I can see the issue with hoplites, they were on the decline by this point in history (~270 BCE) and were fairly well overmatched by sword infantry. On the other hand, the reason that they were overmatched was because the hoplite formation really only worked on solid, level ground and enemies go decent at forcing them to fight in broken terrain which opened up the wall. I think that would be something that would be easier to represent in a game like Troy where they did a better job representing the various types of terrain; in Rome 2 they had to brute-force it by just making them not as good. As far as this game, I think the cavalry could have been used far more effectively by the Averni player. Even in the late game where there really wasn't much else to control they were leaving them in prolonged combat with those spear units for a long time after the charge when they should have been cycled before the unit could recover from the impact.
Hoplites are currently being given another look at what exactly they did during battle, especially during the Archaic Age. One growing theory suggests hoplites actually began with a skirmishing function, and then developed into a much more solid shield-wall melee unit much later. Would be interesting to see what Total War could do with skirmishing hoplites.
You can easily mod it yourself to get skirmish hoplites. I gave light hoplite, thureos hoplite, perioikoi hoplite and Persian hoplite 3 iron javelin volleys and they do very well. They can’t throw if they are in phalanx tho.
This battle felt a tad sloppy, but the incredible late game performance by Sparta's elite hoplites and that Gallic hunter play with both top-tier moments.
I can't be sure that it was meant like this in the movie 300, but historically the athenians actually throw Persians emissaries in a ravine with a river at the bottom. For the earth and water thing. And that's pretty cool
The game voice actors all pronounce it "perryoykoy" but its "pei REE key" I was guilty of repeating it for years, first Greek professor laughed when he heard it. Done my best to right the wrongs since. Keep Rome 2 alive my man, Be well.
The big hole in the middle of Sparta in the film represents the well. Herodotus records that the Spartan’s threw the Achaemenid envoys into the well in response to their demands for Earth and water.
@@Rellana1 the Spartan’s actually came to regret their actions and sent Bulis and Sperthias to the Persians as compensation for violating established diplomatic norms.
@@JoshLikesFuzz true ..Also Sparta was a really , REALLY Religious Nation and going against Zeus (who was not only the father but the God of Hospitality s well) was concidered by many a blasphemy that would bring misery and destruction to Sparta
I'll be honest. I didn't see how Sparta could win after their skirmishers got decimated by that ambush, but I guess that teaches me for counting out Spartans.
I wonder why Rome 2 multiplayer is so systematic with the developmet of the battles while the newer games just involve outmicroing the other player in a mosh pit as soon as possible. Is it to avoid the greater ranged damage or does it have to do with the single entity units
When they added flying units and single entity unit in a game, It completely break the sense of battle development. People can just fly their aerial units in and shut down skirmish phase completely, meanwhile single entity unit can just tank multiple attacks like no tomorrow and their strength remain the same while standard units become weaker when they lose unit models. This combined with the spell casting create the mesh that is modern TW multiplayer games
It's mostly to do with single entity units, magic and hero abilities. If you look at older Total War games like Rome 2, Shogun 2, Rome 1, Medieval 2 etc. you can see how much things like formations (phalanx, shield wall, yari wall etc) and outflanking your opponent with rear charges straight up changes a battle. Single entities can tank so so much damage that rear charges become useless. Magic abilities can completely destroy elite units or outflanking charges making strategic play kinda useless. Warhammer multiplayer is literally who can just kill the enemy lord the quickest. If this battle were total war warhammer, those units of Royal spartans would have been annihilated with a magic spell 2 minutes into the battle start or a single spartan warrior entity would kill like half of the Arverni army.
I'll bet the Heroes of Sparta have magnificently smooth, waxed chests beneath that historical-accurate armor of theirs.
You gay bro?
The gallic hunters mastered the art of standing very still.
I can see the issue with hoplites, they were on the decline by this point in history (~270 BCE) and were fairly well overmatched by sword infantry. On the other hand, the reason that they were overmatched was because the hoplite formation really only worked on solid, level ground and enemies go decent at forcing them to fight in broken terrain which opened up the wall. I think that would be something that would be easier to represent in a game like Troy where they did a better job representing the various types of terrain; in Rome 2 they had to brute-force it by just making them not as good.
As far as this game, I think the cavalry could have been used far more effectively by the Averni player. Even in the late game where there really wasn't much else to control they were leaving them in prolonged combat with those spear units for a long time after the charge when they should have been cycled before the unit could recover from the impact.
Hoplites are currently being given another look at what exactly they did during battle, especially during the Archaic Age. One growing theory suggests hoplites actually began with a skirmishing function, and then developed into a much more solid shield-wall melee unit much later.
Would be interesting to see what Total War could do with skirmishing hoplites.
You can easily mod it yourself to get skirmish hoplites. I gave light hoplite, thureos hoplite, perioikoi hoplite and Persian hoplite 3 iron javelin volleys and they do very well. They can’t throw if they are in phalanx tho.
U got Skiritai in Wrath of Sparta
This battle felt a tad sloppy, but the incredible late game performance by Sparta's elite hoplites and that Gallic hunter play with both top-tier moments.
This game never gets old. Same with using Sparta.
Even tho Sparta is a shit faction I still feel OP using them lmao
In siege you flex with Sparta not by killing but by making enemies mad by holding
Great video, got to love the at Spartan action. Seeing them win brings a smile to my face. Well done!
Love the battle vids. I never play multiplayer, but I always use my skirmishers that run out of ammo to flank and melee target enemy skirmishers.
A brutal battle. I was rooting for the spartans and they poked their way to victory.
Oathsworn getting kicked into the hole of nothing!
I can't be sure that it was meant like this in the movie 300, but historically the athenians actually throw Persians emissaries in a ravine with a river at the bottom. For the earth and water thing. And that's pretty cool
The game voice actors all pronounce it "perryoykoy" but its "pei REE key"
I was guilty of repeating it for years, first Greek professor laughed when he heard it. Done my best to right the wrongs since.
Keep Rome 2 alive my man,
Be well.
Great battle! That gallic hunter reveal!
Keep up the great content.
The big hole in the middle of Sparta in the film represents the well. Herodotus records that the Spartan’s threw the Achaemenid envoys into the well in response to their demands for Earth and water.
well,it was Sparta they were threatening. What did they expect to happen? Sparta didn't come badasses by playing nice.
@@Rellana1 the Spartan’s actually came to regret their actions and sent Bulis and Sperthias to the Persians as compensation for violating established diplomatic norms.
@@JoshLikesFuzz true ..Also Sparta was a really , REALLY Religious Nation and going against Zeus (who was not only the father but the God of Hospitality s well) was concidered by many a blasphemy that would bring misery and destruction to Sparta
An advantage you missed about the elite Spartans is expert charge defense.
I'll be honest. I didn't see how Sparta could win after their skirmishers got decimated by that ambush, but I guess that teaches me for counting out Spartans.
Incredible game by both players
@HeirofCarthage TW noob here, Is there anyway to play as Heroes of Sparta in Custom Battles??
I wonder why Rome 2 multiplayer is so systematic with the developmet of the battles while the newer games just involve outmicroing the other player in a mosh pit as soon as possible. Is it to avoid the greater ranged damage or does it have to do with the single entity units
When they added flying units and single entity unit in a game, It completely break the sense of battle development. People can just fly their aerial units in and shut down skirmish phase completely, meanwhile single entity unit can just tank multiple attacks like no tomorrow and their strength remain the same while standard units become weaker when they lose unit models. This combined with the spell casting create the mesh that is modern TW multiplayer games
It's mostly to do with single entity units, magic and hero abilities.
If you look at older Total War games like Rome 2, Shogun 2, Rome 1, Medieval 2 etc. you can see how much things like formations (phalanx, shield wall, yari wall etc) and outflanking your opponent with rear charges straight up changes a battle.
Single entities can tank so so much damage that rear charges become useless. Magic abilities can completely destroy elite units or outflanking charges making strategic play kinda useless. Warhammer multiplayer is literally who can just kill the enemy lord the quickest.
If this battle were total war warhammer, those units of Royal spartans would have been annihilated with a magic spell 2 minutes into the battle start or a single spartan warrior entity would kill like half of the Arverni army.
Did you mean to say heroes of Sparta twice at 1:00 lol
Arverni played choked
Perioukoi spears are rubbish, the periokoi hoplites would do much better job there.
FIrst!