i read 3 greek mythology books... about the same myth
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 29 ก.ย. 2024
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As a greek guy, i really like people taking interest in our mythology, i just wish more people knew the difference between greek mythology and greco-roman mythology, it is not just the names that change, its also some key events that define the ethics of entire eras
Same
Agreed!!! I got my degree in Classical Studies and I have to explain this to people regularly. There are a LOT of similarities between Greek and Roman mythology to be sure, but there are some fundamental differences stemming from the different cultural attitudes between the Greeks and Romans. Therefore, you can't REALLY use the gods' names interchangeably! It's super interesting.
same with norse too !
What I'm hearing is, don't lean on Ovid.
As I said in the main comments. If people only knew what was hidden in those myths . They are highly complex symbolic allegories that contain the entirety of the ancient mystery tradition..
kinda scary how I almost bought all three of these and was wondering which one to read and how they compared and the next day Jack dropped this...stop reading my mind and my TBR pls...
I take Latin in school and we study Greek and Roman mythology, so I always enjoy reading mythological retellings and seeing how different authors interpret and work with the stories and how it compares to what I've learned in school.
i'm here for that glowing, gorgeous skin
In our case, we went on a family trip to Egypt and my father insisted we brush up on Ancient Egypt before leaving and honestly, it helped a little. Please nerd out before vacations. It’s a nice experience.
which books did you read that you recommend?
@@mellowmermaid Oh, nothing too academic. Just a general encyclopaedia on Ancient History by Parragon.
I read Penelopiad for my English degree at contemporary novel course, like 10 years ago, and that was one of my fav books that term. I remember professor tellin us that the books narration is kind of a deconstruction of deconstruction. While Penelope's perspective deconstructs the discourse of the classic myth of Odyssey, the chorus women maids voice deconstructs Penelope's.
Margaret Atwood is always great at taking this sort of approach - she seems very fascinated with the way stories are constructed and in turn many of her books/narrators draw attention to their own construction (e.g. Offred in the Handmaid's Tale)
Oh, that's really interesting... I need to read this!!
@@estherbutton6399 yeah that seems to be a repeating pattern, and she does it quite well 👀👌
Yes i wrote my end of term paper on Margaret Atwood's retelling of the Odyssey, and it was so fascinating to look at the way she works with the narration, as a way to point out how big of a difference a change of perspective does to a story!
I would love to see you rank mythology retellings!! With so many out there it’s hard to know which ones to prioritize
JACK RESPECTFULLY... STOP TRYING TO ADD MORE BOOKS INTO MY TBR 😭
but also im in my greek myth era so you dropping this video at this time makes me incredibly happy aaaahhhh
My absolute fav genre! Growing up I love Greek Mythology. I am glad more people love these kind of stories and more books are getting published!
For anyone seeking an incredible retelling: Til We Have Faces by C.S. Lewis is so powerful. I read it 5 years ago, immediately gave it to a friend to read, it wasn't returned and im STILL thinking about that story. I gotta find another copy
...
Thanks for the recommendation! I put it on my tbr 😊
Leave it to Jack to take a sliver of thought and turn it into a full-fledged analysis . I absolutely love it and am totally here for it.
When Jack posts, you already know it’s a good day
“Silence of the girls” is another one about the women of the Iliad that I’ve been meaning to get to!
I love reading Greek mythology so much ❤
#free_palestine
My dumb American mind just went. "Yeah, Ithaca is a place, it's in NY and it's cold as F&$!". I've literally never heard of any other place with this name and have never even heard of this myth. lol. New Facts!
I am of Greek descent. I have read Classics at university, so I have read some of the myths in the original Greek and Latin. I love the retellings. More TBR on my list now! I can't get enough of your amazing youtube channels!
Yessss me too! I'm American, but I got my degree in Classical Studies. I love checking out different retellings! People always seem surprised by that, because they expect me to get mad at "inaccuracies," but I think "inaccuracy" is a fraught subject and retellings have value regardless, since they get people interested in the source material, which is SO important to Western culture!!
I had this issue with Medusa, where I read Jessie Burtons version which was *chefs kiss* so good and so gorgeous in such a compact book. Then I realised that Natalie Hayne’s Stone Blind exists, and I’m so torn on whether to read it because although I love the story of Medusa I don’t want to blur together my recollections of each piece of work :’)
I haven't read these books, however, I did read Circe. I enjoyed it very much. Thank you for the video.
Kisses from Greece, I am teaching Odyssey at the first year of Junior high schook and Iliad at the second year and they love it, thanks for the suggestions that will give us another point of view❤❤
i think the kind of roman equivalent to these books is called lavinia by ursula k leguin because it’s about lavinia - the woman that aeneas marries after leaving troy and settling in italy. in the aeneid she had no lines, but leguin fleshes out that character and extrapolates the story so well. it is probably one of my favorite books. also a good short story collection of feminist retelling of greco-roman myth is wake, siren: ovid resung by nina maclaughlin
Omg this just reminded me of a book called Loop by Brenda Lozano. Its a story from the perspective of a woman waiting for her boyfriend return from his trip to Spain. Its inspired by The Odyssey, however, it draws heavy influence of Latin American literature. One of the best pieces of work I have read this year.
am i the only one hoping for percy jackson?
As a Greek girl it makes me so happy that you’re interested in Greek mythology and since this trend has been going around I’ve started appreciating it much more too(because studying anything for exams makes it not that great ) Also you’ve made reading the book while being in Ithaca (we call it ithace btw) THE goal !!❤
To have watched Jack with so many different backgrounds and the seeing the background in the videos has kinda finally hit me dammm Jack you are a book tuber now (Finally 😂)
Could you please review some Indian literature such as the 5000 year old epic Mahabharata or romantic Chandrakanta ........ World definitely needs to know about the hidden world of India literature...
Have you read Weight by Jeanette Winterson? It's a retelling of Atlas and Heracles. It's from the same series that gave us Margaret Atwood's The Penelopiad. It's so good. It's also short, about 150 pages. In typical Winterson style, it's insightful, challenging, witty, quirky.
Favourite Greek mythology /recommendations?
4:26 Chitra Banerjee Divakaruni has done this with Draupadi (The Palace of Illusions) and Sita (The Forest of Enchantments).
I think all these Greek retellings are popping up now, cuz all the people who read Percy Jackson as kids are now adults. Like it might be a reach, but like that’s such a coincidence
I recently read 'Girl, Goddess, Queen', retelling of Hades/Persephone story. It had so much potential, wasted by too much bickering lines between hades and persephone.
This video was not a question of if but when. Also, it’s really interesting to see this era of Greek Myth retellings.
Yeah, this is our Renaissance basically 😂
@@ChaosLoveHub Hmmm interesting
Currently obsessed with the Odyssey, Epic the Musical was already making my obsession worse and now I have more to be obsessed with 😂
Man, I wish epic makes it to Broadway and becomes like... Hamilton big. The creator is sooo talented, he totally deserves this.
the background is SLAYING !!!
this makes my 1st year Classics student heart so happy
hi jack! i love your videos andyour reccomendations.. I am a big fan of mythology itself and i woukd like to thank you for all the greek mythology books that talked about.
however it would be nice to see you dive into hindu mythology as well. I am an Indian and I have read my fair share of hindu mythology books and here are two of them that think you would enjoy:-
1) Jaya by Devdutt Pattanaik. This book is like a guide book for people who want to dive into hindu mythoogy. The writing is clean and straight forward and it explains every story from level zero. It talks about the epic war of Mahabharat. And i really adore this book
2) Draupadi: The Sati Series III by Koral Dasgupta. this is a sort of retelling of Mahabharata through the eyes of Draupadi who was the sole wife of the Pandav brothers who were later victorious in the war. It talks a lot of her early life and moral ambiguities which make this interesting
I hope you will take a look at these. And again I loved this video as well
0:38 I don’t think it was a himbo moment. It was a British Tourist Moment.
P.S. Ithaca is also a name of a place in the US East Coast, if I’m not wrong.
Yes. There’s a city (and university) called Ithaca in NY.
the huge full bookshelf behind jack rly is the perfect setting for these videos
I will forever encourage friends to read Natalie Haynes. Her work is always so satisfying to read!!
Wait! Greece is a real place?
Out of the ones you mentioned (not covered) I've only read Circe and I think that it's a beautiful retelling of the original story. I am not sure I'd want to read another version of the same story, but rather would want to read more retellings of other stories in greek mythology ◡̈
The only one of these I’ve read is a thousand ships and I found it a little disappointing. It just felt too straight forward of a retelling. It promised to tell the untold stories of the women but we didn’t get much more than what we already get from the myths.
Natalie Haynes has a nonfiction book called pandora’s jar which I really enjoyed. It’s an analysis of ten women from Greek mythology and how their stories changed over time and through all the different versions and adaptations.
I would have sworn this was a main channel video lol
Gotta read me some Natalie Haynes, it seems!
How is Jack’s skin sooo good though?
Just when I was about to write an article on recommendations of books that are mythological retellings, this video was posted haha
Forget the Roman Empire.
Huh?
Try Till We Have Faces by C. S. Lewis. It is a retelling of Cupid and Psyche. One of my favorite books.
I haven't read these books yet, but I was already thinking about picking up Ithaca - mostly because 'The first fifteen lives of Harry August' and 'The sudden appearance of hope' by Claire North were just exceptionally good! Highly recommend those :)
I really want to go visit Ithaca now!
A thousands ships and Ithaca are my favorite books so beautiful written and details and amazing beautiful ❤
My day is now significantly better, thank you Jack
greek mythology retelling books are the reason I got back into reading I just fell in love with them and they make me want to reread the classics I once read but feel like I didn’t get to appreciate them enough
omg i love greek mythology ❤
can we talk about how beautiful jack's skin is ? sir, drop your skincare routine
JACK, YOU'RE AWESOME! I love Greek mythology!
YOU ROCK JACK! I appreciate you so much most sweetest and kindest and amazing inspiring person 😊
cant believe i came across this video having also gotten obsessed with penelope's myth in summer of 2023!! i read Ithaca (and the sequel) and the Penelopiad and loved them both HOWEVER why does Hera shout 'Oy!' in Ithaca like, she's not British 😭😭😭😭 instantly pulled me out of the atmosphere like why did the editors approve that....
A friend and I are on a constant debate concerning the differences between The Song of Achilles and The Silence of the Girls, both retellings of Homer’s Iliad. One is written from the point of view of Achilles’ alter ego/close friend/lover/we don’t really know, Patroclus. The other is written from the point of view of one of Achilles’ slaves, in the book his sex slave, Briseis. TSOA focuses on Achilles’ and Patroclus’ love story, whilst TSOTG is about women’s lives on the greek camp during the Trojan War. Both are fascinating and incredibly well-written, but they differ in so many aspects (i.g., in TSOA, Achilles doesn’t have sex with Briseis at all, as he is in love with Patroclus). We are now on a quest to discover which of those two retellings is the closest to the actual Iliad, and also to the myths themselves. If anyone knows more about this, we are all ears. But also, in general, it’s super interesting to see how one story can be told in many different ways!!
Very much enjoyed Miller’s Circe, and now have three more books for my reading pile!
jack in light of the percy jackson series being released in december maybe some percy jackson content????
I'm requesting this please some pjo content
Jack, there is a town called Ithaca in the finger lakes region of upstate New York. It is the home of ivy league school, Cornell University. It's a lovely small big town. FYI
STOP,, BC I DID THIS EXACT SAME THING TOO 😭😭 but it was all about the women in the trojan war
I wrote an essay about different eras' perceptions/portrayals of Penelope and what they said about that era's ideas of the perfect wife. I'd argue that Penelope isn't one dimensional in the Odyssey but that's also my 21st century feminism and tendency to read more into women from literature speaking. I mean, as a young queer woman, you're better served by doing that, no?!
I've read some of those, Silence of the Girls was most noteworthy and was dreadful.
as a greek the beginning of this video hurt x
If you only knew what was hidden in those myths you'd never read a retelling for fear a crucial element might be lost.. the entire ancient mystery tradition is hidden within those myths
Love me some Greek myths. Hope you talk about Natalie Haynes she is so great
Thank you for sharing your thoughts about the 3 books. I too was fascinated with Greek mythology in school and how people of that age interpreted the world around them through the various gods they created.
Jack: I didn't know Ithaca was a real place
Me: 😱🤯
i don’t know ithaca was real place either
I would definitely recommend Emily Wilson's translation of the Odyssey...also her piece in the New Yorker about women in the Odyssey, she has a very interesting perspective!
ulysses video when??
5:28 me trying to understand whether Jack said handmaids or hanged maids
I would love more videos on greek mythology ❤️
Love your videos so much Jack ❤
Penelope’s POV in A Thousand Ships made me so mad as it was just her reiterating the Odyssey and I was so disappointed- was expecting so much more. Agree with you that hers was the weakest.
I actually listened to A Thousand Ships (on audio) and could not stand it at all. My gripes were similar to yours, but I had a stronger reaction as I just found it completely baffling that anyone would write in this way or enjoy the writing. Penelope's story was the very antithesis of a feminist retelling. Like you mentioned, everything she says is in relation to her husband's actions (and even addressing him, like a god you would pray to or something); she doesn't have any unique actions or motivations of her own. Then none of the other characters showed up more than once, which meant I had zero motivation to care about them. Perhaps this should have been written as a short story collection (minus Penelope), but I'm not sure if it would have actually succeeded at that either. Finally, I found the author's narration to be terribly boring, and really thought she should have hired another more experienced narrator or just...sounded more excited about her own book? ...haha
I felt bad for my negative reaction upon reaching her final note about the research she did for the book, but I still could not bring myself to give it more than 2/5 stars. XD
Oh this is my topic! I am always interested in these books. I read Circe, Ariadne, Elektra and Daughters of Sparta. I loved them all, except Elektra, which was not as good as the others.
You could do that video with Clytemnestra, too. Daughters of Sparta and Clytemnestra and also Elektra all have her as a main figure.
All the books you have read in this video interest me, too.
A retelling of The Odyssey that I HAVE TO recommend - I just discovered it a couple days ago - is EPIC: The Musical. It's in progress, only the first 10 songs are out, but it's INCREDIBLE. The music is great, the singers are great, and the retelling is super interesting!! Another recommendation (an oldie but a goodie) is O Brother, Where Art Thou? I didn't realize it was The Odyssey the first time I watched it. After reading The Odyssey and discovering the connection, I watched it again and it's SO well done.
I have very mixed feelings about Greek mythological retellings right now, because I actually did my bachelor's degree capstone project on exactly that... long before this was a popular thing!!
So on the one hand, this is TOTALLY up my alley. I LOVE reading different translations and retellings to see where they differ and what's most effective. In my capstone, I argued for the value of retellings, regardless of "accuracy", because it gets people interested in the source material. And we cannot deny the influence that ancient Greek culture has on our modern Western culture, so I think it's really important for people to be aware of the origins of big parts of our culture. "Accuracy" is such a fraught term, too, because there's a big debate between being true to the source material word-for-word, versus making changes that make plot points make more sense to modern readers... which I think can sometimes get the source material's points across better!! For example, I came up with the idea of retelling Sophocles' Antigone as like a 1920s Italian-American mafia story, to better get across how EXTREMELY important loyalty to your "family" is, along with following the orders of the head of your family... thus the major conflict! Plus the way that people of the 1920s/Jazz Age were ignoring the rot in their society and the very real dangers of doing that - the following Great Depression in America, versus the miasma in Thebes. So all very different from the original play, but I hoped the changes would get the ideas at the heart of Antigone across better to modern Western audiences!!
Why I'm upset about this sudden popularity is that I did that capstone with the intention of actually writing and publishing my own retelling. If I had actually followed through, I could have published my retelling at the very start of this surge in interest. And maybe I could have done well by that. Tragic. Curse you, chronic illness!!
I love Greek mythology and the contemporary retellings are just wonderful. We do have similar taste in books. Are you, by any chance, single?
actually you know, have u heard about this musical called Epic? its abt odysseus and dawg its SO brilliant!!
My two (three really bc one of them is a duology) favorite books that retell myths are the King Must Die which is a retelling of Theseus and Nobody's Princess/Nobody's Prize which centers on Helen of Troy before she became Helen of Troy...when she was Helen of Sparta. They were AMAZING I absolutely adore both of them
I read The Penelopiad for an independent study in high school and it was really my first foray into (feminist) Greek myth retellings/reimaginings. Recently, Girl Goddess Queen (a completely good time) has reignited my love and interest for this genre.
If you love the Greek myth retellings you will probably like The Wolf Den by Elodie Harper, it follows a slave prostitute and her life in Pompei (fiction), it is probably my all time favourite trilogy.
I have a theory a lot of us who grew up reading percy jackson are now reading these greek myths retellings…
Coincidentally just finished reading the Iliad and the Odyssey specifically so I could read Ithaca (I love Claire North).
Whilst I do understand what you are getting at w.r.t the inconsistent narration, I really think it works. Hera narrating the entire novel but sometimes being the classic ‘objective’ omniscient narrator and other times being an active participant with opinions and agency for me highlights the ways in which Gods work in Greek mythology (particularly in the Iliad and Odyssey).
Oftentimes the Gods are simply observers from above, watching with passing interest, if and when they can be bothered to watch at all. Greek gods would normally only get involved in events that were deemed to be significantly consequential or where they have a vested interest in the outcome. To me this is what the narrative voice is trying to accomplish. Hera is mostly a passive observer, often flitting between conversations trying to get the gist of what is going on and then flitting away to someone else.
Hera as the narrator really becomes present when the events of the novel become directly tied to something that Hera is invested in, namely her wish for Queens to still rule in Greece, or otherwise has strong opinions on. It’s similar to how the narrators for the Iliad and the Odyssey are, ostensibly, the muses talking through the bard. The Gods are both invoked as being objective observers “you know this story is true because it is not me some guy telling you, but it is coming from the gods through me” even though the Iliad and Odyssey quite clearly show Gods being capable of having agency and opinions.
For me the tension of the narrative voice of Ithaca, is in some sense an unspoken tension within Greek mythology itself. That’s why it works for me at least.
I've read most of Margret Atwood's books including that that one.
ooo adding Ithaca and The Penelopiad to my tbr, these sound like refreshing reads from a genre I'm a little bit burnt out by atm
Omg new jack video STOP EVERYTHING!!!
Your Ithaca comment. Literally same 😂 I knew what you were going to say before you said it!
Greek retellings and myths will always be a part of western culture so I’m not surprised that Greek myths are being retold again. Still I’ll enjoy the new perspectives and stories that are coming out about them ❤
Jack, hence you are a big greek mythology fan, I guess you must‘ve loved the Percy Jackson books as a teenager? 😍
Jack it might make you feel better to know that this video is where I have learned that Ithaca is real. You aren't alone lmao - himbo solidarity
I have A Thousand Ships on my tbr because I enjoyed Ariadne by Jennifer Saint. It was a couple of years ago when I read it but I am sure it references Penelope in there as well though it is mainly about Ariadne
is there a reason why there’s been so many greek mythology retellings from the perspective of women in recent years? ive really enjoyed some but it seems to be quite an oversaturated subgenre now
0:39 us moment jack
I study classics at uni! I think classical reception (looking at classics in today's world) is such a fascinating field, especially when it comes to mythical retelling- how do they each handle the myth and why! Penelope as a character is very interesting. You mentioned hera too - although I think she is quite misunderstood as a character!
The bookshelf looks good, but it's still not properly aligned 🥺
no ur so valid for thinking ithaca wasnt real because i really thought it was just a common setting too
Well Hera was the protector of marriage and there are multiple stories where she goes ballistic on men assaulting married women
Please listen to Epic the Musical. You won't regret it ~