4/5 Chinese canto guy I can confirm that the clever has durability of a diamond. My parents still have a cleaver made in the 1800s from my grand parents and it looks fine and works fine
@@Drownedinblood interesting. I never heard of tenderizing meat with the flat of a blade. Thats usually not a good idea especially if u have a thin knife
My cleaver is now the only knife I use for cooking, it's so darn versatile, you can get some in so many different styles, for cheap, I have a small(ish) 6" cleaver, even though it's only 6", most people's jaw drop when I pull this out for cooking, an I'm waiting on my 8" that should get here today. The only things you need for cooking is a huge cutting board, a cleaver, a carbon steel wok, and pair of wok spatula and ladle, and you are golden. You can make ANYTHING in this... Soups... Steaks... Pasta... sauces... You can use it to fry anything too from chicken to making french fries... And if you get a metal handle wok, you can even stick it in the oven. I don't see anything you can't do with a wok, you aren't limited to chinese dishes!
Just to correct some misconceptions here. Some people suggest that since the Chinese style chef knife is call "cai dao" (菜刀), lit. vegetable, knife, it means that it's design purpose is to chop vegetable. We sometimes call cooking "zuo cai" (做菜), lit. make, vegetable, but that doesn't mean vegetable is the only thing being cooked. The "cai" here means dishes. It just means this knife is used for cooking. As for the knife, it is a general purpose chef knife. It has been said that the reason it is shaped this way is because of the popularization of stir fires and high heat fast cooking beginning in the Song Dynasty circa 10th century CE, and for that you need to dice and cut the ingredients, meat included, into stripes or thinner slices. The weight and shape of the blade help to expedite that work. The knife can be used for deboning or carving very efficiently, but that would require substantial training. It can cut through softer bones and it will be used to chop up ribs, for example. Professional Chinese chefs all use this knife for all types of preparation unless they face something that requires a special tool. Knife skill is considered the basic of the basic among professional Chinese chefs. This style of knife is intimating and can be difficult to wield for some home users, especially the younger generations, so certain people who have exposure to western style knives would use those at home instead. People who have experience with the Chinese chef knife tend to love it.
No, there is a different between 菜刀 and 肉刀. The vegetable knife is thinner, and more suited for fine cutting, while the meat cleaver is thicker and heavier to hack through bones.
These come in like 5 spine thicknesses the so called veggie knife designation is for home cooks only. The professionals call them "mulberry", "slicer", "all purpose", "bone", and "9kong" 桑刀, 片刀, 文武刀, 骨刀, 九江刀 The all purpose one can chop up to cooked chicken on occasion but not recommended. And a few specialty versions exist as well such as the duck knife and the dim sum knife. You can look up chan chi Kee's selection to learn more, they are the biggest exporters of kong kong knives to chefs around the world.
Traditionally, the Chinese diet contains a large number of vegetables and a small amount of meat, mainly chicken, duck, and fish. A thin blade can handle the tasks very well and efficiently. Oh, unlike Europeans who don't want to see small bones in their dishes, the Chinese chop the whole chicken or duck into bite-size with bones and cook.
Had my Chinese clever passed down from my parents Its just a simple stainless steel clever doesn't have any fancy wood handle Just a simple practical clever Used it on a lot on different foods, it doesn't matter meat fish chicken bone or vege A simple prep on the 5 dollar whetstone( also passed down) and its good to go One thing to elevate the pleasure lr experience of using a Chinese clever is a higher chopping board made from thick wood trunk, like those used by chefs in Chinese restaurants The cutting position would be better and some dampening from the chopping board itself The grain , hardness and type of wood would effect the cutting experience and how the clever stops when hitting the cutting board Typically western style comes with flat grain this will make the wood stronger when used and slight tendency to bounce the knives, and will give positive feedback when then knives hit the board, but this could cause some stronger vibration on the knives itself Compared to those used in Chinese restaurants, they're typically made by wood log or trunk milled in vertical grain and around 3"or even more depends i personally own a 2" thick Put a cloth under the board if u use a thinner one The weight and thickness kept the board sturdy and the grain itself would dampen the impact of the clever and if u use it daily and it would absorb moisture, the top layer will become mushy overtime, just scrape it off, and the moisture and the steel band around the board actually keep the grain intact and less prone to crack and split, as wood would shrink when dries up and start cracking Hope u could give it a try, different wood different experience Cheers from Malaysia
Thanks! The wood trunk style boards are basically end grain boards and work really well with cleavers (especially for chopping meats). Theyre not very common here in the US - as they are reaaaaally expensive unfortunately
As a knifemaker, I need to point out that that cleaver is NOT a full tang knife, it is a through tang knife. A full tang is sandwitched between two scales of other material, filling ut the entire contour of the handle and provides a much better weight distribution, as you point out with your western style knife (which looks to be an actual full tang knife).
@@BlackTieKitchen - Great, glad you're aware of it. I realize it's easy to make a mistake, I'm just posting to correct for those watching the video who may want to get their own knife and are confused by the terminology. 🙂👍
I have just purchased one and can't wait for it to arrive!! It's the fact the when laying it flat on the copping board it rests "Like a Muffin on a Hill" that got me to buy it!! Also an old trick to stopping water from exiting your eyes whilst cutting onions is to put them in the freezer about 20 mins before cutting. This solidifies the liquid that would normally offgass when being cut hence no crying!!
Imagine a armed thief break into your house, if you have this knife in kitchen, it can be used as shield too. A perfect balance of offensive and defensive. I have two of them in my kitchen.
The Shi Ba Zi is my personal favorite prep knife in a professional kitchen where I do ALOT of knife work. Actually a great deli meat knife as well as veggies of course. Easily the most versatile and durable of all my knives and the one I default to 80% of the time.
@@BlackTieKitchen Good -- I periodically hit the Spyderco sharpener to touch it up . After about 35 years the handle had a piece break off . I just shaped some wood and epoxied it on .
@6:51 "Sucks for cutting meat." You can actually see this in a lot of poultry dishes in China, where instead of doing fine knife work, the pieces are cut straight through the bone. Drunken chicken, or BBQ duck is usually served this way.
@@BlackTieKitchen Actually, a well trained Chinese chef can do this easily. Check out this video. It's from Chef Wang, a famous TH-camr in Sichuan China. th-cam.com/video/vFVim6R598s/w-d-xo.html
I found a Chinese cleaver at the flea market; rusty and dirty but it cleaned up and sharpened nicely. I use it almost exclusively for vegetables and especially like it when slicing cabbage for coleslaw or stir fry. It also performs well cutting semi-frozen meats for stir fry or fajitas. When I make biscotti I use it to make clean cuts with little or no crumbling. My cleaver is made of carbon steel and requires a light coat of oil after each use to keep it from rusting. Great addition to my kitchen tools. Darlington, South Carolina
When it comes to deboning, you should see the techniques used with a Chinese knife. That may shed some light on how they can use this wide style knife to do that.
Hey, you're the one that got me to start using a cleaver to chop with, and I love it.(I am not a cook, covid/keto made me give it a try) Now I want one of those. Thanks for the comparison. Keep up the great info.
Thanks! for some reason, Im going through my comments and I saw that my earlier reply to you didnt go through (TH-cam has some funky stuff with comments and the app -_-) I pretty much use the cleaver for everything - if it's not a santoku knife - it's the cleaver!
I brought this cleaver 8 months ago after watching your video and it's been my go to daily knife for the very same review you provided here. The blade has also kept its edge for a long time.
Really cool video, these Chinese cleavers definitely deserve a place in any kitchen. Something quick to note: The "proper" way to cut with them isn't a vertical chopping cut like you mentioned, but a forward push cut. Thanks for helping bring popularity to a fantastic, simple, and effective tool!
@@BlackTieKitchen for sure. In the end, the best way to use a knife is the way that works and feels comfortable A classic test is to slice green onions and make sure they're a clean.cut
I recently bought a $15 version from a local Chinese grocery store just to satiate my curiosity (have always been a Japanese style Chef's knife guy) and quickly started gravitating toward it for almost everything outside of finer meat work as you mentioned. I love that it doubles as a bench knife, I normally use a Japanese chef's knife + bench knife (primarily for food transfer/scraping board) and this gives me one less thing to clean. Now I use this + Victorinox boning knife for 95% of cutting tasks and basically neglect my (MUCH more expensive!) Japanese chef's knives. Plus, yeah they may look unconventional, but they sure make you feel like a boss!
Thanks for the video! Shi Ba Zi (十八子）is definitely one of my childhood nightmares lol It’s made in a city called Yangjiang, which is not far from Guangzhou City. I was about 9 years old on a road trip to Yangjiang with my parents. On our way back, we decided to check out a souvenir shop. In the shop, you can find many local snacks and all kinds of knives, swords all made by Shi Ba Zi. So I was walking around in the shop, a lady suddenly screamed : “OMG, what’s going on? Blood everywhere!” I looked at the floor, it’s like a murder scene. After a short moment, I realized blood was dripping from my hand. No sure which blade cut me, but damn it’s shape. I didn’t even feel any pain after the cut. So I kept walking in the shop and created a huge mess. The staffs were very helpful and brought Band-Aid within a second. (I am sure they probably encounter this kind of shit pretty often). Then my parents had to cut the shopping short. They bought some local snacks and a similar knife. It’s almost 20 years after, they are still using the knife…Also a little fun fact why it’s called Shi Ba Zi (十八子）, because the owner’s name is Li (李）. If you try to write the character 李, you will first write 十 (Shi) then 八 (Ba) then子(Zi). It’s shared by one sales girl in that shop, after 20 years I can still remember the scene so vividly. 😂😂😂
Here I was trying to tease out why it was 18. Eventually, I came to the conclusion (apparently incorrectly) that it was referring to how many centimeters the blade was in length since it was Chinese and 8 inches is around 18 centimeters (yes, I know it isn’t quite, but the base measurement would be centimeters and in converting it to imperial folks usually round up HEAVILY to make the length seem more impressive).
I got one of these knifes soon after Nixon got back from China. Got it in a finger jointed wood box with a cutting board top along with a wok and a few other cooking things that I had never seen before. Still using them all and it still is sharp as a razor with just a few strokes on a steel but never sharpened. It's never chipped or failed in any way. The set cost me $8. It's cut through lots of chicken bones.
Different types of Chinese cleavers. You don’t chop any type of bones with veggie cleavers - they’re for finesse slicing. If you ever have to, use the spine of the knife.
@@nobat6351 Sorry, I've been chopping chicken bones with it for 30 years. Still razor sharp and all I ever do is strop it on a steel. China can make some really good stuff when they want to.
You bought the right one. Shibazi Zuo makes a great knife. I own 4 cai dao, and my 2 favorite are the 8" from this video and the stainless handled combo chopper/slicer Chef Wang Gang uses in a lot of videos.
@@BlueGorillaInTheMist th-cam.com/video/ok_SO-V0Mh0/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=%E7%BE%8E%E9%A3%9F%E4%BD%9C%E5%AE%B6%E7%8E%8B%E5%88%9A watch his video about his knife, but the brand of the model was cover in the video, but some part of the video still identify it, it is Shi Ba Zi item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.81.5b521e65tFPyfZ&id=563241996120&ns=1&abbucket=8#detail Model: SD-1 There is some different the one show in this video, the one from Amazon is 3 layer stainless steel, Wang Gang is using the one with traditional single lay stainless steel.
It does my heart good to see some more Chinese cleaver content being made and people filling the comments section with there Chinese cleaver experiences and knife opinions and insights
Fun fact about Chinese cleavers: they have differential beveling, meaning that the section of blade that's closer to the heel is actually less sharp than the forward section. The idea is that you use the heel section to do high impact chops, and the forward section to do precise work. This way, you won't chip the heel, and the forward section is super sharp for fine cutting.
I chuckled when you said "My first Chinese Cleaver but definitely not my last". There are 2 ways to understand this: 1. "I enjoy Chinese Cleaver and I will definitely buy more Chinese Cleavers from now on" 2. "This Chinese Cleaver sucks so I will definitely buy a different one." They mean completely opposite things, lol
I have a 30$ „chinese kitchen knife“ which I think is the correct name for these, since the fall of 2020 and I never let go of it again. I use it for basically everything, as u say not deboning and stuff like that. But I put my index finger on the top, thumb on left and middle finger on the right side of the blade, when cutting. Meaning holding the blade, the handle begins at the end of my index finger/beginning of palm, palm controls the handle, fingers the blade. This allows for amazing control and u dont get tired.
Actually the Chinese cleaver is meant to be hold a little deeper than the handle (like the way you showed). I didn’t know about this until recently when my mother, who is Chinese, said I sucked at cutting just because I had my hand on the handle and not a bit more over it. Apparently it’s designed to be handled this way. Maybe that is why the angle under the handle is sharp, since you’re not supposed to touch it 🤔
I don’t know how I stumbled on this video BUT as a full time chef that uses this particular knife *all* the time (despite having an arsenal of just about every knife in the book), I’m smiling and happy. Yes, there is no going back once you learn to use a Chinese vegetable cleaver. Knife, mallet, spatula - that is *the* knife. Enough for me to custom forge that knife in full Damascus just for display.
You are the only western youtuber who hold the cleaver in a correct way. Even some Chinese youtuber cannot hold right. And another function of Chinese cleaver is transporting the food materials after cutting
I personally have used both types for a year plus in a professional kitchen and I and a vertical cutter so i typically go for my 3rams brand Chinese cleaver. That being said because the center weight of the cleaver you should be using a loose grip like a machete where you use the forward weight to allow you to just let the force do the work if you hold it more firm the weight will wear your wrist and tire you out faster.
You'll get used to the weight distribution and cutting meat. I used to work at a chicken shop and the cleaver is way nicer to use. Better leverage and you can apply more force. Also heaps better to cut through bone. Those knives have been going for almost 10 years and they're still going strong with regular sharpening. I've also found that you can do some quite precise cuts with the front of the blade. Similar to a western style blade. Because after all, all that matters is that the meat is cut. And since you can use that much force, you can get the cleaver pretty much anywhere a western knife can.
Holding this type of Chinese cleaver is different then what you would with a western knife. You don't need a tight grip on the handle and your middle finger shouldn't be touching the bolster and the heel part. Opt for a loose grip and have your index and middle finger over the flat of the blade on one side and the thumb (like you're pinching something) on the other side to stabilize the cleaver, your fourth and little finger are wrapped around the handle with minimal force so you don't drop the cleaver. This method will not tire you out with prolonged use.
And the verdict pays homage to cutting meat at last, since chefs knife was specifically designed for cutting large chunks of meat down. Cai dao is better all rounder because it was designed to be exactly that, an all rounder.
I use a chinese cleaver for almost everything... Paring knife for peeling fruits and vegetables, bread knife/slicing knife for slicing bread and boneless meats. Cleaver is great for cutting apart chicken at its joints and sternum. Rookies may be scared of its size and weight, but practice proves it's a better all-around blade in the kitchen.
Hey there! My first video of yours, I enjoyed it thoroughly! I wanted to mention that I too had bought a chinese cleaver recently. I really enjoy it as well, has really become my go to knife. I wanted to make an observation that as an amateur home, and not professional chef, I really wouldn't consider the weight a huge issue as I don't think I'd need to cook for more than a few hours tops, and very easy to switch between smaller or lighter knives for other jobs too. I just love its massive cutting surface, and shovel feature it provides as well. Sometimes I won't even use bowls, just cut up into piles on the cutting board and shovel them in when v ready. Plus, I think it's the sharpest knife I have, so it's a beast. The knife I've been using is the Kyoku Daimyo Series 7" Cleaver. It's around 110 USD, but I've thought worth every penny since I bought it March of last year. Anyways, take care, God bless, keep cooking! I'll be sure to watch more and subscribe.
Thanks! Im not a professional chef either, so for most cases, the weight wont be an issue (as you stated). Sometimes the weight is also how it's distributed - I have some knives where the weight is in the correct spot and although they are heavier than other knives, the knife feels light as a feather!
There is a technique to smash garlic with a chinese cleaver which involves literally smashing it like a hammer. You cannot do this with any other type of knife as far as I know. Hold the blade completely perpendicular to the board and smash down and press in one motion. The weight of the knife completely crushes the garlic and you can then use tip to grind the garlic into a finer paste with one hand on the handle and the other pressing at the top along the cutting board. You can find chinese chefs using this technique on youtube sometimes. The same technique is often used to smash ginger and chinese onions quickly and they are used extremely often in almost all dishes.
Just to be sure, you mean like placing the knife on the garlic and press down to get rid of the peel? That can be done with most if not all chef knifes
There's two different things you're talking about I think, if I follow you. You can press down on garlic cloves and then just slip them out of their peel, then afterwards, you lay the knife on it side on the peeled clove (or cloves) and smear it across the board instead of mincing it with lots of slices. Then you swipe the blade of the knife across the board to pick up your now very finely mashed garlic paste. The smearing/turning it into a paste, then using the blade to gather it all up off the board technique also works with peeled ginger and turmeric, turning a 30 second to a minute or two prep job into a two or three second one.
I use a CCK 1303 small cleaver for 5 years. Its the only cleaver I've used that dose not wedge the vegetables it glides through the product. it is my daily prep knife I use it for 8 to 10 hours a day the edge holds too. And its only $70 You can get one off chef knives to go web sit. If you like cleaver you will love it. I actually have 2. 1 for work and 1 for home
I found a knife like this, believe it was a dexter Russell Chinese Chef's knife, by far the best knife ever, it's the multi tool for anybody in my position, as a farmer. Helps process large portions of raw veggies, meat, and is amazing when utilizing the leverage to chop lots of high stacked produce, fast. I prefer thin blades personally over the thick, as they glide through produce faster and create less drag, or shift the vegetables less, so reorganizing the stack for consistency is not an issue. I threw that knife away as it got rusty and was starting to become serrated from all the bones it had hit, defiantly going to look into another.
The Dexter Russell is a fantastic Chinese Chef's knife! Although, dont throw them away! It can be sharpened and made to be like new! These are also mostly meant for everything except cutting through thicker bones - those require the thick blades that are less prone to chipping
For other use of the Chinese style cleaver, I recommend the movie "Big Trouble in Little China", with a demonstration from the king of stuntsmen Al Leong himself!
As someone who works in an Asian style kitchen, Chinese knifes are better for general prep work for veg and slicing fried things Western knifes are better for prep work for meat and to do patterns Both knives are used often but the Chinese style knife is favored more by most of the cooks If you use a western style knife, it would take awhile to adjust to a Chinese style one, this is because western style uses the center/front center to cut things, while the Chinese style has the front for slicing, center for chopping and back for meat/bone cutting(bone as in soft bones like chicken joints) Both does have their advantages Highly recommend everyone to try both
I don't think I have seen a new knife that didn't have a burr from sharpening, except from a friend who takes old knives and refurbishes them. I do like the Chinese style cleavers. Very practical for so many things. I do agree about the weight issue. I finally found an old saw, high carbon steel, that has some flex to it for making a few for personal use. There is one 'category' of cleavers called 'Mulberry Knives' which, apparently were for slicing up the mulberry leaves for the silk worms, and the slices were supposed to be very thin. The blades will flex. Most of what I have seen that were called mulberry knives are rather rigid like the one you have here. Most are also in the 8 inch length for the blades, which is a bit big for me. So, when all else fails, make your own. I should have some pieces left over for more traditional kitchen knives and paring knives.
I believe with the traditional western knife you're supposed to use it to slice/cut while keeping the tip of the blade on the surface, instead of using it in a chopping way. As said below, with the right technique it is nearly impossible to cut the fingertips.
Personnally I'm only using old school antique Nogent-made kitchen knife, from France. Here you can find these pretty easily, they are absolutely awesome and not expensive if you got to some flea markets. But in other countries, that's not so easy...
I have had the 9 inch version for a year now, it is my go to knife at work. I prep, cook, do it all with this knife and since I do not have a set menu where I work I could be Dicing Beef to chopping onions. I have only injured myself a couple times and both are from me being unsafe. Over all I highly recommend this knife to any kitchen worker, I do not recommend the 9 inch for home use. It is a bit big for that, I have not used the 8 inch and that one might be better.
Seems like you would love nakiris. They're essentially a lighter, narrower version of this that's much better suited for precision cutting and prolonged use in my opinion
That's exactly what I thought before using a Vegetable Cleaver. For people that like to push cut it's definitely worth to try both of them. When holding them they feel so different. It's hard to describe. I love both and both are comfortable to hold but gripping style is different and switching from one to the other is weird.
I just received one of these knives in the $35 range and instantly fell in love with it. Prepping all the ingredients for bulgogi with it felt like I was using a cheat (from chopping vegs to thinly slicing steak, wow). It's definitely intimidating at first, but it's a daily use blade for me now.
This is improved version with stainless steel, I have one of those old one passes from family member, hand made with high carbon steel wedge embedded in iron body( 夹钢工艺）, beside rust issue and watch your finger, this old one works the best
It's a traditional blade making technique common in east asia and called sanmai(three layers) in japanese, it can be done with any high performance cutlery steel and a softer jacket. I have a stainless sanmai gyuto in zdp-189 that takes a wicked edge and holds it like a champ. Nothing beats the blending of traditional artistry and modern materials
@@chaodong4620 I did mean east and yeah the technique itself isn't necessarily fancy just takes skill. There's a reason why they use it as a challenge on Forged In Fire. It's a fundamental skill for a good smith.
Mandarin and Cantonese are both dialects of Chinese, the language is still called "Chinese". Mandarin uses the simplified writing system whereas Cantonese uses the traditional ☺️
Actually, Cantonese is a popular southern dialect. Mandarin is the standard "official" pronunciation by modern day standards. Mandarin really isn't even the Beijing dialect like many thinks. If you've been to Beijing, their dialect is only similar to Mandarin, but it's not the same. the Chinese for mandarin (language) is "common tongue". I believe it has a northern origin as a result of the Man Dynasty having control of China before it became a republic.
Yes, but both mandarin and cantonese speakers also use traditional Chinese characters (and simplfied characters), it's not decided by the dialects you speak but education system you received and personal preference .
I have almost that same knife! Its fantastic, i use it 8 hours a day at work for almost a year now, i can chop, chip, slice anything, with a fresh sharpen i can get some nice sushi cut too even.
@@BlackTieKitchen Ya I wack out chopped and sliced veggies by the quart all day, they can clean up and carve big slabs of meat with practice, and they sharpen so nice
wow!....This Brand ”Shi ba zi”from my hometown，whether the quality was good or not，its very very famous....at least in china, we usually pay around usd10 for ur video cover‘s knife
I'll politely disagree. I work for P.F. Chang's and I'm a prep cook. I cut 90-210 lbs of boneless beef/chicken a day and I prefer my cleaver all day long over the supplied chef knives at work. I find the blade length, blade height and weight of the cleaver to be an advantage. But, this is my preference.
You can find it in lots of Chinese family, as it used to be the classic wedding gift (before the standards went up). My parents got theirs as a moving away gift (yeah you eventually got one in your life one way or another).
I like that your first thoughts ran to smashing garlic. But seriously, I went a long time without a chef's knife and now I can't imagine life without one. The best $100 you could spend. Well-balanced, good edge. (My father was a butcher, knives are in my blood) Now I'm looking at this knife/cleaver and thinking, mmmm.
If your city has an asian market, you'll likely be able to find a Shi Ba Zi cleaver there for not a lot of money, I bought mine a few years ago for like $7 and it is still a good knife. Steel is soft but sharpens easily, which in my opnion, is better than hard steel for a kitchen knife. The name Shi Ba Zi means Eighteen Men, I do not know where the name came from but it is pretty well known in China.
After years of using American, German, and Japanese style knives, I've been converted to using Chinese-style knives only. I own three of these cleavers, different sizes for different jobs. Also got a Chinese-type fish prep knife, which is so easy to use.
My secret cutting technique is NOT cut the food with top down motion, but slice with moving forward and down motion. It will use the weight of the cleaver to cut food, and you won't feel tire easily. And the way you cut will damage the Chinese cleaver easily. If you use magnifier to see the edge of the blade, you will find that looks like a saw rather than a smooth line. A saw cuts with slide forward/backward, not up and down.
chinese cookware have evolved over 5 thoussand years, japanese had learnt from it but included the western chef knife form. that depend on the person who is using the knife, they are all good knifes.
To be honest the whole hearing something evolving over X thousands of years in china tends to be often somewhat overstretched then again it's the same for most cultures. Cookware overall has been evolving across China or Europe for the relatively over a thousand years or in a matter of speaking across all of human history. Learning from another culture and adopting it for your own use case is also part of the evolution. However, it is true that it is dependant on the person using it one can still get used to another type of knife provided enough time it spends with it.
Yup - things have evolved for the use (and materials available). For example, a skinning knife would make a terrible kitchen knife - bit for it's specific use, it works wonders.
@Lyon Cheapest and only brand selling Chinese cleaver over here is SAN HAN NGA which sells for 20€ however I'm assuming it's mainly sold in China and rarely outside since I couldn't even find it on aliexpress however saw it on amazon once I think.
You can cut meat just fine with a Chinese cleaver. Separating chicken quarters is effortless with the extra mass behind the cut. You do want to "choke" further up the blade for finer control, and the extra height makes it really safe for your fingers.
You wouldn’t really need to do any hard chopping when using a Chinese cleaver of this nature for separating chicken quarters as long as you slice through the joints, but I guess if it’s a whole chicken you could still use this knife efficiently but would dull the blade faster when you cut out the spine.
I just minced half of a pork loin into sausage with that very cleaver. Then, I turned a half of a cabbage into shreds, along with several peppers , a carrot and a couple onions. I didn’t have to clean a food processor or meat grinder. It saved time and effort while producing superior results. They’re pretty great .
The heel and the "tip" of the cleaver is also 90 degree-ish so you get a semi point if you need it. I use a cleaver sometimes but I find the balance to be a big disadvantage. The cleaver weight is a big advantage, even in slicing type cleavers, and so is the height where you hold the handle in some applications. I'm Chinese so i grew up using a cleaver but I use a santoku as a daily driver
I still keep my Shi Ba Zi zuo knife set on my counter top, it was bought 25 years ago in Shanghai. I love them.... Only addition to that set is a 8" zwilling chef's knife.
There are different type of Chinese knife，the one in the video is called 桑刀(sang dao)，this type is for slice and chop. 斩骨刀（zhan gu dao） are for break bones in the contrary
I have a ShiBaiZi桑刀. Not the greatest. There are far better 桑刀 than ShiBaiZi. I only hope the ShiBaiZi knife did not ruin Black Tie Kitchen experience.
There is a kind of japanese knife which is also square with a similar straight edge profile, but only half in height. My wife uses such one. You might look it up.
@@BlackTieKitchen yes that's the name thanks. Also the knife in this video is actually a professional product and is heavier than most of those in household kitchens.
Nice job on choosing a Chinese vegetable cleaver, the SBZ F208-1 and S210-1 are crazy sharp out of the box with pretty impressive edge retention. They are great for cutting paper thin salami slices as well.
I'm a semi-pro (No balls to start a full scale manufacture x) ) knifemaker and a great fan of Chinese (mostly south-western provinces and hardcore north so basically Mongolia) and I gotta say I never thought of getting/making a knife like this even though it's probably the easiest thing I could think of. Lack of point on the main knife standard will feel a bit weird but the ease of chopping in comparison to what I mostly do with a knife basically sells the design on its own. And I've seen a Guangdong chef slice meat into paper thin slices with, it must be magical :
I've been using these $15 rectangular knife since I was 8-9 years old. They the best for chopping anything. Even better than my $200 damascus steel kitchen knife
you are absolutely right. got to see who is doing the talking. you cannot talk about the forest if all you know is the tree in front of you. this cleaver works great deboning a chicken - that is, if you know how to use it.
Anyone here two years later; I bought one. Good knife for the price. Blade is excellent; handle and fitting are OK. I will say that I find myself going for it as my general purpose rough chopping knife more often than anything else so take that testimonial for what it's worth.
Try a French style Western knife like a Sebatier, rather than that German style knife. French style has a straighter edge meant for up/down chopping, rather than German style which has the more rounded belly for ‘rolling cut’.
I use it to debone chicken, filet fish, cut veggies, peel ginger, chop green onion... I just have a hard time using western knife except the bread knife.
It depends on what youre used to. This blade for me would be too heavy for deboning chicken and such. However, i do have other cleavers that I *would* feel comfortable deboning chicken with!
I love a good cleaver. Having large hands, they feel substantial and easy to grip. I currently use a Serbian style chef knife and it's my favorite daily driver at work and home.
A piece of advices, when using Chinese cleaver, always use your left hand knuckles to safeguard your finger tips while cutting with right hand holding the cleaver. In other words, always use claw hand gesture to hold whatever you are cutting. Because Chinese cleaver has the extended height compare to the western knife, the side of the cleaver will make contacts with your knuckles while you are cutting, therefore it greatly reduces the chance that you accidentally cut your finger tips as long as you make sure you cut straight down towards the chopping board without tilting the angle of the blade. And be aware of your pinky, I know some people's pinky finger is not fully retract when they use claw gesture.
It's one of the reasons I like cleavers - there's enough surface area where you can rest your knuckles against it with ease
You'd better use a finger guard to 100% protect your finger being harmed
@C S it's that true?
That applies to using any knife regardless of the style It's knife skills 101
Pinky? When I was a 17 year old apprentice, I once got told off for not tucking my thumb.
I tend to learn better trying things out myself rather than getting a demonstration, which was the same in the case. Following day, there goes part of the top of my thumb. Luckily it was just thin slice
Forgot to mention that in a home invasion, arming yourself with this cleaver will debuff your opponent's leadership by 2 and increase their combat attrition rolls by 1.
*parry*
and if your cleaver has unholy attribute you get +3% lifesteal
If home invasion is on your mind a lot you have bigger problems than which knife to choose to cook dinner with.
But what if youre an internationally recognized agent that goes around telling people youre a secret agent and therefore, are constantly in danger?!
*Cough*Archer*cough*
😂🤣 good to know 👍🏻
The Shi ba zi brand used to produce war swords/broad sword for warfare in China near a century ago. The whole township families were black smith. A few decades ago they started making chef knife they made fine chopping cleaver and rough/heavy ones with that traditional wood handle.
Thanks for this info! I have the smaller cleaver version of this blade from the same company. I've had it over a year, daily use. It has chopped through everything including bone. It didn't cost too much, and I have to admit I have been super surprised at what a great knife it has been.
Were they still making them with carbon steel or stainless steel?
Shi ba zi brand is originated in 557 AD as a weapon producer in Yangjiang when the sword-manufacturing technology of general Feng An's sabre spread to locals, but it has not become a corporation until 1983. Yangjiang is, however, still the largest knife production city in China today, but the world standard is totally different from the time the brand was established.
CCK best knife.
Chinese cleavers: they don't look great but you can use em in rain, sleet n snow. They're like jeeps.
Sunshine too! They're not vampire blades 😂
@@BlackTieKitchen I've found medium-sized ones to be really fun, and agile if sharp
I have two of medium size that im trying now - and I agree!
While I like Chinese cleavers.... com'on... what you said is true of any knives. French Chef's, German Chef's, Japanese Nakiri.... they all work in rain, snow....etc.
They survive nukes and can still out cut gordon🤣🤣🤣
Love my Chinese style cleaver. I even nicknamed it, Choppy Chop because of how well it works on all sorts of fruits and veggies. Plus when it comes to sharpening, I prefer it to a traditional chef’s knife because I don’t have to worry about maintaining a point on the blade. It’s a great example of simplicity being king.
Loved this video, and I can’t wait to watch more of your work!
Thanks! Also, thats a great name for your blade 😂
Lived in Hong Kong 19 years, but only started using the Chinese cleaver in the final four years - absolute revelation. It is true that you can't put the tip down and rock it back and forth like a western chef's knife, which takes the weight off the wrist for sustained use - but for home cooking where you don't need to dice 100 onions at a time, the Chinese cleaver wins.
That's cool you lived in Hong Kong for so long! Just wondering, was it for work or what? I'm interested in your story haha
@@ozisike family moved there for Dad's job when I was very young. Left Hong Kong for college stateside after high school, but went back and worked there for 5 yrs in the 2010's.
As 4/5 Chinese canto guy I can confirm that the clever has durability of a diamond. My parents still have a cleaver made in the 1800s from my grand parents and it looks fine and works fine
do food cut by an ancient relic taste any better?
Only area of weakness is if you try to smash something harder than garlic with the side.
@@Drownedinblood what are u trying to smash that's harder than garlic? If it's that hard I recommend a motor and pestle
@@MrKhankab like tenderizing meat or something. I forgot exactly what I hit with the side. But it was a bad idea.
@@Drownedinblood interesting. I never heard of tenderizing meat with the flat of a blade. Thats usually not a good idea especially if u have a thin knife
My cleaver is now the only knife I use for cooking, it's so darn versatile, you can get some in so many different styles, for cheap, I have a small(ish) 6" cleaver, even though it's only 6", most people's jaw drop when I pull this out for cooking, an I'm waiting on my 8" that should get here today. The only things you need for cooking is a huge cutting board, a cleaver, a carbon steel wok, and pair of wok spatula and ladle, and you are golden. You can make ANYTHING in this... Soups... Steaks... Pasta... sauces... You can use it to fry anything too from chicken to making french fries... And if you get a metal handle wok, you can even stick it in the oven. I don't see anything you can't do with a wok, you aren't limited to chinese dishes!
Agreed!!
I like how this guy is liking and replying every comment. Love ur good work.
Thanks! Reply for you too! 😄
Just to correct some misconceptions here. Some people suggest that since the Chinese style chef knife is call "cai dao" (菜刀), lit. vegetable, knife, it means that it's design purpose is to chop vegetable. We sometimes call cooking "zuo cai" (做菜), lit. make, vegetable, but that doesn't mean vegetable is the only thing being cooked. The "cai" here means dishes. It just means this knife is used for cooking.
As for the knife, it is a general purpose chef knife. It has been said that the reason it is shaped this way is because of the popularization of stir fires and high heat fast cooking beginning in the Song Dynasty circa 10th century CE, and for that you need to dice and cut the ingredients, meat included, into stripes or thinner slices. The weight and shape of the blade help to expedite that work.
The knife can be used for deboning or carving very efficiently, but that would require substantial training. It can cut through softer bones and it will be used to chop up ribs, for example. Professional Chinese chefs all use this knife for all types of preparation unless they face something that requires a special tool. Knife skill is considered the basic of the basic among professional Chinese chefs.
This style of knife is intimating and can be difficult to wield for some home users, especially the younger generations, so certain people who have exposure to western style knives would use those at home instead. People who have experience with the Chinese chef knife tend to love it.
Thanks. It definitely requires a high level of skill certain applications!
No, there is a different between 菜刀 and 肉刀. The vegetable knife is thinner, and more suited for fine cutting, while the meat cleaver is thicker and heavier to hack through bones.
These come in like 5 spine thicknesses the so called veggie knife designation is for home cooks only. The professionals call them "mulberry", "slicer", "all purpose", "bone", and "9kong" 桑刀, 片刀, 文武刀, 骨刀, 九江刀 The all purpose one can chop up to cooked chicken on occasion but not recommended. And a few specialty versions exist as well such as the duck knife and the dim sum knife. You can look up chan chi Kee's selection to learn more, they are the biggest exporters of kong kong knives to chefs around the world.
Traditionally, the Chinese diet contains a large number of vegetables and a small amount of meat, mainly chicken, duck, and fish. A thin blade can handle the tasks very well and efficiently. Oh, unlike Europeans who don't want to see small bones in their dishes, the Chinese chop the whole chicken or duck into bite-size with bones and cook.
@@peterkhew7414 He's just saying it's not used for veggies exclusively.
Had my Chinese clever passed down from my parents
Its just a simple stainless steel clever doesn't have any fancy wood handle
Just a simple practical clever
Used it on a lot on different foods, it doesn't matter meat fish chicken bone or vege
A simple prep on the 5 dollar whetstone( also passed down) and its good to go
One thing to elevate the pleasure lr experience of using a Chinese clever is a higher chopping board made from thick wood trunk, like those used by chefs in Chinese restaurants
The cutting position would be better and some dampening from the chopping board itself
The grain , hardness and type of wood would effect the cutting experience and how the clever stops when hitting the cutting board
Typically western style comes with flat grain this will make the wood stronger when used and slight tendency to bounce the knives, and will give positive feedback when then knives hit the board, but this could cause some stronger vibration on the knives itself
Compared to those used in Chinese restaurants, they're typically made by wood log or trunk milled in vertical grain and around 3"or even more depends i personally own a 2" thick
Put a cloth under the board if u use a thinner one
The weight and thickness kept the board sturdy and the grain itself would dampen the impact of the clever and if u use it daily and it would absorb moisture, the top layer will become mushy overtime, just scrape it off, and the moisture and the steel band around the board actually keep the grain intact and less prone to crack and split, as wood would shrink when dries up and start cracking
Hope u could give it a try, different wood different experience
Cheers from Malaysia
Thanks! The wood trunk style boards are basically end grain boards and work really well with cleavers (especially for chopping meats). Theyre not very common here in the US - as they are reaaaaally expensive unfortunately
Damn seems like someone is the favorite child here considering your parent passed down the cooking utensil to you.
@@EricChien95 nah.... my sisters rely prepared meals with those utensils
And I'm willing to spend time and effort to learn how to use those utensils
@@EricChien95 no no its divided equally the fav gets the cleaver and the other broothers/sisters get pans/pots/other utensils
I prefer bamboo chopping boards rather than trunks, which are heavy and need maintenance.
As a knifemaker, I need to point out that that cleaver is NOT a full tang knife, it is a through tang knife. A full tang is sandwitched between two scales of other material, filling ut the entire contour of the handle and provides a much better weight distribution, as you point out with your western style knife (which looks to be an actual full tang knife).
Correct - not sure why I said full tang in the video, but I cant go back and edit it :(
@@BlackTieKitchen - Great, glad you're aware of it. I realize it's easy to make a mistake, I'm just posting to correct for those watching the video who may want to get their own knife and are confused by the terminology. 🙂👍
I have just purchased one and can't wait for it to arrive!! It's the fact the when laying it flat on the copping board it rests "Like a Muffin on a Hill" that got me to buy it!! Also an old trick to stopping water from exiting your eyes whilst cutting onions is to put them in the freezer about 20 mins before cutting. This solidifies the liquid that would normally offgass when being cut hence no crying!!
Imagine a armed thief break into your house, if you have this knife in kitchen, it can be used as shield too. A perfect balance of offensive and defensive. I have two of them in my kitchen.
Rofl that's a great point!
that's a very good idea
Isnt it?!?! Lol
Two of them for a duel wield configuration. The optimal configuration for attack and defense. Perfect. 👌
It's coming, dont worry 😄👍
The Shi Ba Zi is my personal favorite prep knife in a professional kitchen where I do ALOT of knife work. Actually a great deli meat knife as well as veggies of course. Easily the most versatile and durable of all my knives and the one I default to 80% of the time.
As a home cook, it is about the same at 75-85% use!
I've had a Martin Yan Chinese chef's knife for 40 years and I love it .
How does it hold its edge?
@@BlackTieKitchen Good -- I periodically hit the Spyderco sharpener to touch it up . After about 35 years the handle had a piece break off . I just shaped some wood and epoxied it on .
Nice!
@6:51 "Sucks for cutting meat." You can actually see this in a lot of poultry dishes in China, where instead of doing fine knife work, the pieces are cut straight through the bone. Drunken chicken, or BBQ duck is usually served this way.
Great ways to eat meat too! I didnt clarify in the video, but what I was thinking of was deboning a pork shoulder and when you filet a fish :/
@@BlackTieKitchen Actually, a well trained Chinese chef can do this easily. Check out this video. It's from Chef Wang, a famous TH-camr in Sichuan China. th-cam.com/video/vFVim6R598s/w-d-xo.html
I found a Chinese cleaver at the flea market; rusty and dirty but it cleaned up and sharpened nicely. I use it almost exclusively for vegetables and especially like it when slicing cabbage for coleslaw or stir fry. It also performs well cutting semi-frozen meats for stir fry or fajitas. When I make biscotti I use it to make clean cuts with little or no crumbling. My cleaver is made of carbon steel and requires a light coat of oil after each use to keep it from rusting. Great addition to my kitchen tools. Darlington, South Carolina
Nice! Carbon steel works really well - but like you said, simply requires a little maintenance!
When it comes to deboning, you should see the techniques used with a Chinese knife. That may shed some light on how they can use this wide style knife to do that.
中国刀，有砍骨刀和切片刀以及斩切刀，砍骨刀是用来劈砍猪骨牛骨之类的，切片刀主要是把食物切成片或者丝用的，斩切刀的前段相对来说比较薄，后边厚一下是砍软骨之类的。中国厨房大部分用的是斩切刀，而不是切片刀。因为厨房要应对骨头以及切片，我在中国餐厅后厨工作过半年，感觉忙起来很累
Hey, you're the one that got me to start using a cleaver to chop with, and I love it.(I am not a cook, covid/keto made me give it a try) Now I want one of those. Thanks for the comparison. Keep up the great info.
Thanks! for some reason, Im going through my comments and I saw that my earlier reply to you didnt go through (TH-cam has some funky stuff with comments and the app -_-)
I pretty much use the cleaver for everything - if it's not a santoku knife - it's the cleaver!
I brought this cleaver 8 months ago after watching your video and it's been my go to daily knife for the very same review you provided here. The blade has also kept its edge for a long time.
It's a great tool!
Really cool video, these Chinese cleavers definitely deserve a place in any kitchen.
Something quick to note:
The "proper" way to cut with them isn't a vertical chopping cut like you mentioned, but a forward push cut.
Thanks for helping bring popularity to a fantastic, simple, and effective tool!
There's so many ways - i definitely dont have any proper training with them!
@@BlackTieKitchen for sure. In the end, the best way to use a knife is the way that works and feels comfortable
A classic test is to slice green onions and make sure they're a clean.cut
I recently bought a $15 version from a local Chinese grocery store just to satiate my curiosity (have always been a Japanese style Chef's knife guy) and quickly started gravitating toward it for almost everything outside of finer meat work as you mentioned. I love that it doubles as a bench knife, I normally use a Japanese chef's knife + bench knife (primarily for food transfer/scraping board) and this gives me one less thing to clean. Now I use this + Victorinox boning knife for 95% of cutting tasks and basically neglect my (MUCH more expensive!) Japanese chef's knives.
Plus, yeah they may look unconventional, but they sure make you feel like a boss!
Thanks for the video! Shi Ba Zi (十八子）is definitely one of my childhood nightmares lol It’s made in a city called Yangjiang, which is not far from Guangzhou City. I was about 9 years old on a road trip to Yangjiang with my parents. On our way back, we decided to check out a souvenir shop. In the shop, you can find many local snacks and all kinds of knives, swords all made by Shi Ba Zi. So I was walking around in the shop, a lady suddenly screamed : “OMG, what’s going on? Blood everywhere!” I looked at the floor, it’s like a murder scene. After a short moment, I realized blood was dripping from my hand. No sure which blade cut me, but damn it’s shape. I didn’t even feel any pain after the cut. So I kept walking in the shop and created a huge mess. The staffs were very helpful and brought Band-Aid within a second. (I am sure they probably encounter this kind of shit pretty often). Then my parents had to cut the shopping short. They bought some local snacks and a similar knife. It’s almost 20 years after, they are still using the knife…Also a little fun fact why it’s called Shi Ba Zi (十八子）, because the owner’s name is Li (李）. If you try to write the character 李, you will first write 十 (Shi) then 八 (Ba) then子(Zi). It’s shared by one sales girl in that shop, after 20 years I can still remember the scene so vividly. 😂😂😂
That's a crazy story! Super sharp knives - a lot of times you dont even realize you were cut, so that makes sense!
Here I was trying to tease out why it was 18. Eventually, I came to the conclusion (apparently incorrectly) that it was referring to how many centimeters the blade was in length since it was Chinese and 8 inches is around 18 centimeters (yes, I know it isn’t quite, but the base measurement would be centimeters and in converting it to imperial folks usually round up HEAVILY to make the length seem more impressive).
so the knife was so sharp that it avoided the gaps between the nerves accidentally while managing to cut the blood vessel
I got one of these knifes soon after Nixon got back from China. Got it in a finger jointed wood box with a cutting board top along with a wok and a few other cooking things that I had never seen before. Still using them all and it still is sharp as a razor with just a few strokes on a steel but never sharpened. It's never chipped or failed in any way. The set cost me $8. It's cut through lots of chicken bones.
Different types of Chinese cleavers. You don’t chop any type of bones with veggie cleavers - they’re for finesse slicing. If you ever have to, use the spine of the knife.
@@nobat6351 Sorry, I've been chopping chicken bones with it for 30 years. Still razor sharp and all I ever do is strop it on a steel. China can make some really good stuff when they want to.
You bought the right one. Shibazi Zuo makes a great knife. I own 4 cai dao, and my 2 favorite are the 8" from this video and the stainless handled combo chopper/slicer Chef Wang Gang uses in a lot of videos.
it's worked really well so far
What is the brand and model of the one Wang Gang uses?
@@BlueGorillaInTheMist th-cam.com/video/ok_SO-V0Mh0/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=%E7%BE%8E%E9%A3%9F%E4%BD%9C%E5%AE%B6%E7%8E%8B%E5%88%9A
watch his video about his knife, but the brand of the model was cover in the video, but some part of the video still identify it, it is Shi Ba Zi
item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.81.5b521e65tFPyfZ&id=563241996120&ns=1&abbucket=8#detail Model: SD-1
There is some different the one show in this video, the one from Amazon is 3 layer stainless steel, Wang Gang is using the one with traditional single lay stainless steel.
It does my heart good to see some more Chinese cleaver content being made and people filling the comments section with there Chinese cleaver experiences and knife opinions and insights
More to come 😉
in Chinese, this knife is called 菜刀 which is veggie knife, that's why is so good to cut veggies
Makes sense 😄
@@BlackTieKitchen watch this is very clear. Don't worry if you don't understand what he is saying th-cam.com/video/ok_SO-V0Mh0/w-d-xo.html
If you are skilled enough you can also use it like a food processor
Thats a great TIL fact!
You make a very good point! Although there is no "肉刀” (meat knife) and my parents definitely use the 菜刀 to cut everything 😂
Fun fact about Chinese cleavers: they have differential beveling, meaning that the section of blade that's closer to the heel is actually less sharp than the forward section.
The idea is that you use the heel section to do high impact chops, and the forward section to do precise work.
This way, you won't chip the heel, and the forward section is super sharp for fine cutting.
I chuckled when you said "My first Chinese Cleaver but definitely not my last". There are 2 ways to understand this:
1. "I enjoy Chinese Cleaver and I will definitely buy more Chinese Cleavers from now on"
2. "This Chinese Cleaver sucks so I will definitely buy a different one."
They mean completely opposite things, lol
Either way - I now have more cleavers 😄
I have a 30$ „chinese kitchen knife“ which I think is the correct name for these, since the fall of 2020 and I never let go of it again.
I use it for basically everything, as u say not deboning and stuff like that.
But I put my index finger on the top, thumb on left and middle finger on the right side of the blade, when cutting. Meaning holding the blade, the handle begins at the end of my index finger/beginning of palm, palm controls the handle, fingers the blade.
This allows for amazing control and u dont get tired.
Will have to try it, thanks!
Actually the Chinese cleaver is meant to be hold a little deeper than the handle (like the way you showed). I didn’t know about this until recently when my mother, who is Chinese, said I sucked at cutting just because I had my hand on the handle and not a bit more over it. Apparently it’s designed to be handled this way. Maybe that is why the angle under the handle is sharp, since you’re not supposed to touch it 🤔
Yup! If you hold any knife up by the handle, you increase the amount of torque you need to cut, which makes it tiring!
I don’t know how I stumbled on this video BUT as a full time chef that uses this particular knife *all* the time (despite having an arsenal of just about every knife in the book), I’m smiling and happy. Yes, there is no going back once you learn to use a Chinese vegetable cleaver. Knife, mallet, spatula - that is *the* knife. Enough for me to custom forge that knife in full Damascus just for display.
I use this type of knife for most of the applications except for removing the bones from meat.
Same!
I seen traditional markets auntie fillet with this
You are the only western youtuber who hold the cleaver in a correct way. Even some Chinese youtuber cannot hold right. And another function of Chinese cleaver is transporting the food materials after cutting
Transport is a huge one!
I personally have used both types for a year plus in a professional kitchen and I and a vertical cutter so i typically go for my 3rams brand Chinese cleaver. That being said because the center weight of the cleaver you should be using a loose grip like a machete where you use the forward weight to allow you to just let the force do the work if you hold it more firm the weight will wear your wrist and tire you out faster.
OMG thank you SO SO SO MUCH
i just realised that my blade wasen't flat so i got left with a extra piece!
Thanks for sharing !
You'll get used to the weight distribution and cutting meat. I used to work at a chicken shop and the cleaver is way nicer to use. Better leverage and you can apply more force. Also heaps better to cut through bone. Those knives have been going for almost 10 years and they're still going strong with regular sharpening. I've also found that you can do some quite precise cuts with the front of the blade. Similar to a western style blade. Because after all, all that matters is that the meat is cut. And since you can use that much force, you can get the cleaver pretty much anywhere a western knife can.
That's why I love a Nakiri Style Knife! All the pros of a Cleaver, while being very handy.
Holding this type of Chinese cleaver is different then what you would with a western knife. You don't need a tight grip on the handle and your middle finger shouldn't be touching the bolster and the heel part. Opt for a loose grip and have your index and middle finger over the flat of the blade on one side and the thumb (like you're pinching something) on the other side to stabilize the cleaver, your fourth and little finger are wrapped around the handle with minimal force so you don't drop the cleaver. This method will not tire you out with prolonged use.
I got a quality santoku knife about 10 years ago and I'm still using it daily, best knife I ever had.
And the verdict pays homage to cutting meat at last, since chefs knife was specifically designed for cutting large chunks of meat down. Cai dao is better all rounder because it was designed to be exactly that, an all rounder.
It's the jack of all trades, master of none
I use a chinese cleaver for almost everything...
Paring knife for peeling fruits and vegetables, bread knife/slicing knife for slicing bread and boneless meats.
Cleaver is great for cutting apart chicken at its joints and sternum.
Rookies may be scared of its size and weight, but practice proves it's a better all-around blade in the kitchen.
Agreed it's great all around. Need to figure out how to peel fruits 🤔
Hey there! My first video of yours, I enjoyed it thoroughly! I wanted to mention that I too had bought a chinese cleaver recently. I really enjoy it as well, has really become my go to knife. I wanted to make an observation that as an amateur home, and not professional chef, I really wouldn't consider the weight a huge issue as I don't think I'd need to cook for more than a few hours tops, and very easy to switch between smaller or lighter knives for other jobs too. I just love its massive cutting surface, and shovel feature it provides as well. Sometimes I won't even use bowls, just cut up into piles on the cutting board and shovel them in when v ready. Plus, I think it's the sharpest knife I have, so it's a beast. The knife I've been using is the Kyoku Daimyo Series 7" Cleaver. It's around 110 USD, but I've thought worth every penny since I bought it March of last year. Anyways, take care, God bless, keep cooking! I'll be sure to watch more and subscribe.
Thanks! Im not a professional chef either, so for most cases, the weight wont be an issue (as you stated). Sometimes the weight is also how it's distributed - I have some knives where the weight is in the correct spot and although they are heavier than other knives, the knife feels light as a feather!
Hi, I am from the region where this blade is branded of, great to see this on TH-cam make me so nostalgic!
Very cool!
There is a technique to smash garlic with a chinese cleaver which involves literally smashing it like a hammer. You cannot do this with any other type of knife as far as I know. Hold the blade completely perpendicular to the board and smash down and press in one motion. The weight of the knife completely crushes the garlic and you can then use tip to grind the garlic into a finer paste with one hand on the handle and the other pressing at the top along the cutting board. You can find chinese chefs using this technique on youtube sometimes. The same technique is often used to smash ginger and chinese onions quickly and they are used extremely often in almost all dishes.
Just to be sure, you mean like placing the knife on the garlic and press down to get rid of the peel? That can be done with most if not all chef knifes
You can do that, but you can also use the heel of the handle on some knives
@@LasseHG1 nope... Google Yan can cook garlic
There's two different things you're talking about I think, if I follow you. You can press down on garlic cloves and then just slip them out of their peel, then afterwards, you lay the knife on it side on the peeled clove (or cloves) and smear it across the board instead of mincing it with lots of slices. Then you swipe the blade of the knife across the board to pick up your now very finely mashed garlic paste. The smearing/turning it into a paste, then using the blade to gather it all up off the board technique also works with peeled ginger and turmeric, turning a 30 second to a minute or two prep job into a two or three second one.
I use a CCK 1303 small cleaver for 5 years. Its the only cleaver I've used that dose not wedge the vegetables it glides through the product. it is my daily prep knife I use it for 8 to 10 hours a day the edge holds too. And its only $70 You can get one off chef knives to go web sit. If you like cleaver you will love it. I actually have 2. 1 for work and 1 for home
Sounds like that might be a winner
I found a knife like this, believe it was a dexter Russell Chinese Chef's knife, by far the best knife ever, it's the multi tool for anybody in my position, as a farmer. Helps process large portions of raw veggies, meat, and is amazing when utilizing the leverage to chop lots of high stacked produce, fast.
I prefer thin blades personally over the thick, as they glide through produce faster and create less drag, or shift the vegetables less, so reorganizing the stack for consistency is not an issue.
I threw that knife away as it got rusty and was starting to become serrated from all the bones it had hit, defiantly going to look into another.
The Dexter Russell is a fantastic Chinese Chef's knife! Although, dont throw them away! It can be sharpened and made to be like new! These are also mostly meant for everything except cutting through thicker bones - those require the thick blades that are less prone to chipping
For other use of the Chinese style cleaver, I recommend the movie "Big Trouble in Little China", with a demonstration from the king of stuntsmen Al Leong himself!
Fantastic demonstration indeed!
As someone who works in an Asian style kitchen,
Chinese knifes are better for general prep work for veg and slicing fried things
Western knifes are better for prep work for meat and to do patterns
Both knives are used often but the Chinese style knife is favored more by most of the cooks
If you use a western style knife, it would take awhile to adjust to a Chinese style one, this is because western style uses the center/front center to cut things, while the Chinese style has the front for slicing, center for chopping and back for meat/bone cutting(bone as in soft bones like chicken joints)
Both does have their advantages
Highly recommend everyone to try both
I don't think I have seen a new knife that didn't have a burr from sharpening, except from a friend who takes old knives and refurbishes them. I do like the Chinese style cleavers. Very practical for so many things. I do agree about the weight issue. I finally found an old saw, high carbon steel, that has some flex to it for making a few for personal use. There is one 'category' of cleavers called 'Mulberry Knives' which, apparently were for slicing up the mulberry leaves for the silk worms, and the slices were supposed to be very thin. The blades will flex. Most of what I have seen that were called mulberry knives are rather rigid like the one you have here. Most are also in the 8 inch length for the blades, which is a bit big for me. So, when all else fails, make your own. I should have some pieces left over for more traditional kitchen knives and paring knives.
I believe with the traditional western knife you're supposed to use it to slice/cut while keeping the tip of the blade on the surface, instead of using it in a chopping way.
As said below, with the right technique it is nearly impossible to cut the fingertips.
Yep, It is not rocket science, you use a rocking motion for a curved blade.
By the way that piece of fancy crap that he calls a "western" Blade has nothing to do with a proper Zwilling or Whustof knife.
The cleaver is now my favorite kitchen tool and peels garlic like mad. You don't understand until you've tried it. Thank you for the recommendation!
awsome man just found your channel love your content and the voice overs are epic keep it up
Thanks!
Your here too? 😂😂😂
Personnally I'm only using old school antique Nogent-made kitchen knife, from France. Here you can find these pretty easily, they are absolutely awesome and not expensive if you got to some flea markets. But in other countries, that's not so easy...
As a dyed-in-the-wool beard despiser, I must say, you have a fantastic looking beard and mustache.
Thanks 🥸
Men have beards, non-men don't have beards.
I have had the 9 inch version for a year now, it is my go to knife at work. I prep, cook, do it all with this knife and since I do not have a set menu where I work I could be Dicing Beef to chopping onions. I have only injured myself a couple times and both are from me being unsafe. Over all I highly recommend this knife to any kitchen worker, I do not recommend the 9 inch for home use. It is a bit big for that, I have not used the 8 inch and that one might be better.
Thanks for the info! Would def be an interesting blade will working on the line 🤔
Seems like you would love nakiris. They're essentially a lighter, narrower version of this that's much better suited for precision cutting and prolonged use in my opinion
That's my next foray into a different knife style 😄
That's exactly what I thought before using a Vegetable Cleaver. For people that like to push cut it's definitely worth to try both of them.
When holding them they feel so different. It's hard to describe. I love both and both are comfortable to hold but gripping style is different and switching from one to the other is weird.
I just received one of these knives in the $35 range and instantly fell in love with it. Prepping all the ingredients for bulgogi with it felt like I was using a cheat (from chopping vegs to thinly slicing steak, wow). It's definitely intimidating at first, but it's a daily use blade for me now.
This is improved version with stainless steel, I have one of those old one passes from family member, hand made with high carbon steel wedge embedded in iron body( 夹钢工艺）, beside rust issue and watch your finger, this old one works the best
Carbon steel is a different animal altogether!
It's a traditional blade making technique common in east asia and called sanmai(three layers) in japanese, it can be done with any high performance cutlery steel and a softer jacket. I have a stainless sanmai gyuto in zdp-189 that takes a wicked edge and holds it like a champ. Nothing beats the blending of traditional artistry and modern materials
@@lydiamourningstar2028 you mean east Asia or waste Asia? Yeah not that fancy, just some village smith did that
@@chaodong4620 I did mean east and yeah the technique itself isn't necessarily fancy just takes skill. There's a reason why they use it as a challenge on Forged In Fire. It's a fundamental skill for a good smith.
Old meets new 👍
First video I've seen of this channel, it's already my favourite cooking show.
Woooo! 😂
Mandarin and Cantonese are both dialects of Chinese, the language is still called "Chinese". Mandarin uses the simplified writing system whereas Cantonese uses the traditional ☺️
Chinese is not a language. When people say Chinese they usually mean mandarin.
Actually, Cantonese is a popular southern dialect. Mandarin is the standard "official" pronunciation by modern day standards. Mandarin really isn't even the Beijing dialect like many thinks. If you've been to Beijing, their dialect is only similar to Mandarin, but it's not the same. the Chinese for mandarin (language) is "common tongue". I believe it has a northern origin as a result of the Man Dynasty having control of China before it became a republic.
Yes, but both mandarin and cantonese speakers also use traditional Chinese characters (and simplfied characters), it's not decided by the dialects you speak but education system you received and personal preference .
@@MrGod47 simplified Chinese is predominantly used in mainland china. Only hk uses the traditional writing
@@samuelchen717mu7 it depends whom you are talking to. There are tons of chinese who doesn't speak Mandarin
I have almost that same knife! Its fantastic, i use it 8 hours a day at work for almost a year now, i can chop, chip, slice anything, with a fresh sharpen i can get some nice sushi cut too even.
Theyre great workhorses!
@@BlackTieKitchen Ya I wack out chopped and sliced veggies by the quart all day, they can clean up and carve big slabs of meat with practice, and they sharpen so nice
wow!....This Brand ”Shi ba zi”from my hometown，whether the quality was good or not，its very very famous....at least in china, we usually pay around usd10 for ur video cover‘s knife
I def paid more than that lol. Good to know it's popular!
I'll politely disagree.
I work for P.F. Chang's and I'm a prep cook. I cut 90-210 lbs of boneless beef/chicken a day and I prefer my cleaver all day long over the supplied chef knives at work. I find the blade length, blade height and weight of the cleaver to be an advantage. But, this is my preference.
@@kevinobrien3888 absolutely agree! I'm just a home cook, but I cook in my kitchen like I am a chef behind the line. I always grab my cleaver! 💪🏽
You can find it in lots of Chinese family, as it used to be the classic wedding gift (before the standards went up). My parents got theirs as a moving away gift (yeah you eventually got one in your life one way or another).
Super interesting!
I like that your first thoughts ran to smashing garlic. But seriously, I went a long time without a chef's knife and now I can't imagine life without one. The best $100 you could spend. Well-balanced, good edge. (My father was a butcher, knives are in my blood) Now I'm looking at this knife/cleaver and thinking, mmmm.
Yeah, a good knife makes such a difference. I'm always afraid if sharpening them though 😂
First time I've seen your videos. Really liked it. I also really want a Chinese cleaver now. The narration was a classy touch, love it.
Thanks
If your city has an asian market, you'll likely be able to find a Shi Ba Zi cleaver there for not a lot of money, I bought mine a few years ago for like $7 and it is still a good knife. Steel is soft but sharpens easily, which in my opnion, is better than hard steel for a kitchen knife. The name Shi Ba Zi means Eighteen Men, I do not know where the name came from but it is pretty well known in China.
We have a handful of asian stores but theyre not very large (and rather far) :(
You now have a new subscriber. All hail the cleaver.
THE CLEAVER!!!!!
I really enjoy your sense of humor and cooking prowess.
Thanks!
Loving the editing on this video, nice work!
Thanks!
After years of using American, German, and Japanese style knives, I've been converted to using Chinese-style knives only. I own three of these cleavers, different sizes for different jobs. Also got a Chinese-type fish prep knife, which is so easy to use.
I've been cooking with a cleaver now for a few years. Can't go back to knife now, it feels good in my hand.
It quickly grows on you 😂
My secret cutting technique is NOT cut the food with top down motion, but slice with moving forward and down motion. It will use the weight of the cleaver to cut food, and you won't feel tire easily. And the way you cut will damage the Chinese cleaver easily. If you use magnifier to see the edge of the blade, you will find that looks like a saw rather than a smooth line. A saw cuts with slide forward/backward, not up and down.
chinese cookware have evolved over 5 thoussand years, japanese had learnt from it but included the western chef knife form. that depend on the person who is using the knife, they are all good knifes.
To be honest the whole hearing something evolving over X thousands of years in china tends to be often somewhat overstretched then again it's the same for most cultures. Cookware overall has been evolving across China or Europe for the relatively over a thousand years or in a matter of speaking across all of human history. Learning from another culture and adopting it for your own use case is also part of the evolution. However, it is true that it is dependant on the person using it one can still get used to another type of knife provided enough time it spends with it.
Yup - things have evolved for the use (and materials available). For example, a skinning knife would make a terrible kitchen knife - bit for it's specific use, it works wonders.
@Lyon Cheapest and only brand selling Chinese cleaver over here is SAN HAN NGA which sells for 20€ however I'm assuming it's mainly sold in China and rarely outside since I couldn't even find it on aliexpress however saw it on amazon once I think.
You can cut meat just fine with a Chinese cleaver. Separating chicken quarters is effortless with the extra mass behind the cut.
You do want to "choke" further up the blade for finer control, and the extra height makes it really safe for your fingers.
You can, sure. This cleaver isnt meant for heavy chopping though and should be used for slicing rather than hammering!
You wouldn’t really need to do any hard chopping when using a Chinese cleaver of this nature for separating chicken quarters as long as you slice through the joints, but I guess if it’s a whole chicken you could still use this knife efficiently but would dull the blade faster when you cut out the spine.
Fun fact: 十八子 (shi ba zi) is actually the deconstruction of the name 李 （li). Any one found their similarity?
He does not understand how to use it.
Now that makes perfect sense, I was wondering why the name, never thought that way.
That's interesting
@@lucisleesion8824 I feel he used it pretty well
🤷♂️😂
I just minced half of a pork loin into sausage with that very cleaver. Then, I turned a half of a cabbage into shreds, along with several peppers , a carrot and a couple onions. I didn’t have to clean a food processor or meat grinder. It saved time and effort while producing superior results. They’re pretty great .
Agreed!
The heel and the "tip" of the cleaver is also 90 degree-ish so you get a semi point if you need it. I use a cleaver sometimes but I find the balance to be a big disadvantage. The cleaver weight is a big advantage, even in slicing type cleavers, and so is the height where you hold the handle in some applications. I'm Chinese so i grew up using a cleaver but I use a santoku as a daily driver
Yeah, 100%. I have a santoku that's perfectly balanced and fits me like a glove - I feel like Arya from GoT when I use it 😂
I still keep my Shi Ba Zi zuo knife set on my counter top, it was bought 25 years ago in Shanghai. I love them.... Only addition to that set is a 8" zwilling chef's knife.
that's where I keep mine as well! Besides use... lack of space has become an issue as well lol
There are different type of Chinese knife，the one in the video is called 桑刀(sang dao)，this type is for slice and chop. 斩骨刀（zhan gu dao） are for break bones in the contrary
That was my understanding! Thanks
I have a ShiBaiZi桑刀. Not the greatest. There are far better 桑刀 than ShiBaiZi. I only hope the ShiBaiZi knife did not ruin Black Tie Kitchen experience.
I have another cleaver that im working about to start testing - let the duel begin!
I became a home cook after buying my cleaver, and struggling with the western knife. It was also cheap, but it's amazing.
Thanks! Someone who feels my pain!
My small handed weak ass was having so much trouble with this thing so seeing it be dwarfed in your paws took me aback *.*
haha it IS a rather large blade. Heavy too
There is a kind of japanese knife which is also square with a similar straight edge profile, but only half in height. My wife uses such one. You might look it up.
A nakiri?
@@BlackTieKitchen yes that's the name thanks. Also the knife in this video is actually a professional product and is heavier than most of those in household kitchens.
It’s how you hold it, I’ve seen 100 pound women use these knives all day, find the proper pinch technique and you can achieve these skills
Nice job on choosing a Chinese vegetable cleaver, the SBZ F208-1 and S210-1 are crazy sharp out of the box with pretty impressive edge retention. They are great for cutting paper thin salami slices as well.
Ya! Agreed on paper thinness - as thick of a blade as they are, they cut pretty thin
That knife looks awesome
It's pretty dope, no lies lol
I'm a semi-pro (No balls to start a full scale manufacture x) ) knifemaker and a great fan of Chinese (mostly south-western provinces and hardcore north so basically Mongolia) and I gotta say I never thought of getting/making a knife like this even though it's probably the easiest thing I could think of. Lack of point on the main knife standard will feel a bit weird but the ease of chopping in comparison to what I mostly do with a knife basically sells the design on its own. And I've seen a Guangdong chef slice meat into paper thin slices with, it must be magical :
It all depends on purpose! I wouldnt use a gut knife for cutting veggies just like i wouldnt use a paring knife to cut sashimi!
Clearly the cleaver is the one I want when the fight scene takes the obvious course and bursts into the kitchen.
Both a shield and a blade!
I've been using these $15 rectangular knife since I was 8-9 years old. They the best for chopping anything. Even better than my $200 damascus steel kitchen knife
中式菜刀很好用，只是你可能不知道如何使用...
他用得不错，除了剔骨，中式菜刀都很好用，就是略沉
他能用啊，在徐州我也有这种的。。。切得真好哦
西式刀只是切某些蔬菜有加成而已，其余时候都不如中式
you are absolutely right. got to see who is doing the talking. you cannot talk about the forest if all you know is the tree in front of you. this cleaver works great deboning a chicken - that is, if you know how to use it.
The ironic part is, even though i said chicken, I was really thinking of deboning fish - or pulling all the meat off a pork shoulder :/
Anyone here two years later; I bought one. Good knife for the price. Blade is excellent; handle and fitting are OK. I will say that I find myself going for it as my general purpose rough chopping knife more often than anything else so take that testimonial for what it's worth.
It's a great tool for almost all general kitchen use!
Try a French style Western knife like a Sebatier, rather than that German style knife. French style has a straighter edge meant for up/down chopping, rather than German style which has the more rounded belly for ‘rolling cut’.
Ill add it to my list!
Thanks for the review, i just got mine and i love it, still getting use to it
My finger has been saved by my nail a few times, myself. Thank God!
ditto lol
I use it to debone chicken, filet fish, cut veggies, peel ginger, chop green onion... I just have a hard time using western knife except the bread knife.
It depends on what youre used to. This blade for me would be too heavy for deboning chicken and such. However, i do have other cleavers that I *would* feel comfortable deboning chicken with!
The knife, like all your female relatives, is reminding you that there is no band on that ring finger.
Insulin resistance is the worst superpower!
Haha oh man 😅😅😅
I found you because of this video, I stayed for your style, thank you for the wonderful and extremely entertaining content.
Thanks!
I’ve really got to get one of these things ... someday when I have more drawer space ...
Haha yeah - it definitely takes up a decent amount of space 🤦♂️
Magnetic wall strips are your friend or wall mounted slotted knife rack
I havent found a good spot on a wall that wouldnt be overly dangerous and is also easily accessible 😂🤦♂️
I love a good cleaver. Having large hands, they feel substantial and easy to grip. I currently use a Serbian style chef knife and it's my favorite daily driver at work and home.