ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 10 ก.พ. 2025
- I genuinely think they are the worst-designed raider. If they stay in this direction I don't think it'll be healthy for the game.
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I think a lot of you guys are missing the point here. This isn't whether or not anyone played correctly.
It's if these types of games are fun or healthy.
If you kept experiencing these games repeatedly would you keep playing? Me personally I don't know if i would.
i have run into these types of games all the time for aleast a week. Broly gets super transpheres at 2,3 and 4. Goku Black can have the transphere never come out with the level 2 strat. it's boring and not fun. Goku Black is just a meta rat
Pretty sure it's just one of three things because what I saw was just a normal raider game where the raider just had problems finding survivors during key phase
- You're burnt out on Goku Black since no transpheres when your level 2 so no challenge in fights
- You did not down/kill a lot of survivors the whole match so was boring for you
- You were almost killed when they played their best without a transphere.
Tbh though, you calling them pussies after running away from them at the end is kinda sus ngl tho. Calling them out for hiding in the beginning when it's the name of the game and then saying that is pretty lame
@ok107500 I agree with you bro. Which is why I sadly I removed my sub from this page. It's not the survivors fault for playing the way they do. It's the way the game has been moved into this stupid meta. It's annoying don't get me wrong but to on a live stream or video name call like that is childish and immature. Especially when people are just playing smart or the objective. They aren't wrong for how they play. Makes ironcane look pretty bad in my opinion
I'm thinking about quitting until ranked ends because you know the game's state is bad when you don't have fun even when you win.
I already stopped playing cause rank is too serious can’t even enjoy a casual game as raider without getting key rushed or running into overpowered survivors. Spamming stuns UC ,supers it’s made it impossible to enjoy the game. Even the best raiders dc now. Seeing a gold Ginyu main dc under 3 mins is very sad. Rank just ruins the game in general it’s worse with how overpowered survivors are and how weak the raider is…. Not to mention the fact that games normally last less than five minutes now because the raider is defeated or the machine is activated because the Raiders are struggling with ranked.
-As a survivor the game is difficult when you dont have people that dont know what they are doing
-As a raider the game is difficult when you get key rushed dont have good siv rng and or go against a group
on Steam, both of those happen nonstop, you dont get even slightly as many good or decent matches on PC as it seems iron gets on playstation
@@kittyclaireit seems iron also gets a group or people that know him in game so the raiders or survivors help him out in games but i consistently get games where people hog dragon balls n die n we have to etm cuz of immortal etc, or people who take transpheres just to hide n not help. but i love iron i’m not hatin on him
@@kittyclairesame bro when I play on Xbox I always get brain dead teammates even with crossplay and it feels impossible to beat goku black level 2 strat.
Why is it worth nothing that it is difficult for raiders to go against a competent coordinated pre-made? It's like saying, "Yeah you may be a good fighter but you would lose against an army." Okay how is this fact relevant? If the only thing that can defeat raiders are competent premades then GUESS WHAT? RAIDERS OP!!!!!!!111 WHY IS THIS HARD TO UNDERSTAND? THIS IS MAINLY A SOLO QUEUE GAME.
Also Goku Black level 2 strat is the dumbest thing to do, the only thing dumb Dragonball players understand is winning by punching the bad guy, and that's what you open yourself to if you stay level 2, everybody is going to be level 2 as well and will be able to punch you. Okay maybe it's what you could do against a premade because they'd use the ST effectively, not against the average Dragonball fan.
@@forestmanification lol none of that matters. it’s the skill level n most players just started 1-2 weeks ago since it was was sale for 4$. so you’ll obvi get new players who don’t know where or what to do, then you’ll get players who know what to do and completely wipe ur team out if team doesn’t play smart.
I mean if survivors didn't have like 89 stuns and able to dragon change 20 times a round. What are raiders literally supposed to do?
I mean if Goku Black didn't have like two infinite range supers, a charge, a teleport, an evasive that covers ten of him, and ki sensing with no chance of an Ultimate Change, which no other raider can do. What else are survivors supposed to do?
@UltLuigi1 Please tell me you're trolling.
It's because of Goku Blacks two AOE attacks, a dash, and Ki sense is why he is viable! Why else is he, Broly and the Ginyu Force so popular?
I haven't seen many Buus, Vegetas, or cells around these past couple of weeks.
@@UltLuigi1 Crazy how survivors still beat them most of the time, and statistics will end up proving that. The supers arent infinite range either, they just go a far distance, as cells all clear goes super goes around the same distance. No one really uses the teleport considering in the stm phase zamasu stays near u.
Goku black is literally just a better broly and as usual survivors still beat the raider most of the time. Literally everything u said doesnt matter if a smart group of players know what their doing
@@Banished_Soulz If a smart group of players is in the queue, the raider will never win no matter what raider is selected. That's just the nature of the game; a raider's success is determined not by their own skill, but by the survivors' failures and the raider's ability to capitalize on those failures.
If the Survivors don't fail, the raider doesn't have an opportunity to win, so they will lose. Goku Black is popular right now because his supers enable him to more easily capitalize on survivors' failures, such as failing to insert keys or revive players.
@@UltLuigi1 have you played raider against decent players? i admit what you listed is an issue for newer players but the game is still survivor sided
It got to the point the game needs to make the Super Time Machine take longer to charge up whenever areas destroyed before keys are planted
Or stop resetting the meter whenever raiders begin destroying the time machine: if Key Progressing doesn't reset when Survivors start, the destruction shouldn't either
But that's my dumb opinion
Could balance it to where keys also get the 25% 75% thing?
I think STM's Progress decay does make sense (Otherwise Raiders can win by ignoring survivors long enough) but there needs to be more thresholds it can't decay under. As of now it's 33 and 66 percent. 25, 50, and 75 would be a lot better. Heck maybe even 20, 40, 60, 80 but that might be overkill. I feel that ideally you want to to make fighting to keep him off matter but not be so favored for survivors that you can make the Raider waste a lot of progress in one group attack.
STM Destruction does have some points of damage that are beyond recovery.
Though I suppose it's harsh if you can reach those points in the first place.
I feel like what needs to happen balance-wise is that survivors need harsher punishments for leveling up higher, which is effectively what transformations worked as in Dragonball.
Also Immortal Champion should only work when being melee'd. Mr. Satan never got sent flying away by projectiles, so something clearly as useful as this needs to just be melee only.
IC not even that bad, attack them near a wall there dead, you can snipe them with super, black, broly, ginyu can counter it with dashes
@@wadaisyjoe3188 Not always an option for Ginyu, and players that are smart can just use AI/AS as a means of stopping the landing delay or even take advantage of it. Which can often be the difference between being able to snipe them at all, or just wasting your time.
Also, purposely angling yourself to make sure they hit a wall when they don't have it can waste up to at least a dozen seconds of your time if not more just trying to get an angle. And every second counts when playing raider.
@hythunza1811 yea sometimes but sniping not hard to be honest
With ginyu recoome has dash, if lucky guido freezes IC, ginyu also has a dash meaning you could still easilly chase and his super has AOE too if you cant snipe thats more of just bad aim
Not everyone runs it AI/AS ether with it specially stun teams
And on STM yea they might get away but still gives you time to focus stm sometimes
Its a one time use so if you already doing well you proubly already knocked IC a few times
I had a black match where all 7 players had IC but 5 ICs failed 2 from wall and rest me just snipping them
Heck i have snipped with galick gun vegeta, some lv 4s with beam ults can kill easilly specially Broly heck broly lv 3 aoe ult too
Or use lv 4 broly quick AD or Fused Zamasus
Vegeta still gets damage so its helping him get ape which ape is easy to chase, Broly also still gets his evo too
There are counters to it learning how to use them
so I had these 3 games last night:
1- a scum player goku black that took down someone, but would go aways just barely so the heart beat would´t sound till you go for the res, came back, killed the one go went to save, and repeated all the game camping.
2-a survivor game with a normal raider, but 2 players that didn't play at all, one of them using jaco's ship to go to the top of the map and do nothing.
3- my only raider game, and of course, a 3-4 players premade, I was so tilted by then that I said "yeah.... I'm not dealing with this right now.
this is getting really frustating, somehow both sides do their freaking best to make you despite the game man, and is not even that competitive, please chill out a bit lol
btw whats the PU bug in the game, didn't notice
So all of this you are saying you don't like campers. We'll the whole point on each side is to win the game there is no fairness in all of this. Plus i've been getting selfish survivors than selfish raiders.
They need a balance patch so that the level 2 Strat isn’t a thing ppl resort to. But also if they took it away when goku blacks key rushed he’d totally be used a lot less
It kills me cause I do see people play like this because of key rushing. The stm comes out under a min and 30 so it’s impossible to find civs in time and it’s crazy or survivors have to many overpowered evasive so people like goku black are forced to stay in lv 2
@@JinxKitzunehonestly the only time it bothers me is when they do it when they’re in full control or if it’s that situation where ppl keep picking you up and the raider shoots you back down over and over for 5 minutes straight cuz he doesn’t want to execute you
@@NiteStrikeI can agree it’s alil too much. But if keys are nerfed it would give the raider more time to look around. Find civs. Open chest and get prepared to fight survivors. It should take u about 5 mins to be lv up when the stm come out. Even if you get lv 2 under a min survivors sometimes would already find almost all the keys, leaving us raiders with no other option then to not level up. As a Goku black your goal is to be at least level three before the stm is out. Sometimes we’re forced to key camp but once I’m lv 3 I won’t really care if the last key is planted I’m very good with goku black. But everything is so survivor sided that it ruins the game. Balance for both sides is a must
ST was a terrible idea regarding GB in my opinion, it is fine with Broly since he gets evolution power by damaging survs so you don't really have the option to not evolve, but GB? It just discourage getting lv3/4
I think just make black get Evo when he damages like Broly for his level 2, then reduce the gain for 3 or completely remove it for the next level
Its too many skills allowing you to fight back divinine incarnate didnt need to be a thing. Survivors have almost become unkillable now with super transphere and power to change the future. The skills need to focus on more escape and survivability then bullying the raider
Yah at this point this is why i say raiders needs co op
agreed 100%
Im not mad at survivors or raiders playing how they play at all. Simply because the actives and passives are there for survivors to use, so you really can't get mad at them for using it. However the devs of this game i feel dont really play their game making it in ghe state that its in. This has been genuinely the worse season to come out. Gameplay on both sides is genuinely boring because of matches like this one. It's not the players fault though. I took a week off the game and didnt miss it at all. Ive been playing since the beta and some people i know feel the same way. This game is going down a very bad track.
AGREEEEEEED
I can get mad at survivors for running a particular build. If I see a premade running all stuns with Majin Vegeta to bully me you’re damn right I’m going to get mad because they know exactly what they’re doing, it’s toxic and I’ll reward that play style in kind.
@joshuakrueger3392 hey do what you gotta do. I fought Italian Bronx guys premade squad and camped them to secure kills and they all cried like little girls. I didn't care cause they were a premade. The other time before that they tried to jump me and failed. Said I was bad due to my medals. Again I didn't care lol. I lost my last match against them but it's all good. Can't take wins or losses personally.
Same here. 2000+ hours in this game since the beta. I used to play everyday, just for fun. Not any more. Worst season ever.
Key rushing and stun spamming are ruining the game 😒
Ok imagine this but the second you try to kill one person as base goku black you get junped by 7 majin vegetas with stuns. I took a break from the game after that.
I had something like that but with bansho fan and special beam cannons along with the up close attacks
You deserve it for choosing to play Goku Black, again and again.
@@forestmanification it's not always Goku back it's Frieza broly or the giynu force
That or cell and soppovic
@@forestmanification uh srry for wanting to play the new raider
Nah I think survivors played near perfectly this match by not getting found (even tho they actively looked out for you to fight) saving all the civs and not getting stuck at the last 2 keys in a very campable spot, the only reason they lost was because you were using goku black which has no ultimate d change mechanic until lvl 3, if you were any other raider it would have been most likely a lost.
I think they deserved that win
If you think these games are fun power to ya. On both sides I find them incredibly boring
@@ironcaneBoring and meta. Hide all game until STM comes out, play around areas that have key spawns right next to each other, having multiple stuns and escapes, have all the cool down drinks they need on hand and rotate out their D-change perfectly, never get downed once so they just keep reviving during STM phase, this is just Breakers anymore since ranked. I've never had less fun playing raider since launch, even Volley meta was more enjoyable.
@@ironcane I'm not saying its fun, I'm saying they should've won. Survivors did everything right to the point you were playing goku black flying simulator and you still won because they didn't have any way to keep fighting and they even stayed to try and secure the kill when you know they could have ALL etm.
@@super_kami_dende so when you play survivor you should just let the raider find you and execute you? Finding people is raider's work bruh
What do you mean by "play around areas that have key spawns right next to each other" ? If anything the raider plays around areas by camping
If you don't find people and force them to use their resources then don't expect them to not have them
What I'm getting at is that they will obviously have a lot of sodas and stuff because Iron didn't fight them for most of the match
@@josecriollo6976 Playing around the keys right next to each other meaning planting keys in areas raiders can't easily just camp. If the raider has to defend a key in A and D most likely one of those is getting planted and it's TPD easy. I'm not mad at the players, it's the way you want to play survivor so you're not dying every time. I'm upset with the way every skill in the game benefits premades/good randoms while Raiders have a cap on what they can upgrade/change about how they play. I leave it up to RNG anymore, but when that RNG is someone finding a key radar, all the keys up in 2 minutes, and I'm still level 2 I start to get frustrated. When I've played 3 matches with people who throw games just to go up against the survivors actually playing the game it gets hard to play sometimes. I enjoy this game, but sometimes I can't fathom how my whole lobby is A5 - S5 as well as level 150+ and they still get killed so easily. It's whatever though, just gotta work with what you got in this game as annoying as it can be.
I think the survivors need more balancing, they should also somehow delay the time for the keys to spawn, the pacing of the games is fucked, and also it makes the raiders more willing to camp and tunnel to win some games
This was an idea I was thinking. Something like a set number of crates that need to be opened in an area before it is possible for its key to be in one.
You got off easy. They didn't even chain stun you.
I just had my first Lol moment playing as the Vegeta raider. I was still Nappa by the time the STM came out. I managed to destroy it without being rushed (possible ETM gamers), only one person tried to stop me. I got the survivor to run off when I saw another survivor trying to ETM at the spot near the STM (Dark Future map) so I destroyed it giving me my first Nappa win.
I won't lie, I kinda wish I could opt out of ranked sometimes.
It just feels like people sweat too much now.
(Small wall of text ahead)
Hell it got to the point where Raiders aren't finishing someone off, but they're putting them in the animation so they don't DC because the timer doesn't go down while in it, it's just downright toxic at that point.
Like I respect good survivors and raiders, but there's a point where the game's balance is called into question.
I had 3 notable games yesterday.
1. An entire premade all having Immortal champion, with either Instant Rise/Descent, charming pose, and Jaco ship along with it.
2. A salty Goku black player that got mad I was playing good as survivor, and instead of killing me while everyone else was escaping (STM gaming), he just decided to put me into a loop by finishing me off but not completing the animation to actually kill me and waste both mine and his time.
3. A dragon ball rush premade abusing UC with the Level 4 basically spam dodging and just trying to stall me out.
Like none of those games were remotely fun except the first one, but that was only because I saw so many people flying away. It feels more like a chore to play raider when I'm running into teams that play like this. So many abilities are so exploitable when an entire team stacks them weirdly enough.
From personal experience people still play like that here are some notable games I had
1: I was Spopo and got shenroned summomed on me
2: I killed Zamasu with some other survivors and I got downed and instead of him finishing me off he just sat on my body spamming voice lines
3: I was Vegeta and got jumped by 3 level 3s and a level 4 all running SBC and chaining stuns
its harder and harder for newer players to learn with quick in your face raiders like zamasu and its very hard for them to get skills like Instant Transmission with how many there are in the game now. as for older players playing raider sucks as its sadly its survivor sided against higher levels. I tried teaching two friends but we kept going against zamasu and they eventually gave up playing it :(
I don't think key radars should be a thing I've always thought that its a big problem in itself and super transpheres are a problem making it harder to play raider i really hope the next raider has dragon balls
we'll if they want to they can go on youtube and watch guide videos like iron so they know what to do. That's what everyone should do when playing a game and how can they improve if they get stuck.
@@mysticstrikeforce5957 watching streammer is one exerience, playing the game is another. Streammer frequently play in premades with sweats
@@mysticstrikeforce5957 yea i told them about videos and tried teaching them myself I also told them to expect to die your first few games. I've done it with a few others and they stayed around for a long time just doesn't work with everyone
@@mysticstrikeforce5957 A video game doesn't give you the end boss right at the start and then tells you to go to university to learn the theory for 3 months before actually playing the damn game. You just play the game and learn from reward and fun, it's a GAME.
This isn't the topic of the video, but Stuns need a nerf and need to be limited. This isn't a request at this point, it's a demand.
What do you mean, don't you enjoy being double stunned as Vegeta and losing over 75% of your health to 2 final explosion users?
I dont see what was wrong here, the survivors did what they were supposed to do, stay out of sight of the Raider and avoid him until STM phase and then defend the STM. GB health was low after the STM blew up, so they attempted the kill instead of ETM gaming
What's wrong here?
100% agree with you. They did all that right and STIlLL lost, so survivors cant be that OP. Most games end in the raider just stomping. It's a nice change when its a bit more of a challenge
Nobody is saying they played wrong.
The issue is that these games suck to play, on both sides. They are extremely unfun. Getting keys fast isn't inherently skill based or challenging.
@@ironcane as a survivor, i have the most fun hiding from them rather than fighting them, since it is always a losing battle and can never seem to escape after without the powerful actives.
Bro was salty xD he does this same thing in his vids
@@paiichan-Pyeicedup yeah, i noticed haha
12:50 Look at this shit right here.
These assholes were more into killing Ironcane than escaping. Survivors don't fear/respect the raider anymore.
Fucking reminds me if the early days of DbD and of Resident Evil Resistance, Survivors making a the "power role" a joke.
But it’s literally in the manual that it’s a viable option during etm phase. Instead of escaping, killing the raider is another chance at an actual win. it’s not BM, it’s just part of the game
@SURVIVOR515 I call bullshit because it is a EGO and BM thing.
If there are 30 seconds left and the raider still has some health? Why not just go for the ETM on the other side of the map while one of your teammates distracts the raider?
Players like you just wanna flex on the raider, please concern troll somwhere else.
To be fair, of course they would try to kill the raider with less than 2 bars left. They would have lost anyway since STM was destroyed, the ONLY chance was to kill hum, but they should have realised that Ironcane was avoiding and staying alive until the timer ran out and should have just taken the emergency time machine
@@loopyshot3326This isn’t an asymmetrical horror survival though at the end of the day. It’s in its own unique niche category. This game tries to capture the feeling of dragonball where you take on an enemy stronger than you with the help of others just like in the series. It’s always gonna be a hard game to balance. Fighting and killing the raider is what makes this game fun compared to these other games. The only other game I’ve played where is was fun to survive against the killer was Friday the 13th before the rage buff patch.
@@loopyshot3326 becsuse how are u gonna win or rank up
I had a game that lasted about 5 minutes really only took them two, cause they all jumped in with stuns and somehow kept getting their power back.
Only a few minutes in the game.
I enjoyed the game since it came out, with how the last season went kinda down the experience for me.
So I’ve already haven’t been playing the game like I used to.
But if this keeps up idk.
Play perfect or lose, that's where we're at now. If a team knows what they're doing and coordinate well, forget it.
We had a game where survivors played it all well, but we still lost because we had no DC left, and though we had a few seconds left before the STM activated, Zamasu shot everyone.
What I hate is when there's lobby issues and only have 1 or 2 survivors, and instead of leaving with etm they hide the whole time. Just waited an hour to fight 1 of 2 people..... thx
I have trouble aiming as both raider and survivor at far things, what are your settings like?
This game is not healthy. It's a toxic game. It's a game made for sweats, now.
It was fun. But ranked killed it.
You have bully squad. So you have body camp, key camp, level 2 strat.
The problem is not GB.
The problem is the game
Agreed, the game got worse when they put back ranked. I've been facing nothing but sweaty goku blacks all day and idiot survivors who don't help with the keys or fighting.
honestly they should just remove radars, especially key radars
you can hear civs, dragon balls should be rare and keys are gonna be found regardless
and don’t act like survivors won’t still be able to transform 20 times because of drinks and skills anyway
The soda machines should not be destroyable with ki blasts, only by holding button near them like civs. The raider just removes play by doing so and is not fun. If he wants to remove play then make him lose his time doing so (unless Great Ape Vegeta, can just stomp them, but he already won anyway so it doesn't matter).
I was thinking some of the times you used Ki Sense, you may have been to far up in the sky area for it to detect the survivors.
As survivors get better with evasive skills it seems important to put more points in to any detection abilities that the raider has to cut down cool down time.
My tips for game balance. Nerf level 2 Goku black (mainly their “sniping” skills range) and raise the cooldown of all stuns by a fair amount (that way landing it matters on your end, besides your teammates probably have more). As for knockback skills I’m not too sure. They’re annoying but put you in a more ideal place than stuns most of the time. They’re only two of them as far as I know that are fully intended to be knockback. That being King furry’s skill and bansho fan. Also let’s face it, any healthy dbtb main gameplay should not involve key rushing 90% of the time, except for when you’re lucky. Nerf all the radars. That’s why we have radar passives, maybe they wouldn’t be unnecessary if they had a use besides rushing.
Edit: Kaioken attack too.
With games like these I don’t think there’s ever gonna be a balance, so I choose not to care and play how I feel, I like giving survivors a chance
I know what is coming...
Goku Black and Zamasu will be Nerfed/buffed. They'll nerf Base Goku Black to hell to stop players from staying level 2, but will boost Rosé and Fusion Zamasu to greater heights... As to when, Idk, but IK it will happen!
Of course the survivors had fun, they got to do whatever the fuck they wanted with no real repercussions.
Meta survivor group + Dangerous grounds is the worst type of match for any raider.
They lost the game what do u mean?
@KeyGameUniverse lol lol they choose to lose the game instead of escaping. The point of games are to have fun. It isn't fun to play goku black.
@@StandXGamma Escaping means the raider won the game.
@@forestmanification The game considers it a draw if too many people escape. If all 7 escaped, it would have been a draw. Having to run from survivors is terrible like this too win feels terrible for both players.
That’s how this game been playing.....that’s why I don’t take this game serious anymore.
This game was never supposed to be that serious lmao
Wonder why they added ranked then@@Auuman
@@hoesmad8626 Most games have a ranking system of sorts, it has always been like that, even in single player games 🤷♂️
Ranked needs to be balanced when you encounter games like this.
Goku black’s problem is his lack of useful passives. He needs to have a passive where when he damages survivors he gets either evo meter or cool down reduction like broly and then a passive where when he gets damaged he hets evo meter like frieza.
Do you want my honest opinion?
Survivors > Raiders
Raiders > Survivors
Yep the tables have turned around
They were trying to key rush but it seems that RNG wasn't on their side, but you were having a hard time finding people because of the map. But people staying behind just to waste time and not escaping it good but most of those people had their change close to below 10% at that point, best to leave.
I feel like we survivors need less powerful skills to make the match more interesting.
Though I think the biggest fault here is the rank matchmaking. Since the matchmaking has a priority on high ranks first then fill instead of fill only, it only makes it a higher chance that people who use meta will pair up instead of a random match (though pre-mades are still a thing and are more frequent now due to rank season).
With the power gap of survivors and raider is always going raider then to survivors, I feel like their should be more to help raiders but that would be hard for people who are still new on survivors or don't have meta.
"Though I think the biggest fault here is the rank matchmaking. Since the matchmaking has a priority on high ranks first then fill instead of fill only, it only makes it a higher chance that people who use meta will pair up instead of a random match (though pre-mades are still a thing and are more frequent now due to rank season)"
Perfect explanation
I haven't had fun with the game since ranked first released. No one has fun with it these days except maybe Craic.
Dumbest thing they ever did was adding so many skills that allow Survivors to fight back. These are supposed to be Power Level 5 civilians, struggling to survive against a Signature Dragon Ball villain, not dime-store Xenoverse CaC school dropouts up against a Time Patroller cosplaying a villain. Fighting the Raider should've never become a primary way of winning a round - fighting the Raider at all should be a last resort outside of the STM phase, and even then fighting them should be with the objective of delaying them until the STM can complete, not killing them.
I've been saying this ever since Instant Transmission was released, and only *now* are people starting to realize that I'm right. These games aren't fun or healthy for the game's future, but they're necessary for Raiders to continue to exist in this meta of repeated dragon changes, stronger dragon changes, easy escapes, and the constant expansion of Survivor options with every gacha banner that drops.
People are like, "oh make them waste resources, make them waste resources" and I'm like "bro, what resources?" because it takes virtually nothing at all for Survivors to get back whatever you take from them unless you hard eliminate them entirely. Meanwhile, a Raider's health is a finite thing in most cases, as is the evolution power needed to go up levels and stay ahead of the Survivor power curve. Now with Super Transpheres, going up levels - you know, your primary means of changing up your kit and staying competitive - isn't even an advantage anymore because you *give the survivors more weapons to kill you by doing so.*
You could have the easy escapes, and easy hiding, and maybe even the keyrushing, *if* Survivor swarms weren't so strong in direct combat in the modern meta. But nope! That's not at all what's happening. You devote most of your actives to escapes and stuns, you devote most of your passives to getting your Dragon Change back faster, and you have it both ways, able to run and fight with equal ease. There's jack squeaky squat the Raider can do about it, because their kit's pretty much fixed.
All Goku Black players do is stay in the air and snipe with AOE. Makes games extremely boring.
Wasn’t it already shown that PU activating resistance isn’t a glitch but only it activating a third time after PU if D-Changed was considered the bug by devs?
at that point that specific bug you're referring to was still in the game
They really need to nerf super transpheres because its sometimes impossible to play rośe against these sweaty players. They need to make the super transphere have a death requirement that must be fulfilled, like 3-4 players must be dead (not downed, straight up dead) in order for the super transphere to spawn.
Also, they gotta make raiders have immunity for short periods against stuns to prevent chain stunning cheese. Cause it's impossible to fight against due to how premades like to fight.
Also we need a feature that can help players to prevent being put up against premades cause premades overall make everything worse. Its a nightmare going up against chain stunning, key rushing, infinite d changing premades. Premades are super sweats who demolish every raider with either chain stunning cheese and use special beam cannon or key rush and have builds focused on regaining d change so they'll have basically infinite d changes to prevent the raider from ever destroying the STM.
I think the problem is the map size. Larger maps are inherently more survivor sided because it makes it easier to hide, and should you find someone they have the option to go across the map with IT which is a 500 meter gap. Its boring raider side because we dont have the speed to hunt down survivors anymore, or if we do spend our time hunting one, we are usually punished by having all the keys found and mostly planted. This kind of gameplay loop just encourages area camping, because its the only way to get survivors to be agressive.
The problem with Goku Black is you're just not encouraged to level up a lot of the time. Especially if you get key rushed where levelling up is just a really bad idea. I've had plenty of games where I have no choice to either stay in base Black or Rose form because going further is too risky. I typically get to Fused when I've already basically won.
I'm thinking maybe Black needs either auto evolve energy at a very slow pace mind you to force going up, or he delivers damage/receives damage for a little pushing to higher levels. Maybe a SSJ2 Goku level 2 transphere but Black is already kinda squishy but it's a possibility. Unlike Broly he completely dictates the transphere game which can make things less fun.
I'm surprised they didn't give Goku Black the damage taking mechanic Frieza has, consider how he goes on how "this pain will make me stronger."
At this point they should have matches where it is an option to have dragonballs in Goku Black matches. We get that they wanted it to be where dragon balls didnt exist in the future but this shouldnt be the only way to play the matches. Could be a fun addition to the game as well
6 minutes to start STM, for me was a slow match.
I love this game as well, but it feels like there is a big imbalance.
People are incentivized to play Goku Black and Zamasu as a raider, because you get to control the state of the game the most. All too often I see level 2 or 3 raiders get jumped by a dragon ball level 4 and the whole gang. They stun lock the raider and it's GG's.
Raiders are being forced to play lame, because that's all they can do to keep up in the current state of the game and that's what the game is rewarding.
There needs to be a big balance change and a lot of survivor actives and passives need massive overhauls imo.
If the game had a combat mode where ultimate dc’s fight each other that’d be dope
My Raider matches:
- Pick Broly
- Immediately hunt for survs (at least 2)
- Kill them and camp waiting for ST to appear
- Kill ST and go on 1VS4/5
Is it fun? No
Am i playing like an asshole? Absolutely yes.
But otherwise you just lose.
Btw this is a casual game, implementing ranked was a terrible idea for both parts, now you have to sweat survs match just to get Raider match where you even have to sweat more. Fuck this shit honestly.
I also pick broly most of the time when playing raider. Unconscious Control on the ST are a nightmare...
@@gzayorvus3195 Yeah but at least Broly's solid, everytime i got jumped as GB half my health was gone lol
Hey if people will be assholes when they play then I’ll be an asshole while I play.
Tbh I haven’t had the lv 2 Goku black problem on both sides even if I lost a few times going past level 2. I do think they should decrease the rate of finding keys down just a tiny bit
The problem is survivor skills don't have the correct cooldowns. Instant Rise and descent should be 60 secs, jaco ship should be 2mins, etc. Otherwise they become too spammable for the raider to keep up.
You honestly can’t be serious. Why would you want survivors to have outrageous cool downs and the raider have lesser cool downs that makes no sense you pretty much want it one sided to where the survivors don’t even have a chance.
Just make the survivor stay in place for 10 minutes, I choose to play Goku Black, how come I won but the survivors gave me a hard time!?! The game owes me a perfect victory ONLY I GET TO PLAY I'M RAIDER
People have been adapting to goku black pretty quickly from the intensity of ranking, always carry time patrollers duty, always have 1 maybe 2 stuns which is useful of the group also have stuns, avoid fighting and saving your DC till the STM phase, melee or ki blast him, don’t use super attacks unless you know it hits.
13:24 yo bro what is dragon ball the breakers about?
Me:so you are a raider and you have to 1v6 people and stay alive witch is kinda impossible cuz for some reason they are spawning cooldown drinks every 4 seconds and basically have infinite dragon changes
1vs7
Might be a bad idea but what if once you found a key, it had a timer before you can start planting it/working on it if it was found before 5 minutes (3 minutes maybe if it's too much). Maybe like a 30 sec timer or a one min timer.
Bad idea, game should be balanced for new players first, they should have fun first. New players will just get key camped even worse than they are now, they won't have Time Patrol Duties. Just remove radars if you are a premade.
This game has so much potential but I just dont see a long term future for this game. Theres too many problems in the base games dna that need just huge reworks or redesigns. If I had to go through 5 survivor games (plus the game crashing in all the queues) and had this game as my raider match i'd be pissed af too
The survivors literally played how they were supposed to. The fact you couldn't find them was on you.
Yeah, as raider these matches are no fun (you want to chase, you want to fight etc), but this still happened in previous seasons and it's nothing toxic or bad. It's just how a game like this is sometimes imo.
I mainly like to play raider btw, I've had matches like this. Nothing out of the ordinary imo.
I don't really think the devs intended for survivors to never be seen before the STM comes out or for it to come out that quickly.
I just don't find these games enjoyable on either side, I think that's what's being lost on people, I'm not complaining as a raider, I'm complaining as a player.
What he's saying isn't "People playing the game in the current meta are ruining it" He's saying "The way the way this game has been developed has encouraged un-fun winning strategies, promoting gameplay that isn't particularly thrilling to experience on any side (Survivor, Raider, or Viewer)"
@@ironcane Fair enough, I personally think it's a natural product of the Breaker's gameplay and you can't really avoid it.
Matches will be fun and sometimes they will be unfun regardless of how devs want the game to be imo.
Hoenstly I'm more bothered by the overall meta the current skills and GB are festering than this.
@@hariffton8482 Again, fair but so?
Should the game be more focused on combat and killing the raider instead?
Cause the combat was clearly never built to be anything complex, so if survivors are not meant to never be seen are we gonna build over an already faulty foundation?
Regardless of that I don't think there's anything to fix in this particular case, it just kinda happens sometimes.
I mean they evaded the raider and did objectives. Its the job of the raider to force interactions between themselves and the survivors. So out side of that one guy abusing exploits. The survivors didn't do anything wrong.
The devs need to find some way to slow the game state down so there can he more interactions between survivors and raiders. This can be done by making smaller maps like the OG 3. While also making it take longer to place keys or allow Raiders to regress keys if they find it.
Yeah, the problem is that the Raider can't really force interactions by touching down in a map and searching more closely, because the moment the Raider does so, the keys in all 4 other areas get found + set, and then TPD does the rest. It's indeed as you say, the game needs to be slowed down, as currently the only thing the Raider really can do is to just keep hovering high in the air in the middle of the map to force everyone to move slowly in cover and hope someone screws their cover up.
Raiders win 9 times out of 10 against solo queues and you want them to win 100% of the time now? If survivors don't have TPD then how to combat key camping? I'd say by being able to relocate the key setting site, but that's deep in the issue, the broader issue is that the game needs to be fun for new players and there needs to be 7 survivors to fill a match so playing survivor has to be worthwhile somewhat, no it's not because you choose to play as GB&Z that you are entitled a win.
Ateaat you won in the end. Legit imagine this same situation and they gang up on ya no matter how fast or hard you tries to hun them at the start. Idk, I'd take a boring match over a frustrating one where I end up losing in the end.
I know it's not totally relevant to the subject at hand but raked mode has made nervous xD and matches like those screw me up so much
It’s kinda bs Goku Black can essentially be punished for choosing to make himself stronger by evolving. Super Transpheres are a problem that needs to go away. They also make skills made for hunting dragon balls useless.
This might just be me being salty, but I lost a ranked super buu game because some guy got all the balls and then spammed special beam cannon, it was miserable
Damn, you're not alone bro...
Have you tasted SBC whith souls?... Or final explosion?... It takes like 2 to end your life... Some supers need to be nerfed
I feel for everyone besides Goku black to get a faster area destruction and to have survivors to only hold one stun not like 4 or 3 cause that been happening to me for two days that or increase the slow down for them that and to only have one vehicle/shape shift skill
This is weird for me since this is what most of my raider games are like (minus the end, that's new)
I swear Zamasu is one of if not my favorite raiders but you can't even have fun playing as him when you're in situations like this where you're forced to use the level 2 strat and you have an ending like this. You got no kills and no one managed to pull a W with the STM or ETM. EVERYONE lost that game
How about you just take the loss sometimes, I bet you are complaining that you lose 1 game out of 6.
@@forestmanification You'd have lost that bet because 9 times out of 10 I'm getting my ass kicked. As for taking the loss. What for? I'm not just going to stand around and throw the match or worse DC like other players when they're outmatched. I might be playing a boring or even a losing match but I'll still play to win
Honestly they should just add a super transpheres for lvl 2 black. It doesn't even need to make that much sense. Like vegeta blue idk
Survivors should get debuff depending how many in a party
This is what premades consider peak breakers gameplay
Today i killed a rose with another survivor. Now yes that rose was a level 6 c3(i think that was his ranking) and i am lv 72, but steel me with the super trasphear and another random was enoughf to kill him.
I blame the devs for putting back ranked now theirs nothing but sweaty players trying to get to Z5.
It took them like 7 minutes to put the key...how is this key rush?
They were all alive when the stm was up...
Yet you still manage to destroy the stm and win the game...
Yet people are asking for more survivor nerfs and buffs to raiders...wtf are you all smoking.
Some games just don't go fully your way and that's what this game was.
This game has some element of rng and yet you still won.
Exactly, just because he didn't "enjoy" the game doesn't take away thathe still won. Massive delusion on his part.
@UnlimitedOEnergy hey Mr. Delusion! My Issue is HOW I had to win this game by playing like a pussy essentially and stay at lvl 2 when by this game's rules you should typically lose in that scenario.
But because I was key rushed, which means FINDING all the keys fast, I couldn't risk getting my lvl 3 because a super transphere would've spawned and probably would've made me lose the match.
Let's try to analyze the game and not just think it's about X or Y group complaining the other is stronger. This raider was designed poorly. And it leads to games like this.
I don't want to see more games and raiders like this for the good of the game. This goes beyond me champ and my ego or whatever people want to make it out to be.
Yes! But my critqiue is what I HAD to do to win.
And if I played normally which would be tryna get my lvl 3 I woulda lost because of the super transphere.
That's my issue. The fact that this works and both roles have to play the way they do.
You didn't get good RNG or snowball in the slightest, a bunch of your attacks got cucc'd and you still won, idk if anything else needs to be said.
Good job winning the STM as a level 2 but also if you can do this consistently then Survivors have next to no chance of winning, what more could they have done this game?
They could have got level 3 and jump him
Super attacks from survivors need to cost more energy or less damage💀
Goku black makes me appreciate Broly more
I have games like this before and theres nothing you can really do about it, especially on that vampa map.
Tbh it doesnt bother me that much since I'd rather a peaceful game than get jumped constantly and get cooked😂 but games like these i can understand can be boring. But at the same time; what exactly is the solution? Survivors didnt really do anything wrong here. They stayed away from you, planted keys, and thats it. Thats how games are supposed to go. Its really just this map imo but it can happen on other maps.
Yeah, exactly. It's how matches go sometimes and that's fine.
@Frieza-yg4zp Yeah like I said it happens but it's not really a bad thing. Iron talks about if it's 'good' or 'bad' for the game but imo due to the gameplay style I feel like that doesn't even matter. Survivors are SUPPOSED to avoid you until the STM phase. It's not like your going through the entire game without interacting once, you just get a lack of it. Which again I think is fine because would you really take getting jumped by survivors? Or have a peaceful game?
@Frieza-yg4zp That's pretty situational and in your case yeah you definitely wanna get jumped ☠️ breakers is luck based as well since civs can spawn in different places
This has ranked for me so far, I think they need to make balance adjustments on both sides
This game was born dead tho (jk), They need to fix Goku Black, he's the problem!
..I acknowledge not being allowed to give my opinion on this game, as a survivor only player.
I don’t know the escape spots on the broly map cause I never make it that far on that map we normally win and any other game takes me to green coast
I feel this game shows the problem of Breakers in two different ways. Long rant incoming!
TL:DR: This game's balance is crap. Also Medal reward balance is equally bad.
Survivors just have too many ways to avoid conflict on top of their ways to stall/escape/fight/stun etc.. This match alone showcases why Instant Transmission and Immortal Champion are cheap. IT may need 4 seconds but when you can hear the raider ahead of time it doesn't matter if he found you while this move is up. You are gone and safe if you dont' flub and teleport to someone only 10 feet away. Immortal Champion creates distance and an opportunity to run away. Even if you get sniped (which Ironecane had no time or opening to do so) they still have to fly towards you to finish you off in a place likely to be safer then where you would normally of been downed.
But now we look at Goku Black here. Goku Black's biggest advantage is that he has no fear of Lv 4 Wish or a Super Transphere until he's level 3 and thus has the power to deny the survivors one of htier major win cons. But this in turn makes the game less fun for everybody. Rose is a fun form but it's not worth switching to when STM is out and Trunks ST users can easily stall you out or help kill you if the group rushes you. And much like all the dlc raiders from Vegeta to now. His kit is an answer to all the things survivors been using to win the game. From his dash skill to breakstrike negating EF+IT, from his Super attack AOE snipes to A.I> support. His kit is built 100% with the meta in mind. Punishing survivors who don't have the meta skills along with the previous raiders why aren't built for it. Especially Cell, Frieza, and Buu.
There's a lot more problems glaring on both sides but I only wanted to cover what's observable from the match. Another small quick note is look at the medals too. Despite winning Ironcane got meh medals because he's rushed too hard to transform. The game wants the raider to keep the game going and entertaining. On the flip side, you can only see it by a frame or two but the survivors got mostly gold and plat as the game rewards them for rushing to STM asap and making the game short. One side rewarded for longer games. One side rewarded for rushing. That's whacked.
Ive never gotten key rushed cause I guess i dont play against good survivors
But its always easy to get level 3 and aim for the transphere right away
If they have the time machine out i do the time machine until they reach me and just aim for the level 3
Idk cause i never play against premades nor have I got ten key rushed badly
Like 3 by the time i reach level 2
Ranked play is out now, people are going to do what surivours gotta do to win even the raider will cop out to rat strat. hopefully dimps and bandi will balance the game soon
I have this problem with the term " rushing ", is it rushing when it's the objective for survivors? DBD had this problem too with " genrushing "
Do we all have to play " nice " with each other when we are trying to beat each other?
If the speed that the objective is being done at is too fast, therefore " rushing " then it just should be balanced.
There will always be "rushers" wether we like it or not. Yeah it feels bad when you as raider get to play only a short match, but that's a possibility when you are in a match.
A way I think " rushing " could be slowed for survivors is getting rid of the key radar, but that's just my idea.
I think you misunderstand, I'm not implying rushers as sweats or "mean." It just happens, sometimes people get lucky and the first crate they open is a key or a gold lvl 3 key radar.
I don't blame survivors for key rushing because it's all RNG. But I will complain about it.
@ironcane I was in a game a few days ago and in 27 SECONDS 3 keys were found and 13 seconds later another key found while the raider was still Guildo 😐
I honestly don't know what can be done to slow down the key rushing at this point
@@ironcane It's not even RNG. It would be nice if it were. The keys and every item have a set spawn. So if you just memorize all the potential items and key spawns, you can make a chart and basically have a level 3 key radar from the first second.
A classic match on dangerous ground
I didn't even know that power unleashed shit was an exploit I've literally lost a really close match because of that fucking shit and survivors playing like this ever since ranked started i haven't had a single raider match were I've been able to have any fun whatsoever.
It's been patched since but it was a thing yeah
@@ironcane that's good but it's shocking how many people were soo fast to use the exploit in the first place.
Yah i noticed when people hide they want to trap you in caves or tight squeeze spots as i tried to find them in the caves and underground and i got stuck. Also damn people in the comments really don't like it when raiders camp uh maybe that's the strats to beat raiders. I mean if i know people are healing others up of course i'll sneak around and camp. As a raider you are a villian remember that you guys nothing is fair.
The current state of this game is garbage and in its worst state ever, yes worse than the November 2022 raider buff patch, I actually want raiders to be as strong as they were in that patch now because survivors have legit too much shit that is basically a “you win” button. Also I want to mention in my last 4 Goku black games all 4 matches I was stuck in level 2 while being keyrushed and horrible luck with civ spawns. The game isn’t fun for me now and I wouldn’t be surprised if I quit within the next few days…
Had a similar raider game last night as Black where I got key rushed like crazy and was forced to camp the spot where the last key spawned.
Was able to take down 2 players and I hated I had to camp their bodies, but had no choice when they fell right where the last key to be planted was.
In the end I did get level 3 once enough players were out, destroyed the escape time machine and then took out the rest of the players before STM could be destroyed due to Zamasu killing the last player off
I won but man, it felt boring playing that way
I bet you still won those 4 Goku Black games.
@forestmanification Win or lose, it's still boring having to stay level 2 knowing that going to level 3 will come to bite one in the ass
@@forestmanificationlost all 4 of those matches actually.
@Ironcane I'm gonna be Honest no it was especially when even tho I did do the LV2 Strat the Survivors are just so good that you might as well take the Risk of Fighting Super Transpheres if anything I think the Super Transpheres got off easy with the Nerfs and should be Nerfed more like have the Ki blast be taking Meter too maybe even have UC start costing Meter but only when in Ultimate Dragon Change like make it so that the Survivors HAVE TO HAAAAAVE TO use it wisely then
"I get Super Transphere I use UC Annoy Raider go Blink Blink with Ki Blast Finish off Raider call him Trash have nice day"
😡🔥
wasn't
You can't fix key rushing. Touching that in any aspect will make the game unplayable for survivors. Goku black is horribly designed he's the best lvl 2 and is not worth going further. Why would you go lvl 3 to give them a super transphere and better supplies.
Literally played for 6 hrs with earthy and all we got was Goku black lvl 2 campers lmao 💀
How did you survive that?!
Dark iron looks like a great arc
2:35 uve queued into a match with a Z5 lvl 100 goku black
I miss the dragon balls at least you gotta find them
the real problem are premades, they are the pivot of this whole situation.
if raider gets stronger only premades will be able to compete
if survivors gets strongers premades will cook even faster
how to solve it!?
%5 dmg reduction on the raider for each person playing in a premade
@Frieza-yg4zp I mean the could make the private lobby system tell the game that each player in said lobby is playing together. Once they get to the match screen the game applies the buff and then the game starts.
I don't know much about programming, but it shouldn't be that hard to implement in theory.
No, add ranked to rate players for how fun they are to play with/against, then segregate all the sweats together. I'd play against that fun Broly player I had anytime if I could.
I barely get to go Rosé because of people like them
I have had 3 games where I had most the dragon balls and the person with the last 2-3 balls wouldn’t give them up and threw/sold the game
AND THEY WERE HIGHER LEVEL AND RANKING!!
That's because some high players/rank think they own the game anda no one else deserves a try
I still can't stand going up this kind of teamwork
That match is typical and it wasn't fun. I feel like that's most goku black games
Goku black his design is terrible for the game Health raider for most of the time that puts you and a more difficult situation for evolving is crazy in my opinion when you evolve it should make quite easier and give you a sense of relief now I can win
Game was never good tbh. Most "fun " I ever had was when ginyu released.
I quite literally had 3 raider games back to back like this and it wasn’t very enjoyable and very boring to play, then ran into a premade with every person had 2 stuns each I quite literally couldn’t do anything but take the L