It would be interesting to have a side by side demonstration at the range. Set some to zero and set some off center. What would the groups look like. This may explain the occasional flier. Thanks for the videos.
Remember, runout is half of what you are reading on the indicator. Because runout is how much out of alignment. But you are reading plus on one side and minus on the other. So less the 0.0005 pretty damn impressive.
I just bought one and after opening the box, I would think that there would be instructions with this tool, none. So I will email or go online and see if I can get a copy of instructions on how to use Hornady Concentricity Tool. Thank you for the video a great!
Thanks, just bought one and this was very helpful. I'm noticing that there is a scratch ring on the bullet from the spindle. Do you get this, or does it go away once it wears in?
I’m just buying press your videos helped me purchase everything I bought keePt me from getting wrong dies and you explain so well learning lot watching you will receive equipment in around ten days question if I want to produce a match grade bullet like the federal PREMIUM 308 win 168 grain Sierra matchking bthp where or if any reloading manual would I buy or find everything about how to reproduce it ?
Hornady Loader, I was going to ask if you had a video on this and look what I found...awesome video as they always are. I really like this tool and want to get one. I'll have to watch it a few more times when I do buy so I can make sure I know which side of the bullet to push against...I'm trying to understand that aspect, I'll get it. Does the bullet spindle easily accept tipped bullets like the Nosler Accubond? I have to assume that the spindle will allow the insertion of the polymer tip without distorting, bending or otherwise compromising the tip?
+Lance Schul Hi Lance, yes, it will handle ballistic tipped bullets with no problem. It comes with 3 spindles so you can select one that contacts the copper part of the bullet rather than the polymer tip to avoid any damage. Although the pressure the spindle puts on the bullet is minimal and shouldn't be a problem either way. Thanks for watching!
two things I've noticed with this tool: 1. Directions say to grab the rubber knob always when turning the cartridge for accuracy (2 stationary points). However, I've found great variances in the readings of the dial by how much pressure I apply with my hand to the rubber knob. (any advise other than developing a consistent hand technique)? 2. I noticed that the adjustment screw leaves a small "swirl" like mark on the bullet. Any concerns that the adjustment screw could deform the bullet (small dents perhaps or warp-age, loss in projectile concentricity)? Also: -have you had any issues with the rubber tip of the adjustment screw longevity?
+Dan Steven Hi Dan, very good questions. 1) You only need to hold the rubber knob if the right-hand spindle rotates when you rotate the bullet. I try to avoid it unless it turns when I turn the bullet. If you adjust the tension on the right-hand spindle properly, it shouldn't turn. If it is turning, try adjusting it so there's less tension. Otherwise, yes, you do have to be careful not to skew the results when holding it. You also have to have a light hand to avoid skewing the results when turning the bullet. It takes a little practice to get the right "feel" to turning it. 2) I tend to avoid using the adjustment screw mostly because unless you use a roll crimp on the case/bullet, it tends to change the neck tension because it's twisting the bullet in the neck of the case and that will cause the neck to deform slightly. In extreme cases, it will cause the neck to lose tension altogether and the bullet will slip back into the case. When I do use the adjustment screw, I try to only turn it so that the dial goes up around 0.015" to 0.020". Any more than that and you might get some indentations on the bullet and cause the neck to deform too much. I've never noticed any marks on the bullet though. In any case, it's best to use the gauge as a measurement device only and if you are having concentricity issues, you might want to look at your seating die adjustment and how well the die lines up the bullet just before it gets seated. A higher quality die with a well fitting alignment sleeve might be necessary to reduce run-out during the seating stage of the process. 3) I've wondered about the life span of the pad on the adjustment screw myself. I've been using it for quite a while now and haven't noticed any degradation yet, but I suspect it has to happen eventually. I hope this helps. Thanks for watching and for the great questions!
I have heard it stated that using this tool introduces varying neck tension and/or "bends" the case. As the tool is working off of the case rim and the rim has no bearing on how the shell rests in the chamber, is measuring this way effective?
hello, after I saw your video I bought one to complete the RCBS case master. Like you use only Hornady tools what is the product from them I can use to check concentricity of empty cases?
Hornady Reloader, what can you do with your bullet seating die to get the correct concentricity? Do you have to run your reloads through your concentricity gauge and correct them? Thanks for your help and enjoy your videos.
+robert austin It depends a lot on the quality of the die. I also only use dies that have an alignment sleeve that gets everything lined up properly as the bullet is seated. Having a seating stem that is shaped properly for the type of bullet being used (round nose, flat point, etc) also helps a lot. Using the flat seating stem with a round nose bullet or the concave stem with a flat point bullet can throw things off a bit. Some companies, like Hornady, have seating stems you can get that are designed to fit a specific bullet so that helps quite a bit. Regardless of how well my dies perform, I usually check a random group of bullets from a batch just to make sure.
The bullet/neck spindle casting bore is off from the spindle shank diameter. The bullet spindle is fine if you set the right tension between the spindles, The neck spindle, for me, needs a custom pilot to give good readings. I will see if I need a custom spindle made to prevent any movement.
the neck spindle has too much clearance in the frame bore. I have a friend making me a new spindle and pilot. The bore in the spindle for the pilot isn't center either. I feel it's best to have this unit as tight as possible to eliminate errors and not blame sizing and bullet seating.
+Dan Steven The rim shouldn't be an issue. You could cut the case mouth at a 45 degree angle and the results would still be accurate. What is important is that the centerline of the neck is the same as the centerline of the body at the head of the case. What this tool measures is whether the centerline of the bullet itself is on that same centerline. Since this operation is done on a finished cartridge, the case has been through a sizing die which would correct any minor differences in the centerline. A more pronounced difference would result in a bent case or at the very least a dented side which would be filtered out during case inspections. Excellent question though, it's not readily apparent what is actually being measured. Thanks for watching!
+HornadyLoader I suppose my concern came from my impression that even a FL re-sizer doesn't quite true up the case past the top of the case head (where the head and body meet - you can always see the line on the case after re-sizing). However, after I read your reply, i measured my case rims and saw that I never really saw more than an .0005 run-out on the case rims (even on LC mil brass). All that aside, after watching your video, I purchased one and have had no complaints. Thanks for all the great responses!!!
I just bought this gauge. I trued 20 rounds and I my goal was to true each cartridge to < one thousandth. I checked each cartridge again and they were all within this tolerance. Maybe I got lucky.....
I've done some research on this gauge and I do not believe this gauge can work properly but maybe I am wrong. I do not take any credit for this information as I discovered this from another website, and will try to explain the problem here. Now this gauge will self center the cartridge from the bullet tip to the center of the flash hole. But if the bullet has runout, the self centering axial line will NOT coincide with the true axial line running through the center of the flash hole and the cartridge body/neck.
I don't see the benefit in this tool because it is capturing the rim or head of the cartridge. Meaningful concentricity measurement must be taken with regard to the fireformed or resized case body. Not only is everything rear of the webb irrelevant but, also unreliable as a point to assume concentricity. Not only that but, a crooked bullet inside the neck is not bullet concentricity. That is just a shit bullet seating job. If you have bullet eccentricity, the bullet has a different centre to that of the case body & shoulder but, could be as straight as a pin with regard to the neck. Furthermore, you do not simply straighten a crooked bullet & call it good. You start looking for why & how the bullet was seated crookedly & correct the problem.
This tool is number one bull shit. When you try to tweak the neck just bc you do this does mean that it’s going to shoot straight if anything was going to be done would be to f/l size and clean up the outside if the necks and clean up flash hole uniform primer pockets that’s it. If you sizing die is set right you should have at least 1-2 thousand run out
je pensai que hornady ete une marque fiable etant moi meme utilisateur de leur produits mais qu il soit IMPOSSIBLE d acheter une vis ( n°10 ) de cet outil c est pitoyable !!!!!!
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EXTREMELY HELPFUL, Thank you so much for answering all the questions I had with just watching this video
It would be interesting to have a side by side demonstration at the range. Set some to zero and set some off center. What would the groups look like. This may explain the occasional flier. Thanks for the videos.
Love your vids! They have very good detail and instruction on how to perform the various tasks. You have become my #1 go-to reloading resource.
Thanks, using mine later this week and be watching you again for help.
Best video on this tool I've seen, thanks
very helpful, much more so than the Hornady printed instructions.
HornadyLoader has not uploaded a video in 3 years, hope he's ok. I enjoy his hard work and learn from it.
Remember, runout is half of what you are reading on the indicator. Because runout is how much out of alignment. But you are reading plus on one side and minus on the other. So less the 0.0005 pretty damn impressive.
I just bought one and after opening the box, I would think that there would be instructions with this tool, none. So I will email or go online and see if I can get a copy of instructions on how to use Hornady Concentricity Tool. Thank you for the video a great!
Спасибо за видео!!! Приобрёл данный прибор! Не знаю английского языка, но из видео все технически понятно как делать!!!
Top notch explanation as always.
Great video I will have to save up ad buy one thanks for the video.
Well instructed video. Any accuracy tests of bullets above and below accepted specs?
Very helpful, thanks!
Thanks, just bought one and this was very helpful.
I'm noticing that there is a scratch ring on the bullet from the spindle. Do you get this, or does it go away once it wears in?
very interesting video with clear comments. I subscribe. thanks
Excellent review
Best video on this I’ve seen! I was working the deck tension on one bullet and the neck became so loose the bullet fell out. Had that happened to you?
Great demo
Great instruction! Thanks
+Eddie Stivaoson Thanks Eddie!
I’m just buying press your videos helped me purchase everything I bought keePt me from getting wrong dies and you explain so well learning lot watching you will receive equipment in around ten days question if I want to produce a match grade bullet like the federal PREMIUM 308 win 168 grain Sierra matchking bthp where or if any reloading manual would I buy or find everything about how to reproduce it ?
Are you performing this prior to crimping or after or are you crimping your loads and have you found that COAL has changed due to the spring collet?
Hornady Loader, I was going to ask if you had a video on this and look what I found...awesome video as they always are. I really like this tool and want to get one. I'll have to watch it a few more times when I do buy so I can make sure I know which side of the bullet to push against...I'm trying to understand that aspect, I'll get it. Does the bullet spindle easily accept tipped bullets like the Nosler Accubond? I have to assume that the spindle will allow the insertion of the polymer tip without distorting, bending or otherwise compromising the tip?
+Lance Schul Hi Lance, yes, it will handle ballistic tipped bullets with no problem. It comes with 3 spindles so you can select one that contacts the copper part of the bullet rather than the polymer tip to avoid any damage. Although the pressure the spindle puts on the bullet is minimal and shouldn't be a problem either way. Thanks for watching!
great video
I have followed your set up and i am amazed my ammunition has only 2 thou run out
two things I've noticed with this tool:
1. Directions say to grab the rubber knob always when turning the cartridge for accuracy (2 stationary points). However, I've found great variances in the readings of the dial by how much pressure I apply with my hand to the rubber knob. (any advise other than developing a consistent hand technique)?
2. I noticed that the adjustment screw leaves a small "swirl" like mark on the bullet. Any concerns that the adjustment screw could deform the bullet (small dents perhaps or warp-age, loss in projectile concentricity)?
Also:
-have you had any issues with the rubber tip of the adjustment screw longevity?
+Dan Steven Hi Dan, very good questions. 1) You only need to hold the rubber knob if the right-hand spindle rotates when you rotate the bullet. I try to avoid it unless it turns when I turn the bullet. If you adjust the tension on the right-hand spindle properly, it shouldn't turn. If it is turning, try adjusting it so there's less tension. Otherwise, yes, you do have to be careful not to skew the results when holding it. You also have to have a light hand to avoid skewing the results when turning the bullet. It takes a little practice to get the right "feel" to turning it. 2) I tend to avoid using the adjustment screw mostly because unless you use a roll crimp on the case/bullet, it tends to change the neck tension because it's twisting the bullet in the neck of the case and that will cause the neck to deform slightly. In extreme cases, it will cause the neck to lose tension altogether and the bullet will slip back into the case. When I do use the adjustment screw, I try to only turn it so that the dial goes up around 0.015" to 0.020". Any more than that and you might get some indentations on the bullet and cause the neck to deform too much. I've never noticed any marks on the bullet though. In any case, it's best to use the gauge as a measurement device only and if you are having concentricity issues, you might want to look at your seating die adjustment and how well the die lines up the bullet just before it gets seated. A higher quality die with a well fitting alignment sleeve might be necessary to reduce run-out during the seating stage of the process. 3) I've wondered about the life span of the pad on the adjustment screw myself. I've been using it for quite a while now and haven't noticed any degradation yet, but I suspect it has to happen eventually. I hope this helps. Thanks for watching and for the great questions!
I have heard it stated that using this tool introduces varying neck tension and/or "bends" the case. As the tool is working off of the case rim and the rim has no bearing on how the shell rests in the chamber, is measuring this way effective?
Good video. Thanks. New reloader and sub.
hello, after I saw your video I bought one to complete the RCBS case master. Like you use only Hornady tools what is the product from them I can use to check concentricity of empty cases?
Hornady Reloader, what can you do with your bullet seating die to get the correct concentricity? Do you have to run your reloads through your concentricity gauge and correct them? Thanks for your help and enjoy your videos.
+robert austin It depends a lot on the quality of the die. I also only use dies that have an alignment sleeve that gets everything lined up properly as the bullet is seated. Having a seating stem that is shaped properly for the type of bullet being used (round nose, flat point, etc) also helps a lot. Using the flat seating stem with a round nose bullet or the concave stem with a flat point bullet can throw things off a bit. Some companies, like Hornady, have seating stems you can get that are designed to fit a specific bullet so that helps quite a bit. Regardless of how well my dies perform, I usually check a random group of bullets from a batch just to make sure.
The bullet/neck spindle casting bore is off from the spindle shank diameter. The bullet spindle is fine if you set the right tension between the spindles, The neck spindle, for me, needs a custom pilot to give good readings. I will see if I need a custom spindle made to prevent any movement.
the neck spindle has too much clearance in the frame bore. I have a friend making me a new spindle and pilot. The bore in the spindle for the pilot isn't center either. I feel it's best to have this unit as tight as possible to eliminate errors and not blame sizing and bullet seating.
Does the adjustment screw that pushes the bullet deform the side of the bullet any great amount?
Nevermind, I saw on the neck wall thickness video that it had a green colored polymer/plastic pad.
Hi, yes, it does have a rubber-like tip so no damage is done to your bullet.
would you say the results are subject to how true the case rim is, as the case rim is one of the axial surfaces?
+Dan Steven The rim shouldn't be an issue. You could cut the case mouth at a 45 degree angle and the results would still be accurate. What is important is that the centerline of the neck is the same as the centerline of the body at the head of the case. What this tool measures is whether the centerline of the bullet itself is on that same centerline. Since this operation is done on a finished cartridge, the case has been through a sizing die which would correct any minor differences in the centerline. A more pronounced difference would result in a bent case or at the very least a dented side which would be filtered out during case inspections. Excellent question though, it's not readily apparent what is actually being measured. Thanks for watching!
+HornadyLoader
I suppose my concern came from my impression that even a FL re-sizer doesn't quite true up the case past the top of the case head (where the head and body meet - you can always see the line on the case after re-sizing). However, after I read your reply, i measured my case rims and saw that I never really saw more than an .0005 run-out on the case rims (even on LC mil brass).
All that aside, after watching your video, I purchased one and have had no complaints. Thanks for all the great responses!!!
I would like to see you put the same cartridge in you just straitened and see if it repeats itself
I just bought this gauge. I trued 20 rounds and I my goal was to true each cartridge to < one thousandth. I checked each cartridge again and they were all within this tolerance. Maybe I got lucky.....
WoW
what is the appropriate bullet spindle size? r/
I've done some research on this gauge and I do not believe this gauge can work
properly but maybe I am wrong. I do not take any credit for this information as
I discovered this from another website, and will try to explain the problem here.
Now this gauge will self center the cartridge from the bullet tip to the center of
the flash hole. But if the bullet has runout, the self centering axial line will NOT
coincide with the true axial line running through the center of the flash hole and
the cartridge body/neck.
I don't see the benefit in this tool because it is capturing the rim or head of the cartridge. Meaningful concentricity measurement must be taken with regard to the fireformed or resized case body. Not only is everything rear of the webb irrelevant but, also unreliable as a point to assume concentricity. Not only that but, a crooked bullet inside the neck is not bullet concentricity. That is just a shit bullet seating job.
If you have bullet eccentricity, the bullet has a different centre to that of the case body & shoulder but, could be as straight as a pin with regard to the neck.
Furthermore, you do not simply straighten a crooked bullet & call it good. You start looking for why & how the bullet was seated crookedly & correct the problem.
This tool is number one bull shit. When you try to tweak the neck just bc you do this does mean that it’s going to shoot straight if anything was going to be done would be to f/l size and clean up the outside if the necks and clean up flash hole uniform primer pockets that’s it. If you sizing die is set right you should have at least 1-2 thousand run out
je pensai que hornady ete une marque fiable etant moi meme utilisateur de leur produits
mais qu il soit IMPOSSIBLE d acheter une vis ( n°10 ) de cet outil c est pitoyable !!!!!!