20 Things Dungeon Masters Wish Their Players Did
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 2 ม.ค. 2025
- Many D&D players wonder if their dungeon masters hate them. These are the 20 things every DM wishes their player did!
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0:13 Number 1: *Come to the game prepared*
0:37 Number 2: *Take responsibility for fun*
1:03 Number 3: *Pay attention*
1:26 Number 4: *Stop metagaming*
1:50 Number 5: *Take the GM's side from time to time*
2:47 Number 6: *Don't expect the game master to buy everything*
4:32 Number 7: *If you're not enjoying the game, tell the GM*
5:34 Number 8: *Don't argue with the GM*
6:24 Number 9: *Describe your character actions narratively*
6:51 Number 10: *Take notes*
8:23 Number 11: *Minimize side conversations*
8:40 Number 12: *Be ready when it's your turn in combat*
9:08 Number 13: *Be honest about your PC's limitations*
9:40 Number 14: *Know your own backstory*
10:26 Number 15: *Be invested in everyone's character, not just your own*
11:08 Number 16: *Take the game seriously*
12:11 Number 17: *Help with logistics of the game*
12:39 Number 18: *Show appreciation for the work the GM puts into the game*
12:59 Number 19: *Tell the GM what you like about the game*
13:21 Number 20: *Help the GM with their planning*
1. Bring healthy snacks.
2. Bring healthy Snacks.
3. Bring Healthy snacks.
4. Bring Healthy snacks.
5. Bring healthy snacks.
6. Bring healthy snacks.
7. Bring healthy snacks.
8. Bring healthy snacks.
9. Bring healthy snacks.
10. Bring healthy snacks.
11. Bring healthy snacks.
12. Bring healthy snacks.
13. Bring unhealthy snacks.
14. Bring healthy snacks.
15. Bring healthy snacks.
16. Bring healthy snacks.
17. Bring healthy snacks.
18. Bring healthy snacks.
19. Bring healthy snacks.
20. Bring healthy snacks.
I love to hear how much you like narrative description from your players. Unfortunately, I have never encountered a DM who truly appreciates this. I’m in 3 campaigns right now and I’m pretty much the only player who RPs their character. And people tend to think I’m weird for doing so.
Oof, that sounds rough. I hope you find some people that really enjoy the RP or that these people somehow start realizing that it can be fun
It's a roleplaying game :'( march on friend
Me, an intellectual: I am the DM, and I forgot everyone's character sheets, which I took with me so no players can forget their character sheets.
We all know the financial (& time) burdens fall on the DM. I have had games before where I (the poorest of the group) am DMing, and my players gave me some money to cover game expenses. If you are a player with financial means, I would highly recommend offering something like this. Even a small budget per player goes a long way in helping offset this burden.
That's awesome. I wish my players understood this.
I would add one more thing: "Don't plan anything else for the evening!" -- I hate it, when somebody comes to the table and says, "I have exactly 3 hours. After that I meet with some guys. Is that ok? 3 hours should be enough, right?"
To be honest, 3 hours is perfectly reasonable.
@@jasonlane9576if it’s asked ahead of time and not when they arrive, sure. But we generally only get to meet once a month, if not every other, so we want as much time as we can. So it sucks when one guy is like, “gotta go in two hours”
I don't know man, that's not always super realistic for adults with responsibilities. I'd try to block out more than three hours, but scheduling is hard enough without insisting you only play when everyone can commit to a six hour marathon. The reasonable version is "tell everyone well in advance what your time restrictions are," because what really sucks is when some players blocked out the whole evening and then discover at the table that other people have to bounce early.
We don't get 3 hours XD and 3 hours is fine but I get the sentiment. It's the idea that they aren't there for the DnD you planned but already mentally onto the next event.
My problem with this advice, is I"m just going to tell you I can't make it. So instead of 3 hours, you got 0. And any time I'm 5 min late or have to leave early, I won't go to the game.
I'm ALMOST guilty od 8.
ALMOST BC I'll say "this is what raw says, how are you ruling it? So I know what to expect"
1:03
I had a DM who was guilty of not paying attention. They would often play video games mid session, so we would sometimes have to repeat what we say because the DM wasn't listening to us when we tried to do things like talk to NPCs, take actions, etc. Other times, they would blurt out about their game with no context, which confused us into thinking that NPCs was speaking up to us.
Managing the entire game world already sounds rather challenging, so I can't imagine why a DM would want to distract themselves with an outside activity.
Probably just that unhappy
I would walk from that game
Players should write adventure logs or player diaries for the DM after each session. Not only does that help cement the events of the game into their minds, it gives the DM an invaluable look into what the players find most important / interesting about the game.
Contrast one adventure-log that reads "we stopped in town-X for 3 days to rest up and buy supplies, then we returned to adventure site-Y" to one that details what happened in the town, interactions with town NPCs, etc. The first players clearly sees the "down time" portion of the game to be boring, while the second finds it the exact opposite. So the DM, now knowing this, can work to add "excitement" to the parties down-time to keep the first player engaged while not depriving the second player of an aspect of the game they enjoy.
I think I'm gonna write these down and tell new players and old players that if I am their DM..these are what I expect of my players. These are great rules for table etiquette. Which I don't think a lot of people go over. As a DM/GM I am so thankful for this video. Thank you Luke!
I had a horrible player for a while(even worse that same person talked everyone into letting them DM, equally as horrible in that roll). I kept discreetly dropping every video like this I could find in the discord chat hoping they would, you know, watch....maybe take the hint that these were full of things they were doing and stop. I later had to move onto just pointing at something and screaming "Knock it off!"....still kept going and the group didn't want to get rid of them because they thought there was hope they'd improve. They did not improve. I had basically quit myself. I wrapped up my campaign early and was "working" on nights they DM'd. Then, the clouds parted and the gods threw us a bone. They'd taken a new job and couldn't play on our night anymore. Thus, the problem removed itself and there was peace again. My new campaign starts this week with my Halloween one shot as a lead up, the players are excited to play again, and all is right with the world.
I agree, players should describe how their characters attack or cast a spell.
Unfortunately, I've seen a lot of DM's/GM's use that as an opportunity to go "well, since you're making a called shot, you're going to need to roll a nat 20".
So, instead of a player going "ok, my halfling barbarian runs up to skeleton and with a mighty (pipsqueak) yell slams his hammer in to the undead's kneecap (cause he's so short) *dice roll* does a 16 hit?", you get "my halfling moves to the skeleton and attacks, does a 16 hit?".
It's a minor difference but it changes the tone.
Fair point but I would suggest just dropping the last part of the description. "... slams his hammer [at the undead fiend for 16!]" Now its narrative, confident and doesnt imply a result.
one of my players shared this on our dnd text group. thank you.
I’m totally OK with my players arguing with me. If the player makes a good case, I should agree with them. I only draw the line at arguing with me AFTER I heard their case and ruled on the issue.
100% on the knowing your own background. Man, i loved it when my DM linked the campaign to my background old enemy, not only did she make him the leader of one of the central guilds but also a dragon in disguise. Became a while arc, all from a single line on my backstory.
I had a DM who didn't even know the main details of my background after I sent it to them. I did something in game and they started to say my alignment needed to change, and I was just like, yeah but the person I'm having killed is evil and worshiping some demon/devil thing.
My players use a form-fillable PDF for their character sheets and send me a copy each time they level up. If they forget their sheets (and it has several times happened) I just print a copy for them to use.
Really need to introduce your players to outlook/google drive/drop box so they can save their character sheet and always be able to bring up a copy on their phone or tablet to recopy for the game session.
#14 all day
I've had so many instances where I've worked to include a characters backstory into the current story to make a dramatic reveal relevant to them and they're just like "... huh?" I once revealed a PCs close family member to be the main antagonist and they went "... who's that?"
"Does your GM hate you?"
GM: Uh....yeah...
In regards to number 18. The thank you to the GM. I have a story that I remember. Absolutely finally to this day this was years ago.
I tend to have a very self deprecating sense of humor. And as such, I made a comment about how they were stuck with a schmuck like me as a GM.
One of my players told me “I adore you as a GM”
I think about that moment fondly to this day
No. 2, "Take responsibility for fun." This is something I have said for a long time . Everyone at the table is stewards of one another's fun. If you all act that way, you will have a great table.
Good advice, I'll watch this behind my dm screen after the players are gathered to set the mood 😂
Tip 20 would be nice, especially the players not changing their minds part... Nowadays, after asking the group several times on different occasions what they're planning to do, if the group says they want to do A and I prep for it and when the session starts and they start going to B, I just flat out tell them no or tell them that the session will be full improv from this point on so if it sucks it's on them.
Usually I find this is a case of number 1 as well, I have a few players that literally tell me that the game time is the only time they're committed and they won't do stuff outside this timeframe.
In many cases I've seen D&D players have a mistaken expectation that the DM will automatically update their lore books with notes, similar to how video game lore journal entries are discovered, rather than actively taking notes themselves.
It is a gift to the GM to have the players make errors in memory, thus not linking bits of plot to make the plot twist even more of a surprise.
I have one of the players tell the "story so far" recap at beginning of the game session, and I don't correct them unless is it a vital bit they really should get right. USUALLY, one of the other players will make the correction before I have to.
Arguing with the DM should be like trial lawyers before a judge - BRIEFLY make your point, then if the DM disagrees, drop it.
1:47 That can be a fine line. If you have 2 players search parts of a room and Player B is asked by Player A to double check, I won't qualify that as metagaming.
so you ar eallowng multipkle rolls, the dice will give to them eventually. when player seaqrch a room iisuggest letting them choose a player to roll and giving them advantage. that sall, that it, nothing mor e:D
@badmojo0777 1. This is called the Help action. I would allow them the advantage cause maybe it's a plot hook and I am feeling magnanimous. 2. your spelling/ grammar mistakes gave me a headache. It's 2023, and we have had spell check for 20+ years.
@@dragoninthewest1 apologies on the typing skills, graduated before the internet was a thing 🤓
I was once in a group for a couple of years. I brought two boxes, each of a different dessert snack (ding-dongs, twinkies, etc). I had a good job, brought literally little more to the group being new to 3.5 and having not gamed in over a decade, i figured why not be the snack fairy. Then after a few weeks I got an idea. After about a year, the host said, "Hey you don't have to bring snacks if you don't want to." So I admitted I had been recording their snack consumption. Not just which snack was eaten more, but when. So after a character died, or a winning but stressful encounter, or if they were having a crappy day IRL, and so on. It was a fun exercise that cost me, what, $10 or so a week.
Haha i wanna see the break down of when the snacked the most.
Definitely kinda creepy.
stop making jokes when the DM is trying to set a scene and atmosphere
and wait until the DM has finished describing the area or situation before you jump in with what you are going to do.
:D
The DM doesnt hate you. The deck of many things does.
11:45
-Luke: Would you really call the litch "bone daddy," in character, while he's trying to kill you.
-Chaotic neutral bard, who warships the God of pranks and banter: "If it anoys him, then absolutely!"
...yes, I can see at least two of my players that have characters that would most certainly call a lich Bone Daddy. There's also another one that could be warranted in calling one that because it may actually be her father as he went for smokes and bourbon one day and never came back lol.
For me, it would be not to dodge plot hooks. I had a group for a long time that would ignore or refuse to adventure or abandon plans halfway in due to 'the jig being up' despite them acing rolls with deception and fast talking. Come to find out this was because in their other game, their DM was Japanese gameshow style DM , where it wasn't about overcoming adversity, but punishing bad decisions in over the top ways. I eventually had to end the game since they were basically too afraid to follow plot hooks.
I would agree, as long as the plot hook is reasonable. I once had a DM (who I think was kinda new) who maintained that we were to play good characters (at least not evil characters) and then their plot hook was for us to go kill a good aligned person. (It sounded like the person was good, and we weren't presented with any information that would counter that point). So I do think the DM needs to remain in the limits of the game that has been set up. It might not also be a good idea to make a plot hook that involves going out to sea if your PCs still have things that need to be accomplished on land (like waiting for some fancy armor to be fixed or worse, you are actively in the middle of pursuing another quest) or if one of the PCs have stated their character will not go out to sea.
I think there are times when you have to refuse a plot hook if the DM makes one that your character(s) would reasonable not do.
Love this advice! Super helpful and concise. Thanks!
I have new players and only a couple of sessions in, but asking for a backstory was like pulling teeth man. 3 outta 4 of them have solid backstories now after me "interrogating" them :D
Number 1: Come to the game prepared. Yeah, I kinda did that last time during our game groups session of Vampire the Masquerade. I had written a plan of 4 pages what my character would do in the 1 month time skip with a bit too much detail. I think one page would have been decent enough to wrap it all up.
The worst part was that GM, or story-teller as VtM tend to call it, did not have time to get all that information because I sent it to him 1 day before the game day.
Therefore I would say, come prepared but if they involve other people to take a note on them, remember to prepare well before the game day and not a day before :D
Definitely. I'm currently lucky in I run a game on a day I'm off, but even then if you send information to me that day, I am going to be improving whatever I remember from it. I definitely say the earlier the better.
If the flour that touched the invisible character, became invisible as well, would that not create a visible void in the cloud of flour?
Yes. Also according to RAW, you know where invisible characters are unless they take the hide action, as you can still perceive their sounds. (I can link you to the Podcast where Crawford talks about it if you want) I realize almost no one plays that way, but using flour to accomplish something the rules say you already know isn't exactly trying to break the game.
This became more important in a recent game I played in, in which effectively if you don't know where a character is, any PC or Monster with Greater Invisibility could always attack at range and move, thereby killing everyone without a chance of being hit. (Unless someone has a bow/crossbow and can ready an action to attack)
This, imo, is one of your best videos ever. Great content in an easy to understand and digest format. I watched this with two of my players, one was agreeing and understanding, the other poo-poo'd almost all of it. Needless to say that second player is a "problem" player within our group and I have a feeling they probably won't be part of the group much longer (other players have already had a couple discussion about them and with them with no changes).
As an agreeable person myself, I just have such a hard time understanding problem player mentalities.
@@user-jt1js5mr3f do you mean the mentality of the "problem player" or the people that think others are problems?
@@chaoshead87 the mentality of the problem player. Those I’ve encountered seem so frustrated by the game that they cheat, or argue rules to no end, or want it to be all about them, and I just don’t get it. It just feels like they’d be happier not playing, but they “want” to play but they’re frustrated by playing and thus make games miserable.
Sorry but number 4 : Stop metagaming has a horrible example. While I do agree that some person re-rolling whenever someone else rolls low is bad in terms of mechanics and shouldn't always be allowed. Everyone has had an experience in their life that is similar to the following :
Person A is looking for a specific object.
Person B asks if Person A has looked in a specific place.
Person A confirms that they have looked in said place.
Person B looks in said place and finds specific object.
Or how many times has someone told you a door is locked, only for you to check if the door is indeed actually locked? Or someone fails to open a jar and someone else tries and manages to open it. If someone tells us it's raining, we look to check. If someone tells us a plate or cup is hot, we carefully check to feel how hot. People screw up all the time. We know people screw up all the time, because we ourselves are people and we screw up all the time. That's why we tend to trust our own senses over those of someone else. If someone was looking for something and would roll a 2 in real life, others would probably see that this person wasn't really putting in a lot of effort, just like a 2 on acrobatics would have people see a character falling flat on their face. The numbers may be invisible to the characters, but the resulting actions are not.
This described scenario is exactly why there are (or should be) help/assist mechanics in your TTRPG system. If you're in a room, and someone suspects there's a secret door somewhere, why would only one person be looking anyway? Unless of course the others are busy doing medicine checks, in which case you have a reason to tell them "no". There are multiple better solutions to this scenario. Just have everyone roll for these type of things. Make sure rolling has a proper cost/decision attached to it. Use a fail forward mechanic.
A better example for metagaming would have been : Don't look in the monster manual right after the GM told you the name of the creature you're fighting.
In a West Marches game I play. The DM rewards players with low level magical items for posting adventure summaries. 1 item for every 5 summaries posted. Seems to work well.
I was watching ep. 7 of Thieves Abound. I can't wait to see what happens during the next one lol. Another TPK? Finally doing to main quest goes wrong (again)? I need to do a speedrun to catch up
"Game Master"
Are they the keepers of all of the secrets that exist in the world that the PCs may discover?
Or, are they the master of ceremonies, trying to get all of the PCs onto the dance floor to shake it for all they are worth?
...yeah, it's both!
The GM is the facilitator, making sure that "the things" happen within the parameters of the rules of the game system that is being used - the foundation of how things interact in the world.
The GM is the facilitator, giving the Players opportunities to interact narratively within the game world, with all the objects and with each other - the drama, the conflict, the discovery, the story that plays out of and around the PCs.
The biggest thing I wish players would do is PRIORITIZE THE GAME SCHEDULE. I know we're all busy and we have real life and stuff, but just for once I wish people would cancel the other thing, instead of D&D. It makes scheduling a hell lot easier. My group players D&D every thursday night, that's not a mystery. But we still have people constantly saying "I can't play D&D tonight because I got this X other thing to do" How about instead, you say, "I can't do X with them because I got D&D that day"
As a DM I have to admit that not only do I have a least favorite player, but I actively don't like playing with him. Unfortunately he's sort of at the center of our friend group, so kicking him would likely cause others to splinter off. It also wouldn't be fair to the other players who maybe don't have an issue with him.
Talk to them or as a group! Use "I feel" and be direct as to why they are ruining your enjoyment. Use compliment sandwiches if they tend to get defensive. Its scary but it helps even if it ends badly (The next campaign will be better cause everyone will be having fun).
With the rise of livestreamed campaigns and an increasing number of players, the number of Dungeon Masters (DMs) willing to run games for the average player base has significantly decreased. Many players now do not invest the same level of effort as the dungeon master or the players they watch in popular shows. Instead, they often expect the DM to handle everything and neglect roleplaying. They seek a specific style of gameplay, often at the expense of other styles, and are less flexible in their preferences.
Well, I'm all over 10 at least. I've even had the DM ask for my notes from a couple of sessions. I also keep a spreadsheet with tabs for PCs, NPC, items, locations and other noteworthy things. It's quicker to find specific information like this than going through several pages of notes. It's also available for the other players to see. Everything is digital, but the spreadsheet is still way easier.
I think I'll thank our DM next time we play. Don't know how to make it not sound awkward. At least it's through Discord and I don't have to attempt eye contact.
Remembering names is super difficult...
So I put all the people in my backstories in the Bonds section of my character sheet, so they're all right in front of me on page 1.
I can even imagine that a DM who pronounces the name differently than what you had in your head might cause problems. Especially months into the campaign.
And here I was thinking this was going to be a list of behaviors DMS have when they hate one of either character or actual player. Glad to see not all our secrets are being revealed here. But then if a DM does hate a player / character, I don't think it would be that hard to figure out.
You made some good points, BUT MANY OTHERS I DISAGREE WITH!
Everyone has a different opinion about what counts as "Metagaming"!
Yes you should provide most of your own stuff, BUT (unless you specifically want to play a certain module) it isn't your responsibility to buy a module/book for the DM.
Yes you shouldn't be constantly argumentative, HOWEVER if the DM is being a bad DM/j*rk then you have to argue against that!
EVERYONE HAS A DIFFERENT OPINION ABOUT WHAT'S FUN & GOOD PACING!!!
Yes you want to somewhat be invested in your Party/Other Players, BUT at the same time it doesn't mean you do everything in game with them. For example; if you are a certain alignment but a different party member is a different alignment, then you don't have to help them do something that is opposed to your alignment.
Number 21 roll attack rolls and damage together. It makes combat faster.
But make sure you give each attack and damage roll individually when the GM calls for it you’re attacking a caster maintaining concentration
I've had players lose/forget their character sheet. If they aren't spell caster it's not that hard. You can figure out expected to hit, damage and hit point in a couple of minutes. Then spend a minute noting the their favorite feats and class abilities.
1:37 If my friend is looking for something and I notice them not finding it, I will help them. I don't see how this becomes "meta"gaming when it's literally something we do IRL all the time.
But the point is that the character doesn’t know their friend didn’t find it. They only see the person searching for something and coming back with the certainty that they didn’t find anything odd or suspicious.
At best, you could declare beforehand that your character wants to help look for it, which would translate into a sort of advantage or bonus on the roll. But coming after seeing a low roll, and declare “I want to help him search better” crosses into metagaming.
@@FabienMariauxdeSerres Sure, if I did it just because of a low roll. But there can be IC reasons to double-check. Time to kill, unreliable character, troupe are particularly desperate, retracing their steps, etc... I'm against metagaming, but this was just a poorly chosen example.
@@FabienMariauxdeSerres Important concept here. You can not generally prove universal negatives. So, if you are looking for traps and the rogue doesn't find any that is not proof that there are no traps. You can only prove traps exist if you find one. So in all circumstances, if you are looking for traps, you would in fact help the rogue see if he missed something, if he didn't find any, because there could still be traps.
There are very few situations where every PC shouldn't be looking for traps. They all should be. That tends to make tramps less fun because if 6+ people are checking for them, one of them is going to probably find them due to the nature of the game, which is why I prefer the idea of having one character roll with advantage from the help of everyone else, so that they are participating, but only two rolls are made.
1 big one missing from the list is the player who acts.
Too often, players get in a circle of analysis paralysis with each one saying "...And we can do this" "...and we can do this". "....OR better yet I'll do this..." "Ohhh, yah, and even better, we can do this..."
Instead DMs love that one player that hears the great suggestion off the rip and goes
"That's a great idea - as the elf suggests, I begin climbing the wall assuring that I have the rope at my belt to lower to the others."
or
"Great. Just as the cleric suggested, I bring out my lightstone, and head around to the back of the building".
Short discussion - into the action. We love that player that is Mr. Agreeable and go-getter.
I pressed the like and the likes increased from 1k to 1,1k, very satisfying. Also thank you for this video❤️
The traps thing seems like a pretty borderline case of metagaming. If the DM rolled the player's perception check behind the screen, so they don't know whether they failed, it seems likely the others would still want to do a check just to be safe. If you were really in a booby-trapped dungeon, wouldn't everyone be looking out for traps? Also the tacit premise is that a character who fails a perception check would have no inkling that they might have failed, but often we do. Sometimes "I don't see my friend in this crowd" means I'm pretty sure he's not there, and sometimes it means it's hard to tell and I know it's hard to tell.
That's called using judgment on a case by case basis. If scanning a crowd, I use the number rolled not just to see if they find the person, but also how much time is spent doing so. If they want to roll again, there's an understanding that it could be sacrificing more time rather than a direct choice. It works pretty well.
Technically everyone should role. Granted the way this is handled in 5e I believe by default is that you provide one PC help, granting them advantage to roll, rather than everyone rolling individually. You should technically mention that you are going to offer help before they roll. But I believe this idea is new to 5e, (and I honestly don't remember if it is an optional rule or default rule) so the DM should probably remind players that if they are going to be helping search for traps, they need to mention that ahead of time.
Also of note, DMs should also remember to pay attention to passive perception. I think a lot of DMs ignore passive perception when it comes to traps so they can trick a player into springing the trap, when, even if a rogue doesn't say they are looking for traps or roll a 2, their passive perception likely should have let them find the trap in the first place.
@bradleyhurley6755 I mean if the rogue rolls a 2 they roll a 2. Their passive perception shouldn't matter anymore and I don't think they should be given a freebie after failing just because they happen to have a high passive. I do agree about using passive instead of hitting them with a gotcha just because they aren't walking through the dungeon saying "I check for traps" every 2 minutes
I try to use low rolls as time sucks instead of fails to avoid this issue. I use 1 min + the difference of the DC as the penalty and buff something. I use a lot of time related "traps" to make it feel more tense; like the doors will seal in an hour, patrols, chases, etc. I line up dice to that I know what happens when they run out but they dont; you'll see them really start weighing risk v. reward after they see them get lower and lower.
@2g33ksgamingttv3 according to the rules it does. If a rogue's passive perception reaches the DC they technically aren't suppose to roll. So it is the roll that shouldn't count according to the rules. This is true of any character whether they say they are looking for traps or not. If you had a Ranger or something with a passive perception of 20, then that PC should still know there was a trap unless the DC on the trap was higher than 20. Same for the rogue.
I could see an argument if the second PC isn't near the rogue, but if they are then they should be able to warn the rogue even if they rolled a 2.
Thanks Luke!
If they don't call him Bone Daddy to his face, they are cowards.
Character sheet...
I have always required a copy, so I have their sheet if they don't.
Even back in the 1970s, I played where there was access to a copier.
Fate Core has a motto/slogan/philosophy for Characters. They should be: "proactive, capable people leading dramatic lives"
It is so important for Players to have their Characters interact with each other, as that is fuel for the drama just as much as a BBEG or some NPC's tragic quest.
"Playing together" but everyone is practically soloing when it is their turn to be in the spotlight...that isn't "playing together", it is more like "playing at the same time".
I'm the only one, who bothers with backstories in our group, and then some complaint when the DM gives me extra hook/content...
If you wish to derail and destroy your campaign, introduce the Deck of Many Things.
my first long campaign, nr 14 happend to my ranger who had an intressting backstory I thought.. so I dropped hints using the names from it.. nothing.. The rest of the group engaged with the plot and when they finally finished the quest, the group were awarded a house in the little village. The village the PCs grandparents came from, and I described a photo of said grandparents with a little girl. and on the back was the name of the PCs mother. and the player, bless his heart. asked who that was....
The metagame one I think can be difficult. For example, in real life, if we were searching for traps, I would expect every person to in the group to be searching for traps not just the "rogue"/expert. So in a lot ways it is more metagaming that everyone doesn't roll for traps, than it is for a player to roll if the first player doesn't find any. (As that is what I would expect to happen if it was real). The other issue is whether or not someone's passive perception should have picked up on the trap anyway. I think in rule terms though, the original player who rolled should have gotten advantage for having help looking for traps, as I believe the rules generally solve the problem with everyone rolling by allowing one player to roll twice.
In our games, any player that requests a skill check(or prompts one from the DM) can roll as normal. A player can only make a 'second opinion' roll if they are proficient in the skill in question.
I happen to like the outcome of this system on paper and in practice. It makes sense narratively. Two people who are proficient in Arcana will not always know the same thing(or be equally versed). People are trained to notice different things, investigate different ways, etc. However, it is reasonable to conclude(at least mechanically speaking) that someone who is not proficient would not have more to offer to someone who is.
Mechanically, it helps scratch that metagame itch while also shutting down attempts for the whole party to roll, just on the odds alone. Lastly, it allows players to feel that their proficiency still matters, even if someone else showed up with a higher bonus.
Completely agree, the video is wrong on that.
When I play a spellcaster I make paper copy of my spells and have a litteral spell book with me.
Why did you change the thumbnail? I was totally going to send it to my group and that be the first thing they see!
Just a "thanks for dm'ing last night" the morning after in the group chat would go a long way to making it all feel like the effort is worth while...
This should be mandatory viewing by anyone who wishes to play the game BEFORE they play the game.
So,
How do you guys deal with players all wanting to make the same checks?
If its happening together, like 2 players checking for a trap, i'll let one player do it at advantage if the other player is proficient and helping, but how do you guys deal with
P1: I check for trap - rolls bad
DM: you find no trap
P2: I want to check too, to be safe
ad infinitum
I've got that one player that always gets himself into a terrible spot when fighting and therfor gets attacked first / most and gets surrounded and eventually downed. He gets crazy mad like everytime that happens. I tried to explain him hat I can't just not attack him, when the enemy is standing right next to him and only him. It simply wouldn't make any sense. But he seems to have no understanding for that (And he used to dm himself..!). I am out of ideas how to handle it.
Last time he went "yeah i consciously positioned myself here so the opponent can't attack me after his 30 ft movement. I told him that 1. thats pure metagaming and 2. the monster has 10 ft. range and was still able to attack him, as it did not need to be within 5ft. He almost left the table telling me I would have had to tell them about the monsters attacking range. I almost feel like in the future i just print him a statblock of each monster so he can metagame the shit out of it without getting mad at me for roleplaying the opponents. But thats obviously no solution.
Kicking him from the table is no option as he's a good friend of everyone and he basicly started the group (And ofc i do not want to kick him). Should I just go easy on him / ignore him in combat from now on to attack the others, even if it doesn't make sense roleplaywise?
Nah bud kick him. I've perma banned my own brother from my games. I warned him I would and he kept obviously reading the module before hand. I won't dm for him ever again and fair warning of this consequence was given. You can't play with people acting so disruptively.
i would ask the rest of the group on their opinion, and if none is helpful i would go easy on him 2-3 times ignorming him 100% of the time but also ignoring him for real, like he hits and kills the monster, the monster simply dies, it says nothing there is no hype, i would only hype and RP with those who hype and RP but for him, ye buddy you are playing a differnt games and you are winning good job, if he didn't like that i would again tell him the reason behind it is how he plays, and if the party doesn't like that then i will get back to simply target his bad position (that is my own opinion)
A good friend doesn't make for a good player, which is sometimes a hard truth.
Is he going in trying to be the hero?
If possible, maybe adjust the dispersal of enemies when seeing where he is to spread things out?
But if this guy is getting into situations like that during a fight, that's all on him.
I wouldn't cater to him, he seems toxic
Assuming a creature has a 30' move as that is common and positioning yourself 35 feet away is not meta gaming. Knowing the creature has reach when you never encountered it or have any knowledge of it and positioning yourself 45' away however would be.
Maybe try to make the monsters/opponents more spread out. Also keep in mind that not everyone is going to go directly to the person in front. The higher intelligent of the foes, the more likely they are to position themselves to get to the weaker member or the cleric/spell caster. Unintelligent monsters will go right after him, but anything with intelligence might have a couple people on him, but the rest are probably going to the more detrimental character.
I do feel like when it comes to reach, the PC probably should be able to recognize that the creature could hit them. Like, it's hard to argue that you look at the monster with tentacles and don't realize the tentacles can reach 10ft. to you or that the Monster is holding a pole that reaches 10 ft. That is something that he is probably right that his character should have known that. (Unless of course there is a specific reason we would not, such as the weapon suddenly grows or something).
I wonder how much of your audience are players vs DMs. I don’t think there’s a way I can share this with my players without it coming across as a passive aggressive attack…
You throw flower on the floor to see the footprints of the invisible creature....
Great video. Concerning no 3: quite some neurodivergent people actually perform better when they do something else when paying attention to the game. But that is more a session 0 thing to discuss with the DM.
Having a fidget toy is one thing, having a whole other thing to pay attention to and be distracted by is very different. Depends on the situation though I guess. In person you definitely shouldn't be on your phone or whatever.
The something else can be taking detailed notes or something else that keeps focus on the game. At our weekly game, we have people who do other things while gaming. (Online game, so the things people do range from crafting to folding laundry to, yes, playing another game.) I used to be one of those people, and yes, this did help keep my mind from wandering. A few months ago I started taking detailed notes, and it really helps keep my mind from wandering AND keep my mind solidly on the game.
@@dirtywhitellama I disagree. I can be on my phone and paying 100% attention to you. I can also be bored and just sit there and daydreaming and have no clue what you said.
In fairness in a real game I'm probably taking notes. But if you are focusing on another player and My PC isn't there, I'm 100% not going to be paying attention and will definitely be doing something on my phone to kill the time until you are done with that player. I also likely won't be taking notes during that time until the player returns and mentions what happened to them.
Let me know what your intentions are. This will be very helpful with figuring out exactly how to make things work.
Truthfully my players are pretty awesome. The best I've had. Though the distractions get away from us from time to time. I didn't always have these players though. I've had others and um . . .ya. needed this video then. . .
I once had to remove a player for power gaming. They would be rolling dice non stop even not on their turn and then cherry pick their best rolls. I gave them a talk the first time and a constructive way of not doing so and they continued after the talk leading to their dismissal.
That just sounds like straight up cheating...
@@user-jt1js5mr3fyeah, that’s not powergaming. It’s just plain old cheating.
@@FabienMariauxdeSerres for real 😆 I swear, I don’t understand some “players”
I guess the door thing literally is about how you do it at your table. I prefer it being treated as "you can't be sure"; if you prefer it being treated like a character is confidently incorrect, it's also OK. But just saying that one way is inherently wrong for every table goes a little too far.
why would a second character not show up and help someone look for a secret door if some area looks suspicious, but the first character didn't find one? metagaming would be: "ah, this looks like a troll. my character has never seen or heard about one, but i know to use fire on it".
Because in practice the only time a second character helps look for a secret door is when the first character rolls low on the d20. When the first character rules high no one ever helps look for a door.
12:55 thanld yow
My dungeon master makes it no secret that they hate me...
Number 1: Come to the game prepared
Just yes
Number 2: Take responsibility for fun
There is some truth to this and it's certainly a back and forth and ideally both players and GMs feed into each other. However, I have been in games where the GM doesn't really give anything for people to work with or did things that the players have made clear they aren't interested in. Shoot I have seen GMs make scenarios where the abilities of some characters have no relevance and have nothing to contribute and those players did not have fun those sessions.
Number 3: Pay attention
No one can pay attention 100% of the time but yes. Also don't particularly have an issue in general with people using electronics just because some people are using them to play their characters and they don't distract everyone equally. Not to mention some people sort of mentally figit and playing a low effort game or side scrolling here and there may help with that. I don't try to judge too harshly unless it's truly disruptive.
Number 4: Stop metagaming
I understand this but not all metagaming is bad metagaming and quite frankly avoiding any is impossible. Not to mention I don't think people realize how many things fall within the realm of metagaming that is considered normal.
Number 5: Take the GM's side from time to time
Depends on the context but certainly helpful especially if it keeps things moving.
Number 6: Don't expect the game master to buy everything
That just never happens.
Number 7: If you're not enjoying the game, tell the GM
True enough. That said there are some with egos that won't take criticism well.
Number 8: Don't argue with the GM
Depends on why they are arguing. I seen GMs make bad calls or uninformed ones or at times an issue at hand if not handled correctly or expected could have a dangerous trickle effect can also leave a bad taste at the table. One example is in a Starfinder Society game I had a GM tell me I could not do something only for me to point out actually the way my character was built I could in fact do that thing. Also remember when a table practically rebelled when the GM said that because the whole party got hit by a fireball anything non magical is now burned away and gone which included spear shafts, the bowstring on a magic bow, leather and cloth armors and so forth. That did not exactly go over well and the GM disgruntledly backpedaled thinking they did nothing wrong which contributed to the sour tone the game had the rest of the night.
Number 9: Describe your character actions narratively
Depends on the table and the mood. Some people are into that and some are not and there is objectively nothing wrong with either and just comes down to style.
Number 10: Take notes
Not necessary but certainly can be helpful.
Number 11: Minimize side conversations
Unavoidable but sure within reason. Some groups or sessions are certainly more casual than others though.
Number 12: Be ready when it's your turn in combat
In general yes. That said sometimes something can happen leading up to your turn that puts throws what you intended out the window but I find that in general people understand that.
Number 13: Be honest about your PC's limitations
No argument there.
Number 14: Know your own backstory
To a reasonable extent sure. Sometimes though can be difficult to remember some details off the top of your head especially if they have not come up in a while.
Number 15: Be invested in everyone's character, not just your own
As much as one can sure.
Number 16: Take the game seriously
Within reason. Each table is different but at the very least certainly respect everyone's time.
Number 17: Help with logistics of the game
When possible or reasonable sure.
Number 18: Show appreciation for the work the GM puts into the game
Certainly. Especially when things are going well.
Number 19: Tell the GM what you like about the game
Every GM likes this.
Number 20: Help the GM with their planning
If it can be done sure.
Not one of the numbers but one point I will push back on somewhat is not ruining immersion. For me at least at the end of the day it's a game and don't be surprised that some people treat it as such and honestly there is nothing wrong with that though that does not necessarily mesh with everyone's playstyles and for that matter same does with hardcore roleplaying. Admittedly part of my reaction to this is some of the most toxic behavior I have encountered is people taking immersion too seriously. Also another things is I can understand wanting to call on timid players to get them to participate but that can also backfire since it can make them more uncomfortable or have nothing to say. Not to mention seen more then a few deer in the headlight reactions when it was done out of the blue. At the very least depends on the person and some people just need time to get comfortable with the group.
Also don't send 100s of messages to the dm because you constantly want to find loopholes with lesser known races, asking for rules that you can easily read online or asking th dm to change rules just because you want to be stronger (the dm is here to run the game, not do QA). It's good to have a few questions, but keep most of them for the sessions if you can't find an answer and be reasonable with your questions.
Yeah, totally. Wow
Context for those wondering: I used to run dnd oneshots with friends. That was the attitude of 1 player.
Who needs loopholes when you have Bugbears and Rogue - Assassin - Way to turn invisible. Though I would caution about reading rules online instead of asking the DM. Sometimes places use optional rules, and sometimes the DM doesn't agree with the "intent" of the rules. But you definitely don't need to message a DM to get loopholes. I mean I have to find loopholes to make my character not do 100 damage a round at level 5.
you nailed it
As GM, I keep character sheets. I can run a game without the player. The players can run a game without me.
For number 4 there is nothing wrong with a back up check. I'll give a real world example. You misplace your car keys and search the kitchen for them and swear they are not there. Your wife then searches the kitchen and finds them right away. Backing up searches only makes sense in game as it does IRL.
I agree with you. In almost every case it makes sense. There are some exceptions, but for the most part it definitely makes sense.
We have had players show up wt noting, expecting players to just give them stuff....
Normally out of six players only 4 will have books.
While "Pay Attention" makes sense, remember neurodivergence. For some of my friends with ADHD, the phone paradoxically lets them pay MORE attention to the game, and not having it would result in less attention being paid as they're wandering off in their own mind.
Hello, my players. I’m here, too
Though as far as backstories, I'm more of an old-style GM and tell players to keep the backstories short and sweet. As your past is mostly meaningless and the game should be about the stories we create, not the forced story that you created alone. Your past should solely define your personality and why you went off to adventure but beyond that it's just for flavor. You'll also learn more about your past the more you learn about your PC while playing them.
No.9
No.9
No.9
No.9
No.9
Yes
too many of the new generation of players still thing an RPG is an MMO, player vs the DM, instead of what it should be, MUTUAL STORY TELLING.
If you have a problem with another player tell the DM.
I cannot read your mind.
I will deal with it.
I am fairly open about hating my players, so I dont think they will click this
21 help the GM cleanup after the game.
Not to dis the sponsor, but as a long time player I hate the DOMT and would never want to encourage its use. On the other hand, buying tools for GMs is always a good thing.
#9 Ya know, Players narrating how their Character swings their sword, or goes about disarming a trap, or other such thing is child's play. Want real Player narration? Let them help shape the scene and the story through their narration. It doesn't just have to be the DM making it all up on some grand story that they've come up with during prep.
Please give us an example.
@@archersfriend5900 Pick up a copy of Fiasco and play it. It is a GM'less narrative improv RPG. That's like a crash course, of sorts.
There's other narrative games out there as well that give Players more say in how the story pans out.
The concept behind the scenes is "emergent gameplay" - what the characters are doing will shape events to come, but of course there's stuff on the periphery that may or may not influence events as well.
Can consider Apocalypse World (and variants under the Powered by the Apocalypse engine), or even Edge Genesys/Star Wars RPGs which both use the dice to aid in the narration. In those, the Players immediately see success/fail and degrees of such on the dice rolls, and can play off of those to define the narrative.
Besides this, one can look into Fate Core, which is also a narrative focused game, which has the gimmick of a meta economy between the GM and the Players that encourages one to lean into their character concept, which then helps the Players in driving the narrative.
@@archersfriend5900 Just to add: its about where the Players' narrative is. Front load (proactive) it for these effects I'm describing. Back load (reactive) it for more traditional feel with the GM being the main narrator.
@@orokusaki1243 The positive energy is circular. Get on, it comes back like Carousel, feel the flow.
Players should buy their own Player's Handbook, but no, they are not obligated to buy the DM's miniatures. Now, if the player gets to keep the monster mini, fine, but if the player never wanted it he is not responsible for getting it just because the DM used it in a game. Miniatures are fun to use but not a requirement for the game. Miniatures may be the DM's hobby, but it's not the player's. As for a module, that is the DM's sole responsibility. Unless the player will run the game himself as a DM with another group and it remains forever his book, but how is the DM to run the game without the module? The DM can borrow the book, but it's the player's book. No, I'm not buying the DM pizza either. Everyone pays for their own food. If a player wants to treat everyone, hey great thanks, but there's no obligation nor expectation it's to be done every time. Everyone bringing snacks for everyone to share is fine.
I can see you're not a GM.
@@xczechr I am. Currently running two games.
As a GM, I can definitely say yes even without watching the video.
Watching the video, it's great and I absolutely agree.
I'll add one thing, if your GM is a forever GM: Try the mantle from time to time to let him play!
Also, if there's something you want to try, that's the perfect opportunity!
Like, I was a bit frustrated with how X or Y was executed in a 5E game GMed by a friend. After giving feedback and we weren't sure how it could be handled in the future, I found ideas and subsystems for PF2E that I liked and could be used to address it, and I decided to run a "Two-shot" to test those things.
Only did the first session for now, and it already gave us quite interesting ideas for the future, both for his and my games.
I would add: nerovate what you do, but not make it very long.
One of my players buys wotc books I buy 3rd party books.
I love my players,but this ONE player literally starts benching out of boredom when anything that’s not combat is happening 💀 and I’ve known this guy for years,I don’t know why suddenly he has ADHD to the max😂