0:40 "One thousand Kellicams... Closing." For some reason, that line always give me chills, like this is about to really happen. One of the best, most tense moments in the entire Star Trek saga.
I thought he was a great Klingon to be honest, especially before they had really fleshed out the characters like they did in TNG. He had a lot of charisma as a Klingon commander.
Doug M I always liked this exchange... Kruge: Surrender your vessel. Kirk: All right, damn you, all right. Please give me a minute to inform my crew. Kruge: I give _two_ minutes for you and your gallant crew. Even an evil bastard like Kruge was willing to show a little mercy as well as respect to his enemies. Too bad he made a huge mistake by doing that, because it allowed Kirk enough time to set the Enterprise to self-destruct.
That's the Klingon, ULTIMATE Version of the WHOOPEE Cushion ! One of my other Trekkie friends actually suggested it, to the First N.Y. , Star Trek, fan Newsletter. NEVER thought any writers, would use the idea. Luckily for him, it made it into a movie, just before he passed away, from Hemophilia complications.
@@natalieschannel7675 I never made the link. Loved Voyage home as a kid. This ship had a wicked stand off with a Whaling ship a final victory if you will.
Fun Fact: the term 'Bird of Prey' was originally reserved for Romulan ships. In an early draft of the script for Star Trek III, the Klingons actually steal a Romulan ship with a cloaking device to go find Genesis. However, the screen writers felt this would make the plot too convoluted, so they removed that portion. But the name for the ship, 'Bird of Prey' stuck. Henceforth, Birds of Prey would be Klingon ships from that point forward. :-)
Not to mention the fact that during the TOS years, the Romulans and Klingons had a mutual defense treaty against the Federation going on at the time, so much so that they gave Klingon D7 battlecruisers to the Romulans, while off-camera, Roddenberry acknowledged that the Klingons got Romulan cloaking devices for their own use--and quite possibly a few Romulan ships in exchange. There would have been no logical reason for Kruge to steal a Romulan ship, even if their alliance with each other soured since then. I'm so glad they never went with that daft draft idea.
I saw this in theaters with my younger brother and my Dad. I was 8 years old at the time, and this scene blew me away, it was so epic watching these massive ships on the big screen fighting in space. I remember wishing the battle lasted longer. And I will never forget that green sheen on the bird of prey, which you really never see again on BOP's in successive films; they tend to look brownish-green or muted green. But this one looked like it just stepped off the assembly line. :)
I think had the Enterprise had a full crew, they might have defeated Kruge but since they stole the Enterprise, there was no way they could win. I think it was Kruge's intention to provoke the Federation into a war, since he thought of the Genesis device as a weapon.
If the Enterprise was at full crew and undamaged from her encounter with Khan, The Enterprise would have easily squashed the Bird of Prey. Kruge himself is astonished that the Enterprise hasn't destroyed them after he returned fire because Enterprise outguns his ship 10 to 1.
You can't commit an "act of war" against a renegade. If Kruge's was (a) inside Federation space without the permission of the Federation Council or (b) committing acts of aggression without the permission of his own government, then there was no exchange of hostilities between the greater powers - just two renegades fighting it out for control of Genesis.
McCoy was referring to Kirk's decision to leave the Enterprise's shields down. Kirk was probably worried that if he raised his shields it would alert the cloaked shipped that they were aware of their presence. He baited them into attacking so he could strike before the bird of prey had a chance to raise their shields.
+fireupontheearth back in the TOS and TMP eras ships supposedly couldn't fire through their own shields. Kind of like how early aircraft couldn't fire through their own propellers until the synchronizing mechanism was developed. Supposedly they'd worked through this problem by the TNG era.
Actually the Enterprise was in good condition, in the monologue at the at the beginning of the film, Kirk reports that most of the battle damage from their battle with Khan had been repaired, most of the damage you see on the hull is just superficial marks that could not be fixed unless in spacedock. If the Enterprise had a full crew on board they probably would have beaten the Bird of Prey without to much trouble, the automated system just overloaded and shorted out rendering them helpless.
I take it you are referring to the extra damage on the Enterprise from the additional torpedo holes on the saucer to the damage to the starboard side of Engineering and the nacelles?
Kirk should have unloaded everything the Enterprise had on that Bird Of Prey and destroyed it completely. Yet, at the same time, perhaps only two torpedoes were loaded into the one working launcher. Still, there are the phasers.
Exactly. Look at what those same torpedos did to the Reliant: destroyed a weapons pod and blew off a warp nacelle. Damage to a smaller, unsheilded Bird of Prey? None. It was still able to fight, warp capable, and able to withstand the gravitational stress of landing on Vulcan. No discernible damage whatsoever, except for the dead ship’s mascot.
@@christopherflowers6583 "the previous damage the phasers are still offline" They possibly did. As Scotty said "I didn't expect to take us into combat, you know." Right after they fired, Chekov found he couldn't raise the shields.
@@sheriff0017 so? As far as the phasers, and basically the entire ship, it was all basically running on automatic. The automation center overloaded after firing Torps. And only after the BoP fired back the enterprise was disabled. So of course then couldn't fire phasers then.
Kirk is probably following basic Federation protocol. The Constitution Class starship dramatically outclassed the Bird of Prey, so under normal circumstances, the Enterprise could just apply enough force to disable the Bird of Prey without destroying her and be relatively safe in doing so. Kirk would have been trained against wantonly destroying a ship needlessly. The only problem with this situation was that, without a crew and relying on the automation system, the Enterprise couldn't raise her shields.
You also have to keep mind that all Kirk knows at this point is 1. There's a clocked enemy ship 2. The USS Grissom is missing when it should be monitoring Genesis. Kirk did not want to destroy the Bird of Prey in case of the possibility that the USS Grissom crew were being held hostage on the Bird of Prey.
MASSEFFECTfan101 And they got one right back,p. Then, the Klingon commander called Kirk’s bluff, which ended up costing Kirk both his son and his ship. So, not exactly an unalloyed success.
Uh, no. Kruge had provoked war. He was in Federation space, had destroyed Grissom, and I think Kirk was very rapidly aware of why Grissom wasn't answering hails. The moment he saw the distortion on screen he knew he was flying into a trap. The Enterprise was in no condition to fight a prolonged battle, even with a Bird of Prey. Fully crewed? Maybe, but as it stood, The Enterprise was on her last legs, and Kirk needed to act fast.
I've watched the film since I was six years old. I know it quite well. Kirk had two pieces of information. No response from Grissom, and a CLOAKED ship. There are two powers that the UFP has had prlonged engagements with. Klingons, and Romulans. He knows they would be interested in getting their hands on Genesis, or it's creators. Not to mention there is no guarantee that the shields would have held. The Enterprise was in very bad shape. It wasn't a risk he was willing to take.
No. McCoy was indicating that the Klingon bop shields are down while it is cloaked giving them a brief opportunity to hit it while the shileds were still not up.
+Corey Curtiss No, they were actually right. Kirk knew the Enterprise was under powered and ill prepared. He was hoping to glass jaw the enemy vessel with all the power in the weapons and not spreading it out over other systems.
Am I remembering an extended version of this scene shown on network TV? One where Kirk says to Scott something like "Ready photon torpedoes. Target the center of that distortion field." Or is it from the novelization, which I haven't read in decades?
"Kirk committed an unprovoked act of war, he didn't know Kruge had gone renegade. He didn't even know if it was the Klingons! The correct command choice is to de-escalate the situation. Raising the shields tips their hand that the Scout ship had been detected. Actually there was a good chance that Kruge would of retreated in that scenario." He didn't commit 'an unprovoked act of war', they detected an energy surge that they guessed was a cloaked ship. Kirk fired first but this was after they saw the BoP decloak and arm weapons. Remember they are in Federation space and this is before the peace treaty with the Klingons. So an enemy ship decloaks right in front of them in their own space and arms weapons, ofc they are going to fire on it. A Klingon ship being in Federation space is more an act of war than Kirk firing first. As for Kruge retreating, unlikely Klingon behaviour. Kruge himself (after the shot that disables the Enterprise) wonders why they don't destroy him as 'they out-gun us 10 to 1' so he knew he was engaging a much more powerful ship and there was a very good chance they would lose. It's unlikely the shields being up would have deterred him.
Really, you think so, even though he was giving orders to attack, and decloaked his ship to launch torpedos, which were being armed when he fired, he only fired after the torpedos were being armed, they made the first move to arm them, and back in this universe, the klingons never retreated from any battle.
It's always interesting to me how variable the effect of Star Trek weaponry is. By the details we get in the tech manuals and other "official" sources of lore/canon, one torpedo should obliterate either ship with the shields down. Yet we see the BOP tank 2 torps and return fire, and the Enterprise tank 1 with little effect (the automation system was already damaged, leaving them helpless before the torp was ever fired).
enterprise was only automated to use warp drive thats it it wasnt crewed or fully repaired or ready for battle it lucky it had few torpedos loaded. remember bird of prey shot out automated center knocking ship right out. if fully crewed that would be different.
Errrr no, the shields failed to raise after they fired because the automatic systems were overwhelmed. The logical thing to do was try and raise the shields, they had worked out it was a Scout ship a vessel that has no capability to punch through their shields. Raising the shields would show the cloaked ship that it had been detected and as Kruge said the Enterprise out gunned him ten to one! It would of given more options to Kirk in respect of bargaining. Kirk made the wrong choice.
And I never understood why the only time Kirk ever asked for standard room lights after Red Alert was in the first movie. A red-lit bridge cannot be good for your nerves.
This was a serious mistake by Kirk, he didn't know if it was Romulans or Klingons two races that the Federation were not at war with at the time. He should of raised shields to de-escalate the situation.
Ok, today's filmmakers please pay attention to the battle scenes in this film, Star Trek II and Star Trek VI, these are HUGE ships, they weigh hundreds of thousands of tons in their concept design, they don't move like sports cars. In these movies the ships move as they're supposed to, they can maneuver but not with lightning like speed like in the new Trek films or that Godawful STD series. It's like trying to stick outboard motors on an aircraft carrier, they don't move quickly.
I think they trek-con it by saying they mess with inertia and/or mass e.g. by generation of a low level warp field from the nacelles, it allows the ship to behave as though it was a much smaller (less massive) object. Otherwise all space battles would be much more like you say (2 aircraft carriers flying slowly and cornering in massive sweeping arcs)
Not a big star trek person but I kinda noticed something. Do Klingons represent what would be russians/USSR? Idk i just the over confidence, the attitude, and the theme all pointed USSR/Cold War Era.
Old question, but worth answering for someone less familiar with Trek. The answer, however, depends on which era of Star Trek you're watching. In the original TV series they were like these mustache twirling villains, like really badly written Bond bad guys. At the time they, in fact, were kind of a stand in for the USSR, representing a super power that stood in opposition to the Federation the way the USSR stood in opposition to Western Europe, Canada, Australia, and the United States. In the original series movies, as seen here, they're more fully fleshed out as a warrior culture, but not entirely a culture of 'hats'. IE, not all Klingons are warriors even though they value personal combat prowess greatly in their culture. You don't see too much of that in this movie, but it's a lot more on display on Star Trek VI. In that movie you see Klingon diplomats, military officers, politicians, even two lawyers and a judge. All of these Klingons seen in the movie are clearly considered to be people have accrued honor to themselves and their houses for their service to their society, which makes them seem far more real as a culture. For my part, I think the portrayal of Klingon culture is at its best for the franchise in Star Trek VI due to those portrayals. Klingons in the The Next Generation series are angry, bumbling doofuses. They don't know much of anything beyond 'RAWR SMASH'. I think the writers were trying to portray them as an almagamation of every warrior ethos from our own history, especially Sparta and feudal Japan. However, the implementation of that was awful and it really was the worst era of the franchise for them. Deep Space Nine rehabilitated them a great deal and while they weren't as skillfully presented as Star Trek VI presented them, it does them justice in my opinion, especially the interplay between Cmdr Worf and General Martok. In Worf you have the younger man striving his best to achieve the Klingon cultural ideal, in Martok the older, more experienced man who understands a little more of the reality of that ideal...without ever losing his love or pursuit of it at the same time.
I'm pretty sure that the power from the cloaking device immediately was channeled into the bird of prey's shields. That's probably why two torpedoes wasn't enough to obliterate it, because it wasn't hitting the hull. In fact, I'd suspect that the cloaking field is technology NOT too far from shields, in being an energy field that surrounds the ship.
If you're referring to why it takes so many photon torpedoes to bring one down (no down in space 😋), I'd say by TNG-Generations era, improvements were made to their power.
Several questions come to mind with seeing this clip again for the umpteenth time. Why don't Federation Star Ships travel through space with their shields up all the time automatically, just in case of surprise attack like this. Surely all those years of war with the klingons should've taught them that ? Maybe shields are a huge drain on dilythium crystals so shields are only raised as and when needed. And as for klingon birds of prey , they only raise shields when they aren't cloaked but otherwise it's normal to cruise through space with your shields down ? I'm a bit confused.
Combat Shields are more of a drain on power (they have navigation shields to handle stellar debris less drain), the cloak is less draining on the power so can be active during travel but can't be use at the same time as Shields (possibly use some of the same emitters?) so they have to de-cloak to raise shields at least that's always been how I figured.
It was established in Balance Of Terror that the cloaking device draws so much power that a ship has to decloak to fire, much less raise shields. While the Klingons did briefly overcome this weakness in Undiscovered Country, they never proceeded with it after that. That was the only thing that bothered me with the Scimitar in Nemesis. They were able to fire while cloaked, no problem. And still have their shields up.
Power drain, interferes with other systems (you can't use the transporter when shields are up for example) and it would just strain the shield generators to have them on all the time requiring more maintainance and repairs. Despite the action requirements of movies showing the most exciting moments of the crew's career 99 percent of the time Federation ships don't get randomly jumped by enemy ships all the time.
Semantics. Kruge was acting for the preservation of his race in the face of what was perceived as a planet destroying super weapon. In his own way, Kruge was the hero. The differences in culture between the two means that neither was truly the "villain" of the piece, they're both people doing what they think'gs right by their own civilization's core values.
Kirk committed an unprovoked act of war, he didn't know Kruge had gone renegade. He didn't even know if it was the Klingons! The correct command choice is to de-escalate the situation. Raising the shields tips their hand that the Scout ship had been detected. Actually there was a good chance that Kruge would of retreated in that scenario.
t@@thephantasm581 That is the point. He didn't know making his decision to shoot a mistake. He should have raised shields as his first choice. He did know it was a Scout class ship and that it was cloaked making it either the Klingons or the Romulans (or possibly an unknown race with that technology) neither of which the Federation is at war with. Raising the shields would have shown that he knew a threat was there and acted as a warning for the mysterious ship to back down. Kruge himself stated that the Enterprise outgunned him ten to one.
@@Fedaykin24 plus let’s put it this way in some alternate universe she made it to the fleet museum after all was said and done she didn’t blow up if they had perfected the auto systems she would have made it
Kruge: may' yIghuH (Battle Alert!) Kruge: Report status. Torg: We are cloaked. Enemy approaching on impulse power. Range, 5,000 kellicams. Kruge: Good. This is just the turn of luck I have been waiting for. Maltz: Range - 3,000 kellicams. Kruge: Steady. Continue on impulse power. Maltz: Range - 2,000 kellicams. Kruge: Stand by to transfer energy to weapons... at my command. Maltz: Firing range, sir. Kruge: baHwI', DoS yIbuS. QuQ neH. yaj'a'? (Gunner: Target engine only - Understood?) {"Sight on target, gunner," Kruge said. "Disabling only. Understood?"} Gunner2: yajchu' qaH (Understood clearly, sir.) Maltz: 1,000 kellicams closing. Kruge: wej... wej. [WAIT. WAIT.] (captions) {"Wait," Kruge said, as the Enterprise loomed larger in his viewport. "Wait..."} Maltz: vaghvatlh qelI'qam [Five hundred kellicams.] (untranslated) [VAQ VALIS KELIQAP] (captions) Kruge: cha yIghuS. So'Ha'! [Stand by on torpedoes! Uncloak!] (untranslated) [TYRUSCH. SHOHA!] (captions) Kruge: Emergency power to the thrusters! Kruge: baH [Fire!] (untranslated) [BAH!] (captions)
+Luke Sargent Well, it's a callback to the earlier scene where the gunner destroys the USS Grissom outright with a "lucky shot" and is vapourised by a furious Kruge, who wanted prisoners. BTW I always thought it was a little insensitive to name a starship after Gus Grissom, who died in a horrible ball of fire, and then to have that ship explode in a horrible ball of fire.
The subtitles are on every version I've ever seen. Today at work my supervisor told to do something and stressed NOT what I had done earlier which caused a problem. and her delivery reminded me of this scene. so l was going to share this clip on her FB page, but w/0 The subtitles, it's not funny.
Just one proton torpedo? When did Kirk become a penny pincher? The Kirk I know would have fired a spread of proton torpedo's, completely demolishing the Bird of Prey with his first volley
The ship is running on automation because they stole it and have only 5 people crewing a ship that usually needs over 100. Two shots at a time is probably the fastest the automatic system could load it, especially since if you look closely they only have one working torpedo launcher (The other is still wrecked from Khan's attack in the last movie and hadn't been repaired)
But Kruge's perception was wrong. Genesis was invented to create life, not death. And Kruge makes it clear that he wants to know the secret of Genesis so that he can use it as a weapon. At this point, The Klingons would not have passed on an opportunity to conquer The Federation.
The ship was fine. But the computer the crew was using to help them run the ship with only 5 people went offline. So the ship could function, just not with so few people.
Basically this, the ship was meant to be crewed by 400 hundred or so people-scotty jury rigged the automation systems to get the ship moving with just five people on the bridge-but it couldn't take the extra strain of controlling all the tactical systems too. Unshielded torpedo hits to the...impulse engine? certainly didn't help the situation. Computers in Star trek wouldn't be advanced enough to handle such a complex ship without a bare minimum crew until the The Next Generation era.
They would get the crap kicked out of them until Worf destroys them with a "full spread" of one torpedo, followed by Troi crashing the ship into the Genesis planet
@@davidshaffstall4902 Truth is that the bird of prey in Generations could have killed the crew if they targeted the bridge first instead of the engines.
Semantics? Really? Everyone has a justification relative to themselves for the things they do. That doesn't make them right. Kruge is most certainly not a hero. He was responsible for the murder of a freighter crew, the crew of a science vessel, the murder of Kirk's son, and the attempted seizure of a Federation ship. Nothing particularly heroic in that. Whereas Kirk fought in defense of his ship, acted to save his friend, and even gave Kruge one last chance with "Give me your hand!"
They were often used as a "them" allegory for many things, among them the Russians. It's very overt in Star Trek VI : The Undiscovered Country where you have a "Gorkon" 'falling of the Berlin Wall' "Gorbachev" connection.
I'd say it was the Saudis in 1986 (at Reagan's urging) flooding the market with oil to crash the price (and the Soviet economy) to punish the Soviets for Afghanistan. The Soviets had grown addicted to oil revenue when the price spiked in the 70s. It was to prove their undoing.
1:14 I love that torpedo launch sound effect.
I think this is the best the photon Torpedoes ever sounded in the whole film series.
They used the TMP torpedo launch sound FX 🔥🔥🔥🔥💯👍🏾
0:40 "One thousand Kellicams... Closing." For some reason, that line always give me chills, like this is about to really happen. One of the best, most tense moments in the entire Star Trek saga.
For long distances, I always use kellicams instead of kilometres. 😂
8D FööLZ ^^
bäsh´D mövee möney $pent??
I read recently that one of Christopher Lloyd's most favorite roles he ever played was this one: Captain of the Klingons.
I thought he was a great Klingon to be honest, especially before they had really fleshed out the characters like they did in TNG. He had a lot of charisma as a Klingon commander.
Doug M I always liked this exchange...
Kruge: Surrender your vessel.
Kirk: All right, damn you, all right. Please give me a minute to inform my crew.
Kruge: I give _two_ minutes for you and your gallant crew.
Even an evil bastard like Kruge was willing to show a little mercy as well as respect to his enemies. Too bad he made a huge mistake by doing that, because it allowed Kirk enough time to set the Enterprise to self-destruct.
Definitely. Christopher Lloyd had great theatrical flair which worked well for Kruge.
Samantha Parks So he liked this character more than Dr. Emmet Brown, the villain from who framed Roger Rabbit or the Martian from My Favorite Martian.
+Samantha Parks He's fucking brilliant in it. Pretty much all his lines are quotable, with his unique delivery.
Christopher Lloyd - The *best* Klingon commander
I agree!
I wholeheartily agree.
Christopher Plummer though
Totally underrated actor. Lloyd, that is.
He was so stubbornly Klingon! It was perfect!
1:40 you know a Klingon's pissed off when he inexplicably switches to English for dramatic effect.
I've Said this before but I love sulus reaction when he sees the bird of prey .
I remember watching the scene in the theater. When the bird of prey got nailed by the torpedo the crowd went crazy!!
when enterprise blow.. what their reaction ?
All Federation vessels come equipped with exploding chairs.
So do Klingon ships
and no seat belts, despite the speed they can reach.
That's the Klingon, ULTIMATE Version of the WHOOPEE Cushion ! One of my other Trekkie friends actually suggested it, to the First N.Y. , Star Trek, fan Newsletter. NEVER thought any writers, would use the idea. Luckily for him, it made it into a movie, just before he passed away, from Hemophilia complications.
The irony is this Klingon ship later became a Time Machine…(How do you say “Great Scott!” in Klingon?)
Answer: Chon
Very funny
Is she HMS Bounty?
@ Yep
@@natalieschannel7675 I never made the link. Loved Voyage home as a kid. This ship had a wicked stand off with a Whaling ship a final victory if you will.
Fun Fact: the term 'Bird of Prey' was originally reserved for Romulan ships. In an early draft of the script for Star Trek III, the Klingons actually steal a Romulan ship with a cloaking device to go find Genesis. However, the screen writers felt this would make the plot too convoluted, so they removed that portion. But the name for the ship, 'Bird of Prey' stuck. Henceforth, Birds of Prey would be Klingon ships from that point forward. :-)
Not to mention the fact that during the TOS years, the Romulans and Klingons had a mutual defense treaty against the Federation going on at the time, so much so that they gave Klingon D7 battlecruisers to the Romulans, while off-camera, Roddenberry acknowledged that the Klingons got Romulan cloaking devices for their own use--and quite possibly a few Romulan ships in exchange.
There would have been no logical reason for Kruge to steal a Romulan ship, even if their alliance with each other soured since then.
I'm so glad they never went with that daft draft idea.
"The Klingon Bird of Prey is my favorite Klingon ship!"
I saw this in theaters with my younger brother and my Dad. I was 8 years old at the time, and this scene blew me away, it was so epic watching these massive ships on the big screen fighting in space. I remember wishing the battle lasted longer. And I will never forget that green sheen on the bird of prey, which you really never see again on BOP's in successive films; they tend to look brownish-green or muted green. But this one looked like it just stepped off the assembly line. :)
I think had the Enterprise had a full crew, they might have defeated Kruge but since they stole the Enterprise, there was no way they could win. I think it was Kruge's intention to provoke the Federation into a war, since he thought of the Genesis device as a weapon.
If the Enterprise was at full crew and undamaged from her encounter with Khan, The Enterprise would have easily squashed the Bird of Prey. Kruge himself is astonished that the Enterprise hasn't destroyed them after he returned fire because Enterprise outguns his ship 10 to 1.
You can't commit an "act of war" against a renegade.
If Kruge's was (a) inside Federation space without the permission of the Federation Council or (b) committing acts of aggression without the permission of his own government, then there was no exchange of hostilities between the greater powers - just two renegades fighting it out for control of Genesis.
Well, Okie doke! What does a yellow light mean? Slow down.
I love the score of JAMES HORNER r.i.p.
Name a score by James Horner that ISN'T good. It's darn near impossible.
Damn masterpiece just like Wrath of Khan.
McCoy was referring to Kirk's decision to leave the Enterprise's shields down. Kirk was probably worried that if he raised his shields it would alert the cloaked shipped that they were aware of their presence. He baited them into attacking so he could strike before the bird of prey had a chance to raise their shields.
+fireupontheearth back in the TOS and TMP eras ships supposedly couldn't fire through their own shields. Kind of like how early aircraft couldn't fire through their own propellers until the synchronizing mechanism was developed. Supposedly they'd worked through this problem by the TNG era.
A very Kirk move. :)
@@ooooreality7190 every see ST 6? They fix the problem there
@@ooooreality7190 In TOS, the Enterprise fired through their own shields plenty of times. It was transporting that couldn't be done.
Actually the Enterprise was in good condition, in the monologue at the at the beginning of the film, Kirk reports that most of the battle damage from their battle with Khan had been repaired, most of the damage you see on the hull is just superficial marks that could not be fixed unless in spacedock.
If the Enterprise had a full crew on board they probably would have beaten the Bird of Prey without to much trouble, the automated system just overloaded and shorted out rendering them helpless.
Correct
I take it you are referring to the extra damage on the Enterprise from the additional torpedo holes on the saucer to the damage to the starboard side of Engineering and the nacelles?
Kirk should have unloaded everything the Enterprise had on that Bird Of Prey and destroyed it completely. Yet, at the same time, perhaps only two torpedoes were loaded into the one working launcher. Still, there are the phasers.
@@doctorpool480 & the two torpedoes should have obliterated the Klingon bird-of-prey🤷🏽
@@scifiguy26 not if they were not fully charged with anti matter. the ship was in spacedock. most of the torpodeos would have been disarmed.
1:10 I like this part sulu made me laugh bc he yelled and he turned around fast LOL
The klingons had no shields ...those torpedoes shouldve blown it to bits ....
Exactly. Look at what those same torpedos did to the Reliant: destroyed a weapons pod and blew off a warp nacelle. Damage to a smaller, unsheilded Bird of Prey? None. It was still able to fight, warp capable, and able to withstand the gravitational stress of landing on Vulcan. No discernible damage whatsoever, except for the dead ship’s mascot.
Gunner. Target engines. ONLY. Understood?
Dr J Reefer don't forget the last guy
Understood clearly
The ol girl saved 2 of her BEST punches for last…RIP NCC-1701
This film has my favourite portrayal of klingons ever now.
(sees the Klingon commander holding his pet dog's corpse)
BALL SACK! NOOOOOOOOOOO!
If someone killed my lizard puppy, I'd be seriously pissed off too.
When the Klingon ship turned away for a moment after being hit. The Enterprise should have kept firing. Don't rest on your laurels as the saying goes.
ike fun did phasers ever pop up in your head?
@@christopherflowers6583 "the previous damage the phasers are still offline" They possibly did. As Scotty said "I didn't expect to take us into combat, you know." Right after they fired, Chekov found he couldn't raise the shields.
@@sheriff0017 so? As far as the phasers, and basically the entire ship, it was all basically running on automatic. The automation center overloaded after firing Torps. And only after the BoP fired back the enterprise was disabled. So of course then couldn't fire phasers then.
Kirk is probably following basic Federation protocol. The Constitution Class starship dramatically outclassed the Bird of Prey, so under normal circumstances, the Enterprise could just apply enough force to disable the Bird of Prey without destroying her and be relatively safe in doing so. Kirk would have been trained against wantonly destroying a ship needlessly. The only problem with this situation was that, without a crew and relying on the automation system, the Enterprise couldn't raise her shields.
You also have to keep mind that all Kirk knows at this point is 1. There's a clocked enemy ship 2. The USS Grissom is missing when it should be monitoring Genesis.
Kirk did not want to destroy the Bird of Prey in case of the possibility that the USS Grissom crew were being held hostage on the Bird of Prey.
If I were the Klingons, I'd de-cloak BEHIND the Enterprise.
Great Scott!
She gave that Bird Of Prey a knuckle sandwich.
MASSEFFECTfan101 And they got one right back,p. Then, the Klingon commander called Kirk’s bluff, which ended up costing Kirk both his son and his ship. So, not exactly an unalloyed success.
Always thought a Bird of Prey was a beautiful ship.
1:14 Photon torpedos, FIRE!
It was a question he was asking why Kirk hadn't raised shields yet at :50
Uh, no. Kruge had provoked war. He was in Federation space, had destroyed Grissom, and I think Kirk was very rapidly aware of why Grissom wasn't answering hails. The moment he saw the distortion on screen he knew he was flying into a trap. The Enterprise was in no condition to fight a prolonged battle, even with a Bird of Prey. Fully crewed? Maybe, but as it stood, The Enterprise was on her last legs, and Kirk needed to act fast.
OpenMawProductions
Kamarag: We have the right to preserve our race.
Sarek: Do you have the right to commit murder?
1:58 chekov almost moved like my grandma
Klingon BoP must have instantly activated shields when cloak droped otherwise that direct 2 photon torpedo hit would have destroyed it.
I wonder what a proud Klingon warrior thinks when his son says he wants to become a lawyer? xD
"Good shooting, Mr. Scott."
That exact same cloaking device just made a nice appearance on Picard.
I've watched the film since I was six years old. I know it quite well. Kirk had two pieces of information. No response from Grissom, and a CLOAKED ship. There are two powers that the UFP has had prlonged engagements with. Klingons, and Romulans. He knows they would be interested in getting their hands on Genesis, or it's creators. Not to mention there is no guarantee that the shields would have held. The Enterprise was in very bad shape. It wasn't a risk he was willing to take.
No. McCoy was indicating that the Klingon bop shields are down while it is cloaked giving them a brief opportunity to hit it while the shileds were still not up.
+Corey Curtiss No, they were actually right. Kirk knew the Enterprise was under powered and ill prepared. He was hoping to glass jaw the enemy vessel with all the power in the weapons and not spreading it out over other systems.
Am I remembering an extended version of this scene shown on network TV? One where Kirk says to Scott something like "Ready photon torpedoes. Target the center of that distortion field." Or is it from the novelization, which I haven't read in decades?
"May all your guesses be right."
I watched this last night on my new Sony 4K TV Bravia XR And the flames look so real
True, but nobody's perfect. A million command decisions a day, plus Kirk was on a defiant mission. Stress can be overwhelming.
In other words, what did grandpa Worf (Worf's grandfather and namesake) say when he decided to become a lawyer?
"Kirk committed an unprovoked act of war, he didn't know Kruge had gone renegade. He didn't even know if it was the Klingons! The correct command choice is to de-escalate the situation. Raising the shields tips their hand that the Scout ship had been detected. Actually there was a good chance that Kruge would of retreated in that scenario."
He didn't commit 'an unprovoked act of war', they detected an energy surge that they guessed was a cloaked ship. Kirk fired first but this was after they saw the BoP decloak and arm weapons. Remember they are in Federation space and this is before the peace treaty with the Klingons. So an enemy ship decloaks right in front of them in their own space and arms weapons, ofc they are going to fire on it. A Klingon ship being in Federation space is more an act of war than Kirk firing first. As for Kruge retreating, unlikely Klingon behaviour. Kruge himself (after the shot that disables the Enterprise) wonders why they don't destroy him as 'they out-gun us 10 to 1' so he knew he was engaging a much more powerful ship and there was a very good chance they would lose. It's unlikely the shields being up would have deterred him.
No he didn’t
1:59 Chekov just moved
Really, you think so, even though he was giving orders to attack, and decloaked his ship to launch torpedos, which were being armed when he fired, he only fired after the torpedos were being armed, they made the first move to arm them, and back in this universe, the klingons never retreated from any battle.
It's always interesting to me how variable the effect of Star Trek weaponry is. By the details we get in the tech manuals and other "official" sources of lore/canon, one torpedo should obliterate either ship with the shields down. Yet we see the BOP tank 2 torps and return fire, and the Enterprise tank 1 with little effect (the automation system was already damaged, leaving them helpless before the torp was ever fired).
I think the shields went up on the BoP once the cloak dropped.
enterprise was only automated to use warp drive thats it it wasnt crewed or fully repaired or ready for battle it lucky it had few torpedos loaded. remember bird of prey shot out automated center knocking ship right out. if fully crewed that would be different.
Errrr no, the shields failed to raise after they fired because the automatic systems were overwhelmed. The logical thing to do was try and raise the shields, they had worked out it was a Scout ship a vessel that has no capability to punch through their shields. Raising the shields would show the cloaked ship that it had been detected and as Kruge said the Enterprise out gunned him ten to one! It would of given more options to Kirk in respect of bargaining. Kirk made the wrong choice.
agreed. He repeated his mistake from before with Khan
I never did understand why Red Alert not like its normal circumstances or ship full of crew. Your the only ones on the bridge.
And I never understood why the only time Kirk ever asked for standard room lights after Red Alert was in the first movie. A red-lit bridge cannot be good for your nerves.
Target Engines only... UNDERSTOD?
"BUT SIR THIS IS THE USS ENTERPRISE! WE ARE COMPLETELY OUTGUNNED!"
I would agree with a full crew the enterprise would have defeated the bird of prey and captured the crew.
incredible scenes with enterprise an klingon bird of prey
No matter where the Enterprise takes a hit there is almost always an explosion on the bridge.
1:15 James Horner re-appropriates his Battle Beyond The Stars music.
And to think this Klingon Bird of Prey becomes the HMS Bounty in the next film!
It's just "HMS Bounty" or "the Bounty" - "the HMS Bounty" is grammatically incorrect.
@@andrewshouse9840 Oh please, get a life.
The Klingon subtitles are missing ☹️
RIP Kruge’s Dog…
Probably would have eaten the targ for dinner had they survived lol
Wouldn't think it'd be hard to put up shields
Why wasn‘t the Klingon translation shown when the Klingon commander had ordered his gunner to target the Enterprise‘s engine only?
Love this
This was a serious mistake by Kirk, he didn't know if it was Romulans or Klingons two races that the Federation were not at war with at the time. He should of raised shields to de-escalate the situation.
Watch the film again! Kirk didn't know Grissom had been destroyed! He had time to raise the shields.
Ok, today's filmmakers please pay attention to the battle scenes in this film, Star Trek II and Star Trek VI, these are HUGE ships, they weigh hundreds of thousands of tons in their concept design, they don't move like sports cars. In these movies the ships move as they're supposed to, they can maneuver but not with lightning like speed like in the new Trek films or that Godawful STD series. It's like trying to stick outboard motors on an aircraft carrier, they don't move quickly.
I think they trek-con it by saying they mess with inertia and/or mass e.g. by generation of a low level warp field from the nacelles, it allows the ship to behave as though it was a much smaller (less massive) object. Otherwise all space battles would be much more like you say (2 aircraft carriers flying slowly and cornering in massive sweeping arcs)
Now why can't the starships we play in video games have a great torpedo reload rate like the Enterprise does? LOL
good point. Bit a legal mess for the lawyers.
The Enterprise should have fired Phasers right after they launched the torpedoes from the right torpedo launcher. The two hits were not enough.
just how big is a 'Kalakam'?
About 8 inches.
I have a rather large, fat "KALAKAM"
Not a big star trek person but I kinda noticed something. Do Klingons represent what would be russians/USSR? Idk i just the over confidence, the attitude, and the theme all pointed USSR/Cold War Era.
Old question, but worth answering for someone less familiar with Trek.
The answer, however, depends on which era of Star Trek you're watching. In the original TV series they were like these mustache twirling villains, like really badly written Bond bad guys. At the time they, in fact, were kind of a stand in for the USSR, representing a super power that stood in opposition to the Federation the way the USSR stood in opposition to Western Europe, Canada, Australia, and the United States.
In the original series movies, as seen here, they're more fully fleshed out as a warrior culture, but not entirely a culture of 'hats'. IE, not all Klingons are warriors even though they value personal combat prowess greatly in their culture. You don't see too much of that in this movie, but it's a lot more on display on Star Trek VI. In that movie you see Klingon diplomats, military officers, politicians, even two lawyers and a judge. All of these Klingons seen in the movie are clearly considered to be people have accrued honor to themselves and their houses for their service to their society, which makes them seem far more real as a culture. For my part, I think the portrayal of Klingon culture is at its best for the franchise in Star Trek VI due to those portrayals.
Klingons in the The Next Generation series are angry, bumbling doofuses. They don't know much of anything beyond 'RAWR SMASH'. I think the writers were trying to portray them as an almagamation of every warrior ethos from our own history, especially Sparta and feudal Japan. However, the implementation of that was awful and it really was the worst era of the franchise for them. Deep Space Nine rehabilitated them a great deal and while they weren't as skillfully presented as Star Trek VI presented them, it does them justice in my opinion, especially the interplay between Cmdr Worf and General Martok. In Worf you have the younger man striving his best to achieve the Klingon cultural ideal, in Martok the older, more experienced man who understands a little more of the reality of that ideal...without ever losing his love or pursuit of it at the same time.
with no shield shouldn't have the photons but holes in the bird of prey?
+Justin Brown Well, they didn't want to blow up the studio model of the bird of prey because they still needed it to film the rest of the movie.
Yes. Two photons to an unshielded BOP would have obliterated it.
Except this BOP was shielded.
I'm pretty sure that the power from the cloaking device immediately was channeled into the bird of prey's shields. That's probably why two torpedoes wasn't enough to obliterate it, because it wasn't hitting the hull. In fact, I'd suspect that the cloaking field is technology NOT too far from shields, in being an energy field that surrounds the ship.
If you're referring to why it takes so many photon torpedoes to bring one down (no down in space 😋), I'd say by TNG-Generations era, improvements were made to their power.
One thing though. Why were the Clingons whispering? It's not as though anybody on the Enterprise can hear them.😊
I’ve never seen it spelled that way. Hmm. Congrats.
No subtitles?
1:27 BALZAC!!! NO!!!
Several questions come to mind with seeing this clip again for the umpteenth time.
Why don't Federation Star Ships travel through space with their shields up all the time automatically, just in case of surprise attack like this. Surely all those years of war with the klingons should've taught them that ? Maybe shields are a huge drain on dilythium crystals so shields are only raised as and when needed. And as for klingon birds of prey , they only raise shields when they aren't cloaked but otherwise it's normal to cruise through space with your shields down ? I'm a bit confused.
Combat Shields are more of a drain on power (they have navigation shields to handle stellar debris less drain), the cloak is less draining on the power so can be active during travel but can't be use at the same time as Shields (possibly use some of the same emitters?) so they have to de-cloak to raise shields at least that's always been how I figured.
It was established in Balance Of Terror that the cloaking device draws so much power that a ship has to decloak to fire, much less raise shields. While the Klingons did briefly overcome this weakness in Undiscovered Country, they never proceeded with it after that. That was the only thing that bothered me with the Scimitar in Nemesis. They were able to fire while cloaked, no problem. And still have their shields up.
Power drain, interferes with other systems (you can't use the transporter when shields are up for example) and it would just strain the shield generators to have them on all the time requiring more maintainance and repairs. Despite the action requirements of movies showing the most exciting moments of the crew's career 99 percent of the time Federation ships don't get randomly jumped by enemy ships all the time.
Semantics. Kruge was acting for the preservation of his race in the face of what was perceived as a planet destroying super weapon. In his own way, Kruge was the hero. The differences in culture between the two means that neither was truly the "villain" of the piece, they're both people doing what they think'gs right by their own civilization's core values.
2:00 2:01 2:02 I only seen this part before 2:03 never seen this before when I was a child 2:07 I seen this part and I copied it with my toy 2:09
Ok, what killed Ballsack? I mean all that happened was some minor sparks fell on him and he fucking keeled over!
Yes, the targ was nicknamed "Ballsack" during the Nostalgia Critic review.
Klingon pets are ironically very weak and will die if you so much as breathe on them.
Christopher Lloyd was excellent in this. Cool movie.
Kirk committed an unprovoked act of war, he didn't know Kruge had gone renegade. He didn't even know if it was the Klingons! The correct command choice is to de-escalate the situation. Raising the shields tips their hand that the Scout ship had been detected. Actually there was a good chance that Kruge would of retreated in that scenario.
how was jim kirk suppose to know
t@@thephantasm581 That is the point. He didn't know making his decision to shoot a mistake. He should have raised shields as his first choice. He did know it was a Scout class ship and that it was cloaked making it either the Klingons or the Romulans (or possibly an unknown race with that technology) neither of which the Federation is at war with. Raising the shields would have shown that he knew a threat was there and acted as a warning for the mysterious ship to back down. Kruge himself stated that the Enterprise outgunned him ten to one.
@@Fedaykin24 plus let’s put it this way in some alternate universe she made it to the fleet museum after all was said and done she didn’t blow up if they had perfected the auto systems she would have made it
@@Fedaykin24 and she was in no condition to fight
Kruge: may' yIghuH
(Battle Alert!)
Kruge: Report status.
Torg: We are cloaked. Enemy approaching on impulse power. Range,
5,000 kellicams.
Kruge: Good. This is just the turn of luck I have been waiting for.
Maltz: Range - 3,000 kellicams.
Kruge: Steady. Continue on impulse power.
Maltz: Range - 2,000 kellicams.
Kruge: Stand by to transfer energy to weapons... at my command.
Maltz: Firing range, sir.
Kruge: baHwI', DoS yIbuS. QuQ neH. yaj'a'?
(Gunner: Target engine only - Understood?)
{"Sight on target, gunner," Kruge said. "Disabling only.
Understood?"}
Gunner2: yajchu' qaH
(Understood clearly, sir.)
Maltz: 1,000 kellicams closing.
Kruge: wej... wej.
[WAIT. WAIT.] (captions)
{"Wait," Kruge said, as the Enterprise loomed larger in his
viewport. "Wait..."}
Maltz: vaghvatlh qelI'qam
[Five hundred kellicams.] (untranslated)
[VAQ VALIS KELIQAP] (captions)
Kruge: cha yIghuS. So'Ha'!
[Stand by on torpedoes! Uncloak!] (untranslated)
[TYRUSCH. SHOHA!] (captions)
Kruge: Emergency power to the thrusters!
Kruge: baH
[Fire!] (untranslated)
[BAH!] (captions)
I have a website on my Laptop with Klingonese quotes from Star Trek Movies :D Which is here : www.kli.org/tlhIngan-Hol/2008/October/msg00037.html
Klingon subtitles weren't hardcoded in this movie?
He basically says target weapon systems and engines only or something like that. Nothing important to know.
Luke Sargent
-Gunner, target engines ONLY, understood?
-Understood.
MrMoorkey Understood clearly sir.
+Luke Sargent Well, it's a callback to the earlier scene where the gunner destroys the USS Grissom outright with a "lucky shot" and is vapourised by a furious Kruge, who wanted prisoners.
BTW I always thought it was a little insensitive to name a starship after Gus Grissom, who died in a horrible ball of fire, and then to have that ship explode in a horrible ball of fire.
The subtitles are on every version I've ever seen. Today at work my supervisor told to do something and stressed NOT what I had done earlier which caused a problem. and her delivery reminded me of this scene. so l was going to share this clip on her FB page, but w/0 The subtitles, it's not funny.
Ha, he killed his Dog!!
Yeah Michael :( That is a Klingon Monster dog, Targ's are more like a wild boar. memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Klingon_monster_dog
BBBAAAAALLLLLSSSSAAACCCKKKK and also kirks son but more importantly BBBBBBAAAALLLLSAAACCK
We all know what happed to the last guy who messed up that order.
Just one proton torpedo? When did Kirk become a penny pincher?
The Kirk I know would have fired a spread of proton torpedo's, completely demolishing the Bird of Prey with his first volley
Photon. Proton torpedoes are Star Wars. Photon torpedoes are Star Trek.
The ship is running on automation because they stole it and have only 5 people crewing a ship that usually needs over 100. Two shots at a time is probably the fastest the automatic system could load it, especially since if you look closely they only have one working torpedo launcher (The other is still wrecked from Khan's attack in the last movie and hadn't been repaired)
But Kruge's perception was wrong. Genesis was invented to create life, not death. And Kruge makes it clear that he wants to know the secret of Genesis so that he can use it as a weapon. At this point, The Klingons would not have passed on an opportunity to conquer The Federation.
fucking the relient must have really fucked up the enterpise insanely bad if it only took one torpoedo to render the ship dead.
The ship was fine. But the computer the crew was using to help them run the ship with only 5 people went offline. So the ship could function, just not with so few people.
Basically this, the ship was meant to be crewed by 400 hundred or so people-scotty jury rigged the automation systems to get the ship moving with just five people on the bridge-but it couldn't take the extra strain of controlling all the tactical systems too. Unshielded torpedo hits to the...impulse engine? certainly didn't help the situation.
Computers in Star trek wouldn't be advanced enough to handle such a complex ship without a bare minimum crew until the The Next Generation era.
Also it had been damaged in the previous film......
Should have went with the shields instead of the photons....
The urination systems overloaded
Baallsaaaack!!!!
What if the Enterprise D encountered that Bird Of Prey.
They would get the crap kicked out of them until Worf destroys them with a "full spread" of one torpedo, followed by Troi crashing the ship into the Genesis planet
@@davidshaffstall4902 Truth is that the bird of prey in Generations could have killed the crew if they targeted the bridge first instead of the engines.
Sulu - "KLINGON BIRD OF PREY SIR! SHE'S ARMING TORPEDOS!
Kirk - "FIRE MR. SCOTT!"
Adreneline was really pumping when i saw this the very first time.
THEY KILLED HIS DOG
Happy New Year, everyone . . . and may all YOUR guesses be right.
12/31/23
¿Eres consciente de que estás hablando de una película comn un guión ya escrito?
Semantics? Really? Everyone has a justification relative to themselves for the things they do. That doesn't make them right. Kruge is most certainly not a hero. He was responsible for the murder of a freighter crew, the crew of a science vessel, the murder of Kirk's son, and the attempted seizure of a Federation ship. Nothing particularly heroic in that. Whereas Kirk fought in defense of his ship, acted to save his friend, and even gave Kruge one last chance with "Give me your hand!"
Why wont this ship get to 88mph? He outguns me 10 to 1.......
They were often used as a "them" allegory for many things, among them the Russians. It's very overt in Star Trek VI : The Undiscovered Country where you have a "Gorkon" 'falling of the Berlin Wall' "Gorbachev" connection.
I'd say it was the Saudis in 1986 (at Reagan's urging) flooding the market with oil to crash the price (and the Soviet economy) to punish the Soviets for Afghanistan. The Soviets had grown addicted to oil revenue when the price spiked in the 70s. It was to prove their undoing.
The "closed captioning " is some of the worst I've seen ! Some body needs to find other employment!
you realize those are computer-generated subtitles, right?