Roger Ver Interview: Some Bitcoin Cash maximalists don’t want you to hear this message
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ก.พ. 2025
- Watch the latest interview with Roger Ver on BTC, BCH, and BSV, how the future looks, adoption, and much more!
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►Original video:Roger Ver is Not Ready to Exit BCH (but wants to use his voice to improve it): • Roger Ver is Not Ready...
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![Roger Ver Vs Blockstream Supporter [FULL DEBATE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/WsVR1o1Gi7U/mqdefault.jpg)
►Timestamps:
0:11 - Introduction, Roger wanted to participate in the show
2:43 - When was the first time we met? The importance of the Foundation of Economic Education (FEE)
6:17 - Free market, BSV's Craig Wright's rhetoric, What is your take on BSV compared to BCH technically?
10:30 - Why haven't you retired yet, Roger? What keeps you going after 9 years?
11:51 - Memo.cash post: ‘Why do we support BSV?’ - jasonc.me/blog/why-memo-supports-bsv
13:04 - Roger: Do we give up on BCH or do we fight that war again?
16:49 - The truth behind the Thai meeting
20:51 - Calling everyone in crypto criminals, liars, scammers
21:26 - "Roger, have you considered sitting down with Craig and Calvin and hashing the stuff out and debating it?"
22:58 - Would you be open to discussing it with anybody else from the BSV community?
23:18 - What was the game plan?
24:06 - Thoughts on BSV mining 300 MB block
27:31 - It made mining unfair, BCH is an intermediate blockchain, BSV is not concerned about safety
28:51 - The technical arguments from the BCH philosophy were actually wrong across scaling
29:52 - Thoughts on Roger being banned from BSV threads on Reddit
35:40 - Good news about BCH
37:57 - How would you describe yourself? Anarcho-capitalist or voluntarist?
38:12 - Thoughts on what we share in common
40:30 - Two possible statements: BCH vs. BSV; eg: What chance do these two cryptocurrencies have to bring more economic freedom to the world?
44:36 - Deryk takes a look back on the history of Bitcoin
46:44 - Big difference in tools: CashFusion
49:39 - If you had a choice between a new digital currency that…
50:56 - Deryck's thoughts on bridging the gap, and economic freedom
53:22 - Steve's approach to building the Bitcoin economy
54:32 - To make freedom possible we need to skirt the boundaries of laws
56:57 - BSV approach vs. BCH approach on adoption strategy
1:00:31 - What if Bitcoin would have just raised its block size?
1:06:26 - Breaking Bitcoin in 2013
1:10:08 - Roger, did you ever communicate with Satoshi?
1:10:24 - Roger bought the domain name of Blockchain.com
1:11:05 - How are you not walking around being super paranoid?
1:12:25 - On BTC people: Greg Max, Adam Back
1:15:43 - Thoughts on things that could have been done differently: Bitcoin Classic, Bitcoin XT, Hong Kong agreement, New York agreement, fork to BCH, etc.
1:18:14 - Opinion on the decision making of the Chinese miners
1:20:39 - Adam Back's signature
1:21:16 - What happened to Bitcoin.com during the scaling civil war?
1:24:21 - A big advantage that Bitcoin Cash has today
1:25:44 - Positives of Bitcoin in 2020
1:28:00 - What are the winning scenarios in the next 5-10-years? Laughing at an awkward interview only hardcore fans would know
1:31:03 - How does BCH succeed? An analogy between BSV and BCH
1:34:46 - Create tokens at mint.bitcoin.com
1:35:52 - Who is Carl Watner?
1:38:06 - What could be fixed to make you interested in BCH rather than some other coin?
1:49:04 - Do you think it matters who Satoshi is?
1:51:56 - Is there anyone that you suspect to have a greater than 50% probability of being Satoshi?
1:56:11 - Final words
It looks like Roger is pivoting towards going to BSV.
Pin this please
It does made me sad all these great people we lost in the fork. I think the same about Emin. The BCH community was so strong and vibrant.
Thanks for the helpful timestamps!
@@loopnester7157 Nice try, bro. He indicated he still supports BCH since it is the best equipped to provide global economic freedom.
Roger is a legend actually... some of us have been against him and then for him... then against him again and for him again.... we are all actually being played by various media outlets. For me, I want to say Roger you are a legend dude. Congratulations and thank you for your passion dude, fuk them HATERS
BCH for the win! 📈👏🏼🤑
Damn straight! Great job Roger Ver!
100%
Thanks Roger, stay with BCH. It's a marathon.
Why do you see BCH better than BSV?
if you want BCH to be a currency for the world you don't fill it with random data as they have with SV. It's also questionable as to whether they can sustain 100MB+ blocks, it's not a bad thing that BCH is being more careful when there's still plenty of capacity available for pushing adoption.
100%
I think they are delusional in thinking that BSV will be successful over BCH. Having a higher blocksize limit or none at all means nothing compared to growing your user base. The current network effects that BCH has over BSV is more than enough to beat BSV. We do need to increase blocksize limit though.
BSV has thousands of organic users, plus many more available use cases, lower fees, more reliable development protocol and infinitely more capacity.
@@Kurtwuckertjr BCH is good enough, we don't need another fucking coin.
All of the worlds value should be in 1 coin not distributed amongst many.
We need deflation and as much deflation as we can get on 1 coin.
I would prefer it if everyone used Monero and forgo all other coins.
If everyone used Bitcoin Cash and Bitcoin Cash still worked for cheap fees, instant transactions by 0 confirmations and all that good stuff I would still be happy with that though not as good as Monero.
Adoption is happening far too slowly.
Bitcoin core is crippled beyond belief.
Send money in BCH vs BTC... It's no contest! BCH is blazingly fast!
Hey Roger! You’ll be missed dearly if you leave the crypto scene. Keep up the work good sir!
This was a great discussion. I rarely make it through long-form videos like this, but was glued through every second.
Who agree bch value will be 10k?
1million in a decade.
BCH is Bitcoin that actually works. Once use of Crypto begins people will get it... BCH works
I am anti-state. I have been following bitcoin for many years and currently own only BCH because of Roger.
If Roger goes to BSV or starts his own coin, I am in.
Thank you for your support, but please do continue to think for yourself as well.
Don't follow anyone.
Start a new coin? Seriously?
We should be building on the network effects of Bitcoin Cash and grow adoption.
Adoption is happening far too slowly.
I just want to say this was a fun interview with open minds from the classic big block camps. As a BSV supporter, I just want to say that BSV is more than just Craig or Calvin, just like BCH is more than Roger or Amaury or whoever else.
I was saddened by the split because I’m a bitcoin fundamentalist, and a voluntaryist. I went with BSV despite my reservations about worldview because I believed that a fundamental application of bitcoin was more powerful than any one person’s bad ideas.
BSV has continued to shatter records on bitcoin scaling, and I believe it will continue to outpace BCH in development, and (more importantly) enterprise adoption.
I don’t want you to join us or do anything in particular. Just consider the fact that BSV is a stripped down implantation of bitcoin. Nothing more or less. If that appeals to you, come build an app, or a wallet or use it as cash at your business.
If not, no hard feelings. We will keep on building.
you are a voluntaryist? I don't want to be mean, but I doubt that.
It's a shame miners and exchanges didn't switch to Bitcoin Unlimited software instead of Bitcoin Core. That could have avoided the chain-split, but maybe BCH vs BTC would have happened anyway. But then maybe we should still be trying to switch everyone over to BU, on the BTC chain.
50 BTC were moved from a Wright claimed 2009 BTC adress (first month mining)... How could he be Satoshi? So how could he pretend a Satoshi Vision? I guess we can qualify Wright as scammer and BSV is impostur, simply.
He is Shitoshi wankamoto
Wow what a great point. Every 6 months there is a huge opportunity for controversy and stress.
I'm in on Bitcoin Cash, I didn't know though that BSV isn't actually the Craig Coin, so I'll be paying more attention to it and more so if Roger Ver were to back it.
Privacy is freedom. Some of you guys should seriously meditate a "real democracy concept" in which every citizen is responsible. It's the root of decentralization and the root of real cryptocurrency IMO.
Watched the whole thing, great intervju! Thanks for your work Roger. 🙌🏻🙌🏻 I really like that you're striving for a better money. Would love to see a focused video on the argument for bigger blocks answering how BCH can still be decentralized even though the node runners need to have larger hard drives. Some solid maths and projections (HDD space will be cheaper over time). Maybe also around what incentives there are to run a full node, and how you can do it! Would love to!
Decentralization isn’t about node count. The white paper even warns against running a node that doesn’t hash because it creates the opportunity for a sybil attack. This is actually how UASF occurred on BTC.
The incentive to run a real (hashing/mining) node is to earn the block rewards and to earn the fees generated by transactions. Any other incentive actually creates a drag on the network.
@@Kurtwuckertjr ok i understood half of that. Im not so tech savvy sorry. But where does it say that in the WP? Satoshi litterally said nodes can log off and when they come on they accept the longest chain as the valid one. or ma I wrong?? Miners and nodes are splitted. I dont understand how running a node can be bad for the network. It gets harder to shut down when nodes are many? Few = weak, right? Every node can vote on changes to the network etc?
The real question is, did the 300mb block come from the network mempool or just a local mempool? Previously BSV has been doing these blocks without broadcasting the tx's (so they never touch network mempool), which actually creates more of a propagation issue because it's the first time peers have seen any of the tx's (as they didn't exist in their mempool). I agree there is no good argument for small blocks. There's issue with third-party infrastructure currently when you pass 20mb blocks (on bitcore & bitdb etc, basically anything using mongodb). rpc-explorer is able to handle it as it doesn't do its own indexing but is still slow. However, these applications/indexers should be improved instead of allowed to limit network scaling.
There have been a few 300mb+ blocks. A Chinese social/dating app came online and is using BSV for payments and data integrity. The transactions were mostly from them.
Older but blocks were indeed specific stress tests. These blocks were built from the public mempool.
@@Kurtwuckertjr Block 635141 was 300MB+ ; the block before (635140) was only 1MB and the block after 2MB.
It doesn't look like any other node was aware of any of the transactions included in 635141.
This block is merely a PR stunt. Interesting to see that after that huge block, subsequent blocks have had to be mined by taal during half an hour... Other miners were busy trying to validate that block to check if they could (or not) build on-top of this one...
big-T They were aware. The avg fee was ~0.25 sats/byte which means the txns were sitting to aggregate for a while. This is why it’s crucial to have reliable mempool management and 0-conf, so the end users are none the wiser about their transaction settlement.
This was not a PR stunt. There have been consistent large blocks from the app for weeks now.
I always thought that 6 month fork was very stupid idea. In fact because of the BSV fork and the 6 month forking I've come to appreciate the BTC immutability and find value in it.
USD is the most black-market currency ever. So the arguments of crypto (such as BCH) not being able to simultaneously be both, holds no water whatsoever.
Glad you shared this. Had some criticism of you, but posted anyway :)
Stay based Roger. We love ya.
Really great interview and discussion.
However, the reason BSV is a non-starter for so many people, is because of 1) HOW the BCH/BSV split happened and the shenanigans of CW and CA, 2) the continued shenanigans of CW in regards to suing anything that moves, 3) patenting the hell out of anything and everything, thereby creating a further avenue for satisfying CW’s nasty penchant for lawsuits, and 4) statist boot-licking rhetoric.
There was very little effort to try to work out the differences between BCH/BSV on the part of CW and CA. For example, it would have been REASONABLE to employ a compromise that allowed for a fixed schedule that allowed for regular block size increases (assuming no issues arose with the previous larger block increment) say, doubling every 6 months or 1 year, until the desired BSV size was achieved. Thereby satisfying both parties (BCH = don’t increase block size too rapidly out of concern something disastrous might happen; BSV = giant blocks now).
Also we could have structured network updates in such a way that a supermajority of miner acceptance was required for contentious issues like 1) including an opcode that would later allow for the addition of smart contracts (bad idea, imo, Ethereum and half a dozen other alts already do this, Bitcoin Cash’s focus should be on peer to peer electronic cash for the foreseeable future), and 2) CTOR (good idea, imo, it substantially improves network efficiency but doesn’t change functionality). In either case, let the miners decide by requiring them to signal which new features/changes they will accept and which they won’t. Miners are incentivized to choose wisely for maximum longevity, usability, and success of the network. And if they choose wrongly, they will hamstring the network and pay the price in lost future revenue.
Governance is a huge issue, and it is paramount that there be some way of dealing with contentious new features/upgrades in a predictable way assuring all participants that the stability of the network will remain intact first and foremost - where disruptive and harmful chain forks are not acceptable. Plenty of people hold sizable amounts of crypto and want to see the value of their holdings at least preserved in USD equivalent. Either the upgrade should succeed or fail. For example, code into the network upgrade process, that if the upgrade doesn’t receive overwhelming consensus within a short period of time (75%? the upgrade fails, and the original unmodified chain continues). This ensures that developers don’t pack too many (possibly contentious) new features/changes into a single upgrade, and instead upgrade the network incrementally with smaller changes that can be voted on individually.
In my mind, BSV was dead before it even started for the shenanigans cited above. My trust-o-meter will never allow me to be on board for BSV due to the absurd level of power wielded by CW and CA as well as previous deplorable behavior. BCH is following not too far behind due to governance issues that instills fear and uncertainty into the markets. Some big improvements are necessary here to revive BCH and foster excitement and renewed interest. Embracing Ava Labs’ superior consensus protocol to get immediate Visa-level scaling and performance could do it.
@@jimmyhua731 What differentiates BSV from BCH?
@@jimmyhua731 The problem is, you can't... If you choose to build something on top of BSV, you literally choose to build on top of a coin that is ***owned*** by Calvin & Craig.
@Jimmy Hua Unfortunately, BSV = CSW and Co. There is no separation.
How does roger ver calculate optimal block size?
Emil said bitcoin.com wallet can’t have cash fusion because it uses onion routing or something like that, is there any truth to that? One thing I am so excited about is cash fusion in the bitcoin.com wallet.
Nice
I have a problem putting my coins and even my fiat money anywhere close to CSW's reach or in any way that would support his cause. If he stepped down and was no longer part of the project, then yes maybe.
lmao
Legally compliant... historically every new tech innovation will surpass laws... cause laws adapt to new teks and not the inverse.
Early in the conversation (prior to 13 minutes) there's discussion about another debate as to whether or not "data apps" should be on block chain. I don't have the background about all these controversies but I'm curious as to which chains (BTC, BCH, BSV) were generally for the concept and which were against. Can someone clue me in?
Many times in this video, I heard various people say that it is important to have a "stable protocol to build on". When people make that statement, it makes me wonder whether they have ever tried to develop a product on top of any cryptocurrency platform. For the vast majority of applications, what you really need is a stable high-level API. If your application code can call a function like "sendTransaction(amount, destinationAddress, mySigningKey)", then everything that happens "under the hood" is usually irrelevant. Will the transactions in the block be ordered topologically or canonically? Will there be a compression algorithm applied to block data transmission? Who cares. I just wanted my app to send a transaction.
It's an extremely small subset of applications that genuinely need to care about the underlying protocol. And those that do probably care about it BECAUSE they stand to benefit from pushing the boundaries of what the protocol is capable of. They don't want "stability", they want the new protocol features that would enable their application to exist. For the 99% of everyone else, they want that discussion abstracted away behind a high-level API like BITBOX.
Would love any response to these thoughts from pro-BSV people.
BCH IS REAL BITCOIN.....KOREAN THINK LIKE THAT..
Koreans are smart. Can't wait for the New Ioniqs to come out to Aus. Those things are amazing.
Kevin Pham trolls for BSV too. Loves government involvement in crypto too...
Great video.
a super transparent and totally traceable money is a great thing if the Government and all the people working for the government were required to use it. Then there would be no privacy for the government and the people could see everything they do. Next time some idiot politician starts jabbering about money laundering we should we cant have privacy why should you.
Honestly I never took Craig Wright seriously. I watched his content for about 30 mins when he first started trending and I knew there was something 100% not right about him. Just my gut and I have no proof. But just thought I’d throw in my 0.02 for what it’s worth.
I hope BCH grows but I think XMR is the true bitcoin and it will be adopted widely 2-10 years from now.
I think both will be popular, for different use cases. XMR will be the king Crypto of choice for the underworld forever. those are some deep pockets. BCH will be the day to day cash for most people who aren't as worried about people knowing they bought a coke at a deli. Plus Cashfusion does a great job at keeping nosey people out of the basics.
BCHadoken!!💚
what is the title about? bitcoin maximalists or bch maximalists?
They arent trying to be maximalists
I can pretty much tell they are Generation Y (excluded Roger Ver.). All they know is »winner takes it all« - growing up with google and facebook. The world dominating crypto currency Bitcoin - LOL. But blockchain scales very good by diversity. Many small blockchain scale perfect for different people with different needs in a decentralised way. I am glad the fork went through. That is how anarchy works. Vote with your feet. I use Monero, because i want privacy and love nerd tech.
P.S. I don't even have a facebook account. My facebook is called IRC.
I think different blockchains for different use cases have much more merit than just a one size fits all approach. I believe in Monero for absolute privacy, I believe in ETH for DEFI, and i believe in BCH for day to day transactions between people like a massive global savings account.. There is plenty enough room for everyone.
Why is Roger attacked so much, hes acually really nice guy with some valid points. I think BTC lost a huge asset when BCH was created.
I think that people believe it is fashionable. Either that or we are too dumb do understand.
2017 saw a lot of shit slinging. couple that with blatant censorship of /r/bitcoin and you have a recipe for hate that never got questioned for those who resided in the brainwashed one sided chat channels.
Roger, I do not want you to even think about retiring. That's Not You. Keep you head and Spirit up at all times, we support you! Please I need to talk to you in private (face to face). I do not travel, but if you ever come to Belgium, let it be known. Ik will buy you dinner.
It was the same pool that mined the blocks after the big blocks on SV.
Thanks for making me cry everyone
@Roger Ver what is your opinion on the claims that Adam Back is Satoshi? I feel disappointed.
Roger keep doing the lords work, ty.
But people forget the code fork that is still better than btc, has more adoption including ATMs than either fork and is better at not changing than BSV is Litecoin.
Isn't it easier to just use a better architecture? One with unbounded on-chain scalability, sophisticated conditional transactions, deterministic finality, doesn't leak network value to power companies and miner manufacturers, fair transaction ordering, low predictable fees. e.g. Obyte.org
Why not??
BSV told us everything about them when it was admitted a backdoor to that coin. Promises of privacy except for the police or government who might need to know what you are doing..........get it.
That was not admitted. Technically, every piece of software has back doors, also. Exploiting them is a function of cost/benefit.
Its sound very good but I think it needs a very best instructor or educator for someone from Africa to clearly understand how the earns are obtained and how to have an account/ a bitcoin wallet
BCASH keep up with the market !!! PUMP !!! 1000 $ 2020
bitcoin cash do pump 1000 $ 2020
There will be a pump 1000 $ 2020
So the problem with SV is not with the blockchain itself but Calvin, CSW and some SV reddit run by random guys. Got it.
This roundtable was certainly informative, but it was hardly encouraging. I've been heavily invested (in relation to my means) in BCH for quite awhile, but have nothing in particular against BSV. According to this discussion, there's contention within the ranks of both camps, with little hope on the near horizon of resolution. Everyone agrees that BTC sucks the big green one, and both BCH and BSV are vastly superior, but so what? That doesn't really advance the ball down the field very far. My other big investment (again, for me) is in ETH. This discussion has me considering just forgetting Bitcoin in all its forms altogether, and pinning my hopes entirely on ETH, although I don't like the idea of being totally concentrated like that. Kind of frustrating, actually. One thing that seems worth considering is that both BCH and BSV camps should probably be rooting for ETH to flip BTC in market cap, and at less than an 8 to 1 current ratio, it has a much better chance than either BCH or BSV of doing so. If and when that happens, BTC will have been knocked off its leadership perch, which is fraudulent in my opinion, possibly opening up the space in a healthy way for either or both BCH and BSV. Just a thought.
ETH is only good for 15 transactions per second. It doesn’t scale, and it’s extremely buggy to program. My advice: if you want something to succeed, try building something with/on the protocol.
Diversify. don't hold all your eggs in one basket. look at Monero & Cardano, They imho are long term bets.
So what youre telling me is there are going to be trade offs depending which cryptocurrency I use? How reflective of economics! There is no utopian coin!
-- traceable currency backed by CW...NFW!
Interesting points of view that I would not normally even listen to. I just know the history of CW (aka douchbag king) and his law suits, the battles. Nah.. I will never go to BSV. It is not my cup of tea. We just need money that works, no tricks. If you want to build on something - that is what EOS if for.. faster, and cheaper.. If you are needing to put things on top of it, why not use ETH? but EOS is still better. Look - you want freedom from THE WORLD controllers from their regulations, then you are going to have to fight until they can't fight you anymore. Ahh.. I'm tired of fighting for the right chain.. ahh ahh.. eek gads! Stay in the system and enjoy your slavery. Freedom isn't free and if you think putting up with this fight for a free currency is too much, you are not interested in freedom.. you are interested in profit.. and in the end, you will not have neither. Regulations are there for control, nothing else. Great example coming - FDIC insurance.. they back $200,000 ...will pay out nothing as this dollar collapse hits in the next 16 months.
Satoshi gave himself a million bitcoin never mined bitcoin so people saying that satoshi mined butcoin is a lie
State doesn't fund itself by inflation.
That's one way.
Jim Rickards says Bitcoin is headed to $200.
Alot people dont want to here this all this talk about satoshi minning bitcoin he never mined bitcoin he assigned him self one million bitcoin out of the 21 million
Both coins are a scam and the fork happened in the last possible moment to bring down the price of BTC. So it was well calculated in advance.
samson block me on twitter for saying liquid aml/kyc is a joke
Samson Mow might be the most pathetic person in crypto. Maybe Adam Back or Gregory Maxwell are comparable imbeciles.
BTH 1000$
CARDANO
Will BSV be added to the Bitcoin.com wallet?
No.
Hopefully never. BSV is a scamcoin.
bsv is total scamcoin. Lol they want stable protocol, high throuput and shit hahaha
@@SBU_007 They want 1 thing: to rip you off. Don't be an idiot.
Bcash is core 2.0?
Hahaha, that's all kinds of stupid, but it's typical for Roger i guess.
It's a game over Roger, you failed. B cash even failed it's halving. BCH is a shit coin, what ever you say.
lol meanwhile btc dominance is falling like a rock and BCH is killing it. BTC is going to go down in flames.
Adam Back is Satoshi Nakamoto!..........now that his identity has been revealed it didnt turn out to be a surprise nor a big deal. I was hoping for a complete unknown but if it was Szabo who would be surprised.
no he isn't
Yep. Definitely Adam Back. I was hoping I would never find out so he would be a Santa Clause figure and not show the human frailties of greed and lack of humility.
False. Adam Back doesn’t even make sense as a plausible candidate.
Satoshi wouldn't have crippled his own creation so that the fees got so high that only the rich could afford to use it. use your head.
@@Fanta.... No he wouldn't would he.
All BCH folks are welcome to BSV with open arms. I'm afraid Roger's anarchist/anon ideas are a dead end though. Enterprises will flee and govts will crack down. BCH is fighting a losing battle. I love the BCH community in many ways, but they don't seem to understand that total anonymity ENABLES state corruption. I'm not a fan of Craig or Calvin, but they're right... BSV is the only way. The enormous growth/capabilities of the BSV ecosystem shows this (Twetch, Tocial.io, Moneybutton, EHR Data, etc).
Are you in this business to please enterprises and governments? There is definitely no value in adoption if it comes with compromising the crypto values.
You need to brush up on what permissionless means. Who gives a shit about "enterprises"? It's not for them, it's for the people. People need to learn not to depend on government money to trade amongst themselves. Let it run as its own economy, even to the point that enterprises are alienated.
You are talking about going against everything bitcoin was founded on. The whole point is to get outside of the global banking cartel, otherwise known as the government. If you want government to control your money and how you spend it, by all means go for BSV.
Bch will go down
So will btc
I really do like Monero as Internet money - but i do also use BCH and Dash to do offline (real world payments), because they are pretty fast.
@@norbertlegion9402 Monero is gold standard in privacy