The Armstrong Whitworth Albemarle; Wooden Nonwonder
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I love that after 30 plus years of learning about military aircraft, I'm still finding types I've never heard of. Thank you!
Yep - Totally so
My grandfather worked at Armstrong Whitworth in the test crew. And grandma told a story of farming out construction of part of an Albermarle to a locomotive carriage works. After a couple of circuits, the aircraft design team gave it a thumbs up, to which the proud carriage works rep - who apparently was used to working to locomotive tolerances - said “yep, and there’s nothing more than an inch out over the whole structure…” - after which the air crew was told to get the plane down on the ground sharpish! 😂 funnily enough, my other grandfather was a plywood chippy working at Dehavilland on the mossie and later on the vampire prototypes - all the “wooden wonders” together!
Never mention the Albemarle to an MG enthusiast. MG's founder and manager, Cecil Kimber, was suddenly fired in 1941 because he had secured a contract for the MG factory at Abingdon to built the Albemarle's nose section. The plant was virtually idle at the time, and the workforce had all the relevant skills, so this made perfect sense. And his dismissal for it [or rather, his being ordered to tender his resignation] after twenty years service was clearly ridiculous. The official explanation was that Kimber had secured the contract without authorisation from the Nuffield board of directors. The real reason seems to have been a combination of jealousy of his success among other Nuffield executives, and Lady Nuffield somehow getting the idea that Kimber had been 'carrying on' with a married woman, and nagging her husband to sack him. The concensus among MG historians has always been that their relationship was entirely proper until after her divorce came through, and that Lady Nuffield had been fed malicious gossip by somebody who wanted Kimber's job.
An offshoot of the Albemarle story as obscure as it is fascinating
Its those sort of strange snippets which were it not for platforms like this would soon be lost to history
I haven’t forgotten that Cecil was brilliant. M
Back then employees rights were virtually nonexistent and sacking him they would just do it, but forcing them to resign was easier for the other executives and would not lead to awkward questions being asked about why they were sacked, even in that era the newspapers loved a good old bit of “gossip” and “mudslinging” that would increase their circulation and would not harm their bank balance. I can’t imagine how hurt Cecil Kimber would have felt, being ousted from the company he created and had devoted his working life to must have been a nightmare, and all because of some brown-nosing, jumped up, corporate ladder climbing snitch, and the directors took the word of the person who had informed the board over the word of the man who literally created the company, and therefore made it possible for them to be part of the management team, should have been haunted by their actions for the rest of their lives.
@@allandavis8201 The Curse of Kimber explains the fate of Nuffield/BMC/British Leyland/+ ?
kinda typical ain't it
17 lost on operations, 81 in accidents....stark reminder of how risky flying was, even without taking enemy fire.
It still is, we just mitigate it with heaps of technology :D
. Which makes it less risky these days. In other words, flying is much less risky these days.
But I get your point, we humans are really not adapted to flying, and our flying machines are inherently dangerous contraptions.
AFAIK
10% of German fighter loses during the Battle of Britain , were landing accidents
Surprisingly enough jet engine aircraft are safer (Apart from prototypes) but propeller aircraft were quite dangerous, the number of accidents (Mainly due to wartime shortage of training) were significant, probably in excess of 10% of deaths in operations.
To mine eyes it looks like an alternate universe North American B-25. Dual radial engines, mid-wing, tricycle gear, twin tail.
Why all the glass in the tail?
Another fascinatingly obscure aircraft brought to light, thanks!
Re: The all glass tail.
Where else would you plant the geraniums? Not the nose, that’s for the roses.
@@Sherwoody So the Albemarle is not your garden variety warplane I suppose.
@@Nedski42YT😂 🍻cheers
I am from Uruguay, 85 , no pilot, but I do agree sir: Albermarle looks like an American B-25 ! There is a B-25 on static display here at the Col. Meregalli Aviation Museum adjoining Carrasco Intl Airport, which if you ever come to MVD is really worth visiting.
People forget the Westland Wensleydale, a secret Barnes Wallis project only declassified in 1992 which utilised the nations strategic wool reserve and our pre-existing army of highly-skilled schoolgirls and mothers, to knit a medium range bomber.
i heard it was originally proposed to use Swiss cheese ; but with war coming they felt an indigenous supply should be found but Wensleydale couldn't be supplied with suitable holes.
I've often thought that the majority of Supermarine projects (with the one notable exception) owed much to macrame work.
... outstanding flight performance, but failed due to unreliable engines.
Don't forget the proposal of a floating ice berg as an aircraft carrier.
@@phann860 But that was a real proposal (and apparently one judged feasible). Perhaps it never got built because you can't get the wood, you know.
Glad to see you cover this type. First British one with a tri cycle undercarriage too , I read, decades ago.
Just a brief correction: the Albemarle originated as a Bristol design, the Type 155. It was passed to Armstrong Whitworth to ease the burden on the Bristol design team; hence the planned construction at a Gloster factory, as both Glosters and AW were part of the Hawker Siddeley group of companies. Otherwise, Ed, thanks for a great summary of the Albemarle's tale of woe!
Makes sense. It looks like a relative of the Blenheim
The first thing I noticed was the resemblance to Blenheim and Beaufort, so I had wondered why that was
@@MisterOcclusion7:05 looks kinda Mitchellish as well
@@user-do5zk6jh1kand followed the Blenheim’s naming after a medieval Earldom
Err, not according to Tony Buttler in Chapter 5 of British Secret Projects - Fighters and Bombers 1935-1950. The Armstrong-Whitworth AW.41 was not based on the Bristol Type 155, which came in 2 versions, a conventional tail-dragger and one with a tricycle undercarriage, but all their own work. The original specifi action they were built to was the B.9/38 but after mock up conferences 2 new specification were issued B.17/38 for the Bristol Type 155 and B.18/38 for the Armstrong-Whitworth AW.41 with a minimum cruise speed of 250mph and a bombload of 4,000lb an increase from the original specification of 1,500.bbombload.
A number of years ago I read a book that had a section on the Albemarle that included a quote from the flight testing reports: "A remarkably average aircraft. No virtues. No vices."
Reminds me of a Churchill quip.
President Truman: “Clement Attlee came to see me the other day. He struck me as a very modest man.”
Churchill: “He has much to be modest about.”
@@donjones4719
But much to be proud of
regarding his screwing 🇬🇧
& his services to the soviets.
February 1946. It was good enough to make it to the end of the war.
In the end, most of us are albemarles at heart.
I can recall when I was about seven- reading one of those WW2 comics One pilot in one story was expressing his horror that he was going to fly an Albemarle. I recall thinking-"What's that?" This aircraft had not ever featured in my reading- it was clearly- like the Balliol- a "plane that time forgot".
Concrete has a notable history in UK aircraft with the Tornado ADV using a block of concrete dubbed"Blue circle"RADAR until the actual RADAR was available
The Brits also tried Led Zeppelins, but Goodyear beat them to it by incorporating them into the light-up advertising sign.
@@joshuabessire9169 The Fairey Battle was just a rip-off copy of the Pixie Punchup.
😁
My head teacher at primary school was a navigator in ww2. He flew in aircraft i had never heard of . Whitleys, Bothas, and the Albermarle among many other types.
Hamilton's War Plane Museum's Dakota just flew directly over my house, here in Niagara, 5 minutes ago, can't wait for Vera to pass by!
I’ve been in Vera and Hot Gen. Great experience.
Hopefully we'll see C-GVRA, the Mynarski memorial Lancaster, at the CNE next weekend. I too have spent a few unforgettable hours alone with Vera. Lost the barrel of my Very Pistol somewhere on the flight deck. I think it rolled under the floorboards. Always worried it might end up jamming a linkage, but she's been halfway round the world since then.
I love learning about these relatively unknown and oddball aircraft.....more of these please.
I did know of this aircraft Ed. But only a tiny fraction of the detail you've uncovered , and the accident rate was horrific !!! Thankyou Ed
Same here. I knew it existed, but knew nothing about it.
You have done it again, Ed.
I knew nothing of this aircraft before this video.
Thank you.
☮
You are using a antichristian symbol in your comment. Lord Jesus is real.
I saw a picture of the
AW Albermarle in the American
aviation magazine FLYING
May 1944 issue, in its section
of rare planes.
I haste to say that it was in 1962.
The Scottish base at which the Soviet crews were doing their training on the Albemarle was RAF Errol, a station on the banks of the River Tay about half way between Dundee and Perth.
The real reason the Soviets wanted the Albermarle (They actually asked for it by name) was that they wanted to examine the sleeve-valve technology of the Hercules engines.
Source: Victor Kotelnikov.
As you say Ed, a pretty good looking aircraft. It was almost exactly the same size and performance as a contemporary He111, only that aircraft first flew in 1935.
Thanks for this video, Ed. I'd never heard of the Ambemarle. While the aircraft was far from a world-beater, the plane's history is genuinely fascinating for the insight it provides into confused state of the pre-war British aero industry and the early war years.
Don't think of the Mosquito as one of the last wooden aircraft, but one of the first composite ones.
If there's a "strangely lovable" military aircraft list, it might include the Albermarle.
7:30 that is the most insane story to happen, alongside the cut off rear portion of a b17 and that one guy who survived without a parachute
You mean this guy?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicholas_Alkemade
@@reynard61 yup exactly
Nice. With the H-tail and invasion stripes, it’s a pretty nice looking aircraft. Sort of a low-rent B-25. I like it. But then I’m weird-to me the Tu-2 is one of the prettiest airplanes ever.
Well. It does look very British. That's something.
I have nothing but utmost respect for military personnel that "get by with what they got".
Perhaps a rule could be derived: if you want an emergency stopgap type, start with an engine which is already in service.
I like that you made a Nigel Tufnel joke
I seem to recall that the Albemarle was initially a Bristol design (hence the similarity of the front fuselarge to the Blenheim and Beaufort) but was transferred to AW due to the contract and development committments at Bristol.
Very interesting, this is a nice looking aircraft it's too bad it didn't live up to its design potential. It kind of reminds me of a British version of the B-25 Billy Mitchell
First time hearing of this type, and the wartime materials limitations dictating a steel framed plane.
Thank you for sheding light on this story.
Another great episode, and another unfamiliar aircraft with lots of interest.
You will forgive me for saying this, Ed, but as a result of the influence of your channel, I've started to adopt the view that the RAF was rather more fond of their under-performing aircraft than they should have been, and that there were more inferior types fielded by the British than by any other allied nation...
Except the French, of course.
I say this as a life-long fan of British WWII military aviation. The achievements of the Hurricane, the Spitfire, Lancaster, Mosquito, Tempest and Meteor...to name just a few, are beyond question. But I do have the distinct impression of a certain mentality present among the boards, or committees that made the critical decisions on these aircraft, somewhat analogous to the mentality of the Royal Navy during the age of sail. It goes something like this:
"Here's our design."
"It looks somewhat inferior."
"It is, but you wanted something cheap that could be built quickly."
"That's right. Well, very good. We'll take it."
During the Age of Sail, French (and later Amercian) warship-prizes were considered highly desirable, because they were frequently faster and more seaworthy than their British counterparts. The British captains knew this, and relished the prospect of refitting a captured warship for their own command.
It wasn't universally true, of course, but it was frequently true. I wonder if this mentality carried over into the RAF in the 20th Century.
At any rate, great content! Thanks again!
5:50 The way Nash paused, I was half-expecting him to say "four-thousand five hundred pounds...of WOOD!"
It’s the wood that makes it good.
@@Sherwoody "If plane does not fly, you can use it to heat your stove!"
Rex? Wrong channel.
@@ollimoore Oops, fixed!
Sees an New Ed Nash video, settles down , Thank you 👍
Interesting selection of aircraft behind the Stirling at 12:35.
Gloster Meteor only one I recognize.
Excellent video, I always wondered about the history fo the Albermale. Thanks for this
The aircraft appearing several times with Invasion Stripes towed a Horsa glider, Chalk 35, on operation Tonga on D Day. THE horsa was flown by S Sgt C H Hopgood and Sjt D Phillips. Hit by flak crossing the coast the glider crashed into a wood killing all the pilots and all but one of the airborne aboard. RIP
Nice looking plane
A very balanced view of a limited aircraft.
I think one think could be said about the Albemarle: it DID the transport job, and it did it flying faster than the C-47.
Thank you Mr. Nash. Who knows maybe IKEA guy got the idea for his modular bookshelf’s. From this modular British bomber. - not.
Never heard of this plane before, even despite its role in Market Garden. The C-47 however were in much larger numbers so that's the plane normally associated with this mission.
But the idea of getting furniture manufacturers and coach builders in airplane construction was somehow a good one.
I wonder what would have happened if they had dropped that "engine pod" feature earlier and completed the design before the war started? One problem with these "reserve designs" seems to be that they are intended to be cheap and easy but usualy somebody adds a few more exotic features that are well intended but in the end add complexity far beyond anyone is willing to pay for.
I also wonder what would have happened if they had designed it as a dedicated transport from the start or nearly so.
Thanks for covering one type I had read a little about (being a failure at it’s designed role, but its main use was for something different) but I didn’t know about the concrete issue etc!
Love your channel Ed.
The testing story at 07:00 is astonishing and literally incredible but I 100% believe you!
When I read it I had to include it.
I'd never heard of this one before and it looks rather like Blenheim and Beaufort had a child!
As soon as I start thinking that I have heard about all of the funny little light/medium British WW2 bombers, another one pops up.
Great Video, Ed! I Love Learning About Aviation History. Thank You. (Like #847)
"Mummy, I want a B-25."
"We have B-25 at home."
B-25 at home...
It bears a passing resemblance to the B25 Mitchell...I'd have just ordered more of those.
Even with Lend Lease, it was an uncertain supply until the start of 1942 and the USAAF wanted them too. By that point, it probably made more sense to make the Albemarle for transport to keep B-25s for bombing.
Interesting fact is that De Havilland had some experience in the stressed-skin all-metal aircraft production in the form of the De Havilland DH.95 Flamingo.
A familiar story:
Government orders a backup aircraft.
It's a lower priority so it can't get a good engine. The government assigns an engine in development. Said engine runs into problems and delays. Plane ends up delayed - so delayed it's obsolescent by the time it's produced. The government complains about the late delivery and blames the aircraft company.
One thing I wondered about is fabrics. Since WW2 we have developed loads of new and different kinds of fabric and surely some among them should be at least _interesting_ for aviation. Not perhaps for big transport and passenger planes, not for high performance military machines. But for lesser stuff... I dunno. Perhaps I just want to suggest a couple of video's not aimed at specific craft, but at specific materials.
Power egg was a good idea like the "powerpack" concept. Just took em a while to prefect it.
A lesser known fact about the Mosquito was that it was primarily made out of wood to save strategically important steel and aluminium.
Great story & video 👏
Ersatz ..good word . Nice to hear it. 🌝
To be fair, if the Albemarle had entered service as planned in 1940, it would have been a pretty average, medium bomber. It was only the design and testing issues that slowed down its introduciton until it was obsolete.
As a dedicated transport, the British had a rather nice design on hand: The Bristol Bombay. Stripped of the bomber equipment it carried due to the original demand for a multirole aircraft and placed in mass production as early as possible, it could have played a much bigger role than it did.
The original requirement included being used as a maritime patrol bomber. If it had been available in 1940 it would indeed have been very welcome in that role. More capable, faster bombers could be reserved for use over land in contested air space.
Thanks for sharing 👍
Looks a bit like a Bristol Blenheim/Beaufort around the front end.., and then when viewed on tricycle landing gear, you get Douglas Boston / B25 Mitchell vibes ?? ;)
Some of the parts for the Albemarle were manufactured by MG Cars in Abingdon.
While on the subject of reconaissance aircraft, can I suggest the Blackburn Botha for a future edition of Forgotten Aircraft? My old grandad worked on them at Middleton St George (now Teesside Airport) before speaking out of turn to the station commander and upsetting the Boss so much that Grandad went from being able to cycle to work to being posted off to Burma. Anyway, not much positive is ever said about the Botha, but I bet you can find something Ed.
There is nothing good to be said of the Botha.
'Access to the aircraft is difficult. It should be made impossible' is a quote often attributed to a flight test of the type.
Something positive about the Botha for you: the Botha made the Battle look good.
@@neiloflongbeck5705 The Battle flew well. It was unsuitable for combated but it made a good trainer. The Botha couldn't even do that.
The Botha flew badly and after it was found to be unsuitable for combat was used as a trainer too. Presumably to show the noob cadets what a steep learning curve looked like*.
*The rapidly approaching ground/sea.
@chrishartley4553 that was part of the joke. I'd explain it, but like the new roof, it would go over your head.
@@neiloflongbeck5705 I misread.
No need to be a jerk about it.
Using the observer as a spin recovery chute is a painfully British thing to do 😅
Never knew, interesting
Now we know why the British loved their Douglas A-20 Havocs so much; it was everything the Albelmarle should have been....
why does nobody ever mention nor include the Bell XP-77 when talking about wooden airplanes? Even the US was thinking about aircraft made from non-strategic materials.
7:06 most insane story ive heard on this channel
love your vids 👍👍
I found a certain resemblance between the Albermarle and the B-25.
And I agree: it looks pretty nice. Too bad it wasn't a success....
Wood and resin is the 1940s equivalent of carbon fibre. Looking at the F18 today, I see an aircraft with a lot of composites, 2 engine and multi role fighter
For a transport, de Havilland had some decent options in 1938.
Flamingo. One of the most gorgeous planes ever.
Re the Soviets and the Albermarle, they had their own license built DC-3 version, the LS-2 in production since before the war. I guess they were hoping on getting more Douglas types that way as Li-2 production wasn't top priority after the german invasion but instead got Albermarles...
& I thought that the sovs’ve
always been masters of autarkic JUCHE.
Interesting, well-made video about a,somewhat rareity. I dont understand some of the comparisons e.g. with the B25, different as chalk and cheese.
You know of course that the mosquito was made out of wood, right?
That's nice, but will you PLEASE light the citronella candle?
It was indeed made of wood dontcha know
Needs a turret ... Oh! wait ! :D What heck was that tail glass section setup ? tail gunner ? or something else.
I would guess, as most were used for paratroopers and glider tugging, it was to allow for visual checks with the glider pilot. Only a guess mind.
Excellent question. Those transparent sections were present in the design right from the start when it was designed as a bomber, long before it was considered for transport duties. According to Oliver Tapper's book "Armstrong Whitworth Aircraft since 1913" - "In order to coordinate the defensive fire, it was proposed that a fire-controller should be carried, and this was the reason for the extensive transparent areas at the rear of the fuselage." - Because the dorsal (top) turret had no view of the bottom hemisphere and the ventral (bottom) retractable "dustbin" turret had no view of the upper hemisphere the "fire controller" would have given a running commentary of where enemy fighters were approaching from so that the turrets could be rotated to engage them when they came into view. However, there is another possibility, the ventral dustbin turret was located very far back in the fuselage, only just in front of where the transparencies ended. The twin guns of the ventral turret were located in the floor of the turret and there is a distinct possibility they would have protruded slightly, even when the turret was retracted into the fuselage. Thus the gunner, sitting in the fully retracted turret, could still have opened fire on enemy fighters approaching from the rear, looking out through the transparent rear of the aircraft. So he would not need to extend the turret and slow the Albemarle down because of the extra drag. No definitive diagrams of the ventral turret installation have been found.
@@johndell3642 Well, well. Not what I would have even considered.
Spin recovery procedure was a bit extreme.
Wood has now been replaced with carbon composite materials. 🙂
Subtext on the overlooked importance of logistics.
The first time that I saw pictures of it, I thought "Oh! It's a Mitchell". Nope!
The problem with high utilisation of wood was burning.. Italy suffered badly due to this and mosquito crew were very keen to bail out as soon as any fire was noted..
Has an uncanny resemblance to a B-25. On different note as to the supply of transport AC, as sailors say, "Any port in a storm".
Excellent Ed. How did the pilots see to the side ?
The plane had all Witworth hardware, requiring the mechanics to have a dedicated tool set to maintain it.
Nice reference. To 11
Why was the tail end of the Albemarle's fuselage glassed in?
Hi. So sad, oh dear, never mind. Cheers, P.R.
I have a great idea! Design me an aircraft around this wonderful new engine! It is absolutely guaranteed to be ready in time.
(Except it never is.)
Poor old Armstrong Whitworth. Always the also-ran!
Huh, fly by wire with a chunk of concrete, neat
Far far worse was the Blackburn Botha. Who's asking Airfix for a model of that.? The Albemarle is like Armstrong Whitworth's answer to the B-25 Mitchell.
Always thought this looked like a slightly "off" B25.
The outcome of the mating of a Blenheim and a Mitchell?
It’s not so unusual when you remind them MTB boats too, were made from wood
In how many outtakes did Ed accidentally say Marble? Asking for a cousin’s friend’s ex-roommate.
We take for granted how available aluminum (aluminium) is today. Extracting it from Bauxite ore uses a massive amount of electricity.
Well if the Mosi stepped it up to 11, the Zero had 17 in the open the whole time.
How thick are those wings?
Do you sell merchandise ?
Top hole, as usual.
👿☘
Better at least than the Botha?