This is such a stupidly detailed and in depth review, amazing work. Pure passion for sound! I really loved the input comparasions, because the source for your music matters alot. Question ,do you remember if the usb input on the ef600 was inferior to its own coaxial input etc btw? Thanks for the great review again.
I'm glad you liked it! I didn't actually do detailed testing on the EF600, but I ran it from both USB and coaxial and didn't notice any significant drop-off from either so I think it's comparable on both.
I've been super curious about the Serenade. I've been using the Arya Stealth and EF400 for a good while now. Really love the pairing. I recently got the HE1000 Stealth and after lots of listening to various genres of music, and checking out opinions from people with way more experience with Dacs/amps, I've been feeling like it might be time to upgrade to something a little more robust to really bring out the full potential of the HE1K Stealth. Not sure what would pair "best" with this headphone, but the price of the Serenade is definitely at my upper limits. On the other hand, I've heard so many stories of how many of these Hifiman headphones pair well with tube amps, and I own 0 tube amps lol. Basically, I have lots of curiosity, but a limited budget atm. Something keeps drawing me back to the Serenade. Still not entirely sure 😅. Lots of helpful info in this video though!
Glad you liked the video. The HEK Stealth definitely goes well with tubes, but the Serenade is also excellent with them. Hard to say which option is best, but you could always start with the Serenade as DAC and amp upgrade and then add a tube amp later too if you want.
Just watched the video - timely as I have been researching getting a new streamer to upgrade from a Bluesound NODE. As I never use the internal DAC on the NODE you hope the money goes into the best network streamer implementation I.e. the Lumin U2 Mini. I also want a ‘different flavour’ of sound as I have a Naim Atom Headphone Edition which has a very good streamer. Like you my main DAC is the TT2 & MScaler - but I am also saving to add a new Dac- again to try a different flavour … and am looking at Dayzee Geshilli or Audial S5 - which is interesting and has some positive comments ( and uses an old Philips chip) what matters to me is soundstaging and holographic presentation - so a transport only seems the best way to go for me and can ‘grow ’ as I want to experiment with different Dacs! Thanks
Hello! Great review as always I’m currently using a Fiio K5 Pro as my DAC/amp and I’m considering an upgrade. I’ve been eyeing the Serenades to pair with my Meze 109 Pros. Since the Mezes have a more treble-focused sound, I feel like the Serenades, with their calmer and warmer emphasis, could complement the tonality of the headphones and further enhance the already excellent experience I’m getting. Would love to hear your thoughts on this pairing!
I didn't have the 109s here to try with the Serenade, but I do think it would be an excellent pairing, particularly if you're finding the treble on the 109s to be too spicy.
@@PassionforSound Thank you very much for your response! If you think there are other pairings for the 109s, I’m open to suggestions within the same budget and would love to hear if you know any other alternatives to consider. Thanks!
I just listened to the Serenade and a FiiO R9 using a Focal Clear MG and I preferred the Serenade. Warmer and cleaner. The R9 sounded harsh and sibilant to me. This is of course with my ears and my tastes, so YMMV.
That's so funny! The previous comment on my feed was complaining about it, but I'm with you - I'm really happy with my audio capture and processing now. To answer your question, I apply some gentle compression (2:1) with a very soft knee and then some multiband compression to tailor the tonality a bit (+3dB below 120Hz, -2.9dB from 308-3176Hz). And I also run a de-esser to take the edge of any sibilance. Honestly, it sounds pretty great with none of that applied so this is more preferential than necessary.
Great review! thanks! I have the Arya Stealth with the Schiit Modius DAC and Drop THX AAA 789 amp currently and i definitely find this setup way too bright on the highs... I was looking at replacing the Drop THX AAA 789 for the Xduoo TA-20 plus hybrid tube amp to warm things up but now after seeing this review, should i consider the serenade to give me similar results of taming the highs but keeping more resolution overall? Thanks.
Do you think the Serenade is a great combo for the Empyrean 2? Or would you prefer the Aune S9c? Or maybe something else? Looking forward to your answer :)
Good question. I'd have to test this to be certain, but I think the amp stage on the Serenade might pull ahead while the DACs are probably comparable. I'll see if I can find the time to check for you...
Having now compared both the Mojo 2 and Serenade driving the Arya Stealth (nearest tuning to the HEK Stealth that I have here), I'd say that both are similar in overall performance, however, the tonality of the Serenade brings a better tonal balance to the headphones IMO. The Mojo 2 comes across as maybe having slightly better resolution, but the Serenade has more weight and authority in the sound which I think these brighter HiFiMan headphones benefit from. The Serenade isn't lacking in resolution either, it's just not emphasising the details due to the richer/warmer tuning of the amp and DAC. I.e. if I were choosing, I'd get the Serenade despite the fact that I LOVE the Mojo 2 as a portable device.
Thanks for the review! Can these drive the Susvara good? I'm looking to buy these soon but don't have the budget for like another 3k+ for an AMP/DAC, I´ve no need for speaker or anything, just the susvara via USB to my PC.
I don't have a Susvara to test with the Serenade, but the specs of the Serenade would suggest that it has about 2W available at the Susvara's impedance so it should do fine.
Yep. No conspiracy here. It was a flip of a coin between the Serenade and Prelude and either could have been released sooner still is not for the other gear I had to get to first. 🙂
Current is a part of the power equation (watts = amp X volts). If the amp has sufficient power and headroom at the headphone's impedance, it has enough current.
@@PassionforSound Serenade JR Red - junior version, has Himalaya Le R2R chip, cost 500 usd, much cheaper than black Serenade with Himalaya Pro. Ef600 cost 500 usd too, but black Serenade cost 930 USD, is it worth overpaying?
12:26 can i ask what device you're using in order to access the optical input, coax input, and network input on the Serenade and Bifrost? As a newbie, who got into this hobby via iems, I'm only familiar with usb C inputs on dongles (to connect to a phone) 🤔
Sure thing! For the optical, coax, etc. I'm taking those outputs from a Singxer SU-6 digital to digital converter (DDC). This is a great way to give you many outputs from a single USB connection and to also isolate your DACs from PC noise. There are multiple DDCs on the market that all seem to perform quite similarly at their price levels (i.e. similar price = similar performance). For the network input, that's just a regular ethernet connection from your home internet modem/router setup and then you can access it from software on devices connected to the same network.
I'm not sure which DACs are using resistor volume controls, but I don't know that it's worth chasing an R2R control when most DACs these days are lossless/bit perfect with their volume controls and therefore could technically be better than R2R ladders because you're not adding additional components in the signal path.
14:13 can i ask how you would rate the usb output of an android phone like samsung s22 ultra? As a newbie, who got into this hobby via iems, I've been using my phone as the music source and connecting it to a dongle. But it seems like when i watch desktop dac reviews, nobody is using a phone
There's nothing at all wrong with using your phone and they can actually be better than a laptop/desktop computer because they produce less noise by being more power efficient (i.e. less stuff going on = less noise produced). It's most likely that reviewers like me are using desktop setups with computers because that's what we have. I've also done things to my desktop to optimise the USB output quality. (I'll explain that in my response to your other question)
I wonder how you can be sure about Serenade internal DAC implementation since there is no any mention about how it works on Serenade manual? Is it NOS or oversampling, who knows?
I believe I speculated in the video, but said "I think", not "I know" as it was only based on how it sounded when compared to the Himalaya DAC in the EF600 which can be switched between OS/NOS.
@@PassionforSound ic Then would be nice to see your thoughts about the differences between OS/NOS modes in EF600. Or am I miss something and you've already mentioned it in one of your previous videos?)
Having some issues getting it back on the network. Might have to do a reboot of the system later and see what's going on. I'll reply once I get it all working again
Ok. Update #3: it's back on the network (after a switch reboot) and it's not showing up in Bubble UPnP, but it is available to Roon. I can't see it in JRiver either so perhaps it's limited to Roon and maybe Apple Airplay (it appeared briefly in Roon as an AirPlay device before reverting to the Roon ready option)
it does have an issue with Ethernet Tidal Connect also, when it works its great but it disappears and need to restart maybe an issue with the IP address or maybe Tidal Connect certification is not complete but Airplay via wifi is perfect. I informed Hifiman they told me they have applied for Tidal certification. Am using it purely as Dac now with Eversolo A6 as streamer. Serenade R2R Dac is good non fatiguing@@PassionforSound Your reviews are great.
Interesting product. I am sure I really care to switch off the network feature. But kind of nice still. I have the Sundaras and those never leave me, but more listening is done on my Focal Elegias these days. I think this is intriguing and lets learn more product, but not stop press, and get it now kind of thing for me. I would probably go with EF600 more if I made a move. From a packaging standpoint that Serenade is a big boy for me. Space is a biggy for me. But hmmm, at my work desk. Could be very tasty. If my work didn't MAC filter everything this could be a contender. Possibilities.
Correction: Goldenwave is/was a Hong Kong based company
Nice we finally got a real review on this dac/amp.
I'm glad you liked it
This is such a stupidly detailed and in depth review, amazing work. Pure passion for sound!
I really loved the input comparasions, because the source for your music matters alot.
Question ,do you remember if the usb input on the ef600 was inferior to its own coaxial input etc btw?
Thanks for the great review again.
I'm glad you liked it!
I didn't actually do detailed testing on the EF600, but I ran it from both USB and coaxial and didn't notice any significant drop-off from either so I think it's comparable on both.
@@PassionforSound Thanks man, really appreciate it.
I have this with my Hifiman Arya stealth - I always look forward to switching it on … and I’m always blown away as if listening for the first time ❤
That's such a great feeling to have. I can imagine it being a wonderful combo with the Arya Stealth. Enjoy!
I was very curious abour this review. Excelent as always.
Glad you liked it!
excellent review, thanks! 🎉
I'm glad you liked it!
Now in 2024 Hifimann bring another 3 in one device : EF 500 for a very nice price.
I hope to see an review in your channel .
I'll see what I can do!
I've been super curious about the Serenade. I've been using the Arya Stealth and EF400 for a good while now. Really love the pairing. I recently got the HE1000 Stealth and after lots of listening to various genres of music, and checking out opinions from people with way more experience with Dacs/amps, I've been feeling like it might be time to upgrade to something a little more robust to really bring out the full potential of the HE1K Stealth. Not sure what would pair "best" with this headphone, but the price of the Serenade is definitely at my upper limits.
On the other hand, I've heard so many stories of how many of these Hifiman headphones pair well with tube amps, and I own 0 tube amps lol. Basically, I have lots of curiosity, but a limited budget atm. Something keeps drawing me back to the Serenade. Still not entirely sure 😅. Lots of helpful info in this video though!
Glad you liked the video. The HEK Stealth definitely goes well with tubes, but the Serenade is also excellent with them. Hard to say which option is best, but you could always start with the Serenade as DAC and amp upgrade and then add a tube amp later too if you want.
Just watched the video - timely as I have been researching getting a new streamer to upgrade from a Bluesound NODE. As I never use the internal DAC on the NODE you hope the money goes into the best network streamer implementation I.e. the Lumin U2 Mini. I also want a ‘different flavour’ of sound as I have a Naim Atom Headphone Edition which has a very good streamer. Like you my main DAC is the TT2 & MScaler - but I am also saving to add a new Dac- again to try a different flavour … and am looking at Dayzee Geshilli or Audial S5 - which is interesting and has some positive comments ( and uses an old Philips chip) what matters to me is soundstaging and holographic presentation - so a transport only seems the best way to go for me and can ‘grow ’ as I want to experiment with different Dacs! Thanks
Glad I could help! I'm hoping to get my hands on a Dayzee soon too.
Hello! Great review as always
I’m currently using a Fiio K5 Pro as my DAC/amp and I’m considering an upgrade. I’ve been eyeing the Serenades to pair with my Meze 109 Pros. Since the Mezes have a more treble-focused sound, I feel like the Serenades, with their calmer and warmer emphasis, could complement the tonality of the headphones and further enhance the already excellent experience I’m getting. Would love to hear your thoughts on this pairing!
I didn't have the 109s here to try with the Serenade, but I do think it would be an excellent pairing, particularly if you're finding the treble on the 109s to be too spicy.
@@PassionforSound Thank you very much for your response! If you think there are other pairings for the 109s, I’m open to suggestions within the same budget and would love to hear if you know any other alternatives to consider. Thanks!
Nothing else springs to mind at the price and with that style of sound unless you went for separates like maybe a Geshelli J3 DAC & A3/E3 amp.
I just listened to the Serenade and a FiiO R9 using a Focal Clear MG and I preferred the Serenade. Warmer and cleaner. The R9 sounded harsh and sibilant to me. This is of course with my ears and my tastes, so YMMV.
That makes sense as the Serenade is a little more full bodied compared to some more sterile devices. It's a lovely unit.
Wonder how does the Serenade compares to the SPL Phonitor XE just on amplification alone. Great video by the way, I’ve always enjoyed your videos.
That's a great question. I wish I still had the Phonitor XE here to compare. I think the Phonitor amp is better, but the Serenade DAC might be better.
Hey mate, your sound is so awesome! Do you have any audio processing after that Podmic?
That's so funny! The previous comment on my feed was complaining about it, but I'm with you - I'm really happy with my audio capture and processing now.
To answer your question, I apply some gentle compression (2:1) with a very soft knee and then some multiband compression to tailor the tonality a bit (+3dB below 120Hz, -2.9dB from 308-3176Hz). And I also run a de-esser to take the edge of any sibilance.
Honestly, it sounds pretty great with none of that applied so this is more preferential than necessary.
Thank you, I have 2 Podmics that I use for my podcast and they are such great value for money!@@PassionforSound
I agree. They're crazy good for the cost. What interface do you use them with? My only challenge with them is getting sufficient gain.
Yes, they really need a cloud lifter. I use a rodecaster pro.@@PassionforSound
Great review! thanks!
I have the Arya Stealth with the Schiit Modius DAC and Drop THX AAA 789 amp currently and i definitely find this setup way too bright on the highs... I was looking at replacing the Drop THX AAA 789 for the Xduoo TA-20 plus hybrid tube amp to warm things up but now after seeing this review, should i consider the serenade to give me similar results of taming the highs but keeping more resolution overall?
Thanks.
I think both paths will sound great, but the Serenade will be a nice upgrade of both DAC and amp
Do you think the Serenade is a great combo for the Empyrean 2? Or would you prefer the Aune S9c? Or maybe something else? Looking forward to your answer :)
I haven't tried the S9C, but the Serenade would be a great match!
Would you say that Serenade is a big step up over the Mojo 2 in both DAC and DAC+headphone amp department for driving He1000 stealth?
Good question. I'd have to test this to be certain, but I think the amp stage on the Serenade might pull ahead while the DACs are probably comparable. I'll see if I can find the time to check for you...
@@PassionforSound That would be amazing! Thank you for providing community with amazing in depth reviews. :)
Having now compared both the Mojo 2 and Serenade driving the Arya Stealth (nearest tuning to the HEK Stealth that I have here), I'd say that both are similar in overall performance, however, the tonality of the Serenade brings a better tonal balance to the headphones IMO. The Mojo 2 comes across as maybe having slightly better resolution, but the Serenade has more weight and authority in the sound which I think these brighter HiFiMan headphones benefit from. The Serenade isn't lacking in resolution either, it's just not emphasising the details due to the richer/warmer tuning of the amp and DAC.
I.e. if I were choosing, I'd get the Serenade despite the fact that I LOVE the Mojo 2 as a portable device.
@@PassionforSound Thank you very much for doing the comparison! Really appreciate taking the time! :)
My pleasure 🙂🙂
Thanks for the review! Can these drive the Susvara good? I'm looking to buy these soon but don't have the budget for like another 3k+ for an AMP/DAC, I´ve no need for speaker or anything, just the susvara via USB to my PC.
I don't have a Susvara to test with the Serenade, but the specs of the Serenade would suggest that it has about 2W available at the Susvara's impedance so it should do fine.
Wow this review was posted 5 hours after wavetheory's review for serenade, coincidence?
Review embargo was lifted at midnight I believe
I wish the world was as interesting as conspiracy minded people believe it is
Lol. I was as surprised as you all. No conspiracy here.
Another fine review, Lachlan.
Edward Snowden was a week earlier.
Yep. No conspiracy here. It was a flip of a coin between the Serenade and Prelude and either could have been released sooner still is not for the other gear I had to get to first. 🙂
Interesting. Hifiman is really bringing value for money. does it has enough juice to play hifiman He6SE or susvara?
Yes. It will deliver about 2W into a 60 ohm load so no issues at all.
You’re forgetting that Sus need a lot of current. Can the power supply deliver peak current needed?
Current is a part of the power equation (watts = amp X volts). If the amp has sufficient power and headroom at the headphone's impedance, it has enough current.
In your opinion, would the combo Chord Qutest + Schiit Jotunheim 2 be better than Serenade?
That's a tough one to answer, but I think so.
@@PassionforSound thanks so much sir
Hifiman Serenade JR or Hifiman ef600, could you please give advice?
If the Serenade Jr is what I've reviewed here (I haven't seen one specifically called the junior) then I think the Serenade is the better device.
@@PassionforSound Serenade JR Red - junior version, has Himalaya Le R2R chip, cost 500 usd, much cheaper than black Serenade with Himalaya Pro. Ef600 cost 500 usd too, but black Serenade cost 930 USD, is it worth overpaying?
I can't say because I've not tried the Jr. Sorry
12:26 can i ask what device you're using in order to access the optical input, coax input, and network input on the Serenade and Bifrost? As a newbie, who got into this hobby via iems, I'm only familiar with usb C inputs on dongles (to connect to a phone) 🤔
Sure thing! For the optical, coax, etc. I'm taking those outputs from a Singxer SU-6 digital to digital converter (DDC). This is a great way to give you many outputs from a single USB connection and to also isolate your DACs from PC noise. There are multiple DDCs on the market that all seem to perform quite similarly at their price levels (i.e. similar price = similar performance).
For the network input, that's just a regular ethernet connection from your home internet modem/router setup and then you can access it from software on devices connected to the same network.
Is the any good R2R dac with volume control? I don't want the other features. Want it to feed my Burson 3xp in power amp mode.
Sonnet Morpheus but fairly expensive.
I'm not sure which DACs are using resistor volume controls, but I don't know that it's worth chasing an R2R control when most DACs these days are lossless/bit perfect with their volume controls and therefore could technically be better than R2R ladders because you're not adding additional components in the signal path.
question to somone who knows: Serenade and LAN connection, so can i connect this to PC somehow and there is no issue with latency? or only usb?
You'll need to use USB for a direct connection to PC. The LAN connection is only for streaming from dedicated apps like Roon.
14:13 can i ask how you would rate the usb output of an android phone like samsung s22 ultra? As a newbie, who got into this hobby via iems, I've been using my phone as the music source and connecting it to a dongle. But it seems like when i watch desktop dac reviews, nobody is using a phone
There's nothing at all wrong with using your phone and they can actually be better than a laptop/desktop computer because they produce less noise by being more power efficient (i.e. less stuff going on = less noise produced). It's most likely that reviewers like me are using desktop setups with computers because that's what we have. I've also done things to my desktop to optimise the USB output quality. (I'll explain that in my response to your other question)
I wonder how you can be sure about Serenade internal DAC implementation since there is no any mention about how it works on Serenade manual? Is it NOS or oversampling, who knows?
I believe I speculated in the video, but said "I think", not "I know" as it was only based on how it sounded when compared to the Himalaya DAC in the EF600 which can be switched between OS/NOS.
@@PassionforSound ic
Then would be nice to see your thoughts about the differences between OS/NOS modes in EF600. Or am I miss something and you've already mentioned it in one of your previous videos?)
I covered that off in my dedicated EF600 review: th-cam.com/video/jWpcw9jkWoM/w-d-xo.htmlsi=2u6HX2cmthY6Y6hW
🤜🤛💪
👍🙂
Does this have UPnP?
Yes. It will appear as a renderer in apps like Bubble UPnP (I think - I'll got double check...)
Having some issues getting it back on the network. Might have to do a reboot of the system later and see what's going on. I'll reply once I get it all working again
Ok. Update #3: it's back on the network (after a switch reboot) and it's not showing up in Bubble UPnP, but it is available to Roon. I can't see it in JRiver either so perhaps it's limited to Roon and maybe Apple Airplay (it appeared briefly in Roon as an AirPlay device before reverting to the Roon ready option)
Thanks for the response. Don't think it does have UPnP.
it does have an issue with Ethernet Tidal Connect also, when it works its great but it disappears and need to restart maybe an issue with the IP address or maybe Tidal Connect certification is not complete but Airplay via wifi is perfect. I informed Hifiman they told me they have applied for Tidal certification. Am using it purely as Dac now with Eversolo A6 as streamer. Serenade R2R Dac is good non fatiguing@@PassionforSound Your reviews are great.
Interesting product. I am sure I really care to switch off the network feature. But kind of nice still. I have the Sundaras and those never leave me, but more listening is done on my Focal Elegias these days. I think this is intriguing and lets learn more product, but not stop press, and get it now kind of thing for me. I would probably go with EF600 more if I made a move. From a packaging standpoint that Serenade is a big boy for me. Space is a biggy for me. But hmmm, at my work desk. Could be very tasty. If my work didn't MAC filter everything this could be a contender. Possibilities.
It's definitely a lovely option, but so is the EF600 if you need a smaller footprint